A big wad of theories. (BIG SPOILERS)

[Croyles]

There havnt been many new threads or posts in this forum so i decided to fire it up a bit.
They arent my theories. Heres a link to an interresting article that delves deeply into the ff7 story and its many unanswered questions:

http://www.ffshrine.org/ff7/ff7_theory.php

I found this really interesting, but however there was still some things that im not sure of. I think this thread doesnt require people to wrap spoiler tags around any spoilers as its a thread basicly based on spoilers anyway.

heres an email i sent to him since he asked people to give him/her feedback on theories:

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" Perhaps we are overstating the power of Holy. When it emerges from the Northern crater and moves underneath Meteor it seems to resemble a shield, rather than some kind of magical force. Indeed, I would wager that Holy isn’t as powerful as Bugenhagen made it appear to be. Holy’s purpose was essentially a Meteor counter, not a giant reset button for the Planet. In this way, the Cetra fashioned it as a shield that would envelop the Planet, keeping all foreign objects off of its surface for a certain period of time (probably until a sufficient blast occurred which it would interpret as Meteor’s dissolution). "

Ok, all evidence seems to be pointing that Holy was designed by the Cetra to save the planet from another thing crashing down to the planet, such as a Meteor. But you said yourself that the creators of Holy/Holy itselfs true intention is to actually/also eliminate or threaten etc anything that causes damage or any kind of harm to the planet. In this case when Meteor hit it helped it (e.g. "had the OPPOSITE effect") because humans were causing harm to the planet.

But because you said that Holy was such a powerfull thing and instead only a shield to protect against meteors, doesnt that mean that Holy would have expected a meteor all the time so it can use that chance to destroy humanity? Or could this mean, even with all the evidence, mainly bugenhagens holy scene, that holys intention was never to eliminate humans, but simply arrived to late to protect the meteor because it was being held back and therefore somehow caused the oppisite effect? Remember, before Red XIII said it is having the oppisite effect he said "It is too late for Holy."

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Im not sure if its true, but i remember a rumour somewhere about the disease Geostigma in FF7:AC to be caused by Holy (or was it the lifestream?). Could this mean that Holy tried to stop Meteor and simultaniously unleashed a disease that would wipe out the threat that humans created and was therefore had much more power than to just be a shield force and really was all that powerfull that Bugenhagen stated it would be/was?

NOTE: Concerning another theory from the url, i disagree with this guys theory that Aeris's death was meaningless as i agree with Squall of Seed's evidence that her deaths purpose was to give the player a sense of reality.

EDIT (this is like my 6000th one): Remember, these are only THEORIES, even with evidence (not proof! what i mean is, he was able to back up his points with evidence but did not have any PROOF that suggested that these things are DEFINITELY true)

[Masamune·1600]

While the specifics of Holy and Meteor are never fully explored in FFVII, the player can make a number of logical assumptions concerning the true effects of both spells. Meteor is fairly simplistic. It is the Ultimate Destructive Magic (as stated in the game), causing small planets to collide. As noted in the game:


Aeris: ...this must be magic. Just what Sephiroth was saying. The Ultimate
Destructive Magic, Meteor. It finds small drifting planets with its magic. And
then collides with them.

This can lead to further specualtion, though; the ability of a materia to influence powers beyond the direct scope of Gaia could suggest a number of ideas. Perhaps the Black Materia was corrupted by JENOVA (recall that JENOVA also arrived via a catastrophic impact with the planet). Perhaps the concept of Lifestream is not exclusive to Gaia; this would explain the apparent hold of the magic of the Black Materia over an extraterrestrial body. On the other hand, Bugenhagen does suggest that all souls of the universe return to the Lifestream of the Planet.


Bugenhagen: Ho Ho Hoooo. Yes, it is something, isn't it? Well, let's get to the
subject. Eventually... all humans die. What happens to them after they die? The
body decomposes, and returns to the Planet. That much everyone knows. What
about their consciousness, their hearts and their souls? The soul too returns to
the Planet. And not only those of humans, but everything on this Planet. In
fact,
all living things in the universe, are the same. The spirits that return to the
Planet, merge with one another and roam the Planet.

Regardless of all of this, however, the actual purpose of the Black Materia in the game is simple; it allows for a direct threat to the planet, as well as for a means for Sephiroth to achieve his goal of 'godhood.' This apotheosis, of course, would likely be exclusive to Gaia (ignoring the infleunce of Jenova and any speculation about other offworld issues).

Holy, however, leaves some room for discussion. The actual mechanics of Holy have proven to be a source of near continual debate. I don't personally view Holy as simply a shield for the planet; the game itself attests that Holy is much more.


Bugenhagen: The knowledge of the Ancients swirling around here is telling me one
thing. The planet's in a crisis... A crisis beyond human power or endless time.
It says, when the time comes, we must search for 'Holy'.

Cloud: Holy?

Bugenhagen: Holy... the ultimate White Magic. Magic that might stand against
Meteor. Perhaps our last hope to save the planet from Meteor. If a soul seeking
Holy reaches the planet, it will appear. Ho Ho Hoooo. Meteor, Weapon, everything
will disappear. Perhaps, even ourselves.

Cloud: Even us!?

Bugenhagen: It is up to the planet to decide. What is best for the planet. What
is bad for the planet. All that is bad will disappear. That is all. Ho Ho Hoooo.
I wonder which we humans are?

It seems that the Planet itself has told Bugenhagen exactly what Holy is, explaining why he didn't suggest resorting to such a power in the first place. It seems unlikely that the script of the game would be written in such a way that Bugenhagen would decieve the gamer as to the actual purpose of Holy. Rather, having Bugenhagen explain the concept of Holy allows for an important plot element to be explored within the story itself.

Continuing on the subject of Holy as simply a shield, the theory seems to collapse in on itself. If this were its actual and sole function, it should have had no difficulty in repelling Meteor. If it was, as Red XIII said, too late, then it simply should (by this logic) have formed a barrier in or above Gaia's atmosphere, and have had no visual effect on Meteor. However, the game depicts Holy as actually interacting with Meteor, and failing to stop it. While some have theorized that this shows that Holy was trying to eliminate humanity, it would have required Meteor to strike the Planet, which would have been unacceptable. It seems most likely that Holy was simply inadequate to stop Meteor on its own. This could be, perhaps, because the magic of Holy had been enacted too late; had Meteor not gotten so close to the surface, it might have been destroyed without the devastation seen in the ending sequence. Whatever the case might be, Holy by itself did not stop Meteor, and so the Lifestream also became involved in the stuggle. Based purely on the images in the game, it seems the combined forces of Holy and the Lifestream were able to accomplish what Holy alone couldn't, and stopped Meteor.

As to the theories explored in your original post, however, there is no way Holy could have activated itself. As Bugenhagen stated, Holy appears when a soul seeking it reaches the Planet. The consequences of this activation, however, would be in the best interest of the Planet, not any people living on it.

Now, as to Geostigma, I can't fully comment on the nuances of the condition, since I've done my best to avoid spoilers on AC (I want to be able to fully enjoy it when it comes out in September). However, from what I've accidentally picked up, I believe Geostigma involves adverse reaction to Jenova cells. As far as I know, it has nothing to do with Holy, although someone who hasn't avoided AC spoilers may be able to better comment on the subject (and if anyone does want to comment further on AC elements, I recommend spoiler tags, since this is not the AC forum). If you're interested, an abundance of information on AC can be found all over the Internet.

And, yes, Aeris' death was an important story element. As Squall has noted in a thread, as well as a post in the stickied FAQ thread, Aeris' death was fully intended. The exact comments from Nomura and others can be found in either of those places.

[Raistlin]

Holy was not a shield of any kind. It was a powerful anti-Meteor magic which would, when summoned, destroy Meteor(go figure). It formed close to the Planet because, at that moment, Meteor was pretty damn close to the Planet. It was so close, in fact, that the energy let off by Holy destroying Meteor would have effectively caused as much damage to the Planet as just letting Meteor hit it(hence Red XIII saying something along the lines of "It's too close...It's having the opposite effect.").

[Squall of SeeD]

On the other hand, Bugenhagen does suggest that all souls of the universe return to the Lifestream of the Planet.

What he meant by all things in the universe being the same is that all life originates in that same manner, not that it all comes from the Planet Gaia. Every Planet would have its own Lifestream, as made most evident in Final Fantasy IX where Garland attempted to replace the Lifestream within the physical material of that Planet Gaia with the Lifestream of the Planet Terra.


As for Geostigma...

It's already been revealed that Geostigma is the side effects of an inner conflict between JENOVA's Cells and an individual's Spirit Energy. The conflict has negative effects on one's body, causing sores to open on the surface of the skin and leaving the victim with extreme fatigue. In fact, the fatigue is so great that it tends to be leading to death.


On the matter of Holy, it's not implied that it always must take the form of a shield. It gathering beneath Meteor was simply the only logical thing for it to do. If it had slammed straight into its side, it would have simply knocked it off course and caused it to plummet into the Planet in another spot rather than on top of Midgar. Getting beneath it and then forcing its way up would be the only logical course of action.

[boys from the dwarf]

I cant be bothered to read all this. leave me alone.

[anima977]

i have my own theories about holy and meteor. Im not as hardcore a fan as everyone else seems to be so maybe my ideas are crap. let me know either way.
Bugenhaagen says that any individual can summon holy, i think that sephiroth knew that it would strengthen meteor and so it was HE that summoned it. Just before you fight bizzaro seph, you see him immersed in holy, and cloud says something along the lines of 'we have to kill him to allow Holy to work'
when cloud kills sephiroth in their one on one battle, seph is clearly smirking when he gets killed as he knows that meteor is still going to hit and he can become deified or whatever.
my theory on the lifestream is that it was summoned when aeris prayed (just before she dies)
i think she had somesort of lifestream materia, it did glow that same color when it was activated after all. Once again, before she dies Aeris is smiling as i think she already knows hers and the planets fate.

sorry if my ideas are BS, but i like to think thats what happens. please dont be too savage with me! :) :) :)

[Croyles]

dont worry, but the materia that aeris had was holy, not lifestream. also, i dont think sephiroth ever got his hands on holy, only the black materia which was used to summon Meteor.

[Masamune·1600]

Actually, the reason Holy doesn't appear until the end of the game is because Sephiroth was blocking it. Aeris, when she died, was calling Holy, not the Lifestream. It doesn't make sense that Sephiroth would block something that would only further strengthen the effects of Meteor.


also, i dont think sephiroth ever got his hands on holy, only the black materia which was used to summon Meteor.

He didn't. It certainly wouldn't have helped him, in any case.