Bioware listens; plans to "extend" ME3's ending

[Pike]

BBC News - Mass Effect 3 to get extended ending at no cost to gamers (http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-17626125)

So this is pretty unprecedented for a really big video game from a big publisher, or really any big media production in general: Bioware is listening to feedback and changing things. AFTER their game has already been released and sold millions of copies.

"Extended" endings will be available as free (!) DLC this summer.

Pretty great, no? :kakapo:

[KentaRawr!]

Meh

[Sephex]

I laughed because they aren't going to be satisfied with the new ending.

[Hollycat]

Watch them charge it as DLC

[Freya]

Actually there was something pointed out that it could come out sometime before spring 2013 or something xD So it might actually not come out till who knows when. It's great that they are doing it but I'm worried about how this will affect the gaming industry. If enough people bitch, video games have to be altered? I dunno. I don't want people to be bitching about every ending of every game form now on.

[NorthernChaosGod]

Maybe developers will put more thought into things before they release games then. Instead of beta testing paying customers. :colbert:

Not having played ME3, I can't really comment on that specifically though.

[Pete for President]

It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

Let's compare it to other great things non-game designers have brought to the game universe. Like the levels made in Little Big Planet and Modnation Racers. Were they good? No; 99% of user-generated content is absolutely unplayable. Why? They are not level designers, just as these people demanding a new ending are NOT story writers. It shouldn't happen.

A dark day in history of gaming.

[Hollycat]

I don't think its a dark day, it's a lesson to game makers, don't be cheap with your ending or you will earn the players wrath.

[Pike]

It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

Let's compare it to other great things non-game designers have brought to the game universe. Like the levels made in Little Big Planet and Modnation Racers. Were they good? No; 99% of user-generated content is absolutely unplayable. Why? They are not level designers, just as these people demanding a new ending are NOT story writers. It shouldn't happen.

A dark day in history of gaming.

I actually have to disagree here. They didn't change it just because the fans dissented; they changed it because they realized that the fans had a point. Let me copypaste something I wrote earlier:


I can’t express how much I love this. I am of the firm belief that when you make something creative and then publish it— whether it is a book, movie, game, or whathaveyou— that thing then belongs to the people. To the fans. You make it for them and it stops being yours and becomes theirs. I was taught this when I went to university for Media/Theatre/Film and I still believe this strongly.

The fact that Bioware realizes this and listens to their fans is so neat to me. If I ever make it big as an author and I publish a book and a huge portion of my fans dislike a part of it and explain to me why they didn’t— I hope I have the humility to similarly listen to the people I wrote the book for and change it if I agree with them.

On a game-playing level this doesn't affect me because I haven't played ME, but as an artist and writer I believe they're doing something amazing. They are interacting with the people they, as entertainers, are giving their creations to. And that's great.

[Madame Adequate]

It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

Let's compare it to other great things non-game designers have brought to the game universe. Like the levels made in Little Big Planet and Modnation Racers. Were they good? No; 99% of user-generated content is absolutely unplayable. Why? They are not level designers, just as these people demanding a new ending are NOT story writers. It shouldn't happen.

A dark day in history of gaming.

Yeah and 99% of professionally-produced games are terrible and should be avoided at all costs, notwithstanding the paid level designers and storywriters. In point of fact, the tremendously terrible ending to Mass Effect 3 proves very handily that just because someone has a job title does not mean they are above either error or reproach :monster:

I agree with Pike.

[Værn]

Let this be a lesson to them: If they do a half-ass job the first time around, it's going to blow up in their face and they're just going to have to replace the whole thing.

On a completely unrelated note, I wouldn't recommend letting me try to fix a gas stove. Again, completely unrelated to my previous statement...

[Iceglow]

It's great that they are doing it but I'm worried about how this will affect the gaming industry. If enough people bitch, video games have to be altered? I dunno. I don't want people to be bitching about every ending of every game form now on.

This isn't the first incident of this. The only difference is that the previous publisher to change an ending to a game over the fans disappointment in the original ending was Bethesda with Fallout 3 and they charged for it, it was Broken Steel which was well received. The only major difference here is that if you download the DLC for Mass Effect 3's "Extended cut" before April 2014 you'll get it for free.


Maybe developers will put more thought into things before they release games then. Instead of beta testing paying customers. :colbert:

Not having played ME3, I can't really comment on that specifically though.

I think it wasn't a case of that, I genuinely believe Bioware thought the ending would be sufficient in wrapping up the game plots. However they tried to introduce the unexpected ending to a series which took hundreds if not thousands of hours to complete within 14 lines of dialogue. It also disappointed the fans because regardless of the story you'd built over 3 games, who lived, who died, the endings were all on a level which didn't incorporate that they just totally disregarded it. I found it funny that in the final moments of the game (just prior to the part where you meet the AI on the Crucible) you can still earn renegade and paragon points for your actions and yet the minute you board the crucible firing room there is no changes to the ending based on these points that are earnable. It felt more like a different team worked on the ending than on the actual story of the past 3 games. The dark visual overtone that there could be no happy ending option for Shepherd also didn't feel right in the eyes of the players. Or even the option of a sad ending but one where the player rejects the Catalyst's "choices" and decides that the galaxy will win without firing the crucible or die trying. (this ending in particular would have given Bioware an awesome excuse to show Shepherd taking down Harbinger in any way possible up to and including the use of the Normandy as a bullet to the face in a suicide run where he is simply so unforgivingly determined to destroy the reapers it's deemed necessity for victory at any cost, this would've been an awesome Renegade Shep ending)


It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

Let's compare it to other great things non-game designers have brought to the game universe. Like the levels made in Little Big Planet and Modnation Racers. Were they good? No; 99% of user-generated content is absolutely unplayable. Why? They are not level designers, just as these people demanding a new ending are NOT story writers. It shouldn't happen.

A dark day in history of gaming.

You're comparing a game trilogy made up of 90% story development to a game like little big planet which is approximately 10% story development. That's like comparing a Chimp to a Human because we share 10% of the same DNA as them. Or an apple and an orange because both are round and both are fruits. It's not plausible to see where you are going on this. You claim it is a dark day for gaming history, I like Pike and Huxley am somewhat of a writer, though I freely confess, Pike is better than I could hope to be because unlike myself she had the guts to get something published. The ending as I pointed out to Julian, jarred badly with the story of the games and also with what Bioware's development team promised the fans. They promised us wildly different and diverse endings based on the decisions made over the course of 3 games. These endings based on player decisions never materialized, instead we had 3 ending choices which were pre-determined, poorly explained and required little to no choice from the player and did not rely at all upon the decisions made in the 3 games. I suppose the only thing which did get determined by the decisions made in previous games is who out of your crew (also considering the blast by Harbinger should have killed your companions in your party it was more than a little weird for myself to see EDI on board the Normandy completely unscathed when Shepherd himself was nearly killed and his N7 armour was all but totally destroyed) would be alive to randomly selected to appear on the Normandy fleeing the explosions of the Mass Relays. Something which in itself was never explained, especially considering Joker would never have fled that battle. I doubt this extended cut dlc will answer every players questions, as do I doubt that it will provide an adequate ending for Mass Effect in the eyes of a majority of players. I do however feel it is far from a dark day in gaming history and the world will not crumble overnight as a result of this being done.

[Mirage]

I think this whole event is good because it raises the bar for game storywriters. There are plenty of terrible story writers in the game industry, we should let them know when they come up with things that are just not adequate. Not saying Bioware's writers are all terrible, my comment is more aimed towards games in general. I don't want the writers in the video game industry to be second-rate writers compared to those in movies and stuff, and telling them about it when they do terrible fuckups that lead to enormous plot holes is just one way to let them improve themselves.

The problem I have with ME3's ending (except the fact that it disregards almost every player choice up to that point in the game) is that there are so many plot holes. Now, before anyone screams INDOCTRINATION THEORY, I want to say that yes, I have watched those theory videos and they are pretty convincing, but even if you go by this theory as what actually happened, there are still a zillion plotholes. If the indoctrination theory is correct, we never actually got to see the crucible in action, we never even got to know if the reapers were even defeated.

[Slothy]

It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

The only insult was to the paying customers when Bioware decided to release that ending as the finale to a 3 game long space epic. It is not an insult to writers to tell them their ending sucked. It is not an insult to writers to tell them they should change it because fans deserved a lot better than what they paid good money to get.

It's entirely up the Bioware if they wanted to amend the ending, but considering how widespread the backlash was, they really didn't have much choice. They could either try to appease fans who paid good money and invested hundreds of hours, or they could do nothing and piss them off more.

More importantly, fans aren't asking that they be allowed to re-write the ending. This is not going to be some shitty user generated content. This is going to be Bioware trying to fix an ending which they made that was utterly terrible. Hell, all I did was watch the endings on Youtube and I can see why fans were pissed off. There was no artistic integrity there in that mess. It looked like they slapped it together without ever really taking the time to revise and work on as though they were in a rush to get it out of the door.


It's great that they are doing it but I'm worried about how this will affect the gaming industry. If enough people bitch, video games have to be altered? I dunno. I don't want people to be bitching about every ending of every game form now on.

I don't think this will happen for one very simple reason: the amount of time and money players invested is on a completely different scale with ME than most series, and the type of game is completely different. Players paid for three titles, followed the story and characters for over a hundred hours minimum, and more importantly, made decisions which were supposed to carry over into each of the games. The amount of psychological investment in that series if you followed it all the way to the end is huge. It's one thing to make a fairly stand alone title, or even an entry in a series that's only loosely connected, or where you know up front that decisions made in different games don't affect each other, and include a terrible ending. People will still hate it, but they'll move on with their lives pretty quickly and simply be wary of buying the next game. But when you play through 3 titles being promised that your decisions will matter and becoming more invested in the story and characters because you're making decisions, and then they yank the rug out from under you in the last 10 minutes, that is a whole different ball game.

I'm sure there will be games where people hate the ending and ask that it be changed, but the outcry won't be nearly as widespread unless someone else decides to pull a Mass Effect and drop the ball at the end.

Now regardless of whether fans get an ending that doesn't suck out of this, I think this is a damn good thing. Fans got something that can only be described as an insult and a slap in the face, and they actually stood up and told Bioware to go fuck themselves. This pleases me greatly because I usually find the gamer community to be filled with a combination of apathy and apologists who will try to explain why developers are right to screw them over. To see things swing so wildly against such a popular developer who screwed up so badly is heart warming. And I think it will serve as a lesson to other developers that they had better step up their game already because this shit doesn't fly.

Also, I agree with Pike and MILF, though I should make that my sig with how often it happens.

[DMKA]

I laughed because they aren't going to be satisfied with the new ending.

This. All the complainers are still going to say it's not good enough and bitch about how they responded to their initial bitching. They're going to complain that BioWare tried to appease them. They're going to insist on not forgiving BioWare for their terrible transgression by giving their game an ending that didn't meet their expectations. Nothing BioWare does is going to make the majority of complainers happy, especially if they're "extending" the ending, as that means everything all those people complained about in the ending is still going to be there.

It's cool that they listened to the negative feedback though, albeit mostly silly.

[Pete for President]

It is ridiculous and a big insult to the story writers and artists. People claiming a different ending aren't writers. They are not professionals. Game developers should not listen to them.

Let's compare it to other great things non-game designers have brought to the game universe. Like the levels made in Little Big Planet and Modnation Racers. Were they good? No; 99% of user-generated content is absolutely unplayable. Why? They are not level designers, just as these people demanding a new ending are NOT story writers. It shouldn't happen.

A dark day in history of gaming.

Yeah and 99% of professionally-produced games are terrible and should be avoided at all costs, notwithstanding the paid level designers and storywriters. In point of fact, the tremendously terrible ending to Mass Effect 3 proves very handily that just because someone has a job title does not mean they are above either error or reproach :monster:

I agree with Pike.

Agreed that even professionals can make mistakes. As for the 99% professionally-produced games are terrible; I completely lost faith in game critics as well as gamers to decide what games are terrible and what not. I hope some of you can see how demanding gamers have become when we won't even settle for a multi-million dollar production anymore. We're talking about hundreds of people working non-stop for 3 years to bring you this experience, and it's easy to not show any appreciation when you're hanging on your couch. To relate back to my previous 'insult'-statement; it's like telling the cleaning lady 'you've missed a spot'. Deus Ex comes to mind as a good example; I think this game is amazing. People seemed to dislike the boss fights and all of a sudden the game is branded as terrible. Righteous? I don't think so. Last but not least; I can't even imagine managing a production this big with a storyline focus. Maybe this is where the error-part could set in, but I think we all underestimate the difficulty of bringing the storyline across in a production involving hundreds of employees.




You're comparing a game trilogy made up of 90% story development to a game like little big planet which is approximately 10% story development. That's like comparing a Chimp to a Human because we share 10% of the same DNA as them. Or an apple and an orange because both are round and both are fruits.

I am talking about involving non-professionals in creating or altering the gaming experience. To keep your apple/orange analogy; people telling the grower what their product (be it apples, oranges or kiwi's) should look, taste or feel like, despite hardly having any knowledge of the growth process.

[Slothy]

I hope some of you can see how demanding gamers have become when we won't even settle for a multi-million dollar production anymore. We're talking about hundreds of people working non-stop for 3 years to bring you this experience, and it's easy to not show any appreciation when you're hanging on your couch. To relate back to my previous 'insult'-statement; it's like telling the cleaning lady 'you've missed a spot'. Deus Ex comes to mind as a good example; I think this game is amazing. People seemed to dislike the boss fights and all of a sudden the game is branded as terrible. Righteous? I don't think so. Last but not least; I can't even imagine managing a production this big with a storyline focus. Maybe this is where the error-part could set in, but I think we all underestimate the difficulty of bringing the storyline across in a production involving hundreds of employees.

First, I've never seen anyone say Deus Ex was a terrible game because of the boss fights. No, they weren't very good, and yes, not many really liked them and they were incongruent with the rest of the gameplay, but they didn't ruin the whole game. But when you're complaining about something that hampered an otherwise great experience, what are you going to hear about when there's basically just that and the ending, and neither completely shat on everything that came before?

Second; yes games can cost millions to develop now. Yes, they are made by hundreds of people and can take several years. No I do not underestimate how hard it may be to get the story across in a production with that many people.

But none of that should be an excuse for releasing a shitty product. Or completely dropping the ball at the end of production. Should I feel bad for Bioware when they spent a couple of years making a game which they released with a shitty ending? Am I supposed to lament their plight of working so hard only to fuck it up at the eleventh hour? No, I feel sorry for the fans who got a crappy ending. A game taking millions of dollars, hundreds of people, and years to make does not give them a free pass on anything they screw up. Such a notion is silly.


I am talking about involving non-professionals in creating or altering the gaming experience. To keep your apple/orange analogy; people telling the grower what their product (be it apples, oranges or kiwi's) should look, taste or feel like, despite hardly having any knowledge of the growth process.

You don't have to know anything about how an Apple is grown to know if it tastes like ass. Or in the case of ME3's ending, to know that that Apple tastes like a Mango.

[Madame Adequate]

Deus Ex comes to mind as a good example; I think this game is amazing. People seemed to dislike the boss fights and all of a sudden the game is branded as terrible.

Well sure that would be a problem if it had actually happened. As it stands what happened was everyone said "holy shit the new DX is actually amazing, the boss fights are out of place and badly implemented but they can't do much to mar a truly superb game".

[Psychotic]

i don't give a toss about your artistic vision

particularly when it is so lame

i pay you money

now do as i say

i say have a krogan bang miranda up the butt until she explodes, and then kai leng, then allers, and then councillor udina, then the smurfing salarians and the quarians, then that reporter lady

make that the ending

edit:

actually you know what

i would rather have dlc that meant kai leng just did not happen rather than rejigging the ending

literally the worst character i have ever seen

IM A SPACE NINJA HEH HEH IM A BADASS. pfft! i farted. oh no i need a gunship to win my battles and BLEH BLEH TINY SWORD

seriously

dlc that shit out first bioware.

[Skyblade]

Actually there was something pointed out that it could come out sometime before spring 2013 or something xD So it might actually not come out till who knows when. It's great that they are doing it but I'm worried about how this will affect the gaming industry. If enough people bitch, video games have to be altered? I dunno. I don't want people to be bitching about every ending of every game form now on.

Fallout 3 would like to point out that it already set the precedent with its Broken Steel DLC, thus that argument is moot.


I hope some of you can see how demanding gamers have become when we won't even settle for a multi-million dollar production anymore. We're talking about hundreds of people working non-stop for 3 years to bring you this experience, and it's easy to not show any appreciation when you're hanging on your couch. To relate back to my previous 'insult'-statement; it's like telling the cleaning lady 'you've missed a spot'. Deus Ex comes to mind as a good example; I think this game is amazing. People seemed to dislike the boss fights and all of a sudden the game is branded as terrible. Righteous? I don't think so. Last but not least; I can't even imagine managing a production this big with a storyline focus. Maybe this is where the error-part could set in, but I think we all underestimate the difficulty of bringing the storyline across in a production involving hundreds of employees.

If a waiter brings me a piece of cheesecake with a bone in it, I complain, get it taken back, replaced, and charged nothing for the entire meal.

The ending was broken, it did not match anything from the rest of the series. Themes, tone, lore, character traits, plot points, all thrown out the window.

Perhaps more importantly, specific statements made about the ending by the devs even a week before release were outright fabrications. I complain when I don't get what I pay for. That's not "being entitled" it's being a smart consumer.

I don't care how many hours or dollars they spent on the project, if they produce crap, I'm going to complain about it.


And, yeah, we aren't going to be happy with the extended cut. Why? Because it doesn't fix any of the problems.

[Freya]

I like that everyone likes to bring up the fallout 3 thing like I don't already know about it.

The difference between Fallout 3 doing it and Bioware doing it is that while the ending of Fallout 3 was kinda a ":(" they did not have the uproar that Bioware did. People were not as vocally upset about it. Ergo it is not a moot point thank you very much. Go suck a Popsicle.

[Roto13]

I'm disappointed that they're giving in. Whether the ending is good or bad, it's Bioware's ending to Bioware's game.

You don't see HBO releasing an extended ending to The Sopranos.

[Slothy]

You don't see HBO releasing an extended ending to The Sopranos.

A fairly famous example getting thrown around lately with the whole ME3 thing is the fact that Sherlock Holmes didn't die in "The Final Problem". He apparently did because Arthur Conan Doyle wanted to get away from the character, but brought him back later due to public outcry.

No, HBO didn't release an extended Sopranos ending. But they didn't have to. Nor did Arthur Conan Doyle, and nor did Bioware have to update the ending to ME3. It was a good idea for them to at least make the attempt though given how terrible the ending was, and with their fans unconditional love of them waning a bit as of late.

[Jessweeee♪]

I think everyone was overreacting to the ending. But I do think this is kind of cool :excited:

[Skyblade]

I like that everyone likes to bring up the fallout 3 thing like I don't already know about it.

The difference between Fallout 3 doing it and Bioware doing it is that while the ending of Fallout 3 was kinda a ":(" they did not have the uproar that Bioware did. People were not as vocally upset about it. Ergo it is not a moot point thank you very much. Go suck a Popsicle.

So a small fraction of your fanbase (read: customers) complain, and it's ok to change it.

But a large fraction of your fanbase (again, customers) complain, and you should ignore them.

I think you need to study basic economics again.

[Freya]

I never said it was okay for fallout to change it either. :monster: I think you need to stop strawmanning it.

[krissy]

what
a
bunch
of pushovers

bioware from here on in every publisher is going to beat you for your lunch money.

[Renmiri]

A bit late to the thread but hopefully don't get a ding for resurrecting it.

For those saying fans always complain about endings I say this is different. Everyone here knows how much of a fan I am of FFX and Tidus / Yuna. The ending on FFX killed Tidus, Auron, Jecht, left questions unanswered and never got this uproar. Why ? It was WELL WRITTEN and completely in sync with the story so far. Of course I bitched, and every other fan of the Yuna / tidus romance bitched, we wanted more. And we gladly payed more when FFX2 showed up. We didn't feel cheated out of hundreds of hours.
FF7 ? Aeris ?
People bitch when their favorite characters die, but never to the tune of raising 80 thousand dollars in a week for charity. Never with such ire. I personally have not reached the ending on ME3, I just passed Kai Leng's appearance and have to agree with Psy. They killed "Auron"!! There is this badass cool guy on ME2, Thane, he reminds me a lot of Auron. He gets some 15 lines on ME3 and 90% of those are about death and dying, and he gets killed by a ninja wannabe at random in the middle of the game. Awful! I saw Tidus, Auron and Jecht die and it sucked but it was well written. Here in ME3 they cure a plague that has been haunting the krogan species for 300 years and they let "Auron" die in a hospital bed ? Lame.

This game is all about saving the galaxy and i hear in the end you save nothing and the protagonist dies. Sounds to me it is what my teacher in writing class said "Too many dying in the ending shows a writer too lazy to deal with tying up plot threads. Kill them all is the simplest answer to the conundrum but is also the one that will tell everyone you can't write for shit"

[Iceglow]

This game is all about saving the galaxy and i hear in the end you save nothing and the protagonist dies. Sounds to me it is what my teacher in writing class said "Too many dying in the ending shows a writer too lazy to deal with tying up plot threads. Kill them all is the simplest answer to the conundrum but is also the one that will tell everyone you can't write for shit"

I thought your entire post was awesomely well written Ren, been a while since I saw something that well written on here we've all become lazy I think.

I selected the last paragraph for a quote though because of a reason. I like the quote I think it's damn true with one singe exception. There is a series of Warhammer 40,000 novels called Gaunts Ghosts written by an author named Dan Abnett.

He is writing the series until he essentially has no characters left to write about. Or until he can no longer get funding for the series. It's a brilliant series in my opinion about a regiment of soldiers from a dead planet, their world gone they're the final few survivors fighting until they have won their own planet and retired or died out. He kills main characters off in entire slews, one book saw about 20 characters you'd spent 6 books getting to know and love die in one chapter! It's however awesomely well written the idea that eventually there will be none of the Ghosts left makes each death feel immensely powerful "a ghost died today" kind of feeling even if there's 60 - 100 dead in a book you feel the deaths of each Ghost keenly. Now if he'd simply kept the Ghosts to themselves they'd be well below fighting strength by now. So to keep them as a regiment he's recruited new soldiers from other worlds which have become "ghost worlds" to fill the ranks, they're the survivors of wars what left entire planets dead or dying with nothing left to call their own. Yet you still keenly feel that whilst certain soldiers from the new recruits become favourites or awesome characters in their own right, the books are firmly centred on the Tanith core of the regiment and their commander Gaunt.

So whilst not a bad quote it's not always necessarily true in every circumstance, there are ways that "kill everyone" becomes more powerful than having the characters live.

[Skyblade]

This game is all about saving the galaxy and i hear in the end you save nothing and the protagonist dies. Sounds to me it is what my teacher in writing class said "Too many dying in the ending shows a writer too lazy to deal with tying up plot threads. Kill them all is the simplest answer to the conundrum but is also the one that will tell everyone you can't write for tit"

I thought your entire post was awesomely well written Ren, been a while since I saw something that well written on here we've all become lazy I think.

I selected the last paragraph for a quote though because of a reason. I like the quote I think it's damn true with one singe exception. There is a series of Warhammer 40,000 novels called Gaunts Ghosts written by an author named Dan Abnett.

He is writing the series until he essentially has no characters left to write about. Or until he can no longer get funding for the series. It's a brilliant series in my opinion about a regiment of soldiers from a dead planet, their world gone they're the final few survivors fighting until they have won their own planet and retired or died out. He kills main characters off in entire slews, one book saw about 20 characters you'd spent 6 books getting to know and love die in one chapter! It's however awesomely well written the idea that eventually there will be none of the Ghosts left makes each death feel immensely powerful "a ghost died today" kind of feeling even if there's 60 - 100 dead in a book you feel the deaths of each Ghost keenly. Now if he'd simply kept the Ghosts to themselves they'd be well below fighting strength by now. So to keep them as a regiment he's recruited new soldiers from other worlds which have become "ghost worlds" to fill the ranks, they're the survivors of wars what left entire planets dead or dying with nothing left to call their own. Yet you still keenly feel that whilst certain soldiers from the new recruits become favourites or awesome characters in their own right, the books are firmly centred on the Tanith core of the regiment and their commander Gaunt.

So whilst not a bad quote it's not always necessarily true in every circumstance, there are ways that "kill everyone" becomes more powerful than having the characters live.

Unfortunately, "kill everyone" is by no means nearly the worst part of the ending.

Seriously, Ren, you have not begun to see the bad part of the game. Keep going. Even Thane's death has an awesome silver lining as you approach the endgame (all I will say: Take the Interrupt. You'll know it when you see it).

But the ending itself is far, far worse than anything you have seen so far. It's not just killing everyone. It's not just failing to save the galaxy. It is a systematic betrayal of everything, from themes to character traits, to lore, that the series has stood for.


Perhaps worst of all, it is a complete betrayal of the fans, as the devs lied, outright, on multiple occassions, even with less than a month before release. "[The decision to save the rachni] has huge consequences in Mass
Effect 3. Even just in the final battle with the Reapers" is one of those that pisses me off the most, but it is one of dozens. A large list can be found here (http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/323/index/10204263/1).


But, frankly, I think it's too late. Most of the ardent fans have already given up. It honestly doesn't matter what BioWare does at this point, people have moved on. The latest multiplayer weekend event fell far short of its goal, and, while the bad ending is still dominating the forums, it's only because no one wants to talk about anything else. BioWare has driven tens of thousands of fans away from this game already, and most of them aren't even going to remember to look at the new ending when it comes out.

[Renmiri]

Is sad because "everyone dies" can even work. A lot of important characters died at the end of FFX, Aeris dies in FF7 and still both games worked very well and we gladly paid money for sequels. But Aeris, Tidus, Auron, Jecht's deaths are mourned and Yuna / Cloud are visibly shaken as are their friends. No such thing on Thane's death. Was so gratuitous! And why should I care to try to save the galaxy if the Mass Effect relays are going to be destroyed and condemn trillions to hunger and death ?

Think they tried to do a mystic ending and failed miserably.

[Skyblade]

Think they tried to do a mystic ending and failed miserably.

In a way, you're right.

The ending is essentially Star Trek the Motion Picture. A complete genre swap from everything that came before, an abandonment of themes and even the basics of the series, to do an "artsy" finish. And, like STTMP, no one liked it.

This type of ending can work, sure, but it has its place. Mass Effect is not the place for it. It's not Blade Runner. It's not 2001 A Space Odyssey.

However, honestly, even on its own merits, taken entirely apart from the original game, the ending sucks. Not because it's "mystic" or "arty", but because it is horribly written. It is the best example in modern storytelling of how bad deus ex machina can be. It's nonsensical, forced, and inconsistent even with itself.

[Shiny]

Let me copypaste something I wrote earlier:


I can’t express how much I love this. I am of the firm belief that when you make something creative and then publish it— whether it is a book, movie, game, or whathaveyou— that thing then belongs to the people. To the fans. You make it for them and it stops being yours and becomes theirs. I was taught this when I went to university for Media/Theatre/Film and I still believe this strongly.

The fact that Bioware realizes this and listens to their fans is so neat to me. If I ever make it big as an author and I publish a book and a huge portion of my fans dislike a part of it and explain to me why they didn’t— I hope I have the humility to similarly listen to the people I wrote the book for and change it if I agree with them.

I partly disagree with this because while it is entertainment and meant to entertain the consumers, creativity doesn't imply that you have to cater to their every wishes. It ceases to be your property if you have too many outside people putting their own input in it. There has to be a line drawn between creating and appealing so that there can be a happy medium between the creators and the consumers.

The cynic in me thinks the reason they are appealing to the fans is not because they care about your opinion, it's because they still want people to play their stuff and buy their DLCs. They said that this might be the last Mass Effect, but with and ending like that they obviously intend on releasing a similar story, but the backlash has them back tracking.

[Fonzie]

When it comes down to it, the game's big "thing" was that it was influenced by multiple choices in-game. I have no clue why they would make an ending in which none of the choices matter that you've made in the previous three games. Feels like as others said, they were attempting for some sort of (half-assed) deep/magical ending to it.

This wouldn't be an issue if only a few members of their fanbase were angry, but it's more than a good amount that were let down.

[Slothy]

The cynic in me thinks the reason they are appealing to the fans is not because they care about your opinion, it's because they still want people to play their stuff and buy their DLCs.

That's pretty obvious honestly. And if you're going to release a game with such a monumentally terrible ending as that you better be prepared to either fix it or deal with the consequences. I'd imagine EA is a bit wary of the latter with their monumental losses of late.

[Renmiri]

Anyone thinks the free DLC fixed the ending problems ?

[Skyblade]

Anyone thinks the free DLC fixed the ending problems ?

Somewhat.

The ability to actually discuss what the hell is going on with the Catalyst, argue about what it means, and even outright disagree with it is a huge plus. Shepard as a character can now remain intact throughout the ending.

And the fourth option, to put a bullet in the Catalyst's head is great, even if it is too short of an ending (finally, there's a "Reaper's win" ending, but it sucks that it's only by choice, and never by failing to gather the right forces/team).


The extra look at the world afterward (and the retconning they did) does make the ending more bearable too. It probably salvages the series enough that I'll actually be willing to go back and play it again.

The only real remaining problems are that your War Assets are still really nothing but a number, and that the Catalyst is still just a massive, badly written deus ex machina.

But most of the plotholes are gone, and they did offer some closure, as well as retconning that galaxy to not be quite so frelled up afterward.

[Jowy]

i shot that little bastard after i regained control of shepard not knowing i was going to get the bad ending. and i really didn't feel like suffering through fighting six banshees again while laser-dodging so I just looked everything up on the internets.

anyone still play ME3 online?

[Hollycat]

I will be playing it online soon, I just finished me2 for the first time and started me3 yesterday. So maybe a week or two.