Unofficial Olympics Thread

[Dingo Jellybean]

Okay, anyone READY FOR EXCITEMENT?!!!

Well, maybe not. But personally, I always loved the Summer games. I mean the Winter games are fun to watch, but the summer games is where my heart is.

I'm always hyped up about the Olympics because they are only held every 4 years, it's always a great opportunity to watch something rare. This year however, I'm sorely disappointed in Greece's preparation for the Olympics.

There has been blackouts, traffic jams, lackluster ticket sales, and poor security in Athens and the Athens area. I mean I know the committee didn't have a crystal ball in 1996 when they made this decision, but this is really pathetic. I personally thought the Sydney games were the best Olympics(Winter or Summer) period. There's nothing from the Greek government to make me change that.

Not only that, the US isn't sending its best athletes now. There's doping allegations involved and I've lost all faith in Marion Jones. Tim Montgomery, the self proclaimed fastest man ever, didn't even come close to qualifying...and neither did Marion Jones. The only true favorite now is Maurice Greene, who is one of my favorite athletes ever. He even criticized Jones and Montgomery(fellow US track athletes) and felt they should be banned for good, and I agree.

The Dream Team is sending its B-List stars(with exception to Tim Duncan and Allen Iverson) and could be the worst Dreamteam since the Dreamteam started back in 1992. All because NBA players are lazy and don't want to go because they're too spoiled.

My gold medal predictions: I think Michael Phelps will win at least 3 gold medals in swimming, the Yugoslavia or Argentina team to get gold in basketball, Maurice Greene(USA) to win the 100m dash and set a new record, and the Chinese national team to win gold in gymnastics(men).

I haven't read all the articles, but I'm catching up on it. But I'm just a huge fan of these games...they make me watch sports I would never watch outside of the Olympics like track and field, swimming, skiing, etc.

[Kirobaito]

I like the Winter Games better. Mainly because the premier sport that TV shows 24/7 is Gymnastics, and I'm sorry, but those girls just don't have enough "substance" for me to be glued to the TV like I usually am. I like the snow sports more. And Olympic basketball is pretty pathetic.

[Dingo Jellybean]

I like the Winter Games better. Mainly because the premier sport that TV shows 24/7 is Gymnastics, and I'm sorry, but those girls just don't have enough "substance" for me to be glued to the TV like I usually am. I like the snow sports more. And Olympic basketball is pretty pathetic.

Maybe the bodies aren't ideal, but the gymnists are usually pretty cute.

[White Raven]

No hockey. No curling. No snowboarding.

Not my kind of olympics.

I just like watching someone mess up.

[Imperia]

I don't like to watch the Olympics anymore. I just don't. It's boring to me now. The Americans ALWAYS WIN, and it just gets old. I'm not anti-American or anything like that, but I would just like to see other people have a chance to win.

[Dingo Jellybean]

I don't like to watch the Olympics anymore. I just don't. It's boring to me now. The Americans ALWAYS WIN, and it just gets old. I'm not anti-American or anything like that, but I would just like to see other people have a chance to win.

See, this is kind of like how hispanic people want hispanic athletes to win.

Personally, I don't care who wins...as long as it's competitive. The good people should win...not juiced up athletes like Marion Jones.

[Kirkpatrick]

Yeah, I would say I'm pretty excited about the upcoming games, I enojy watching the Olympics and all, but I definitely prefer the winter games, what with the hockey and the other ice/snow sports (hey, what can I say, I'm Canadian :p). Also, it always seems with the summer games that the coverage tends to focus on a few areas, like swimming and track, and that Does get a little tedious after the fifth or sixth time they cut from something else to show a 100m dash heat.

Along that line, something that annoys me about the coverage is that it often shows a every possible moment of a few sports (track, swimming, gymnastics, and I'm sure a few I can't think of) while ignoring many others (I'm thinking of Equestrian and Sailing specifically, but there are lots more). Ah well, I know that there is only so much time to show highlights and events, but I'd still like a more balanced covering - I guess that's what the internet is for :p!

...Despite my rantings, I do hope Athens can somehow manage to pull it off this year, and we can still have a good games.

[Dingo Jellybean]

And summer has women's beach volleyball...

I'm just watching the Women's Beach Volleyball tournament and I'm like...gawd...they are like, athletic models. Good looking and athletic...you don't get that combination very often.

[Dingo Jellybean]

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer04/basketball/news/story?id=1851520

If that's not cause for concern for the US team, I don't know what is.

Italy was a 18 point underdog...instead looked like a 20 point favorite. I swear, this team is lacking shooters of any kind whatsoever. I've said it earlier, I still like Argentina to win the gold...but I'm not even sure the US can win a medal now.

[Casey]

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summe...tory?id=1851520

If that's not cause for concern for the US team, I don't know what is.

Italy was a 18 point underdog...instead looked like a 20 point favorite. I swear, this team is lacking shooters of any kind whatsoever. I've said it earlier, I still like Argentina to win the gold...but I'm not even sure the US can win a medal now.



Eh, so what if we lost, its just a game. Thats the spirit, yeah, go USA! They should send the pistons over there. :D

[Dingo Jellybean]

Jeez, there's 116 events for Saturday alone, which topped last Olympics, which had like, 103.

I'm just watching this field hockey game and some US girl got her face whammed by a stick. I'm surprised they play this early, this game started at 8:30AM Greece time.

I always felts the Olympics should have their events start at 2PM on the first day to give a chance for the athletes to attend the opening ceremony without punishment...especially those who have to wake up early...but eh.

I always love the Olympics...though not many Americans do anyways.

[Mo-Nercy]

In Australia, there's a lot of Olympic hype. Apparently, we have potential gold medals in pretty much every sport. Swimming, Athletics, Cycling, Rowing...

I prefer the diving and the gymnastics. "Oooh. Spinny"

I believe that China is leading the medal tally right now, with Australia in second.

I hate how all the events are on live at like 3am. In Sydney 2000, I could watch tv normally, dammit!

[Dingo Jellybean]

Oh man...I can't believe United States is down 22 freakin points against a non-medal contender.

The US can't buy a jump shot, not surprisingly. I mean they're all under the 3 point line...which is sad considering it's only 20 feet or so. That completely takes away Tim Duncan. Gawd...and hearing Lamar Odom speak, he's obviously playing another game because he doesn't seem worried.

[Calliope]

Thank god for the repercharge, that's all I have to say. Bloody rowers.

THORPE VS PHELPS!

Oh, and go South Africa.

The Olympics - the only time I voluntarily watch sport. Hm.

[Tulmane]

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I feel really bad for gymnists. Shit, even if I were serious about something like that, I wouldn't go to digestive-tract destroying methods to maintain an 80lbs physique so I could hurl myself around. o_O

Either way, I've never been too keen on the Olympics in general. It's like watching a "My penis is bigger!" arguement, you know the ones...

[queen of the jungle]

Well if the gymnasts were having trouble finding dates they could just impress people with a 2 1/2 twist somersault or whatever it is they do. And was anyone else surprised how badly USA got beaten by Puerto Rico?

[Dingo Jellybean]

>>
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I feel really bad for gymnists. Shit, even if I were serious about something like that, I wouldn't go to digestive-tract destroying methods to maintain an 80lbs physique so I could hurl myself around. o_O

Either way, I've never been too keen on the Olympics in general. It's like watching a "My penis is bigger!" arguement, you know the ones...


You have to remember that Gymnasts are not skinny, not even the girls. Most male gymnasts never see past 5'5" and most female gymnasts barely see 5'. The average height for the US male gymnasts are 5'4" and for the women it's like, 4'10.5". So while some of gymnasts are 80 lbs(actually none of the US female gymnasts are, they are around 92-105 lbs), that's hard to do. I think it's preferable to have small gymnasts because as you get taller, it's incredibly hard(or even impossible) to balance yourself in the air like that. Imagine someone like Gheorge Murasean(who's 7'7") trying to do gymnastics, it's practically physically impossible.

But yes, the Olympics are another form of bragging rights...but that's only for us spectators. For people who compete in these olympics, it's pretty much their life...much more than bragging rights.


Well if the gymnasts were having trouble finding dates they could just impress people with a 2 1/2 twist somersault or whatever it is they do. And was anyone else surprised how badly USA got beaten by Puerto Rico?

I doubt any of them have trouble finding dates, I mean did you see Blaine Wilson's wife? She's a former volleyball player...and female volleyball players are usually cute with fantastic bodies.

But anyways, despite Courtney Kupets being a local girl(to me, that is), Mohini Bhardwaj is pretty cute, and I guarantee you she doesn't have trouble finding dates...even if she is just 4'10".

I've followed Team USA basketball since the 1992 dream team, and I wasn't surprised that they lost so badly. They lost worst to Italy, a non-medal contender. What's worst is that Puerto Rico were not even a medal contender, just "happy to be there." The problem with the US is that they don't have an outside shooter. They shot 3-24 in the first game from 3 point land and 4-21 in the second game. What's more mocking is how the 3 point line is 3 feet shorter than the NBA 3 point line. In game 1, the US missed 16 3 pointers in a row. That's pathetic. I mean you could throw me the cutest girls on the court and have them strip down their clothes to distract me and I guarantee I can hit at least one out of 16.

But eh...if they can't shoot 3's, DON'T TAKE THEM. I thought that would be obvious.

[Rinoabella]

I love watching the Olympics. I thought I was the only one. I can't believe NZ won a basketball game :O That was EXCITING!

My favourite sports to watch are: basketball, hockey, rowing (sculls).

[Dingo Jellybean]

I love watching the Olympics. I thought I was the only one. I can't believe NZ won a basketball game :O That was EXCITING!

My favourite sports to watch are: basketball, hockey, rowing (sculls).

I assume you were speaking of the Men's team because the USA Women's completely killed the Kiwis. The final score was 99-47, and it's only the first time in over 20000 games(NBA or international or collegiate) that a basketball team doubles up on someone.

But anyways, congrats to Paul Hamm(pronounced "Hom" like "mom" not "Ham"...like so many people pronounce it :rolleyes2 ) to becoming the first US male gymnast to win all around gold...he came back from 12th place...I already knew he won gold, but I had to see it to believe it. I still can't believe he made that come back...it was amazing. And congrats to Carly Patterson for matching the US men. I don't think I've ever seen an Olympics where the US men and women matched each other in gymnastics.

Personally, I love gymnastics. How those people contort their bodies...I never fail to be impressed...it's just...wow...*melts*...so damn cool.

[Strider]

How 'bout that Carly Patterson?

[Denmark]

^_^ YAY AMERICA

Wow, I just realized that the Olympics is the only time I like my country. Yay for sports overshadowing everything else going on in the world. It would be nice if stuff like this happened more often. But I know it can't. :\

Personally, I used to enjoy the Winter Olympics more because of skiing (my personal favorite sport), but now I like the Summer Olympics more because of all the stuff I never get to see on TV or do myself. I am on the track team at school but the Olympic track athletes are just so good that it's a completely different sport. And gymnastics. Wow. I just have to say, don't piss off a male gymnast.

[Doc Sark]

I think its pretty obvious that the Americans will win the overall medals but when you consider how much money and how much time is spent on developing the vast number of potential athletes in the country, it is hardly surprising. They are currently top and that is before they dominate the track events.

I like watching the Olympics becasue there's always a sense of the underdog for the British in most events, which makes it more special if one of our athletes wins a medal. The only events in which the Brits normally expect success are the boat events. Rowing, Sailing etc, Britain has obtained a dominance over in recent years, so its nice to see the Boy Hoy winning Gold in the Cycling events. I certainly have enjoyed watching the British athletes compete.

[Rinoabella]

I assume you were speaking of the Men's team because the USA Women's completely killed the Kiwis. The final score was 99-47, and it's only the first time in over 20000 games(NBA or international or collegiate) that a basketball team doubles up on someone.
Damn right I meant the guys :cool: You may have killed our girls, but we're still in the semis. And you may have killed our guys, but we killed the guys who killed you in 2002.

[Dingo Jellybean]

I think its pretty obvious that the Americans will win the overall medals but when you consider how much money and how much time is spent on developing the vast number of potential athletes in the country, it is hardly surprising. They are currently top and that is before they dominate the track events.

I like watching the Olympics becasue there's always a sense of the underdog for the British in most events, which makes it more special if one of our athletes wins a medal. The only events in which the Brits normally expect success are the boat events. Rowing, Sailing etc, Britain has obtained a dominance over in recent years, so its nice to see the Boy Hoy winning Gold in the Cycling events. I certainly have enjoyed watching the British athletes compete.

You also have to remember that nearly half of the non-US olympic swimming athletes train in the US. So in essence, they spend more money than they US athletes who get to stay home.

Also, I always wonder why people say the US has the most athletes, so it gives them more of a chance to win. I never liked that. People have to realize that these athletes have to make it through the Olympic trials. And often these trials bump other countries out. So it's not like the US is sending 50 100m dash athletes. It just so happens that US athletes make it through the olympic trials and knocks out some of the international competition that prevents them from competing.

[Strider]

How 'bout them Lithuanians?

[Dingo Jellybean]

How 'bout them Lithuanians?

At least a former Terp got them.

Everytime I see Lithuania play, they amaze me with how accurate their shooting is. Just when the US plays its best game(both during the olympics and exhibition games), it loses. Not because of lack of shooting that this team is known for, well actually it is, but because of a lack of free throw shooting. If we had Reggie Miller or Brent Barry or Michael Redd, man, this would be a different story. We haven't even blown an opponent out. The fact that the 3 point line is more than 3 feet shorter than the NBA's just shows how pathetic this squad is at shooting. Even though they shot well today, I think it was a fluke.

No way the US keeps this shooting for the 4(potentially) remaining games. What I'm more surprised is that the former Yugoslavia(Serbia and Montenegro) lost again. I thought they were the 2nd best team in the pool next to Argentina.

Oh well, the US advanced to the quarterfinals anyways, because Angola got smashed by Greece(who we play next). If this is a game where we can afford to attempt 3's, this is the team to do it against. They're even worst than China(and that's saying a lot), oh man...the US should win by like, 21 points or more...it shouldn't even be close.

[Miriel]

Well it appears that Paul Hamm's gold medal is only his because of an error in calculations. I personally thought that his disastrous fall from the vault deserved much much less than a 9.1 so I'm totally feeling for the South Koreans on this one. Poor guys, they looked so anguished when they discovered that they had lost out on being 1, 2.

[Doc Sark]

Also, I always wonder why people say the US has the most athletes, so it gives them more of a chance to win. I never liked that. People have to realize that these athletes have to make it through the Olympic trials. And often these trials bump other countries out. So it's not like the US is sending 50 100m dash athletes. It just so happens that US athletes make it through the olympic trials and knocks out some of the international competition that prevents them from competing.

Obviously.

The USA have a far bigger crop of athletes to choose from when it comes to sending athletes to the Olympic Trials. Comparing the USA team to the British team for example, the USA has sent nearly 100 more competitors to the games, spanning a vast number of events! I think it is totally fair to say that America are always favourites because of the number of quality athletes to choose from. That's not a dig at American Sport at all. It's a compliment, you should be proud of your country's sportspersons and not undermine the institutions that make the American Olympic team not only one of the biggest, but certainly the best.

[CloudySky]

How 'bout them Lithuanians?

I love this team! They will take goldM in basketball!
That would be hilarious!
The US dreaming team are getting better with every game! US-Lit game was much more interesting and could be a final itself, lol.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Obviously.

The USA have a far bigger crop of athletes to choose from when it comes to sending athletes to the Olympic Trials. Comparing the USA team to the British team for example, the USA has sent nearly 100 more competitors to the games, spanning a vast number of events! I think it is totally fair to say that America are always favourites because of the number of quality athletes to choose from. That's not a dig at American Sport at all. It's a compliment, you should be proud of your country's sportspersons and not undermine the institutions that make the American Olympic team not only one of the biggest, but certainly the best.

What I meant was that the US just has better athletes because they are better, not because there's more of them. You look at China, who has 396 athletes. Look at Australia, they have 489 athletes, yet look at the total gold and medals that China has compared to Australia...practically double that of Australia.

So the argument of "more to choose" from doesn't really account. The US simply has better athletes because they train harder, not because there's more of them. While the US has 647 athletes to China's 396, China is actually ahead on the current gold count, but trail in total medal count by only 5 medals. While China only sends 61% of the number of athletes to Athens compared to United States, they certainly have much more than 61% of the medals compared to the United States.

You look back 4 years ago in Sydney, Australia sent close to 500 athletes in Sydney compared to the US who sent about 620 athletes. The US won the total gold and total medal count with 97(39 gold) total medals. Australia only had 58 total medals with 18 gold.

Although I'm not accusing you of this, many people outside the US often claim that because the US has the most athletes, they win more medals. Completely untrue. You can go back to the 1984 Olympics in Los Angeles and realize that the US took home 83(174 total medals) gold medals, the most dominant olympics in olympics history(winter or summer). Yet during that time, it was actually the former Soviet Union that sent the most athletes. They didn't even get 30 total medals, and 2nd place for total gold was like, 15 or something.

[Dingo Jellybean]

I love this team! They will take goldM in basketball!
That would be hilarious!
The US dreaming team are getting better with every game! US-Lit game was much more interesting and could be a final itself, lol.

Heh, Dreaming Team. That should be the title for this current 2004 Team USA.

[Calliope]

Two gold for NZ now! *waves flag*

[Rinoabella]

Two gold for NZ now! *waves flag*
Yeah! Go our #24-or something team! We are now ahead of Canada, Eithiopia and United Arab Emirates :eek:

Highlights for me:
- Our quadruple array of penalty corners in the men's hockey AFTER the time had run out! Poor India though :(
- Beating Serbia + Montenegro in the men's basketball. It was the only team I really wanted us to beat.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Oh man, oh man...the 100m dash is the single greatest race in the world.

It's my favorite race. Justin Gatlin finished in 9.85s. Maurice Greene took home bronze in 9.87s...that time was good enough for gold in 2000...but man...oh man, I just love this race so much. 5 racers finished under 10s, Kim Collins finished 6th at 10s flat. Fastest and closest 100m ever.

I can't wait for the 4x100m relays...man...I love track and field.

[Rinoabella]

But it only lasts for like 10 seconds! It's okay for a quick thrill.

[Dingo Jellybean]

But it only lasts for like 10 seconds! It's okay for a quick thrill.

Yeah, but it shows what humans can do. Not some race car or a horse. I love it...it's like...oh man, so fun to watch.

[Calliope]

Oh, and gotta love the Murray Halberg and that other guy car bomb scare thing :D

[Dingo Jellybean]

Oh man, I thought there would be the first 10 in gymnastics since Nadia Comaneci.

Marian Dragulescu his like, the greatest move in sports that I've seen with some kind of 3 somersault-double twist. The commentators were calling for a 10.0, but it got <i>only</i> a 9.9.

He hit the perfect landing and did everything right. Too bad he stumbled badly on his last vault to get bronze.

But yeah, US swept the 400m finals. The US softball team won gold but beating the Aussies again :cry: But eh, they won all 8 games by a combined score of 51-1. The most dominant olympics in softball olympics history. And the US women's soccer team should beat Brazil.

But man...that single vault Marian did was just like...damn.

[Strider]

How 'bout that Jennie Finch?

[Kirobaito]

She's hot.

Good job for Jeremy Wariner, my sister's friend. Well, my sister knows him. Not really friends, but whatever. :D

[Dingo Jellybean]

Oh man, the AP story reporting the booing during Alexei Nemov didn't even come close to describing how bad the booing was during the last gymnastics routine.

I'm not sure if the booing was primarily during the pathetic score they gave Nemov(it was a horrible score) or if it was because Paul Hamm was going up next. I couldn't even hear the announcers because it was so loud. Paul Hamm got a 9.812 on a routine that wasn't near as good as Nemov's, who had 6 lift offs that were just out of this world. Nemov's routine, who 99% of the crowd felt was worthy of a gold medal, didn't even get a medal for it.

Nemov got a 9.725 for his amazing routine, and the crowd booed like crazy. Even having the judges redo the score, but the score itself didn't please the crowd either as Nemov didn't even move a position.

They booed Hamm like crazy, which wasn't even close to being fair. The score he got, from my POV, didn't warrant a 9.812, but he did get a 9.9 start value. Nemov got a 10.0 start value, and other than a slip landing, it should've gotten close to a 9.9. But yeah...the judges during these gymnastics should really look over their tapes. I didn't think Hamm deserved the silver medal, that should've went to Alexei Nemov.

But man...anyone who didn't see this part of gymnastics should see it, the audience should be ashamed of themselves.

[Kirobaito]

I don't think they were booing Hamm as he was trying to go. They were simply still mad that Nemov failed to get gold, which that routine obviously deserved.

[Ellerkerm]

I have seen it and I'm not happy with the score. I'm also a Canadian who liked that routine with Alexei Nemov(should gotten the gold medal) paul Hamm should gotten the silver. I also watched it on NBC.

[Dingo Jellybean]

I don't think they were booing Hamm as he was trying to go. They were simply still mad that Nemov failed to get gold, which that routine obviously deserved.

I'm beginning to think that too. I think it went both ways...but when Hamm's score of 9.812 came up, the crowd started booing again like there's no tomorrow.

But they did cheer him after he finished his routine. But Igor Cassina did deserve the gold, Hamm should have gotten bronze while Nemov with silver. Cassina's landing was much better than Nemov's.

Also, did anyone see the weight lifting competition? Man I love those.

[Miriel]

Wow, the men's gymnastic was insane :eek:

The judges don't appear to know what the hell they're doing. The scoring throughout the Olympics has been loopy but tonight's judging was severely screwed up. I agree with Dingo, it should've gone:

1. Igor Cassina - Italy
3. Alexei Nemov - Russia
2. Paul Hamm - USA

I still can't believe Nemov placed 5th for one of the best bar routines I've ever seen. It's shameful.

And I find Paul Hamm to be supremely annoying.

[Rusty]

So the argument of "more to choose" from doesn't really account. The US simply has better athletes because they train harder, not because there's more of them.


I think that is a really un-fair statement to make. Your basically saying that The US train harder than all the other athletes in all the other countries participating. And it's not fair to say the US has better athletes either. Thats just a completley one sided statement.
I'm not tryingt o start an arguement, just realise that there other athletes that are "better" than those in the US.

[Doc Sark]

So the argument of "more to choose" from doesn't really account. The US simply has better athletes because they train harder, not because there's more of them. While the US has 647 athletes to China's 396, China is actually ahead on the current gold count, but trail in total medal count by only 5 medals. While China only sends 61% of the number of athletes to Athens compared to United States, they certainly have much more than 61% of the medals compared to the United States.

You look back 4 years ago in Sydney, Australia sent close to 500 athletes in Sydney compared to the US who sent about 620 athletes. The US won the total gold and total medal count with 97(39 gold) total medals. Australia only had 58 total medals with 18 gold.

Did you get your calculator out for those statistics? It stands to reason that if you send more athletes to the games, you increase your chances to win medals. With these stats you have effectively proved my point. In the case of Australia (and I'm not sure of the figures exactly), the population is something like 20 million and of those 20 million, what fraction of those are registered athletes? If for example you took the same fraction and applied it to the American population, which is nearly 300 million people the number would be 15 times greater. Of course these are not pinpoint figures but it helps to get the point across.


I think that is a really un-fair statement to make. Your basically saying that The US train harder than all the other athletes in all the other countries participating. And it's not fair to say the US has better athletes either. Thats just a completley one sided statement.

I agree. That is total bull. To say that athletes from the USA train harder than athletes from other countries is an absolute unfounded assumption. The USA has better facilities and more money to throw at sports than any other country in the world! True the Soviets were the only nation that could compete with the United States, but that was nearly 20 years ago. Since the USSR splintered out, the Russians are not a serious challenge to the USA's olympic crown. Once again, I must reiterate, I am not attacking the American Olympic team, if there was more money to throw at sport in other countries, particularly my own, I would be more than happy to witness the benefits of that at a major competition such as the Olympics.

[Ellerkerm]

Us team has more medals than Canada which is good because I had been in the states for the past 6 years. I have been in Florida a couple of times(By driving down from Brampton,Ontario,Canada)

I hope the judges are going to be fired after the olympics are over.

[Strider]

Is it a coincidence that the blown gymnastics judging prompted a minor earthquake near Athens? (http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/reuters20040824_199.html) I think not.

The ancient Greek gods are clearly displeased.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Did you get your calculator out for those statistics? It stands to reason that if you send more athletes to the games, you increase your chances to win medals. With these stats you have effectively proved my point. In the case of Australia (and I'm not sure of the figures exactly), the population is something like 20 million and of those 20 million, what fraction of those are registered athletes? If for example you took the same fraction and applied it to the American population, which is nearly 300 million people the number would be 15 times greater. Of course these are not pinpoint figures but it helps to get the point across.


You're saying that if you send more athletes, you have a better chance to win more medals. My stats with Australia was that they had 80% of the athletes of the US, but only 1/2 the number of total medals. By your statement about more = more, then shouldn't Australia end up with about 80% of the medals that the US has? It was even played in their own country. You look at China this year, with 396 athletes compared to the US' 647 athletes. Yet they still have the same amount of total gold medals, and we certainly can't say that they have better facilities. They are also not far off the pace of total medals. What bothered me about your statement was how you said more athletes equals more medals, completely ridiculous. There are 4 times the US finished #1 in the medal standings when other countries had more athletes, and of those 4 times(1896, 1984, and two other years I forgot), the Soviet Union and/or Germany sent the most athletes. Remember the famous Jesse Owens olympics? Germany had more athletes but US still won more gold. So that's the assumption I'm trying to kill.



I agree. That is total bull. To say that athletes from the USA train harder than athletes from other countries is an absolute unfounded assumption. The USA has better facilities and more money to throw at sports than any other country in the world! True the Soviets were the only nation that could compete with the United States, but that was nearly 20 years ago. Since the USSR splintered out, the Russians are not a serious challenge to the USA's olympic crown. Once again, I must reiterate, I am not attacking the American Olympic team, if there was more money to throw at sport in other countries, particularly my own, I would be more than happy to witness the benefits of that at a major competition such as the Olympics.

Perhaps I didn't word myself properly, but just because the US simply has better facilities doesn't make them better athletes alone. You have to remember, half of non-US swimmers in this year's olympics train in US facilities. Yet again, the US pulled in more swimming gold and total medals than any other country by far. There are a ton of track and field athletes not in the US who train in US colleges like Clemson and Tennesee Universities. You'd be surprised how many non-US athletes train in the United States, the number is probably close to 33-40%. I'd be happy to research this for you if you like and provide links for proof.

All I'm saying is that the US has better athletes for the sake of being better, whether it's for the motivation of having their face on a Wheaties box or getting the media attention, I don't know. Not because they have better facilities or more athletes.

[Polaris]

GO FRANCIS OBIKWELU

[Dingo Jellybean]

GO FRANCIS OBIKWELU

Yeah. He only got silver, but you should be proud of him. He left his country of Nigeria and trained for Portugal because of poor treatment of athletes. Nigeria has had a history of this, and many of its top athletes left the country.

[Kirobaito]

I agree with you, Dingo. For whatever reason, we get more medals. It could be that the US has a more diverse environment, so they are able to succeed in a larger number of areas. They have a better collection of athletes.

[Dingo Jellybean]

If anyone needs a good laugh:

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer04/basketball/news/story?id=1866247

[Doc Sark]

The countries with the most athletes are at the top of the medals table. That is undeniable. If you send more athletes spanning a vast number of events, and your athletes are good and well trained, as most olympic athletes are, you have more chance of winning more medals. You're statistics and precentiles are irrelevant because you don't take in to account all the variables that apply to sporting competition.


I agree with you, Dingo. For whatever reason, we get more medals. It could be that the US has a more diverse environment, so they are able to succeed in a larger number of areas. They have a better collection of athletes.

I have actually already stated this. They have a bigger and better collection of athletes. See what started off as a compliment to how the USA organises and trains its sporting talent from a very young age, has for some reason turned into an arguement about statistics and percentages which is a frankly circular and boring route.

[Dingo Jellybean]

The countries with the most athletes are at the top of the medals table. That is undeniable. If you send more athletes spanning a vast number of events, and your athletes are good and well trained, as most olympic athletes are, you have more chance of winning more medals. You're statistics and precentiles are irrelevant because you don't take in to account all the variables that apply to sporting competition.



I have actually already stated this. They have a bigger and better collection of athletes. See what started off as a compliment to how the USA organises and trains its sporting talent from a very young age, has for some reason turned into an arguement about statistics and percentages which is a frankly circular and boring route.

It's ridiculous to assume that more means more. Didn't I just say that the specific four times that US won most medals and most gold were the times Germany and/or Russia had more athletes?

Statistics back up what I say that more does not equal more. Every country starts athletes off at a young age. You still don't back up your side of the argument of more = more. Completely untrue. It's like you completely ignore statistical facts just for the sake that they don't agree with your view of why the US wins so many medals. You don't specifically state why the statistics are wrong.

For example, you said more athletes means more medals. Again, I've pulled up numerous times where the US won the most medals without nearly having the most athletes(in the 1974 Olympics, Soviet Union had about 80 more athletes than the US, yet pulled in like, 1/3rd or 1/4th the total medals that the US had.)

You still ignore that fact and claim there's more variables in competition...what kind of argument is that? And for your information, China is competing in more events than the United States. So saying that the US sends the most athletes that span the most events is also completely untrue.

I keep bringing up facts and you keep denying them, so I don't know what else to tell you. The reason why this conversation turned into a statistical battle is because stats are history, and the stats disprove your point of view of why the US wins the most medals. If you just research this yourself(I can help you if you like), you would see that what you've said is a completely ignorant assumption of United States athletes. It's total disrespect to the US athletes saying more is more. I don't deny the US has the best facilities, but when 33-40% of non-US Olympic athletes train in the US, what can you say about that? You can't start claiming that the facilities are the reason why the US wins the most medals because now other countries are starting to use the US' facilities too.

I know a lot of countries are jealous(though many won't admit and I'm not accusing you of it) of the US' success. I probably would be too if I were to live in another country, but if you're going to make outrageous statements like that, at least have the courtesy to defend your arguments and not discount the facts that I have presented.

[Rinoabella]

Well he has a point. More means more of a chance. There's almost an American, Australian and Chinese athlete in almost every heat of every event. Other countries can't even afford to send that many.

On a side note, the women's volleball has really gone down. In terms of standard of dress - camera angles and zooms. Plus the additional DJ music and exotic dancers :rolleyes2

[Dingo Jellybean]

Well he has a point. More means more of a chance. There's almost an American, Australian and Chinese athlete in almost every heat of every event. Other countries can't even afford to send that many.

On a side note, the women's volleball has really gone down. In terms of standard of dress - camera angles and zooms. Plus the additional DJ music and exotic dancers :rolleyes2

More doesn't necessarily mean more of a chance. Often when you have the most athletes in a certain event, you often don't have a clear cut favorite to advance out of an event. China actually has more male gymnasts than the US, but that certainly didn't give them more of a chance to win the gold medal in team gymnastics...the US were favored slightly to win it by virtue of their victory at the 2003 World Championship. I wasn't comparing the US to a country like Mongolia...of course they can't compete with the US. But for those who can compete against the US like Australia or Great Britain, more certainly doesn't mean more of a chance. Just because the US has 300 million doesn't mean they have a better chance to win. I mean India and china both have over 1 billion in their country, but granted they do not have the facilities like the US. And not all 300 million in the US are athletes.

But if you go back to a time when the Soviet Union had more athletes and were actually stronger than the US(in terms of military and economics), you would notice that the US won the most medals by far...even against a country that was economically more wealthier with more athletes and a greater population.

As for women's volleyball, I never watch anyways. They have fantastic athletic bodies, but it's usually not enough to keep an audience, especially to that of an average sports fan. It's nice that they're wearing skimpy clothes, but if that's what attracts viewers, then I can't blame them. It's all marketing.

[-N-]

Is it a coincidence that the blown gymnastics judging prompted a minor earthquake near Athens? (http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/reuters20040824_199.html) I think not.

The ancient Greek gods are clearly displeased.By Zeus! The gods have spoken! *validates the thread with his post* :D

[Dingo Jellybean]

On further review, Paul Hamm did win that medal.

The Korean gymnast should have lost .2 points off his score...so that means someone was snuffed out of a bronze medal. I think they mentioned something about having only 6 holds total or was it 5? But anyways, that medal Paul Hamm won was legitimate.

[Rinoabella]

Yay NZ! Go our #1 and #2 team in the Men's Triathlon.

[Dingo Jellybean]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=whitlock/040826

I agree with Jason Whitlock, <i>some</i>, not all of Americans simply root against Team USA men's basketball team because it's all black...he has a point...just read the article.

[CloudySky]

I agree with Jason Whitlock, some, not all of Americans simply root against Team USA men's basketball team because it's all black...he has a point...just read the article.

That's bullshit, it has nothing to do with the race. It's all about different basketball schools. People have a right to choose what school or style of BB they like. I don't see how disliking NBA style make anyone a racist. I’m sick to hear that nonsense everyday.

[Dingo Jellybean]

That's bullshit, it has nothing to do with the race. It's all about different basketball schools. People have a right to choose what school or style of BB they like. I don't see how disliking NBA style make anyone a racist. I’m sick to hear that nonsense everyday.

I said <i>some</i>. Not all. I wish people would actually read the things I say.

Race is always an issue, no doubt about it. <i>How much</i> of an issue is another issue. Look, this country is predominantly white, most of them have seperated their racist ways, but you can't be so blind that it doesn't exist.

If it has nothing to do with race, why do ESPN polls show that people in the US want Team USA to lose? Shouldn't they be cheering for them? If you visit www.sportsline.com and read their message boards, there are a ton of people who say "not enough white players" or "a team of all blacks can't win." You can't be so blind to realize that race isn't an issue. It is. There's a difference between not liking the NBA game and not cheering for Team USA.

[CloudySky]

If it has nothing to do with race, why do ESPN polls show that people in the US want Team USA to lose? Shouldn't they be cheering for them?
Go to any BB forum for God's sake. BB fans wants US to win gold real bad and they are cheering.
Why do you care about some stupid polls! Some fans are offended by best NBA players refusal to represent their country in Olympics, that's all. I don't see any "race issue" in that.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Go to any BB forum for God's sake. BB fans wants US to win gold real bad and they are cheering.
Why do you care about some stupid polls! Some fans are offended by best NBA players refusal to represent their country in Olympics, that's all. I don't see any "race issue" in that.

Any basketball forum? Have you been to <i>any</i> basketball forum? There are topics that sprout out about how this Team USA is all black and how they can't win. I'm a regular board member to 3 basketball forums. Go to www.sportsline.com You'll see how many topics that are race related. Show me a basketball forum with at least 2000 members and tell me that race isn't an issue in one of those topics and I would know you'd be a liar, because I've been to 3 basketball forums with at least 2000 members and race is brought up almost everytime Team USA plays basketball.

Why do I care about "stupid" polls? Because they show the opinion of people. That's why. 51.4% wants Team USA to lose according to an ESPN poll.

I'll type this again for the dumb and deaf: Race is always an issue in basketball...<i>how much</i> of an issue is another issue. You're always going to get people who simply root against someone because of race. Anyone who denies racism is absent in this country(or even this world) is completely out of their mind.

[CloudySky]

http://www.sportsline.com/messages/message/nba/1093548874-djlee3

This is just one man's opinion of the situation and I don't see it as playing the race card because there are some individuals who do feel that the team is "too black". I hope and believe that this population is the minority, but it does exist and if he wants to write about it, so be it.
That's exactly my point. Why do you tend to hear someone trying to shout really loud over many talking possitive things.

[Dingo Jellybean]

http://www.sportsline.com/messages/message/nba/1093548874-djlee3

That's exactly my point. Why do you tend to hear someone trying to shout really loud over many talking possitive things.

You just quoted part of what I was trying to say. If you read all the messages in that article, you'll find other users agreeing with Jason Whitlock. That goes to show you that what you said about BB forums being in support of Team USA is completely false.

I never said all of America was against Team USA. I said that <i><b><u>some</i></u></b> of America is against Team USA simply because they are all black.

[Sandy]

I know a lot of countries are jealous(though many won't admit and I'm not accusing you of it) of the US' success. I probably would be too if I were to live in another country, but if you're going to make outrageous statements like that, at least have the courtesy to defend your arguments and not discount the facts that I have presented.

Haha, that's hilarious.

Go NZ! Yay we did so well in the Men's Triathlon. And just the other night, the males where getting hassled on TV about them not winning anything XD

[Dingo Jellybean]

Haha, that's hilarious.

Go NZ! Yay we did so well in the Men's Triathlon. And just the other night, the males where getting hassled on TV about them not winning anything XD

How is it hilarious? You deny any international jealousy of the US dominance of the olympics?

[Sandy]

How is it hilarious? You deny any international jealousy of the US dominance of the olympics?

Just because I thought it was funny doesn't mean I'm implying something. I'm sure there are SOME countries out there jealous of the US, or any other country doing well in the Olympics. However I would've used 'admired' rather than 'jealous'.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Just because I thought it was funny doesn't mean I'm implying something. I'm sure there are SOME countries out there jealous of the US, or any other country doing well in the Olympics. However I would've used 'admired' rather than 'jealous'.

Well, trust me...when I was in Canada and Australia...there certainly wasn't any admiration of the US. Some country admires the US, but I know plenty more hate it.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Heh, it's funny during the men's 200m that the fans interrupted the race for about 10 minutes.

Chants of "Hellas" delayed the start of the race. Apparently some Greek newspaper stated that there was an American conspiracy to keep Kentaris(the Sydney 2000 gold medalist who missed a drug test and was banned from competition and won't represent his home country) out of the race. Apparently(I know I use this word a lot) these were the tickets that were hardest to get and the most expensive. So the home crowd were disappointed that Kentaris wasn't in the race. The 3 Americans swept the medals in the process.

[Sandy]

Well, trust me...when I was in Canada and Australia...there certainly wasn't any admiration of the US. Some country admires the US, but I know plenty more hate it.

Are you saying you went to Canada/Australia during the Olympics or are you using them as a general example of countries that don't like America? Because it's unlikely countries would hate another just because of their Olympic success (which is what I was refering to when using the term 'admired' - not taking into account any political/social factors.)

[Dingo Jellybean]

Are you saying you went to Canada/Australia during the Olympics or are you using them as a general example of countries that don't like America? Because it's unlikely countries would hate another just because of their Olympic success (which is what I was refering to when using the term 'admired' - not taking into account any political/social factors.)

No, maybe I didn't state myself in a way I wanted people to understand me, but when I was in Australia(after the olympics, where I wore my USA jersey in Sydney) I didn't exactly get the nice, warm welcome from some people. I was in Canada right before the olympics in 1992(though I was very young), I remember that many people simply stated that the US was overated and called US athletes dirty players.

This isn't to say that every one in every country is jealous of the US, it's to say that some people in some countries are jealous of the US. Though I know some admire the US.

[Rinoabella]

USA jumpers are an exception though, especially in New Zealand and probably Australia. If you wore one people would look at you funny. You have to be here to understand.

As for the topic, this has turned into a pretty big argument thread. And as for the Olympics, I just read that there was a massive booing at the 200m Men's sprint final, and also an argument at the Men's basketball final between Spain and the US. Amazing what arguments an event such as the Olympics can create. I don't remember this happening 4 years ago.

[Kirobaito]

There was a story in the Greek media that that Greek track guy (don't remember his name) missed the drug test due to some USA conspiracy to try to keep the Greeks from going 1-2-3 in their event. I must say, one of the funniest things I've heard in awhile.

[Dingo Jellybean]

The olympic games in Sydney were by far, the best games I have ever seen...winter or summer. And I've seen 7 Olympic games so far.

As for the Greeks finishing 1-2-3...eh, they might have 1 gold medalist from Sydney, but the other 2(other than Kentaris) were like...bleh 200m sprinters. But eh, I think it's just bitterness from <i>some</i> of the Greek fans.

[Rinoabella]

I agree. Sydney was spectacular. It'll be hard for any other host to outdo them in the future!

[Dingo Jellybean]

See, the real problem now is _AFTER_ the olympics.

I went to Sydney twice after the olympics and visited Olympic park and the facilities there were like...empty...twice...despite being open to the public. It's amazing how useless these gigantic structures are after the olympics. LA and Atlanta never had this problem, mainly because they're such big markets...but for such a small country like Greece...whew, not sure if they'll recover from this.

[Rusty]

I agree. Sydney was spectacular. It'll be hard for any other host to outdo them in the future!


That's a really nice comment to read when your an Aussie, so thank you :)


To Dingo Jellybeans comment, you right some people might admire the USA, but jealous? Of what? That there on top of the medal tally at the moment? I reckon most of the countries are happy or downright proud they one a medal or that they made it to the olympics at the least, not stewing over the fact that they didn't win more medals than the USA.
I know us Aussie's are just proud of our athletes and the medals they have won and we hope that they do well in the other competetions they are in :)

[Rinoabella]

That's a really nice comment to read when your an Aussie, so thank you :)
And a nice comment by a Kiwi (me) to an Aussie (you) might I add ;) Nothing wrong with a little trans-tasman friendlyness here and there.

And damn right about the medals thing. NZ is a country of less than 4 million. We have 3 gold medals. I'm so proud of our little country down under! With the small number of medals we have, we can really spend time congratulating each of our winners :)

[*ETERNAL FANTASY*]

See, the real problem now is _AFTER_ the olympics.

I went to Sydney twice after the olympics and visited Olympic park and the facilities there were like...empty...twice...despite being open to the public. It's amazing how useless these gigantic structures are after the olympics. LA and Atlanta never had this problem, mainly because they're such big markets...

yea u might have only been there twice but ive grown up here before and after the olympics and trust me when i say its not "useless".... Its still used for footy games, competitions, live concerts....but mainly for sports.....so just because you've been there twice does not mean its a "useless sturcture".

Sorry bout the whole mistreatment for wearing an american t-shirt but honestly i can assure you is that theres no jealousy here in Australia mate! as long as its a good game....the people are happy.....heck were commin 3rd or fourth in the tally equalling our record here in Sydney and best record out of the country and heck were stoked here! so....there isnt any jealousy round here.... but just becase u got treated badly by some people doesnt mean all of us aussies dislike americas domminance of the games.....heck good on ya!

Again im seriously proud of how Sydney handled the games n all.....though it showed alot of cultural background in Athens....i loved Sydneys opening ceremony!

btw THORP, PHELPS, VAN DEN HOOGENVAN (sp? sorry), HACKETT....best swimming match

oh and the indoor volleyball is crazy!

Sydney rocks....!

[Dingo Jellybean]

yea u might have only been there twice but ive grown up here before and after the olympics and trust me when i say its not "useless".... Its still used for footy games, competitions, live concerts....but mainly for sports.....so just because you've been there twice does not mean its a "useless sturcture".

Sorry bout the whole mistreatment for wearing an american t-shirt but honestly i can assure you is that theres no jealousy here in Australia mate! as long as its a good game....the people are happy.....heck were commin 3rd or fourth in the tally equalling our record here in Sydney and best record out of the country and heck were stoked here! so....there isnt any jealousy round here.... but just becase u got treated badly by some people doesnt mean all of us aussies dislike americas domminance of the games.....heck good on ya!

Again im seriously proud of how Sydney handled the games n all.....though it showed alot of cultural background in Athens....i loved Sydneys opening ceremony!

btw THORP, PHELPS, VAN DEN HOOGENVAN (sp? sorry), HACKETT....best swimming match

oh and the indoor volleyball is crazy!

Sydney rocks....!

That's what I mentioned in my earlier posts...that not everyone is jealous of the US. But for countries equally as large in terms of economics and political power, you can't deny it. I think people misinterpret what I meant by my posts. I never said all people were jealous, I'm just stating that you can't deny there's people sick of the US dominating the olympics every 4 years. Especially when I see Greek newspapers insist that there was an American conspiracy to keep Kostas Kenteris out of the 200m race(the US swept this event), it just shows that some people like to point fingers at the US...even though it's not the US' fault Kenteris skipped a drug test and had a motorcycle "accident."

As for the stadiums in Sydney, which is my hometown, my family lives there and that's what they tell me. As for holding concerts, usually they hold it in the Sydney convention center. The track & field stadium is much too big to hold a concert, you would have too many open seats. The indoor pool hardly has anyone in it. My family has been to olympic stadium several times, and every time the stadium's lot is like a ghost town.

[Dingo Jellybean]

Okay, next time Stu Jackson decides to build Team USA...keep Tim Duncan and lose everyone else.

Ugh, the way Team USA lost was so embarrassing. They can't defend the 3, let alone make the 3. Any team that shoots over 50% from downtown should win the game, and that's what Argentina did. I hope they win the gold medal...but jeez, no defense whatsoever. You only have one All-NBA defensive player on the team and that's Tim Duncan. As last I saw, Tim Duncan can't guard 5 players at once...but eh.

It's good for the world that Team USA lost...but I won't put an asterisk next to this All NBA 3rd team. Even though the NBA's best players didn't bother playing on this team, Argentina should win. How the US beat a team like Spain, I'll never know.

Amazing, USA was 109-2 in Olympic play. Now they're 4-3 in these olympics.

[Kirobaito]

Had Shaq or KG decide to do these Olympics, a frontline of those three would be invincible. That doesn't mean I feel sorry in the slightest for the US. There were plenty of shooters available that this team needed (Anthony Peeler, Voshon Lenard, even <i>Wesley Person</i> for crying out loud) that they failed to go get. Instead they took guys like Emeka Okafor and LeBron James that never even really played all that much.

[CloudySky]

Damn, how can they be that bad?????! They have no idea how to play BB! I'm so pissed!!!!

BTW congrats to Argentina!

[Miriel]

On further review, Paul Hamm did win that medal.

The Korean gymnast should have lost .2 points off his score...so that means someone was snuffed out of a bronze medal. I think they mentioned something about having only 6 holds total or was it 5? But anyways, that medal Paul Hamm won was legitimate.

Judges miss mistakes ALL the time. To watch the Korean gymnast's routine in slow-mo and then point out a mistake to justify Paul Hamm's gold medal is just silly. This isn't a question of who's the better gymnast it's whether or not the medal was given to the gymnast with the most points. Everyone, from the Americans, the Koreans and the IOC acknowledge that a mathematical error determined the winner. The only real question is what to do about the mistake.

The International Gymnastics Federation today suggested to Paul Hamm that he give the medal to the Korean gymnast (which infuriated the United States Olympic Committee) but in my opinion, it doesn't even matter anymore.

I really think the South Koreans should let it go (the gymnast himself has stated that he lost because of his own mistakes, and he has to deal with that). The gold medal is tainted with controversy and whether it stays with Paul Hamm, or goes to the Korean, it can't ever give the recipient the same sense of joy or accomplishment as it could have without all the controversy.

[*ETERNAL FANTASY*]

Yea the gymnastics scores have caused quite a stirr....and after watchin it few days ago i can see why....i mean nemov did not have the best landing in high bars but to come 5th or 6th.....thats just rediculus (sp?)!

[Doc Sark]

Jealous of the USA team?

Congratulations to the Great Britain 4x100 Sprint team. Rank outsiders to take the Gold away from the Americans. Excellent display and good luck to Amir Khan today.

Britain cannot compete with the USA for total medals, to say that is utter nonsense, since the first Olypmpics I watched in Seoul, the Brits have never come close. You obviously have a problem with other peoples opinions, all you have done is throw stats at me. Statistically Claus Jensen was the highest scoring midfield player in the Premiership last season, we was sold for a million pounds, peanuts in football terms. Statistics don't do all the talking in sport, the 4x100 result should tell you that. The gold Britain won in the Equestrianism should tell you that. Carl Lewis upgrading to gold should tell you that. There are thousands of variables in sport that cannot be accounted for by statistics. The Americans have sent more athletes to every Olympic games I have watched since 1988, I think you have already stated that. And they have won them all. Do you have a job by the way?

The olympics is the only major sporting event that America have any dominance over. They can't play rugby, they can't play cricket, and despite their high FIFA ranking, they are a long way off being dominant in world Soccer. In fact their high world ranking is another example of stats in sport not working. Pretty good at Tennis though, in fact America tends to excel in individual events only (with the exception of the sports they invented so they would be the best at.). To say other countries are jealous is just an example of an egotistical American, don't be a sterotype man! I don't need help researching anything, get over yourself! I have a full time job and a degree to think about, I'm not gonna waste my time researching, at length, an arguement with an arrogant "we're the best, we're the best" american. What's the point, you've made up your mind that America rule the sporting world, who am I to argue?

[nik0tine]

America does rule the sports world. We have all the steroids we'll ever need!

[Dingo Jellybean]

Jealous of the USA team?

Congratulations to the Great Britain 4x100 Sprint team. Rank outsiders to take the Gold away from the Americans. Excellent display and good luck to Amir Khan today.

Britain cannot compete with the USA for total medals, to say that is utter nonsense, since the first Olypmpics I watched in Seoul, the Brits have never come close. You obviously have a problem with other peoples opinions, all you have done is throw stats at me. Statistically Claus Jensen was the highest scoring midfield player in the Premiership last season, we was sold for a million pounds, peanuts in football terms. Statistics don't do all the talking in sport, the 4x100 result should tell you that. The gold Britain won in the Equestrianism should tell you that. Carl Lewis upgrading to gold should tell you that. There are thousands of variables in sport that cannot be accounted for by statistics. The Americans have sent more athletes to every Olympic games I have watched since 1988, I think you have already stated that. And they have won them all. Do you have a job by the way?

The olympics is the only major sporting event that America have any dominance over. They can't play rugby, they can't play cricket, and despite their high FIFA ranking, they are a long way off being dominant in world Soccer. In fact their high world ranking is another example of stats in sport not working. Pretty good at Tennis though, in fact America tends to excel in individual events only (with the exception of the sports they invented so they would be the best at.). To say other countries are jealous is just an example of an egotistical American, don't be a sterotype man! I don't need help researching anything, get over yourself! I have a full time job and a degree to think about, I'm not gonna waste my time researching, at length, an arguement with an arrogant "we're the best, we're the best" american. What's the point, you've made up your mind that America rule the sporting world, who am I to argue?

Oh God, now you're throwing insults at me because I've proven my point? The US can't compete in Rugby, cricket, etc because _THEY DON'T PLAY_ those sports.

Carl Lewis won the gold, gasp, why? Because Ben Johnson was found guilty of steroid use. Don't even bring his name up in this matter, to do so would disgrace the best track athlete to grace international grounds.

Great Britain won that 4x100 meter relay, big deal. It was a fair victory, I'll give you that...but only because of a botched handoff...not because Britain was faster. If you're going to bring up small tidbits of Great Britain's victories, I can fill up a whole book with the victories the US have had. Not only do you not read what I say, you put words in my mouth by me saying that I said all people are jealous. I said <i>some</i> are jealous. I never once said everyone hated the US, but you act like I claim I did. I could say you're that stereotypical European that hates all things American. You're doing that now, trying to criticize the US' high FIFA ranking...trying to claim that we only dominate American-origin sports.

Sports like basketball are Canadian in origin, not American. Surely you cannot say swimming and track and field are American in origin, because their origin have not been accurately accounted for.

Also, you said _AFTER_ 1988 the US had the most athletes. So you discount whatever the United States did prior to the Seoul Olympics. That's just ignorance right there.

As for you saying you have a job, I suppose, why would you bother to reply in the first place? Don't you have a "degree" to "work" on? If you are so concentrated on your degree and job, why bother typing up lengthy replies?

If you don't agree with me, fine...don't look like a hypocrite and accuse people of not having jobs and degrees while you look the other way just because people don't agree with you.

[Rinoabella]

Alas the Olympics are over! I am eagerly awaiting the Commonwealth Games :D

[Loony BoB]

You guys can go on and on about jealousy and winning and what they win etc, but I'm pretty confident that NZ had a higher gold-medal-per-capita than a large amount of the countries ranked above 'em. ;) 3 golds, 4 million people. That's one gold for every 1.3 million. For the US to do that, they'd need to have over 190 golds. :D I think only Aussie can beat us on those grounds, actually, although I'm not entirely sure about the populations of some of the other countries.

US is good, yes, as is China and Russia and UK and whatnot. But going by the standards of smaller countries who produce more successful athletes per capita, they aren't "dominant" for any reason besides sheer numbers. So you can all shut your pie holes already. :p There is possibly a country with less than a million people that has a gold medal - those countries/nations would likely have produced a better result than any of us. :)

EDIT: Woah, I just read some posts in this thread. Dingo, calm down, man... you're taking some sentences by people I know are very relaxed and don't really watch sport that intensely and thinking that they're implying so much more than they are. Keep in mind that for most people, Olympics are something you watch and go "Ooh, yay, we won! I'm so happy for my country!" or "Aww, we didn't win, bummer. :( Oh well, maybe next time." and that's about it. Try to keep in mind that a lot of the people who will post in this thread don't really care to do much more than celebrate the wins of their own country, and how much other countries win doesn't mean much at all. Especially for small nations like us NZ'ers, we don't care about who beats us unless it's Aussie, and that's nothing to do with jealousy. :D Sandy and Kelly are both NZ'ers, so I doubt they'd even care about how many medals are won by the other nations, they'd concentrate on NZ's victories. To the average NZ'er, nothing else matters.

[Dingo Jellybean]

EDIT: Woah, I just read some posts in this thread. Dingo, calm down, man... you're taking some sentences by people I know are very relaxed and don't really watch sport that intensely and thinking that they're implying so much more than they are. Keep in mind that for most people, Olympics are something you watch and go "Ooh, yay, we won! I'm so happy for my country!" or "Aww, we didn't win, bummer. :( Oh well, maybe next time." and that's about it. Try to keep in mind that a lot of the people who will post in this thread don't really care to do much more than celebrate the wins of their own country, and how much other countries win doesn't mean much at all. Especially for small nations like us NZ'ers, we don't care about who beats us unless it's Aussie, and that's nothing to do with jealousy. :D Sandy and Kelly are both NZ'ers, so I doubt they'd even care about how many medals are won by the other nations, they'd concentrate on NZ's victories. To the average NZ'er, nothing else matters.

BoB, before I go on, I respect your opinions and I have nothing against you after/before/during this post. But this is where you're wrong.

I never lashed out at anyone(unless someone lashed at me), if you carefully read the posts...I explained my side of the story.

People always criticize the US about the most number of athletes means most number of medals. I've always defended that side of it and my factual stats prove it, I even offered proof. We can go on and on about quantity vs. quality. 24 athletes were tested positive for these olympics for steroid use, none of them American...that should speak volumes. Only 1/4 athletes in these Olympics were tested, but even the cheaters were kept out of the olympics by the US. So many of the gold medals won by the US were not even favorites to win.

I never said everyone was jealous, I said <u>some</u> are jealous. I don't know why people overlook that. <b>Some != all.</b> If you want to go through Gold medals per capita, I can go through gold medals per event. Gold per capita is useless in this case because a more accurate measure is gold per number of athletes. The USOC recognizes just over 2 million athletes this past year. I'm not sure how much other countries OC recognize, but still...just 2 million participating in the olympics(whether it's in the world championships, trials, etc.) out of a population of about 293 mil isn't exactly sheer(if you want to go on relative terms).

I know there are people who don't care, that's not what's at dispute. What I'm saying is that I'm sick of people saying the US wins just because they have more athletes. Funny how those people(like BoB, and Doc) never have lived in the US. I've been near these athletes and seen how hard they work. I can't imagine why people would criticize the US like that other than jealousy. Am I saying everyone is jealous? No. That's an ignorant comment. You can't deny there is <u>some</u> jealousy.

People tend to "false praise" the US athletes. They say the US has the best athletes...(they should stop here)...but then go on to say they wouldn't be so great if they didn't dominate their "own" sports and that they just have the most athletes. That's pretty much an insult in disguise.

Bottom line: The US has better athletes(overall) simply by being better. That's it. Don't go on to criticize the athletes who worked their whole lives only to be shot down with ignorant comments like "more athletes means more medals." They are good because they worked hard, trained smart, and often are monetarily rewarded.

[Loony BoB]

I disagree that you have the best athletes as it's impossible to compare them with overseas people. Just because they don't have as fancy a facility doesn't mean anything, as you said it's how hard you train, and Russians or Cubans or Romanians, they all train just as hard.

I don't know how many people train to be athletes in other countries but I can't see it being too far in difference when it comes to per capita. I won't say there is no jealousy, though, I can see what you mean there. I just think that you accused (or questioned) people who were posting nothing to do with being jealous or against US, y'no.

Otherwise I can pretty much agree with everything else you said, I think, so yay.

EDIT: When you say you have better athletes overall, you overlook the fact that in countries outside NZ, most of the sports that are #1, #2 and #3 - possibly even #4 - are all not played in the Olympics, and therefore Olympics isn't any way to judge overall ability. I don't think anyone can honestly say who has the overall better athletes (per population or per athlete). NZ, for example - Cricket? Rugby? Rugby League? Netball? Maybe Netball, if any of them, but I don't think it was there. I don't know what comes after that but I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't played at the Olympics either. I'm not saying NZ is the best in the world, I'm just saying you have to take into consideration that most US Sports are played there and therefore most US athletes are competing. A lot of countries, like NZ, do not have their top athletes performing at the Olympics.

[Rinoabella]

Especially for small nations like us NZ'ers, we don't care about who beats us unless it's Aussie, and that's nothing to do with jealousy. :D Sandy and Kelly are both NZ'ers, so I doubt they'd even care about how many medals are won by the other nations, they'd concentrate on NZ's victories. To the average NZ'er, nothing else matters.
Quite right, mate!

edit: Might I add that NZ could not afford to send many of their atheletes to Athens. I'm sure a lot of other (small) countries couldn't either!

[Skogs]

Basically, I'd say that for a country to do well (meaning win stacks of medals) at the Olympics it needs at least two of:

1) a large population.
2) a strong economy.
3) a large fanbase.

USA wins because it has a quarter billion people, and has stacks of money to throw at athletes. As far as China is concerned, they aren't as rich as the US, but they have five times the population - so there will be more people who have the potential to be of Olympic standard. Russia is a smaller than the US, and has a pretty wonky economy, but it'll still have much of the Soviet sports infrastructure left over so the legacy still perists. Australia, although very small in comparison, throws stacks and stacks of money at our athletes - and in addition we are a sports-mad country - so naturally we do well. Japan in fifth is pretty big and also boasts a strong economy.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that there is no single factor that should determine the Olympic success of a certain country. No counrty is 'just that good'. There are a variety of reasons why this may be.

And I tip China to top the medal table at Beijing. Home advantage, I imagine, will play strongly into their hands.

[Imperia]

I think everyone is good in at the Olympics in one way or another. There's no reason we should argue about who's better.