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Citizen Bleys
01-11-2014, 01:52 PM
Yay, someone voted!


My conception of day/night in this game is pretty screwy, how much time do we have left of Day 2?

Day 2 ends at 22:30 GMT.

Technically that's a few minutes past the 24 hour mark, but rounding to a 10 minute mark just makes things easier.



edzxcvbnm has only made the one post. Maybe we should look into them prodding rules.

Roger, prodding ed

Vote Count 2.1:

Jinx (0) -
Laddy (0) -
I Took the Red Pill (0) -
edczxcvbnm (0) -
(L-2) Jessweeee♪(1) - Madonna, Shion
Madonna (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Jinx, Laddy, Red Pill, edczxcvbnm, Jessweeee♪

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch or no lynch

Jinx
01-11-2014, 06:10 PM
For the record, I didn't say that being asked questions was exhausting. I said when I ask questions, and people automatically assuming I'm being sneaky for just asking a question relating to how the game is played--that's exhausting.

I Took the Red Pill
01-11-2014, 06:38 PM
I hadn't though of that last part. At first I voted for edzxcvbnm because he was inactive and I figured why not. I don't particularly care for changing votes. I dunno why, really. But I figured I needed to vote for someone, so it was worth a shot. If ed was gone, considering his inactivity, it wouldn't be a huge loss. Sure, he may be a townie, but he wasn't contributing much to the thread or trying to help us find the goons. He's probably just busy with life, which is fine, but having a bunch of silent members doesn't do much for excitement :monster:

I don't intend to vote for him again, because you're right, being inactive doesn't make him mafia. Neither does being active. I already gave my reasons for my vote, even if they weren't really good reasons. I have no idea who to vote for this time.I don't know how anyone can actually be against changing votes. If new "trout has come to light" (shoutout to The Dude), or if someone points out a flaw in your reasoning, or points out something you haven't noticed before, how can you be "against" changing votes?

Day 2 has been pretty dismal in terms of livelihood, and there hasn't been a coherent discussion about who to lynch. I'm not blaming anyone here (I'm the one who lives in Asia) but it's just kind of a bummer that you can see tumbleweeds rolling through the Day 2 posts.

So with nothing actually substantial to go on, I'm going to vote for shion. Her continued claims of ignorance of a good strategy are starting to make me think she's trying to blend in as the clueless girl of the bunch. Would be pretty bold if that was the case.

##VOTE: Shion

Since I'll be sleeping when the deadline hits, I want to apologize. Missing the first two down-to-the-wire moments in the first two Days sucks, but it's out of my control. Sorry guys.

Laddy
01-11-2014, 07:37 PM
Fair enough, Jinx. That still doesn't explain your insistence that we kill regardless, even if it, as you stated, would very much likely result in a Townie death.

Jinx
01-11-2014, 07:40 PM
I think I made it pretty clear that I took that stance because then we'd have more to go off of today. Lynx pointed out that that would only work if we had ample discussion yesterday, which ended up happening.

Pumpkin
01-11-2014, 08:03 PM
There's nothing wrong with changing votes if something new comes to light, but nothing did, so me changing my vote from a blind vote to another blind vote just seems silly to me personally.

Madonna
01-11-2014, 08:50 PM
It seemed like we had all the time in the world until we had to sleep or do stuff in real life, huh, Red Pill?

##UNVOTE

Jiro's roleclaim and the whole bandwagon on Jiro or edzxcvbnm thing, two events, and nothing new came to light? I am still amazed that the only two people who gave a damn about Jiro being the Jailkeeper were Red Pill and I, unless I missed something. Laddy did not seem to care; I pointed out how ridiculous it had to be, and he just chirped that he believed him, despite logic being against it. I am not impressed with Day 2, and think that a lot of nothing has been posted during my absence. What happened, folks?

##VOTE: I Took the Red Pill

The only movement worth counting I have seen since coming back is noticing only two other people voted? shion and Laddy have done nothing to put themselves in a positive light, but... I have this darker suspicion this is currently the best move.

Madonna
01-11-2014, 08:52 PM
Holding out on voting until do or die time is just a way to drop a vote without having to discuss it. And not discussing, again, is the worst thing you can do. Ugh.

Citizen Bleys
01-11-2014, 09:02 PM
Vote Count 2.2:

Jinx (0) -
Laddy (0) -
I Took the Red Pill (1) - Madonna
edczxcvbnm (0) -
(L-2) Jessweeee♪(1) - Shion
Madonna (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Jinx, Laddy, Red Pill, edczxcvbnm, Jessweeee♪

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch or no lynch

3 1/2 hours til deadline
5/7 players not voting
you are being heckled by the dead

Madonna
01-11-2014, 09:14 PM
Sorry, rather than write off all the posting you guys have done, I will take a look and try to respond.


Okay. I'll second the

##vote Jessweeee♪
Dislike. Why pile up on votes instead of spreading it out? I guess we could quickly pile up on her and get people immediately talking, but you are one of my better suspects, and doing a speed lynch is not usually the work for town.


Just did a quick skim through and this is what I have to say for the moment.


The other person I'd like to hear more from is Jesswee, who began the Jiro revolution before his roleclaim. I feel like most people waited at least until we had generated some conversation to vote, even though, I know, Day 1, etc. I'd still like to hear what she has to say.

To be honest, I put it there on a whim. Just kicking some pebbles around until a ball starts rolling, y'know. I almost unvoted just because he posted some gifs I liked but I didn't oh well. The only eensy bit of suspicion I felt for anyone was later on after my vote, Jiro role claiming after Bleys made a post reminding us of the roles. I felt like Jiro would do something bold like that as town or mafia, but it was more than I had on anyone else, so I was just kind of "eh, I'll just leave it."
This seems legit; I, too, had plenty of reason to believe Jiro was Vanilla and theorized on it a great bit, but I also feared that Jiro was pulling off a goon move of a century because it was so unsafe for a townie, and we all know that turned out horrible. What I really wanted was to see votes pulled off Jiro and put on a new line of inquiry, but on just offering up edzxcvbnm when I was looking at Laddy and his change of fortunes.




What I want to know is this: was there a certain reason the mafia killed Shorty?Yeah, I'm curious about this too. If I was scum, I feel like it would be my priority to take out Madonna. He's by far the most frequent posting and well-articulated player at this point. Nobody else is analyzing the game at a level as deep as he is, and I'd try to take him out for fear that he'd sniff out my identity somehow. So why isn't he dead? Well, he could be scum, and I think that's something to seriously consider. If he's not scum, then it's possible that the mafia was afraid that due to his leadership role in the town, a hypothetical doctor/jailkeeper would throw a protect his way and it would be too risky to try taking him out at night. It seems like everyone trusts him at this point. Shorty would be a much safer kill. Option three is that they're just killing random people to smurf with our heads.

Ok I've always been better at playing mafia than playing town, so maybe I can offer some insight here. The mafia do not kill:
Unconfirmed town with a history of voting confirmed town (easy lynch target, safe vote)
Inactive players (unthreatening, easy lynch target)
Their own (duh)
People they fear will be a wasted action (they suspect the player is protected somehow)

Shorty fits none of these criteria, so she's a good target. The mafia spends a great deal more talking about who to lynch the next day than who to kill. This is something very important to consider. Don't fall for the obvious set ups c:All of this is pretty good advice, and something to consider when you start brewing your own batch of revelations. So maybe, just maybe, I can see the wisdom of lynching inactives, but I fear there would be little discussion in doing so.


I went and reread the posts from Day 1 and I think Jinx's posts should be brought up. Essentially, she was the first one to cast a second vote, on Jiro, claiming he was causing a suspicious stir and and despite the probability of lynching a townie as she claimed, she insisted to lynch one anyway. She also insisted that being asked questions was "exhausting". Whatever that means. xD

Now I'm not stating her strategy was wrong in itself, but her insistence that we lynch a probably townie regardless of anyone's actions for information does set me as a bit bloodthirsty. Her methodology is just was to insistent on lynching a town the first opportunity she got. Sorry, Jinxie~
We were dealing with a blind situation, and Jiro made a really, really strange gambit. When there is something a person does not understand, an instinctual response is to lash back and leave it be. I can see why people would vote Jiro when presented with the conundrum of his situation, especially because he obviously tried so hard to get that effect. I am not ruling out Jinx, but a lynch has to start somewhere. Good find! However... are you not the second person to vote for edzxcvbnm, Laddy?

Madonna
01-11-2014, 09:20 PM
Quoting all of this to highlight a waste of daytime. They could have been discussing theories, looking into that Jinx slant one of them sort of mentions. There was a "campaign" for edzxcvbnm, but that goes nowhere. Then it devolves further, something I could barely imagine, into a kind of #eoff chat.

But what about Laddy talking about Jinx talking about Jiro?


I don't know what you mean. I campaigned for edzxcvbnm.


I meant your last post is clearly trying to get us to question Jinx so that we won't be questioning you

GASP!!!!!!

I actually have no idea what I'm talking about, I'm just trying to participate.


No, it's cool. Ask away.



No, it's cool. Ask away.

Are you mafia, Laddy?

You should be honest because nobody likes a liar.


No. I'm a good person.


You should believe me; I'm handsome.


You bring up some good arguments.

I'll trust you.





For now


Good.

Madonna
01-11-2014, 09:38 PM
For the record, I didn't say that being asked questions was exhausting. I said when I ask questions, and people automatically assuming I'm being sneaky for just asking a question relating to how the game is played--that's exhausting.
Maybe your questions are bad questions. Maybe you do have something to hide and you lash back when interrogated. Maybe you have nothing to hide, are defensive, and lash back when interrogated. Maybe I take Mafia a little too seriously to walk a newbie through the process. None of this is positive.



I hadn't though of that last part. At first I voted for edzxcvbnm because he was inactive and I figured why not. I don't particularly care for changing votes. I dunno why, really. But I figured I needed to vote for someone, so it was worth a shot. If ed was gone, considering his inactivity, it wouldn't be a huge loss. Sure, he may be a townie, but he wasn't contributing much to the thread or trying to help us find the goons. He's probably just busy with life, which is fine, but having a bunch of silent members doesn't do much for excitement :monster:

I don't intend to vote for him again, because you're right, being inactive doesn't make him mafia. Neither does being active. I already gave my reasons for my vote, even if they weren't really good reasons. I have no idea who to vote for this time.I don't know how anyone can actually be against changing votes. If new "trout has come to light" (shoutout to The Dude), or if someone points out a flaw in your reasoning, or points out something you haven't noticed before, how can you be "against" changing votes?

Day 2 has been pretty dismal in terms of livelihood, and there hasn't been a coherent discussion about who to lynch. I'm not blaming anyone here (I'm the one who lives in Asia) but it's just kind of a bummer that you can see tumbleweeds rolling through the Day 2 posts.

So with nothing actually substantial to go on, I'm going to vote for shion. Her continued claims of ignorance of a good strategy are starting to make me think she's trying to blend in as the clueless girl of the bunch. Would be pretty bold if that was the case.

##VOTE: Shion

Since I'll be sleeping when the deadline hits, I want to apologize. Missing the first two down-to-the-wire moments in the first two Days sucks, but it's out of my control. Sorry guys.
Highlighting I Took the Red Pill's post to show I am not skipping important things, that I have read it, and to say that this has been a pretty good contribution to the war front. Not so great that he votes and leaves, because we want people to argue about votes, but solid nonetheless.


Fair enough, Jinx. That still doesn't explain your insistence that we kill regardless, even if it, as you stated, would very much likely result in a Townie death.
I acknowledge you may have found a loose thread here, but what are you going to unravel? That she voted on a person that was possibly town? With an inability to confirm innocence, that person we strung up could have been scum. Your persistence on this, Laddy, makes it seem you just want her to trip up in explanation.


I think I made it pretty clear that I took that stance because then we'd have more to go off of today. Lynx pointed out that that would only work if we had ample discussion yesterday, which ended up happening.
Well, yesterday's givens are great and all, but I was hoping there would be a lot more givens today as well, but no one is providing. Today, in the best case scenario, would have been a very robust discussion of what we learned yesterday, lots of defensive responses, and plenty more to work on while we all began voting. No one is voting.


It seemed like we had all the time in the world until we had to sleep or do stuff in real life, huh, Red Pill?

##UNVOTE

Jiro's roleclaim and the whole bandwagon on Jiro or edzxcvbnm thing, two events, and nothing new came to light? I am still amazed that the only two people who gave a damn about Jiro being the Jailkeeper were Red Pill and I, unless I missed something. Laddy did not seem to care; I pointed out how ridiculous it had to be, and he just chirped that he believed him, despite logic being against it. I am not impressed with Day 2, and think that a lot of nothing has been posted during my absence. What happened, folks?

##VOTE: I Took the Red Pill

The only movement worth counting I have seen since coming back is noticing only two other people voted? shion and Laddy have done nothing to put themselves in a positive light, but... I have this darker suspicion this is currently the best move.
So I want to point out here with my post that I have been harping on about Laddy so far, and it might be surprising I am not going after him and instead I Took the Pill. I am going after Red Pill because of several reasons, but the most pertinent is that he was the one other lynch candidate, at a long shot, and was voted for the lynch by edzxcvbnm.


you are being heckled by the dead
I did not get killed yet, dead. Nyah.

Citizen Bleys
01-11-2014, 10:39 PM
I did not get killed yet, dead. Nyah.

I'm also heckling and I am not dead.

Jessweeee♪
01-11-2014, 11:16 PM
##Vote: I Took The Red Pill

I feel of all of the players here he is saying the most game related things without saying anything at all. It just feels a little wishy-washy. Just a little. An example of what I mean by that sort of behavior:


So why isn't he [Madonna] dead? Well, he could be scum, and I think that's something to seriously consider. If he's not scum, then it's possible that the mafia was afraid that due to his leadership role in the town, a hypothetical doctor/jailkeeper would throw a protect his way and it would be too risky to try taking him out at night. It seems like everyone trusts him at this point. Shorty would be a much safer kill. Option three is that they're just killing random people to smurf with our heads.

What I see when I read this is "mafia killed someone and it could be because x, but also y and z are also pretty likely I mean who could possibly discern their intentions."

Another example:


Regardless, I think we need to be very careful of Madonna. He could be a wolf in sheep's clothing. In fact, the only person to really bring him up in a suspicious light, as far as I can see, was me, in the very beginning, with little to no basis for my claim (as Day 1 usually goes). It would be quite nice to just cruise to the finish with everyone trusting you as the father figure of the town.

"People appear to trust Madonna. Maybe they shouldn't. For no reason other than because they do trust him."

It's not something I find hugely incriminating, but it's a red flag to me, and it's what sticks out to me the most.

Madonna
01-11-2014, 11:27 PM
Anyone else here? We got, like, six minutes left.

##UNVOTE

Madonna
01-11-2014, 11:28 PM
Unvoting puts Jessweeee♪ in a distinctly bad position.

Madonna
01-11-2014, 11:30 PM
You know what, I wanted Red Pill, and I am going to take it.

##VOTE: I Took the Red Pill

Citizen Bleys
01-11-2014, 11:37 PM
Vote Count 2.3:

Jinx (0) -
Laddy (0) -
I Took the Red Pill (2) - Jessweeee♪, Madonna
edczxcvbnm (0) -
Jessweeee♪(1) - Shion
Madonna (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Jinx, Laddy, Red Pill, edczxcvbnm

With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch or no lynch

JACQUES TREEHORN
Good Knave, my thanks for travels thou hast made;
By Jacques Treehorn I am called in name
I bid the welcome to my humble home
And beg thee take a bev'rage of thy choice.

THE KNAVE
The brew of whitest Russia I would sip,
As fair York's rose. How fares thy working trade?

JACQUES TREEHORN
A playwright and a theatre-man am I,
With tendrils dipp'd in lakes of many stripes,
In printed word, in dumb-show and in court.

THE KNAVE
Which be 'Log Jamming?"

I Took the Red Pill has been lynched! He was Jacques Treehorn, a Mafia Rolecop

Night lasts ~18 hours from the time of this post. (This will be 16:40 GMT for purposes of night actions, but daystart may be an hour and a half to two hours or so later because I'll be at work...my shift starts literally 10 minutes before deadline)

I'm not going to ask for this thread to be locked until I am able to fill in the flavour, but kindly pretend it is

Jinx
01-11-2014, 11:39 PM
I think we have longer than six minutes.

I've been keeping up with this thread as it goes along. Here's my two cents:

First, Madonna, I think you're just jaded against everyone who is new to this game. I get it; you're experienced, you don't want to show people the ropes. I could also be asking dumb questions. xD

I still find it suspicious that two people who voted for ed were offed and he only showed up to vote Red Pill. If find shion suspicious that she changed her mind of his guilt for no apparent reason, and I find her exchange with Laddy really fucking suspicious. Laddy has only really posted one or two posts of substance that aren't just him saying "oh, I'm so handsome" or "everyone should love me". But then, shion hasn't really posted much of substance either, except to say that she doesn't want to make a blind vote. Yesterday was okay, though? Hm, hm. I dunno, girl.

Madonna has me more on his side now. I guess the game is to be suspicious of everyone, but he seems intent on calling everyone out too. Right now he's pretty low on my list.

As of right now, my vote goes to who I find most suspicious, and that's shion. I don't really understand her motives, and her relationship with Laddy (whose motives are also questionable) is something for everyone to keep an eye on.

##Vote: shion

Jinx
01-11-2014, 11:40 PM
Oh shit, nevermind.

Also, how was that 24 hours?!

Endless
01-12-2014, 02:52 AM
Oh trout, nevermind.

Also, how was that 24 hours?!

It actually was 24h14m03s.

Citizen Bleys
01-12-2014, 07:19 PM
Dawn breaks, and you are one fewer in number.

Madonna, who was Bonnie Lebowski, a Vanilla Townie has been shot Night 2.

Endless replaces edczxcvbnm effective immediately as Lynx was the player who was replacing out.

Vote Count 3.0:

Jinx (0) -
Laddy (0) -
Endless (0) -
Jessweeee♪ (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Jinx, Laddy, Endless, Jessweeee♪, shion

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch or no lynch

EDIT: Deadline is Monday @ 18:30 GMT

Endless
01-12-2014, 08:36 PM
Hm.

HM.

HM.

I had read quickly all the posts as you played, but now I'll have to reread them looking at the details.

Citizen Bleys
01-13-2014, 02:04 AM
*crickets chirp*

Vote Count 3.1:

Jinx (0) -
Laddy (0) -
Endless (0) -
Jessweeee♪ (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Jinx, Laddy, Endless, Jessweeee♪, shion

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch or no lynch

Jessweeee♪
01-13-2014, 02:47 AM
Well I guess yesterdays actions show that Madonna and I are both town. But Madonna's dead and I already knew I was town so that didn't teach me anything at all!

JINX WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THIS

(or anyone really doesn't gotta be jinx)

Citizen Bleys
01-13-2014, 01:47 PM
less than six hours to deadline

prodding the 60% of the playerbase who haven't posted since daystart

Jessweeee♪
01-13-2014, 02:06 PM
##Vote: Laddy

:(

Jinx
01-13-2014, 03:29 PM
Still suspicious of shion and Laddy. Madonna was my number two suspect and he's dead. Shion voted for Jeswee, what, twice now? While both Laddy and shion are friendses, I'm more inclined to think shion is the scum.

##vote: shion

Endless
01-13-2014, 03:38 PM
So here's the voting history:
VoterVoteeDay 1JiroShionJessJiroJiroJessJiroShortyRed PillMDNAShionEdShortyLaddyMDNAJinxJinxJiroEdRed PillMDNALaddyLaddyEdJiroLaddyRed PillJiroJiroShortyJiroEdShortyEdMDNAJiroDay 2MDNAJessShionJessRed PillShionMDNARed PillJessRed Pill(Jinx)(Shion)Day 3JessLaddyJinxShion

So, based on these, here's what I can see:
On day 1, Red Pill voted both times against a townie, so with a small stretch, his vote on day 2 most likely was for a townie.

Both Jess and Jinx voted for Jiro on D1, but Jess voted for Red Pill on D2, lynching him. This makes Jess less suspicious and Jinx suspicious.

Jinx almost squeezed a last minute vote for Shion, which would have given a good chance for that scum Red Pill to survive. This makes Jinx more suspicious.

Red Pill was the first to argue about a D1 lynch, and the first who followed was... Jinx. HM.

Laddy only voted once (against me/Ed).

So far my only vote, while a stab in the dark, was also the first on target.

Based on all of this, I'm heavily leaning towards
##Voting: Jinx

Pumpkin
01-13-2014, 04:34 PM
##vote Jinx

Because she's trying to vote me off :P

Jinx
01-13-2014, 04:56 PM
##vote Jinx

Because she's trying to vote me off :P

And I'm the suspicious one? Shion has been acting scummy since Day One. Most of her contributions to this thread have been random voting, clearing people's name with no reason, and joking around with Laddy!

You guys all need to pay attention to this. Voting against me just because I'm voting her and bringing light to her scummy ways. Notably, her vote puts me in the lead to be lynched with only a couple of hours left.

Citizen Bleys
01-13-2014, 05:01 PM
Vote Count 3.2:

(L-1) Jinx (2) - Endless, shion
Laddy (1) - Jessweeee♪
Endless (0) -
Jessweeee♪ (0) -
shion (1) - Jinx
Not Voting: Laddy

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch or no lynch

Citizen Bleys
01-13-2014, 07:36 PM
Vote Count FINAL

(L-1) Jinx (2) - Endless, shion
Laddy (1) - Jessweeee♪
Endless (0) -
Jessweeee♪ (0) -
shion (1) - Jinx
Not Voting: Laddy

With 5 alive it takes 3 to lynch or no lynch

A lynch has been reached!

Jinx was lynched, Day 3. She was Geoffrey "The Knave" Lebowski, the Town Jailkeeper

Night deadline will be 18 hours after I confirm a replacement for Laddy, I'll edit this post with the deadline time in GMT when it's done and the replacement's Role PM has been sent.

EDIT: Confirmed! Deadline is 12:40 GMT tomorrow.

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 03:07 PM
Sorry about the delay; I slept like 10 pounds of ass in a five pound bag last night, so I slept in 'cause I don't work today.

A new day dawns, and you discover the town is smaller yet.

Endless, who was Sir Donald of Greece and a Vanilla Townie, was shot Night 3. It is now lylo.

Vote Count 4.0

Scotty_ffgamer (0) -
Jessweeee♪ (0) -
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Scotty, Jessweeee♪, shion

With 3 alive it takes 2 to lynch or no lynch

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 04:26 PM
Oh gosh. Not many people left :O

Scotty_ffgamer
01-14-2014, 04:30 PM
Before I post anything of substance, I just want to say that I was about to post in this thread while I'm sitting at the mall before going to work, and a mall worker who was working on the escalator near me dropped a wrench from where he was working and it landed right next to me, nearly landing on my head. I am convinced the mafia is taking this game way too seriously and just tried to kill me in real life :(. I'm on to you, mafia.

Anyways, starting on what will probably be the last day is going to be really hard and make my playing time pretty short, but this should be fun. I have work in a couple of hours in which I won't be able to have access to the computer again until probably 10:30 - 11pm CST, so there's a good chunk of time I'm going to be missing out on, but I'll try to stay active up until the moment I go into work, and I'll get right back on the first chance I get after work. For now, I'm going to let myself wake up a bit more before I start working on my thoughts.

Scotty_ffgamer
01-14-2014, 05:14 PM
Me waking up more seems like a lost cause at this point. I didn't sleep well last night, so I apologize for what I'm sure are many grammatical errors to come.

Anyways, I've been following this mafia game since the first day, and everyone here at the last round were my top candidates for Mafia #2 for various reasons. I find both of you pretty suspicious; the hard part comes with deciding which of you I find more suspicious.

Jessweeee has a few things going against her in my book. Part of this thinking might be unfair because she could be following a mafia strategy that I was starting to develop when I first began to play the game. This strategy mainly involved putting the other mafia member onto the chopping block going into the last day in order to gain near absolute trust in everyone. If she were mafia, doing this and killing Madonna puts her into the most trustworthy position and gives her a lot of power to direct and control the conversation in the end game. Madonna also nearly caused Jessweeee to be lynched, but reverted to voting off Red Pill that day. Of course, all of us (before Laddy got reincarnated into Scotty) have been in Madonna's watchful eye from the beginning, but I feel like Jessweeee was near the top of that list consistently. This adds to my suspicions here, but I feel like there wasn't enough for Madonna to go on, and he was simply picking one of us more at random to apply pressure.

Shion, however, has been playing the naive player part this whole game. I know she hasn't played many mafia games, but she was playing the naive part when she played chat mafia the other day in a game where she was mafia. This makes me a bit more suspicious of her. However, it's not really just her playing the naive part that gets me. She also hasn't really contributed anything to the day discussions (or at least she's contributed so little that it's hard to find as I skimmed through the previous days just now). She's posted and voted and stayed active, but to me it just looks like she's posting to not draw suspicion from being inactive, but also trying to keep attention off of herself through her silly posts. I get no sense of any real arguments justifying her votes either. She hasn't done anything to build any trust throughout this entire game. Jinx also suspected her with her final vote before she was lynched. Again, shion had the mostly throwaway reason of voting for Jinx because Jinx voted for shion first. Shion had power, and it was her vote that was really the death sentence for Jinx, again with no real reasoning behind it.

As for Laddy (now me), I of course have a bias since regardless of if I'm mafia or Town, I don't want to be lynched. That being said, I should be pretty suspicious to you two as well. A good example of this can be found in the conversation Madonna (I think) quoted a while back between shion and Laddy. Laddy has kind of played a similar role to shion at times. However, Laddy has at some points at least employed some logic to the game and made contributions, however small they may have been. More suspicion can be drawn by the fact that Laddy did not vote the past two days. Of course, on Day 2, hardly anyone voted. He also really didn't talk at all on day 3. Considering I'm not replacing him, this could simply be from inactivity in general and a lack of being able to get on the forums or something. I'm not Laddy, so I don't really know his thoughts or anything aside from what he has posted and voted for. I will say that he had no real power in the final day to vote had he got on later. The only thing he could have done to keep Jinx from dying would have been to vote for himself and get himself lynched, which people are unlikely to do in this game. In any case, he is(and therefore I am) pretty suspicious.

Hmm....

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 06:03 PM
I was thinking Jesweeee too. I suspected Laddy, but Laddy is gone and I don't suspect you because... I dunno. You just started playing so I dun want to kick you out anyway.

We are down to very few people anyhow so I'm going to

##vote Jesweeee(musicalnote)

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 06:47 PM
Vote Count 4.1

Scotty_ffgamer (0) -
(L-1)Jessweeee♪ (1) - shion
shion (0) -
Not Voting: Scotty, Jessweeee♪

With 3 alive it takes 2 to lynch or no lynch

Scotty_ffgamer
01-14-2014, 06:49 PM
I'm running out of time before work. I don't want to gang up on Jessweeee simply because my mind keeps going back and forth between which of you two are most likely mafia. I want to hear her thoughts first. So, I'm going to wait until I get home from work to make my vote unless I'm able to get online during my break and some more discussion has happened. The connection at the mall seems to be getting bad though, and I don't even know if this message will end up sending.

Jessweeee♪
01-14-2014, 08:55 PM
##Vote: shion

My reasoning: I know I am town. Shion or Scotty has to be mafia. Shion voted me and if Scotty were mafia, he could have voted me and won the game with that last post. Therefore, it must be shion. Until this I found you both equally fishy for general lack of contribution and whatnot, but to me it proves shion is mafia or scotty is really really really dumb mafia. I don't think Scotty is that dumb.

And in my defense Scotty, that mafia strategy is good for a long con, but in my opinion far too risky for a short game like this. (And to me it says, "Jessweeee♪ might be mafia because she's just so town that it's weird.")

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 09:10 PM
EXCITEMENT!

Vote Count 4.1

Scotty_ffgamer (0) -
(L-1)Jessweeee♪ (1) - shion
(L-1)shion (1) - Jessweeee♪
Not Voting: Scotty

With 3 alive it takes 2 to lynch or no lynch

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 09:38 PM
##Vote: shion

My reasoning: I know I am town. Shion or Scotty has to be mafia. Shion voted me and if Scotty were mafia, he could have voted me and won the game with that last post. Therefore, it must be shion. Until this I found you both equally fishy for general lack of contribution and whatnot, but to me it proves shion is mafia or scotty is really really really dumb mafia. I don't think Scotty is that dumb.

And in my defense Scotty, that mafia strategy is good for a long con, but in my opinion far too risky for a short game like this. (And to me it says, "Jessweeee♪ might be mafia because she's just so town that it's weird.")

I'm going to laugh when you screw yourself because I know I'm town :P.

I figured I would be next voted out anyways :monster:

EDIT: I should specify that I don't mean this in a mean or snarky way, and I apologize if it comes across like that :)

Scotty_ffgamer
01-14-2014, 10:14 PM
I've never played a longer mafia game. I can see your point with that working better for a longer game. I can still see it working for a shorter game, but it just depends on how you work it out. It would take precise maneuvering from both mafia people I think, and it would still be extremely risky because a lot of factors could screw it up. I was just saying that I still had reasonable doubt whether you were town or mafia.

Anyways I see your point in your last post, though, and it seems in line with my current thinking. Despite the fact that you and shion were about neck and neck in my mind, she has continued to be just slightly higher in suspicion for me. I hope I don't regret this and find you really were doing the long con.

##Vote: shion


Anyways, my break is about to end. Hopefully the connection holds up for this post to send. I'll review any further discussion upon getting home from work to see if anything changes my thinking.

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 10:15 PM
Bye everyone ;___;

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 10:22 PM
A lynch has been reached!

Vote Count 4.2

Scotty_ffgamer (0) -
(L-1)Jessweeee♪ (1) - shion
(HAMMER!)shion (1) - Jessweeee♪, Scotty
Not Voting: Nobody

With 3 alive it takes 2 to lynch or no lynch

shion has been lynched. She was Maude Lebowski, a Vanilla Townie.
Jessweeee♪ has been endgamed. She was Sir Walter of Poland, a Vanilla Townie.

The Mafia team of I Took the Red Pill and Scotty_ffgamer has won the game!

As the game is over, now anyone living or dead, player or non-player, may now participate in this thread for postgame analysis.

Scum QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/MDhJcSdDabG)

Dead QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/ctA7WEXssxjR8)

Mod QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/rW8HVW83xgnVy)

I've got to afk for a while, but I'll be back later to participate in postgame analysis, answer any questions, and provide any feedback requested--although you may find answers and the feedback you're looking for in the Dead QT.

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 10:23 PM
We aren't friends anymore Scotty :nonono:

Madonna
01-14-2014, 10:30 PM
Well, that was unexpected. Good luck next time, town, and congratulations, scum.

Pumpkin
01-14-2014, 10:41 PM
As the game is over, now anyone living or dead, player or non-player, may now participate in this thread for postgame analysis.

Scum QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/MDhJcSdDabG)

Dead QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/ctA7WEXssxjR8)

Mod QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/rW8HVW83xgnVy)

I've got to afk for a while, but I'll be back later to participate in postgame analysis, answer any questions, and provide any feedback requested--although you may find answers and the feedback you're looking for in the Dead QT.

So I read these. Good to know people think I suck at this game :(.

Today has been a good day

Madonna
01-14-2014, 10:48 PM
Citizen Bleys, thank you for being a fantastic moderator, thanks for the introduction to QuickTopics, and even the graveyard was tons of fun. I think you brought a lot of good from MafiaScum, even when you left some people behind with OMGUS, AtE, and so forth. Nyah.

shion, you can always get better, and it is important to know that is how they feel about you as a Mafia player, not as a fantastic and wonderful person with a cute Hamtaro set.

Shorty
01-14-2014, 10:50 PM
I hope that everyone can see that the opinions of player moves does not reflect on the opinion of the actual person making these moves. I think that there is a reasonable cushioning for newbies and that people understand we don't have enough experience to make perhaps otherwise obvious moves.

When spectators are watching a football game, they constantly yell about bad plays and what could have been done otherwise. It doesn't mean anything; this is just a stupid game.

Shorty
01-14-2014, 11:01 PM
Thank you to Bleys for organizing an awesome game for a first-timer. This was super fun and I hope we can do more.

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 11:09 PM
So I read these. Good to know people think I suck at this game :(.

Today has been a good day

It was your first game, wasn't it?

Nobody expects you to be an ace the first time you play. I was pretty bad in my first game here at EoFF, and worse on my first game on MS.

I was overall impressed with the first time players, especially on D1 because of Shorty giving the scumteam PR vibes that caused them to shoot her instead of Jinx -- especially since Jinx was the only PR, and because of Jinx stopping the mafia from getting a rolecop result. Since the rolecop was lynched day 2, that completely neutralised the rolecop.

The biggest learning opportunities were mentioned in the Dead QT: Jinx could have inferred shion's alignment due to there being a kill and only one scum on the night shion was jailkept and breadcrumbed the result so the town could guess shion's innocence should Jinx die, and a massclaim on D3 may have flushed Laddy out. The last one, as has been mentioned, was that Scotty could have hammered and won as soon as shion voted, were he not under the impression that the day had to run all the way to deadline. (I said otherwise on D1, but that would be easy to skim over, and no other day reached a hammer point due to the short deadlines). Having seen Scotty post with shion at L-1, the thought process Jess used to conclude that shion was scum was correct, even if the conclusion was not. However, this didn't really change the game, it was effectively over from the first vote of D4.

Lylo is different from the rest of the game in that enough people to pull off a lynch should usually agree to do so before the first vote is cast, in order to prevent scum from having an opportunity to quickhammer.

This setup works a lot better as a teaching setup with longer deadlines, so that it's reasonable to employ the rule whereby if no hammer has been cast at deadline, a no lynch results. This is how it's done at mafiascum in most games, but although I was hosting mafiascum style (You may have noted that other hosts have not assumed the responsibility of posting vote counts), I did not believe that a no hammer=no lynch method would work with 24 hour deadlines. Trying to do that here would essentially ensure that scum won every game by getting 2-3 nightkills in per lynch.

Role layout : With one of the 2of4 roles landing on VT, your first impression might be to think that the roll favoured scum. This isn't the case, since Jailkeeper is the most versatile role that pops in the 2of4 setup. As the game progresses, both sides may naturally gravitate towards thinking about cops, since a cop who claims a guilty before lylo basically guarantees a scum lynch, but a jailkeeper can function as a doctor while two scum are alive and a cop after the first scum lynch--a jailkeeper can't provide the town with a cop guilty, but they can provide a cop inno by revealing or crumbing who they jailkept on nights where only one scum was left and someone died.

Setups with a jailkeeper are also the only setups where one PR can confirm the other, in the scenario I posted in the dead QT where a doc's target dies overnight.

The most horribly scum-sided possibility in 2of4 is Doc/VT (I've been the doc in that. We lost badly), but Cop/JK is just as heavily town-sided. Cop/JK in this setup actually has a higher win rate than Cop/Doc because neither cop nor doc can be sure the other is there, defeating the gamebreaking follow-the-cop method in open setups where it is known that both roles are there.

One stylistic issue I'd like feedback on: Did you like the use of a Dead QT instead of an open thread like previous games on EoFF have employed?

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 11:13 PM
Thank you to Bleys for organizing an awesome game for a first-timer. This was super fun and I hope we can do more.

I'm actually quite happy we had multiple first-timers in this game. I picked this setup because I miss playing it from my newbie days not so long ago at mafiascum, but it was designed specifically to teach the game to new players. The current newbie setup there is Matrix6 (http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Matrix6), which I find less fun to play, even if no setup is as scumsided as doc/vt or townsided as cop/jk.

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 11:18 PM
Also, did anyone have an issue with my hosting style being too different from previous EoFF games, heavily influenced as it is by an outside site?

If at any point you thought "Go back to mafiascum, outsider," the answer is yes.

If it's yes, is it for any reason other than the use of a private Dead QT instead of a public thread or host-supplied votecounts (where traditionally the players are responsible for keeping count of votes here)?

Shorty
01-14-2014, 11:31 PM
I've not had the opportunity to utilize anything other than a private thread, but I quite liked it. Can non-players can request to be included in order to observe?

Jinx
01-14-2014, 11:36 PM
Shion, I'm a dumb-dumb too. /fistbump

Endless
01-14-2014, 11:39 PM
Shion: I was a stupid townie ;)

Bleys: I didn't participate in the previous mafia games, so no comparison I can make. I had no issue about how you ran the game, though my time was short >.> The QT is nice to have around, I didn't know about it, and it was nice (and easier to set up than a hidden forum/thread so it's a plus).

What annoys me here is that I was too dumb to not go with Jess and question Laddy before casting my vote, and it feels like the mafia wins because the town killed itself dumbly, rather than because the scum lead us by the nose.

Also I hate losing ;)

Citizen Bleys
01-14-2014, 11:42 PM
I've not had the opportunity to utilize anything other than a private thread, but I quite liked it. Can non-players can request to be included in order to observe?

Yes. If I didn't say that explicitly in the signup thread, I meant to ><

Nobody requested spectator access, so the dead thread was just me and the actual dead.

The only issue with spectator access to a dead QT is that privileged information such as night action results and targets can be posted (indeed, that's the whole point to a private thread) and thus anybody who requests spectator access to a dead thread would thus be ineligible to play. It also precludes situations we've seen in previous games where dead players replaced back in later in the game for the same reason.

Shorty
01-14-2014, 11:43 PM
I'm pretty sure you did, as I mentioned it to Scotty (who refused to ask for the links as he wanted to play). The question was really just me confirming it.

I requested to see the lineup this time. I think that next time I will leave it as a surprise to myself.

Also, congratulations Scotty on honing in a win on your only active day! I know you didn't have much time, but you were clever enough with your observations and elaborate posts to keep both of the girls from voting for you. Well done.

Laddy and Red Pill: Please disclose to me why you thought I was a PR.

Citizen Bleys
01-15-2014, 12:31 AM
Did you find it difficult to avoid posting spoilers?

I did.

Del Murder
01-15-2014, 12:36 AM
Very entertaining Bleys and everyone. :mymelkiss:

Shorty
01-15-2014, 12:39 AM
Did you find it difficult to avoid posting spoilers?

I did.

In the Dead QT, kindof, yeah. I tried to focus on posting who appeared to look the most suspicious rather than who I knew was acting scummy because they were scum.

Jessweeee♪
01-15-2014, 12:53 AM
wtf scotty xD

Jiro
01-15-2014, 04:24 AM
Thanks, Bleys! Great game. I really liked the use of QT; I hope we can continue using that, as it's simple and easy enough to follow. I think this was a perfect game to have newbies start with and I hope that all the new players have gained a taste for the game, because I would love to play with you all again.

My only criticism with anything is that people didn't talk enough. Even if I found your ability lacking, it's not as if I could really say much: I was the idiot who got himself lynched on Day One :jess: Thank you all for participating and hope to see you in the next one soon

Scotty_ffgamer
01-15-2014, 05:26 AM
Jessweeee, the answer to your wtf is that I'm a really, really, really dumb mafia :D

More specifically, this was my first day in the game, and only my second time ever playing forum mafia. The first time was really kind of weird and I don't count it much. Also, I didn't sleep last night very well, so I was just quickly trying to gather the rules when i jumped into the game. Yes, Bleys said at least explicitly once near the beginning I guess the rules, and he said how many it took to lynch with each of his posts almost. But, I was thinking about something he told me in the Mafia QT (I can change my vote anytime before the deadline for Nighttime actions.) I mixed that up with daytime actions, particularly because you always reached your deadline and never reached a majority. I never mentioned that.

So, I was strategizing with which person would be less likely to change their vote on the last day. Either way, my goal was to make both of you think it wasn't me so I could have leverage. Honestly, even if I knew the rules, I probably would have done it this way anyways simply because I wanted to see if I could convince both of you that it wan't me. I wanted to cast more doubt on shion because I figured you'd be a little less likely to change your mind. Either way, it worked and I won so I shouldn't care.

As for shion, this is pretty much your first game (just as it was mine). It just takes practice to get better. You are a lovely person and I didn't think you were terrible at the game. Most of my statements in the QT with myself were to work out strategy and to make it more interesting for others to read. Anything I said more had to do with what angles I could work with with convincing other people of my innocence and such.

To end this post, I want to thank Bleys for the hard work and thank the other members for a good time. It was fun, even if I only had one day.

Jiro
01-15-2014, 05:45 AM
If it's yes, is it for any reason other than the use of a private Dead QT instead of a public thread or host-supplied votecounts (where traditionally the players are responsible for keeping count of votes here)?

Just noticed this: no, hosts are traditionally responsible for keeping vote counts here, it's just that every host is lazy :monster:

Scotty_ffgamer
01-15-2014, 06:57 AM
Such mafia. Very kill. Wow and so forth.


I hope next time a mafia game comes up I can get in from Day 1. Chances are I'll forget the rules again.

Pumpkin
01-15-2014, 07:01 AM
##vote scotty

Scotty_ffgamer
01-15-2014, 07:04 AM
##vote: Scotty

Pumpkin
01-15-2014, 07:05 AM
Doesn't feel so good does it :nonono:

You aren't invited to my birthday party

I Took the Red Pill
01-15-2014, 07:13 AM
Laddy and Red Pill: Please disclose to me why you thought I was a PR.Laddy said that. I just kind of rolled with it. For me the most important thing was nightkill anyone who wasn't Madonna, because I felt like the hypothetical jailkeeper/doctor was going to recognize him as the leader of the Town and protect him.

Little did I know that Jinx was going to protect me Night 1 and prevent me from investigating. :sweat:

Bleys, great job moderating, I have zero complaints. The Lebowski reveals were hilarious, too. Did those come direct from The Gentlemen of Lebowski?

Citizen Bleys
01-15-2014, 01:58 PM
Laddy and Red Pill: Please disclose to me why you thought I was a PR.Laddy said that. I just kind of rolled with it. For me the most important thing was nightkill anyone who wasn't Madonna, because I felt like the hypothetical jailkeeper/doctor was going to recognize him as the leader of the Town and protect him.

Little did I know that Jinx was going to protect me Night 1 and prevent me from investigating. :sweat:

Bleys, great job moderating, I have zero complaints. The Lebowski reveals were hilarious, too. Did those come direct from The Gentlemen of Lebowski?

Word for word.

Also, it was Lynx who got jailkept N1; a jailkeep blocks all actions taken by or on the target, including cop/rolecop investigation.

Jinx
01-15-2014, 02:35 PM
I protected Madonna Night 1, not you, Red Pill.

I Took the Red Pill
01-15-2014, 06:27 PM
oic. Glad we didn't try to kill him Night 1, then :grover: