PDA

View Full Version : I Can't Pay My Bills



Clo
09-17-2012, 10:18 PM
I can't be the only one. I spent all day worrying over worksheets and the copy machine about all the bills I need to pay, loans I owe, all that jazz... I try hard to be a functioning adult, I actually am a fairly responsible person, and yet I am never able to take care of everything when I need to.

What is the secret to having your tit together? How is it that I work nine hour days and have no money?

Commiserate with me, people. Talk about your broke ass selves.

People with money, gtfo. :colbert: Or mail me a check, kthanx.

Shorty
09-17-2012, 10:32 PM
Answer: You live in New York. Also I will mail you a check, with love.

It took me years to get my trout together. Finally, at 23, I am just now starting to get the hang of DON'T BLOW YOUR GROCERY MONEY FOR THE WEEK ON ETSY. The only reason I am not broke right now is because I am paying the cheapest rent I have ever seen in the area I live in. Although that's to be expected when your place is not bigger than a cardboard box. :aimmad:

Clo
09-17-2012, 10:43 PM
I live in Western New York, not exactly the Big Apple.

Jowy
09-17-2012, 10:45 PM
you're still paying thirteen bucks for a pack of cigarettes though

eff wegmans, man!

Clo
09-17-2012, 10:47 PM
I go to the reservation.

And this isn't diss where I live thread, it's a bitch about money thread. :stare:

Sephex
09-17-2012, 10:48 PM
I am okay at paying bills. I do it in a timely fashion, but I sometime end up spending on crap that I don't really need. I guess a good analogy is that I sometimes rock the boat, but I am never reckless enough to tip it over.

Rostum
09-17-2012, 11:11 PM
I'm back at uni and having to rely on my parents to fork my half of the rent/bills. Not a good feeling. :\

escobert
09-17-2012, 11:38 PM
dirty new yorkers!

I live with my parents so my lack of making much money is offset by having fewer bills!

Clo
09-18-2012, 12:09 AM
:colbert:

None of you people made me feel any better, except Tifa's Boobs.

Jinx
09-18-2012, 12:14 AM
:colbert:

None of you people made me feel any better, except Tifa's Boobs.

:D

Nous sommes povres! :D Je t'aime, Clo. Je t'aime le povre. Je suis the povre. Nous sommes le povre.

Maintenant, je pleure. :( Mon dieu, je n'aime pas ma vie. :mad2:

Raistlin
09-18-2012, 12:24 AM
I spent all my money on law school and couldn't work much of the summer due to the bar. And now my deferral for my subsidized law school loans ends in a month or two, which means I'll be paying an additional ~$400-500/month just for loan payments. Should be interesting.

Jinx
09-18-2012, 12:26 AM
I spent all my money on law school and couldn't work much of the summer due to the bar. And now my deferral for my subsidized law school loans ends in a month or two, which means I'll be paying an additional ~$400-500/month just for loan payments. Should be interesting.

You won't be able to buy those thirty-six-hundred-dollar suits

COME ON

Christmas
09-18-2012, 12:28 AM
I was really broke at a moment of my life and was digging from the trash cans or fighting with the stray animals for food . :(

But I managed to get into a few random encounters, killed some monsters, get the money that magically appears after they died and I am loaded again!! :bigsmile:

fire_of_avalon
09-18-2012, 12:46 AM
I am getting to the point where I'm not picking which bill doesn't get paid that month and I have a teeny tiny little bitty amount in savings. A little progress at a time.

Iceglow
09-18-2012, 01:15 AM
it's called 2 credit cards, pay bills with those then repay each card with one payment each month. Hope the credit limits aren't breached before you pay all your bills and only have to pay those off each month.

NorthernChaosGod
09-18-2012, 01:28 AM
I'm broke because I get too few hours at work and have too many fucking expenses. School being the largest one since that's mostly out of pocket.

Pike
09-18-2012, 01:49 AM
I am getting to the point where I'm not picking which bill doesn't get paid that month and I have a teeny tiny little bitty amount in savings. A little progress at a time.

Same here. It took a loooong time. Turning 29 years old in a few months and I live with my dad because I can't afford to live on my own. Not that it's a big improvement. But slightly better than when I lived with my mom the year prior, and we were all wearing coats and snowsuits indoors because we couldn't afford heating during the winter, and we ate nothing but rice for months on end.

I could never comprehend friends or acquaintances who say things like "oh, my parents are helping me pay for this/that/the other thing." It's such a foreign concept to me. You... you mean there are people out there whose parents aren't in crippling poverty? :confused:

Jiro
09-18-2012, 05:23 AM
I just don't spend money. Just. None.

Shorty
09-18-2012, 05:33 AM
:colbert:

None of you people made me feel any better, except Tifa's Boobs.

I guess you skipped the part where I said I'd mail you a check. WITH LOVE. :colbert:

Shlup
09-18-2012, 05:49 AM
My bank account hasn't ever been anywhere near empty since I got my first job at 17. I'm a saver, and I married a saver, so we've always been okay despite having trouble keeping steady jobs. It helps that we didn't have to put ourselves through college, and we've had cheap rent for the last couple of years.

Araciel
09-18-2012, 06:20 AM
Step one: Have simple pleasures (drinking occasionally, no drugs or cigs or bars, don't buy vehicle unless necessary for income)
Step two: Skip college
Step three: Somehow land job that nets me almost 40k/year
Step four: Meet life partner who did same

Bubba
09-18-2012, 10:12 AM
Paying mortgage and bills is a real struggle. If I didn't do guitar teaching as well as my normal job then I probably couldn't afford it. I could get a smaller place but I love my house. I've had lodgers in the past though when money's been particularly tight.

As long as you budget and you know where all your money goes then it's not hard keep on top of things.

Night Fury
09-18-2012, 11:37 AM
I work a part time job while at uni, and stick my loans and grants into savings for my trip next year.

I have a fair bit in there but not as much as I'd like as I had to dip into it a lot last year when times were tough, and my laptop broke.

But yeah, at the moment I'm working so many more hours a week and by the end of the month I'm still in my overdraft and that's just to pay for the necessary stuff. Bills/food/rent.

It's too hard :(

I'm going to be moving in with relatives once I graduate so hopefully I'll be better off as I won't be paying so much out.

If all else fails I will just become a Golddigger.

Cuchulainn
09-18-2012, 12:11 PM
Sell your ass for money on Craigslist or Gumtree Clo, that's how i'm able to afford all my expensive drugs, plus i've a little left over for bread & milk & for when i need to buy a new spoon or lighter.

Pheesh
09-18-2012, 12:30 PM
Ever since I started saving for my trip to america it got super hard to stay on top of bills. I had to stop making the payments on my piano and that got carted off (plus, I'm moving interstate next year and wouldn't be able to take it with me without paying heaps), and it is the worst feeling ever to have to dip into savings to pay for bills/food etc.

It'll be good to relax about it all on holiday and have access to all the money I haven't been touching in months. I'll probably come back to a mountain of bills though AND I got my first credit card as a safety net for my trip, so I may b paying that off as well if I'm forced to use it Y_Y

Iceglow
09-18-2012, 06:21 PM
I'm being incredibly stupid of course deliberately so though for bigger issues 2 credit cards can definitely help but you can't possibly keep paying everything for it.

Seriously best ways to save money:

Quit smoking it's a luxury and bad for you if you can't afford to pay bills you can't afford to smoke.
Quit drinking it's the same as above though you could still go for the odd drink you need to keep being somewhat sociable.
Change your cell tariff so you don't pay ridiculous rates for crap you don't use.
Change your isp if possible, this might save you a small amount of cash.
Cancel all non-essential services.
If you're spending lots on like dvd's/music/games join services like Netflix/Spotify (and similar) it'll at least cut down the outgoings each month. Be warned services like netflix/lovefilm in the uk what offer games don't provide any online activation codes for games so you'll need to buy them separately or get the game on the high street still.
Look around for a cheaper apartment, find out how much the average room rental in your area is. If you're renting and it's above the average you could try negotiating with your landlord if he/she won't budge then consider moving. The cost of a deposit is a large lump sum but in the long term it could be better.
Apply for better paid jobs that are in your field, change of job means upheaval but if you're earning like £15k doing customer service work and a company pays £20k for the same sort of jobs moving job would be win win.
Drive less, spend the initial outlay on a mountain bike with a decent set of gears, cycling will keep you healthy meaning you need less from a gym and once you've got your bike and gear you need for road cycling it's pretty much free (I count there being a minor cost in cost of things like water/energy drinks you might need after cycling mid-long distances as an expense still)
Look at your schedule, can you work 2 jobs? If you can could you cope with working an extra job around your current schedule, this is great for short term money building, choose something stupid like waiting tables as tips go a long way in your week without forming part of your budget.
Look at what you eat and buy grocery wise, if you're buying branded food like Kellogs and there's a cheaper own brand alternative that's just as good or a value range available what isn't too bad consider eating that.
Look at changing your diet to cut junk and increase the core health groups you need, this is especially important if looking at cycling/jogging to work!


It's what I consider when looking to save money.

Psychotic
09-18-2012, 06:30 PM
Get a budgeting spreadsheet somewhere online, fill it in. I know most of you will read this and disregard it as effort, but for the one or two of you that give a shit, trust me, it'll fucking work wonders. I do this for a living, my friends.
it's called 2 credit cards, pay bills with those then repay each card with one payment each month. Hope the credit limits aren't breached before you pay all your bills and only have to pay those off each month.Don't ever, ever, do this.

The Summoner of Leviathan
09-18-2012, 06:31 PM
I went from not living paycheque to paycheque to living from paycheque to paycheque again. I just started a second BA, so I had to cut my hours at work back. I'm still waiting on student loans to go through. Oh, and to top it off, my dental work that was supposed to be covered by my uni's insurance is in a blackout period so it is now coming out of my pocket. I might get reimbursed come Christmas! Though the blackout period ends way before that! Oh and my credit card got maxed out (thanks to scrambling to pay the dentist)!

Edit: My current wages puts me on the cusp of a higher tax brackets so I am getting taxed more thus essentially making the same as my previous wage! This isn't counting my 42k student loan that has been on deferral since forever.

Clo
09-18-2012, 09:52 PM
What the hell people, I didn't ask for financial advice (though I guess... thank you?). I strictly wanted bitching for the purpose of making me FEEL BETTER, not to add to my to-do list.

This is an internet forum, I thought you guys would be fantastic at bitching about money. Think of it like a blues song. This place could write a self-help book, christalmighty.

Love you guys though.

Maybe.

Psychotic
09-18-2012, 10:00 PM
What the hell people, I didn't ask for financial advice Well actually.
What is the secret to having your tit together? Unless you literally meant having your tits together and in which case my advice is a push up bra. Always does the trick for me.

Jinx
09-18-2012, 10:02 PM
What the hell people, I didn't ask for financial advice (though I guess... thank you?). I strictly wanted bitching for the purpose of making me FEEL BETTER, not to add to my to-do list.

This is an internet forum, I thought you guys would be fantastic at bitching about money. Think of it like a blues song. This place could write a self-help book, christalmighty.

Love you guys though.

Maybe.

yeah guys

she didn't ask for advice

this isn't eoeo

you don't have to be dicks

fuck

:peachdance:

Shiny
09-18-2012, 10:05 PM
Can you pay her bills?
Can you pay her telephone bills?
Can you pay her automobile bills?
So maybe then you and her can chillll.

Clo
09-18-2012, 10:10 PM
Oh trout, when I asked that question I suppose I didn't expect anyone to have any answers.

Carry on, then. Keep giving me advice.

krissy
09-18-2012, 11:44 PM
i don't have any answers

but we'll always have tonight

Jiro
09-18-2012, 11:51 PM
Gotta be careful what you say~~~

Money's always been tight so yeah I dunno how we do it

Christmas
09-19-2012, 01:57 AM
This reminds me, all the kids in my school are crazy over bottle caps because there is a lucky draw promotion going on by a drink company. Think the prize is quite a sizable amount of cash. They will search the rubbish bins for bottle caps and will get so happy when given one bottle cap by me. Oh gosh, the temptation of money starts at such a young age. :bigsmile:

PS: Guess they are tight too! :bigsmile:

Laddy
09-19-2012, 05:57 AM
I misread the thread as "Can't play with my balls."

Heh.

Pheesh
09-19-2012, 06:14 AM
Clo can always play with her balls! Always!

Chris
09-19-2012, 11:59 AM
There is always a simple solution to all money problems: Do not spend what you do not have!

I'm not a very organized person, but my account never hits empty. Why? because I'm cheap as hell. Being cheap, does have many benefits.

Loony BoB
09-19-2012, 01:18 PM
Aside from the obvious "cut costs everywhere" ordeal, the easiest way for me to manage money is to always know how much I have, how much is due to come off for scheduled bills (eg. rent, power, gas, bus card, phone, internet, MMO subscriptions, credit card payments, whatever) and when I'm next getting paid. That way I know exactly what I'm playing with for the rest of the month and I can have a better idea over how much I can spend on any given day. I check this roughly every few days. If I'm unsure and I don't have access to my spreadsheet at home, I don't spend much if anything at all.

Basically I've made it a habit and a duty of mine to know exactly where my money goes and when.

Also, despite it costing extra for delivery, I get my groceries online when I can because you can see exactly what you are spending and can shop around a lot easier. I always spend more when I do big grocery shops at the store than I do when I shop online. It's so much easier to see what's coming out of your account.

If you buy food/drink/etc, don't overspend on things and then not use them (eg. things that expire or just things you don't end up using). A good way to do this is to think "breakfast, meals, snacks, drinks." Then when you look through your shopping basket, check over things that will expire fast and think over whether you expect to eat them anytime soon. Check to see if you have too many of one thing and too little of something else - people often spend a lot of money on expensive snacks and not much on less expensive meals, or vice versa. Finally, fruit. People moan and moan about how much it costs to eat healthy, but damn, have you seen the price of bananas? They're so damned cheap compared to even crisps and biscuits. It's great!

Drink more water. This will save you a very large amount as other drinks cost a lot of money compared to water, which is free. Diluting juice is your next best bet.

Christmas
09-19-2012, 01:25 PM
BoB will make a good husband and dad. :bigsmile:

Did you bargain and shout abuse when the cashier refuses to give you a discount or free gifts like those housewives? :bigsmile:

Loony BoB
09-19-2012, 02:54 PM
I'm not the kind of guy who feels entitled to discounts for no reason. Instead, just look for good deals on foods you like and buy them when they come about (if you can afford it - and that's important!).

Christmas
09-19-2012, 03:02 PM
Man, you are like the person I really like to meet up to see just how mindful you are with everything you do. :bigsmile:

Loony BoB
09-19-2012, 03:12 PM
Eh, it's not that tricky. When you get paid, figure out how many scheduled bills you have for the month and what they are likely to be (most should be the same pretty much every month). Subtract that amount from what you have at the time you get paid and whatever is left is what you have to spend that month on groceries, nights out, savings, petrol, whatever it is that you do. The rest is just standard budgeting... eg. how much you spend on food, how much you spend on petrol, figure out what's most important, manage the cash, blah blah blah.

Clo
09-19-2012, 06:18 PM
Wow, I am not that organized.

Money is much more complicated than some of you make it sound. Except BoB, who is clearly an accountant.

I don't spend excessive money. :colbert: I never buy clothes, accessories, whatever, anymore. I usually only buy food, and I buy cheap. I only drink water. The thing really draining me of funds are my loan payments for college, and stupid traffic tickets, and necessary evils like buying a bridesmaid dress and fixing my car.

Jinx
09-19-2012, 06:32 PM
Loony Bob

Common sense is a concept these plebs don't understand.

Beowulf
09-19-2012, 06:36 PM
I'm paying my bills, somehow, and still affording to smoke like a chimney.

Oh, wait. I eat maybe once a day.

I have my priorities straight. :cool:

Peegee
09-19-2012, 09:07 PM
I was told to GTFO but as if I would ever listen to Clo. Besides I always give good advice.

My colleague had this comment once that made no sense to me - he said that he has no money this week because it all went to bills.

I was like 'wait what?' because my bills break down as follows (yes I am telling you people my finances)

first two weeks:
- gym membership
- car insurance
- 80-100$ bus pass
- refill tank once
- food / fun

That's not actually a lot of expenses tbh - I end up saving at least half my paycheque this round

second two weeks:
- car payment
- 80-100$ bus pass

again, I end up saving half. At least until last month, where I paid off my car. So now I can go back to saving money.

The point of explaining my finances is to give you an idea of how things should look. You normally get 2 or 4 paycheques a month, and so you should split the bills such that you do not get overloaded. Imagine paying rent and car payment in the same pay period? That's possible but you would have to have savings in order to cover a month ahead (and then refill the spent amount using the money earned in the current month).

I am ofc talking about living paycheque to paycheque. If you have several months of earnings saved, then whatever (invest that mother!)

The other thing is to sit down and figure out your after tax income vs your expenses. Is your after tax income > expenses? Great. I'll get back to that.

The other thing is credit cards. I bet a lot of you have a balance. Credit cards are very annoying to pay down. What happens is you go through a cycle of spending money to pay down the credit card, and then you need that money to make expense payments. Oops - the balance goes back up to (or higher than) what it was before.

That's why you have to add into your expenses the minimum payment of the credit card(s). And then put away your credit card. So now you have your expense column (sigh) and your earning column (awww...nuts). What do?

Sort your expense column from lowest to highest. Yes really. Pay off the debt that is the lowest. This includes credit cards. Pay down your credit cards (I know you have more than one) from lowest balance to highest. If you ever get birthday money, or bonuses or whatever, it goes into your loans. It works! You'll pay down your credit cards really fast this way. Yes, really just pay minimum payments on the ones with higher balances - minimum payments ALWAYS are higher than the interest added to the principle, and you are basically keeping your balance somewhat the same as you pay down the rest.

Eventually you'll pay off all of your debt. I promise you.

The only way the above does not work, is if your expenses (minimum loan payments + monthly bills) are higher than your earnings. Then you'll have to make more money, or cut expenses. I'm afraid I cannot give too much advice as the scenarios are too different and varied. Suggestions might be moving back to your parents' place, getting a roommate who is stable (this is important as hell), or selling your assets to increase your revenue.

Good luck eoffers.

Jinx
09-19-2012, 10:16 PM
lol pg lives with his parents

Clo
09-20-2012, 01:16 AM
My parents would never let me live with them.

I love them. But yeah.

Jinx
09-20-2012, 01:19 AM
My point was more like, he was being high and mighty about "THIS IS WHAT I SPEND MY MONEY ON WHY CAN'T YOU SAVE YOUR MONEY" but rent was not one of those things.

NorthernChaosGod
09-20-2012, 02:29 AM
Don't make PG squat you.

krissy
09-20-2012, 02:33 AM
i was actually listening to a radio program today about how the whole 'kids have to move out' is mainly a north american phenomenon, and most non-western countries work rather differently. ethnically speaking, i'm not expected to leave the house until i get married (e marriage doesn't' count unfortunately) and while i don't expect that to be the reason why i'll leave, it's interesting how there's a stigma for staying at home and saving money that way, but that stigma is mostly a western thing. i actually notice that my north american/western raised friends will comment on me living with my parents in terms of 'so when you movin out huh', while most of my non-na friends don't really care or think it that weird.

of course, there's the case where you don't do any development while you're at home, but i think that's less common than you'd think.

but even in canada there's a growing trend of 20-somethings moving back in with their parents or just living with their parents. i dunno if it's an economic thing, but when i hear about people that have to move out because their parents want them to i always tilt my head a little bit because i guess i'm not really used to it (although i should be after living in western society for so long).

Clo
09-20-2012, 02:52 AM
I haven't lived with my parents since I was 18. I can't even fathom. My mom is kinda cray, if 'knom sayin'.

I really enjoy living on my own too. My apartment is small and cozy and not that expensive.

Clo
09-20-2012, 03:14 AM
Almost two years ago I stayed with my parents a month in between apartments after being hospitalized and having to deal with the bill, so I can kinda relate, Boobs.

I ended up living in a single bedroom with my good friend Robyn to pay cheap rent somewhere eventually.

Peegee
09-20-2012, 03:30 AM
Krissy--I'm 21 and live with my parents. Financially, I could live on my own (with a roommate) and almost did. But I decided against it. I pay rent money to my parents (obviously it's much much less than I'd pay on my own) so I DO help out.

I was more commenting on the fact that someone thinks they can be superior and high-and-mighty about saving money and being "fiscally responsible" when they don't include paying rent on their own part of that equation. Sure, it's easy to save money/have enough money for bills when you're living for rent-free. Even in my situation where I pay my parents $300 a month, I still have it easy, and have plenty of disposable income.

I'm just a little short at them moment, since I was in the hospital.

So wait, because I live with my parents that invalidates..what exactly? I've lived in 3 different cities and two different countries since I turned 18.

How are you going to justify it next year when I own property that I rent out to tenants? That I'm part of the "1%" that was able to do this?

My advice on paying off debt is spot on. Pay off the loans that are lowest in balance and move toward the highest loans afterward. Don't throw all of your cash into loans if you will just end up using them once you run out of cash.

If you can't afford to do even that your expenses are too high. Then you'll have to evaluate whether your situation is unmanageable.

Ever consider that I know this because of experience? You must think I'm sitting here with a silver spoon going 'oh those working class marxists are at it again'. Please.

>hurr durr pg doesn't spend 1200 dollars a month on rent what a fool

krissy makes a good point that outside of western culture, the idea of moving out asap is not really a norm. It's a waste of money. You rent only because the expenditure is less than your perceived value. I see renting as a colossal waste of money.


Anyway the good thing about forums is my post is right there for the world to see. Some lurker or person who won't reply will see my advice on paying off credit cards and in a year or two will be clear and free.

krissy
09-20-2012, 04:02 AM
oh i wasn't offended or anything honeyboobs, i just felt the entire 'living at home' solution could be mentioned in the thread again, and the posts and the radio show just reminded me of my own situation. thought it was topical and interesting, there was a south asian lady that was saying how no one in that community sees the kids leave home before they're married, and it certainly helps with launching them out of the nest.

rent is DEFINITELY a huge expenditure, and i see where pg is coming from avoiding renting vs paying off a place. i can also see where clo is coming from, because there are times where we don't all get along, no matter how close we are; it's just a result of living with other human beings. but it's all different and every situation has ups and downs; i'd be incredibly afraid to move out AND take care of a kid for example, i'd be living off food stamps and i don't have a regular job. luckily i'm not in that position.

there were some items in the news today, following a local census, which described that whole moving back in thing i talked about earlier, and that there was a rise of people who were living alone which was interesting, although that may be the aging population. a lot of the older folks have trouble making ends meet as well. i heard a few years ago, that to maintain your current standard of living you need at least a million saved up in the bank before retirement comes around, on average. i'm not sure what kind of inflation that's had in the past few years, or even how true it is, but i don't see very many older people who AREN'T supported by their families doing so good economically. it seems like it's very good to have family support no matter what age you are, although i am beginning to sound like captain obvious and oh geez i digress.

adjacently (thought the news didn't connect the two) there's been an increase in food bank use by various populations. is there a food bank system in place near you clo?

Loony BoB
09-20-2012, 10:48 AM
Except BoB, who is clearly an accountant.
Only for my own account, like most people should be for their own account. :p

But if you really want me to, you can send me your monthly incomings and outgoings and I can point at areas that you could potentially work on. I would say traffic tickets are one thing you could definitely focus on avoiding. Don't speed, don't park where you can't, etc.

Pike
09-20-2012, 11:16 AM
The problem with handing out tips like this and "just budget your money" and so forth is that while they are sound for most people they are not sound for people who have been in situations where they suddenly find themselves sick/unemployed/disabled/etc. and are unable to budget because they are not making enough money to budget. I know because I have been there. I've had people telling me "just make a budget" when I'm coming up hundreds of dollars short every month just from paying necessary bills, and I've had people telling me "just get a job at Wal-Mart lolol" when I'm sending out dozens of applications to everywhere, Wal-Mart included, every day.

I'm not saying your guys' advice isn't sound. I'm just saying I've been in situations where none of this works.

Night Fury
09-20-2012, 11:21 AM
The problem with handing out tips like this and "just budget your money" and so forth is that while they are sound for most people they are not sound for people who have been in situations where they suddenly find themselves sick/unemployed/disabled/etc. and are unable to budget because they are not making enough money to budget. I know because I have been there. I've had people telling me "just make a budget" when I'm coming up hundreds of dollars short every month just from paying necessary bills, and I've had people telling me "just get a job at Wal-Mart lolol" when I'm sending out dozens of applications to everywhere, Wal-Mart included, every day.

I'm not saying your guys' advice isn't sound. I'm just saying I've been in situations where none of this works.

^ 100% this

Loony BoB
09-20-2012, 11:49 AM
The problem with handing out tips like this and "just budget your money" and so forth is that while they are sound for most people they are not sound for people who have been in situations where they suddenly find themselves sick/unemployed/disabled/etc. and are unable to budget because they are not making enough money to budget. I know because I have been there. I've had people telling me "just make a budget" when I'm coming up hundreds of dollars short every month just from paying necessary bills, and I've had people telling me "just get a job at Wal-Mart lolol" when I'm sending out dozens of applications to everywhere, Wal-Mart included, every day.

I'm not saying your guys' advice isn't sound. I'm just saying I've been in situations where none of this works.
I completely understand this kind of a situation, but to leave it alone and do nothing is just going to exaggerate the issue. Eventually, inevitably, something will need to change, and that is what budgeting and accounting are all about. If your outgoings are higher than your incomings, it is an impossible situation and will have to change sooner rather than later. Something will have to go. Even people who are on jobseeker's allowance can still survive (and it's been shown that many do so for a living), so even if it means moving in with a large group of people so you have a lower share of the rent, something has to change. This is just the way things are. Moving in with your parents, renting with your friends, cancelling your internet... something. Anything! Whatever makes things work.

I'm not saying this because I'm showing off and I'm not saying this because the person wants help and I'm not saying this because I've been there before nor am I saying this because I have it easy. I am saying this purely for one reason: I believe people need to solve these kind of problems. It is a neccessity for their sake to make things work, or their problems will get worse until they are homeless. Why would I not want to stop this happening to someone that I know?!

Clo
09-20-2012, 11:51 AM
I agree with Pike. And this thread is getting a little serious. :(

Loony BoB
09-20-2012, 11:53 AM
If your outgoings are more than your incomings, then it's a serious problem and deserves serious advice.

Bubba
09-20-2012, 11:53 AM
You're right, Clo. How about a joke?

Why did the dwarf enjoy playing soccer?

Because the grass tickled his testicles.

Clo
09-20-2012, 11:59 AM
If your outgoings are more than your incomings, then it's a serious problem and deserves serious advice.

Well, since some things are just not options, I guess I just have to deal. Also, I should probably clarify, I do pay my bills, just not on time, and sometimes I'm eating pasta for two weeks and staying in.

My life is still good, and I will probably get out of this slump once I get my trout together and the beginning of the school year is over.

Until then, I'm going to enjoy some light-hearted bitching on the Internet. It's not like I have a kid and I'm on food stamps.

And ha. I thought of Tyrion, Bubba.

Christmas
09-20-2012, 12:25 PM
Final fantasy forum discussing real life money. Lol.

Edit: Continue please.

Loony BoB
09-20-2012, 01:04 PM
If your outgoings are more than your incomings, then it's a serious problem and deserves serious advice.

Well, since some things are just not options, I guess I just have to deal. Also, I should probably clarify, I do pay my bills, just not on time, and sometimes I'm eating pasta for two weeks and staying in.

My life is still good, and I will probably get out of this slump once I get my trout together and the beginning of the school year is over.

Until then, I'm going to enjoy some light-hearted bitching on the Internet. It's not like I have a kid and I'm on food stamps.

And ha. I thought of Tyrion, Bubba.
Ranting on the internet about problems will always result in people suggesting solutions to problems. ;) That's the internet for ya.

Jiro
09-20-2012, 03:33 PM
Some good advice in this thread. I now know how PG is a rich canazn.

Madame Adequate
09-20-2012, 05:12 PM
ITT people who believe income actually matches necessary outgoings for many people. BoB especially has no clue what he is talking about and especially when he says people on JSA somehow "make it their living" or whatever that mindless nonsense was.

The reason you have no money is simple. You're getting fucked coming and going, at work, with your rent, and at the bank. You're not getting paid enough, you're funding your landlord's rentier life, your bank is using your money to give the CEOs huge bonuses.

Clo
09-20-2012, 06:06 PM
And that's when Hux became my new best friend.

NorthernChaosGod
09-20-2012, 06:13 PM
So is this when PG comes in a suggests something anti-government?

Pike
09-20-2012, 06:15 PM
So is this when PG comes in a suggests something anti-government?

Of course! I've already got popcorn in the microwave :hyper:

Clo
09-20-2012, 06:23 PM
I'm pretty much ready to print Hux's post and frame it in my foyer to be the first thing I see when I come home from work.

Iceglow
09-20-2012, 06:45 PM
I've got an unusual situation for myself at the moment, having spent the last 10 years living with monthly wages, monthly expenditures I'm finally going to have money every week. This is because my current job has taken the unusual approach to paying us weekly (I suppose because it's a call center and weekly payments means easier to terminate contracts and so forth with how high turnover could become) Though I like the fact that it's contractual that each year with cost of living increase my wages will always go up to match it (some sly fox put that in the contract to the client organization) Weekly wages means I have now a difficult position for me; I have to somehow begin managing my money far better so that when my wages clear I do not wind up spending too much and having nothing to pay my monthly lump sum of rent in the first week of the month. Roll on the overtime though because if I do some extra hours (which whilst ridiculous amounts are ill-advised overtime is freely available on a regular basis) it's extra income for when I needs it.

Psychotic
09-20-2012, 08:34 PM
Just want to say I've advised dozens of people on finances who have even less money than any of you. Well, unless you're homeless but then I'd question what you're doing on a Final Fantasy forum if that was the case. Budgeting is the first step. No it's not a cure all, of course it isn't. It's a way of making what little you do have stretch as far as it can.

So much stuff is out of your control and unfair when it comes to money. This is one thing you can control. It won't solve it, but it'll make a dent. And let me tell you, being able to finally control something about their finances, however small, has meant so much to a lot of desperate people.

Pike
09-20-2012, 09:31 PM
Yeah Paul put it very nicely, no doubt better than I could. My biggest problem when I was in my worst financial doldrums was that people were giving me the budget step, which was good, and then saying "There you go, all fixed! :jess: " and I was just "wtf no it's not fixed come back I need more help :( "

Madame Adequate
09-21-2012, 01:10 AM
Yeah I didn't want to suggest there was absolutely nothing at all to be done, you can usually improve things to some extent. It's just that there should be no surprise that budgeting alone is rarely sufficient for people who are legit poor.

~*~Celes~*~
09-21-2012, 02:05 AM
I know how you feel, dear. I had to take a leave from work a little earlier than anticipated (i'm 9 weeks away from my due date) for the health of both myself and my son, which unfortunately, leaves us riding on just Andrew's income until 7 weeks after the baby's born. Minimum payments on bills and cheap-as-possible eating will be the way of life for a while :/

Loony BoB
09-21-2012, 10:10 AM
ITT people who believe income actually matches necessary outgoings for many people. BoB especially has no clue what he is talking about and especially when he says people on JSA somehow "make it their living" or whatever that mindless nonsense was.
I know a lot of people who have financial woes and I know a lot of people who earn a notable amount less than they do but get by just fine because they live within their means (some pay rent, too, just a very minimal amount because they live with a large number of people). I also know people who are happy enough to live off the government with no job whatsoever. You can ask Danielle, she knows them too. =P

So don't go around saying I have no clue when I have seen first hand the evidence that such things do bloody well happen. False accusations are a terrible thing and they certainly don't flatter you, MILF.

Also, pretty sure that a large number of people in this thread have said a hell of a lot more than "budgeting". Suggestions have ranged from cutting cigarettes to moving house. Budgeting just happens to be a massively important step to the whole damned lot of it. When people complain about finances and don't budget, then I'm sorry but what can you do besides first advising them to start budgeting? If they don't want to, then it's their own fault. If they do want to but it's not helping enough, then they need to go to companies like that which Psychotic works for and ask for professional advice. Again: You can't just ask for sympathy. Sympathy will not help your financial situation and your financial situation is an important thing. If your outgoings are more than your incomings then you need to take action until the problem is solved. Bitch at me because I might not be in such a situation and "don't understand" (because clearly everyone here has known about my financial situation all my life o_o I didn't learn to be a tight bastard by having a lot of money), but that doesn't make what I'm saying any less true.

If I didn't give a rat's arse about any of you I wouldn't offer you advice. So before you yell at me, consider the fact that I'm giving advice because I care about you bastards and I want to help. If you aren't willing to take the advice, then I ask of you: Why not?

If you really want to put me to the test, send me your incomings and outgoings and your living location and whatnot. I'll tell you what I'd do in your situation. *shrug* Might not be a quick thing though as I'd have to do a notable amount of research into your options. You'd still be better off contacting a company who specialise in this sort of thing, too. C'mon, Psychotic works for them. How bad can they be? :shifty:

Christmas
09-21-2012, 11:14 AM
See BoB, the internet matured. People are actually helping and giving advice to each other.

Goldenboko
09-21-2012, 08:19 PM
...did not expect this out of general chat o.o

I took out a butt load of loans for college under the assumption I'd get my 3 paid internships. 1 third of the way there so far :monster:

Madame Adequate
09-21-2012, 09:17 PM
BoB being mad

Someone didn't read the later post I made in the thread :greenie:


Yeah I didn't want to suggest there was absolutely nothing at all to be done, you can usually improve things to some extent. It's just that there should be no surprise that budgeting alone is rarely sufficient for people who are legit poor.

Ultimately saying "Budget better" is something that might help individuals but it doesn't address any of the problems that exist on the social scale; failure to teach people in school how to budget, failure to provide a decent, living wage for many people, extortionate rents, the near-complete destruction of social housing, the lack of social mobility and endemic poverty that afflicts many groups, the crushing debt incurred in going to uni or whatever in an attempt to better one's situation, the concentration of wealth and political power in the hands of a cronyist elite - these things are all contributing massively more than any individual carelessness or profligacy to the situation. So yes, Clo might find it easier to pay her bills if she uproots her life, gives up much of her independence, and lives like an ascetic, but she shouldn't actually have to do that just to get by.

In closing,

http://i789.photobucket.com/albums/yy178/Automilf/384066_490654867612163_2081421730_n_zpsedda4426.jpg

Goldenboko
09-21-2012, 09:24 PM
Income inequity has been around since the dawn of recorded human history. Rich have always existed, poor have always existed. Class based wealth is almost a natural outcome of society so that image says little to nothing to me. :|

Raistlin
09-21-2012, 10:12 PM
MILF and BoB: You're both focusing on entirely valid, but also entirely distinct, points. Huxley is focusing on overarching social/political problems, whereas Daniel is focusing on how to deal with one's situation personally. None of your points are mutually exclusive.

On one hand, the system sucks. It's created, funded, and continued by the people with money, who are most interested in keeping their own wealth. There are serious, systemic disadvantages with being poor that are incredibly difficult to overcome.

On the other hand, you still have to control what you can, and it's always possible to do something better. Just because a given situation sucks does not mean it could not suck somewhat less with some planning, organization, and effort. I don't think Daniel was dismissing the former issues (or at least I did not see any reason to think he was in this thread), but viewing them as a separate issue to the problem of managing one's own life. Because, well, it is, unless you just want to rant or make other people aware. But that still doesn't help short-term.

If anything, Huxley, you seem to be minimizing the importance and feasibility of careful planning and budgeting, which should be the main concern of one's personal life... and was the entire subject BoB was talking about. Nothing you said took away from anything Daniel and others such as Psy have said. I think your comment about BoB "having no clue" was unfair and unjustified. Something Psy said deserves special emphasis:


Budgeting is the first step. No it's not a cure all, of course it isn't. It's a way of making what little you do have stretch as far as it can.

So much stuff is out of your control and unfair when it comes to money. This is one thing you can control. It won't solve it, but it'll make a dent. And let me tell you, being able to finally control something about their finances, however small, has meant so much to a lot of desperate people.

Clo
09-21-2012, 10:29 PM
I kinda wanna rename this thread a nasally, drawn out "Fiscal Responsibility."

Madame Adequate
09-21-2012, 11:18 PM
I did specifically say that it was specifically his statement about people on JSA making a living from it that was nonsense, if anyone cares to read the entire sentence?

Raistlin
09-21-2012, 11:53 PM
The rest of your statement seemed much more broad than that, referring to his and others' statements about the importance of budgeting. That is what I was primarily addressing when saying you were minimizing the importance of planning and budgeting in individual lives and instead ranting about systemic woes. The latter's existence does not impact the significance of the former, and your statement that the latter is THE "reason you have no money" (seeming to refer to a general "you" instead of just Clo) is just as much an overgeneralization as what you are accusing Daniel of.


Ultimately saying "Budget better" is something that might help individuals but it doesn't address any of the problems that exist on the social scale

Also, admittedly I had no idea what "jobseeker's allowance" was (in context some type of government-funded unemployment?), and will say that BoB's statement in that context that "many" people make it a living (implying some sort of long-term abuse I'm assuming from Huxley's reaction, instead of him saying that people simply can live off of it) strikes me as highly dubious -- that is something that requires citation, and to something that's not the Daily Mail. Of course, assuming no one takes advantage of government benefits is just as bad as assuming every poor person does, but determining the laziness of a significant portion of an entire group due to the actions of some is disingenuous, and sounds more like a political soundbite than budgeting advice. I'll concede that point to you, Huxley. :p

Loony BoB
09-22-2012, 11:13 AM
Perhaps I should clarify that JSA isn't the only thing they claim. What I was getting at is that people who are unemployed are out there, making ends meet, using a combination of various state benefits (and I'm not talking disability or child benefits, I'm talking the benefits allowed to even me if I were to be unemployed). And for what it's worth, there are people living with their parents who probably do get by on JSA alone.

I have a friend who recently got made redundant at our work (no severance package, they were contracting) who has informed me of how they were surprised just how much they could claim, and that they would be able to get by okay if they cut out a lot of costs and just remained unemployed. But that kind of living isn't for them nor would it be one for me. Not because they want to work (although I do), but because they want to be able to afford things that are taken for granted by many of us but are not technically neccessary to live your life.

I'm fairly sure Psy has more of a clue as to how these people manage than I do, though.

Psychotic
09-22-2012, 11:53 AM
Yeah you can get by on state benefits if your circumstances are right. If you live in a privately rented property and/or if you have children you'll do just fine. Mortgaged people are smurfed, and people in social housing usually have pre-payment meters for their utilities and the prices on those are ridiculous. If you have kids then the Child Tax Credit gravy train will roll right into town and you'll be a-okay. Being part of a couple will also put you in a better position.

On the other side of the coin, it's impossible if you're under 25, single with no children. You get £56.25 weekly as opposed to the £71.00 for over 25's, or £111.45 for a couple. It's a complete and utter joke, because the gas company or supermarket or whoever don't suddenly say "Oh, you're 23! Here, have a discount!" or anything. For someone in social housing, £15 a week for gas, £15 for electricity, £5 for water, £3 for TV license, £2 for phone. You now have £16.25 per week for food, clothing and travel costs. Enjoy. You could always cut back on your TV license and have absolutely nothing to do all day, or stop using your phone so now you're socially isolated and can't ring up potential employers. That or you can go without heating or electricity, that's always a lark. And yeah you can just forget about any kind of leisure activities or buying anyone any Christmas/birthday presents! Usually they're forced to turn to doorstep or payday lending and get even more of an arsesmurfing.

The imbalance is something that pisses me right off.

Raistlin
09-22-2012, 03:18 PM
I have a friend who recently got made redundant at our work...

Is that your stiff-upper-lip, British way of saying "fired"?

Loony BoB
09-22-2012, 05:46 PM
If I were to say "I got fired", I would be suggesting that I did something wrong that got me fired. If I were to say "I got made redundant", "I got let go" or the slightly more emotional "I got fucked over" then it would suggest I did nothing wrong, but the business cut me out because they're wankers who don't want to pay me anymore. :p