Relationship Advice, FFVIII-Style!

[Forsaken Lover]

If you and your father have an unhealthy antagonistic relationship, just give up! You don't need that old fossil anyway. Just find your nearest socially maladjusted emotionally crippled introvert bishounen and boom, you're set for life.

Yes, this is an FFVIII hate topic. Why? Because I goddam like Rinoa. I want Rinoa's character to go somewhere apart from being Squall's piece of ass. And that potential was there - a lot of potential was there. Yet it was all squandered. Her being a Sorceress? Only matters because Squall can be her Knight now.

It pisses me off. Rinoa should have had more development with her dad and she should have had more development period. With regards to General Caraway, they could have had a scene where they have a small talk about how Galbadia is pretty much finished and her resistance days are long since behind her. That grows into a more substantive talk about where the real root of their conflict is. And they end up getting along and loving each other like a good family.

And of course the potential of Sorceress Rinoa has already been greatly expressed in all the theories about her future. People wanted to give her a bit more independence, a bit more character growth beyond Squall, but sadly Square couldn't have that.

[charliepanayi]

Pretty sure it's going to take a bit longer for Rinoa to get over her Dad trying to lock her in a room.

[Leigh]

Perhaps no further development was needed. One of Leigh's philosophical truths about human existence. Some people in this world are, for no particular reason, just a group of arseholes.
...Like General Caraway. :p

It's all a sign of the times I guess. Many video game developers still haven't managed to craft any scenario involving social conflict, and dialogue, that doesn't emulate a scene from a Movies4Men broadcasted B-Movie at 2:15am.

[maybee]

If you and your father have an unhealthy antagonistic relationship, just give up! You don't need that old fossil anyway


Well yes, if you have a unhealthy relationship with somebody, even a family member it's best to move away from the person who's harming you. Staying in the relationship is going to do nothing for the victim. The victim is only going to feel more miserable and trapped. Rinoa made the right to choice to get away from her dad who locked her inside the house, instead of trying to get her away from the SeeDs and the parade in a loving manner.

Plus why stay with somebody who treats you like dirt ?

Squall on the other-hand, was willing to die for her and she saw good in his character, just that he needed to open up his shell and fight his fears on losing people.

[Forsaken Lover]

Rinoa ran off to join a terrorist group and nearly killed his boss. His boss being a totalitarian despot who would not hesitate to kill anyone who opposes him. Like, ya know, Rinoa.

The time for stern talking to's is kind of over by that point. More drastic action is necessary - like locking her in a house. Oh the horror!

You might remember also that Rinoa is the one who refused to communicate. Her father, upon finding her on the floor, tried to talk with her and all she did was wave him off. She was the one who refused to cooperate which also led to him having to take drastic measures to try and save her life from the all-powerful witch.

Burning bridges does nothing. It's not like her dad abused her or was an alcoholic or anything of that sort. The only problems they have are due to Rinoa's mother dying when she was very young and Rinoa being in rebellious teenager mode.

[Pumpkin]

Sometimes in real life people have bad relationships and they don't get resolved. That happens quite a lot, actually

[Forsaken Lover]

If you want to be realistic, I think any girl who would abandon her father for a guy she's known five minutes probably needs serious psychological counseling.

[Fynn]

There's a world of a difference between world-building realism, or sci-fi hardness, or fantasy degree, or whatever you wanna call it, and psychological realism. Call me weird, but regardless of genre, I want my games to be realistic psychologically. VIII is great because it has realistic characters and yes, Rinoa had the full right to just leave her dad. Yes, she's also a rebellious teen, which also makes it have a larger degree of sense for her to leave. And no one says she didn't reconcile with her father after the game.

And Squall is a fantastic, layered protagonist, and Rinoa really helped him and they make a very nice couple and I will fight anyone who disagrees :colbert:

Anyone :stare:

[Shauna]

Your fantasy land in which people can get over any and every bad relationship they have, and never do irresponsible things, is the real unrealistic scenario in this thread.

[Leigh]

Your fantasy land in which people can get over any and every bad relationship they have, and never do irresponsible things, is the real unrealistic scenario in this thread.

The most irrational thought we can have as humans is the belief that we are rational. ;)

[Forsaken Lover]

Your fantasy land in which people can get over any and every bad relationship they have, and never do irresponsible things, is the real unrealistic scenario in this thread.

It's called good writing. I'm sorry FFVIII didn't have any of that.

Dropping the father of one of your main characters into a plot void and making him irrelevant is just flatout bad writing, especially given what prominence he had upon his introduction. (also the fact he married Julia)

Having Rinoa amend her relationship with her father would have done nothing but strengthen her character. And god knows she needs it because her character is a gasping cripple clinging to Squall's character. I merely ask for some character growth free of the intolerable Mr. Leonhart so Rinoa can actually do something on her own without the game making her look like a complete fool.

[Fynn]

Dropping the father of one of your main characters into a plot void and making him irrelevant is just flatout bad writing, especially given what prominence he had upon his introduction. (also the fact he married Julia)




http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111029021520/finalfantasy/images/0/03/Hope_Estheim.png

[Shauna]

Calling it bad writing because you can't fathom that someone has an irreparable relationship with another person... This actually happens, you know?

I am not saying that FF8 has fantastic writing, but I honestly do not know why you think this is so ridiculous.

[Forsaken Lover]

Hope not only resolved all his issues with his father, the party never had the chance to see him again even if he hadn't.

You can go right back to Caraway as soon as you have the Garden but all he says is "look after my daughter." There's not even extra dialogue if Rinoa is in your party. Also he's never mentioned ever again in spite of being a general in the nation you are fighting for the rest of the game.

Having Caraway around makes Rinoa an individual, a character with he own worth, and we can't have that.

[Fynn]

Hope'a daddy issues get conveniently resolved in one scene. I really don't think that proves XIII has the superior writing.


Look, I get it. You hate VIII and want to find any possible way to justify that, but you really won't convince anyone this way, no matter how much you try to present it as fact. You believe Rinoa should have resolved her daddy issues. That's fine, you have that right. But she decided she wanted nothing to do with her father. Be it her leaving an abusive situation or just being the impulsive teenager she is, it makes sense that she wouldn't see him again for the duration of the game.

[Rin Heartilly]

Rinoa and her father could never see eye to eye, the ideals that he represented were the absolute opposite to Rinoa, and she probably knew that considering she got her stubborn side from her father, there would be nothing she could do to convince him of her ideals otherwise. Rinoa left for a reason, she probably had tried numerous times to convince him to see things the way she does, but her father is not the type to be swayed by emotion. He's a general, a military man.

Going by character, General Caraway looks like the type of serious father who left all the coddling and nurturing to the mother. It's obvious that he does care for her, but he's the type to put work first, family second. I'm sure Rinoa was aware of this too, and it's obvious the two of them weren't close anyway.

Rinoa made her own family with the forest owls and now she has made a bunch of true friends along with Squall who is loyal to the point that he would turn on the world to stop harm from coming to her, who needs a dad like her's when she's got a guy like Squall? She's still an impulsive teen, whose to say she won't make up with her father later when she's older?

It's more realistic this way, instead of resolving issues with her dad for the sake of a cliche' ending.