Running out of Ideas Squeenix?

[Dignified Pauper]

Why do we have our third world of Ivalice? We had FFT, and FFT:A, not FFXII... I like the name, but come on? Has square begun to simply run out of ideas?

[Assassin Wolf]

Probably

[Lich3636]

I dont think so I think square is just nameing it Ivalice in the hopes ppl will buy it because it takes place in the same world as FFT which IMHO is the best FF so squares not running out of ideas there just to lazy to come up with new worlds I wouldnt be suprised if we saw another game that takes place on Spira too

[TheAbominatrix]

So... they introduce a brand new battle system, new designs for moogles, a brand new story and brand new characters, and because it's set in the same world as another game, they've run out of ideas.

That is, quite simply, the stupidest thing I have ever heard in these forums.

They're using Ivalice because they want to. How hard is it to come up with a new world? It isnt. They didnt even start giving the worlds names until Ivalice and Spira.

I guess FF fans just need something to bitch about.

[TasteyPies]

So... they introduce a brand new battle system, new designs for moogles, a brand new story and brand new characters, and because it's set in the same world as another game, they've run out of ideas.

That is, quite simply, the stupidest thing I have ever heard in these forums.

They're using Ivalice because they want to. How hard is it to come up with a new world? It isnt. They didnt even start giving the worlds names until Ivalice and Spira.

I guess FF fans just need something to bitch about.

He didn't say they ran out of ideas, he said they were running out of ideas. As in they don't have the same amount of ideas as they used to. The new idea bar is on the decline. This fits because they did not make a new world. That is one less new idea. It may seem as though with all these sequals and repeats that square is in fact getting fewer and fewer truly unique ideas.

[TheAbominatrix]

How is the new idea bar on the decline? They just created a brand new game with a brand new battle system, a new magic system, new characters, and a new world in the sense that they just created that particular world. The ONLY way it mirrors Ivalice is because it's called Ivalice. Its set thousands of years after the Ivalice games we've played. For all we know, ALL the FF games are of the same world (though I doubt it) because they have in common the complete lack of names.

Sequels are also hardly 'running out of ideas'. X-2 was, in fact, a brand new idea. New battle system, and the expansion of a previous story. They'd never done a sequel before. As for AC, BC, CC, and Doc, AC is only the second movie they've done. That's hardly rehashing the same thing over and over. BC is a cellphone game, which they've never done before. CC, cant say as it doesnt have much info. DoC is a shooter, which Square has also never done before (or at least not on the context of FF).

What is unique, anyway? Lets see... FFI was four people saving the world. FFII was four people saving the world. All has to deal with crystals. All FF games have the same basic plot (saving the world) and the same basic battle system. The games have never been wildly different or incredibly innovative, that has never been the draw for FF.

Square is simply damned no matter what they do. No matter what they'd done for FFXII, their fans would bitch about it. For years fans begged Square to make more FFVII. And then when X-2 came out, they exploded because "Hey, X sucked, VII is way better so why dont we get a sequel!?" then they do. Then its "omg Square is running out of ideas, they're just after our money, and so on!!!" It doesnt matter what Square does, they're going to bitch about it.

And to make it perfectly clear, no I am not angry. No I am not pissed off. I'm expressing my opinion.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

They like Ivalice, so they're setting FFXII in Ivalice. Ivalice is never exactly the same world anyway, so it's not like they're really repeating anything.

You may as well have said Square was "running out of ideas" in FFIV because they reused the chocobo from FFII and FFIII instead of making a brand new form of animal transportation.

[TasteyPies]

Sequels are also hardly 'running out of ideas'. X-2 was, in fact, a brand new idea. New battle system, and the expansion of a previous story.

Brand new? That wasn't a "brand new idea", its has the same characters, world, spells, in fact allot of the areas ere almost EXACTLY the same!


What is unique, anyway? Lets see... FFI was four people saving the world. FFII was four people saving the world. All has to deal with crystals. All FF games have the same basic plot (saving the world) and the same basic battle system. The games have never been wildly different or incredibly innovative, that has never been the draw for FF.

FF1 was Orbs and FF2 was crystals. FF1 you had the same characters the entire time. FF2 characters left and joined and blah blah blah. A very different spin I think. The battle system was totally different as well, the leveling up system too.


Square is simply damned no matter what they do. No matter what they'd done for FFXII, their fans would bitch about it. For years fans begged Square to make more FFVII. And then when X-2 came out, they exploded because "Hey, X sucked, VII is way better so why dont we get a sequel!?" then they do. Then its "omg Square is running out of ideas, they're just after our money, and so on!!!" It doesnt matter what Square does, they're going to bitch about it.

Well, yeah they are just in it for money, they are a company...what do you expect?


And to make it perfectly clear, no I am not angry. No I am not pissed off. I'm expressing my opinion.

Well, to be perfectly frank, I think your opinion is the stupidest thing I have ever heard on these boards.

[TheAbominatrix]

-The idea of a sequel was a brand new idea. FF games had never had direct sequels before.

-Alright, so we'll go on to the rest of the games, which have had the exact same battle system. Enemies on one side, characters on the other. Fight fight fight. Different magic systems, same battle system. It varies here and there, but its not brand new everytime.

-I never said they werent. Im well aware that they're making it for money, I'm refering to all those people who say that the Compilation of FFVII was just Square out to make money, as if they hadnt been before.

-Good for you.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Brand new? That wasn't a "brand new idea", its has the same characters, world, spells, in fact allot of the areas ere almost EXACTLY the same!The core gameplay and mission system--the actual meat of the game--were indeed brand new.
FF1 was Orbs and FF2 was crystals. FF1 you had the same characters the entire time. FF2 characters left and joined and blah blah blah. A very different spin I think.And then FFIII came out and reused the Crystals and job system from FFI. And then FFIV came out and reused the "characters leaving and joining as the plot dictates" mechanic from FFII! And then FFV came out and reused the Crystals and job system again! Square must have been running out of ideas! Or, more likely, they simply willfully reuse elements that they and their customers have enjoyed in the past.

[Vyk]

I have nothing against them re-using the same world. Like has been said, it is possible, though unlikely, that they've always been the same world. But considering it's been given a FFT look and world-name. I think its kinda weird that they made it one of the FF games with a number. I think it shoulda been more like FF:something. Not tactics because its not going to be a tactical game. But set in tactics' world. But I get the feeling Square are coming into their own. With FF11 and 12 and Tactics. Not sure how to word this. But some in Square are obviously latching onto the Job-fetish. They see things they've done in the past that they liked. Remixing. Black mages, chocobos, and moogles have always gone through this. Now all the jobs are being thrown in. And the pastel renasaince look of FFT/FF9/FFTA etc. They're not running out of ideas. I think they're trying to keep things familiar, yet fresh. They're remixing the things that some have thought envoked FF. I mean you see a moogle you think FF. Be glad the game even has moogles. Kinda moots the point in bitching that it has moogles because they're unoriginal. They're a trade mark now. Among a lot of other things.

[Destai]

I agree with Abominatrix. if you bothered to learn anything about this game then youd see FFXII is probably one of the most unique FF's so far (and that wasnt stated by Abominatrix, thats my opinion) Seriously, I think its a good thing that Ivalice is being further developed. And yes its definitely the term "further developed" over "recycled" and if you dont know what i mean you should probably read up more on the game you're criticising.

[JAS4Yeshua]

Reuse is very common. Final Fantasy "borrows" ideas from previous incarnations, as well as traditional mythologies. It is very difficult to find a "new idea" anywhere in the world. Sure, once in a while a new idea might come around, but if you really look at it, it is still just an old idea given a new name and a slightly different twist.

[SomethingBig]

A completely new battle system(one never before used in an FF) does show the lack of ideas. So does a brand new magic system, new characters, and a new story.

Seriously, though, Square works night and day(literally) to give new things to the fans. We get a new and more action-oriented battle system, yet Square's suddenly running out of ideas because they're using a name from one of the previous games? They've been using Biggs and Wedge for God knows how long. OH CRAP! Square must have been running out of ideas for a damn long time. Damn you to hell, Square!

[TheAbominatrix]

Not to mention Biggs and Wedge came from a whole different series entire (Star Wars), so the idea has never been original! My life is teh over!

[Rostum]

Not to mention Biggs and Wedge came from a whole different series entire (Star Wars), so the idea has never been original! My life is teh over!


www.ohnoes.org
!!!

[Craig]

I think using Ivalice is a great idea, the world has alot going for it that will be good to see in 3D, like the different races, and the judges.

[Destai]

One thing I really Love to see in games is references anddetail being added and Square is a great company with that.

[GooeyToast]

I think now that Square has promised to release at leat 12 games a year, it's gonna be a lot more difficult to keep making outstanding & innovative games.

As for FFXII, I'm glad that Square is reusing the world of Ivalice. It's much more unique than any of the previous FF worlds, and it just looks SO much cooler. Also, the elements of gameplay they're putting in XII looks like they're gonna be really fun. Their trying to make something different from the typical FF adventure, and you can't blame them for that.

[Fire_Emblem776]

I think now that Square has promised to release at leat 12 games a year, it's gonna be a lot more difficult to keep making outstanding & innovative games.

what ever happend to the old days...

[TheAbominatrix]

Its not like they're going to be making 12 games a year on the same amount of manpower they had before. They have a lot of rescources now, especially since they merged with Enix. Wait and see, as we're already seeing some very promising and innovative features in all the new games they're releasing. Its not like they only made one game a year before, as some seem to think.

[ff-fanatix]

some very good points brought up by evryone here.....

still i have to bang my ehad on the table everytime i hear someone say SE are running out of ideas.....

Ok Ivalice.....Who cares...its just a name...get over it....

btw....Gaia...Terra....were they not planetary/world names???...not bitching just saying...

also you could say that constantly using the same summons, magics, job classes, chcobos, weapon names, enemy names...even sprites.....

biggs and wedge....and if you care to notice, have you seen an ff so far without a cid in it???

the point is SE can do whatever the hell they want....they wont keep releasing the same /xxx.gif/xxx.gif/xxx.gif/xxx.gif if its not gonna sell....and they aint gonna dissappoint the fans because fans = sales.....so to keep fans appeassed and prob to keep their own sanity they are always adding new stuff in...remixing from old games...bumping in new features to old trademarks such as chocobos and moogles.....

enjoy all the hard work the put into making allt hese new and exciting games.....

oh and i laughed my ass off at this one....

all the areas in ffx-2 were almost identical.....well aren't you a genius....what the hell does SEQUEL mean to you....a new world with new maps??...NO!

i always say this to people because its the way it is....Think yuo can do better....go ahead....go launch one of the most succesful RPG games companies...the merge with yet another successful company.....after a good 20 + years of making amazing RPG's and see how may ORIGINAL ideas you have to throw into a game....that is if you have enough brain power to get your head around the idea of what it takes to make an original game concept that people will actually want to play.....

WHY DO PEOPLE BITCH SO MUCH!....it is only a name???

[crazybayman]

Further developing ideas such as names, summons, magic, and battle classes of characters, etc, are what makes us FF fans continue to buy their games. Everytime I play a Final FAntasy game for the first time, my usual reaction is:

Cool! There's Ifrit!
or
Wow, the Bahamut summon keeps getting better and better with each game.

And so on.

Its the familiarity with the battle system that makes me keep buying them. I actually bought The Third Age because it featured the same battle system as FFX.

I'll bet using Ivalice as the world may even make people buy FF Tactics after they're through with FFXII, just to see what it was like in previous games, and to find similarities.

Running out of ideas? Not a chance. They have just as many or more creative and innovative employees at Square than anyone, I'd say. Re-using names, fiends, summons, names and concepts are what makes each Final Fantasy title live up to its name - FINAL FANTASY.

What some people would bitch about........ :rolleyes2

[ff-fanatix]

hehe i have a friend who hates final fantasy because of the name....keeps saying that as soon as they made ff2 the name became pointless bacause it wasn't very final....we all know the reason ebhind the name...but he wouldn't have it lol......

some people eh :rolleyes2

[Germ Hamee]

FF1 was Orbs and FF2 was crystals.

:eek: You've brought up a great point! I never, ever thought of how original it was of them to change the look and name of something that does the exact same thing. Y'know, I sent them a million letters to use bubblegum balls for FFV, but I guess they never reached Japan. =(

I'm not even going to bring up the argument that true originality is a myth. I'll just say that if you're so upset about this sudden upsurge of unoriginality, go find another series to obsess over. Or make your own, you go-getter you.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Jesus Christ, it's Germ Hamee.

[Super Christ]

I see no problem. It's like with Wild Arms, they all take place on a desert world called Filgaia, but they don't actually take place in the same world.

....and if you care to notice, have you seen an ff so far without a cid in it???
Yes, actually.

[Gwelenguchenkus]

I'm playign Wild Arms right now, and I'm obsessed with it.

Anyway, I don't think there was a Cid in the first FF. There were no chocobos either.

[crazybayman]

I'm playign Wild Arms right now, and I'm obsessed with it.

Anyway, I don't think there was a Cid in the first FF. There were no chocobos either.

Definitely not. Just a fighter, red mage, white mage, black mage, and black-belt who were trying to save the world. Not even a thief. No chocobos, just swords, nun-chuks, the basic magic, some evil dude named Chaos trying to take over the world.

Truly a great game.

I find it very neat that you fight some of the same fiends then as you do now, such as imps, and Tiamat, who's a boss in FFI and FFVIII.

[Super Christ]

There was a thief, actually. But yeah, no Cid or Chocobos. Neither of them appeared until FFII. Summoning and Moogles didn't appear until FFIII themselves.

[Yuffie514]

what's wrong with Ivalice? it always seems to be evolving FFT > FFTA (TA is better). what needs to change, the way of travel. i get bored walking back and forth all over the map, and from town to town. highly unexpected in XII.

[crazybayman]

There was a thief, actually. But yeah, no Cid or Chocobos. Neither of them appeared until FFII. Summoning and Moogles didn't appear until FFIII themselves.
Ya know its funny...........I just went to the FFI site here on EEof, and of course, there's the Thief, with the rest of the characters.

I still, for the life of me, can't remember the Thief, when I played it as a kid. And I spent a lot of time playing that game, with that Nintendo Power Strategy Guide and all. Still can't remember the thief. Maybe its because I just ignored him, as I would prefer a fighter, red mage, or black belt as a thief is relatively weak, except for his agility, compared to those classes just mentioned.

Maybe be its just major brain-fart, but I normally remember these things.


what's wrong with Ivalice? it always seems to be evolving FFT > FFTA (TA is better). what needs to change, the way of travel. i get bored walking back and forth all over the map, and from town to town. highly unexpected in XII.

There was a bit of backlash at the fact that you couldn't travel around the world map in FFX. I wouldn't be surprised if you can, in FFXII.

EDIT: Please uset the edit button instead of double posting. -Murder

[ff-fanatix]

i do believe there was a cid in ff1....think he was already dead... or died but he was theguy who built all of the city in the sky, designed the levistone and the airship, then hid it all before he died! ... :p

[RedCydranth]

Yeah, it appears that NO ONE is fighting for the "Square has run out of ideas" side of this argument anymore. Its just a bunch of us saying how Square is actually innovating and such. Good Jorb to you all! Saves me the time to bitch. BTW, Kawaii and Abominatrix are right as always. as soon as i read their posts i knew I had nothing more to add.

Tastey Pies.. You lost big time...


FFT > FFTA (TA is better)

You meant FFT < FFTA (TA is better). *in a old school teacher's voice* "The alligator's mouth opens up to the one thats bigger" or in this case better. This would be read as... FFt is less than FFTA.

My opinion is FFT > FFTA, Original is better, but TA was good in its own right.

[*ETERNAL FANTASY*]

sorry whats the big deal here? they just used the same name here and there. Particularly, yes, Ivalice...But looking at the whole picture i'd think squenix is hardly running out of ideas, a risk? yes! but i guess we'll see when we all get our hands on it!

Abominatrix: I hope i had your sense of composure cause if someone told me my opinions are the most stupidest things someones heard in the board you could bet that my chair would be on its way to smashing the bloody computer screen...

cant wait!

Cheers guys!

[yunafan01]

So... they introduce a brand new battle system, new designs for moogles, a brand new story and brand new characters, and because it's set in the same world as another game, they've run out of ideas.

That is, quite simply, the stupidest thing I have ever heard in these forums.

They're using Ivalice because they want to. How hard is it to come up with a new world? It isnt. They didnt even start giving the worlds names until Ivalice and Spira.

I guess FF fans just need something to bitch about.

I know! People need to chill out, they will think of knew names! LOL. It would be a cool name if they called it Quadrata. LOL. But it sounds cool. Sounds like a name for a sci-fi movie though... lol. Really, they just started naming them people! What was the name of the World for FF8? Or 7? Planet does not count for FF7, they said "planets cry" it was the planet they are on. REALLY! What about ff1? or 3? or 4? Do I have to go on people?! I don't even think there was a name for the world in ff2!