The lottery is a scam

[Raistlin]

In the US, politicians make a big deal about gambling. Some states don't allow casinos, and allowing casinos or slots is a controversial subject. Some view gambling itself as immoral, or that gambling institutions prey on the poor. In recent years, the US government has made in extremely difficult for foreign online gambling sites to serve US customers, out of fear mongering about consumer safety from well-respected international organizations. On the other hand, the government continues to push its own lottery -- because it really doesn't give a smurf about if people lose all their money, as long as they lose all their money to the right group.

It is true that pure chance games like slots are arguably scams in that they are designed to make you lose more money than you win long-term (though at least in games like roulette and craps there is an entertainment factor). But they all pale in comparison to state and federal lotteries. These are as much scams as snake oil salesmen, preying on nearly impossible dreams in return for profit.

The most infamous one is the US Powerball, which frequently has a jackpot in the tens and hundreds of millions of dollars. The odds are impossibly high, but that does not stop people from pouring thousands of dollars into it over a period of years out of misguided notions of their chances. In response, someone decided to make this excellent simulator (http://justwebware.com/powerball/powerball.html), which demonstrates just how ridiculously broken the lottery system is.

On max speed, I've found it runs through about 1 year every 1.5 seconds or so. Open it in its own browser window (it won't run in inactive tabs) and let it run for a while. See if you can win any of the top three prizes. The other day I let it run for a few thousand years without winning any of the top 3, and with a return of about 7-8 cents on the dollar (~12-13 cents with Power Play, but you end up with a greater net loss due to the increased cost of the tickets).

What do you think of the lottery? Do any of you play it (I promise to refrain from yelling at you, but it is my sincere hope you are persuaded to stop)? Any other games of chance?

[Iceglow]

The National Lottery here in the UK is often smaller though on occasion there are big prize draws normally around £120m or so. Only when these massive prizes come up do I bother to put a single lucky dip on the lottery. I figure if I haven't won anything it's like £1 - £1.50 (sometimes the prize is in the Euromillions draw which is more expensive. In regards to net losses and net wins. I've entered the lottery like 20 times in my life since turning 16 and legally being allowed to do so. I have won £10 (3 balls matching) 3 times. I have won around £80 for matching 4 balls once. Therefore my net wins are way higher than my net losses on it. I know it's unlikely on a 1 in xxxxxx many millions chance of ever winning but apart from blackjack I doubt I would ever win in a casino. I'm not bad at blackjack but there's not as much money in it.

[Faris]

Nope, I avoid the lottery because I don't really understand or care to learn how it works. What I do love are scratch cards! Since I don't work in a grocery store anymore I don't buy them anywhere near as often as I used to though :( Keno is the best.

[Shorty]

I've bought a few scratch cards with my friends for jokes so we could sit around and tell eachother what we're going to do with millions of dollars while laughing at the other person for still being poor. I didn't really put any stock into it, though, because it's seemingly impossible. I do indeed think it's a scam, especially considering the taxes you have to pay on your winnings.

If I really wanted to gamble, I'm sure I could go to a casino but I'm not really the gambling type.

[Quindiana Jones]

I found out that casinos can't take your winnings from you if you count cards. Blackjack ftw?

[Sephex]

Occasionally, I will give a coworker 25 cents to a dollar in a small company pool for major lotteries. If the earning is VERY big, then even more occasionally I will buy a personal ticket. That's about it.

I know the chances are very rare, but I still feel it is okay to try for something that ridiculous every once in awhile.

[Shiny]

Nope, I do not play the lottery. I'm way to pessimistic to gamble with money. My dad buys lotto tickets and scratch offs all the time. He has most likely spent more money overtime than he has won, but I believe the most he has ever won at one point was around $200 and other times $50, so I guess that's enough for him to keep playing.

[Bunny]

I had a statistics professor ask the class on the first day "So, how many of you play the lottery?" A few people raised their hands, to which he responded "you are all idiots." He then explained why using math.

I don't play the lottery. I know a few people who play it sparingly, about 1 or 2 tickets every couple of months, just for fun. It's a nice dream if you win, but the odds are so impossibly slim that nobody I know takes it seriously.

[Madame Adequate]

Well, the point of a game of chance is that you're unlikely to win but if you do it's a Big Freakin' Deal. :greenie: Though as I am aware of just how bad the chance of winning is I do not play the lottery.

[Shiny]

A former college professor of mine won the lottery recently. $7 million dollars. He quit his two jobs, but might actually come back next to teach.

[Pike]

Nope, never cared to play the lottery. My dad does sometimes for MEGAMILLIONS or whatever. He also gets scratch cards sometimes. I think he got a free tank of gas off of one of them once.

[Raistlin]

I had a statistics professor ask the class on the first day "So, how many of you play the lottery?" A few people raised their hands, to which he responded "you are all idiots."

I like this guy.

[Agent Proto]

I don't play the lotto for the extremely poor odds of ever winning. I might do it like once in a blue moon, but that's very rare.

[Jinx]

Nope. I even opted out of going to the casino on my 21st. I morally don't agree with casinos and gambling. But hey, that's me, and this isn't EoEO.

[Bunny]

I had a statistics professor ask the class on the first day "So, how many of you play the lottery?" A few people raised their hands, to which he responded "you are all idiots."

I like this guy.

He was a good professor. Really understanding for people (like me) who are just bad at math. He had a few times where he made fun of people in the class, or the class in general, because of something stupid that they did.

[Jiro]

I love gambling but I prefer something that requires a little more skill and a little less luck.

[Tigmafuzz]

http://www.smbc-comics.com/comics/20110728.gif


I'm great at Poker btw.

[Jiro]

Tigmafuzz I would love to play some heads up hold 'em with you.

[Madonna]

Only a fool gambles when you can instead kill the person possessing what you covet; it is known.

[Citizen Bleys]

Only a fool gambles when you can instead kill the person possessing what you covet; it is known.

It is known.

[Raistlin]

I morally don't agree with casinos and gambling.

I cannot understand any moral qualms with gambling on principle. I play poker once a week at a local game, $15 buy in. The tournament generally lasts about 3 hours, with the top 3 paying out. If I lose, I just paid $15 for 3 hours of fun and entertainment, which is what I would spend for a movie theater ticket + snacks. The only real distinction between gambling and any other form of entertainment is that gambling involves the possibility of getting money back.

Of course, it can be a very expensive game and you can lose a lot of money, but people can lose a lot of money on anything if they are irresponsible (fancy cars, drugs, electronics, video games, etc.). Some people's irresponsibility does not make the act itself immoral (which is my same argument for abortion rights when people say "but some people use it like birth control!").

I will say that I do not understand games of pure chance (slots, roulette, etc.). I have fun playing poker because it also involves some level of skill and constant meaningful choices, as well as personal interaction. But I appreciate that many people do enjoy those games, so whatever floats their boat.

[NorthernChaosGod]

I used to love going to casinos for about a year. I would go and play blackjack 90% of the time because I'd just count cards and turn $40 into about $120 in an hour or two. Then I'd get them to feed me for free. :monster:

I've also played War there, which is stupidly luck based.

[Quindiana Jones]

The Grosvenor Casino in Manchester does the best hot chocolate. And I mean the best. You get drinks free as long as someone's gambling.

[Pike]

I had a coworker once who would go to the casino once a week or so and she always made out with more money then she went in with. Always. It was ridiculous. Once she called in and said she would be late for work because she was busy collecting her winnings; when she finally showed up she had like $8000 cash with her.

[Old Manus]

You can go on the National Lottery website and set up a direct debit to automatically buy you a certain amount of tickets a week and send you an SMS if you win anything. I don't really care about people doing it though, the National Lottery give a phenomenal amount of money to charities and good causes.

I prefer sports betting.

[Jiro]

Sometimes I feel like I should do sports betting. AFL has many games that are so clear cut that you could just bet your whole life savings and be guaranteed a return.

[Slothy]

I certainly agree that throwing money at the lottery every week is a bit silly since it's highly unlikely any single person will ever win, but calling it a scam is a bit much. Calling it a scam implies that it never pays out to anyone. It's really no more a scam than playing slots or roulette or something in a casino. I'd actually almost say a lot of pure random chance based casino games like that are more scam like since they rely on various psychological tricks to try and get people literally addicted. The lottery does the same thing to some extent, but not quite as much as Casino's are willing to resort to I find.

I've been known to throw a few bucks at the lottery if the jackpot is high enough. If my situation were so dire that I needed that money to live I obviously wouldn't, and I don't do it very often. Maybe two or three times a year tops if I happen to be in a store that sells tickets and the mood strikes me. Yeah, I know the odds of winning; I've calculated them myself numerous times, but screw it. Sometimes it just feels nice to take the chance on it and I'm not going to miss those few dollars it costs me every year.

[Raistlin]

I certainly agree that throwing money at the lottery every week is a bit silly since it's highly unlikely any single person will ever win, but calling it a scam is a bit much. Calling it a scam implies that it never pays out to anyone. It's really no more a scam than playing slots or roulette or something in a casino.

I disagree. The odds of you winning a greater return on your "investment" long-term is one in hundreds of millions. Say some con-artist is selling bullshit quackery as a medical cure to save someone's life; most people would generally consider that a scam. But what are the odds of the "cure" having an actual beneficial affect by some freak accident? I'd say it's at least as high as winning the lottery. I don't see much of a reason to distinguish the two. They prey on uninformed hopes for profit but are realistically virtual impossibilities. The fact that the lottery very rarely pays out does not change the fact that the design is to take money; snake oil may very rarely work too.

Roulette and slots are also designed to take more than they give, but the odds are not nearly as bad as the lottery. It's not even remotely debatable. People also go to casinos for those games for the entertainment factor.

[Peegee]

The chances of you winning are astronomically low. That's why success stories are so amazing

(I will refrain from telling the mother of success stories, but if you have a way to ask me out of this forum I will tell you, but I will still censor out names...censor names? you mean this story has to do with people I know???)

I don't play the lottery. I don't think the lottery is a scam because I seriously associate the word 'scam' with 'government intervention' (what other definition is there? seriously, indulge me). Say you were PG walking down the street in Toronto and some guy talks to you asking if you want to buy a computer. Would you buy it, or would your BS detector go off? If it did, does it mandate government interference? Or would you just not buy from the guy? Yeah. That's what I did.

I see the same thing in lotteries. You almost are certain not to win, and people will give me every excuse under the sun. Statistically you'll end up losing money in the long run. I see them like slot machines - if you ever profit in slots you better cash out, because you won't win. I don't play slot machines, but people win all the time. Same with lottery:

A teacher at work won the 10mil lottery once
My friends have won some nice money in slot machines - enough to subsidize their entertainment expenses.

Does this justify playing? nah. Should you play? I'd say no, but I won't complain if you did. You might even win.