Rikku's first impressions... [Archive] - Eyes on Final Fantasy Forums

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Rikku, the Al Bhed

07-19-2007, 09:19 PM

Okay, so yesterday I rented FFXII to see what was all the fuss about the game was...
I popped it in the PS2...Picked up my controller...Started playing...

Big dissapointment to me, big time. Why was I so dissapointed in Final Fantasy Twelve? I'll tell you why...

For one, the gameplay is tedious to the finest degree. To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going. To pause, then wait for an action bar to fill up, only to pause the game again is aggravating. In other Final Fantasy games, when you defeat an enemy, you get exp. and gil at the same time, in Twelve; this is forgotten. I ask you why? It was practical and logical.

Another thing I was greatly dissapointed in was the appearence of the game. For a second there, I thought it was a Lord of the Rings, Star Wars crossover! I really was infuriated when I saw my beloved chocobos decorated in heavy armor. Chocobos in Ten were decorated in armor as well, but not to the extent of the ones in Twelve. Chocobo's are supposed to be realistic, but adorable. In Twelve, they lose their trademark cuteness. So have the moogles. Moogles have a cat-like appearence, but in Twelve, they take the shape of a rabbit! Way to break tradition Square!

Another failure in Twelve is the shoddy storyline. Like I said before, the beginning of the whole thing looks like a Lord of the Rings clone. The story makes it seem out of place with the rest of the Final Fantasies. Although, I haven't gotten that far in the story yet, it seems to me, based by other posts here, that we don't have a specific main character. If that is true, then it's a failure. In a story, you must have a specific main character.

All in all, I'm very dissapointed in this latest installment of Final Fantasy. I was blown away by Final Fantasy Ten, but this game, doesn't make a dent.

Sorry to fans of Twelve, but this is Final Fantasies low point.

demondude

07-19-2007, 09:23 PM

I think you dislike it because it differs from x to like the game I think you need to see it as it's own game not a sequal to x.

LunarWeaver

07-19-2007, 09:23 PM

Wolf Kanno is about to come in here and eat this alive.

CimminyCricket

07-19-2007, 09:28 PM

I can't wait.

Rikku, the Al Bhed

07-19-2007, 09:30 PM

Wolf Kanno is about to come in here and eat this alive.

Bring it on.

PeneloRatsbane

07-19-2007, 10:51 PM

wow what a unique opinion.......
X is forgetable and no where near as good as twelve, it realllllly really isn't any where as good as twelve.
i hated the battling in X and the stupid sphere grid, but XII got rid of that boring aspect of game play and made it fun.

Ichimonji

07-19-2007, 11:21 PM

Okay. There are a lot of things wrong with your post other than your inefficient presumptions. First of all:

To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going.

Final Fantasy X has a CTB system. Which means, nothing is going on while you're attacking, or even just idling. In FFXII, along with most other Final Fantasies, you can change the battle system from Active to Wait. This is something I did for FFXII right off the bat. Changing the ADB to Active allows you to enter commands while the enemies are attacking and etc. Like most other Final Fantasies, you can change the system to Wait, and no one will bother you whilst choosing commands.

In other Final Fantasy games, when you defeat an enemy, you get exp. and gil at the same time, in Twelve; this is forgotten. I ask you why? It was practical and logical.

Practical? Maybe. Logical? Absolutely not. Please; explain the logic with piles of money pouring out of a dead animal's carcass. Also, in Final Fantasy VIII you didn't receive Gil from killing fiends. You can get your precious Gil from selling Loot, fighting humans, or opening treasure chests. This is just fine.

The rest of your post is plain foolishness. Complaining that the chocobos are creepy, and the moogles look different. First of all, play Final Fantasy XI. Chocobos do not look friendly. Secondly, moogles have been changing appearance drastically since they've been introduced. FFXII isn't the first game to change their appearances.

Listen. Final Fantasy has been breaking the mold from its predecessors since day one. As the series progresses, the games differ from the last. This is what makes the series so special. It creates a new experience for every gamer. If you want to play the same game over and over again, go play Dragon Quest. This series isn't for you.

f f freak

07-19-2007, 11:25 PM

Vivisteiner

07-19-2007, 11:33 PM

This is all your opinion. And I (and others) disagree with you.

One of the strengths of Final Fantasy is its versatility.

And how can you say this moogle isnt cute!!!

FINAL FANTASY XII Net - Image Viewer (http://www.ffxii.net/image.php?view=images/screens/fmv/701.jpg)

Why must you have a main character, and whats so good about Final Fantasy X!?
And I wont even touch on your gameplay points.

f f freak

07-19-2007, 11:37 PM

^ Awwww that picture is so cuuuuuuuuuuuuute!!! :jess:

Bolivar

07-20-2007, 03:30 AM

Sorry people, but I gotta agree with the threadstarter on some points, this game is beyond great but you gotta take the good w/ the bad.

1. I recommend you turn the battle system (config in the menu) to active. I use that the entire time and only use wait if it's a tought boss battle and i need to take my time/i'm in trouble.

2. Unfortunately this is the first FF that completely ripped off of another RPG series rather than revolutionize it, apparently Knights of the Old Republic had a much similar battle system to ADB. I've heard this from several people, maybe someone else can clarify this for me.

3. You're right, the battle for Nalbina looks a little too much like LOtR.

4. Yes, I too realized moogles....don't look like moogles in this one.

5. I, II (kinda), III, V (kinda), and VI all don't have a main character, i wouldn't say it's necessary for an FF.

Like other people have said, FF is about bringing something new to the table with each game, but only a novice to the series would honestly say that there aren't underlying traditions that bind them all together, beyond Chocobos and Cids. IMO XII unnecessarily broke with some of those traditions, but for the most part did a great job as an FF installment.

Rikku, I recommend you keep playing this game, as pretty soon you'll get access to Gambits and you won't have to input a command everytime. Also this is a great game and I highly suggest you give it a shot, but if you're already disliking it i would recommend playing straight through the storyline because mark hunting can get really boring and monotonous and only drive your perceptions of this game down further (at least it did for me 1st time).

edit: by the way, X destroys XII.

Goldenboko

07-20-2007, 03:56 AM

2. Unfortunately this is the first FF that completely ripped off of another RPG series rather than revolutionize it, apparently Knights of the Old Republic had a much similar battle system to ADB. I've heard this from several people, maybe someone else can clarify this for me.
Wrong. KOTR was a deceptive fighting system, it appeared to be doing the same thing as FFXII but in reality it was a turn-based game. Plus KOTR's attack style really made the entire thing feel different from FFXII.

Bolivar

07-20-2007, 05:00 AM

Proxy

07-20-2007, 06:38 AM

Well, you were blown away by 10, so your taste in Final Fantasy games is somewhat lacking flavor. It appears you like boring games that are predictable, and have bad voice acting, and characters with no emotion.
Let me guess. FFVII was utter garbage in your eyes right?
Ichimonji is right. Final Fantasy has been breaking the mold for EVERY RPG that has been made. And it's constantly upgrading from the previous game.
Oh no they changed the appearance of something.
"Hey Square! Why doesn't Shiva look the same from IV as she does in X? Way to screw that up jackasses!"
I'm surprised you didn't say anything about the Espers (Which although are useless later in the game, are a great change from the typical same-ol' we see from every FF game).
The chocobos are meant to be heavy armed, because the timeline in this game, if you even played far enough, because you did rent it, is set in a war torn world. And if you look at it that way, the other Final Fantasy games have it wrong, now don't they? The trusty "steed" without any protection?
A Star Wars & LoTR cross? I love how you say that but prove no points in the similarities between the movies & game. Or is it cause "They have ships that can fly, and they use swords, and bows & arrows & stuff?"
Your turn based, more realistic battles when the entire thing is paused waiting for you to make your choice.
And your lack of comments on the gambit system makes me think that you didn't get far at all, or else you would have ripped into that.
Turn on active mode, instead of wait, then you get a better feel for, what I think, to be a very innovative and creative battle system, that I hope sticks around with the rest of the Final Fantasy games, because it's a whole hell of a lot less boring then sitting there & selecting whatever you want to do each round.
I can safely assume that you didn't play far enough into the game to appreciate it's value, and as to what Square was trying to do.
You can go back to playing your "amazing" FFX.

Hambone

07-20-2007, 06:53 AM

I thought X was amazing. :(

Was XII your second FF? You really need to open your mind to change because FF does a lot of it...

Wolf Kanno

07-20-2007, 07:55 AM

Wow, this brings back memories of my debates with Timerk and Renmiri (Renmiri even had a Rikku avatar at that time!) I'm happy to hear you are at least playing the game and I mostly ask that you remain patient, and keep playing. ;)

For one, the gameplay is tedious to the finest degree. To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going. To pause, then wait for an action bar to fill up, only to pause the game again is aggravating. In other Final Fantasy games, when you defeat an enemy, you get exp. and gil at the same time, in Twelve; this is forgotten. I ask you why? It was practical and logical.

Like many before, I suggest you play it on Active mode. This is one of the few FF's where the difference in modes is obvious. Wait, really destroys the point in having the Gambit System. Oddly enough, if you really watch it, the system is basically the ATB system it just put's into account the 3D enviroment.

I didn't care for the combat system when I first played, but once you get a fully controllable party, it becomes a little more fun. Later when you finally get more Gambits, you can begin to experiment. Not to mention by this point you should have a wide variety of weapons which actually change how you should manage them. The systems fun it just takes a while to kick in.

Another thing I was greatly dissapointed in was the appearence of the game. For a second there, I thought it was a Lord of the Rings, Star Wars crossover! I really was infuriated when I saw my beloved chocobos decorated in heavy armor. Chocobos in Ten were decorated in armor as well, but not to the extent of the ones in Twelve. Chocobo's are supposed to be realistic, but adorable. In Twelve, they lose their trademark cuteness. So have the moogles. Moogles have a cat-like appearence, but in Twelve, they take the shape of a rabbit! Way to break tradition Square!

The change is not nearly as drastic as VII's Chocobos to VIII's but that's just my opinion. Well the "Star Wars feel" continues through I'm afraid but it's actually easy to forget about. LOTR disappears quickly though. The SW/LOTR feel is mostly felt in the action CG cutscenes though (the opening and the ending are the worse offenders). The story is actually quite different so don't worry about playing a clone of someone else's work.

The series is about change and innovation so you have to just either accept or suffer through it I'm afraid.

Another failure in Twelve is the shoddy storyline. Like I said before, the beginning of the whole thing looks like a Lord of the Rings clone. The story makes it seem out of place with the rest of the Final Fantasies. Although, I haven't gotten that far in the story yet, it seems to me, based by other posts here, that we don't have a specific main character. If that is true, then it's a failure. In a story, you must have a specific main character.

That's completely untrue. As Bolivar pointed out, only half the series actually had a main character (You forgot IX though;) ) Telling a story with no central main character is challenging but eventually the story does begin to focus mostly on Lady Ashe (seriously, am I the only person who feels she technically qualifies for role of lead?). It's difficult to tell a story by it's first few moments. The story really begins to pick up once you finish the Leviathan. To be honest, the story mostly focuses on Lady Ashe, Balthier, and Basch. Though the others have their moments.

I'll admit the storytelling is very different from the rest of the FF series, it's actually closer to the team's earlier works (FFT, FFTA, and Vagrant Story) XII focuses mainly on politics and the conflict about the impending war. XII's greatest charm though is in it's fleshed out world. Though the area of Ivalice is only a small part of the world, there is more detail and history in this place than most of the FFs combined.

Definetly explore and enjoy the world. The game doesn't guide your hand anymore and you are allowed to go where you wish (until you accidentally wander into the Feywoods at Lv. 20 and get totally owned by a vegetable man that looks like an extra on the Nightmare Before Christmas.)

It's the little details and the nuances of this game that make it impressive. I also feel it's story is very powerful, even if the cast is a little subdued at times. Either stick with it, (btw the game is LOOOONG, borrow it from a friend or you'll never make it far enough to enjoy the story.) or just stop now if it seems like too much of a hassle. I'm personally a masochist when it comes to gaming but I don't feel others need to be.

All in all, I'm very dissapointed in this latest installment of Final Fantasy. I was blown away by Final Fantasy Ten, but this game, doesn't make a dent.

Sorry to fans of Twelve, but this is Final Fantasies low point.

For me, X is the low point in the series. But we are allowed to each hold our own opinions. No one ever said that every game in the series would appeal to everyone unquestionably. Sometimes the games fail to meet our expectations.

Rikku, the Al Bhed

07-20-2007, 04:30 PM

Formalhaut

07-20-2007, 08:35 PM

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy

DarkLadyNyara

07-20-2007, 08:36 PM

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy

Yep, sounds about right.

Brandon Stroud

07-20-2007, 09:28 PM

It's one thing to say that you just don't like FF12. However, completely bashing it without seriously trying to get into the game, THEN proceding to praise another game like it's "God's Gift?" ...You gotta be kidding me. This is just asking for your logic and common sense to be put into question as well as for your statement itself to get ripped apart, stitched back together, then drawn and quartered on 4 heavily-armored chocobos on speed.

To address your "concerns" over the gameplay: As stated earlier, the Final Fantasy series has been built on revolutionizing and reinventing the combat system. It went from static (FF1-3) to ATB (4-9) to CTB (10). Attempting a combat system that further smooths out the flow of the action is what was done in FF12. However, there is always the option of setting the system to Wait if the player is more accustomed to the more traditional style as well as if the player is more methodical or in a pinch.

As far as the presentation goes, you're gonna need to get over the fact that Tetsuya Nomura had NO PART in the design for the game. If you can't then you must not've liked or even bothered giving Vagrant Story a chance, did you? In retrospect, Nomura is one of my personal favorite character designers, but seeing a different art style is actually refreshing.

To continue, let's cover what your beef seems to be with the story. A lot of the developers at Square Enix are admitted fans of Star Wars and LotR. ...And you weren't expecting to see refereces thereto somewhere in the game? Right... And I got some beachfront property in San Bernardino to sell you. The story itself is presented at a slow, methodical and in-depth pace. There's a lot of history behind the world and it's inhabitants. Of course, you'd realize that if you had given the game as much of a shot as you claimed. Just to let you know, the pacing for the game was too slow for me, thereby I couldn't get as far into it as others. Of course, that's after I had completed a good 80+ percent of the game. Shoddy storyline covered up by badly spoken Olde English? I think ye doth protest too much.

Earlier, I mentioned heavily armored chocobos on speed. You remember that? Or are you too busy fuming over this game's failure? Pay close attention, now, as we cover the beloved mascots of the series. The majority of chocobos in the game are armored. The ones you fight out in the field are not. The chocobos in previous games had a fluffier look to them. The anatomy and physiology on these birds in this particular game is closer to how something feathered would look when existing in an arid, war-torn region. As for the moogles... Take some time to really look over how much they've changed since their introduction. They came from being "Stay-Puft Marshmallow Cherubs" to what they are in 12, and guess what? It's likely they'll get changed up for 13.

Now, you want logic as far as experience and money drops after combat? It's already been said. What in the world makes you think that when you kill something, piles of money will just ooze from their wounds where blood should be? Money is acquired in a mostly real-world manner... through commerce. Buying, selling and trading. On a quick note about main characters in the FF games, at least half the games in the series did not have a definite main character. Some had multiple, others you didn't meet until later in the game as the story really revealed itself and was fleshed out. Of course, that requires taking the time to really play the game. Not just skim through over a rental period.

Take it from me, someone who is not at all... I repeat NOT AT ALL a fan of FF12. This game is one that's at least worth doing your homework on before bashing it. Oh, and just to let you know... Outside of Auron, Lulu and Kimahri... I utterly despised FF10.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you and good day.

Elpizo

07-20-2007, 09:59 PM

I wanted to say, the moogles in FF XII shouldn't be that surprising. They use the same design as FFTA's moogles (Logical, they are drawn by the same artist, aren't they?). So FF XII's moogles should be nothing new or shocking.

Further, there's no point in me trying to say something positive about XII, you won't listen anyway. You're too spoilt by X.

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans? After the magnificent IX (and XII) I didn't expect something that... tries to make me stop playing by throwing all kinds of stuff at me that makes me swallow hard and feel a bit sick...

Ah well, each to his own. Some of your complaints make absolutely no sense to me but I won't try to understand. I feel that it's not worth it. Try to stop thinking that every FF has to be like X to be a FF, maybe then you'll like XII. I'll go as far as saying that FF X feels the least FF-ish to me.

Don't think I had no problems with XII, there were some problems, but for me the fantastic Final Boss and "Battle for Freedom" more than made up for all of my little problems with XII.

atlanteay

07-20-2007, 10:48 PM

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy
even worse than a FFVII fanboy :(

have you played any other Final Fantasy besides X? To me, X was really average. Not at all worth the hype. The love story wasn't even as great as VIII's and the storyline is nothing compared to 4,5,6,7,8,9&12.

You said that it's the first time they've given voice acting... that's actually arguable because in FFVIII, the song Eyes on Me was sang by Julia so that's a voice and the humming in FFIX also counts. Besides, the voiceacting in X sucked.

also, the only reason the characters showed a lot of emotions in X was because of the graphics. PS2 was able to show character expressions unlike the previous FFs. IMO, the previous FFs had a lot more emotions than X but the graphical limits prevented you from seeing their sad little faces (even though VI had hilarious sprites xD)

PeneloRatsbane

07-21-2007, 12:57 AM

i love the XII moogles, Nono especially is adorable!

Bolivar

07-21-2007, 03:09 AM

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans?

It's one of those "you had to be there" things. I got X (and Playstation2) when it first came out, and it's hard for me not to have fond memories of it.

Now i'm going to get back to chrono trigger and try to figure out what's so special about it...

atlanteay

07-21-2007, 03:32 AM

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans? After the magnificent IX (and XII) I didn't expect something that... tries to make me stop playing by throwing all kinds of stuff at me that makes me swallow hard and feel a bit sick...

i'm not the only one then? :eek:

i think it's because it's the first FF on the PS2 with enhanced Graphics and a very "cute" love story. The main character is also a nice looking guy which got a lot of fangirls. Yuna is decent looking too so you got your fanboys. And Lulu's chest got a lot of attention too :rolleyes2 it was simply a good timing. Same thing with FFVII. First FF in 3D :O first FF on PS1 (?)

The Unknown Guru

07-21-2007, 04:38 AM

Although, I haven't gotten that far in the story yet, it seems to me, based by other posts here, that we don't have a specific main character. If that is true, then it's a failure. In a story, you must have a specific main character.

Uh... have you ever played or heard of FFVI? Also, idolizing FFX isn't gonna help you win debates or anything.

Slothy

07-21-2007, 12:37 PM

i think it's because it's the first FF on the PS2 with enhanced Graphics and a very "cute" love story. The main character is also a nice looking guy which got a lot of fangirls. Yuna is decent looking too so you got your fanboys. And Lulu's chest got a lot of attention too :rolleyes2 it was simply a good timing. Same thing with FFVII. First FF in 3D :O first FF on PS1 (?)

Ugh, even I'm getting tired of people who don't give FFX the credit it deserves. The story was good, and the characters were some of the best in the series if you ask me. Unlike a good chunk of the FF titles, they actually had natural character development. Wakka accepting the Al Bhed didn't come out of nowhere, nor did Lulu getting over Chappu, or Tidus becoming a hero willing to sacrifice himself if it means saving he world. All of it was a natural and believable progression for the characters, and it was handled well. Throw in gameplay that was at the same time some of the fastest, and most strategic in the series, and you have a great game.

As for Rikku's comments on FFXII; I might have said something here, but Wolf Kanno kind of beat me to it.

Yukki-Chan

07-21-2007, 02:14 PM

Just to comment on the likenesses of SW and LoTR in connections to FF12, I will first say of course!
Since when hasn't the best of the out of reality, futuristic or medievil style of storylines not featured a small group of heros on a quest to defeat an evil Villan/Empire or what not with countries quibbles going on in the background? As far as I see its a common appearance.

Second, something as large as conceiving the idea for a whole world is going to need inspiration from somewhere and where better to get ideas from something that all of the staff can understand than a few viewings of Movies that fit the bill. Ghost in the Shell inspired the Matrix for instance so why not this? Other FF's have been inspired by a mix of Technological and Magical Medievilness so it's arguable that the editing and storyboarding took a page from Star Wars then had Squeenix's airships put in.

Basically put unless Vaan and Ashe start marching off to Ye olde mount Doom to defeat Darth Vader by dropping some random piece of jewelry into it's depths you can't convince me that the storyline itself was tainted by other referances, it follows the basic Fantasy Storyline tradition and I don't argue, I like that.

CloudedSquall

07-22-2007, 05:09 PM

It makes me laugh how so many people are like "my god! FFX fanboy" and you all sound like FFXII fanboys.. running to it's defence when someone merely comments on the game or expresses their opinion.

I personally enjoyed X more than XII. However, i love both games. The reason I liked X more was because of the character connections and moments in the game. There were parts of X where I was so inthralled, where there was intense action! Sin attacking the army on the beach, escaping from the temple, the opening scenes, the battles in Old Zanarkand.. these memories really stick out because the characters bonded more, which made me feel bonded with them, and also because there was a lot of action.

That said, there are moments in XII where it could have been really well done.. but they would last for a few moments and finish. You merely travelled through the dungeon, fought a boss and when this part was done.. o look, we're off again to obtain an item to get further in the map. **SPOILERS** The part where the Empire invade Mt.Bur-Omicase (SP), escaping from Nalbina Fortress, meeting the Gods at the Great Crystal **SPOILERS** were great parts of the game but were never elaborated enough to make me want to play this game again.

I'm not a fanboy of either game, and I see both sides of the argument. I loved the battle system of XII and going back to time based would be strange now, but the characters in X had more depth personally.

Proxy

07-23-2007, 03:51 AM

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy

I agree. But then again, named after a minor character in the downfall of the final fantasy series, this type of review is to be expected.

Atleast this game isn't linear.
"lets just walk in a set direction, never being set back by the thought that something important has/could have happened in a town/city we were just in. Where we've made friends."
Even in X-2 you go back to other cities & towns to progress the story. I think 10 was the first Final Fantasy to do this. I have a very shoddy memory.
I bought a PS2 for FFX, and I liked it, but it was a downfall in the series. As pointed out before by a couple other members.
And I will give it to you that Auron was the most half decently impressive voice acting in that game.

Uh... have you ever played or heard of FFVI? Also, idolizing FFX isn't gonna help you win debates or anything.
Win.

Brennan

07-23-2007, 04:23 AM

*Goes on a rant about people who don't like the game just because they think it's bad*
What is your problem Rikku?!
The game takes place in a war-torn era!
So what if the chocobos wear armor?
So what if the moogles look like rabbits? They still are cute!
So what if the game-play freezes when you select a command? It does that on about every other FF!
If you want the game-play to keep continueing when you select a command use "Acive" mode!
*Rant over*

Northcrest

07-23-2007, 10:41 PM

I think you dislike it because it differs from x to like the game I think you need to see it as it's own game not a sequal to x.

1. Ditto

2. I just think that you are too use to X and expected almost the exact kind of gameplay or the way its played. In this game you have to remember that they probably almost had to use a new crew for the FF game play. Thats why everything is almost comepletely what you didn't think of with X. I mean yeah I didn't really like the way how they changed a bunch of ideas that kind of took away the Final Fantasy Flow but the gameplay was enjoyable. Wait until u beat the game you will love it.

Wolf Kanno

07-25-2007, 06:37 AM

Wow, this thread has devolved into a X vs. XII argument and neither Renmiri or I was responsible... Check the skies children! The world is coming to an end!;)

I wanted to say, the moogles in FF XII shouldn't be that surprising. They use the same design as FFTA's moogles (Logical, they are drawn by the same artist, aren't they?). So FF XII's moogles should be nothing new or shocking.

Further, there's no point in me trying to say something positive about XII, you won't listen anyway. You're too spoilt by X.

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans? After the magnificent IX (and XII) I didn't expect something that... tries to make me stop playing by throwing all kinds of stuff at me that makes me swallow hard and feel a bit sick...

Ah well, each to his own. Some of your complaints make absolutely no sense to me but I won't try to understand. I feel that it's not worth it. Try to stop thinking that every FF has to be like X to be a FF, maybe then you'll like XII. I'll go as far as saying that FF X feels the least FF-ish to me.

Don't think I had no problems with XII, there were some problems, but for me the fantastic Final Boss and "Battle for Freedom" more than made up for all of my little problems with XII.

Lord I understand this too well. I still don't understand how X got such a rabid fanbase. :rolleyes2 And yes X is pretty bad about forcing things down your throat. It's the worse offender in the FF series when it comes to holding your hand and being linear.

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans?

It's one of those "you had to be there" things. I got X (and Playstation2) when it first came out, and it's hard for me not to have fond memories of it.

Now i'm going to get back to chrono trigger and try to figure out what's so special about it...

Speak for yourself :p I got X when it came out and found it too be really boring and disappointing. My feelings only grew stronger when I played through it a second time. I still feel it's the low point of the series and pray that no future FF tries to be like it.

As for CT... yeah, the game is far more impressive if you played it when it came out. It was mind blowing at the time. But I still feel the games overall charm holds up to today.

Back on topic... Outside of the fanboy/girl squabbling Rikku. XII is very different in storytelling and structure. Some like it, some don't. I personally felt Lady Ashe's struggle and the theme of freedom were beautifully told and it really connected with my personal feelings about the subjects. The game's realism with politics and dropping grandiose ideologies like "saving the world" felt refreshing after so many years of playing the genre. Granted I don't feel ever RPG should be like XII, but I felt it was a nice breather after playing through so many similiar games.

Hopefully XIII will learn from XII's strengths. ;)

Renmiri

07-26-2007, 07:18 PM

I gave Final Fantasy Twelve a try, I really did to see if I would like it...But more or less halfway through, I'm not impressed at all. Hiding a badly written story behind old english. Sorry, Square...You failed big time. Way too big of a change in my perspective.

I really tried to like it, I really did. But when it comes to what makes me bond with a group of characters...This falls flat.
I felt the same as you when I was in the middle of the game. I got to appreciate it better after I forced myself to proceed.

I think part of it was the hype and expectations. I was expecting something better than X, in my taste of games. When I finally forgave Square for not making an X-3 I enjoyed it more.

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy

Yep, sounds about right.
I thought that every X fan would dislike XII and vice versa but it turns out this is not true. There are actually quite a few people that like both.

You're too spoilt by X.
Good point.

Right now I'm playing X for the first time, after I finished XII, and can you please tell me how this game got so many fans?

It's one of those "you had to be there" things.
I bet in five years people will be asking the same about XII :p

Ugh, even I'm getting tired of people who don't give FFX the credit it deserves. The story was good, and the characters were some of the best in the series if you ask me
QFT!!! :love: :love: :love:

It makes me laugh how so many people are like "my god! FFX fanboy" and you all sound like FFXII fanboys.. running to it's defence when someone merely comments on the game or expresses their opinion.

I personally enjoyed X more than XII. However, i love both games.
Told ya so. It is possible to like both ;)

I think it is very normal for FF fans to be disappointed with XII (and perhaps with every new FF game). It changed a lot of things that were liked, not enough of things that were disliked, all the hype made people expect too much, etc... XII fans will just have to be patient with us "fanboys" that were expecting more of Square. To each his own.

Vivisteiner

07-26-2007, 07:40 PM

Wow, this topic has somehow managed to get me hating FFX. Just like those FFVII fanboy threads. ;)

When in reality, I think both of them are great games, and so is FFXII. But they are soooooooooo different, and as demondude said, that has caused all the hate. Both games have their weaknesses. FFX's emotion was sometimes over the top to the point of ridiculousness and FFXII's was the reverse. In FFXII you sometimes feel a lack of purpose whereas in FFX its like someones holding your hand and guiding you the whole way through.

Only FFIX got the perfect balance. :D :D :D

What is Final Fantasy anyway?
How can you claim that FFXII is not a proper Final Fantasy when you've only played FFX?

Consider though that if Final Fantasy weren't so versatile, it would probably not exist today.

Shemhazai

07-27-2007, 12:48 AM

I got FFX as soon as i could after i had obtained the mighty PS2, after playing into it got nearly all the way i thought "Great, this'll occupy me for a while". Not long after i completed it and felt very disappointed at how easy-ish i found it compared to whe i first tried FFVII (which was my first escapade into the FF world, sometime around the late 90's, i was only ikkle :P.) it took me a good few months (bout 7 :$) but i felt satisfied once I had completed it (I'm no 'Fanboy'), and have to come to respect the FF series as one of the finest, IMHO The FF's have been getting better.

BUT, there is always a lowpoint to each game, for VII was how hard i found/find Emerald and Ruby weapon (Still can't beat em :mad2: ) for VIII the materials needed to make better weapons were quite hard to find. IX was probably how much you had to run about (me being lazy i like to fly/sail about) X for me was the gameplay and those ruddy annoying battles. X-2 was quite poor i can't even remember completing it (i have btw). (I haven't found one for XI as my freakin' comp has packed up allowing me to play games on it so i only played it for about 2 months). for XII atm it would have to be that i don't feel armour has a large part to play, but thats me and it'll probably get me killed in the game somethime.

I Enjoy FFXII even though the story is 'a bit slow' and i find the Combat System very refreshing as are the change to the Moogles and the slightly tougher edge to the Chocobos.

All in all, most of the FF's were good, just that for me FFX wasn't as good.

Thanks for reading my long (probably boring) post
And Hello To Y'all I'm New. =]

TaTa, Shem

Jesta

07-27-2007, 03:47 AM

yet another FFX Fan boy who tries to hate every other Final Fantasy

agreed

i did however firstly agree with some of the first comments originally made about 12. its lack of depth in its gameplay, the plat that has no real goal. the battle system was something i wasnt too fond of either. but those little things tend to ebcome obsolete when you give a gfame a chance and play it as it is and not compare it to others. we are there to play the game and enjoy it for what it has to offer, rather than criticise a game for not being more like a previous.

you need to open your mind to the possibility that a game is more than it first appears to be.

Dirufan

07-30-2007, 09:43 PM

I don't know about anyone else, but I was absolutely STOKED about not having random battles. Granted, that is a major change from every other final fantasy in the series, but what's a game series without a little change from every other one?

That's why I like XII over X any day. X holds your hand through the whole game until you get to the final boss. Then you're able to do your sidequests, and by this point in the game, everything you work for is basically useless because you'll be way overpowered when you don't need to be.

And in XII's defense, FINALLY a game where you have to take a little time to defeat a sidequest boss. (Yiazmat) I'll gladly take the 7-10 hours to beat him, unlike FF VI where as soon as you learn Vanish and Doom, you've just beaten the game.

Nifleheim7

07-31-2007, 11:48 AM

pspkilla

08-11-2007, 05:20 AM

To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going.
I'm sorry but I have to argue with this. You say about pausing the action in FF12 but FF10 keeps the action going? What a load of crap!! You can sit there all day and not get hit in FF10 because of the system. The action comes to a standstill while you just stand there. To me you just sound like a crazed lunatic fan of FF10.

I think he/she reffers to the character/monster animations rather than the game mechanics.
It is true that in FFX the character/monster movement continued when you were browsing the battle menu although it was purely for aesthitics.
The only part that i agree in Rikku's original post is about the story.I admit that i also haven't beaten the game yet,but i can clearly see that it's story is plot-driven rather than character-driven.By that i mean that the plot overweights the characters development.I'm always more intrigued about tales that are focused more on characters and less on plots.Or ones that keep a fine balance.
I think the main character in FFXII is Ivalice and not the actual characters.

I have to disagree, the plot of the game is genious! So, if you didn't like this plot, I take it you didn't like Tacticts plot as well? It was a great game! The story lines are quite different than the usual save-the-world type plots. In this game, I feel that the story is alot deeper than most FF games, and the main character in this game, is pretty much everyone in your party, they all play a unique role in the story, the characters and plot were, I think, well balanced out. In FFX the story is good, though I must say this game has one of the best story lines in my opinion. The plot does really revolve around the main characters of the game, if you play further into it, you'll see what I mean, at first I had my doubts as well, but I gave it some time, and now It's one of my favorites in the series.

the holy meteor

08-26-2007, 02:46 AM

I really liked the gameplay because I hated the annoying random battles. I just got tired of the loading times and it was especially painful in IX. However XII's battle system became extremely tedious and it probably had to do with the intensely long dungeon crawling. All those endless mazes aren't even that rewarding. I mean, all that for a little cutscene? And right after that, off we go to yet another 10-hour long destination. I thought it was hard to appreciate the plot because I always got off track on what the heck was going on.

It's been several months since I completed it and I believe it's the least memorable FF I've ever played. The characters seem to be forced to interact with one another from time to time. The only reason I even remember the main characters is because their names are listed right there in the main menu screen. Only Balthier and Fran (I LOVE her voice) are remotely interesting. Penelo just doesn't seem to have a purpose to be in the party.

The plot is okay, but nothing memorable or special. It's not my cup of tea. The characters don't seem to have much depth and bored me. By the time I got to the final dungeon, I was surprised. I know it was 60-70 hours since I started playing but whoa, I didn't realize the story was coming to an end. I thought the story was just unfolding. I understand that it's plot-driven which is different from the previous FFs but I don't think it was executed as well as planned. I don't mind not having a love story, though.

The music for the game is a complete letdown. Nothing memorable except the signature FF themes (such as the victory music).

XII's strong points are the battle system which I absolutely love, and of course the graphics. Other than that, I wouldn't bother playing this game ever again. High expectations might be the reason, but I did give it a fair shot and I still can't get into it.

I had to let it all out. I think FFXII is okay but not great. I enjoyed the game thoroughly and I never "forced" myself to finish it, but I admit I did enjoy the other Final Fantasies a lot more.

Nifleheim7

08-26-2007, 03:40 AM

^Holy meteor,i share your thoughts exactly (i agree even at the part of Fran's voice)!!!
I finished the game a couple days ago (not a 100% completion since i got bored of leveling up) and i was thinking of writing my thoughts on this...but your post covered me 100%!

I just want to add that another let down for me was the art direction.I know that the team were fans of the Star Wars franchise but at the last (long) sequence i felt like i was watching the recent trilogy of George Lucas...Inspiration is one thing but this was just to much for my liking.Even the dialogues where as pompous and horrible as in the last Star Wars films.When i play a FF title i expect at least some originality...
Vayne was also ridiculous at the end and very cliched.

Jiro

08-26-2007, 05:47 AM

There are always going to be people who will love one game so much that they will dislike games that are too different. But in my opinion, both games are good but neither are truly perfect. There is always going to be something that someone doesn't like.

Goldenboko

08-26-2007, 04:40 PM

I have a few comments

For one, the gameplay is tedious to the finest degree. To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going. To pause, then wait for an action bar to fill up, only to pause the game again is aggravating.

First off, if you play on Active the game never pauses, you are constantly in action which is a reason why some people can't play on Active. In fact, playing this game on Active makes it the only game where you will be deciding attacks and your party members will still be running around attacking, keeping the action around you far more then any other Final Fantasy to date. X was actually a step backward in the "keeping the action going" area, as it reverted back to turn base, which means a pause button is never necessary to slow things down, you can just sit and think and nothing bad will ever happen.

In other Final Fantasy games, when you defeat an enemy, you get exp. and gil at the same time, in Twelve; this is forgotten. I ask you why? It was practical and logical.

Practical, yes, logical, not at all. I'd like you to think about what you said for a moment, is it logical for you to go outside, and kill a Bear, and then find 100 bucks on its dead carcass?
Of course not.
Is it logical for you to kill a bear, skin it, and sell its fur for 100 bucks.
Yes, very.
FFXII's loot system was actually a step in the right direction when it comes to logic.

Another thing I was greatly dissapointed in was the appearence of the game. For a second there, I thought it was a Lord of the Rings, Star Wars crossover!
This has been said about FF forever :P But when it comes down to it LoTR was cool, and Star Wars was cool, why is crossing them so bad?

Chocobos in Ten were decorated in armor as well, but not to the extent of the ones in Twelve. Chocobo's are supposed to be realistic, but adorable. In Twelve, they lose their trademark cuteness. So have the moogles. Moogles have a cat-like appearence, but in Twelve, they take the shape of a rabbit! Way to break tradition Square!

The necessity of Chocobos being cute was never intended by Square, thats a personal fan opinion, personally I liked the representation of Chocobos in this game, because they where BAMF.

Moogles being Cat-Like is your interpretation, and to be honest, I dun know where you got it. Square always messes with the character designs, and FFXII's moogles looked fine, they still looked like Cats, just with rabbit ears.

You also said something about not having a main character....

Lets go back in time:
FFI: Characters never talked: No main Character
FFV: Galuf felt much more important to the story for the first half but then he had to go and get himself killed good job Galuf! :crying:
FFVI: One of the best FFs, many regard it as the single best, and guess what, it had no main character. There where only three you could Consider and thats Locke, Celes, and Terra, but each had just as much glory as the last.

2. Unfortunately this is the first FF that completely ripped off of another RPG series rather than revolutionize it, apparently Knights of the Old Republic had a much similar battle system to ADB. I've heard this from several people, maybe someone else can clarify this for me.
Wrong. KOTR was a deceptive fighting system, it appeared to be doing the same thing as FFXII but in reality it was a turn-based game. Plus KOTR's attack style really made the entire thing feel different from FFXII.

lol thanks for the, ummm... agressive clarification.
If you think thats Aggressive Clarification then you should see what happens when Tavrobel corrects someone. Mine was just lazy clarification, making it sound mean and cold. :P

ff is da best

08-30-2007, 12:31 PM

well i just want to say somethin... i was suprised when i first saw the
new battle system how u can run around and fight not like the old ff
but i reckon that it was quite cool and saved sum time from having to see the screen smash when you encounter a enemy. but i still think that is cool just that i think ff12 is just so cooler but i will always rememba and still play the previous ff its just in my nature i guess.

Markus. D

08-30-2007, 12:41 PM

Okay, so yesterday I rented FFXII to see what was all the fuss about the game was...
I popped it in the PS2...Picked up my controller...Started playing...

Big dissapointment to me, big time. Why was I so dissapointed in Final Fantasy Twelve? I'll tell you why...

For one, the gameplay is tedious to the finest degree. To pause the action around you to attack, use items or whatnot is irratating. Unlike in FFX or other installments that keeps the action around you going. To pause, then wait for an action bar to fill up, only to pause the game again is aggravating. In other Final Fantasy games, when you defeat an enemy, you get exp. and gil at the same time, in Twelve; this is forgotten. I ask you why? It was practical and logical.

But not further explored on your behalf, you can edit the battle system in the config menu.

Another thing I was greatly dissapointed in was the appearence of the game. For a second there, I thought it was a Lord of the Rings, Star Wars crossover! I really was infuriated when I saw my beloved chocobos decorated in heavy armor. Chocobos in Ten were decorated in armor as well, but not to the extent of the ones in Twelve. Chocobo's are supposed to be realistic, but adorable. In Twelve, they lose their trademark cuteness. So have the moogles. Moogles have a cat-like appearence, but in Twelve, they take the shape of a rabbit! Way to break tradition Square!

Moogle keep to the same art style that were in the Previous Ivalice involved games, know your stuff ;)... Chocobos however... need clad to survive in wars :3

Another failure in Twelve is the shoddy storyline. Like I said before, the beginning of the whole thing looks like a Lord of the Rings clone. The story makes it seem out of place with the rest of the Final Fantasies. Although, I haven't gotten that far in the story yet, it seems to me, based by other posts here, that we don't have a specific main character. If that is true, then it's a failure. In a story, you must have a specific main character.

Yeah I thought it sucked :p...

All in all, I'm very dissapointed in this latest installment of Final Fantasy. I was blown away by Final Fantasy Ten, but this game, doesn't make a dent.

They try something different with each installment, which I think is wonderful

Sorry to fans of Twelve, but this is Final Fantasies low point.

I don't really like it either... but your points aren't very researched at all...

Tiamat3710

10-14-2007, 03:42 PM

Yiazmat

10-14-2007, 06:19 PM

I can understand why Rikku is so obsessed with FFX. It's an incredible game!
It's a shame that some folks are so Anti-FFXII though. :confused: This isn't a game that you can one day, just decide to rent for a weekend and pick up and play for a couple of hours. I must confess that when I first played the game I was a bit skeptical and had a hard time grasping the battle system. Before I knew it over 282 hours had been invested in my first play through! I was simply blown away and fell in love with the battle system and everything else that the game has to offer. The "main" quest is just the beginning. The real FFXII is experienced by doing all of the hunts and side quests. Collecting all the different loot, weapons, armors, and accessories, is a game in itself! There's just so much to do and experience. It's now my absolute favorite Final Fantasy game! (thus far):D

Bolivar

10-14-2007, 08:50 PM

gudkid

10-15-2007, 11:34 AM

heck with this thread....
i've been reading this thread but i had to stop halfway through.
arguing, for me, is so primitive... just like a pack of cavemen going at each other for a piece of rock that is abundant around.
no matter how much so-called "reasoning" you put into it if you don't respect others' opinion, you'll end up being Hitler. no one's forcing you to like it but please don't force your side. i have played both games and i enjoyed both. i don't consider 10 better than 12 nor the other way around. each has their own flaws but have more good stuff in it. i like the entire series because each one of it's games are great in its own way.
no single game becomes appreciated if it's compared to other games' standards coz each has got standards of their own. just like what's happening here.
i hate it.

i suddenly recall a saying...
keep your mouth shut when you got nothing good to say...
all i'm saying is that saying something negative is good as long as it does not condemn something... hell, being a fanboy's cool but it becomes wrong if you start to demean other games.
FF10 and 12 was not all good but it was great for me. so please stop this bull...

demondude

10-15-2007, 07:44 PM

what are you talking about 12 and 10 suck but especially 12 if people want to play a GOOD FF then do any game underneath the number nine

this game is so star wars theres the poor guy vaan (luke skywalker) the princess ashe (princess leia) the old but wise person basch (ben kenobi) theres the guy with smart ass comments and owns an airship (milenium falcon) balthier (han solo) theres fran the half human half animal (chewbacca) the wimpy annoying one penelo (c3po) and lord vayne which is basically darth vader i mean there called the freakin empire

It may have some inspiration from the star wars series but that dosent make it a bad game.
The only reasoning you seem to have is that star wars is slightly similar.
And I don't know what your on about by saying X sucks.

heck with this thread....
i've been reading this thread but i had to stop halfway through.
arguing, for me, is so primitive... just like a pack of cavemen going at each other for a piece of rock that is abundant around.
no matter how much so-called "reasoning" you put into it if you don't respect others' opinion, you'll end up being Hitler. no one's forcing you to like it but please don't force your side. i have played both games and i enjoyed both. i don't consider 10 better than 12 nor the other way around. each has their own flaws but have more good stuff in it. i like the entire series because each one of it's games are great in its own way.
no single game becomes appreciated if it's compared to other games' standards coz each has got standards of their own. just like what's happening here.
i hate it.

i suddenly recall a saying...
keep your mouth shut when you got nothing good to say...
all i'm saying is that saying something negative is good as long as it does not condemn something... hell, being a fanboy's cool but it becomes wrong if you start to demean other games.
FF10 and 12 was not all good but it was great for me. so please stop this bull...

Good point but there is a difference between debating and arguing.
Though I completely agree with the fanboy comment.

Nifleheim7

10-15-2007, 09:22 PM

Bolivar

10-17-2007, 10:15 PM

what are you talking about 12 and 10 suck but especially 12 if people want to play a GOOD FF then do any game underneath the number nine

this game is so star wars theres the poor guy vaan (luke skywalker) the princess ashe (princess leia) the old but wise person basch (ben kenobi) theres the guy with smart ass comments and owns an airship (milenium falcon) balthier (han solo) theres fran the half human half animal (chewbacca) the wimpy annoying one penelo (c3po) and lord vayne which is basically darth vader i mean there called the freakin empire

I said this shortly after the game came out and no one wanted to hear it, except I said Penelo was R2D2...

"I'm Vaan Ratsbane, I'm here to rescue you!"

I also completely agree with Tiamat about the Star Wars part...it was one of the reasons that after a while i stoped caring about the plot and characters.I love the old Star Wars trilogy but Final Fantasy has an obligation to always be unique.That Uniqueness unfortunately was lost with FFXII.It was very inspired by hollywood and an obvious attempt to lure the average western (mostly American) gamer.
BUT,i do like the game.It had so many other things that i liked that i forgive them for the lack of story and characters.Of course i know that this is only a matter of personal taste as i've come to know many people that liked it's story.

i also noticed recently the way the theme song delivered is alot like how they do it in the beginning of each star wars with the credits, which is alot in the same way they presented each "Chapter" of Omdore's diary.

The huge orchestral buildup and then the unleashing of the main theme...except its the final fantasy epilogue or wahtever and not the star wars one. If anything I think it's intentional, FF plays alot off of stereotypes and if so, I think it worked.

Quindiana Jones

10-18-2007, 06:00 PM

I think 12's a great game. Different, yes. Annoying, sometimes. Good, absolutely. Some parts I hate, some parts I love. But I can say that about any game.

Overall, I think 12 is the only good FF on PS2. I hate 10, and 10-2. Well, not hate really. 10 was alright. 10-2 was rubbish though.

Reasoniamalive

10-19-2007, 12:14 PM

I'd go through posting all my feelings about why I like this game and don't like it...but it's just easier to copy/paste from another forum I commented on this same topic:

BE WARNED THIS TEXT CONTAINS SPOILERS...THANKY!

I found XII extremely unsatisfying - mostly because of the storyline...or lack thereof. There is simply not enough character or story development. Even later on, when the world is falling apart - there's no evidence of it ~ you can freely roam anywhere in the world without it blowing apart or w/o insighting mass hysteria (unlike 6, 7, 10, etc.) Be warned; however, as I was in love with FFX - you may not appreciate my review. I gave FFXII 6.8/10. It would have gotten a much better score with a little more work by the developers to get rid of some monotony, ditch the license board for something a little bit more exponential (like the sphere grid) and story/character development.

My advice: Borrow it from a friend or go in on it together to pass 1 1/2 months away kicking the crap out of baddies. You'll be happy, your friend will be happy, and you won't think you've wasted $50 US (whatever it is by you) + money for the guide...

BTW: I've since played through the game again and have slightly improved ratings for it...it definitely does grow on you on seperate playthroughs.

gudkid

10-19-2007, 02:42 PM

of course there are always blindspots on each and every game.... but you tend to enjoy it once you repeatedly play it disregarding the bad stuff.
nothing can annoy you unless you let it annoy you. :D
plus, like any other game, it actually grows on you... :)

Quindiana Jones

10-19-2007, 07:15 PM

Oh God, not the Sphere Grid. That was like FF cancer. License Board is way better than that.

Nifleheim7

10-19-2007, 08:02 PM

Oh God, not the Sphere Grid. That was like FF cancer. License Board is way better than that.

No it isn't.:p
Sphere Grid gave you much more control on how you wanted to develop your character and it was more in sync with the game.There wasn't a need for grinding.
In FFXII by the time you got some of the better abilities,you didn't really need them because your level was way higher than the monsters you confronted.

Quindiana Jones

10-19-2007, 08:38 PM

I don't want control. It's an RPG. You get a mage, a fighter, a ranger, and some random thing that no-one is sure what it is. That's how it should be. :D

License grid still isn't as good as set jobs.

Captain Maxx Power

10-20-2007, 12:34 AM

Nifleheim7

10-20-2007, 12:40 AM

I don't want control. It's an RPG. You get a mage, a fighter, a ranger, and some random thing that no-one is sure what it is. That's how it should be. :D

Yeah,that would be great.A decade ago!!!:p

The way i see it Sphere Grid was a step forward,and so was the License Board even though i wasn't 100% happy with it.

Reasoniamalive

10-20-2007, 02:44 AM

You people and your opinions make me sick!

Actually, scratch that. You people and your assumption that your opinion is right makes me sick. Seriously, listening to you people picking apart people's arguments as to why people like/don't like a guy and explain why they're wrong is just...poor form really.

Seriously guys, it's one thing to profess your love of a game, but to pull people's arguments apart just to reaffirm it? Get out more is all I'll say.

o.O ...and you are SOOO much more grown up for berrating them??

Why even bother? They're just going to do it anyway. = P People have opinions. While I agree we don't need to pick out each other's flawed thinking - its just a discussion...no one is going to lose any knee caps here - I promise!! XD

gudkid

10-20-2007, 07:28 AM

unless we see each other =P

hhr1dluv

11-12-2007, 03:37 AM

Alright...I will admit that, at the moment, I'm not very interested in Final Fantasy XII either. I have loved FF X, VII, VI, and even, to an extent, X-2. I have also played FF VIII, IX, and IV, and though I have not finished any of these, I have really enjoyed what I have seen in them.
Now, I can't remember how far I got in XII before I lost interest...perhaps maybe an hour or two after you go to the Viera village...This game has yet to pique my interest. I understand that we all have different tastes when it comes to games, and since I see that many people in this thread are comparing X and XII, I will admit that my tastes are probably closer to the sentimentality of X.

Now, I know that I am not as well-versed in FFs as many of you here. I have not really played any of the earlier ones, nor have I played any of the Tactics titles (which I hear are similar to XII). Yet, every single FF that I have played, IV-X has had charm. The most important aspect of a FF to me is attachment to the characters. After all, you're controlling these people for 40-60 hours! In every game I have grown to love the characters. One grows to know them as fictional people. Even in FF IV, which I didn't get far in AT ALL (I think I just had to find a black chocobo),I was very abruptly drawn in by its characters. I symphathized with Tellah over Anna, and I pitied poor Edward after she was killed. Kain and Cecil are fascinating! Yes, I'm playing to see how the overall plot will be solved, but I'm also playing to see what happens to these characters. XII's characters, IMO, leave something to be desired. As a result of what seems to be underdeveloped characterization, XII's overall story seems to fall flat. I feel no desire to play because I do not care about what happens to these characters. I feel as though I don't know much about them! It seems to me that, since FF XII is attempting a political storyline, it has fewer opportunities to realistically link its characters to the action. But I keep finding myself wishing that Vaan, Penelo, Fran, etc. were doing more than just observing political strife. Eh...this is post is getting long and garbled.
Yes, I could be very wrong...maybe the XII will get better. I'm hoping it will. I also have to say: why all the vitriol against FF X and FF VII?

Ari

11-13-2007, 09:41 PM

So much arguing over such a simple difference in opinions. Oh well, it can't be helped I guess.

I'm not gonna argue anybody else's opinions, but while we are on the topic of FF12 ...& 10

Ive been a huge Final Fantasy fan for years, and years, however due to being raised in a slightly poor family, and not having a job when I was younger, I couldn't afford the PS2 until just last January.

I played all the final fantasy games up until they moved onto PS2 with X. Then, I was cut off like an alcoholic in a bar. I ended up replaying all of the old FF titles, and other classic RPG's over and over again. Some too many to count. Until finally in January of 2007 I bought a PS2 and on that same day I also purchased both FF10 and FF12, with absolutely no knowledge of either game besides what I had seen on tv.

I forced myself to play through 10 before 12 since 12 was far prettier and probably made huge advancements. I didn't want to taint my experience with 10 by doing it immediately after beating 12.

I heard so much hype about 10 over the years, and personally, even though it focused a lot on the story, and went a little farther then other games have in the past. I wasn't really blown away like I imagined I would be from the trailers, and reviews, and pictures. Maybe its just because I spent so much time stuck with the previous generations of Final Fantasy games, and other RPG's, but it didn't grab hold of me in the same way. Perhaps it would have been different if I had played it back when it first came out. I dunno. So before anyone thinks I am another FF10 fanboy, you can forget that assumption ;)

When it came to 12... I had so much expectation for this game. All the built up hype on tv, and the internet, it looked and sounded beautiful. The world appeared to be "my dream fantasy world". The voice acting was amazing, and the game looked so smurfing beautiful!
With all these things it had going for it, including a new and interesting battle system, I wanted to bad so love this game and enjoy it. I kept playing all the way up until the end constantly waiting, and hoping it would capture me. But in the end, it just left me wanting more. In my "personal opinion" the game felt incredibly dry and shallow. Even though there were tons of side quests to do, and a large world of enemies to explore. For me, an RPG has always been about the story, and the characters and their growth, more then graphics, or cool new battle concepts. That's why we all loved and played through those long 2D turn based, repetitive-battle RPG's growing up.

It just felt to me like they put all of their effort into making the game look and play nice, and never had any time to invest in the actual core of what makes a good Final Fantasy. Don't get me wrong now, I don't believe all games need to have a hugely drawn out sappy love story. There is nothing wrong with taking a slightly more political, approach to things. Other games have done it in the past, but succeeded.

I also don't have a problem with changes in the games template, like chocobos, or moogles, or whatever else. However there is always still those defining things in all final fantasy titles that allow it to maintain a certain structure, and yet still allow it to change many other aspects, making each game totally different.

The battle system was pretty cool I think. It was something new. However I still almost prefer the old fashioned, stand in a line in the battle mode and take turns hacking away at each other. There are many ways of expanding on this method, or making it more fast paced, so you can quickly land in battle and be done with it in a second, or hit one command and be out of battle. You don't need all the fancy STAT screens at the end of every fight either.

With FF12 I enjoyed being able to wander around freely, and dodge enemies, and explore without being thrown into the same battle screen over and over again, breaking up the game play, but when it came down to actual fighting, or boss fights. I just wasn't too fond of it. It felt like it was just the exact same battle system as always only I would run around aimlessly in a certain area, which never really gave me any advantage like avoiding certain attacks. Plus you still had the time bar, so you would have to choose your moves just like you always did, and still you would have to wait for a time gauge to fill. Really one of the only significant differences was that you could run around a particular ares, and get different angles of the battle, and so could your enemy, making it slightly more involving. But then of course, there was also the fact that now your entire party could sit and hack away with gambits all at the same time, without slowly going through each persons turn. However I miss the strategy that used to be involved where you had to think ahead, and cure because the enemy's turn was coming next and if you didn't you were screwed. On top of everything, when you got in a boss fight or something in FF12, it was a little over the top with commotion, hard to see anything happening, and build a mood from it. It was like BAM your in a fight with a boss, and then there is :skull::skull::skull::skull: flying everywhere and sounds coming from your tv, and a giant red HP bar, and then before you know it bang, its all over again and you casually walk away.

I found any of the battles in Lufia, Lunar, Chrono Trigger, or Breath of Fire to be far more intense than anything in FF12. The suspense was excruciating! It would all build up with such intensity and then wham! the screen shatters into little peaces and the intense boss music would begin blasting away, and you start hacking away at each other taking caution with every turn, because one slip up could mean the end, and each and every single turn the boss took, was intense, because you had to sit and wait and let it happen, and watch the damage land on your head, before you could react. It might be a huge devastating hit, or a miss, or maybe he would do something weak. I remember sweating for long periods of time during those kinds of fights.

FF12... I barely remember each one... It happens to quick and forceful. it leaves you feeling raped or violated, and confuised haha.

This might sound kind of stupid, or hypocritical, considering we are talking about final fantasy here but... When I played FF12, the best way I can summarize the entire game is, "cross the plains of [blank] get to the temple of [blank], obtain the [blank] form within this temple, then cross the plains/desert/woods of [blank], all while being cut up in the middle with little shallow bits of story that are hard to follow, and hard to get involved in, overshadowed by amazingly beautiful graphics and cut scenes, and very impressive voice acting.
I realize this is the case for most Final Fantasy games, however, there is generally a greater emphasis on the characters, and your party, and their journey (the story) that allows you to get really involved. On top of that, when your "crossing the plains of [blank]" in almost all of the other titles, it didn't feel like you were actually doing that, because lets face it. That's rather boring... In FF12, you literally had to cross over vast landscapes, that although very beautiful, got very tedious, very quickly I think.
In the end I felt like I kind of wasted a lot of time. I enjoyed myself I guess. But I felt bored for most of the time, and I didn't seem to take a lot away from that game where you could talk about different parts in the story with your friends like I used to do in school when I was younger. I just wish I had rented it, instead of paying $60. I probably shouldn't have bought FF10 either for that matter, as Ive only ever felt the need to play through it once. However I still find myself wanting to play over and over again, the previous generations of the Final Fantasy series. Am I crazy?

Anyhow, thats just my opinion on the game. Not really a huge fan of 10 either. It was alright.