The legendary Masamune

[DHEvil]

I just wanted to know...how many FF games does this mighty blade appear in if not all of them? And is it a secret weapon in all of the ones that it does appear in?

[RedCydranth]

The Masamune was in FF I (called Masmune on NES), III, IV, V, VII (I think its appearance was as Sephiroth's sword not attainable by your party. Contrary to rumor there is no way to make the Masamune blade you recieve at Gold Saucer's laser shooter game into anything but the replica it is.), IX, X, and T. In crystanl Chronicles the Masamune is not a weapon usable by anyone (if it was it'd be a Lilty weapon I think.. or Clavat), but is an artifact.

The beloved Masamune has also been seen in Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross.

FFII, VI, and VIII do not have Masamunes.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

It's also in FFTA, along with a more powerful version called the Hyakushiki Masamune, or Masamune 100.

The beloved Masamune has also been seen in Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross.Only according to the faulty English translations. That sword is actually called the Grand Lion.

[Hikaro Takayama]

FFII, VI, and VIII do not have Masamunes.

Actually, there is a Masamune in VIII, but in order for it to show up you've gotta complete the Odin's Tower Quest before you fight Siefer for the last time. When Siefer kills Odin, Gilgamesh appears, and takes Odin's sword. Therefater, there's a random chance Gilgamesh will show up during a fight, and He'll use one of his for swords:

The Zantetsuken (odin's sword) instanly kills non-boss monsters
The Excaliber deals massive damge to all enemies
The Masamune deals even more massive damage to all enemies (and it just happens to look just like Sephiroth's Masamune, so it could be that Gilgamesh got it after Cloud killed Sephiroth in the lifestream...).
The Excalipoor did 1 point of damage to all enemies.

I think they added the Excalipoor just to tick the players off. :mad:

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

FFII and FFVI have Masamune, as well. It was called "Aura" in the English translation of FFVI, though.

[Masamune·1600]

FFII, VI, and VIII do not have Masamunes.

False in all three cases, as has already been mentioned. As to the name change in FFVI, blame Ted Woolsey. :rolleyes2


I think they added the Excalipoor just to tick the players off.

Actually, the Excalipoor attack was meant to recall the Excalipur sword from FFV, which Gilgamesh (a recurring boss in that game) attempted to use in a battle against the party. As you might guess, it failed miserably.


To return to the original question, FFX-2 did not include anything called the Masamune. This can be attributed, however, to the fact that the game had no specific weapons. Kaiser Knuckle and Ragnarok were included as accessories, though. FFMQ and FFXI also lack a Masamune.

[DHEvil]

Soo....Let me clear this up...Masamune has been in basically every FF game or squaresoft game...? Or wasn't it? And another thing....the Masamune has changed loads over every FF game that it has been in, not only in design but in attributes too. I think Square should have chosen one design and only changed the stats ALITTLE to fit in with the FF game so that the Masamune would be more recognisable and ultimately achieve a higher status...

What does Masamune mean, if there is a meaning?

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Masamune has been in every FF game released so far in some form or another except for FFMQ and FFXI.
FFX-2 did not include anything called the Masamune.Actually, Rikku wields Auron's Masamune from FFX when she becomes a Dark Knight.

As for the origin, Masamune was the name of a fourteenth-century Japanese swordsmith whose blades were known for being the best under the sun. There were also myths that his swords were blest with some divine purity.

[DHEvil]

Wow....that's deep! Kinda like the LaLiLuLeLo thingy from MGS....but let's not go into that.

Thanks Ryukishi! Any more FF lore that anyone knows about this sword? I'm really interested in knowing about this weapon of the Gods!

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Well, in the fifteenth century, there was another swordsmith named Muramasa. For whatever reason, there were stories that his swords were possessed with malice and bloodthirst--the polar opposites of Masamune's swords, which were supposed to be pure. The main depiction of this was in the myth that if you took one of Muramasa's swords and stuck it in a riverbed, all the leaves floating downstream would be attracted to the blade and end up cut in two; meanwhile, if you stuck one of Masamune's swords in the riverbed, all the leaves would float peacefully on by.

[DHEvil]

Hey! And Muramasa is in FFX too! This is deep! And Auron owns BOTH of them... could this be saying something about Auron? Maybe he has two sides to him? One with anger and hatred, and one with control and harmony?

This is indeed expressed in FFX, as Auron is most of the time a sedate and calm character, but the fact that he had hate in him also proved to be his downfall... you all know what I mean >_o

[RedCydranth]

So, let me get this straight... In FF2 and 6 theres a masamune, but its CALLED something else? Well, by those standards I'm in Final Fantasy 6 too, except I'm called General Leo. If the word masamune isn't there, its not the masamune. I don't give a flying freak what it says in japanese, I don't speak in japanese, and nor does the majority of this board. So, if in the versions we all own the word masdamune doesn't appear, then it is NOT in there.

As for Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross, When I played I saw the word masamune. You try and convince me that a large powerful sword isn't the Masamune when it says Masamune on my screen. Sorry everyone, Cloud doesn't have a "buster sword" although thats what is said, its really called a Ping Pong Paddle. Sorry for the confusion.

[TheAbominatrix]

No, by those standards you arent in FFVI, because he's General Leo in Japanese, too. Just because you arent interested in the true names of things, the names that were needlessly changed by the translators, doesnt mean everyone else isnt. If you don't care, that's fine, but a lot of us do.

But of course, in your theory, that means the FF Legend games were actually FF games, yes? Because they're FF games in America, and Japan clearly doesnt matter, despite having been the ones to make the games and give them names.

[RedCydranth]

Good call Abominatrix. I'm wrong.

But they shouldn't call it a Masamune unless its really a masamune. Not my fault those guys cant translate. It said masamune..

[TheAbominatrix]

Well you're right when we're talking English versions, but when we're talking about the series as a whole, it's important to acknowledge the Japanese, because Masamune is one of those 'constants' of the series.

During the pre-Playstation days, the translators seemed to change things just for the heck of it. Plus, there was also the space issue. ___ 3 black spaces can fit a lot more in Japanese than ___ 3 can in English.

[Hikaro Takayama]

Well, in the fifteenth century, there was another swordsmith named Muramasa. For whatever reason, there were stories that his swords were possessed with malice and bloodthirst--the polar opposites of Masamune's swords, which were supposed to be pure. The main depiction of this was in the myth that if you took one of Muramasa's swords and stuck it in a riverbed, all the leaves floating downstream would be attracted to the blade and end up cut in two; meanwhile, if you stuck one of Masamune's swords in the riverbed, all the leaves would float peacefully on by.

Actually, his name was Murasame which means something like 'village of the rain.' As a matter of fact, the Japanese Maritime Self Defense Force (Nippon Kaijou Jieitai) has a Murasame class of guided missile destroyers, and there is also a JDS Masamune as well. In addition, both the Murasame and Masamune also appear in the Edge master mode of Soul Calibur II (a game by Namco), the Masamune being the best weapon for Mitsurugi and the Murasame being the best weapon for Yoshimitsu, IIRC. Masamune basically means "true/righteous heart" (literally, the words translate as 'right/true chest/heart')

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

It's been my understanding that Murasame never actually existed and was just invented for the nineteenth century novel Nanso Satomi Hakkenden.

[Masamune·1600]

FFX-2 did not include anything called the Masamune.Actually, Rikku wields Auron's Masamune from FFX when she becomes a Dark Knight.

Yes, the appearance is the same, but no name is actually attached. One could argue that the Caladbolg is also present, again without name. However, since the statistics and abilities of Dark Knight are completely identical for all three girls, one might assume that the Masamune is no different from the other swords seen used by a Dark Knight. It seems more likely to me that they simply reused the sword design, as it seems to fit the appearance of a Dark Knight.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

It's the same sword; it's a reference. Same as Yuna using Tidus's Brotherhood and Caladbolg, etc.

[DHEvil]

The masamune is indeedly something that connects all of the Final Fantasy universes, it seems....

Does Auron hop from one FF universe to the other, like Cid does?

Looks like we've touched on an FF nerve here peepsies! (More like, YOU guys have touched on a nerve...I just posted the topic and watched the discussion fly, rubbing my evil little palms of darkness hungrilly for more information on my fave sword)

edit:

I AM SO dissapointed...I FINALLY got the Masamune blade from the ToF in FF1 and it's power was...how shall I say? Lacking? Under expectations?

I don't think it has ANY special abilities it just....happens to be alittle stronger than the other swords. PLUS it's design wasn't exactly Imaginative...heck...even the CORAL sword had more detail on it...

Does anyone else feel the same about the Masamune in FF1?

Oh and I'm aware the coral sword only appeared in the WonderSwan colour version, and the PSX remake...or am I wrong about that too?

[Lord Chainsaw]

The Masamune also appears in Final Fantasy Legend II/SaGa 2. It is one of the 78 Magi. Although I don't remember exactly where it is obtained, I do know that the game's villain, Apollo, uses it on you during your fight with him. Later on, when you get Isis as a party member, she is able to use it in battle. The Masamune is a unique weapon in that it, along with the Xcalibur, are the only two weapons in the game that don't eventually break after a set number of uses.

The other mythological weapon in that game was the Gungnir, of course, used by Odin. I thought the game did an incredible job staying true to the gods. They even gave Odin his famous crows and his many-legged horse Sleipnir.

[DHEvil]

Hey, Lord Chainsaw, I just HAD to say this...LOVE your sig! Retro RPG's like that are what started it all!

[Hikaro Takayama]

It's been my understanding that Murasame never actually existed and was just invented for the nineteenth century novel Nanso Satomi Hakkenden.

Actually, sir, there WAS a real sworsmith named Murasame, and I just happen to know this because I've visited the city where his school of swordsmithing was founded. Murasame lived about 1000 years ago, and once he perfected his art, he opened up a smithy in the small, but hightly strategic city of Odawara, Japan, and the central keep of the castle of said town, which has been converted into a museam, has several of Murasame's swords on display (or they may have been made by journeyman swordsmiths and signed by Murasame as was the custom at that time....).

DHEvil, the only things I know of for certain that appear in all final fantasy games are 1) Cid, who was named after a software engineer who passed away during the making of the first game, so Square (later Square-Enix) has a charachter in every FF game named Cid to honor his memory.... or at least so the story I've heard goes.

The Masamune is the second thing that also appears in every game in some form.

Odin, Bahamut, and most of the other summoned creatures have appeared as either summons, bosses (or both), or some reference is made to them in all the games, AFAIK.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Actually, sir, there WAS a real sworsmith named Murasame, and I just happen to know this because I've visited the city where his school of swordsmithing was founded. Murasame lived about 1000 years ago, and once he perfected his art, he opened up a smithy in the small, but hightly strategic city of Odawara, Japan, and the central keep of the castle of said town, which has been converted into a museam, has several of Murasame's swords on display (or they may have been made by journeyman swordsmiths and signed by Murasame as was the custom at that time....).Well that clears that up then.

[DHEvil]

...FF is alot deeper than it looks! ....maybe I should start off an "FF Lore" thread...?

Perhaps we'll discover many things more about the FF series as a whole!

[ChaosVivi]

The odin's horse thing is always wrong. Sleipnir was supposed to have eight legs, and they always give him six. Also, though I love Odin and the work he does as much as the next guy, he never had a sword in the old mythology. It was always just Gungnir.

[Kain-Highwind]

FFII, VI, and VIII do not have Masamunes.

Actually in FF2: D.O.S u can get masamune in paramekia castle i think it was

[Masamune·1600]

FFII, VI, and VIII do not have Masamunes.

Actually in FF2: D.O.S u can get masamune in paramekia castle i think it was

The Masamune is available in all versions of FFII, not just the DoS remake. Also, it's found in Pandaemonium (all versions).

[Poopcannon]

Kishi, Hikaro, break it up you two. You're both way off on the Murasame thing, so check here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murasame).

As for Masamune, look here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masamune), and for Muramasa, look here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muramasa).
You'll see that Kishi was correct on the old comparison story...

[Lawr]

Well, in the fifteenth century, there was another swordsmith named Muramasa

If he did exist there is a sword in FF7 usable by cloud that is called
'Murasame'
(Mur-uh-same?)
(Mur-uh-som-ay?)

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Moo rah sah may.
Mah sah moo nay.
Moo rah mah sah.
Bah bah boo bah.

[DJZen]

Moo-rah-sah-meh


the only things I know of for certain that appear in all final fantasy games are 1) Cid, who was named after a software engineer who passed away during the making of the first game, so Square (later Square-Enix) has a charachter in every FF game named Cid to honor his memory.... or at least so the story I've heard goes.
He's not in FFI or FFMQ


Odin, Bahamut, and most of the other summoned creatures have appeared as either summons, bosses (or both), or some reference is made to them in all the games, AFAIK.
Bahamut's first appearance was in FFI, but he was absent in FFII.
Odin did not appear until FFIII in any capacity.
Ramuh did not appear until FFIII, and was not in FFVIII or FFX at all.
Ifrit and Shiva didn't appear in any form before FFIII.


I AM SO dissapointed...I FINALLY got the Masamune blade from the ToF in FF1 and it's power was...how shall I say? Lacking? Under expectations?

I don't think it has ANY special abilities it just....happens to be alittle stronger than the other swords. PLUS it's design wasn't exactly Imaginative...heck...even the CORAL sword had more detail on it...

Does anyone else feel the same about the Masamune in FF1?

Oh and I'm aware the coral sword only appeared in the WonderSwan colour version, and the PSX remake...or am I wrong about that too?
You're wrong about that too, the coral sword was in the NES/FC version. Also, the masamune seems underpowered in FFI because it was FFI. In FFI, 500 damage was a huge amount. Today, 9999 damage is just adequate. For its time, the damage Masamune did in FFI was very high, which is special enough.

[kiminori]

in the fifthteenth century there rly was a Sword maker named Muramasa, but it is said he never met the sword maker Masamune there is a legend behind it and here tht legend is.

A legend tells of a test where Muramasa challenged his master, Masamune, to see who could make a finer sword. They both worked tirelessly and eventually, when both swords were finished, they decided to test the results. The contest was for each to suspend the blades in a small creek with the cutting edge facing the current. Muramasa's sword, the Juuchi Yosamu (10,000 Cold Nights / 10,000 冷たい夜) cut everything that passed its way; fish, leaves floating down the river, the very air which blew on it. Highly impressed with his pupil's work, Masamune lowered his sword, the Yawarakai-Te (Tender Hands / 柔らかい手), into the current and waited patiently. Not a leaf was cut, the fish swam right up to it, and the air hissed as it gently blew by the blade. After a while, Muramasa began to scoff at his master for his apparent lack of skill in the making of his sword. Smiling to himself, Masamune pulled up his sword, dried it, and sheathed it. All the while, Muramasa was heckling him for his sword's inability to cut anything. A monk, who had been watching the whole ordeal, walked over and bowed low to the two sword masters. He then began to explain what he had seen.

"The first of the swords was by all accounts a fine sword, however it is a blood thirsty, evil blade, as it does not discriminate as to who or what it will cut. It may just as well be cutting down butterflies as severing heads. The second was by far the finer of the two, as it does not needlessly cut that which is innocent and undeserving."

In another account of the story, both blades cut the leaves that went down on the river's current equally well, but the leaves would stick to the blade of Muramasa whereas they would slip on past Masamune's after being sliced. Or alternatively both leaves were cut, but those cut by Masamune's blade would reform as it traveled down the stream. Yet another version has leaves being sliced by Muramasa's blade while the leaves were repelled by Masamune's, and another again has leaves being sliced by Muramasa's blade and healed by Masamune's.

In yet another story Muramasa and Masamune were summoned to make swords for the Shogun or Emperor and the finished swords were held in a waterfall. The result is the same as the other stories, and Masamune's swords are deemed holy swords. In one version of the story Muramasa is killed for creating evil swords.

While all known legends of the two ever having met are historically impossible, both smiths are widely regarded as symbols for their respective eras.:choc::choc::choc::choc:

[Rantz]

Kiminori, this discussion is long since dead. I'm sure your post had been much appreciated 4 years ago. ;)