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black orb
03-23-2014, 06:51 PM
>>> I'm halfway to beat FFX and I started using the Expert sphere grid. Now, is there any difference with the normal one? Because I really cant see any..:luca:

Jessweeee♪
03-23-2014, 07:20 PM
Less nodes in the expert so you can't properly max everything out, but for most people it doesn't matter considering what it takes to actually fill everything.

Carl the Llama
03-23-2014, 07:40 PM
There are 51 less nodes on the Expert Spheregrid.

Other then the golden background and the less nodes, no. I personally like the standard grey background.

Steve
03-23-2014, 09:03 PM
if I remember correctly the Expert Sphere Grid also had less distinct starting tracts for each character, meaning that they would often develop more similarly and less towards their dedicated "classes". Though I could be wrong, or they may have changed it.

black orb
03-23-2014, 09:28 PM
if I remember correctly the Expert Sphere Grid also had less distinct starting tracts for each character, meaning that they would often develop more similarly and less towards their dedicated "classes". Though I could be wrong, or they may have changed it.
>>> I think this is correct because I have like 4 characters stuck in the same place.

Anyways, normal or expert does not really matter to me since IŽll end customizing the whole SG (the real fun), when I get into the monster arena. :luca:

Jessweeee♪
03-23-2014, 10:20 PM
With expert the paths intersect a lot to provide you a lot more options, so yes you could potentially develop several characters the same way, but you could easily keep them all to their own class if you wanted to.

Dat Matt
03-23-2014, 11:27 PM
I thought the deal with the expert sphere grid was that it had less nodes, but more empty ones that you could add things into yourself. So for example, adding attack+4 would allow you to max out attack faster than using the attack +1 nodes, or having to use a clear node to remove unnecessary spheres.

That and it lets you go basically wherever you want the characters to start on, rather than Auron Being a powerhouse, Lulu being a black Mage etc till they finish their routes

EtcherSketcher
03-25-2014, 05:06 PM
I prefer having the freedom personally. It's nice to be able to get Yuna some decent black mage skills early on.

Tavrobel
03-25-2014, 10:02 PM
>>> I'm halfway to beat FFX and I started using the Expert sphere grid. Now, is there any difference with the normal one? Because I really cant see any..:luca:

Background color. Much more difficult for some forms of color-blindness.

The Expert Grid has all of the characters start in about the same spot. From here, you can play any character how you'd like, right away. Auron as a Black Mage? No problem. The trade-off is that there are less nodes total, so if you want to customize your whole Grid, you're doing yourself a long-term disservice by having fewer nodes.

The Standard Grid has everyone start at a different spot. The game intends for you to play each character following a progression model that is pre-determined. Tidus/Wakka/Auron are autoattackers, Lulu is a Black Mage, Yuna is a White Mage/Summoner, Rikku is a Thief. It's very difficult to stray off of the intended paths because of the Lock Nodes that need Key Spheres.

You can complete the intended area and start a new path (around levels 60-70) for everyone except Kimahri, who finishes at level 30 with balanced stats. You can force characters off of the intended path by using Key Spheres on Locks. This is how you continue to improve Kimahri after using 1s or 2s; other characters start completely new sections with 3s and 4s. You receive a level 3 at Mt. Gagazet, which is about 70% of the way through the story.

If you're a true min-maxer and not some casual scrub, then you only need between base and 50 Evasion and a little over 100 Accuracy to dodge or hit everything that is not automatic. The catch is that you need 255 Luck; this might save you some nodes due to the lack of Expert Grid real-restate (or cause you a lot of headaches). You can then replace every non-plus-4 Strength, Magic, Defense, Magic Defense, and Agility to reach max on either grid.

HP and MP are a little more involved. The common wisdom is that 9999 HP is fine, and you craft armor with Auto-Haste/Protect/Shell and Auto-Phoenix to easy-mode Arena bosses. You can still replace +200 HP nodes with +300s (again, real-estate).

black orb
03-26-2014, 09:21 AM
HP and MP are a little more involved. The common wisdom is that 9999 HP is fine, and you craft armor with Auto-Haste/Protect/Shell and Auto-Phoenix to easy-mode Arena bosses. You can still replace +200 HP nodes with +300s (again, real-estate).
>>> I think there is enough room almost everything (I remember I maxed up all the stats in the PS2 game). I will erase the MP nodes, there is an item that allow you to pay 0 MP for everything..:luca:

Tavrobel
03-26-2014, 09:28 PM
>>> I think there is enough room almost everything (I remember I maxed up all the stats in the PS2 game). I will erase the MP nodes, there is an item that allow you to pay 0 MP for everything..:luca:

1 MP Cost is an ability that you can craft, but it's onto weapons, which means you won't be using the Legendary Weapons for Tidus, Auron, KImahri, Rikku, or Wakka. That will dramatically lower your damage per turn, on top of the additional crafting you have to do (Break Damage Limit, etc).

You can reach 9999 HP rather easily, but going beyond that is a value judgment. If you want to craft Break HP Limit onto your armors, you need 30 Wings to Discovery, which is dropped by Shinryu, the 7th Original Creation. If you max out on Strength, Defense, Agility, Magic, Magic Defense, and Luck, you'll wind up with a little over 55000 HP. If you don't max out any of these stats, you can reach 99999 HP.

Most of the Legendary Weapons scale their damage with Strength (as normal), but do additional damage based on how much HP or MP you have out of your total. This is somewhat important if you want to actually deal 99999 damage to the bosses in the arena. Auron is an exception: he does the most damage at or below 25% HP.

This is where your value judgment comes in: would I rather have 9999 HP so I can make everyone do normal damage and have an easier time healing, or would I rather have absurd amounts of HP to survive an attack that the boss does relatively infrequently, given that I can just cast Auto-Life?

Carl the Llama
03-27-2014, 01:35 AM
Maximum stats for the Standard Sphere Grid:
99999 HP
999 MP
255 Strength
255 Defense
255 Magic
255 Magic Defense
250 Agility
230 Luck
60 Evasion
0 Accuracy

Maximum stats for the Expert Sphere Grid:
99999 HP
999 MP
255 Strength
255 Defense
255 Magic
255 Magic Defense
170 Agility
230 Luck
60 Evasion
0 Accuracy

Explanation of Luck:
To never miss, you need 75 more Luck than the target.
To never miss under Darkness status, you need 90 more Luck than the target.
To always get a critical hit, you need 100 more Luck than the target.

The enemy with the highest Luck is Dark Mindy, who has 130 Luck. That is why Luck maxes at 230.

Explanation of Agility:
The most important thing Agility does is reduce the amount of time between a character's turns. In this regard, Agility maxes out at 170. The other thing Agility does is increase the number of turns a character gets at the start of battle. In this regard, Agility maxes out at 250.

However, to truly maximize the number of turns at the start of battle, you need First Strike. Having First Strike and 170 Agility is the same as having First Strike and 250 Agility, which is better than having 250 Agility and no First Strike. But if you don't use First Strike, having 250 Agility is certainly better than having 170 Agility.

Note that the best way to use First Strike is to start the battle with characters who have First Strike and then switch them to characters who have the best weapons equipped. This way, you do not incur the penalty of changing the equipped weapons during battle. Auron doesn't have to switch because the Masamune is usually his best weapon.


Explanation of Evasion:
In order to always evade an enemy attack, a character's Evasion and Luck must add up to equal the sum of the enemy attack's accuracy constant and the enemy's Luck. The attack with the highest accuracy constant and Luck in the North American and Japanese versions is Malboro Menace's Mega Gastric Juice, which has an accuracy constant of 240 backed by 15 Luck, for a sum of 255. The attacks with the highest accuracy constants and Luck in the International and PAL versions are Dark Ixion's two attacks, which have accuracy constants of 254 backed by 36 Luck, for sums of 290.

That is why Evasion maxes at 122 in the North American and Japanese versions and 60 in the International and PAL versions. There are other combinations of Luck and Evasion that add up to the same amounts, but it is best to have the lowest possible Luck because it is far harder to increase Luck than Evasion.

As for 0MP cost it comes from an item called Three Stars, which you get 60 of for unlocking Earth Eater in the monster arena, you could craft weapons with the 1MP cost with 20 of those Three Stars but tbh its not really necessary.

Jessweeee♪
03-27-2014, 02:23 AM
So with a high enough luck stat it makes no difference if your accuracy is 0 or 255? Interesting o:

Carl the Llama
03-27-2014, 01:47 PM
Yep, its also why the Expert Sphere Grid has exactly enough nodes for this... for to cap everything with everyone you would surely be exactly that.

black orb
03-27-2014, 07:14 PM
1 MP Cost is an ability that you can craft, but it's onto weapons, which means you won't be using the Legendary Weapons for Tidus, Auron, KImahri, Rikku, or Wakka. That will dramatically lower your damage per turn, on top of the additional crafting you have to do (Break Damage Limit, etc).
>>> No need to craft them into a weapon, I can use the item right away into the battle..
Anyways, I still think MP nodes are just for show, I`d rather erase them and put something better there..:luca: