Enough credit?

[Vincent Valentine 007]

Do you think final fantasy 8 gets enough credit? To me it seems it gets bashed the most out of all the final fantasy games most people point to the story saying its weak but I disagree for a game the story is good and I don’t understand why people don’t get the love story whats not to get? I think the graphics at the time were very good and the game play equally as good, in my opinion its up there with the best!

[Goldenboko]

I think FFVIII gets too much credit :rolleyes2

[MJN SEIFER]

If you like it, it doesn't get enough credit.

If you don't it get's to much.

I like it.

[Namelessfengir]

i like the story fine i just didn't like rinoa

[Bahamut2000X]

I think FFVIII gets too much credit :rolleyes2

[Ouch!]

I don’t understand why people don’t get the love story whats not to get?
I understand the love story. It's not a matter of me not getting it; rather, it's a matter of me thinking it was poorly paced and weakly developed.

FFVIII isn't a bad game by any stretch--it tops many other games easily--but I consider it my least favorite in the series for many reasons.

Also, I think FFVIII gets its fair share of credit. I think it's just the only game in the series where the hate is more vocal than the love.

[MJN SEIFER]

I understand the love story. It's not a matter of me not getting it; rather, it's a matter of me thinking it was poorly paced and weakly developed.


In my opinion, it was the best developed love story, but that's mainly because I can realted to it.

[Bahamut2000X]

I don’t understand why people don’t get the love story whats not to get?
I understand the love story. It's not a matter of me not getting it; rather, it's a matter of me thinking it was poorly paced and weakly developed.

To quote the great walkthrough thread of "Let's Play FFVIII"

"They're in love. Which is sort of weird because in the entire 35 hours they've known each other they've said about a hundred words to each other. *Robert's played cards with Dr. Kadowaki more than that."

*Note the person renamed Squall to Robert in their game.

I think they summed up the love story well enough. It wasn't that good. Really FF II, I thought had a better love story going.

Really the weak points VIII had was it's terrible pacing on the story, it's confusing storyline that never went anywhere, a terrible story implementation, undeveloped characters who are 'just there', and well I could go on, but in short the story was terrible. The premise was good but they failed after Disc 1 if not even earlier.

As for the GOOD points, it had some good graphics, some of the best for the era, they transitioned real time graphics and FMV's real well too. The battle and junction system were interesting but have a few flaws (as with any game though). The 2 main vehicles were interesting in the game as well. I enjoyed Garden as a vehicle, and Ragnarok was just plain cool.

But really flashy graphics and an interesting battle system can't overshadow weak characters and lack of story.

[Flying Mullet]

Bahamut2000X summed up most of my thoughts on FFVIII nicely.

The biggest reason I don't like FFVIII is everything in it feels like a chore, from obtaining cards playing Triple Triad(which I find boring) for item refinement to drawing magic from enemies then upgrading it, ad nauseum. I have no care to explore the world and the story feels like it relies on character clichés more than developing it's own unique cast, plot and feel. If a game lacks both an interesting story and fun exploration/item discovery system, there's nothing left in the game for me.

Yes, it does have some positives, but not enough to outweigh the negatives for me.

Also, FFVIII has the distinction of being the only game in the series I haven't finished(besides FFXII, which I'm still working on).

[Vivisteiner]

I think quite a few people thought some of the plot elements were unconvincing. Namely, the GFs causing memory loss and the huge whammy which is the Squall - Rinoa 'relationship.'

I thought the rest of the story was pretty good though. I do think it is overated.

[Bolivar]

VIII was doomed to get immense amounts of hate from the start. On one hand you had the prissy little SNES warriors who were infuriated at the popularity of VII, and it spilled over into VIII as well. Then you had the fans of FFVII, which was among many things, a story of revenge, who didn't want to see a story of teenage angst and love. Of course there were alot of people who played the earlier FF's, or FFVII, or even this one first and enjoyed it alot.

Then there was the fact that the gameplay, similar to FFXII, was misunderstood. I've seen alot of people (like spoony) who assume that you have to draw 99 of each spell for each character before moving on. In reality, that's like seeing the number next to "level" for each character in other FF's and assuming you have to get that to 99 before you can advance. You can draw a little here and there as you go and the experience makes for a much better one.

Up until maybe a year-year and a half ago I also thought the game was weak as hell. I thought junctioning was not only tedious but ineffective system for character development, and that Squall's relationship with Rinoa was completely unrealistic.

Well, I adopted the "draw as you go + refine" mentality and it made the game extremely playable. Also, when you take a second to think about the love story, honestly with an open mind, it is actually pretty damn realistic. I think it has one of the best stories in the series and possibly the best ending. The character development is very addictive and allows for you to make different party compositions each time you go back to replay it. As good as it is, I think yeah, it doesn't get enough credit. It's also notable in that the music really made a huge jump from the previous games. Some might not like the songs, but as far as sound quality, it was pretty noteworthy.

[Vincent Valentine 007]

Bahamut2000X summed up most of my thoughts on FFVIII nicely.

The biggest reason I don't like FFVIII is everything in it feels like a chore, from obtaining cards playing Triple Triad(which I find boring) for item refinement to drawing magic from enemies then upgrading it, ad nauseum. I have no care to explore the world and the story feels like it relies on character clichés more than developing it's own unique cast, plot and feel. If a game lacks both an interesting story and fun exploration/item discovery system, there's nothing left in the game for me.

Yes, it does have some positives, but not enough to outweigh the negatives for me.

Also, FFVIII has the distinction of being the only game in the series I haven't finished(besides FFXII, which I'm still working on).

you dont have to play the card game now do you? as for people not liking to draw it just sounds lazy to me! how can you say the story isnt interesting?

[BG-57]

You might find the poll results for this thread (http://forums.eyesonff.com/general-final-fantasy/108451-most-unreasonably-disliked-ff-title-now-33-more-fan-bias.html) interesting.

FFVIII happens to be my favorite next only to FFT. But it's not to everyone's taste.

[Flying Mullet]

you dont have to play the card game now do you? as for people not liking to draw it just sounds lazy to me! how can you say the story isnt interesting?
Your response to my justifications is so articulated. :rolleyes2

[NeoCracker]

FF VIII is the Victam of trying to do to much in one game. WAY, to much.

As a result, every kind of subplot mentioned is done halfassed, and isn't expanded upon.

GF Memory Loss for one. REally, did that even effect the game at all?
Oh wait, yes it does, it shows IRvine is a heartless bastard.

Note, he DIDN'T loose his memory like the others. And what happened when it was time to shoot edea? He didn't have a problem because she basically raised them, but because he didn't want to miss.

Any problems with this scenario?

[Vincent Valentine 007]

you dont have to play the card game now do you? as for people not liking to draw it just sounds lazy to me! how can you say the story isnt interesting?
Your response to my justifications is so articulated. :rolleyes2

haha does it need to be? sometimes its better to say what you think without all the jargon.

[Goldenboko]

VIII was doomed to get immense amounts of hate from the start. On one hand you had the prissy little SNES warriors who were infuriated at the popularity of VII, and it spilled over into VIII as well.
Oh yes, because thats totally the only reason I, or anyone else, doesn't like this game. Thats definitely it. It has nothing to do with the reasons we've given, its because we're arrogant and we can't articulate opinions.




you dont have to play the card game now do you? as for people not liking to draw it just sounds lazy to me! how can you say the story isnt interesting?
Your response to my justifications is so articulated. :rolleyes2

haha does it need to be? sometimes its better to say what you think without all the jargon.



Um. What? Why make this thread if when people give you good sound reasons why they don't like it, your going to answer with that.


The main reason I hated this game was its story was like throw up. I played FFVII all the way through payed attention to the story, and it at least kept in interested. But with FFVIII, I kept telling PuPu, "Do I have to watch this scene?"

Why? Because so many parts of the story where forced on you. I understand if they're trying to make the story show a coming of age of Squall. But why the hell would anyone put him in charge of Mercenary Base during a time of Crisis when he clearly has no leadership abilities (having a complete failure on the only mission he's lead), doesn't show and compassion for his subordinates, and really doesn't have much of a resume.

The love story was equally as forced. At first it was Rinoa trying to talk to him, Squall saying GTFO! STFU! Its not like he even wanted to say something different, as his thoughts where often much of the same. Later on he had these random hiccups of compassion toward her that would fade as soon as they arrived.

[Raebus]

FF8 is a brilliant game. :)

It doesn't get enough credit imo.

[Flying Mullet]

haha does it need to be? sometimes its better to say what you think without all the jargon.
Yes, actually, it does. And my response was a simple, straight-forward post, whereas your response is vague jargon. I outlined a very specific set of reasons why I didn't like FFVIII, explaining each one. Your response was incoherent and pointless. You ignored what I wrote and invented reasons I never stated to argue against, such as drawing. I said it was tedious and boring, like a chore, which has nothing to do with laziness. You also asked me how I could not like the story when I specifically stated why I didn't like the story in my post. As Boko said, don't bother making discussion threads if you're not going to bother putting effort into an intelligible debate.

[Bolivar]

VIII was doomed to get immense amounts of hate from the start. On one hand you had the prissy little SNES warriors who were infuriated at the popularity of VII, and it spilled over into VIII as well.
Oh yes, because thats totally the only reason I, or anyone else, doesn't like this game. Thats definitely it. It has nothing to do with the reasons we've given, its because we're arrogant and we can't articulate opinions.

Okay, Gobo, you seriously need to chill out. I never said that was the only reason; you've convinced me that you didn't read past the second sentence because I gave another one after that, so, WTF are you talking about. And nowhere in my post did I suggest that those were "THE 0NLY 2 REZONS P0$$IBLE!!!@21!!". Furthermore your lack of reading comprehension is astounding, since I listed those as why it was doomed from the start, not why people would have hate for it after they played it.

I know you're a little young, but here's a phrase you obviously need to incorporate into your vocuabulary:

"Straw Man Fallacy". Please. I'm begging you.

And Mullet, cut him some slack, and by saying that he invented reasons you never stated, you are inventing arguments he never made. You said you didn't like triple triad and drawing, he pointed out that you don't have to play TT, and that finding drawing tedious is lazy. I don't see where the problem is. Also, drawing is only as tedious as you make it, as I stated in my post you can play through the game drawing as you go, it obviously doesn't have to be tedious at all, so I tend to agree with him.

[MJN SEIFER]

Note, he DIDN'T loose his memory like the others. And what happened when it was time to shoot edea? He didn't have a problem because she basically raised them, but because he didn't want to miss.

Any problems with this scenario?


Yeah, I see the problems - YOU have misinterpreted it!

The real reason he couldn't shoot was because he knew who Edea really was, "not wanting to miss" was an excuse as he knew he couldn't reveal the truth what - something I understand perfectly.

[NeoCracker]

Note, he DIDN'T loose his memory like the others. And what happened when it was time to shoot edea? He didn't have a problem because she basically raised them, but because he didn't want to miss.

Any problems with this scenario?


Yeah, I see the problems - YOU have misinterpreted it!

The real reason he couldn't shoot was because he knew who Edea really was, "not wanting to miss" was an excuse as he knew he couldn't reveal the truth what - something I understand perfectly.

And yet not once in the entirety of the game is that touched upon.

While that may have been intended, there isn't, at any point in the game, a time when it hints at the possobility.

That my friend is bad writing, expecting a reader/player to peace it together without dropping some sort of hint that his thoughts were of not wanted to shoot her.

[Flying Mullet]

And Mullet, cut him some slack, and by saying that he invented reasons you never stated, you are inventing arguments he never made. You said you didn't like triple triad and drawing, he pointed out that you don't have to play TT, and that finding drawing tedious is lazy. I don't see where the problem is. Also, drawing is only as tedious as you make it, as I stated in my post you can play through the game drawing as you go, it obviously doesn't have to be tedious at all, so I tend to agree with him.
No, I won't cut him some slack. He called me lazy when he apparently didn't even read my post, asking a question that I plainly answered beforehand.

As I've stated, I find the entire concept of drawing tedious, no matter how you do it. Whether it's in one "power-leveling" session of a couple of battles, or drawing once per battle, I find having to go through the extra motions of drawing magic tedious. This isn't because I'm lazy, it's because I get bored having to draw magic in addition to carrying out the normal battle functions in combat.

Also, when he twisted my thoughts of drawing as tedious into laziness, he invented an argument for himself. If he didn't invent an argument, he would have discussed why drawing isn't tedious, such as you did, instead of saying I'm lazy.

What's really upsetting me here is that I've given simple reasons why I don't like the game. I didn't say anyone else was wrong for liking it, I understand that others will enjoy it and I'm glad they do. FFVIII has redeeming qualities, just not enough for me to enjoy it. But people can't let it be. They have act as if they are being personally attacked for liking the game and are in turn attacking me for my opinions on the game. If you're going to start a thread asking if a game is overrated, why others like it/don't like it, etc... then don't complain or get defensive when people post their opinions about it.

[Goldenboko]

VIII was doomed to get immense amounts of hate from the start. On one hand you had the prissy little SNES warriors who were infuriated at the popularity of VII, and it spilled over into VIII as well.
Oh yes, because thats totally the only reason I, or anyone else, doesn't like this game. Thats definitely it. It has nothing to do with the reasons we've given, its because we're arrogant and we can't articulate opinions.

Okay, Gobo, you seriously need to chill out. I never said that was the only reason; you've convinced me that you didn't read past the second sentence because I gave another one after that, so, WTF are you talking about. And nowhere in my post did I suggest that those were "THE 0NLY 2 REZONS P0$$IBLE!!!@21!!". Furthermore your lack of reading comprehension is astounding, since I listed those as why it was doomed from the start, not why people would have hate for it after they played it.

Wow if you thought I was angry there, I can't imagine the reaction I'd get if I was actually pissed. Would you have been happier if I through a little :rolleyes2 in to show I was only somewhat annoyed. Anyway.

First thanks for the jab reading comprehension I hate those tests :p

My remark was direct to the fact that everytime someone who enjoys old FFs makes a single bad remark to a new FF, eventually you say, 'Your just saying that because you liked the old games.' in some way shape or form.

And your comment did imply that fans of older games would have a predetermined verdict on a newer game, thus not actually take time to come up with an opinion without it being incredibly biased.

[Avarice-ness]

Story - I felt like I was trudging through mud to the end. I was never shocked nor excited during the plot. This game was the only Final Fantasy in which I didn't want to play the second I got home because I wanted to know what happened next.

GamePlay - Drawing -IS- tedious. There had been plenty of battles where I found myself realizing that I had no potions, then come to find out no cures either. So I try to draw a cure to save my party and it fails and the monster does an all character attack and I'm dead. I also feel that draws are a waste of a turn, it doesn't mean they -are- but I found myself using -alot- less magic in this game just because of the draw system.
Junctioning was okay I guess, I never really used it enough to get anything good out of it.


Personally, I feel that FFVIII had so many added things that it was too much, now if FFVIII were like an MMO setting and you weren't bound to a story line -that much- I feel that all the extra's would have been easier to deal with.

FFVIII to me just seems like your following the character instead of actually gaining the feel of the character. The character's themselves where pretty bland, so nearly anything they could do or say could easily be predicted by someone playing the game for the first time.

The graphics were nice though, although I believe when it comes to rating games graphics come last over story and gameplay and all others.

Either way, I play FFVIII when I get bored and -really- have nothing better to do. Usually if I do do a replay I'm not motivated enough to start playing again, which.. yeah leads to no more playing.
I think the only credit it should be given is it's graphics for it's time, but that's about it.

Also, since there's hostility I'd like to state.
I've played the game enough, I've tried to like it, I've formed my opinion since the game came out, if no one likes my opinion good for you, that's why it's an opinion, nothing anyone can say can change my veiws that have been formed over many years so trying to make me "see the light" will be in vain.

[Jessweeee♪]

I think there's a fair fans-to-haters ratio :p

[Avarice-ness]

I think there's a fair fans-to-haters ratio :p

The problem is is that some of the "haters" are merely people who arn't fans but they also don't hate the game.

[blackmage_nuke]

I rather enjoyed the game but note that when i first played, it was one of the first rpg games i played (the first being pokemon) and so my expectations for it was "this should be just like pokemon! yay!" So in this way my underdeveloped gaming mind thouroughly enjoyed it, and i guess that sort of just grew with me.

I think the game doesnt recieve too little credit or too much. It's a good game that alot of people like. It deserves that credit.

[Marshall Banana]

FFVIII has unique and pretty locations; I think they're overlooked. :onnanoko:

[Bolivar]

Mullet, I understand where you're coming from, and it's good to know that there's still people on this site who can accept the fact that other people might have a different opinion than they do. In every thread you're always a voice of reason and common sense.

And Gobo, I didn't think you were mad, but that sarcasm... was that really necessary? If you misinterpreted me, my bad man. And nothing I've ever said suggests that people who have played earlier games have a predetermined opinion. Everyone I know in real life who started with earlier FF's has a Playstation FF as their favorite, it's just a few angry cynics on the internet that you I across, and that's why I used the term "prissy little SNES warriors." BUT! That's not to say that everyone who prefers older games are delusional idiots. I love all the older FF's, I started RPGs in the "old school" and I know plenty of others who played through those games after starting with VII. I just happen to like some of the "newer" games better than some of the "older" games, if it's even appropriate to break them apart like that.

But! On other fronts, I must say again, that drawing is only as tedious as you make it. Here's one problem with that - YOU DONT HAVE TO DRAW AT ALL IN THE GAME!!! You can secure the refining abilities fairly quickly, and M-Stone pieces/Magic stones/Wizard Stones are all common drops.

[BG-57]

My issue with drawing isn't so much the process, but the fact that stats junctioned to magic go down if you use that magic. It creates a strange incentive to hoard magic and not actually use it. Since the most powerful spells raise stats the most, you'll want to use them the least.

But overall its a minor drawback.

[Marshall Banana]

But! On other fronts, I must say again, that drawing is only as tedious as you make it. Here's one problem with that - YOU DONT HAVE TO DRAW AT ALL IN THE GAME!!! You can secure the refining abilities fairly quickly, and M-Stone pieces/Magic stones/Wizard Stones are all common drops.
Even Stones aren't necessary. XP


10 Tents refine into 100 Curaga spells
Angelo's card refines into 100 Elixirs
Various boss cards refine into useful items

[Bolivar]

But! On other fronts, I must say again, that drawing is only as tedious as you make it. Here's one problem with that - YOU DONT HAVE TO DRAW AT ALL IN THE GAME!!! You can secure the refining abilities fairly quickly, and M-Stone pieces/Magic stones/Wizard Stones are all common drops.
Even Stones aren't necessary. XP


10 Tents refine into 100 Curaga spells
Angelo's card refines into 100 Elixirs
Various boss cards refine into useful items


not to mention all the other common drops and steals that refine into magic.

[McLovin']

FF8, mechanics of it aside as when I first played it I was a noob and didn't care about junctions or drawing crap, it was a great story with awesome music and settings that wowified this little boy so long ago ^_^

[Roogle]

I think that Final Fantasy VIII has a more diverse fanbase than other titles. Avid fans of Final Fantasy VIII tend to give the game more than enough credit when it comes to storyline or gameplay — sometimes both — rather than Final Fantasy VII which gets credit all across the board. I think that the diversity in the fanbase is more effective as it allows someone to understand why there is appreciation for this game rather than simply stating that it is a good game.

[LunarWeaver]

FF8 is a brilliant game. :)

It doesn't get enough credit imo.

:kaoclove:

I'm sure it has more fans than not and all that jazz.

[Vincent Valentine 007]

VIII was doomed to get immense amounts of hate from the start. On one hand you had the prissy little SNES warriors who were infuriated at the popularity of VII, and it spilled over into VIII as well.
Oh yes, because thats totally the only reason I, or anyone else, doesn't like this game. Thats definitely it. It has nothing to do with the reasons we've given, its because we're arrogant and we can't articulate opinions.




you dont have to play the card game now do you? as for people not liking to draw it just sounds lazy to me! how can you say the story isnt interesting?
Your response to my justifications is so articulated. :rolleyes2

haha does it need to be? sometimes its better to say what you think without all the jargon.



Um. What? Why make this thread if when people give you good sound reasons why they don't like it, your going to answer with that.


The main reason I hated this game was its story was like throw up. I played FFVII all the way through payed attention to the story, and it at least kept in interested. But with FFVIII, I kept telling PuPu, "Do I have to watch this scene?"

Why? Because so many parts of the story where forced on you. I understand if they're trying to make the story show a coming of age of Squall. But why the hell would anyone put him in charge of Mercenary Base during a time of Crisis when he clearly has no leadership abilities (having a complete failure on the only mission he's lead), doesn't show and compassion for his subordinates, and really doesn't have much of a resume.

The love story was equally as forced. At first it was Rinoa trying to talk to him, Squall saying GTFO! STFU! Its not like he even wanted to say something different, as his thoughts where often much of the same. Later on he had these random hiccups of compassion toward her that would fade as soon as they arrived.

well it is a game it isnt a movie! of course some of the story is a here and there i dont think any of the final fantasy have a sound story they are fantasies. As for being "articulated" haha i say what i think i dont have to explain things so a two year old can understand

[MJN SEIFER]

And yet not once in the entirety of the game is that touched upon.

While that may have been intended, there isn't, at any point in the game, a time when it hints at the possobility.

That my friend is bad writing, expecting a reader/player to peace it together without dropping some sort of hint that his thoughts were of not wanted to shoot her.

It is touched upon, during the very scene I'm talking about.

It doesn't need to be hammerd home, that was the real reason, it's obvious that "not wanting to miss" was an excuse. His descriptions are forced, and surely he could easily fire again if did miss?

I don't really concider that bad writing when viewed at that angle - it would have been bad writing if they had pressed on that scene to hard.

[NeoCracker]

And yet not once in the entirety of the game is that touched upon.

While that may have been intended, there isn't, at any point in the game, a time when it hints at the possobility.

That my friend is bad writing, expecting a reader/player to peace it together without dropping some sort of hint that his thoughts were of not wanted to shoot her.

It is touched upon, during the very scene I'm talking about.

It doesn't need to be hammerd home, that was the real reason, it's obvious that "not wanting to miss" was an excuse. His descriptions are forced, and surely he could easily fire again if did miss?

I don't really concider that bad writing when viewed at hat angle - it would have been bad writing if they had pressed on that scene to hard.

YEs, it was obvious.

But the problem is Irvine showed no signs that something like that was bothering him, and his nervousness on regular missions seemed extremely legit. During that time, there wasn't any reason to think something else was bothering him.

And then after that, that isn't even mentioned once. I will agree hammering in that scene would have been overdoing it and be bad writing, but given the above, it deserved at least a little attention.

They had a perfect opportunity to do some foreshadowing in that very scene, yet they completely blew it off.

Thats the same thing that pisses me off most about the rest of the game. They have all these good Ideas and opportunities to do great things, and they amount to nothing.

[Wolf Kanno]

Aw, I love the smell of fanboy crossfire first thing in the morning ;) Personally I feel VIII doesn't get enough credit for the things it really did and too much credit for the things it didn't do well.

VIII's an odd duck for me Technically I should hate it but for all its faults in its story, Squall's journey of growth hit close to home for me but then again the game came out in a trying time in my life. I could relate to Squall and his journey to learn how to open up to people. Though its gameplay is horribly broken and its story is a mix mash of poorly followed through ideas, the game is quite endearing to me.

Maybe cause its the game that taught me to hate VII fanboys (No, Squall is not Cloud and Tifa's son. No Garden is not a remade Midgard and SeeD has no connection to SOLDIER. No there is no Materia or Knights of the Round. No there is no relation between Seifer and Sephiroth. No, it has no connections whatsoever with VII in any way and no it doesn't suck because it isn't VII-2...:rolleyes2 ) I think of anything, I liked it cause it was daring and tried something new. Especially considering the fact RPGs were just starting to become mainstream worldwide. Non-Japanese gamers were just getting used to how the genre works and Square threw them a curve ball. Even Veteran players had to rethink how to do everything.

I think the Junction system was an interesting idea, I only wish it had been better balanced and better implemented in the story. A better level cap for spells (30 fires is all you need to get the maximum stat boost meaning excess spells can be used for casting), more balanced stat boosting (strength boosts are way too overpowered while its an act of god to get magic stats to do decent damage.) and make the GF not so damn powerful and easier to kill (perhaps summoning the GF halfs their HP so each time you spam them it becomes easier to kill them) but mostly I wanted explanation on what the GF were and there place in the world.

The story has too many ideas and are poorly implemented. Time traveling, witches, amnesia, child soldiers, politics, lost civilizations, space travel, natural disasters, love triangles, childhood rivalries, and a tale of growing up, not too mention a wealth of other crap I don't feel worth mentioning. A few of these ideas alone is all thats needed to make a good story but VIII has all of them and can never spend enough time to justify there purpose in the story. But then again there is another side of VIIIs storytelling...

Its one of only four FFs that actually has a main character and its story is completely revolved around said character (IV, VII, and X being the other three). For this reason you need to understand that the rest of the stuff is pointless. VIIIs plot is about Squall and his journey to learn how to love others. Its one of the only story elements thats actually consistent and well written in the game IMHO. At the end of the day, VIII doesn't give a damn about lousy love triangles, and time traveling witches. Its about Squall learning to open up and trust other people. To learn how to love himself and others. You can call it emo if you want, but its rather touching if you are willing to accept it for what it is.

This is just my opinion though...

[Bolivar]

MJN Seifer, I absolutely agree with you that this game didn't suffer from bad writing, but if you scan Irvine before the Edea assassination attempt, it says that he's been known to crack under pressure.

I can't believe Kanno just said a positive thing about a Nojima-written story and I agree with it. Alot of people have said that it "comes out of nowhere" but if you pay attention even from the very beginning it's easy to see Squall isn't the typical loner. Also I just remembered how emotional the whole outer space scene was. Even on my third or fourth time seeing it, I still honestly thought Rinoa was dead for like a split second... that was crazy.

[Big D]

FF8, mechanics of it aside as when I first played it I was a noob and didn't care about junctions or drawing crap, it was a great story with awesome music and settings that wowified this little boy so long ago ^_^That's how it was for me. It's only on the internet that people get together to bitch and whine about every little detail - the same level of vitriol and nitpicking very rarely, if ever, happens in actual publications or conversation.

[Bolivar]

FF8, mechanics of it aside as when I first played it I was a noob and didn't care about junctions or drawing crap, it was a great story with awesome music and settings that wowified this little boy so long ago ^_^That's how it was for me. It's only on the internet that people get together to bitch and whine about every little detail - the same level of vitriol and nitpicking very rarely, if ever, happens in actual publications or conversation.

And I thought I was the only one who noticed that!

[Corrugo]

I personally don't think it gets enough credit, but I dunno if I can give a good arguement cause I love the game, but I'll admit it had flaws.

Strangely enough, for me anyway, was I dislike how quickly it took to level up. Granted I hate leveling up, so another reason why I like FF8 so much, but it shouldn't have been as easy as it was.

The Junction System can easily be manipulated to get very good stats early on. (Getting Heal Refine (forget the actual name) and having lots of Tents will get you A LOT of Curagas, Junction that to HP to have around 3,000 or much later in the game 9,000)

The Limit Breaks can also be manipulated if you stay in Critical and never Cure. (Critical + Holy War = PWNAGE)

So in gameplay alone it's very easy to manipulate, but also helps alot if you don't like training (like me)

For the story.. Well once again I loved it all, but I'm smart enough to know there are many holes and problems with the story.

For example, the chances of those 5 growing up together, getting seperated then all meeting again, are near impossible. (Other than Squall, Seifer, Zell and Quistis who were all sent to Balamb.)
-What were the chances Selphie was sent to Balamb so close to the time they'd start their Seed Missions.
-What were the chances that Irvine would have been chosen as the SharpShooter? (I'm sure some people assumed he was the only one, but it is sort of hinted by Martine that there are others "Let me introduce an elite sharpshooter from Galbadia Garden. Kinneas! Irvine Kinneas!" He didn't say Our Only, he said AN meaning there's multiple.)
- WHY would they pick someone who cracks under pressure for such an important mission? (this question just popped in my head and it's a good one)


Most people dislike Final Fantasy VIII cause it's a love story (between Squall and Rinoa / Laguna and Julia / Rinoa and Seifer / Laguna and Raine. There's also Irvine and Selphia / Quistis(her crush) and Squall / Edea and Cid)

As a big fan of love stories, I see no real problem. But considering Squall's nature at the begining of the game, he did sort of fall for Rinoa too quick, but did he really? I'd like to quote Irvine now Irvine: "Hey, Selphie... That goes for you, too! Hmm... So, Sis was Ellone, eh? Everyone was fond of Sis, but you, Squall, you kept hoggin' her for yourself."

and any player of FF8 knows this quote..

"I'm...all alone. But I'm doing my best... I'll be ok without you, Sis. I'll be able to take care of myself."

He was always waiting for Sis to come back. If I understand Squall right I think he clings to people. He clinged to Ellone at first and then stopped caring for quite awhile then Rinoa shows up and he clings to her. In that sense it's not really a big love story and they didn't fall fast, Squall just got really clingy and Rinoa just wanted to be protected and loved.

Rinoa is usually many FF8 haters and FF8 lovers hate. Considering she covers most of the game, it's no wonder they dislike the game if they don't like her. I never seen a problem with her, but I have weird taste in girls. =P

She's the typical Girl In Danger right? Let me use my keen memory of VIII to see when she needed rescueing. Well first it was from Iguina things Edea.

- Rinoa was trying to prove she was strong, that she had a purpose and despite what Rinoa Haters claim, that she wasn't useless. She got the Odine Bangle thing, went after her and tried to get her to wear it. I didn't see Quistis, Zell and Selphie showing up after the assassination failed, did you? Rinoa was right there, as was Irvine.

My mind's going in order so I'll mention it was Rinoa who sort of saved Zell, Quistis, Squall and Selphie from D-District Prison. She was saved, and she forced Irvine to go help the others. (Note- Irvine knew he grew up with them but did HE go try and save them? Rinoa, who had barely known them went and tried to rescue them)

I may be missing one, but the next time she needs saved is when she was dangling from the Garden.

- Was it her fault a peice of the Garden broke? Hell I give her huge Kudos for being able to hang on so long. If memory serves at the end of Final Fantasy VII, Cloud was going to fall into the Life Stream and was dangling, he just about fell but was saved. No one mentions that though, do they? -.- Fanboys.. >Is a hypocrite<

After that it's Rinoa in Space (WHICH she wouldn't have been if Squall hadn't taken her there to save her. Then she was possessed. She had no control over going into space to free Adel's tomb.)


So, clearly, in my oppinion, Rinoa has more than shown her worlth throughout the game. She gets more crap than anyone else in the game, and she's done much more than Selphie, Zell, Quistis and Irvine. I mean looked at their screw ups

Zell - Announcing there from the Garden to Deling, was stupid. He's the reason the missiles were fired at Trabia and Balamb.

Selphie - Other than flying the Ragnorak I don't remember her doing much. If anything she's the useless one.

Quistis - Going in the training center after hours? FORSHAME
Okay that was really all that came to mind for her ^^;

Irvine - Failing to assassinate Edea, Leaving the others in Prison (yeah he was following orders but still..)

Squall - Wasting too much time playing Triple Triad (Okay that was my bad but still..)

This is all mostly my oppinions and I'm not trying to start an arguement. Just say why I think it doesn't enough credit, and mention why certain people don't get enough credit.


(I'm actually browsing through the Game Script and I noticed something)

I think someone in this topic claimed Squall had no Leadership skills but I'm noticing something. Granted I'm no leader so this is just my oppinion, but I think he's shown many Leadership traits. During the attempt of Edea's Assassination, Irvine suddenly decides he can't do it. Squall not only inspires Irvine to shoot the gun but also he was the first one to reach Edea after it failed. He didn't wait for back-up, didn't bring anyone. Just took off. He was going to ensure the mission was a success.

When he's being tortured he doesn't give up any information (Okay he doesn't really know anything but I always make make stuff up, the filling the world with flowers is too funny.)

His most notable Leadership quality, well I think so, is his following speech during The Garden Battle (Galabadia against Balamb) Everyone's hurt, some have died, ect

"......Everybody, this is Squall. How's everyone doing? You're all probably too tired to even stand up after all the fighting. But I want to everyone to listen to me... We still have a chance to win, and I need your help. This is going to be our final battle. We're going to attack them before they come in again. To do that, we're going to head straight into their Garden. So I want everyone to prepare for a major collision. Take care of the junior classmen. Irvine, Quistis, Zell, and Selphie will lead the attack into their Garden. As for everyone else, please support them if you can. SeeD was formed to fight the sorceress: at least, that's what I heard. And Garden was created to train SeeDs. So this battle is Garden's destiny and also our destiny. It's a grueling battle, and I'm sure you guys are all exhausted. But I don't want to have any regrets. I don't want anyone to look back and regret this day. So just this once, I want you guys to give everything you got!
For yourselves and for me!"

Isn't a leader suppose to inspire? That's what he does, and in result they ended up succeeding in reaching Edea.

People saying him not caring is not very leadership like, but it's just an act. Listen to his thoughts and you can tell he cares, he just doesn't WANT to want to care. He risks his life for Rinoa, risks his life plenty of times to ensure the mission is successful. He saves Zell aswell during the D-District Prison (He even mentioned his dislike for Zell when they first learned they were working together.)

Well this post is long enough so I'll stop now.