Order of operations: PEMDAS or GEMA?

[Jessweeee♪]

PEMDAS: Parenthesis, Exponents, Multiplication, Division, Addition, Subtraction
GEMA: Grouping, Exponents, Multiplication, Division

Personally, I prefer GEMA. I think GEMA is more clear about what to do in this situation:

http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/internet-memes-curse-you-maths1.jpg

[Pike]

I think I just sort of... remembered the order xD

[Quindiana Jones]

I learned BODMAS: Brackets, Orders, Division, Multiplication, Addition, Subtraction. So that calculation goes thus:

1. (1+2) = 3.
2. 6/2 = 3.
3. 3 x 3 = 9.

Though multiplication and division are of equal precedence, and can be switched around to your heart's content. Using BOMDAS (which doesn't sound as cool), the answer is 1. Silly mathematics.

[Jessweeee♪]

See the way I see it, you do Multiplication and Division and then Addition and Subtraction left to right. A horizontal divider is just another type of Grouping. A division sign instead of a horizontal divider means no grouping, right? :confused:

[Laddy]

NERDS

[sharkythesharkdogg]

Working left to right (Which is how I was taught), I find the same results with PEDMAS or GEMA.

:confused:

With PEDMAS, after parenthesis, I'm left with 6/2x3. Then 3x3, then 9.

With GEMA, it becomes 3(3)...and then, well, 9.

I don't know if my methods are the most correct, but they keep my answer consistent.

[Jinx]

I only ever learned PEMDAS, and so, folks, you will have to Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally.

[Shlup]

When I was a math teacher I taught PEMDAS. We made pretty posters!

[Tigmafuzz]

The reason PENDAS is generally more acepted in American schools is because it's actually PE(MD)(AS), where the multiplication and division are equal in importance, as are addition and subtraction. After going through the equation and solving the parentheses and exponents, you solve the multiplication and division as you go through the equation from left to right, and then do the same with addition and subtraction. But I usually just used a crapload of parentheses to make sure everything was done in the order I wanted it to be.

[Peegee]

Deceptive troll?

The answer is nine.

[NorthernChaosGod]

PEMDAS.

[Loony BoB]

I was taught PEMDAS or PEDMAS or whatever, but I never liked it that much because it's very misleading. PEMA or GEMA sounds a bit better. I dunno. I'm kind of glad I don't have to do math equations that require that sort of thing in my day-to-day job. Although I never had any problem with maths, so I guess when I need to remember how things work, I just... do.

[Pheesh]

I used to spend maths writing "boobs" on my calculator.

[Loony BoB]

It was all about the 5318008

[NorthernChaosGod]

I can actually just write boobs or boobies on my calculator. TI-84+ Silver ftw.

[Jessweeee♪]

Better yet, you can draw them on the graph xD

[Quindiana Jones]

I got 77147105 on normals. Then I got my hands on the scientific calculator, and shit got real. "My daddy is a cabby", "3 in a bed", "Bombay Mix", oh those were the days.

[NorthernChaosGod]

I got 77147105 on normals. Then I got my hands on the scientific calculator, and shit got real. "My daddy is a cabby", "3 in a bed", "Bombay Mix", oh those were the days.
Wtf are you talking about?

[I Don't Need A Name]

Basically, it seems that the British among us have been taught BODMAS or PEDMAS, whereas the Americans have been taught PEMDAS or GEMA. GEMA is far too ambiguous and PEMDAS is far too incorrect. I think the teaching system is a little off there

[Jessweeee♪]

I think GEMA helps drive home the point Multiplication and Division and Addition and Subtraction are the same thing.

[I Don't Need A Name]

But when it comes to the crunch of doing one or the other first, division always comes first and subtraction always comes first.

[Quindiana Jones]

I do them alphabetically, because I like mingling linguistics with mathematics.

[Jessweeee♪]

But when it comes to the crunch of doing one or the other first, division always comes first and subtraction always comes first.

I thought it was left from right in whatever order that so happened to be :confused:

[I Don't Need A Name]

Noo, that's I'm confused here. I did maths until I was in uni (and some in uni) and they've always said you always do it Division -> Multiplication -> Subtraction -> Addition. That's why I'm baffled by the existance of PEMDAS..

[NorthernChaosGod]

Jess is totally right here; it's from left to right, the same way we read.

[Jinx]

What if you're Arabic?

SADMEP?

[sharkythesharkdogg]

Basically, it seems that the British among us have been taught BODMAS or PEDMAS, whereas the Americans have been taught PEMDAS or GEMA. GEMA is far too ambiguous and PEMDAS is far too incorrect. I think the teaching system is a little off there


Noo, that's I'm confused here. I did maths until I was in uni (and some in uni) and they've always said you always do it Division -> Multiplication -> Subtraction -> Addition. That's why I'm baffled by the existance of PEMDAS..


Jess is totally right here; it's from left to right, the same way we read.

Even the British method you mention still puts addition before subtraction, and breaks with what you say is the proper method of thought.

As Jess and myself mentioned before, you can put M/D or A/S in the same order of importance as long as you always work left to right.

At least that's the way I was taught, and that's why I got the answer of 9 each time whether I used PEMDAS or GEMA.

[Quindiana Jones]

I was assuming that IDNAN's "DMSA" thing was just a mistake, and that he meant to write it as DMAS. Nonetheless, GEMA is not ambiguous, as BODMAS and all its partners state exactly the same thing. It's merely the language that is ambiguous, since BODMAS is a primary school term, whereas GEMA uses more advanced terminology.

[I Don't Need A Name]

Yeah, sorry, that was a mistake from me. Dissertations fry your brains kids! And I disagree with you Quin. GEMA uses advanced terminology? Grouping-Exponents-Multiplication-Addition(?) How is that more advanced than Brackets-Order-Division-Multiplication-Addition-Subtraction? Grouping is a far more childish term than brackets and it misses out two functions? But yeah, thinking about it (again, fried brain), Division and Multiplication do cancel out in which order they're done in. Still dislike the complete difference in the way everything has been taught

[Jessweeee♪]

I like Grouping as opposed to Parenthesis because it's more vague. With Parenthesis you think of parenthesis and brackets and overlook the importance of the difference between a horizontal divider (a type of grouping) and a division sign.

[Quindiana Jones]

It's more advanced because it accepts that everybody already knows that multiplication and division are equal, and addition and subtraction are equal. While a child would say crocodile, alligator, snake etc., an adult knows that they exist in the same class and can simply call them all reptiles rather than listing everything.

[Goldenboko]

Grouping can sound vague to me, is six divided by 2 "grouped"? Quin's BODMAS is the most accurate, but it really doesn't matter what you use. I hate seeing "PEMDAS" vs. x arguments because none of this matters if...

A. If you speak English, treat the math like English and read left to fucking right when using your favorite acronym. Whoever made that calculator that got the answer of one is a fuck and as a computer engineer I am appalled. English motherfucker do you speak it???

B. Understand the math that is going on, don't use the division sign, use fractions because it makes it abundantly clear what's going on. When that isn't an option (aka you are putting your fraction math into your calculator for a numerical answer) put parenthesis fucking EVERYWHERE. A calculator is only as smart as whoever programmed it (unless its a TI-84, in which case it can probably do more math than you will ever understand).

And if you ever get any other weird results from your calculator...
35767

[sharkythesharkdogg]

Grouping can sound vague to me, is six divided by 2 "grouped"? Quin's BODMAS is the most accurate, but it really doesn't matter what you use. I hate seeing "PEMDAS" vs. x arguments because none of this matters if...

A. If you speak English, treat the math like English and read left to smurfing right when using your favorite acronym. Whoever made that calculator that got the answer of one is a smurf and as a computer engineer I am appalled. English mothersmurfer do you speak it???

B. Understand the math that is going on, don't use the division sign, use fractions because it makes it abundantly clear what's going on.

I agree with reading left to right, and I like where you're coming from, but when I set it up as a fraction and simplify I get an answer of one. :confused:

I'm not the best in mathematics, but here goes my observations and thoughts on all this.

Bear in mind I'm placing 6 as the numerator and 2(1+2) as the denominator. So it goes 2(1+2), then 2(3), which leaves 6/6 or 1.

If I take the fraction six seconds, 6/2, and combine it with (1+2), it seems to me to be an entirely different problem with a different result. (As far as I know)

I gave this little problem two people I know, and they both got the consistent answer of 1. I watched and here's their line of logic.

Keep in mind they both read from left to right.

6/2(1+2)
6/2(3)
6/6
1

Both of the kept the parenthesis even after they had combined the terms inside. I'd thought that (and I'm not sure on this one) that once the terms inside a set of parenthesis were taken care of you dropped them.

Basically this 6/2x3. If you read that left to right, you'd divide first. So you get 3x3=9

If you are supposed to keep the parenthesis, then it would make that key difference. It reads 6/2(3). Even when reading left to right, you still take care of parenthesis before anything else. When you do, it becomes 6/6. 6/6=1

So now my big question is, what becomes of the parenthesis after you combine the terms inside?? I thought they went away. This seems to be the area of divergence as I see it.

[NorthernChaosGod]

Parenthesis without any other operations attached to them just become the same as multiplication.
6/2(3) and 6/2x3 should be identical.

[Jessweeee♪]

If one wanted to multiply two and three before dividing by six, you would use a horizontal divider with 6 above and 2(3) underneath or write it with the two inside the parenthesis like 6/(2*3). Like NCG says when it's 6/2(3) then the parenthesis is already taken care of. Three is three. Okie dokie then!

[TheGlassesGirl]

I'm going into an art related career so none of this mattered to me past algebra class.

[Goldenboko]

Grouping can sound vague to me, is six divided by 2 "grouped"? Quin's BODMAS is the most accurate, but it really doesn't matter what you use. I hate seeing "PEMDAS" vs. x arguments because none of this matters if...

A. If you speak English, treat the math like English and read left to smurfing right when using your favorite acronym. Whoever made that calculator that got the answer of one is a smurf and as a computer engineer I am appalled. English mothersmurfer do you speak it???

B. Understand the math that is going on, don't use the division sign, use fractions because it makes it abundantly clear what's going on.

I agree with reading left to right, and I like where you're coming from, but when I set it up as a fraction and simplify I get an answer of one. :confused:

I'm not the best in mathematics, but here goes my observations and thoughts on all this.

Bear in mind I'm placing 6 as the numerator and 2(1+2) as the denominator. So it goes 2(1+2), then 2(3), which leaves 6/6 or 1.

If I take the fraction six seconds, 6/2, and combine it with (1+2), it seems to me to be an entirely different problem with a different result. (As far as I know)

I gave this little problem two people I know, and they both got the consistent answer of 1. I watched and here's their line of logic.

Keep in mind they both read from left to right.

6/2(1+2)
6/2(3)
6/6
1

Both of the kept the parenthesis even after they had combined the terms inside. I'd thought that (and I'm not sure on this one) that once the terms inside a set of parenthesis were taken care of you dropped them.

Basically this 6/2x3. If you read that left to right, you'd divide first. So you get 3x3=9

If you are supposed to keep the parenthesis, then it would make that key difference. It reads 6/2(3). Even when reading left to right, you still take care of parenthesis before anything else. When you do, it becomes 6/6. 6/6=1

So now my big question is, what becomes of the parenthesis after you combine the terms inside?? I thought they went away. This seems to be the area of divergence as I see it.

My fractions rant was a rant toward ambiguity. When writing something out when you get 6/2 * (1+2) (bear in mind that the 1+2 is suppose to be shown over to the right of the division far away from the division, this forum browser doesn't do justice to the difference of how it looks on paper) there would be no confusion.

As for your question, 2(3) is the same as 2*3. It shouldn't be treated differently because you wrote it with the parenthesis, the parenthesis first rule means, simplify terms inside the parenthesis first. once you get down to 6/2(3), the answer should be 9, because there is nothing inside the parenthesis so you revert back to reading left to right.

[TheGlassesGirl]

(are we really arguing over a fucking math equation?)

[Yar]

Math is witchcraft. I can't stand math!

[I Don't Need A Name]

Evidently some people don't stand the beauty and awesomeness of maths :colbert:

[blackmage_nuke]

5318008 is small time

A=1
E=-1
X=13.8
OrA!-5EX = 69

Or

B=0
E=-1
X=19.8
BμΤΤ-5EX = 99

Or

C=0
D=0
E=-1
X=5.8
DμCκ-5EX = 29

[Goldenboko]

(are we really arguing over a fucking math equation?)

Better than arguing over an art question :colbert:

[Pike]

Math is beautiful.

[TheGlassesGirl]

(are we really arguing over a smurfing math equation?)

Better than arguing over an art question :colbert:
oh you did NOT just go there :kakapo:

[NorthernChaosGod]

(are we really arguing over a fucking math equation?)
We are, you are not.

[Tigmafuzz]

Math is beautiful.
We can all agree that math is beautiful and it's all about placement of parentheses. Problem solved.

[Jiro]

I like BOMDAS because you can say it and then seamlessly transition into beatboxing.

BASICALLY with this shit you do the brackets first, left to right. STOP. Then you do the Orders, left to right. STOP. Then you do the multiplication and division left to right. STOP. Finally you do the addition and subtraction left to right. STOP.

B
O
MD
AS

[Tigmafuzz]

I like BOMDAS because you can say it and then seamlessly transition into beatboxing.

BASICALLY with this tit you do the brackets first, left to right. STOP. Then you do the Orders, left to right. STOP. Then you do the multiplication and division left to right. STOP. Finally you do the addition and subtraction left to right. STOP.

B
O
MD
AS
That's exactly the same as PEMDAS. Brackets = Parenthese, Orders = Exponents.

[sharkythesharkdogg]

Indeedly.

[Jiro]

I didn't say it wasn't the same thing, just you can't beatbox the word PEMDAS anywhere near as well as BOMDAS.

[Jinx]

PEMDAS, please. Speak for yo' self.