Playstation 4 Inbound!

[nirojan]

OFFICIAL PS4 ANNOUNCEMENT VIDEO:
http://youtu.be/RiNGZMx2vhY

[Loony BoB]

Can't read the Kotaku article as it's blocked at work, but from what I've read at Gamasutra it's not written in stone that this will be the PS4 announcement (although it is most likely).

I'm wary of the early announcement, personally. But then, I'm wary of any kind of news because console launches are generally horrible things, not wonderful ones. At least in my experience, anyway. :p I suppose it's good for me because it means I get to wait until a little later when the console has more games before I start shelling out my cash.

[NeoCracker]

Yeah, Kotaku.

Need I say more? :p

[Mirage]

Well, you could take a look at the video Sony released (linked to from the Kotaku thing) and make your own guess.

[Madame Adequate]

You know the crazy headlines in The Simpsons where Marge says "That's not Bigfoot, it's my husband Homer!" and the paper reports "I MARRIED BIGFOOT!"?

Yeah, that's what Kotaku is like.

[Bolivar]

I'm really excited, these reveal events and console launches are always fun, but it's going to be some time before I jump in on this one. My PC will probably run most games coming out on this thing for a while and a lot of the games I'm currently into are things I only would or only can play on the comp.

[Mirage]

My issue isn't that my PC can't run new games, but that many of the games I want aren't released for PC.

[Ouch!]

You guys should be ashamed. Read the damned article. It cites the smurfing Wall Street Journal. (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323701904578276672168365276.html) Kotaku may be a bit of a rumor mill (and yes, the article they linked to was moved around), but more often they're rarely any worse than the rest of the video game news media, which has a terrible habit of abusing news without proper citation and letting rumors spiral out of control.

[Bolivar]

You guys should be ashamed. Read the damned article. It cites the smurfing Wall Street Journal. (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323701904578276672168365276.html) Kotaku may be a bit of a rumor mill (and yes, the article they linked to was moved around), but more often they're rarely any worse than the rest of the video game news media, which has a terrible habit of abusing news without proper citation and letting rumors spiral out of control.

Hideki Kamiya shits all over Kotaku - NeoGAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=507443)

[Loony BoB]

Say what you like about Kotaku, at least they keep up their payments for their domain!

[Rostum]

Even though there's no way in hell I'll be buying a new console any time in the near or distant future (too much backlog with my PC, PS3 and DS), I'm still excited! Mainly to see where the next generation of tech is going to lead us.

[Psychotic]

I like how their "The Next PlayStation" image is clearly from the PSOne era.

[Bubba]

I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though

[Ouch!]

Hideki Kamiya trouts all over Kotaku - NeoGAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=507443)
Congratulations on missing the point. Not arguing that Kotaku isn't trout, just that they're not much worse than any other gaming "journalism" site. But you know what? Never mind. I'll let you all get back to your circle jerk.


I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though
Given that the PS4 is reportedly switching over to an AMD chipset, backwards compatibility with the PS3 is almost impossible without putting the guts of a PS3 inside it as well, and I doubt Sony would do that after how poorly that went with the early models of the PS2.

[Loony BoB]

Chill, Zach. :p No need to be nasty.

[Formalhaut]

Given that the PS4 is reportedly switching over to an AMD chipset, backwards compatibility with the PS3 is almost impossible without putting the guts of a PS3 inside it as well, and I doubt Sony would do that after how poorly that went with the early models of the PS2.

I'm not getting my hopes up either. They might have some PS3 games on their version of the PSN network, like how you can get classics on every other console.

[Ouch!]

Given that the PS4 is reportedly switching over to an AMD chipset, backwards compatibility with the PS3 is almost impossible without putting the guts of a PS3 inside it as well, and I doubt Sony would do that after how poorly that went with the early models of the PS2.

I'm not getting my hopes up either. They might have some PS3 games on their version of the PSN network, like how you can get classics on every other console.
That'll mean a pretty big HDD.

[Loony BoB]

You can already buy complete games from the PS Store, unless I have what you guys are suggesting confused.

[Bolivar]

Congratulations on missing the point. Not arguing that Kotaku isn't trout, just that they're not much worse than any other gaming "journalism" site. But you know what? Never mind. I'll let you all get back to your circle jerk.

Dude, the Hideki Kamiya stuff was pretty bad. I frequent the big game sites and none of them sink quite this low. Yes, their name comes from Otaku culture and they report on it quite a bit, but haven't you noticed this massive xenophobic anti-Japan campaign they've been conducting for... well, pretty much this whole generation? They make sweeping negative generalizations about an entire country and its people about once a week.

[nirojan]

Dev Kit specs (probably not what the final product has, but will be pretty close):

-System Memory: 8GB
-Video Memory: 2.2 GB
-CPU: 4x Dual-Core AMD64 "Bulldozer" (so, 8x cores)
-GPU: AMD R10xx
-Ports: 4x USB 3.0, 2x Ethernet
-Drive: Blu-Ray
-HDD: 160GB
-Audio Output: HDMI & Optical, 2.0, 5.1 & 7.1 channels

[Pete for President]

Given that the PS4 is reportedly switching over to an AMD chipset, backwards compatibility with the PS3 is almost impossible without putting the guts of a PS3 inside it as well, and I doubt Sony would do that after how poorly that went with the early models of the PS2.

I'm not getting my hopes up either. They might have some PS3 games on their version of the PSN network, like how you can get classics on every other console.

Even then they better not make us buy another copy of games we already own. Not too sure how that would work though.

[Bolivar]

I'm fairly happy with those specs. In the end, the specs don't matter as much as how well developers have been optimizing their games. The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.

I'm glad there's still an optical audio jack! I wasn't expecting them to cut it, but it's good to know this thing will also have a great audio experience. It's Sony.

[Loony BoB]

The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.
That's weird, because SE - known as fantastic people at pushing consoles to their limits - have often stated that the PC version of FFXIV has been limited/restricted by the PS3 cross-platform functionality.

[nirojan]

The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.
That's weird, because SE - known as fantastic people at pushing consoles to their limits - have often stated that the PC version of FFXIV has been limited/restricted by the PS3 cross-platform functionality.

To be fair, I'm pretty sure he's referring to Multi-platform games ala Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, etc. Which are optimized for the 360 and PS3. One could also argue that SE is not a fantastic developer (at least anymore) :P

[Mirage]

I don't believe for a second that the PS4 will have 8 GB of RAM. Calling bulltrout on this.


The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.

Oh really now. Examples, please. Also, define "better".

[Slothy]

I don't believe for a second that the PS4 will have 8 GB of RAM. Calling bulltrout on this.

I don't think it would necessarily be that far fetched. RAM is damn cheap to be honest. I would say 4GB is far more likely though.

[nirojan]

I don't believe for a second that the PS4 will have 8 GB of RAM. Calling bulltrout on this.



My computer has 16 GB of RAM. The Edge report (that came out today) for the next Xbox also says the system will have 8 GB of DDR3 RAM. That's pretty low-to-mid-end tbh.

EDIT: I actually have 12GB of RAM :P

[Slothy]

My computer has 16 GB of RAM.

Same here. I put 2 8GB DDR3 RAM sticks in my PC just four or five months ago for under $100. In fact, the RAM was probably one of the single cheapest things I put in my PC when I upgraded.

If I, as a consumer, can put 8GB of RAM in a PC for less than $50, I'd be kind of surprised if Sony doesn't build that much into a new console. It's not like it's a major contributor to their manufacturing costs to be honest.

[Mirage]

Consoles typically have 1/4th of mid-end PCs of the time. 6-8GB is mid end, really. The fact that you guys have 16 doesn't really mean most people have nearly that much.

RAM was cheap when the PS3 and 360 were released too, but they still ended up with a measly 512MB split between system and video RAM. At the time, 2-ish GB was around mid-end.

I expect the next gen to have 2-3 GB split between system and video RAM. We might see 4 GB, but that's pushing it.

[nirojan]

Consoles typically have 1/4th of mid-end PCs of the time. 6-8GB is mid end, really. The fact that you guys have 16 doesn't really mean most people have nearly that much.

RAM was cheap when the PS3 and 360 were released too, but they still ended up with a measly 512MB split between system and video RAM. At the time, 2-ish GB was around mid-end.

I expect the next gen to have 2-3 GB split between system and video RAM. We might see 4 GB, but that's pushing it.

You Mirage, will be a very surprised man when the PS4 and 720 roll around :D

EDIT: I should explain. All the reports and rumors (and I stress RUMORS) indicate that both next-gen systems will have 8 GB of RAM and the PS4 will have about 2 GB of VRAM (Xbox intel didn't report on this yet).

The reason why I tend to believe this is because the biggest developer constraint near the end of this gen was the RAM. More than the processing power, more than online capabilities, developers were tied down to either 2x256 MB or 512 MB. The consoles are not going to be just for 2013, they have to look to the next 5-8 years of reasonable use. Within 5-10 years we'll probably see 4K take off and we don't even know what else will probably arise (think how quickly 3D blew up after 2009 release of "Avatar").

I know "PC RAM" is not the equivalent of console RAM, but it's much cheaper than it sounds to put 8GB on the new consoles, because they're not using PC RAM. They'll be designing their own unique RAM internally (design & manufacturing), which will cut cost because they dont have to peddle conventional companies like Kensington to make it for them.

[Mirage]

You, nirojan, might easily be just as surprised as you think I will be.

Please don't forget that all you have is 100% speculation. Unless you actually have some sources, that is. In that case, why didn't you link to them in your first post regarding the specifications?

[nirojan]

You, nirojan, might easily be just as surprised as you think I will be.

Please don't forget that all you have is 100% speculation. Unless you actually have some sources, that is. In that case, why didn't you link to them in your first post regarding the specifications?

The next Xbox: Always online, no second-hand games, 50GB Blu-ray discs and new Kinect | News | Edge Online (http://www.edge-online.com/news/the-next-xbox-always-online-no-second-hand-games-50gb-blu-ray-discs-and-new-kinect/)

The PlayStation 4 Has A New Controller, Fancy User Accounts And Impressive Specs (So Far) (http://kotaku.com/5977849/the-playstation-4-has-a-new-controller-fancy-user-accounts-and-impressive-specs-so-far)

Just a heads up I edited the post before this one with my 2cents on the RAM issue :)

[Slothy]

Consoles typically have 1/4th of mid-end PCs of the time. 6-8GB is mid end, really. The fact that you guys have 16 doesn't really mean most people have nearly that much.

Given that developers have been complaining for literally years that the PS3 didn't have enough RAM (and to some extent that the 360 didn't either), I really don't know that this relationship will continue to hold, assuming it is already accurate since I have no real data to support it and my memory of how much RAM your typical computer had doesn't really go back as far as 2000 when I didn't really care.

But 2-3 GB seems unlikely to me if only because the Wii U is already running with 2GB (admittedly reserving 1GB for the OS) and while I don't expect Sony and Microsoft to make as huge a technical leap from the PS3 and 360 as they did from the PS2 and Xbox, I doubt they'll be releasing something that competes with the Wii U in terms of power. Assuming they make a decent leap in power from their last consoles, I fully expect 4GB to be the minimum they'd add to a console with how little it would actually cost them and how much RAM has become a big problem at the end of these extended life cycles.

[nirojan]

^ lol I said that first :(

[Bolivar]

The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.
That's weird, because SE - known as fantastic people at pushing consoles to their limits - have often stated that the PC version of FFXIV has been limited/restricted by the PS3 cross-platform functionality.

I think you're stretching what is really only hyperbole. When a developer is making a game, yes, there will be some things the PS3 simply can't do, but once both versions are made, 99% of all developers spend 1000x the resources optimizing the console versions than they do optimizing PC.

Go on Steam and browse all the AAA multiplatform titles - notice how they all require 2 to 4 gigabytes of RAM? Imagine how poorly the game runs on those bare minimum systems. Then look at how smoothly the games play on a PS3 or a 360 which are running off of only 256mb of RAM.


Oh really now. Examples, please. Also, define "better".

Nexuiz, Splinter Cell: Conviction, the Call of Duty games, and maybe even Crysis 2. By better, I mean running at smoother framerates with comparable graphical fidelity. My laptop is just about where those PS4 specs are at, and all of those games run worse for me than they do on console. Again, it's all about optimization, how much effort developers put in to getting every last drop of performance out of the system. Some do a better job than others. Far Cry 2 is better and FEAR 2 absolutely blows away the console version.

edit: and Vivi and nirojan have the right in this, I simply cannot see these machines having less than 4GB minimum memory, not split with GPU. You can get a computer with that much memory for $200 or less these days if you look hard enough.

[Mirage]

1 GB for just the OS on the WiiU sounds like way too much for a console that only has 2 to begin with. That means it in practice only has like twice of the PS360 for games to actually run on. Being a bit lenient and perhaps saying that the next gen might have 4 GB, that's already 4 times as much as the effective amount of RAM on the WiiU. Sounds like a pretty huge leap to me, especially if the next gen is coming just a year or so after the WiiU.

As for Bolivar, I don't even know where to begin, but I'll sort something out, don't worry.

First of, memory requirements are pointless to use as an example. On a PC, you're in a highly multitasking system, where you have a huge OS and countless of background applications running. I don't close firefox when I start a game, and that thing easily uses 600 GB alone. The windows services that are always running even here on my laptop with just 2 GB RAM use 350MB alone. Of course a PC isn't going to be able to run a game if it has only 512 MB, when the OS and background user applications already use 1 GB.

Secondly, console games use less VRAM because console games use pretty low-res textures. Console games also don't run at a very high resolution. I have no idea which resolution you play with on your laptop, but even if you play at as low as 1280x720, that is likely to be a higher resolution that many of your PS3 games run at. A lot of PS3 games are rendered at a lower res than 1280x720, and then just stretched to 1280x720.

Splinter cell conviction, for example, runs at 1024x576. Black ops runs at a laughable 960x560 on the PS3, and slightly higher on 360, although still far from "HD" even there. Are these the resolutions you play your games at on your laptop?

Thirdly, are you measuring framerates on both your laptop and on your consoles when you say they run better, or are you just "eyeing" it? Just for information, that is extremely inaccurate.

-edit-
Just some math. Even if those resolution changes seem pretty small, they actually aren't. The PS3 res of Blops is actually just 55% of what it is if you run it at 1280x720 on a PC. Then who knows, maybe your laptop actually is 1280x800, and you run it at that res instead? In that case, the difference is even greater, and the PS3 res ends up at 50% of what your laptop would be running it at.

[Bolivar]

You can't look at it in terms of "twice the amount" or "four times the amount." Technically the Wii U have six times the amount of RAM as the PS3, but it's probably going to be years before we see anything that scratches the surface of the Uncharted and Killzone franchises.

[Cloudane]

I heard the announcement is... They're pulling out of the console gaming market :p

[Mirage]

You can't look at it in terms of "twice the amount" or "four times the amount." Technically the Wii U have six times the amount of RAM as the PS3, but it's probably going to be years before we see anything that scratches the surface of the Uncharted and Killzone franchises.

When you're talking about the amount of RAM, yes, you can look at it in terms of "twice the amount". If you're talking about the total graphical performance, then you also need to take into account the GPU and memory bandwidth. However, I wasn't talking about the GPU, I was talking about the amount of RAM. if we don't see a game like Killzone 3 on the WiiU, that has absolutely nothing to do with the RAM in the WiiU. You could have 50 million GB RAM without getting graphics that are even 1% better than the current gen console graphics.

[Bolivar]

I was only saying that it's excessive to paint a 4GB PS/Xbox as too big of a leap over the Wii U just because it's 4x the ram. I'd have to say developers would be pretty vocal if these things shipped with less than 4GB.

Also, just talking about resolutions doesn't sum up the whole debate. I'm running Black Ops II at 1440xsomething on my PC because it was about the highest I could go keeping the framerate at 60fps. The game doesn't look as detailed or vibrant as it does on console, and it does dip just below that perfect 60fps quite a bit.

The only reason I brought all this up is to drive home that at the end of the day, specs don't matter as much as how much effort gets put into optimization. If you disagree with that, then I honestly don't know what to say.

[Mirage]

I was only saying that it's excessive to paint a 4GB PS/Xbox as too big of a leap over the Wii U just because it's 4x the ram. I'd have to say developers would be pretty vocal if these things shipped with less than 4GB.

Also, just talking about resolutions doesn't sum up the whole debate. I'm running Black Ops II at 1440xsomething on my PC because it was about the highest I could go keeping the framerate at 60fps. The game doesn't look as detailed or vibrant as it does on console, and it does dip just below that perfect 60fps quite a bit.

The only reason I brought all this up is to drive home that at the end of the day, specs don't matter as much as how much effort gets put into optimization. If you disagree with that, then I honestly don't know what to say.

You mention that it dips below 60 fps quite a bit, but at the same time, black ops' PS3 average framerate is closer to 40 than it is to 60. So there you have it, your laptop pushes out a higher framerate, while you also have something around 3 times as high a resolution. If I'm going to make a guess, I bet you run the game with higher res textures on your laptop as well.

In addition, your laptop doesn't just run your game. At the same time, it runs a gigantic, enormous OS, with a lot of applications in the background, while still keeping your framerate high. At the same time, XMB slows down tremendously when displaying it during a game, even if the game you play is really, really, really lightweight. It happens to me even when I play Disgaea 3, in the headquarters with almost nothing going on. I just don't think you're giving your laptop as much credit as it deserves :p.

As far as color vibrance goes, that's most likely to be due to you playing it on a laptop monitor, which are notorious for having poor contrast ratio and brightness levels, while in the TV world, the LCD panels are generally a lot better. Maybe you even have a plasma TV, which offers even better picture quality. However, the PS3 is probably not the one to thank for this, it's most likely the TV.

The impression of there being less details could be a by-product of your monitor not showing contrasts as well as your TV does, so those might one and the same issue.

In either case, the resolution doesn't tell the entire story, of course. However, it does tell an important part of the story, seeing as the resolution has a very direct impact on how much juice you need to display a frame of a certain level of detail.

[Formalhaut]

All of these technical terms make my head hurt. :twak:

[Mirage]

Soak it all up. It's good for you!

In either case, I have a PS3 myself and I am pretty satisfied with it. I'm just not going to pretend like it is anywhere near my PC in terms of gaming performance.

I'll probably get the PS4 too, if it looks all right. All I really want is a reasonably priced console. It doesn't have to be super awesome hardware wise. I would probably be satisfied if the PS4 just looked twice as good as the PS3, while displaying every single game in 1080p with around 4x AA and at a stable 60fps. I don't really need more "juice" than for it to be able to do that.

Of course, that's not really a hardware issue, but a developer issue. No matter how much power a machine has, some people just think it is so important for it to have that extra level of flashiness, instead of keeping a stable and high framerate.

[nirojan]

$400 dollar price point?
Japanese Newspaper Claims PlayStation 4 Will Cost About $400 - IGN (http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/02/07/japanese-newspaper-claims-playstation-4-will-cost-about-400)

[Ouch!]

What's this? Games designed to run on the PS3, which has been notoriously difficult to develop for due to its specific hardware configuration, runs more smoothly on that system than it does on an open-ended upgradable platform with superior (but variable) hardware? Color me shocked.

[Loony BoB]

To be fair, I'm pretty sure he's referring to Multi-platform games ala Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, etc. Which are optimized for the 360 and PS3. One could also argue that SE is not a fantastic developer (at least anymore) :P
I would say that is poor development for the PC ports of these games rather than PCs with 8GB RAM and eight cores not being able to run something a PS3/360 can run. Also, you can say what you like about SE's games not having fantastic minigames or stories, but when it comes to game engines, graphics, pushing the limits of hardware etc. they are without doubt fantastic developers that lead the way for the rest of the group. If there is one thing people have always said about SE's recent games it's that these kind of things are done brilliantly.

[Bolivar]

I would say that is poor development for the PC ports of these games rather than PCs with 8GB RAM and eight cores not being able to run something a PS3/360 can run.

That is exactly the point, that specs mean less than optimization, and I'm not sure how what I said could've been construed in any other light.

[Loony BoB]

No, what you said is...

The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.
Which depending on your intended meaning is either so misleading it's not worth saying, or it's just plain wrong. :p What you said suggests that the PS3 runs games better than a PC with 8GB RAM and eight cores, but what it appears you're now trying to say is

If a game is poorly ported to the PC then it's possible that the PS3 will run that specific game better regardless of the specifications of the PC.

It's like me saying...

I can run faster than Usain Bolt
when what I really mean is

If someone else breaks Usain Bolt's leg then it's possible that I could run faster than Usain Bolt while his leg is broken.
:p

[Slothy]

If there is one thing people have always said about SE's recent games it's that these kind of things are done brilliantly.

I will continue to argue, to my death bed if need be, that not only has SE been surpassed in graphical and art direction terms by quite a few AAA developers out there, but their recent games haven't been very impressive visually at all. Not hideous mind you (unless we're only talking about art style, in which case yes, stuff like FFXIII is pretty hideous), but certainly not anywhere near the high bar some developers have been setting. We'll see what happens when their new engine hits I guess, but right now, they're really just not tech leaders at all anymore.

[Bolivar]

While I've always disagreed with Vivi about whether FFXIII is a technically impressive game, I do have to co-sign that Square is not the defacto tech leader anymore. When I think of brilliance solely on the technical level, I think of Guerilla Games, DICE, CD Projekt RED, and Crytek to an extent. SE is more around that second tier of Ubisoft Montreal, Bethesda, and Rockstar.


No, what you said is...

The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.
Which depending on your intended meaning is either so misleading it's not worth saying, or it's just plain wrong. :p What you said suggests that the PS3 runs games better than a PC with 8GB RAM and eight cores, but what it appears you're now trying to say is

If a game is poorly ported to the PC then it's possible that the PS3 will run that specific game better regardless of the specifications of the PC.

It's like me saying...

I can run faster than Usain Bolt
when what I really mean is

If someone else breaks Usain Bolt's leg then it's possible that I could run faster than Usain Bolt while his leg is broken.
:p


I'm fairly happy with those specs. In the end, the specs don't matter as much as how well developers have been optimizing their games. The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.


Why is this... I don't even... I'm not sure how anymore.... why?

[Slothy]

While I've always disagreed with Vivi about whether FFXIII is a technically impressive game, I do have to co-sign that Square is not the defacto tech leader anymore. When I think of brilliance solely on the technical level, I think of Guerilla Games, DICE, CD Projekt RED, and Crytek to an extent. SE is more around that second tier of Ubisoft Montreal, Bethesda, and Rockstar.

Actually, I'd put all three of those companies ahead of SE. Given the seamless open worlds they all create, their games are all technically more impressive than FFXIII was. Ubisoft's also just have way better art direction which is part of why Assassin's Creed 2, while absolutely not on the same level as a company like Naughty Dog or CD Projekt Red in terms of just making things look impressive technically, the great art style means AC2 is still a damn fine looking game. Admittedly, Rockstar and Bethesda are probably more on Square's level in terms of art design these days, but their games still impress me more on a technical level (though in Bethesda's case it's only if I ignore the mountains of bugs their titles are riddled with).


Why is this... I don't even... I'm not sure how anymore.... why?

I'm not sure what's confusing here. Your original statement is at least a little inaccurate. Yes, optimizing a PS3 or 360 title means it can run a game as well or better than a shitty port to the PC with little to no optimization, but that doesn't mean that specs don't matter, and I'm not even convinced that's a good thing since developers are basically running up against the hard limits of what the consoles can do now.

[Bolivar]

Inaccuracy aside, it doesn't get much more confusing than denying I was talking in terms of optimization when it's there in black and white.

And I'm not saying the PC ports are crappy. Even Black Ops II comes with an impressive depth of tweaking options, some of which just came out, like nvidia's TXAA anti-aliasing. Rather, it's more about how insane it is that developers are pulling so much out of these 256mb machines. All I'm saying is even if those numbers are a little lower than I would have wanted, we should be fine for a long while given what developers have been able to pull out of this generation's machines.

[Ouch!]

As has been mentioned earlier in this thread, while it is impressive what developers have accomplished when you look at the specs for the consoles and compare it to high-end gaming rigs, that still lacks a degree of perspective. Consoles are dedicated hardware for a specific and singular purpose. Personal computers are machines built to multitask. If you stripped a lot of basic functionality running with Windows, it wouldn't be using that much RAM either.

[Loony BoB]

While I've always disagreed with Vivi about whether FFXIII is a technically impressive game, I do have to co-sign that Square is not the defacto tech leader anymore. When I think of brilliance solely on the technical level, I think of Guerilla Games, DICE, CD Projekt RED, and Crytek to an extent. SE is more around that second tier of Ubisoft Montreal, Bethesda, and Rockstar.
Perhaps I'm thinking a very different thing than you, because I'm not thinking of environments as much as I am thinking of what is arguably the hardest thing to get right in a game: Humans and their faces. I think SE are still far ahead of the likes of other games out there in this regard. Far Cry 3 was good, don't get me wrong, but when it comes to animated characters being able to go through a variety of different expressions smoothly, I think that SE is ahead of the pack. I will, however, note that they could still use a lot of work when it comes to making things look realistic in the sense of being right for the situation - by which I mean SE seem to not comprehend the idea of a character ever, ever getting dirty. xD But yeah, I've never seen humans done well in many games out there. Putting SE on the same level of Bethseda is quite frankly insulting, because I have never, ever seen a Bethseda game where the graphics blew me away. Even in ME3, the human faces look like they are no more than heads on dolls. Sure, they have expressions sometimes, but they don't look natural at all.

I still think that if there was a 'graphics race' going on and SE decided to emphasise environment visuals more than they do at the moment that they would be able to easily replicate and probably better anything that the likes of CryTek put out. In fact, while Far Cry 3 was beautiful, I'm not sure I would say the graphics themselves or the animations of the environment were a huge amount better than FFXIII. Different goals make up a lot of this. In a free roaming FPS, the time tends to be spent on the environment more than anything at all. In a RPG, they focus on the characters.

Why is this... I don't even... I'm not sure how anymore.... why?

I'm fairly happy with those specs. In the end, the specs don't matter as much as how well developers have been optimizing their games. The PS3 can run multiplatform games better than a PC which does have those PS4 specs.

I'm fairly happy with how fast I run. In the end, my speed doesn't matter as much as how well the other sprinters are on the day. I can run faster than Usain Bolt.
See what I did there? >=] All I'm getting at is that saying such a sweeping/false statement immediately after another vaguely relevant and true sentence doesn't make it any less sweeping/false as a statement. But I think we can all agree that if a multiplatform game was developed and optimised properly for both the PS3 and a PC with 8GB/8 cores then the PC will almost undoubtedly run the game better.

But yeah, what I do agree with is that if the PS4 is "limited" to 8GB RAM then developers will still find ways to use that RAM effectively and create great games with it, as evidenced by all previous and current consoles.

[Bolivar]

I guess we've really been saying the same thing, just at different extremes and at this point it doesn't really matter where it comes down.

I'm with you on a lot of these devs not being able to match SE when it comes to characters and animation. In a lot of Western RPGs, the characters look like they're standing still even when they're moving, and Crysis 2's character animations were like "really?" in a lot of places. In general, there's a lot of things I missed about Japanese game design this generation, especially in RPGs, and I'd hope to see them come back this time around. I'd love to get another FFXII or Dragon Quest VIII and show all these new gamers how an open world is really supposed to be done.

FYI Bioware is behind Mass Effect and Ubisoft Montreal is behind Far Cry 3.

[Mirage]

I'll agree with you that many western games leave much to be desired when it comes to animation quality and accuracy. That is however a problem with the developers, and if the developers don't know how to animate things properly, it doesn't matter if it's on the PS2 or the PS20.

If the developers that made poor animations in some PC games made a game for the PS4, they're not exactly going to magically become better at animations. Well, unless they acquired a lot of work experience in their previous title.

I think it's important to separate those two points, and not mix art direction/skill of developers with the performance of the machines.

[nirojan]

Here come the Durango (Xbox 720) specs:
40226

Many developers and analysts have predicted that the PS4 may be slightly more powerful than the 720, so the specs seem to confirm what we know about the PS4.


According to sketches from information shared by SuperDae, there's 8GB of DDR3 memory, along with a small amount of flash memory for system tasks. The Durango's optical disc drive is 50GB in size, while, as mentioned, there's a 500GB hard drive, with read speeds of up to 50 MB/sec.

If you've got a 3D TV set, the Durango is capable—if developers want to support it—of delivering stereo 3D content in 1080p.

Those reliant on wi-fi, and who were forced to pay for Microsoft's costly external adapter with the original Xbox 360, will be happy to know that the Durango ships with built-in wi-fi (though there's still an ethernet port for wired connections).

In terms of audio, the retail Durango will output via either HDMI or S/PDIF (optical) connections, and can support up to 7.1 channels.

[Mirage]

50 MB/s disk access? That's pretty terrible. Also, what's the source for that image? It seems strange that the CPU doesn't have direct access to RAM without going through the northbridge, seeing as all AMD CPUs have done that the last 10 years, and Intel is doing that since i7.

[Bolivar]

Hmmm, 50GB optical disc drive, doesn't say if it's blu ray or not. If it is, that and the s/pdif optical jack means there's some sony tech in this box. Regardless, it's a good thing they're shipping this one with wifi and optical audio.

[nirojan]

I believe it will have Bluray (read that on IGN).

The article itself is from someone who got their hands on a dev kit:The Next Xbox Has Mandatory Kinect, Game-Swapping and New Controllers, According To Leaked Info (http://kotaku.com/5982986/we-know-all-about-the-next-xbox-from-someone-who-says-theyve-got-one)
has some tidbits from the new Kinect as well.

[Mirage]

Hmmm, 50GB optical disc drive, doesn't say if it's blu ray or not. If it is, that and the s/pdif optical jack means there's some sony tech in this box. Regardless, it's a good thing they're shipping this one with wifi and optical audio.

Having or not having optical spdif isn't that much of an issue anymore, when you can send 7.1 audio digitally over HDMI anyway.

[nirojan]

NEW CONTROLLER:
40341
What the hell? Is this the new PlayStation controller? - Destructoid (http://www.destructoid.com/what-the-hell-is-this-the-new-playstation-controller--244985.phtml)

[Bolivar]

Hahaha I heard about them having a touchscreen, but damn, whatever it is, that thing is small!

What do you guys think the Blue Light is for? Extra bit of personalization???

Kinda sad about the sticks. That's always been the most arbitrary criticism - that concave is better than convex or whatever. PS Analog sticks have always been perfect for me.

[Loony BoB]

At first glance, there isn't much I like about that new controller. =| Still, at least my expectations are now very low. :p

EDIT: While very possible it's just an awkward positioning of the controller / wire connection, it looks like that controller is permanently wired, in which case I don't think it's the real controller.

[Mirage]

Ugh. Calm the fuck down everyone.

First, it's not even verified to be a real PS4 controller. Second, if it is, it is probably a prototype.

[CimminyCricket]

Don't tell us to calm down about something we found on the internet that has a small possibility of being true. What if that is the real controller?

[Loony BoB]

I know, right!?

[nirojan]

3 different sites confirmed it to be a PROTOTYPE from their sources.

Some things to note:
-it's not a "touch screen" in the middle but a "touchpad" similar to the back of the Vita
-They're finally giving us convex analog sticks
-The top glowing blue thing might be PS Move integration (SixAxis kinda sucks)
-The silver box is indeed a PS4 dev kit

[Mirage]

Three different sites, using the same unconfirmed source? :p

[nirojan]

Three different sites, using the same unconfirmed source? :p

I dunno. In the IGN article they reached out to their own source after they saw the article on destructoid and their source confirmed it.



The Countdown has begun!
Evolution of Playstation Pt.1 PSone
http://youtu.be/U7w5i_YCFmQ

[Bolivar]

Apparently it's going to stream PS3 games (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/15/wsj-new-playstation-to-stream-ps3-games/), possibly as a solution to a lack of backwards compatibility.

[nirojan]

The PS4 will not be able to play PS3 game. The PS4 will not be using the Cell processor (to save costs of course) so backwards compatibility will be a no go for next gen.

Emulation may be possible in the future, but Sony seems to have found a stop gap with Gaikai (the streaming service they bought for $380 million last year). I would imagine PS+ integration or some kind of detection system where you put you PS3 game in, it registers it with your account and lets you stream it (sky's the limit before the reveal right?).

What would be really neat is if we could get Gaikai on the Vita and PC's!

[krissy]

Apparently it's going to stream PS3 games (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/15/wsj-new-playstation-to-stream-ps3-games/), possibly as a solution to a lack of backwards compatibility.

i just want to note that there's a user in the comments section named Roto13

WHAT A SMALL WORLD

[Mirage]

Streaming games is useless for any game that has a moderate amount of action/platforming elements. I could probably play something like Disgaea or Persona like that, but that's it.

And before you ask, yes, I've tried it. I played the witcher 2 streamed over a 40/40 Mbps fiber optical connection. There was still noticable input lag.

[Bolivar]

Battlefield 3 came with input lag all on its own for PS3, and I put up with that (enjoyed the game a lot, really) for quite a while before I finally decided I'll stick to lag-free Killzone/Modern Warfare 3 instead. So I think I'll be prepared and ok with what streaming can do, even for FPS/action games.



i just want to note that there's a user in the comments section named Roto13

WHAT A SMALL WORLD

Haha, yes, I've noticed him on there before. He came back here for a bit, I wonder what happened?

[nirojan]

Continuing the Playstation Retrospective.
Here's the PS2 video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Hvcps5dFzfc#!

[Bolivar]

Yo that video's not playing; it's not even up at the ps blog!

[nirojan]

Sorry the Youtube linking on Eoff is acting iffy again. I posted the link instead.

And yes the Blog hasn't gotten this up yet, but IGN has had it since yesterday and Kotaku as well. This video is on the Official PS Youtube channel so the Blog will probably get a post up for it soon.

[Bolivar]

Haha, yeah, I found it elsewhere myself. They posted the PS3 one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XF2pu-4rXc

[Pete for President]

Haha, yeah, I found it elsewhere myself. They posted the PS3 one: Evolution of PlayStation: PlayStation 3 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XF2pu-4rXc)

I'm not here to bash or anything, but it's kind of funny how they use a lot of footage of games yet to be released while "looking back" on the PS3. And seeing consumerism madness like people spending the night in front of a store always gives me the shivers.

[Bolivar]

Yes, or even games that just recently came out like a week ago. There's always been a big lack of context when people discuss this console generation, or discussing it along with the rest of gaming history.

[Mirage]

What a terrible video.

[Bolivar]

Good to see you positive as always, mirage :)

[Mirage]

I like my PS3 and all, but that video was kind of just Sony masturbating in front of a camera.

[nirojan]

Yeah the PS3 video was pretty wierd. You'd think they'd concentrate more on games like MGS4, GOW3, UC2, etc., but I think they have contracts where they have to promote upcoming games with certain publishers in all their promotional content.

Anyways, here's the PSP & PSV video:
Evolution of PlayStation: Portable Gaming - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=X_W1JQ5ubWQ)

[Bolivar]

37 seconds on the PSP! It's almost as if they tried to downplay the thing instead of tell a story. It's an interesting one, for sure. The period when everyone started vehemently hating the thing, from 2009 on, was when I got one and all my favorite games for the system were released!

[Bolivar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKi7qlDdXxs

This one's all about the games! Well, Gran Turismo and a few quick shoutouts to the less conventional, innovative standouts that PlayStation has become known for over the last two generations.

Anyway, it all comes down tomorrow, anyone watching the live feed?

[nirojan]

November release?
Source: The PS4 Will Be Out This November, And You'll Be Able To Control It With Your Phone (http://kotaku.com/5985356/source-the-ps4-will-be-out-this-november-and-youll-be-able-to-control-it-with-your-phone)

[nirojan]

Just a heads up that the PS4 announcement is today at 6 PM Eastern (3 PM Pacific)
Pretty much all the major gaming sites have a video stream going up for the event, but here's the one from the PS Blog:

Today: Watch PlayStation Meeting 2013 Live at 6pm Eastern Time – PlayStation Blog (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/02/20/today-watch-playstation-meeting-2013-live-at-6pm-eastern-time/)


Plenty of AAA developers have shown up



Developers from Ubisoft Montreal, Sony Santa Monica Studios, Bungie and Quantic Dream are amassing in New York City in time for today's PlayStation 2013 Meeting, scheduled to begin at 6 p.m. EST.

It is unknown whether they will simply be in the audience or make a formal announcement; however, taking to Twitter, numerous designers including the developers behind God of War have hinted they will be attending today's Sony event.

"What does our future hold for tomorrow? We heard they may open Pandoras Box (again) live on stage, that would be AWESOME #playstation2013," wrote Sony Santa Monica.

Watch dogs lead designer Jonathan Morin revealed he is also in New York as of Feb. 19, stating: "I just cross Moen, Markov and Pacioretty in my hotel in NY :). Awesome!," while Quantic Dream CEO Guillaume de Fondaumiere also teased he is in town, tweeting: "New York, -6 Celcius and clear sky :-)..."

Dave Lang of Iron Galaxy Studios revealed he would be in the audience for tonight's show, writing: "If you are watching the Sony stream tomorrow: I'm the one in the crowd with the "When's Marvel" sign." In addition, Capabara Games president Nathan Vella will also be in attendance, writing: "Flight boarded... On my way to NYC. See tons of you there :)"

While rumors of a Battlefield 4 announcement have been circling, DICE's Gustav Halling remained mum, saying only: "I honestly have no clue what Sony is showing tonight, as much speculation as everyone else but I can make realistic guesses."

Polygon hears that Epic Games vice president Mark Rein will be in town, while we spotted Bungie composer Marty O'Donnell coming out of the event venue last night.

Polygon will be attending today's show. Stay tuned for full coverage and live blogging throughout, starting at 6 p.m. EST.

[Loony BoB]

11pm GMT. Dammit. I shouldn't be anticipating this as much as I am. I'm getting excited and impatient! I'd laugh if they just said something like say "We're giving Vita a price drop!" But yeah, c'mon. Give me all that PS4 info. Today, I am a tech junky. :(

[nirojan]

Hype thru the roof!!!

[Freya]

HERE WE GO!

There we go, they confirmed it's coming out. NOW DETAILS TIME!

[Psychotic]

Sony, announce Battlefront 3 and/or Bully 2 as an exclusive launch title and I will come crawling back. :shobon:

[krissy]

isn't bully 2 just gta3?

[Madame Adequate]

Ahahahahahhaha

AHAHAHAHHAHAHA

AHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHA

What the actual SMURF was that even supposed to be I don't even

[Loony BoB]

Loads of brand new stuff being shown off by all kinds of developers. Square-Enix come out!

...Agni's Philosophy again. God dammit, SE. :(

[nirojan]

@Loony Bob,
They promised a new FF for E3 :P

Killzone, Infamous, Diablo 3, Watch Dogs, Destiny, etc. Absolutely stunning.
I paid attention to all the technical stuff, but boy was I kicking when the games were shown.

[Madame Adequate]

No, there was nothing new there. There was cars, FPS games, sequels, "LOOK AT ALL THESE POLYGOMS" immediately followed by "FUCK POLOGONS" (nice coordinated message there Sony), and then "This game totally isn't about puzzles" followed by a game apparently entirely about puzzles. Also I guess the one singular Blizzard game that wouldn't have been a game-changer right here.

What they didn't have: The console itself, a release date, a price point, or any meaningful exclusives.

They must be laughing their asses off/breathing a huge sigh of relief in Redmond right now. I had sincerely hoped the PS3 was an aberration and Sony would get back on form here but wow, I don't think I've got any interest in the thing at all now.

Best moment was "Here's a dude to announce Final Fantasy shit!" and he just said "Yeah watch E3 guys!" I was admittedly hugely amused by that.

RIP in peace Sony.

[nirojan]

No, there was nothing new there. There was cars, FPS games, sequels, "LOOK AT ALL THESE POLYGOMS" immediately followed by "smurf POLOGONS" (nice coordinated message there Sony), and then "This game totally isn't about puzzles" followed by a game apparently entirely about puzzles. Also I guess the one singular Blizzard game that wouldn't have been a game-changer right here.

What they didn't have: The console itself, a release date, a price point, or any meaningful exclusives.

They must be laughing their asses off/breathing a huge sigh of relief in Redmond right now. I had sincerely hoped the PS3 was an aberration and Sony would get back on form here but wow, I don't think I've got any interest in the thing at all now.

Best moment was "Here's a dude to announce Final Fantasy trout!" and he just said "Yeah watch E3 guys!" I was admittedly hugely amused by that.

RIP in peace Sony.

Nintendo did not release a price point or release date for the Wii U at E3 2011. Even at E3 2012, they didnt have a firm release date. When the 360 was announced Price and Release date was also absent from their first debut.

You're taking this high stance of FPS's and polygons. Well you'll be in for a surprise at the 720 reveal. Killzone and Infamous are meaningful exclusives. Microsoft doesn't have the bredth of first party studios that Sony has, so the 720 reveal will probably have less exclusives and more MULTIPLATFORM 3rd PARTY GAMES. You'll probably see the other heavy hitters like Uncharted 4, Gran Turismo, etc. at E3!

And you should probably know what RIP stands for by now.

[Bolivar]

Killzone and Watch Dogs gameplay looked bananas. Really glad to hear about the social features, they're like everything I wish Steam's community features were. The only thing is, will all that really catch on? I got 45 Steam friends, some of which are a few of you here, and I'm the only one posting screenshots and such. Still, it was cool to see the early games like Killzone and DriveClub feature how those social aspects will be used in-game.

Obviously the hypercritical folks will be all over that long stretch of the conference which were no games being shown, David Cage talking, the strange media molecule montage, and an old Square Enix trailer. I'm not really sure why they did that.

As far as surprises, I'm not sure which was more unexpected: Blizzard announcing a partnership with Sony, Bungie creating exclusive content for the system, or Jonathan Blow finally coming out of hiding with The Witness as an exclusive. I never would've expected any of those three things to happen, especially since it seemed like Blizzard was leaning towards Xbox. Still, Diablo III being all they announced is disappointing. Been there, beat it almost a year ago, it's fun, but I only pick it up every now and then. Project Titan would have been more appropriate for the occasion.

Still not sure if this will be able to pull me off of Steam at launch, but it's a good first step towards bringing me back to console gaming. It certainly was a good appetizer for E3.

[Pike]

And you should probably know what RIP stands for by now.

that's the joke

[Madame Adequate]

No, there was nothing new there. There was cars, FPS games, sequels, "LOOK AT ALL THESE POLYGOMS" immediately followed by "smurf POLOGONS" (nice coordinated message there Sony), and then "This game totally isn't about puzzles" followed by a game apparently entirely about puzzles. Also I guess the one singular Blizzard game that wouldn't have been a game-changer right here.

What they didn't have: The console itself, a release date, a price point, or any meaningful exclusives.

They must be laughing their asses off/breathing a huge sigh of relief in Redmond right now. I had sincerely hoped the PS3 was an aberration and Sony would get back on form here but wow, I don't think I've got any interest in the thing at all now.

Best moment was "Here's a dude to announce Final Fantasy trout!" and he just said "Yeah watch E3 guys!" I was admittedly hugely amused by that.

RIP in peace Sony.

Nintendo did not release a price point or release date for the Wii U at E3 2011. Even at E3 2012, they didnt have a firm release date. When the 360 was announced Price and Release date was also absent from their first debut.

You're taking this high stance of FPS's and polygons. Well you'll be in for a surprise at the 720 reveal. Killzone and Infamous are meaningful exclusives. Microsoft doesn't have the bredth of first party studios that Sony has, so the 720 reveal will probably have less exclusives and more MULTIPLATFORM 3rd PARTY GAMES. You'll probably see the other heavy hitters like Uncharted 4, Gran Turismo, etc. at E3!

And you should probably know what RIP stands for by now.

Yeah and funny enough I thought Nintendo's WiiU stuff was all massively underwhelming and misjudged as well. I've not seen the 720 conference yet because it obviously hasn't happened but it's probably going to be marketing crap with few meaningful games as well. It's almost as if console gaming is a bit shit nowadays!

[nirojan]

And you should probably know what RIP stands for by now.

that's the joke

Yeah that flew over me and I feel a tad bit looserish

[Slothy]

Really glad to hear about the social features, they're like everything I wish Steam's community features were. The only thing is, will all that really catch on? I got 45 Steam friends, some of which are a few of you here, and I'm the only one posting screenshots and such. Still, it was cool to see the early games like Killzone and DriveClub feature how those social aspects will be used in-game.

I've yet to see the actual presentation, and really my only exposure to announcements so far has been the small updates on Gamasutra so far (I'd rather wait for it to be over and catch the highlights later personally so I can more easily sift through it to find what jumps out at me as actually being interesting), so I have to hold my tongue a bit about what social features were announced. I know there was some talk about things like being able to watch what friends are playing via live stream and "take over the controller and help them," but I'm really not up on what they announced.

But as far as social features in general in consoles and games, there's just no value in that for me. I could care less about taking screen shots of my games, let alone looking at the screen shots my friends take, and I really don't care about being able to watch a live stream of a buddy getting their ass kicked in a game. To me, it's all just silly bullshit that distracts from what I actually want to do with a console: play games. Now I'm not saying others don't enjoy it since obviously there are those out there that like those features, but they just are not for me. I don't see them adding any value to my gaming experience, but I also just dislike social media in general.

[Bolivar]

MILF, be careful. Nothing's making us more satisfied with how the press conference went than the hate-infused vapors fuming from your nostrils. Use preview post in the future.

Another really bizarre moment was the 4 Bungie developers brought out on the stage, three of which who stood there and waived. I'm feeling some "How many Bungie developers does it take..." jokes coming along.


But as far as social features in general in consoles and games, there's just no value in that for me.

That's what I was thinking. For me it's cool cause I hate having to time my screenshots with the game as it's playing, with this you can rewind the last few seconds of gameplay and grab it. But you won't look at it anyway :p

I think watching your friends play will be cool for when we're waiting to get matched into Warzone rounds of Killzone and we watch in utter horror at what new completely esoteric and niche JRPG NeoCracker is playing...

[Del Murder]

Nothing groundbreaking, but I don't decide where to put my money based on the initial announcement. In the end it will come down to its games and the amount of time and interest I have for them. I hope the FF announcement at E3 is something good.

The WiiU may not have the best specs but in the end I will probably get one to play Xenoblade 2 and the usual cavalcade of Mario/Zelda/DK games.

[Mirage]

Well, it'll have 8 GB of RAM. Color me impressed. I seriously didn't think it would have more than 6.

[Madame Adequate]

MILF, be careful. Nothing's making us more satisfied with how the press conference went than the hate-infused vapors fuming from your nostrils. Use preview post in the future.

I'm deeply unsure of what you're trying to say here. You're happy with how the conference went; great, you have terrible standards. I'm really happy for you, it must be awesome to live in a world where this seems amazing! What's that got to do with me previewing post?

[nirojan]

Well, it'll have 8 GB of RAM. Color me impressed. I seriously didn't think it would have more than 6.

Remember this buddy boy?

I don't believe for a second that the PS4 will have 8 GB of RAM. Calling bulltrout on this.




I expect the next gen to have 2-3 GB split between system and video RAM. We might see 4 GB, but that's pushing it.

BOOOOOOOOM!!!!! Been waiting to bring this up. That'll teach you to defy me when I have rumors and speculation on my side :kakapo:

EDIT; Here's the Official Specs
http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18fa3t7dj7zl2png/original.png

[Mirage]

Yeah, admitting to my mistakes is totally not the adult thing to do.

But all right, I'll keep in mind that you're a complete smurfing dick for future reference.

EDIT: No name calling. -Murder

[nirojan]

Yeah, admitting to my mistakes is totally not the adult thing to do.

But all right, I'll keep in mind that you're a complete smurfing dick for future reference.

See ya on the 720 circuit.

[Mirage]

Why? The bar has been set now. It's much easier to predict roughly where the 720 will be in terms of performance.

[Bolivar]

I'm deeply unsure of what you're trying to say here. You're happy with how the conference went; great, you have terrible standards. I'm really happy for you, it must be awesome to live in a world where this seems amazing! What's that got to do with me previewing post?

Because I'm starting to worry that you're truly oblivious to just how emotional you're getting over a video game console press conference. Oh well.

As far as it being amazing, I thought it was just ok. It had its ups and downs, but they showed a couple cool things that interested me. Not really sure why you're so upset about it. It seems like you've really convinced yourself there wasn't anything good about it.

In Mirage's defense, it seems like it's 8GB shared memory, so it won't quite be the 8GB ram, 2GB graphics card we all saw earlier.

[nirojan]

I feel like the humorous nature of my comments isn't getting thru :confused:

[Slothy]

Because I'm starting to worry that you're truly oblivious to just how emotional you're getting over a video game console press conference. Oh well.

Huh? MILF wasn't getting emotional. Slightly amused at what he perceived to be a bad conference sure, but emotional? I'm not seeing it.

[Mirage]

I feel like the humorous nature of my comments isn't getting thru :confused:
You probably weren't using enough smileys and exdees.

[Bolivar]

Thanks, Vivi, I guess I needed a little clarification there! :thumbsup:

Wow. 8GB of GDDR5 seems expensive.

[Madame Adequate]

I'm deeply unsure of what you're trying to say here. You're happy with how the conference went; great, you have terrible standards. I'm really happy for you, it must be awesome to live in a world where this seems amazing! What's that got to do with me previewing post?

Because I'm starting to worry that you're truly oblivious to just how emotional you're getting over a video game console press conference. Oh well.

Yeah I'm just a ball of neurotic tears over here! However can I go on, knowing that Sony has failed me yet again? How can I carry on when there is no light (except bloom) at the end of the brown tunnel? I just... I'm sorry everyone, I think I need some time. :whimper:

[Del Murder]

Take a cold shower.

[Bolivar]

Watch The Witness trailer again.

[Madame Adequate]

I've played better puzzle games twenty years ago thanks :)

[NorthernChaosGod]

I like MILF's posts.

[Laddy]

MILF is reminding me why I adore him so. :)

[Bolivar]

This is why I've called it emotional. Most reactions range from "meh" to "nice" yet here's MILF saying "RIP Sony" and "Redmond is laughing." I honestly cant believe in 2013 people are still hung up on the Microsoft vs. Sony thing, especially when a lot of us have just gone back to Steam. It reminds me of the last thread about how well the PS3 has done but MILF thought it important to remind us all about marketing strategies and consumer demographics. These are machines that play videogames. Can anyone please explain to me why this other stuff matters?

Ive seen a lot of discussions about what we want to see next generation. I would love if gamers stopped the corporate marketing spin and put the fanboyism to rest. I don't ever remember talking about if the ps2 was better than the gamecube. And we never evaluated Sega and Nintendo based on their business strategies and press conferences. We talked about their features and their games.

Damn I miss those days.

[black orb]

>>> Omg! I cant wait, I`ll freeze myself like Cartman..:roll2 :luca:

[Loony BoB]

I'm thinking MILF is simply trolling for trouts and giggles. I mean, he's saying he's played better puzzle games than Witness when nobody has any smurfing clue how good Witness is going to be based on that trailer. I want to explore that world, I know that much. The game gives me a easier (note: not necessarily a bad thing) Myst game.

I was pretty impressed by almost everything on show (with a couple of exceptions, but not every game will be for everyone), and the fact that they didn't show us the console is disappointing but seriously, who cares? The colour and shape of a console is not high on my agenda when choosing a console. I'm interested in seeing how it all shapes up over the coming months.

EDIT: My thoughts...

Regarding the PS4 itself
- Easily the integration with Vita. This is notable for me because come price drop I was thinking of grabbing one of these anyway, but if it means I don't have to worry about Danielle wanting to play a game at the same time as me, all the better (while we have two TVs, both the 360 and the PS3 are in the lounge).
- Integration with tablets (iPad) and smartphones (iPhone/Android), too? At least, that's the impression I'm getting. If it's true that you can use any random remote device to improve your gaming experience, that's... interesting. The potential is high, but how far they reach on this potential is obviously yet to be seen so I'll have to wait and see.
- Witness seems pretty cool, or at least the world does. I'll have to wait and see how cheap/easy the puzzles are, but I'd love to explore that world at the very least.
- I really like the idea of being able to watch someone else's game and comment on it as they go. I don't think I like the idea of allowing someone else to 'control' your game for you, though. Personally, I would not let people do this for me, so the only real annoyance it will bring is some backseat driver saying "GAH LET ME DO IT FOR YOU" which would kind of piss me off. Let me enjoy my own game! Hopefully this doesn't happen.
- I do like the idea of Developers hopping into games and helping people out, although I don't see it happening often enough to expect it.
- I do like how much emphasis they put on making the console easy for developers to work with, because I do think that developers, through their games, will in the long run "own" how things will play out between the 720 and the PS4.
- Good to see how many devs are apparently working with them.
- This whole "the PS4 will download the game before you buy it" is weird. But okay. And I like that every game will be try-before-you-buy, apparently.
- I must be one of the very few people who actually liked the PS3's user interface, because I'm kind of iffy on the new one. Oh well. I don't want pretty pictures, I just want a clean UI where I know where to go for whatever I want to do, and to display decent amounts of information on my screen, not massive ugly blocks like I have on my 360 or groups of updating blocks like on Facebook. Oh well, guess I'll just have to put up with it.
- Thankyou for letting me open up things like web browsers while playing a game. I hated that there were a lot of things I had to quit the game to do.
- On that 'quit the game' note, turning off my PS3 was one of those things I hated to do. If my PSP can keep my game state when it's off, why can't the PS3!? I'm glad the PS4 does this.
- I don't know if I'll ever use that Share button, but okay.
- A lot of sites are complaining that they didn't say enough about the entertainment system use of the PS4, or talk about Facebook-styled games. I am so glad for this. I want a smurfing games console. If it happens to do other things, so be it, but I want it to be about the games. That's the reason I buy it, after all.
- What the smurf is that touchpad for? The only thing I can think of that uses a touchpad that tiny is a laptop. Is the touchpad going to be for a mouse like mechanism? That would make some sense, I guess. It really does make me wonder, though.
- Why is there a speaker in the controller?
- No information regarding 4K?

Regarding the developer bits
- Watchdogs - the new GTA? It's looking more and more like it. I'll be very interested to see how GTA can compare to this, because to me the game looks like a notably improved and perhaps mildly futuristic version of GTA. And it looks far more interesting to me than GTA V.
- Blizzard. Ooh, this could be really intersting. Oh, it's just Diablo III. Never mind, then. Still, I can't deny that I'm glad Blizzard are touching on console gaming again, because it could lead to some pretty cool things in the long run.
- Square-Enix. Ooh, this could be really interesting. Oh, it's just Agni's Philosophy. Never mind, then. Wait a second, what did that guy at the end say? :stare:
- Drive Club seems cool, although I don't think I'd buy it - but then, I never buy racing games. If I were to buy a racing game, I would consider that one. I certainly wouldn't try to avoid it when picking a bundle, although that's a long way down the line and for all I know the game could be given crap reviews by then.
- Knack looks so-so. Another Ratchet & Clank style game, I guess? Hum.
- Bungie and Sony working together is pretty cool. I won't go bragging about them extending outside of Microsoft, though, because obviously thatgamecompany are extending outside of Sony, too. Anyway, Destiny looks okay but I'll just have to wait and see.
- Infamous: Second Son is not interesting to me, really. I loved inFamous, I even Platinum'ed it, but I just couldn't get myself rushing to inFamous 2, so...
- Deep Down looks very interesting. Good to see one Japanese game shown off.
- Oh, yeah, I forgot about Killzone, which is easy to do because I've never played a Killzone game. It looks alright. I think I'd be more interested in Destiny out of the two FPS games shown, though.
- I don't care about the PlayStation Move. I mean, I really liked those sculptures that were being made, but as soon as they turned it into that band thing, I lost all interest. I like the creative part of it. I don't like the idea of using it as a control mechanism for games.
- Holy smurfing crap, that face. o_o

In conclusion: Ah, who cares? I'm inevitably going to buy both the 720 and the PS4 anyway. :D Also, I do agree with what I heard someone say (I watched a lot of various build up things) before the event... whatever happens, it shouldn't be considered positive or negative until we know what we're paying for it, and they were never going to tell us what we're paying for it on the night.

[NorthernChaosGod]

This is why I've called it emotional. Most reactions range from "meh" to "nice" yet here's MILF saying "RIP Sony" and "Redmond is laughing." I honestly cant believe in 2013 people are still hung up on the Microsoft vs. Sony thing, especially when a lot of us have just gone back to Steam. It reminds me of the last thread about how well the PS3 has done but MILF thought it important to remind us all about marketing strategies and consumer demographics. These are machines that play videogames. Can anyone please explain to me why this other stuff matters?

Ive seen a lot of discussions about what we want to see next generation. I would love if gamers stopped the corporate marketing spin and put the fanboyism to rest. I don't ever remember talking about if the ps2 was better than the gamecube. And we never evaluated Sega and Nintendo based on their business strategies and press conferences. We talked about their features and their games.

Damn I miss those days.
Because video games are a business and I we're now adults? o_O

[Loony BoB]

Because video games are a business and I we're now adults? o_O
Screw you! When it comes to gaming, I'm a kid! :D If a console ain't keeping me running back for more fun, I don't care about it.

Disclaimer: That's not to say I don't find it interesting to speculate/discuss marketing/business/etc. relating to games.

[Pike]

Meh. I don't know what you guys are excited about. Nothing seemed impressive to me at all. But then again I stopped caring about Sony approximately halfway through the PS2's lifespan. Hell, I think I'm pretty much done with console gaming in general. The only reason I have a 360 is cause Hux got one for me :) I don't use it very often. My PC can do everything it does and better (because of mods).

[Loony BoB]

Yeah, I'm kind of hoping that the next generation of consoles will be modder-friendly. I don't see why it can't happen, particularly if the architecture is PC-esque enough.

I love PC gaming and all - most of my gaming in the past year has been FFXIV and Football Manager, while X-COM and other games certainly kept me for many a day. I think the PC has the best games when it comes to going back to them over and over, too. But to deny console gaming is kind of ignorant.

Also, none of it seemed impressive? WHAT ABOUT THE FACE. x_x

[Pike]

Well, I'm not denying console gaming, I'm just saying it's no longer interesting to me, especially if they continue to shoehorn this "social" stuff in there that no one cares about.

[Loony BoB]

I'm pretty certain that all this social stuff isn't going to be restricted to console games. Seems to be all the rage at the moment. While I don't know if I'd care to see it showing up on my Facebook page all the time, I will concede that there are certain games I wouldn't mind having the option to allow for commentary on. I mean, I know it won't be, but... if Dwarf Fortress was on the PS4, the ability to watch it live and for people to hop in and take over the controls whenever you wish is pretty cool. That's the kind of social gaming I can really get behind. Also, should FFXIV ever make the jump to the PS4 (again, not counting on it) then it would be great for streaming boss fights and whatnot.

But yeah, pretty sure most of the social things are completely optional, just like with every other major game out there that already has that kinda stuff.

[Cloudane]

Ah so there is actually a console?

I tuned in about half an hour late and they were waffling on about the Vita and how it can be streamed there and tablets and then talking about games and I didn't catch anything about a new console. I had the sinking feeling the "PS4" was going to be a case of "it's not actually a console, but a cloud based experience you can have on any device!" or some modern bulltrout like that :p

8 core processor? Colour me interested.

[Shauna]

Riiiight. I never watched the event so. Brief run down of the things they talked about? :3

[Loony BoB]

The PS4 page on Wikipedia pretty much sums everything up.

[Slothy]

- I must be one of the very few people who actually liked the PS3's user interface, because I'm kind of iffy on the new one. Oh well. I don't want pretty pictures, I just want a clean UI where I know where to go for whatever I want to do, and to display decent amounts of information on my screen, not massive ugly blocks like I have on my 360 or groups of updating blocks like on Facebook. Oh well, guess I'll just have to put up with it.

I still haven't seen it since I just got up, but I did see an article describe the UI as more 360 like before I went to bed. So I'm assuming it's something like the 360 dashboard or the updated playstation store interface we got a while back? Because the only thing I have to say if that's the case is that both of those are some of the worst interfaces I've ever seen.

Like you, I liked the XMB. It was simple, clean, fast, and optimized well for use with a controller. It was actually one of the few things about the PS3 that I'd say Sony pretty much nailed down perfectly. That they're now going to go and rip off interfaces that look and feel like they were designed by blind monkey's who've never held a controller is disconcerting.

EDIT: So I've read up on the gist of the announcements a bit more and here are my general thoughts. I haven't seen any actual footage beyond a bit of the video of Destiny, but let's be honest here, I think we've all seen enough console launches to know what to expect from game videos showing off more powerful hardware. I'll watch them later, but I doubt I'm missing much that relevant to discussing the console itself. Anywhere, here we go:

-Like I said before, social features don't interest me and this was no exception so I'll skip over that.
- Playstation Eye is standard from the sounds of things and works with the regular Dual Shock now? Not seeing much there for me unless I'm missing something. I've used every variant of motion controls out there right now and the conclusion I've reached is they do nothing for me. They have absolutely no value to the sorts of games I want to play and are at best a cumbersome pain in my ass when they're used. Good on them for at least shoving them in the box at launch for those that want them, but I really doubt that motion controls are suddenly going to show their worth to me 7 ears after the Wii came out and everyone else jumped on that bandwagon.
- I'm really not seeing the value in this touchpad on the controller. I'll wait and see what it gets used for I suppose, but I'm not expecting much. The only thing I can figure is it's there for some sort of cross platform play with Vita titles since it has the touchscreen and pad. If you could play Vita titles on the PS4 that would actually be pretty cool.
- The prospect of streaming PSX, PS2, and PS3 titles for backwards compatibility is interesting. People with shitty connections are boned though. And we'll have to see what the price structure is. I'd rather it be subscription based than paying for specific titles to be honest. I have absolutely no desire to "buy" titles that I don't own and may not be able to access if the service or Sony ever go belly up. But a monthly fee for access to the back catalogue for those three consoles? That's something I might be able to get behind.
- The downloading while you play/downloading before you buy is interesting if it all works, but certainly not a bunch of added value to me. I have a fast internet connection and never had a problem with just letting something download for a few minutes. It's convenient don't get me wrong, but since it has no impact on the actual games it's only mildly interesting to me.

And now for the real bread and butter:
- The fairly standard PC hardware interests me because we won't see consoles holding back PC titles for a while, and it will mean easier porting. Both of these interest me since I really don't have much desire to pay a few hundred dollars to jump into a closed gaming system that a big company controls with an iron fist again. I love the openness of PC gaming, the tweakability that comes with it, and that no one can really come along and tell me how to enjoy my gaming rig.

Now, don't get me wrong, that stuff is good for Sony too. Proprietary hardware that was difficult to develop for almost cost them the current console generation completely, and certainly did cost them a huge lead they had going in. But I'm not seeing anything that's making me want to jump in with both feet again what with some of the stupidity these console manufacturers are prone to. At best what I'm willing to say right now is that I will wait and see how things shake out a couple of years post launch. In the mean time, my socks are still firmly in place.

But perhaps that's a little unfair. At this point I'm not sure a console or it's features could really wow me anymore. I care about what games can do with the hardware, not what the hardware is or what it does outside of gaming. So about the only take away from this for me is: new consoles are coming and they're a lot more powerful so expect bigger, prettier games, with better AI and such.

[Loony BoB]

This is what happens when people bitch about things, sadly. The people who enjoy them are never as vocal, and change happens. Glad I'm not alone in my thoughts on it all, though! And yeah, it's similar to the PS Store more than the 360 layout (or at least, the 360 layout as it was back when I played ME3).

EDIT: Hopefully, since they're so big on "Personalise", they'll at least give us an option to change the layout.

[nirojan]

Just a side note for 4K, you really expected them to throw they're backing for it? I mean it'll take at least 5-10 years for it to catch on (seeing how the cheapest 4k set I've seen is over 10 grand).

The Witcher 3:Wild Hunt just got confirmed for PS4:
http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/02/21/the-witcher-3-wild-hunt-confirmed-for-playstation-4

[Loony BoB]

I expected them to at least allow for the possibility that 4K will take off and become cheaper over the next few years and therefore more people to open up to the idea of 4K gaming. Personally I'm not that concerned as I doubt I'll buy a 4K TV anytime soon and it keeps the cost down. I just know a lot of people were talking about 4K before the event.

[nirojan]

PS4 Will NOT BLOCK USED GAMES
Sony Exec: PlayStation 4 Doesn (http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/02/21/sony-exec-playstation-4-doesnt-block-used-games)

@Bob Yeah that's pretty much in line with most most consumers are thinking at this point.

[Slothy]

This is what happens when people bitch about things, sadly. The people who enjoy them are never as vocal, and change happens. Glad I'm not alone in my thoughts on it all, though! And yeah, it's similar to the PS Store more than the 360 layout (or at least, the 360 layout as it was back when I played ME3).

EDIT: Hopefully, since they're so big on "Personalise", they'll at least give us an option to change the layout.

I just feel the need to say again that the current PS Store layout is possibly the worst UI I've ever seen from a console manufacturer (tied with the 360 dashboard probably, if not slightly better than it). It makes it more difficult to navigate with a controller, and harder to find what you want, as well as being a hell of a lot slower (not that I expect that to be a problem on the PS4 anyway).

[Psychotic]

Well, colour me intrigued. I like the idea of rewinding and screenshotting games and I like the idea of making a single player game like Fallout or Mass Effect a shared experience. I assume the feature works without you actually playing the game (ie a video stream?) so you can see a friend messing about on a game and decide if you want it. I'm not letting anyone take control of my games though wtf.

Nothing that's been announced so far has made me want to get one at release though. Couple of games interest me but nothing is leaping out as something I MUST HAVE. We'll see what Microsoft have to offer.

[Loony BoB]

Well, colour me intrigued. I like the idea of rewinding and screenshotting games and I like the idea of making a single player game like Fallout or Mass Effect a shared experience. I assume the feature works without you actually playing the game (ie a video stream?) so you can see a friend messing about on a game and decide if you want it.
Yeah, this seems to be the case - particularly considering that they uploaded to Facebook during the show (there should be the uploaded stream on the Killzone page on Facebook, apparently).

The big question will be how many of the games mentioned will be Sony exclusives, too. I doubt Bungie will have gone Sony exclusive all of a sudden, for example. If Blizzard and Sony get in bed with each other and Blizzard churns out console games for them exclusively, that would be interesting indeed. I don't think it'll happen, though. I think exclusives are almost a thing of the past, Nintendo/MS/Sony developer houses aside. I'm thinking that the reason we didn't hear about things like Uncharted 4 etc. is down to them wanting to keep some of the limelight at E3. If Sony have no massive big new information (and the look of the console for me is unimportant, so...) about what is in their lineup, they will be playing second fiddle to MS's 720 announcement throughout E3, which would be a shame.

Developers that are confirmed for PS4 (according to the slide shown at the event)
2K
4A Games
505 Games
5th Cell
Activision
Acquire
Arc System Works
Artdink
ASCII Media Works
Atlus
Avalanche Studios
Behaviour Interactive
Bethesda
Blitz Games Studios
Blizzard
Bloober Team
Bohemia Interactive
Certain Affinity
Capcom
City Interactive
CD Projekt
Climax
Codemasters Racing
Crafts & Meister
Criterion Games
Croteam
Curve Studios
CyberConnect 2
D3 Publisher
Devolver Digital
Dimps
Disney
Double Fine
Double Helix games
Drinkbox Studios
EA
Edge of Reality
Farsight Studios
Fatshark
Flying Wild Hog
From Software
Frozenbyte
Gaijin Entertainment
Gaijin Games
Ganbarion
Gearbox Software
Genki
Grasshopper Manufacture
Gust Co.
Hello Games
GungHo
Idea Factory
Imageepoch
InXile Entertainment
Just Add Water
Kadokawa Games
Kalypso Media
Keen Games
Klei Entertainment
Konami
Lab Zero, Inc
Level-5
LucasArts
Lucid Games
Marvelous AQL
Mediatonic
MercuryStream
Milestone
Namco Bandai
Nicalis
Ninja Theory
Nippon Ichi
Nixxes
Paradox Interactive
Platinum Games
Quantic Dream
Rebellion Developments
Rockstar
Rovio
Saber Interactive
Sega
Slant Six Games
Sony Online Entertainment
Spark Unlimited
Spike Chunsoft
Splash Damage
Square Enix
Stainless Games
Starbreeze Studios
Straight Right
SystemSoft
Team 17
TechLand
Tecmo Koei
Telltale Games
Tri-Ace
Turtle Rock
Ubisoft
Vector Cell
Vlambeer
Warner Bros
Wayforward Technologies
Yager
Yuke's
Zombie Studios

Missing from the slide: thatgamecompany, Playdead, Insomniac Games, Riot Games, Media.Vision, Mojang, Obsidian Entertainment, ZeniMax Media (id Software), Zynga (:p), Piranha Bytes, United Front Games, 3D Realms, Valve, Mistwalker, n-Space, Crytek and - rather shockingly - Microsoft and Nintendo.

[Bolivar]

^ Blizzard and everyone else kinda confirmed after the show that their stuff will be coming to "other next gen consoles" as well.

[Formalhaut]

Well, colour me intrigued. I like the idea of rewinding and screenshotting games and I like the idea of making a single player game like Fallout or Mass Effect a shared experience.

It'd be great if you could record video gaming sessions, which would make doing video game walkthroughs alot easier. Screenshots though just add to this.

[Madame Adequate]

This is why I've called it emotional. Most reactions range from "meh" to "nice" yet here's MILF saying "RIP Sony" and "Redmond is laughing." I honestly cant believe in 2013 people are still hung up on the Microsoft vs. Sony thing, especially when a lot of us have just gone back to Steam. It reminds me of the last thread about how well the PS3 has done but MILF thought it important to remind us all about marketing strategies and consumer demographics. These are machines that play videogames. Can anyone please explain to me why this other stuff matters?

Ive seen a lot of discussions about what we want to see next generation. I would love if gamers stopped the corporate marketing spin and put the fanboyism to rest. I don't ever remember talking about if the ps2 was better than the gamecube. And we never evaluated Sega and Nintendo based on their business strategies and press conferences. We talked about their features and their games.

Damn I miss those days.

>bolivar calling other people out for being hung up on MS v. Sony

asjdbhashdbashbdhabahahahhahaoh wow son, oh wow.

All I've said is that it was a terrible presentation which didn't do anything to make me want to buy a PS4. I'm not entirely sure where my big diva-esque emotion is coming from in that, but okay. I think it's funny and disappointing because Sony should know better and yet they've made all kinds of mistakes, and you seem to be missing the fact that I am dismissing them precisely BECAUSE they are trying to hit every square on the Buzzword Bingo to please investors rather than to actually provide us with videogames. I'm critical precisely BECAUSE the companies have shifted the focus away from videogames and towards facebook integration and motion control and other bullshit. You're acting like nothing has changed except some of us have randomly decided to invent a bunch of stuff to complain about when it's really been the shift in the companies, their focus, and their presentation. We didn't talk about Nintendo and SEGA like this because when they held a press conference about their new consoles they actually showed the damn console and a bunch of exciting games for it.

Also yeah I think in a thread about how well the PS3 did in terms of sales it was legit to discuss factors that influence sales figures? I dunno, I mean maybe not, but it doesn't seem entirely unreasonable?

[Psychotic]

Mojang, Obsidian Entertainment, ZeniMax Media oh, well, fuck that for a laugh then. :colbert:

[Wolf Kanno]

Honestly, after this last console generation, I can't say I'm really looking excited for the next generation just yet. I'm probably just going to stay on the sidelines for this and wait for someone to finally announce (and show) something I can really get behind cause I'm with Vivi22 where I don't give a fuck about the hardware, I'm more interested in how the software developers will use it to make better games.

Most of the features people have mentioned sound like things I would never use, but I'll echo BoB that I am happy it wasn't just an hour of explaining how I can connect to all my social network sites, Netflix (now with ESPN!), and how its compatible with our new generation of HDTV 3D capable TVs. I like when my game consoles are actual game consoles and not "entertainment systems".

I can honestly say I'm not interested in streaming old games though, I get terrible service where I live.

[Loony BoB]

All I've said is that it was a terrible presentation which didn't do anything to make me want to buy a PS4. I'm not entirely sure where my big diva-esque emotion is coming from in that, but okay. I think it's funny and disappointing because Sony should know better and yet they've made all kinds of mistakes, and you seem to be missing the fact that I am dismissing them precisely BECAUSE they are trying to hit every square on the Buzzword Bingo to please investors rather than to actually provide us with videogames. I'm critical precisely BECAUSE the companies have shifted the focus away from videogames and towards facebook integration and motion control and other bulltrout.
I'm curious - putting the lack of showing the console itself aside, what were you expecting out of the announcement of the PS4 being official? Yes, they mentioned the sharing and social media stuff, but they didn't emphasise them nearly as much as perhaps you are thinking. They spent loads of time, however, with games being played. Hell, the IGN crowd all seemed united in it being a 30-60 minute event showing off perhaps a short reel of games in a single quick video. Instead, we got a number of five to ten minute sessions showcasing a variety of games. A lot of time was spent showing off to devs, that's for certain, but they have all year to show off to the people. Without the devs, they'll get nowhere.

[Madame Adequate]

http://i789.photobucket.com/albums/yy178/Automilf/emot-ssh_zps38b46afb.gif If they had cut the bullshit the thing would have lasted about half an hour. The devs should already be on board and have dev kits in their hands, for that matter.

[Formalhaut]

It's the first announcement... I think people are expecting far too much when it's the first official announcement of the console. As BoB said - they have a full year or more to drip feed us information.

One thing I'm curious about is that game controller. It's got a touch-screen on it's front, plus a very play-station move like Light bar over it's top.

It will be interesting to see how it will be used in the future.


http://cdn0.mos.techradar.futurecdn.net///art/games_consoles/PlayStation%204/PS4NYCAnnouncement/dualshock%204-580-75.jpg

[Psychotic]

Controller is bloody ugly I tell you what. It looks a bit like one of those dodgy third party controllers you'd get for the PS2.

[Loony BoB]

Yeah, I'm waiting to see how the touchpad will be utilised. I can see some benefit to having it but it would be a rare thing and more suited to a flat platform (like a tablet) than a controller.

[Wolf Kanno]

It's the first announcement... I think people are expecting far too much when it's the first official announcement of the console. As BoB said - they have a full year or more to drip feed us information.




I feel the real complaint is that fans and consumers don't want to be drip fed, rather we're interested in telling us what we are going to get from the start instead of speculating about launch titles and price points. For once, I would love a console maker to reveal their console 6 months before its actual release and just flat out tell us what to expect day one and not what to look forward to for the next ten years. When did video game consoles become presidential elections?

[NorthernChaosGod]

Yeah, that controller looks ugly and like it will be hard to use properly with the touchpad. My first thought is that it will be pretty gimmicky since it'd be hard to make that seem natural to gameplay.

[Formalhaut]

I feel the real complaint is that fans and consumers don't want to be drip fed, rather we're interested in telling us what we are going to get from the start instead of speculating about launch titles and price points. For once, I would love a console maker to reveal their console 6 months before its actual release and just flat out tell us what to expect day one and not what to look forward to for the next ten years. When did video game consoles become presidential elections?


I see your point; definitely they could have arranged the order of their telling differently. The way they did it, they led with the technical details, like the chip being used, all of the hardware stuff that I don't really quite get my head around. What they should have done for a first, initial announcement is to lead with the software, games etc.

It's the software, games, etc. that will more interest gamers, not the hardware statistics and whatnot. I'm not exactly an expert on mechanics and stuff, so for your average gamer leading with hardware and developerships is warranting a "Well, okay, that's fine, but what about the games?"

I'm not disappointed, I'm still excited for it, but I'll need more first to commit.


Yeah, that controller looks ugly and like it will be hard to use properly with the touchpad. My first thought is that it will be pretty gimmicky since it'd be hard to make that seem natural to gameplay.

The touch pad in the centre of the controller reminds me slightly of the Wii U's controller. It doesn't seem that hard to use, at least in my opinion. And also; everyone say's that the controller looks ugly, but is the aesthetics of the controller really that important in the grand scheme of things? As long as it works and is used well in games, it could be brightly coloured yellow for all I care.

[krissy]

PS4 Announcement - Abridged Version - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=0rJDn0jRnUQ)

[Shoeberto]

To those complaining about a lack of details: This early announcement was entirely to build hype and build stockholder confidence. Like every launch you can expect the lion's share of details to come out at E3. This was just PR for the business side of things. I think it's silly to really expect much more than that from an event that isn't one of the big industry cons like E3/TGC/Gamescom.

I'm still excited for the technical implications of this. We're definitely witnessing the approach of a singularity in terms of target hardware; by having more open platforms for porting, the big console companies will have to do more creative things to draw users to their machine in particular, which I think will push innovation in services and peripherals. Which is pretty damn cool to me.

I'm also a long-time Playstation fan so I'm biased but goddamn do we live in exciting times for gamers.

[Bolivar]

I feel the real complaint is that fans and consumers don't want to be drip fed, rather we're interested in telling us what we are going to get from the start instead of speculating about launch titles and price points. For once, I would love a console maker to reveal their console 6 months before its actual release and just flat out tell us what to expect day one and not what to look forward to for the next ten years.

They actually showed us gameplay for quite a few launch titles.

[Slothy]

We're definitely witnessing the approach of a singularity in terms of target hardware; by having more open platforms for porting, the big console companies will have to do more creative things to draw users to their machine in particular, which I think will push innovation in services and peripherals. Which is pretty damn cool to me.

So long as we're relying on these three major manufacturers for hardware and services I don't see a whole lot of innovation coming from them. At least not useful innovation. Let's really stop and think about this for a second: does anyone expect useful innovation to come from these guys with their closed platforms?

Nintendo tried with the Wii but motion controls are a bit of a dead end. A nice way to get the non-gamer into games somewhat intuitively maybe, but that's about it. And it didn't even really succeed at that. Sure, it got a lot of people outside the traditional game market to buy Wii's, but they never really got that to translate into retaining them and getting them to buy games. And faced with this attempt at innovation that never really took off or showed much potential to be honest, what was the reaction from Microsoft and Sony? Let's put out our own motion control solutions several years after them, which, while technically superior or at least different in a lot of ways, didn't have any idea where to go from the base product that Nintendo put out.

Fast forward to last year and this year and what are we seeing? Nintendo didn't really know where to take motion control either, so instead they left it as it was on the Wii and decided to ape touch screen tablets by sticking one in the controller. At best it's a retread of ground they already covered with the DS with no obvious improvements (if anything it's worse since you can't keep the controller and TV in your field of view at all times making using both simultaneously a pain to say the least), and at worst it's an attempt to latch onto the "it" thing in electronics for the last few years. Meanwhile, we've got Sony making a push on social features, adding touch screens/pads to controllers without bothering to explain how this is a benefit to the player or showing them in use, and building some motion control into the dual shock (again). Because what the innovation the market needed was more motion controls apparently.

And while some may consider it a bit early to count Microsoft out, if their businesses outside of gaming are any indication, they don't have a clue what they're doing 99% of the time and the 360 might have been a fluke. I'm not expecting much from the company that's spent the better part of the last decade trying, and often failing, to play catch up with their direct competitors, often after they spend years working on innovative technology before anyone else even starts thinking about it and still get beaten to market by years and with better products.

Honestly, the only future I really see for innovation, and something which may end up being inevitable, is a move to open hardware systems and utilizing services like Steam rather than buying consoles, while peripheral manufacturers maybe try and step in and partner with developers. I'm not saying it will definitely happen, but at some point we may find these big companies falling behind guys like Valve with Steam in terms of innovation (and recent financial troubles with companies like Sony do not make me feel good about their continuation in the hardware market), and more open hardware that gives developers more freedom supplanting their boxes.

Hell, if anything, there may already be an example of sorts with Android where this is happening. I could totally see a service provider creating the software and distribution system going forward, and letting multiple hardware manufacturers offer their own boxes, maybe partnering with one for the initial update and then letting it trickle down to everyone else. There's certainly precedent for it, and more open hardware with more competition is going to mean lower prices for consumers (hopefully). If Valve does release a Steam box eventually, that might even be the first step in going down a similar road to what Google did with Android.

Anyway, I'm just spit balling there. I just don't see a lot of innovation coming from the big three. Not without something making them all very, very scared first.

[escobert]

I'm always like 10 years behind on consoles. I just got a PS3 (for the second time this year xD )

[NorthernChaosGod]

Yeah, that controller looks ugly and like it will be hard to use properly with the touchpad. My first thought is that it will be pretty gimmicky since it'd be hard to make that seem natural to gameplay.

The touch pad in the centre of the controller reminds me slightly of the Wii U's controller. It doesn't seem that hard to use, at least in my opinion. And also; everyone say's that the controller looks ugly, but is the aesthetics of the controller really that important in the grand scheme of things? As long as it works and is used well in games, it could be brightly coloured yellow for all I care.

It doesn't look like you can use it very fluidly. Considering that you shouldn't have to move your hand off the controller (or reach far from normal position) to use some of it's buttons/features, I think that's harder than it needs to be.

[nirojan]

Yeah, that controller looks ugly and like it will be hard to use properly with the touchpad. My first thought is that it will be pretty gimmicky since it'd be hard to make that seem natural to gameplay.

The touch pad in the centre of the controller reminds me slightly of the Wii U's controller. It doesn't seem that hard to use, at least in my opinion. And also; everyone say's that the controller looks ugly, but is the aesthetics of the controller really that important in the grand scheme of things? As long as it works and is used well in games, it could be brightly coloured yellow for all I care.

It doesn't look like you can use it very fluidly. Considering that you shouldn't have to move your hand off the controller (or reach far from normal position) to use some of it's buttons/features, I think that's harder than it needs to be.

You mean like the Wii U controller?

[nirojan]

For those of you wondering if the Killzone demo was pre-rendered or not, here's Jimmy Fallon playing it:
PlayStation 4 Demo of Killzone: Shadow Fall - YouTube (http://youtu.be/rGlu3e9kdks)

Looks like it's launch title!

[Pete for President]

For those of you wondering if the Killzone demo was pre-rendered or not, here's Jimmy Fallon playing it:
PlayStation 4 Demo of Killzone: Shadow Fall - YouTube (http://youtu.be/rGlu3e9kdks)

Looks like it's launch title!


Haha "I'm a gamer, I'm a geek". Looks like he never played a shooter in his life. Which is possible of course but hey, had to notice :greenie: fun stuff though! And hurray for demo-immunity.

[Cloudane]

So many complaints about the controller being ugly. Personally I don't intend to keep it on the mantlepiece - it's for controlling games, not for looking at, so as long as it's good for that who cares :p

[Bolivar]

Hahahaha Jimmy failed at Uncharted 3 as well when they brought it on his show. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt since Killzone is like throwing him into the deep end of first person shooters.

Looks like the pad'll be for easily browsing menus, which makes sense.

[Loony BoB]

I wouldn't say it makes much sense for browsing menus, I'd say it makes more sense for browsing windows with a lot of icons. Still, not ideal as far as I'm concerned, because it could be rather awkard holding the controller with one hand and using the 'mouse' with the other, especially if they don't integrate tap = click and instead insist on using X.

[Shoeberto]

Just read Tycho's write-up (http://www.penny-arcade.com/2013/02/22/augurism) of the thing and he came to the same conclusions that I did, and seems to share equal excitement about the prospects. Obviously there's some self-serving bias here in me agreeing with him (fervently) but looking at it in the grand scheme of things I really believe Sony is doing everything right with this machine.

The big misstep could come with the price announcement. But I doubt even a PS3-level snafu could kill it - really, it just made the PS3 more of a slow-burner, and if Sony is good at anything, it's playing the long game.

[Loony BoB]

Yeah, that's why they're doing so well financially. :shifty:

[DownDiagonalLeftA]

I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though

"No," Yoshida said, when asked about any current-gen PSN game being natively supported on the PS4. "Unless, somehow, some games work on emulation. The easiest thing technically would be to make PS1 games work on PS4 through emulation. But we aren't talking about our emulation plans as yet. There are two ways: emulation or cloud service. But native support, no, sorry. We could do so if we choose to. We know who purchased what as a record. But we are working on service plans, and we haven't decided."

In last night's PS4 announcement, Sony revealed the new console won't have backwards compatibility for PS1, PS2, or PS3 discs, although the company aims to use the PS Cloud service to stream previous-gen games as a workaround.

Yoshida: PSN games won't run natively on PS4, no emulation or cloud support yet [update] | Joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/21/psn-transfers-ps4/)

[Bolivar]

I wouldn't say it makes much sense for browsing menus, I'd say it makes more sense for browsing windows with a lot of icons. Still, not ideal as far as I'm concerned, because it could be rather awkard holding the controller with one hand and using the 'mouse' with the other, especially if they don't integrate tap = click and instead insist on using X.

I'm not sure what you mean about holding and using it with different hands... looks like you'll be able to just use your thumbs (that's where start, select and home were, afterall). And when I saw it, I immediatley thought about my Oblivion menus and how convenient it would be to just swipe through it all. You know how when you normally move the cursor if you hold it down for a while to speed up? Well now you don't need that wait period, you can just swipe for faster speeds instead.

I'm actually kinda feelin this thing now.

[Loony BoB]

I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though

"No," Yoshida said, when asked about any current-gen PSN game being natively supported on the PS4. "Unless, somehow, some games work on emulation. The easiest thing technically would be to make PS1 games work on PS4 through emulation. But we aren't talking about our emulation plans as yet. There are two ways: emulation or cloud service. But native support, no, sorry. We could do so if we choose to. We know who purchased what as a record. But we are working on service plans, and we haven't decided."

In last night's PS4 announcement, Sony revealed the new console won't have backwards compatibility for PS1, PS2, or PS3 discs, although the company aims to use the PS Cloud service to stream previous-gen games as a workaround.

Yoshida: PSN games won't run natively on PS4, no emulation or cloud support yet [update] | Joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/21/psn-transfers-ps4/)
If they wanted to support PS1/2/3 games on it, they would drive the cost up through the roof. I'm glad they didn't bother. It's a sadly necessary thing.

[nirojan]

Yeah, that's why they're doing so well financially. :shifty:
:objection:

Hey hey hey, they sold their Manhattan headquarters. They're in the BLACK now!:cheers:

[nirojan]

OFFICIAL PS4 ANNOUNCEMENT VIDEO:
PlayStation 4 Announcement Live Stream (Replay) - YouTube (http://youtu.be/RiNGZMx2vhY)

[DownDiagonalLeftA]

I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though

"No," Yoshida said, when asked about any current-gen PSN game being natively supported on the PS4. "Unless, somehow, some games work on emulation. The easiest thing technically would be to make PS1 games work on PS4 through emulation. But we aren't talking about our emulation plans as yet. There are two ways: emulation or cloud service. But native support, no, sorry. We could do so if we choose to. We know who purchased what as a record. But we are working on service plans, and we haven't decided."

In last night's PS4 announcement, Sony revealed the new console won't have backwards compatibility for PS1, PS2, or PS3 discs, although the company aims to use the PS Cloud service to stream previous-gen games as a workaround.

Yoshida: PSN games won't run natively on PS4, no emulation or cloud support yet [update] | Joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/21/psn-transfers-ps4/)
If they wanted to support PS1/2/3 games on it, they would drive the cost up through the roof. I'm glad they didn't bother. It's a sadly necessary thing.

What's their excuse for possibly not supporting PSN purchases?

[nirojan]

I'll be waiting at least six months before getting my hands on one of these bad boys. Unless the early batch of PS4's are backwards compatible with PS1, PS2 and PS3 games... extremely unlikey though

"No," Yoshida said, when asked about any current-gen PSN game being natively supported on the PS4. "Unless, somehow, some games work on emulation. The easiest thing technically would be to make PS1 games work on PS4 through emulation. But we aren't talking about our emulation plans as yet. There are two ways: emulation or cloud service. But native support, no, sorry. We could do so if we choose to. We know who purchased what as a record. But we are working on service plans, and we haven't decided."

In last night's PS4 announcement, Sony revealed the new console won't have backwards compatibility for PS1, PS2, or PS3 discs, although the company aims to use the PS Cloud service to stream previous-gen games as a workaround.

Yoshida: PSN games won't run natively on PS4, no emulation or cloud support yet [update] | Joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2013/02/21/psn-transfers-ps4/)
If they wanted to support PS1/2/3 games on it, they would drive the cost up through the roof. I'm glad they didn't bother. It's a sadly necessary thing.

What's their excuse for possibly not supporting PSN purchases?

The games are still built on the PS3 architecture. People seem to be very confused with this. THEY ARE NOT USING THE "CELL" ON THE PS4. It would drive up costs on what's already expected to be a pricey machine. This means all games designed to be used on the PS3 will not be compatible. That includes PSN games made for the PS3.

[Loony BoB]

Yeah, it's similar to not supporting some PSP games on the PS3. Sometimes it just doesn't work. But they did say that should certain games be playable in time through streaming software that they will look into options to help people play games they have previously purchased on PSN.

[Bolivar]

I would say that PSN purchases has to be a necessity day 1. I really doubt Microsoft won't carry over, their console is arguably built on their digital store.

[Loony BoB]

When you say PSN purchases on day one are a must-have - do you mean being able to purchase & play PS1/2/3 games on PS4 on day one? If so, I disagree it's a "must have". People who buy a PS4 on day one won't be doing it so they can quickly hop onto the PS Store and start downloading/playing PS1/2/3 games.

[Bolivar]

I mean, for me, not having your PlayStation Store purchases would be a sign of not having their ish together immediately, and to hold off a little while on it, kinda how a lot of us did with the PS3.

[Loony BoB]

You should hold off anyway. Buying a PS4 on day one is just asking for problems. ;)

[Formalhaut]

I wouldn't buy ANY console Day 1. Not even Month 1.

[Mirage]

Not even if it was a PS2?!

[Formalhaut]

Yes, even a PS2. While the PS2 is an amazing console, that's looking back retrospectively. At the time, it was a new console. Besides, you never know with uncertainty. I like to know that a console is proven to work and is not bugged or whatever.

I think the earliest console I bought after release was actually my 3DS, probably about a good 5 months after release.

[Mirage]

I bought a PS2 really close to launch, simply because I never had a PS1, and therefore had an enormous backlog of PS1 games to play through while waiting for PS2 games to become more plentiful.

[Bolivar]

I wanted a PS2 on day 1 but had to wait until next holiday season to get one since the initial shipment was so notoriously low. Looking back, I think that launch windows was just as relatively weak as others, with Tekken Tag Tournament being the only big game to play? In any case, Final Fantasy IX was out and that kept me occupied for a while...

*sigh*, back in the days when Final Fantasy was an annual franchise...

[Del Murder]

I went to buy a PS2 close to launch but they were sold out. So I bought Majora's Mask instead.

[Mirage]

The game cost about the same as a PS2, I bet!

[Formalhaut]

The thing is I often never have enough money to buy a console, so I wait until it's price has dropped first.

[Mirage]

I did have enough money to buy a PS3 when it was new, just... why would I? It only had meh games. I didn't buy it until MGS4 was released, and by then, it was down 40% already.

Of course, MGS4 turned out to be a bit meh too, but there was no way I could have known that!

[Bolivar]

I know a lot of people liked Resistance, but when I played it, I took it as an indicator that the machine wasn't quite there yet. I got one a year later, a refurbed 60GB for $299, primarily to be ready for GTA IV and MGS4. I'm probably the only person on the planet who enjoyed playing through both games.

[Rostum]

I usually wait a year or two, or three. By then a new version of the console is usually out (e.g. PS2 and PS3 slim, NDS Lite, etc.).

[nirojan]

For those of you who were wondering about 4k support, it looks like Sony's 4K movie service will be coming to the PS4:
Sony's 4K Movie Service Will Come to PS4 - IGN (http://ca.ign.com/articles/2013/02/28/sonys-4k-movie-service-will-come-to-ps4)

[Bolivar]

I'm only speaking for my eyes here, but I definitely don't need any higher resolution video.

[Mirage]

I do/n't.

I don't for as long as I have just a 42" TV, but when I buy something around 60+ inches, then it would probably be pretty nice.

[nirojan]

Coming off reading a really interesting article: PlayStation 4 Needs To Learn From Vita (http://www.ign.com/blogs/jamiemad66/2013/02/24/playstation-4-needs-to-learn-from-vitas-mistakes/)

What is the one big exclusive that would push you to buy a PS4 launch day (or within a year or so)?

[Bolivar]

Here's an interesting one I read:

Winning the console wars: Sony's not-so-secret weapon - Destructoid (http://www.destructoid.com/winning-the-console-wars-sony-s-not-so-secret-weapon-247362.phtml?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter)

saying that the real key to success may be PlayStation Plus, considering the massive content it bombards you with, and having that for a brand new machine would be kinda unprecedented.

I think whichever company releases that "Netflix for Games" type service, and does it really well out the gate, will be the must-buy system out the gate.

[nirojan]

Been thinking about that as well. I've been a PS+ member since it launched (my curernt sub goes well into 2014), and I think they should do a "netlix gaming service" for PS+, but they should really look how Onlive succeeded and failed. I'm curious how deep the Gaikai integration will be. We know they'll roll it out for backwards compatibility, but if they adopt an Onlive strategy I think it could be really good for them in the long run.

Think about some of the major Sony exclusives that simply weren't given the marketing or the push that could've made them big AAA releases (StarHawk, Twisted Metal, Valkyria Chronicles, etc.). These are all games that Microsoft or Nintendo would've marketed the s**t out of, but Sony (because of the sheer number of exclusives it has) has let these games get lost in the crowd. Now if these games were added to a subscription based service, not only would they have more exposure, but possibly build the franchise awareness to a level where the sequel, prequel, etc. would have a large enough base to justify continuing that particular franchise.

[Loony BoB]

Coming off reading a really interesting article: PlayStation 4 Needs To Learn From Vita (http://www.ign.com/blogs/jamiemad66/2013/02/24/playstation-4-needs-to-learn-from-vitas-mistakes/)

What is the one big exclusive that would push you to buy a PS4 launch day (or within a year or so)?
Unrealistic: Final Fantasy XV. If it comes out on PS4 at launch, I will inevitably buy a PS4 at launch. But more than likely this will be much later and will not be exclusive.

Realistic: Uncharted 4.

[Bubba]

around 60+ inches, then it would probably be pretty nice.

Not for your partner it wouldn't.

I don't think a huge title like Uncharted will be ready for the launch. I think it more likely to be something like Wipeout.

[Loony BoB]

nirojan asked what exclusive title would make me buy the console at launch, and that was the only realistic exclusive title I could think of that would make me buy the console at launch. :p All other must-buy titles that I know of are cross-platform. Wipeout is far from a must-buy when you already have it on PS3.

[Bubba]

Ah right yeah, I didn't read that properly.

More than likely there will be no must-buy titles ready for launch. Only the suckers will pay full whack on the first day of release.

[Bolivar]

Well, Watch Dogs, Killzone, Drive Club and the Witness have all been confirmed as launch titles and I'm a pretty big fan of the first three developers. I'll probably buy the system if I have disposable income at the time, but Killzone is very close to must-buy territory. I usually burn a lot of hours in Killzone multiplayer and their offerings so far have been pretty substantial. Battlefield and CoD are in that territory as well.

But as far as MUST must haves, that would be Valkyria Chronicles, Metal Gear, or Final Fantasy. FF only if they show us something more than the last console FF's have been.

I also have to say Uncharted is very realistic as a launch title, since this Q4 is around the time they would normally be releasing one.

[Slothy]

I also have to say Uncharted is very realistic as a launch title, since this Q4 is around the time they would normally be releasing one.

I can't see it happening unless Naughty Dog aren't the ones doing it. And personally, I wouldn't want the first next-gen Uncharted to be done by another team. I'd rather Naughty Dog wait at least an extra year before releasing a new title on the PS4 anyway so they have time to get the most out of the hardware.

[nirojan]

I also have to say Uncharted is very realistic as a launch title, since this Q4 is around the time they would normally be releasing one.

I can't see it happening unless Naughty Dog aren't the ones doing it. And personally, I wouldn't want the first next-gen Uncharted to be done by another team. I'd rather Naughty Dog wait at least an extra year before releasing a new title on the PS4 anyway so they have time to get the most out of the hardware.

There are two teams at ND. After UC2, they split their team to do UC3 and TLoU. UC3 came out Q4 2011. Considering a two year dev cycle, it's very possible that UC4 will be out this year (or early next year). But then again, they'll probably need a few months to build a new engine for the PS4. 2014 is probably a more realistic date:D

Annnnd seeing how this is a FF-site might as well post this here:
41627
It's a survey (shown on Kotaku (http://kotaku.com/5989103/heres-what-japanese-people-are-saying-about-the-ps4)) about what Japanese people are most excited for on the PS4 (this particular question was what title are you looking forward to the most).

[nirojan]

InFamous Second Son is apparently a launch title!
Infamous: Second Son Is A PS4 Launch Title, Says Sucker Punch Dev. | Siliconera (http://www.siliconera.com/2013/03/22/infamous-second-son-is-a-ps4-launch-title-says-sucker-punch-dev/)