View Full Version : Masamune confusion

07-07-2003, 11:53 PM
Whoa, whoa, whoa...hold on a minute...
when you talk to Dario with Riddel, Karsh has a flashback again. Now, it was said that the evil Masamune brought out the deepest envy and hatred of the one who possesses it. When Karsh had his flashback, Dario was the one that took the sword, but Karsh asked himself later why HE was possessed by the sword. also, in the second flashback before you fight dario, Lynx picked up the Masamune. Why didn't he go crazy? and howd the sword end up in the Sea of Eden?

Velvet Mink
07-08-2003, 02:41 AM
Yeah I don't know. Karsh never was possessed by it so I don't know what he was talking about. That's weird. I never noticed that before o_O

But it doesn't affect Lynx because he's, in a sense, a living computer. FATE erased Wazuki's humanity and made copy of herself into Lynx. That's why he's called FATE's biological interface (or something). Lynx then doesn't have any animosity or feelings left and just acts on behalf of FATE so he's not affected. He took the sword and put it in the entrance way to the Dead Sea so more people wouldn't go in there and cause all kinds of trouble. Since the normal defense barriers were down this was kinda the only way to make sure people wouldn't get through.

07-08-2003, 10:19 PM
ok, i get it [kind of], but i still wonder...it was the Home Wasuki that went to FATE and became Lynx. Why, then, is there no Lynx in Home World, but one in Another World? and after serge and Lynx switched bodies, how did Lynx go to the Home World [you know, in Fort Dragonia]? i thought only serge and anyone he wanted to could.

07-08-2003, 10:29 PM
I was always under the impression that FATE could switch between the worlds without help.

Velvet Mink
07-09-2003, 03:42 AM
There is no "Home World Wazuki" and "Another World Wazuki". Before 1010 AD there's only one timeline. In that year it splits into two. So...

1006 - Wazuki/Miguel/Serge go to Chronopolis; Wazuki becomes Lynx

1010 - Lynx returns to kill Serge which splits the timeline in two. Now suddenly everything is duplicated and there are 2 Lynxes - one per world.

The Lynx in Home World returned to the Dead Sea with General Viper and the dragoons and got frozen in time there with them.

Dark Serge can travel between dimensions probably because it is Serge's body that's the key. Lynx wouldn't have been able to, but after he took over serge's body he had the powers to, just like serge had the power to warp between the worlds when he wanted earlier.

07-09-2003, 03:48 AM
I thought the timelines were always seperate. Because of the things Crono and the others did to save the world, it created a paradox. They saved the world because the saw a glimpse of the future... but when they saved the world, that future ceased to exist. So how could they have known to save the world? Paradox.

So when they did save the world, another timeline was created to prevent that paradox. In one reality, Lavos still destroys the world. In the other, it's saved by Crono and his pals.

Velvet Mink
07-09-2003, 05:16 AM
Yeah you're not going to get around having a paradox when time travel's involved. I mean, no matter how good the stories are, they're still just games. Square didn't research physics to get things 100% accurate. It's too bad though =(

Either way, the game pretty much spells out that the timeline split when Serge lived/died. The whole basis for him destroying the future rests on the premise that two possible realities formed - one reflecting what would happen if he lived, another showing what would come to pass if he died.

07-09-2003, 06:28 AM
Ah, my mistake. It's been quite a while since I played either of those games. But I do remember them saying that there's still a timeline without the Day of Lavos and one with. Either that or I've lost my mind. Either's possible. :D Thanks for clearing that up though.

07-09-2003, 11:39 PM
huh? what? this is confusing.

anyway, thanks for telling me...i'm still wondering about Masa, Mune, and Doreen. you first meet doreen at enhasa of teh zeal kingdom in CT (she gets pretty psychological).
in CC, though, once you get the Mastermune, Masa and Mune say that its been a long time since the 3 of them were together. Does this mean that Doreen was the Sea Swallow? (if she was, then she was pretty darn weak)

Velvet Mink
07-10-2003, 01:10 AM
Sea swallow? That has nothing to do with it. That's just Serge's weapon from the beginning right? Yeah, forget that.

In CT Masa and Mune were the powers behind the Masamune. Doreen was... who knows where, but she didn't join them for it. In CC Doreen thought (for whatever reason) that she should team up with them so it gave the Masamune an extra boost - the Mastermune.

When they say they teamed up before, it obviously wasn't anytime shown in CT. Dunno what they meant by that. Or maybe they meant that's the first time they'd seen each other since 12,000 BC, but that doesn't make a lotta sense. =/ I dunno.

Kawaii Ryűkishi
07-10-2003, 05:21 AM
In Chrono Trigger, Ted Woolsey changed the Grand Lion's name to the Masamune; thus, Grand and Lion became Masa and Mune. He also mistranslated Dream's name as "Doreen." For some reason, though, he didn't make the same mistake, nor did he change Grand's name, when it came to the triple tech Grand Dream. Grand Dream is also the name of Serge's ultimate weapon, although it was called the "Mastermune" in the translation of CC. I guess the bottom line was that certain things could sometimes retain their good original names, but only until they actually became important to the plot.

So, Dream did indeed join up with Grand and Lion in CT. It was just in the form of a triple tech rather than that of a weapon.

07-10-2003, 05:30 AM
I always wondered why they were in that Triple Tech... thanks for clearing that one up.

07-10-2003, 09:29 PM
alrighty, thanks for telling me!
now i know why there were three Masamunes in the Grand Dream triple tech.

07-11-2003, 08:27 AM
If Lnyx was with Karsh when he killed Dario in Another World he got that dimension's masamune. It wouldn't make sense to have that Masamune in the Home World. So the Masamune in the Dead Sea is a different Masamune since there is one for both worlds I wonder how did he get the one in Home World.

07-11-2003, 09:27 PM
if that's true, then what the heck DID happen to the Another Masamune? Dario was dead, Lynx was killed when Serge defeated FATE, and...so what happened?

Velvet Mink
07-11-2003, 11:10 PM
I guess in the end it doesn't matter. Time resets a little bit back to the begining of the game, so I guess in a way the sword was never purified? I wonder if that means what Serge did to FATE was reset too, and maybe she's still functioning. I didn't like the ending, it just makes the whole adventure seem kinda pointless =/

07-13-2003, 06:29 AM
At the end of the game the timelines united and everyone's memory was erased. Which ghas a few bad consequenses such as demi-humans no longer have peace with humans. Fate is still dead I believe.

07-25-2003, 09:31 AM
maybe these are all questions that will be answered in the possible next installment :)

Velvet Mink
07-25-2003, 05:57 PM
I never understood how the timelines could unite again; they're just too different after 10 years. Like there's 2 Fargos, so which one is the "real" one that gets to survive? Same thing with Viper - does the dimension he died in or the one in which he still lives, become "real"? I think really either the timesplit would have to be prevented from ever occurring, or that one dimension will just suddenly cease to exist, and which one that is could be totally random. I have no dea =/