Rinoa and Ultimecia **dissidia spoilers**

[Serapy]

I was playing Dissidia last night and I`ve just found out that the weapons Ultimecia use have the exact same names as Rinoa`s weapons. Although, both of these weapons differ in terms of styles and colours.

Am I surprised about this discovery? Nope.

Rinoa has light wings behind her back (good) and Ultimecia has dark wings behind her back (bad).
Rinoa`s weapon is lighter (it has white feathers on it) = Ultimecia`s weapon is darker (bad). Not to mention that Rinoa`s personality is so lovely and Ultimecia`s personality is quite the opposite. Therefore, Rinoa is 100% good and Ultimecia is 100% bad. Right? Let`s move onto the next paragraph.

This discovery may be eligible to hold the criteria to question the uncertainty of the R=U theory. For example, there`s no logical reason for Ultimecia to possess such weapons that have the EXACT same names as Rinoa`s weapons.

Perhaps, this is what SquareEnix intended to happen (which it was meant to be a joke) but thier action is still not enough to discredit the whole thing. That is until they make official comments. AFAIK, the Dissidia game doesn`t seem to have anything that may suggest "Oh yeah, we`ll vacuum certain players from the series and put them in Dissidia and we also will make them look illogical more than thier original creations."

[FFIX Choco Boy]

Maybe it's like WoW's Ashbringer weapon, it changes with the user's will. Rinoa turns evil, her weapons do to. R does in fact = U.

[Big D]

Maybe it's like WoW's Ashbringer weaponI mis-read that as "Asperger". Now I feel like a bad person:(

[Aerith's Knight]

Oh god, not this again.

I wish SE would just make a statement to either confirm this or put it to rest.

[Roogle]

What types of weapon does Ultimecia use? Rinoa uses a Blaster Edge. Ultimecia appears unarmed. In any case, it does seem like it is more than coincidence that they share the same weapon names, but is it only the naming scheme that is similar or is it the weapon themselves?

[Crimson]

Your that same dude who posted this same thing on Gamefaqs arent you?



Guess what? Tidus has one of Wakka's weapons in Dissidia, does that mean that Tidus = Wakka!?




Give it up.

[Lacarus]

Did it ever occur to anyone who thinks R=U that Squall wouldn't let that happen? :shifty: That's kinda what VIII is all about.

[Wolf Kanno]

I wouldn't read too much into it. Looking at the weapon list for Dissidia, it follows the rest of the title in terms of fanservice. All of Tidus' weapons seem to actually be named after Wakka's weapons as someone else pointed out, and despite obviously using a sword in battle animations, all of Terra's weapons are from the Flail class of weapons (a class of weapons she does actually use in VI). Kefka uses a... Harp... wherever that came from which is not even a weapon option from VI but it is a major weapon type used in the series.

[Roogle]

From what I can tell, Ultimecia does not even wield a weapon in combat. If she equips a different type of weapon that happens to share a naming scheme with the Blaster Edge, then that is likely for the sake of drawing a parallel to Squall.

[Wolf Kanno]

From what I can tell, Ultimecia does not even wield a weapon in combat. If she equips a different type of weapon that happens to share a naming scheme with the Blaster Edge, then that is likely for the sake of drawing a parallel to Squall.

That's pretty much it. She doesn't use Rinoa's weapons but the Bow weapons are named after Rinoa's different weapons. Weapons affect stats but they don't necessarily change their play style. Ultimecia uses magic exclusively in-game (Her super attack is actually a play on Squall's Lionheart Limit Break ;)) but their are several weapons in the game set up like the classic weapons from II and job class based games. Each character is restricted to a certain type of equipment but the names of most of the equipment are plays on popular weapons in the series or special connections to some characters. For instance, Sephiroth's ulitmate weapon is called One Winged Angel while Kefka's ultimate weapon is called Dancing Mad.

Generally, specialty weapons for characters are drawn from the their characters games, and usually, the villains have some more obscure stuff since we never know much about their equipment.

[Vost]

I wouldn't read too much into it. Looking at the weapon list for Dissidia, it follows the rest of the title in terms of fanservice. All of Tidus' weapons seem to actually be named after Wakka's weapons as someone else pointed out, and despite obviously using a sword in battle animations, all of Terra's weapons are from the Flail class of weapons (a class of weapons she does actually use in VI). Kefka uses a... Harp... wherever that came from which is not even a weapon option from VI but it is a major weapon type used in the series.


Hmmm...I would read much into this since it is just another example of the craftiness that has gone into presenting Ultimecia as Rinoa and Rinoa as Ultimecia. The probability of it being a coincidence is lower than the probability of it being done on purpose.

-Vost

P.S. The main reason I am defending the R=U theory, asides from the fact that there is evidence to support it throughout the game and that it makes perfect sense, is because I have word from a friend who knows one of the programmer's on the Final Fantasy VIII project and he has stated that from what he has heard in passing from the creator and from those who have assisted in the creation process, Rinoa was and is meant to be Ultimecia. It is obviously not official so I can't prove it.

[McLovin']

Gief remake with better structured story :(

[scrumpleberry]

Hahaha way to fuel the flame, Squenix *hi5*

[Wolf Kanno]

Considering its been almost ten years without an official explanation from Squenix, I would say this is more of a coincidence or Squenix humoring the fanbase. We each take our own interpretation from it.

[NeoTifa]

*facepalm* Who cares?! Just play the damn game!!!

[Serapy]

Considering its been almost ten years without an official explanation from Squenix, I would say this is more of a coincidence or Squenix humoring the fanbase.

Although, if SE was indeed humoring the fanbase, the game would of have had a specific theme attached to it. As far as I know, the game doesn't have that theme.


We each take our own interpretation from it.

Then why did you tell us not to read much into this interpretation?

[Wolf Kanno]

Considering its been almost ten years without an official explanation from Squenix, I would say this is more of a coincidence or Squenix humoring the fanbase.

Although, if SE was indeed humoring the fanbase, the game would of have had a specific theme attached to it. As far as I know, the game doesn't have that theme.

The game does have a theme and its blatant fan service. Its got a ton of inconsistencies though, and the equipment is one of them. Please for the love of god, don't drag Dissidia into this debate...



We each take our own interpretation from it.

Then why did you tell us not to read much into this interpretation?

My real response was actually going to be "JESUS F@#%ING CHRIST!!! I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU PEOPLE!!! LET IT GO! You know what? "Whatever" cause obviously nothing I say is going to stop you people from... I'm washing my hands from this..."

But that seemed a little more mean spirited so I went with the above post :)

If you actually read Squall's storyline, Dissidia actually fleshes out Ultimecia's motive. She wants to use Time Compression to freeze all time into a singularity and become a god. This is why she feels people, like Squall, are foolish for not worshiping her. Its not to protect her or to get revenge; she's just an egomaniac like all the other villains. Hell, she spends more time in the game conspiring against her own comrades than worrying about Squall. When she is defeated, she whines about how she "can't die yet until she becomes a god" and then Squall mumbles about the promise he made to Rinoa at the orphanage. So the game probably does more to hurt your theory than help it.

[Moon Rabbits]

Right? Let`s move onto the next paragraph.


Best transition sentence ever.

[BG-57]

If you actually read Squall's storyline, Dissidia actually fleshes out Ultimecia's motive. She wants to use Time Compression to freeze all time into a singularity and become a god. This is why she feels people, like Squall, are foolish for not worshiping her. Its not to protect her or to get revenge; she's just an egomaniac like all the other villains. Hell, she spends more time in the game conspiring against her own comrades than worrying about Squall. When she is defeated, she whines about how she "can't die yet until she becomes a god" and then Squall mumbles about the promise he made to Rinoa at the orphanage. So the game probably does more to hurt your theory than help it.

I was hoping for a good solid backstory for Ultimecia, I guess I'll have to be disappointed. She's an intriguing villainess, but Sephiroth and even Kefka get more explanation in their respective games. In FFVIII she just...is.

The thought of playing as her is awesome though. Almost as cool as when Edea was in the party.

[Moon Rabbits]

If you actually read Squall's storyline, Dissidia actually fleshes out Ultimecia's motive. She wants to use Time Compression to freeze all time into a singularity and become a god. This is why she feels people, like Squall, are foolish for not worshiping her. Its not to protect her or to get revenge; she's just an egomaniac like all the other villains. Hell, she spends more time in the game conspiring against her own comrades than worrying about Squall. When she is defeated, she whines about how she "can't die yet until she becomes a god" and then Squall mumbles about the promise he made to Rinoa at the orphanage. So the game probably does more to hurt your theory than help it.

I was hoping for a good solid backstory for Ultimecia, I guess I'll have to be disappointed. She's an intriguing villainess, but Sephiroth and even Kefka get more explanation in their respective games. In FFVIII she just...is.

The thought of playing as her is awesome though. Almost as cool as when Edea was in the party.

I always got the impression that Ultimecia's motive was revenge upon the people for ridiculing and alienating her for her entire life because she was a sorceress.

[Unstoppable Pig]

Why some of you are so eager to get official statement from SE, when part of the appeal in old FF games is that you could create theories which might be true but no confirmation. Like there is lot speculation who Gogo (VI) really is but it is never revealed and I´m glad it is like that.

New FF games lack the mystery aspect which is one of the reasons their stories is not good as they used to be.

[Wolf Kanno]

Gogo is a non-important entity in VI and his identity would not affect the story much. R=U is a theory that completely alters the entire dynamics of the storyline. Its a big deal if its true or not. This is why some people would like some form of confirmation. Its not a fun theory, its a massive plot twist.

[Roogle]

I agree, Wolf Kanno. If Rinoa was Ultimecia, a developer or scenario writer for the game would have come out and said it or it would have been stated in the Ultimania Guide or equivalent for this game, right? They outright confirm theories that have even less traction like the worlds of Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy X being connected, so why would they not confirm this one if it was true? It would have been an interesting plot twist if it was addressed by anything other than theories.

[BG-57]

I always got the impression that Ultimecia's motive was revenge upon the people for ridiculing and alienating her for her entire life because she was a sorceress.

I got that impression as well. But details would have helped.


Why some of you are so eager to get official statement from SE, when part of the appeal in old FF games is that you could create theories which might be true but no confirmation. Like there is lot speculation who Gogo (VI) really is but it is never revealed and I´m glad it is like that.

New FF games lack the mystery aspect which is one of the reasons their stories is not good as they used to be.

It's pretty simple: Gogo is a cameo from FFV. A better question would be who was he supposed to be in that game.

[Serapy]

I agree, Wolf Kanno. If Rinoa was Ultimecia, a developer or scenario writer for the game would have come out and said it or it would have been stated in the Ultimania Guide or equivalent for this game, right? They outright confirm theories that have even less traction like the worlds of Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy X being connected, so why would they not confirm this one if it was true? It would have been an interesting plot twist if it was addressed by anything other than theories.

SquareSoft did not reveal more information about Ultimecia in the Ultimania book, e.g. her full background. So, what do we make of this action? By the look of things, she has to be accepted as mysterious and that everything about herself and the plot itself are open to interpretation.

If they include additional information about Ultimecia, would that make the whole R=U theory any less plausible?

[Sir Bahamut]

I agree, Wolf Kanno. If Rinoa was Ultimecia, a developer or scenario writer for the game would have come out and said it or it would have been stated in the Ultimania Guide or equivalent for this game, right? They outright confirm theories that have even less traction like the worlds of Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy X being connected, so why would they not confirm this one if it was true? It would have been an interesting plot twist if it was addressed by anything other than theories.

SquareSoft did not reveal more information about Ultimecia in the Ultimania book, e.g. her full background. So, what do we make of this action? By the look of things, she has to be accepted as mysterious and that everything about herself and the plot itself are open to interpretation.

The thing is that firstly the game itself gives a lot of information about Ultimecia's backstory and motives so it's not completely mysterious to begin with, and secondly the Ultimania DOES say something about Ultimecia and in fact supports what we are given in the game (which isn't "R=U"). So no, we don't have to accept that at all.

Now, of course the Ultimania doesn't come out and give some explicit answers on Ultimecia, but the more natural conclusion to be drawn from that isn't that Ultimecia is mysterious, but rather that she's NOT more mysterious than the game implies she is.

[Wolf Kanno]

I'm actually curious to know if a companion guide might be released for the 10th anniversary of VIII but I guess that would be asking too much since it doesn't have the fanbase.

I wish one of the writers would come out and say something but after the whole VII=X bull:bou::bou::bou::bou: from the X-2 Ultimania, I wouldn't be surprised if Nojima would just ok the idea cause the fans thought it up rather than it being planned from the beginning. :roll2

Still, I am a bit surprised no one at SE has said anything but I agree with Sir Bahamut that its probably cause its the only thing that still generates good buzz for the title is flamboyant conspiracy theories concerning the game.

[Moon Rabbits]

Why do people argue with trolls > _ >

[Serapy]

Why do people argue with trolls > _ >

If this is directed at me, then I think you misunderstood the definition of trolling. If I was trolling, I wouldn`t be serious, taking the negative feedbacks for granted, I would be trying to annoy people (intentional). And many other unethical examples, which I wish not to label them into here. All my posts are absolutely genuine.

[Wolf Kanno]

I think he meant me ;)

[BG-57]

I think he's a she. :p

[Wolf Kanno]

My bad, I never bother checking profile information :D

[Moon Rabbits]

I think he meant me ;)

No, I just assume anyone who tries to prove R=U is a troll on principle.

[Serapy]

I think he meant me ;)

No, I just assume anyone who tries to prove R=U is a troll on principle.

My apologises.

[Loxagon]

Hi

I mean too, Rinoa IS Ultimecia. And we in Germany we have one fact more. In German version Ultimecia call: Artemisia.
Now look in Wikipedia. You will found: A Artemisia MAUSOLEUM!
Yes, a Mausoleum.

You know, that Rinoa in CD 3 MUST in a Witch-Mausoleum. I think that Square has Intentionally renamed the "Bad Witch". Then else, i dont see a ground for this renaming!
And the Mausoleum in History ... Was for a Wife callrd Artemisia. She died and her Husband has constructed this Mausoleum. ...And in FF8? Squall "lost" his beloved Rinoa in this Mausoleum!;)

And now Dissidia ... Yes, im extremly sure: Rinoa IS Artemisia (Ultimecia)

At last ...sorry for my grammar, but English Grammar is too hard for me. Words, I can the Most, but Grammar ... Not. (I HATE IRREGULAR VERBS!!!)

[Zyphus]

http://knowyourmeme.com/i/262/original/Lol_wut_shoop.png

[Wolf Kanno]

This thread is like... five months old...

No zombie threads in my forums :colbert:

Please start a new thread if you want to add anything Loxagon. Zyphus, please post something relevant, we don't care for spam in the forums.