So did Anakin fullfill the prophecy and bring balance to the force

[darkchrono]

So do you think after seeing the entire six movies that Anakin truly was the chosen one and did bring balance to the force. Or was Luke the real chosen one.

Also the mother that Leia was telling Luke about in Return of the Jedi must not have been Padme after all. The mother that Leia was thinking about must have been Bail Organa's(think that is his name)wife.

If so, I wonder why Luke would have been told that the people who raised him were not his real parents but not Leia.

And just on a side note. That was one mighty swipe of the lightsaber that Obi Won gave Anakin to be able to cut off an arm and two legs with a single swing. Wow. How come Obi didn't kick Anakin's butt earlier in the contest if he would have been able to beat him that easily.

[Sefie1999AD]

I think Anakin was the chosen one, and he fulfilled the prophecy by killing Palpatine / Darth Sidious. After that, he died too, and so all the Sith were gone. As for the confusion of parents, I watched Return of the Jedi today, and I still don't know whether Leia was referring to Padmé or Mrs. Organa. Luke was quite clearly trying to ask about Padmé, though.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

For a long time, at any one time, there were two Sith and a whole bunch of Jedi. At the end of RotS, there are two Sith and two Jedi. I'd say he certainly did fulfill the prophecy. Like Yoda said, the Jedi just misinterpreted what "balance to the Force" meant.

[TheAbominatrix]

Anakin wasnt the Chosen One. Luke was, and Luke brought balance to the Force.

edit: Kishi has a good point though. The Jedi assumed balance would be in their favor, but whose to say whether it is or not.

Luke was taken in by his Aunt and Uncle, so there was no reason to say they were his parents. He was with family, while Leia was not, and Bail chose to raise her as his own. It would probably be less suspicious this way.

Obi-Wan won at the end because he finally gained the upper hand. He didnt hav ethe upper hand the entire time. Plus, he may have been holding back. He cared for Anakin very much, so it was hard for him to strike down his friend.

[Super Christ]

I'd say that he did bring balance to the force. He killed all the Jedi, and then killed all the sith. As Kishi said, the Jedi don't seem to understand the meaning of balance.

Then his son had to screw it up by living past the RotJ. :)

[Shlup]

I always thought the Jedi's definition of "balance" was a bit off myself. Good to see I'm not the only one.

[Nephiliam]

For a long time, at any one time, there were two Sith and a whole bunch of Jedi. At the end of RotS, there are two Sith and two Jedi. I'd say he certainly did fulfill the prophecy. Like Yoda said, the Jedi just misinterpreted what "balance to the Force" meant.

This is exactly what I thought. he brought order, just not the kind they thought. He evened out the Sith and the Jedi.

[XxSephirothxX]

For a long time, at any one time, there were two Sith and a whole bunch of Jedi. At the end of RotS, there are two Sith and two Jedi. I'd say he certainly did fulfill the prophecy. Like Yoda said, the Jedi just misinterpreted what "balance to the Force" meant.
That's what I always thought. Luke was The Chosen One Mk. II.

[Del Murder]

I think kishi and Seph99 are both correct. The Jedi misinterpreted the prophesy, which led to the balance in numbers of Jedi/Sith, but also Anakin was the one who eventually wiped out the Sith. It could be taken both ways.

[JAS4Yeshua]

Something to consider:

While Yoda and Obi-Wan were the last "official" Jedi of the Republic, those with Jedi powers still existed. There were even those working for the Emperor who had been trained in the Jedi arts.

I don't think the "balance" was the reduction of the Jedi to two individuals. I think the balance comes about after Anakin/Darth Vader kills Palpatine in Ep 6. By leaving only Luke, who is not like the Jedi of old, Luke, IMO, is the balance of the force. So Anakin brought the balance by:

1) Being the father of Luke
2) Killing off all the Jedi, and later the last of the Sith, leaving only Luke

[Excelsior]

anakin was the chosen one, and he did bring balance to the force. its not an opinion, if you think it was luke, your wrong. not only did anakin kill all the light jedis, but he killed all the sith, including himself. although, he wouldnt have done it without luke, fo sho, but it was definately him who did it, and he saved lukes life doing it too.

[nik0tine]

While Yoda and Obi-Wan were the last "official" Jedi of the Republic, those with Jedi powers still existed. There were even those working for the Emperor who had been trained in the Jedi arts. Like Kyle Katarn and the seven dark jedi, with thier sinister plot to uncover the ancient jedi burial grounds. hahaha:lol:hahaha

[Sefie1999AD]

I also thought the prophecy meant what Kishi said. However, I think it was said somewhere that the restoring of the balance did mean the destruction of the Sith. That's because the Jedi were using the Force for knowledge and defence, while the Sith were trying to manipulate it and use it for power. It's a bit why I believe Lifestream/Holy only destroyed Jenova because it was outside the Planet, but it left humans and other creatures intact because they were a part of the Planet. It's all about interpreting, really, and only Lucas and co really know which way they meant the prophecy to be.

[FF Junkie]

So do you think after seeing the entire six movies that Anakin truly was the chosen one and did bring balance to the force. Or was Luke the real chosen one.

Also the mother that Leia was telling Luke about in Return of the Jedi must not have been Padme after all. The mother that Leia was thinking about must have been Bail Organa's(think that is his name)wife.

If so, I wonder why Luke would have been told that the people who raised him were not his real parents but not Leia.

And just on a side note. That was one mighty swipe of the lightsaber that Obi Won gave Anakin to be able to cut off an arm and two legs with a single swing. Wow. How come Obi didn't kick Anakin's butt earlier in the contest if he would have been able to beat him that easily.

Okay, last one before I go to bed...seriously this time..and I'll be much more brief too :) ....
As for the prophecy, I already covered the logic behind that in a different thread.. I'm too tired to figure out how to link to it here though... but yes, no doubt Anakin fulfilled the prophecy.

As for the whole Leia and her mom thing...that was one of a bunch of little plot inconsistency errors Lucas has admitted to over the years. Another small one comes when Obi-Wan's spirit is talking with Master Yoda, trying to convince him to train Luke. During the plea, Obi-Wan says that Yoda trained him in the ways of the Force... clearly an error, as we've all seen Liam Neeson's amazing Qui-Gonn Jinn performance :) (Note: there are some that'd argue that this isn't TECHNICALLY an error, as at the very end of Episode 3 Yoda does set Obi-Wan on the path to learning how to become one with the force in death, a technique he'd learned from Qui-Gonn (who learned it from Whill shaman in turn- it's deleted scenes stuff :) ).

As for the Obi-Wan/Anakin duel..... next to the Mace/Palpatine duel, that was the scene I worried would mislead people the most, due to how it's potentially interpreted from the movie representation. You see, Obi-Wan couldn't beat Anakin at all, in a fair fight. If you watch the movie closely, you'll notice that in the course of that entire duel, Obi-Wan is basically back-pedaling in order to lessen Anakin's attacking prowess during at least 80% of the battle. Obi-Wan himself even admits to Anakin as he's leaving to search out General Grievous that Anakin is a more powerful Jedi than he could ever even dream of becomming. By the start of Episode 3 the hierarchy of potency in the Jedi ranks isn't completely clear, but there are certainly three that stand out head and shoulders above the rest: Yoda, Mace Windu and Anakin. Obi-Wan would be fourth, for sure, but how the top three would be ranked is a bit hard to tell. Yoda is just above Mace, but it's hard to tell where Anakin would rank, as he hasn't reached his full potential at this point (and indeed never does as a Jedi- nor as a 50%+ robotic Sith in all actuality). Another complicating factor in the equation is the fact that in this movie when Anakin achieves his greatest power/ skill levels, he's clearly acting on emotion and thus dabbling into the Dark Side of the force. He DOES mop the floor with Dooku, who earned a draw with Yoda in episode 2, so one could argue that Anakin is tops in the Jedi ranks at this point. However, as stated, he's acting on his anger when he does so, which makes him stronger... this is made quite clear in the official script as well... anyways, I'm getting too in-depth and off topic, so I'll just stop there with that.. at least for now.
Ultimately, the point is that Obi-Wan could never hope to defeat Anakin, had it not been for the topographical advantage he enjoyed. Again, the script makes the high ground advantage he gains much more of a point, whereas the screen interpretation makes it look like he's simply 5 or so feet higher up than Anakin ( I consider this one of those little plot errors again). As for that swing of his, Anakin basically is cocky and pig-headed and jumps right into it..... QUICK sidenote... one I'm sure any Darth Maul fans'll agree with- this is QUITE annoying to me.. that Obi-Wan seizes the high ground advantage by reacting and cutting into an aerial opponent.... recall the end of episode 1, where Darth Maul has Obi-Wan in the disadvantageous position. As Obi-Wan jumps, uses the force to seize Jinn's lightsaber, flips in mid-air, lands, catches and ignites the lightsaber and FINALLY cuts Maul in-half, all Maul supposedly can do is turn around and put out this silly look (looks like 1 part surprised, 3 parts constipated and trying to push to me :p ). Now Obi-Wan was in much more dire straits than Anakin, and he took much longer to carry out his attack... so how in the WORLD could Maul not have the reaction capabilities to ignite his darn lightsaber and let Obi-Wan split himself right down the middle?! lol... it is just absurd... ANYONE could have reacted to that, at least had time to get their saber ready to go again...but having "Jedi reflexes" is a BASE ability to even recognize if someone can be trained as a Jedi... Maul was taking on TWO Jedi at the same time and mopping the floor with them (while he WAS the one travelling backwards and thus in the defensive postion, one of those Jedi was constantly getting a boot to the face or torso :) ). You obviously need better than average reflexes to do this... so what happened to said reflexes when Obi-Wan took 7 years to do his circus thing and kill him? lol.. no one has to answer... just frustrated me that such a great villain could be sacrificed to such an anti-climactic and indeed laughable end.
Good day to all... I'll try and get back on here this afternoon to check in :)

[TheAbominatrix]

Yoda is involved in the training of all Jedi... he's the teacher of the Initiate classes, as we see in Episode II. Obi-Wan was most likely trained in a clan (we see the Bear Clan in AotC) by Yoda as an Initiate, and then when he was of age to become a padawan (13 is the average age) he was taken on as a student by Qui-Gon Jinn.

[Cloud No.9]

the force is balanced with the genocide of the jedi in episode 3. you have two sith (there was always two sith) and two jedi (was lots and lots of them before). the gonocide leaves darth vader and sidious against yoda and obi wan.

the death of obi wan sees luke emerge as a jedi master which keeps the balance. yoda's death leaves the force unbalanced or maybe not. at this point darth vader is trapped in two minds. he is almost between the two sides (luke is having the same transition). this culminates in his killing of the emperor. his death leaves luke. he is not the jedi of old. he is capable of anger and hate as seen in the way he fights his father. but at the same time he is still a jedi and is able to control his dark side.

the genocide starts the balance and it is continued throughout the original films.

[muchacho]

FF junkie, the one thing i disagree with is the yoda being above mace in the saber duelest. in episode 3 mace windu easily takes palpatine down, even when palpatine is in the "defensive back pedal". yoda also fights palpatine, but he loses. i think that yoda is stronger in the force, but mace is the better duelest.

this may sound crazy, but maybe anikan was better than yoda in saber duelest. yoda came to a "draw" with dooku, where as anikan wiped the floor with him in ep.3.

i dont know, its just some thing to think about.......

[RSL]

I think Palpatine allowed Windu to defeat him in order to force Anakin into a decision. I could be wrong but that's how I interpreted the situation.

[JAS4Yeshua]

I agree with RSL. It seemed more like Palpatine was manipulating things to "prove" to Anakin that the Jedi were the ones that were wrong. Although why he became withered as a result? Perhaps it had something to do with the purple lightsaber? I've heard the different colors have different powers, but I don't know what they are off hand.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Mace's purple lightsaber has the power of funk.

[Sepho]

I think he became withered because it takes a certain amount of Force power and/or concentration to maintain the form he kept while maintaining his role as Chancellor Palpatine (not his "natural", dark side-influenced, Sith form), and while he was using the Force lightning, he just let himself go in order to concentrate on and lend more power to his lightning. Maybe.

[JAS4Yeshua]

That sounds plausible, especially considering whenever he addressed people as Darth Sidious, he always had his hood over his face, to mask his features. So you never know, he could have been whithered the whole time. And perhaps he let his appearance revert to normal to add to the effect for turning Anakin to the dark side.

[VampireCrono]

Anakin did fulfill the prophecy, but it wasn't as people thought it would be fulfilled, the same with the Jedi. He did balance the force out, but Obi Wan actually unbalanced it by letting himself get killed, since Luke was nowhere near being a Jedi Knight at that point in the Death Star, I mean he couldn't even deflect lasers from that ball thing. As for FF's point...well...OK, we see Obi Wan on the bring of getting owned. Suddenly, he realizes that he can jump over Maul and use Qui Gon's lightsaber to kill him. I have two explanations for this, one is me taking a shot in the dark, and another one is making an inference. Inference: Maul was too slow for Obi Wan, who was already pumped after seeing his Jedi master fall (not in a negative way, but out of....well..love I guess. After all, the bond between master and padawan's are very very strong.) As for the shot in the dark. Ok, the Sith's use anger to their advantage right? Anger clouds judgement, and makes you unfocused to a point right? The Jedi use the force to their advantage, using it to predict moves or to give them strength. Anger for the siths is like a steroid. It makes them a lot more powerful, and faster as well. Maul could not predict Obi Wan would do that in that split second. I'm taking this because Maul was like "WTFUX, HOW U B DOIN DAT DAWG" and then he got owned. I mean, wouldn't he be smiling if he knew what he was doing? No he was scared and suprised.

Now to address why Anakin lost. Well, I mean Obi Wan even said, I have the high ground. Anakin disregarded this, and Obi Wan, who guessed correctly that Anakin would jump towards him either or above or at him, sliced him up. I mean, Anakin was known to make rash decisions, and he was already like "OMG I R UNBETABLE!!!!!!111111@", so who wouldn't think Anakin would try to kill Obi Wan? He's not just going to give up right there, I mean, come on, after seeing Anakin in the story, he's not one to give up, and will keep pushing until he reaches his goal.

I do believe that Leia meant Padme when she described her, because, if you saw the movie, you saw and heard even from the robot doctor that she had basically given up on life. I mean, she's happy that she had the baby, but sad that Anakin has turned to the dark side, after all, Anakin was married to her out of the enormous love they shared for eachother.

[Rainecloud]

Luke certainly didn't fulfill the prophecy - Anakin did. Who threw Darth Sidious down the shaft? Anakin. Who was being electrocuted by the Emperor at the time, screaming like a giant wuss? Luke.

Luke simply defeated the Emperor by proxy. Anakin was the real hero here.

[TheAbominatrix]

Leia couldnt mean Padme. She talks about remembering her mother. The smell of her perfume, little things about her. She "died when I was very young". Not at childbirth. She wouldnt speak of a woman she didnt remember, especially since she believed Bail was her father, and Bail's wife was her mother.

[Mo-Nercy]

Sure he did. He killed all the Jedi until there were two remaining. Two Sith. Two Jedi. Balance achieved. xD

[RSL]

Leia couldnt mean Padme. She talks about remembering her mother. The smell of her perfume, little things about her. She "died when I was very young". Not at childbirth. She wouldnt speak of a woman she didnt remember, especially since she believed Bail was her father, and Bail's wife was her mother.

I agree with this. I haven't watched the original trilogy in a long time, but I think the part where she mentioned remembering her mother was before she even knew she was luke's twin and Anakin's daughter.

[Shlup]

I thought that Leia was talking about her adopted mother was obvious. :tongue:

[TheAbominatrix]

It's obvious, but people get confused at times.

[FF Junkie]

FF junkie, the one thing i disagree with is the yoda being above mace in the saber duelest. in episode 3 mace windu easily takes palpatine down, even when palpatine is in the "defensive back pedal". yoda also fights palpatine, but he loses. i think that yoda is stronger in the force, but mace is the better duelest.

this may sound crazy, but maybe anikan was better than yoda in saber duelest. yoda came to a "draw" with dooku, where as anikan wiped the floor with him in ep.3.

i dont know, its just some thing to think about.......

I completely agree with you on Mace being more skilled with a lightsaber than Yoda; it was just a simple misinterpretation. I was ranking the Jedi based on overall power, which would have to take into account both the mental side and physical side of the force. I've argued that very point with friends for some time now. It's the same thing with the Sith... When it comes to the mental aspects and overall mastery of the dark side powers, there's no doubt that Sidious is the man (I'm talking about the Sith we see in the movies: he, Dooku, Vader and Maul). But similarly, I don't think anyone would be able to put up much of an agument against Darth Maul being by far and away the most skilled lightsaber user out of the bunch.
I've seen Mace and Yoda's comparison in just the same way. Mace is the man when it comes to using the lightsaber, but Yoda's wisdom and knowledge of the mental side of the force is leaps and bounds above any other Jedi with the exception of Anakin. That's why I said that OVERALL Yoda is either first or second in the Jedi ranks, with Windu second or third (depending on how Anakin is ranked, based on the fact he uses his anger to draw up his most powerful attacks).

[FF Junkie]

I agree with RSL. It seemed more like Palpatine was manipulating things to "prove" to Anakin that the Jedi were the ones that were wrong. Although why he became withered as a result? Perhaps it had something to do with the purple lightsaber? I've heard the different colors have different powers, but I don't know what they are off hand.

LOL... his becomming withered is a pretty simple matter.... you DO realize that as he's trying to use force lightning on Windu, Mace overpowers him and forces the lightning back onto Palpatine, right? And once Mace has done so, Sidious is unable to control the power and he is basically FRYING himself. The deformity comes about as a result of Palpatine's power being turned against himself, which of course the lightning is essentially cooking him... when things are cooking, water evaporates..when you lose water from living cells, it's like a balloon in that it'll shrivel up as it gets smaller...remove volume from any object that's been stretched due to the sheer volume contained therein, and it shrivels, loses elasticity, and gives you that whole "saggy boob" look. I just LOOOVE that now no one can forget about Mace even in the old trilogy.... every time you see Palpatine you're reminded that his distortion is due to Mace, the Jedi who'd have killed him had it not been for the combined efforts of the two most powerful guys in the galaxy.

By the way, I like where you're going with the theory that Palpatine was letting Windu win, BUT I have to disagree with you there. If he were looking to further manipulate Anakin into turning, he could have simply surrendered when first confronted by Mace and his entourage, and then continued to use his mental connection with Anakin to wear him down and get him to rescue him as he did once before. He chose to fight, and got outdueled, it's as simple as that. I believe he'd already been disarmed and was lying on the window ledge before Anakin had even entered the room. Then he started out with his cowardish little pleas, simply because he had no way of surviving without help at that point. If he were looking to MAKE Anakin choose, he'd be putting his life in Anakin's hands and have no say of his own as to whether he'd live or die... he clearly didn't choose that path. As I said, he DID continue to push Anakin to turn and save him, but it's 'cuz that's all he could do... he TRIED a last ditch attack while floored by Windu, using force lighting... Windu was just too strong and turned it back on him... then in the end Palpatine's life truly was in Anakin's hands, but only because he'd been so thoroughly thrashed by Mace.

Also, there's a whole lot of confusion over the notion of the Prophecy of the one...the prophecy states that the one will destroy the Sith and that is how there will be balance to the Force (yeah, it's weird how it's not really balance at all, just one side being eliminated). The whole root of this debate comes when Yoda makes his little statement about how the Jedi may have misinterpreted the prophecy. It's not a misinterpretation; they just didn't realize that it'd be a tragic path to get there. I believe that the statement is made after Anakin's already turned to the Dark Side. Of course when you see the person who is to fulfill the prophecy killing little kids in a surveillance video, your faith in the idea that he'll bring about an end to the greatest threat and evil in the galaxy will be a little shaken! But nonetheless the prophecy IS true, and is fulfilled when Anakin kills Palpatine and then dies himself.. there are no more Sith, and the balance eluded to in the prophecy is achieved.

[FF Junkie]

I think he became withered because it takes a certain amount of Force power and/or concentration to maintain the form he kept while maintaining his role as Chancellor Palpatine (not his "natural", dark side-influenced, Sith form), and while he was using the Force lightning, he just let himself go in order to concentrate on and lend more power to his lightning. Maybe.

Nope, that was his natural form.. he was a human, just like Mace, Anakin and Obi Wan... you can never see his eyes when he's wearing his dark robe in the first two movies, but you can see his profile view and a frontal view of him several times throughout the first two movies, and it's clear that he doesn't have any deformities. I've attached a few such photos so you can see the difference... When deformed, Sidious' entire face droops, making his face much wider at the bottom and very wrinkly. You only see this post-Windu battle (the pic of Sidious with the lightsaber).

[JAS4Yeshua]

I see your points, FF Junkie. Thing was, it didn't look to me that Mace was directing the energy back at Sidious. It appeared like his lightsaber was absorbing the energy. And since Anakin did come in later, I can see your point about the manipulation. Sidious was actually losing. Question is, was he as bad off as he claimed to be when asking Anakin for help? It is obvious he is powerful, perhaps he could have gotten out of that situation, if nothing else, to turn into a draw against Mace. Instead, he further showed Anakin what he wanted Anakin to see, and thus turned Anakin to his side.

[withered]

Anakin kills Darth Sidius the end. It is not then till balance is restored.
Difference between the Sith and the Jedi is that Jedi use the force, the Sith control (or are controlled by it's dark will whatever you care to think). So even with a few Sith they are more powerful than the Jedi and therefore distort the balance. That is how I know it anyway.

[TheAbominatrix]

The Sith and the Jedi both use the Force. It comes from the difference in how they use it. The Sith use it with passionate emotions, and have no qualms about using anything they possibly can, which gives them a wider array of powers. A Jedi could use a Force choke, for example, but wouldnt, as it's considered taboo and wrong for them to do it.

[theundeadhero]

I think Anakin brought about the balance and that Luke was the balance of the force. He wasn't like the old Jedi. The old good Jedis ignored their emotions and used the force in a way that was logical. The old bad Jedis used the force in a passionate way to bring about their will. Luke used both, in a way. Luke fought with his passion, but used his mind to control his passions. He balanced the force by using both sides of it. Other than Luke, Anakin and the Sith were the only to other Jedis, except maybe possibly Leiah. Anakin killed the sith, and himself pretty much, thus leaving the only Jedi Luke, who was a balanced Jedi. Anakin brought it out.

[FF Junkie]

I see your points, FF Junkie. Thing was, it didn't look to me that Mace was directing the energy back at Sidious. It appeared like his lightsaber was absorbing the energy. And since Anakin did come in later, I can see your point about the manipulation. Sidious was actually losing. Question is, was he as bad off as he claimed to be when asking Anakin for help? It is obvious he is powerful, perhaps he could have gotten out of that situation, if nothing else, to turn into a draw against Mace. Instead, he further showed Anakin what he wanted Anakin to see, and thus turned Anakin to his side.

Okay... think back to Episode 2 on this one... When Obi-Wan and Dooku are having it out. Dooku attempts to use lightning on him, but Kenobi just holds out his lightsaber and absorbs it. No emotion or signs of struggle or anything on his face..just the concentration needed to make sure he intercepts the blast... Now fast forward to the Windu/ Palpatine fight. When Palpatine is trying to use his force lighting on Mace, you see Windu's face full of struggle, and as you see this, you also see him push his lightsaber closer and closer to Palpatine... that's where we're supposed to see he's pushing the power back onto Palpatine. Plus, you see Palpatine becomming engulfed in the lightning. It's running over his entire body, you can see it in his face as he's being fried and distorted, just like you see it going through Vader in Episode 6 as he lifts Palpatine and kills him. Any other time the force lightning is used, it simply leaves the fingers of the ones that use it; thus it's not doubling back on them and causing them any damage. In this scene Lucas conveys, via the lightning engulfing/mutilating Palpatine and Windu forcing his sword closer and closer to Palpatine, that Windu is indeed turning his powers against him.
Thus, one could say that Mace truly was winning. And you could also argue that Sidious really was that weak by that point... I mean, if you'd been COOKED for all that time like he was, it'd take a lot more out of you than just all that water that'd evaporate. (Technically, the biggest threat'd be to any systems utilizing the sodium/potassium pump, as when the charges would be altered by the lightning energy things such as heart beat and other vital involuntary functions involving the nervous system would go to pot, but I won't bore anyone with the biology of that one :) )

[JAS4Yeshua]

One thing to think of in Episode 2 as well, Dooku wasn't as powerful as Sidious. He was powerful, yes, but perhaps the energy levels he put out wasn't at the strength of Sideous, which is why Mace had more of a struggle. That, and Mace was actually moving forward, which probably was more of a struggle than just Obi-Wan who stood his ground.

Besides, I'm not denying that he was weakened, all I'm saying is that Sidious probably made it appear worse than it was. He was losing, but I believe he still could have escaped, but was using the losing situation to his advantage.

[FF Junkie]

I think Anakin brought about the balance and that Luke was the balance of the force. He wasn't like the old Jedi. The old good Jedis ignored their emotions and used the force in a way that was logical. The old bad Jedis used the force in a passionate way to bring about their will. Luke used both, in a way. Luke fought with his passion, but used his mind to control his passions. He balanced the force by using both sides of it. Other than Luke, Anakin and the Sith were the only to other Jedis, except maybe possibly Leiah. Anakin killed the sith, and himself pretty much, thus leaving the only Jedi Luke, who was a balanced Jedi. Anakin brought it out.

Before addressing all of this, I'll first post a direct portion of the history of the Jedi and Sith, as evidence of where my argument stems from. This is taken directly from S u p e r s h a d o w . c o m, which I'm certain most Star Wars fans know all about. The guy who runs this site is one of Lucas' buds, and he collaborated with Lucas in coming up with all information contained therein. He's also the guy who Lucas gave permission to post the official episode 3 script over a month before the movie was released. Here it is:

".....Sadly, in Sinis’ lifetime, the Dark Jedi were created by a rogue Jedi named Zooti Frugan. Dark Jedi could act as free agents, choosing any color of light saber they could create and even training themselves without a master. These Dark Jedi studied both sides of the Force, but emphasized the dark side or the Bogan. With the rebellion of Zooti Froogan and others, the Jedi Council under Kaja Sinis saw that an imbalance had been created, so the practice of studying the dark side was disbanded. Nonetheless, the Dark Jedi were already flourishing.

The Sith were conquered by Dark Jedi who adopted their form of magic in Sinis’ lifetime. These Jedi called themselves Sith Lords. The first known Sith Lord of recorded history was Darth Scarz. In imitation of the Jedi Holocron, the Sith made their own holocron, the Sith Holocron. The tension between the two sides eventually came to a head at the Battle of Omicras, the first major conflict between the Sith and Jedi. Nonetheless, the Sith Lords remained and continued to grow the Sith Order including non-Sith species in their Order, as one Sith Dynasty succeeded another."

So you see this brief portion can clear up a lot of debates we've been having on here. For starters, it clearly states that the imbalance in the force came about once people started to use it for evil purposes. There were no Dark Jedi and no Sith in the beginning. All Jedi were trained in both the light and dark side of the force. However, once a number of them started to overuse the dark side and turned evil, acting selfishly rather than selflessly, the imbalance came about. Thus, the balance would only come about again once the force were only used for good. This logically means that the Sith must be destroyed, as they use the force for selfish purposes.

Interestingly enough, based on this I could definitely see your point about Luke being the balance of the force, as he would represent the traditional Jedi, the way the Jedi originally were, being able to use both sides of the force for good.

This excerpt also briefly covers the origin of the Sith. There were always a lot of them, but their in-fighting lead Darth Bane to come up with the rule of two, which is still in place when Anakin brings the Sith to an end. However, just because the Sith have been defeated doesn't mean that the evil Jedi are done for as well, as there are still Dark Jedi in the universe. I won't really get into more of it here, as it's quite lengthy. It's a good read though, for anyone interested.

One thing to think of in Episode 2 as well, Dooku wasn't as powerful as Sidious. He was powerful, yes, but perhaps the energy levels he put out wasn't at the strength of Sideous, which is why Mace had more of a struggle. That, and Mace was actually moving forward, which probably was more of a struggle than just Obi-Wan who stood his ground.

Besides, I'm not denying that he was weakened, all I'm saying is that Sidious probably made it appear worse than it was. He was losing, but I believe he still could have escaped, but was using the losing situation to his advantage.

True... Sidious was the most powerful force user in the galaxy at the time, and he may well have been overexaggerating a bit, but the fact that his very powers were being turned against him still can't be denied if you watch the movie closely. That is what leads to Windu's struggling moreso than anything, in my opinion.

<b>Edit by Kishi: Stop double-posting.</b>

[theundeadhero]

Interestingly enough, based on this I could definitely see your point about Luke being the balance of the force, as he would represent the traditional Jedi, the way the Jedi originally were, being able to use both sides of the force for good.
Exactly my point . Neither the good or bad Jedi were balanced at the time of Anakin. Only after Luke were the Jedi balanced again.