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Lionx
09-05-2008, 10:45 AM
ElmerThePointy of Gilgamesh server recently conducted a little social experiment where he asked both the JP and NA communities which questions they would most like to ask the other, but can't due to the language/culture gap. Elmer is a fluent Japanese speaker as well as a native English speaker and was able to post on Japanese sites as well as NA sites. He tallied the most popular questions that NA would like to ask JP, and that JP would like to ask NA, and posted them on NA and JP forums. Incidentally from the NA perspective, this all is happening on BG.

The answers from the Japanese players have come through and Elmer recently posted them on his blog:

Click here (http://www.jpbutton.com/?p=551)

The questions that were asked of the Japanese players were:

Are there any famous (or infamous) foreign players for the Japanese?
How do you feel about English-speaking players attempting to speak Japanese. (i.e. Using limited Japanese phrases, saying “w” etc.)
Why is using /check considered rude? For English-speaking players it is a fairly innocuous action.
Square Enix has mentioned many times that they are proud of their servers being unique, in the sense that many people from around the world are on the same server, instead of split up by region, and can communicate with the Auto-Translate feature.
Do you feel that this was a success or a failure? Do you think that mixing regions on each server was a failure? If you could choose, would you choose a JP only server?
Have you learned anything about the NA culture that you didn’t know before? Perhaps a polite/impolite gesture/phrase that seemed innocent to you? (e.g. we see /check as innocent, and JP find it rude)
Do you ever utilize English websites such as BlueGartr, FFXIAH, etc for foreigner research and opinions? Do the Japanese have a large end-game community forum, similar to foreign players using BlueGartr?
Is the Adaman Hauberk blue or purple? This debate has raged across NA forums since the dawn of time.
What is your main reason behind having “JP Only” or “English No Thanks” in your search comment? Is it because you prefer to speak in Japanese, or is it a problem with the way foreigners act?
Do JP players still use Skillchain+Magic Burst in their parties or do they TP burn like most NA/EU players do? Do you miss the SC/MB days?Do you wear certain earrings or rings in certain slots? For example, Suppanomimi on ear 1, CoP ring on ring 2. (this was a joke question to see how seriously people were taking this experiment)

Roogle
09-05-2008, 10:43 PM
The answers were an affirmation of what I found the general consensus of most Japanese players to be towards North American players. As representatives of our respective cultures, we must all make the effort to appreciate and understand each other.

It is a shame that language barriers still exist in this day and age.

Miriel
09-06-2008, 02:05 AM
The language thing is interesting because you wouldn't think that Japanese words typed out in English would impress people so much. Isn't there a way through Windower that lets you type in Japanese characters?

Roogle
09-07-2008, 08:08 AM
I speak limited Japanese by using a web translator, checking the results, and pasting the results into the game. Unfortunately, I have no way of understanding what they say in return.

Citizen Bleys
09-07-2008, 01:15 PM
JPs hate windower, though, so I'm thinking if you use kana/kanji, they're just as likely to report you to a GM as be impressed.

Mirage
09-07-2008, 01:35 PM
You can use kanji/kana without using the windower!

Miriel
09-08-2008, 01:21 AM
JPs hate windower, though, so I'm thinking if you use kana/kanji, they're just as likely to report you to a GM as be impressed.

Why in the world would they hate windower? That's nuts!

Jessweeee♪
09-08-2008, 02:50 AM
See, I knew I wasn't crazy about the check thing! I don't absolutely loathe /check (I do get the impression that people are staring at me), but I don't use it on others because I'm always afraid people will think I'm rude xD

Rostum
09-08-2008, 04:26 AM
I like how a simple game mechanic that is designed to be used all the time, is considered rude. I know the Japanese message isn't too good, but I honestly couldn't give a rats ass if that's what the Japanese decide they want to be anal about.

Honestly, a lot of what they are saying is that because us English speaking players know a wide range of politeness and courtesy, and that they have a specific description of what it should be... we are suddenly rude assholes.

It was a good insight, but common Japan, pull your head in.

Del Murder
09-08-2008, 06:02 AM
What if the /check message was changed from 'examines you.' to 'sniffs your crotch.' Would you have a problem with it then?

Bahamut2000X
09-08-2008, 06:04 AM
What if the /check message was changed from 'examines you.' to 'sniffs your crotch.' Would you have a problem with it then?

I'd be laughing too much to even care. XD

Rostum
09-08-2008, 08:46 AM
What if the /check message was changed from 'examines you.' to 'sniffs your crotch.' Would you have a problem with it then?

I'd find it hilarious. :D

No matter what the message is, if I put time and effort into my gear then I'd have no problem with letting people view it. I shouldn't have to ask or avoid using a simple gameplay mechanic.

Roogle
09-08-2008, 09:48 PM
JPs hate windower, though, so I'm thinking if you use kana/kanji, they're just as likely to report you to a GM as be impressed.

I have not had any trouble using Japanese text in a party except when mixed with Auto-Translate words. This causes the text to display as garbled nonsense which is quickly disregarded as a mistake. I know that a lot of people used to modify the PlayOnline client to be able to type in Japanese because they knew the language, and I do not think that GMs can do anything about that or those players. As for being reported to a GM over being able to type Japanese, the Japanese player has no idea whether or not I am Japanese in the first place. I wonder if it is even widespread knowledge that North Americans cannot type in Japanese even if they wanted to? How would they have any way to check, really?

From what I have been able to gather, the majority of Japanese players that I have encountered are very pleased when someone makes the effort to bridge the language barrier by typing in their language. I know this because they tell me so in English. If I speak in Japanese and double-check what I say, and they speak in English and double-check what they say, the language barrier lessens dramatically.

Rostum
09-09-2008, 01:48 AM
But not everyone wants to learn another language, especially for a game they just want to log into and chill out on.

Citizen Bleys
09-09-2008, 11:17 AM
I am thankful for those people. I have had great entertainment being asked to translate things into Japanese and intentionally messing it up. A good example is translating "let's kill some http://forums.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/rpg_009.gifhttp://forums.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/rpg_009.gifhttp://forums.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/rpg_009.gifhttp://forums.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/rpg_009.gif" literally, except I used "yaru" instead of "korosu" (because the Japanese do), and in context, it came out more like "Let us copulate with some excrement."

Roogle
09-09-2008, 08:26 PM
But not everyone wants to learn another language, especially for a game they just want to log into and chill out on.

That is the logic behind JPONLY. Personally, I still construe it as being slightly racist and nationalist even though the general consensus was exactly what you said.

Rostum
09-10-2008, 12:15 AM
But not everyone wants to learn another language, especially for a game they just want to log into and chill out on.

That is the logic behind JPONLY. Personally, I still construe it as being slightly racist and nationalist even though the general consensus was exactly what you said.

I can understand JPONRY being because they want to be able to fully communicate with their fellow adventurers. But, more often than not, it's really because they hate foreigners. I've come across way too many hate comments in search and bazaar comments to think otherwise.

Of course, there are still pleanty out there that will want to play with foreigners. It just irks me that the Japanese want or expect us to conform to their way of playing, and don't even consider that maybe they are the ones that are being rude and uptight (of course, generalising here, there are English players out there like this too).

But then again, maybe all this kind of information comes from all the people who are obsessed with Japan and think the Japanese are by far the best players in the game, so they copy them. I don't know.

Lionx
09-10-2008, 01:45 AM
Its just a different culture, pretty much to me, if you dont speak Japanese then dont party with them. They dont speak English so they dont party with you kinda stuff. It goes both ways, its just they were more vocal about it in their search comments and sometimes its not expressed right.

I party with whomever as long as they dont kill me rofl.

Jessweeee♪
09-11-2008, 02:17 AM
So what did they ask us?

O:

Roogle
09-12-2008, 12:50 AM
There was a follow-up to this in which we were asked questions from the Japanese community: JP Player Reaction from EN Players (http://www.jpbutton.com/?p=593)