I'd like some advice on Japanese grammar...

[Peter_20]

I posted a thread similar to this one a while ago, but that one's an old thread now; and this is a new kind of question anyway.

I was just wondering, is it true that words are spelt by using the signs for certain sounds?
For example, if there are signs for "ma", "sa", "mu" and "ne", then can I just write those signs and thus spell the word "masamune"?

Oh, and one more thing:
what letters are used in the Japanese video games?
Kanji?

[41-Inches-Wide]

I suck in Kanji, so whenever I write MASAMUNE I write it in hiragana form and just write, enclosed in parenthesis beside the word, indicating that I mean a "sword", that it's not a surname or a place or whatever else.
But there is a specific kanji for the MASAMUNE, and for the life of me I have no idea what it is.

Writings used in most japanese games are a mix of hiragana, katakana, and kanji

[Peter_20]

Writings used in most japanese games are a mix of hiragana, katakana, and kanjiEh... why? XD
Are they trying to make understanding the Japanese video games even trickier than it already is?

[41-Inches-Wide]

Well actually, you use hiragana when you write japanese words in japanese characters. you use the katakana for words borrowed from English. Like "AISU KURIMU", it is written EXCLUSIVELY in katakana.
There is a big difference between hiragana and katakana (curved vs. angled strokes), to stop it from being all wierd and messy. It's like this, if you write AISU KURIMU in hiragana form, the japanese will be all like WTF MAN, DUN UNDERSTAND. But when you indicate through katakana that this is a 'borrowed' word, then it's all good.

As for the kanji, that's a pretty long story i dont understand it myself I am terrible at kanji. But anyway you only use kanji for the specific japanese words that have their own characters. Like for example, you don't write FLOWER in katakana (FURAWA-.xD) because it has a japanese equivalent already, which is "HANA". But they use kanji to signify -AGAIN- the difference of the various 'hana's' (i.e. hana means nose) also. The HANA "nose" has its own kanji. And the HANA "flower/blossom" has its own also.

EDIT:
Long-ass post. hope i helped a little

[Marshall Banana]

Even though dialogue in Final Fantasy games contains a lot of Kanji, the games' menus and character names tend to be spelled with Katakana and Hiragana. Thus, they're pretty easy to figure out. =D

<center><img src="http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m285/fofonda/Misc/ffvj.gif"></center>

If I'm not mistaken, all installments prior to FFV use no Kanji.

[41-Inches-Wide]

Why don't you just play English versions? I know I do. :jess:

[Marshall Banana]

Why don't you just play English versions? I know I do. :jess:
Because Japanese is fun and pretty! XP

[41-Inches-Wide]

Why don't you just play English versions? I know I do. :jess:
Because Japanese is fun and pretty! XP

I CONCUR!

[Peter_20]

Even though dialogue in Final Fantasy games contains a lot of Kanji, the games' menus and character names tend to be spelled with Katakana and Hiragana. Thus, they're pretty easy to figure out. =D

<center><img src="http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m285/fofonda/Misc/ffvj.gif"></center>

If I'm not mistaken, all installments prior to FFV use no Kanji.Hey, I just noticed that Reina's name on that picture indeed became "Rena" in Katakana. :D

[Peegee]

おまえはもう死んでいる

Omae wa mō shindeiru

Hiragana - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiragana#Table_of_hiragana-r.C5.8Dmaji)
For 'english' sounds
Katakana - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katakana#Table_of_katakana)

[JKTrix]

If you don't know enough actual Japanese vocabulary, I wouldn't bother too much about reading. Depending what game you're playing, someone should have a walkthrough/story guide on gamefaqs.com or a similar site.

As for 'what words' are in games, it also depends on the age group. Games clearly meant for younger folks would have more hiragana and basest-of-basic-level kanji. Sometimes they might have furigana (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furigana) above the harder words. Actually, in Zelda: Phantom Hourglass, you can touch every piece of kanji that comes up in dialogue to see the hiragana pronounciation for it. I thought that was a nifty feature when I found it out.

Software meant for more mature folks would likely have more kanji for the common words and names. A game like Densha de Go! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Densha_de_Go!) where you're controlling a train, all the location names would be in appropriate kanji.

So yeah. Unless you do know a good bit of vocabulary, don't stress too much about reading dialogue in these games. Games with voice really help too. I mentioned in a separate thread that I was playing Another Century's Episode 3 (http://www.play-asia.com/SOap-23-83-1u6b-71-r-49-en-15-another+century-84-j-70-23yw.html), and there's a *lot* of kanji in here. However, there's also a lot of spoken dialogue, and a great deal of Katakana as well. The majority of the mechs in the game have Foreign-type names (i.e. God Gundam, Nirvash, Black Selena) so they are all in Katakana.

I tend to only import action-type games from Japan, as objectives are usually pretty clear. RPGs are a no-go for me, despite my decent-and-getting-better grasp of the language.

[Peter_20]

Just one more question:

How do you write separate consonants?
I can only find syllables like "ta", "pa", "ma" and so on.
What about the actual letters "t", "p" and "m"?

[JKTrix]

Japanese doesn't use "letters", it uses phonetic sounds. 41-Inches said in one of his posts something like "AISU KURIMU", which is Ice Cream. That is how you would 'spell' it in Katakana and 'say' it in Japanese.

Vowel sounds and the 'N/M' sound are the only syllables that have their own individual kana. Everything else has the consonant sound linked with the vowel sounds.

[Peter_20]

Hey, I got a few more quick questions. :D

#1:
How do you spell dipthonghs?
I can't really find any site that explains it.

#2:
Is it true that most of the Japanese letters are signs for objects?
Are these pretty much the only signs you need to learn?

http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/hiragana_b.jpg

Oh, and I'm aware that '' = voiced versions of other letters.

[starseeker]

Hey, I got a few more quick questions. :D

#1:
How do you spell dipthonghs?
I can't really find any site that explains it.


Japanese doesn't really have dipthongs, but they're spelled by putting two vowel kana together.

ai: a + i = あい



#2:
Is it true that most of the Japanese letters are signs for objects?
Are these pretty much the only signs you need to learn?

http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/hiragana_b.jpg

Oh, and I'm aware that '' = voiced versions of other letters.

Kanji are the signs used for objects, nouns, adjectives etc. But you can't read Japanese using only kanji. Some words don't have a kanji and for verbs, kanji are only used for the stem. The tense is marked using hiragana, called okurigana.
Example:

食べます　＝　食べ　＋　ます
I eat = the kanji for 'to eat' + the okurigana 'masu' which makes it the present (non-past)

[Peter_20]

So, will I get anywhere by learning the Hiragana signs?
I seem to find them a lot in Japanese video game scripts.

I can write simple words like "Ma-sa-mu-ne" by putting the Hiragana letters together.
Is this the way to go when writing sentences as well?

[The Summoner of Leviathan]

So, will I get anywhere by learning the Hiragana signs?
I seem to find them a lot in Japanese video game scripts.

I can write simple words like "Ma-sa-mu-ne" by putting the Hiragana letters together.
Is this the way to go when writing sentences as well?

Japanese syntax differs from English and other Indo-European languages. In the most simple form Japanese sentences are as follow:

topic-commentary

The topic is marked off by what we call a particle (think of them like prepositions, but after the word so more like "post-positions"). Then the commentary follows with the finite verb at the end.

Example (not using hiragana because I am too lazy to make my keyboard type it).

watashi wa daigakusee desu.

"Watashi" is "I". "wa" marks "watashi" as the topic (i.e. I am talking about myself). "daigakusee" means "college student" (if I remember correctly and "desu" is a copula verb which equates two things (in other words it translates to "is").

So what I said was:

I am a college/university student.

As for kanji vs hiragana, you could write it in hiragana instead of using the kanji but it would seem as a less sophisticated way of writing. The difference in homonyms are usually realized through context in writing or pitch in oral. Japanese uses pitch, not tone to put emphasis on the syllables.

[Jimsour]

Well yes, its their alphabet. Its like trying to learn English without learning the latin alphabet.

Sentences will use hiragana, katakana and kanji all toghether, the sentence 私のなまえはジムです uses kanji for "watashi", hiragana for "no namae wa", katakana for my name "Jimu", and hiragana again for "desu" which finalises the statement.

If your looking to be able to understand japanese games you should remember they are written for native or at least someone who can understand Japanese in a passing day living in Japan. I can read hiragana and katakana and a few kanji and I do lessons at university but I'd not be able to play a video game in Japanese.

[aquatius]

If you enable Japanese typing on your computer, you can type in hiragana and convert it into kanji by just pressing the space bar.

[Peter_20]

Another question here...

How do you spell the sounds "chu" and "ju"?
They don't exist in the alphabet tables.

[ReloadPsi]

Why don't you just play English versions? I know I do. :jess:

Same reason I play FF7 in German and FF8 in French: Practice.

[Shoeberto]

Another question here...

How do you spell the sounds "chu" and "ju"?
They don't exist in the alphabet tables.
Those involve "glide" rules. You take the root sound ("chi" and "ji" in this case) and then add a small "y" character next to it to produce the sound. So "chu" is chi+small yu, and the same with ju. If you wanted cho, it'd be chi+small yo. This works for basically all consonant+i characters.

[Levian]

I have FFV in Swedish. :)

Karnak slottet exploderar om tio minuter!

[Peter_20]

I have FFV in Swedish. :)

Karnak slottet exploderar om tio minuter!How did you get that?! :eek:
Is it some fan translation?

[The Summoner of Leviathan]

Another question here...

How do you spell the sounds "chu" and "ju"?
They don't exist in the alphabet tables.
Those involve "glide" rules. You take the root sound ("chi" and "ji" in this case) and then add a small "y" character next to it to produce the sound. So "chu" is chi+small yu, and the same with ju. If you wanted cho, it'd be chi+small yo. This works for basically all consonant+i characters.

For visual reference, since I am too lazy to set-up my Japanese keyboard input, go here (http://www.epochrypha.com/japanese/kana_tables.html).

Scroll down to the glide section to see what they look like when written.

[Peter_20]

Another question:

I saw a Japanese scene from Final Fantasy 10 right now, and they seemed to add some weird inverted C sign everywhere, but it was never separately pronounced.
For example, when Tidus says "makasetokete", in the beginning, I can see the signs for ma-ka-se-to-ke-?-te, and the question mark is where I spot that inverted C thing.
It looks like the sign for "u" without a mark above it.

What is this?

[Marshall Banana]

っ is the same as つ (tsu), but it's smaller. It's placed before a symbol to make a double consonant with it. See:

せっしょうまるさまはかわいい！
Sesshoumaru-sama wa kawaii!

[Peter_20]

Thanks, Marshall banana.
However, I've got another question as well.

Take a look at this Japanese version of the Final Fantasy 10 opening. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLPSuVywHfE&mode=related&search=)

What do the Kanji signs between 00:01 - 00:05 mean?
You know, the two very first signs, and then the full sign that obviously is pronounced "hora" or something.

[Azure Chrysanthemum]

*moves to Study Hall*

[Zeromus_X]

That would be 'saigo' (最後), which means 'last', 'end', or 'conclusion', or something along those lines.

[Jimsour]

っ is the same as つ (tsu), but it's smaller. It's placed before a symbol to make a double consonant with it. See:

せっしょうまるさまはかわいい！
Sesshoumaru-sama wa kawaii!

Yes, thats it basically. っ marks a double consonant.

Personally I think video games / anime are the worst places to learn Japanese. Would you speak English like the characters of FFXII ?

[goth-love]

the only thing i know in japanese is greatings and the song i heard on ffx suteki da ne(isnt it beautiful).

[Zeromus_X]

Please don't revive threads that are this old.