A Theory...

[Flare_Cross]

Allow me to tell my theory... fill up holes if you wish... and give your opinion AFTER reading it... I want everyone to know that i can get insane with theories sometimes..

P.S. The < means the direction where her power can "go".

Summary :

1. In the Present, there is a girl(Ellone) which's power allows her to "go" in(or is it into?) the past(Squall & Co's past). She wants to change the past(Squall & Co's past), for X reason... "Past < Present -Future"

2. In the future(Squall & Co's future and Ultimecia present) there's a sorceress(Ultimecia) who holds the same power then the girl in her past(the past of Ultimecia not of Ellone, or the present time of Squall if you prefer) and wants to compress time(take the Present, past and future and mix that up...)."Past - Present < Future", in Squall's time or, "Past < Present - Future", in Ultimecia's time)

3. So in order for Ultimecia to gain the power she desires("Past < Present < Future" to resume things, present = Ultimecia's) to go to the past(Squall's past or Ultimecia's ... "hyper-past") would be to gain Ellone's power in her past(Ultimecia's past or Ellone's Present) to then be able to go to the "hyper-past"(others words... her power would become something like "Hyper-past < Past < Present - Future"(by using the index of Ultimecia's time being the present of course) or "Past < Present < Future" for Ellone's present if you wish). The power to go to the past of Ellone goes in the past of someone and since no ones immortal you need to go threw someone else with the same power or something with the ability to go in the past.

4. The compression of time(but is it exactly how it is telled in the game?) allows Ultimecia to be able to make her reign in the past(without using the useless words and precision that you all give so much importance) so she would go on and reign forever... A little thing here.... does'nt it seem strange to you that SORCERESS ADEL was once ruler of Esthar and that city is one of the most advance in technology of the entire world of Final Fantasy 8.

5. Ignoring all the other facts, you got it; a loop from this part(maybee because the beginning and the end of FF8 are linked together). The Compression of time isn't simple.... it's not just : i got a part of the past, present and future and hail! The time itself isn't only three
dimension(past, present, future since behind those can hide a precision, years for ex.) for there is a future in the future since for the one living in our future is for them the present and we would be their past(an "hyper-future"). From now on there is something fishy or missing and i can't get my finger on it...

*****

6. THE ULTIMECIA(the last FF8 boss) nows play the big part... We all know she comes from the future but from how far in the future we does'nt. Ultimecia want to go to the past or possess it but how many time did she did that same plan over and over again? What tells us Ultimecia is not somesort of Ellone or someone having the same power or having that Junction Ellone machine? THE ULTIMECIA compressed time making the future as far as the Ultimecia we knows(getting rid of a possibility of Ultimecia or THE ULTIMECIA's hyper past as a different time, since in Squall's time are as they have evoluted from the past and Ultimecia having control of the past of THE ULTIMECIA's present "Squall - Ultimecia < ... < THE ULTIMECIA") and making the past... well we don't have much info since history was rewritten from the compression part(Ultimecia had succeed in getting to the past and then all other pasts... might had been in no time for us but all the past from the creation of the world maybee...)and the presence of our character being send to Ultimecia's time that we shall call here the Present Time(since there's no future, no past and no present... there is a time that is a NOW and that's the present(whoever's present that may be)...

7. THE ULTIMECIA started to abosrb "time itself" or "the universe" blabla during the battle and killing her out of time frame or something alike decompressed the time power she had absorbed, decompressed the time and then as Laguna said it, they had to want to be somewhere(or something alike) to be there...(that part is strange...) but it worked.

8. The Point; Play with time(past, present, future or whatever) always and always leads to a damn loop.... that is if you don't find a way to get out of time and decompress it...

[Olliey2k]

o_________________________O

[G SpOtZ]

o_________________________O

i agree with olliey2k

[Flare_Cross]

you don't understand??? True or not, the most simple thing is sometimes the harder to explain... that proves it..

[Sir Bahamut]

Well, if you aren't an alternate account of Future Esthar then I'm the queen mother. Regardless, I'll respon to your points one at a time:

1. Correct, but we know the "X" reason for her actions. She wanted Laguna to goe back to Raine before she died after giving birth to Squall.

2. Correct, except Ultimecia doesn't have Ellones power; she uses the Junction Machine Ellone instead.

3. Correct(ie. Ultimecia needed to go to the past where Ellone lived to get even furhter back to the past), but you're complicating things. All events in Ultimecias past are 'past'. "Hyper-past" is a confusing term which should merely read "far in the past".

Also, you don't need to go into someone else because you're not immortal, it's because that's how the power works. Simple as that.

4. There is no reason not to believe the concept isn't very similar to what the game tells us. Sure, we must still think things through to make a good theory based on the game, but we still use ingame information as the basis.

Moving on, Adels reign in Esthar is unconnected with their superior technology. It's just that Esthar happened to contain most of the brilliant scientific minds from Centra, including Doc Odine himself. The reason the rest of the world does not share in this technology, is because first Adel took over and waged war on everyone else, and then Esthar sealed themselves off from the outer world so as to rebuild the country.

5. Yes, there is a loop involved in the game, due to the beginning and ending being linked. That is correct.

As for your conclusion on time compression, and time having more than three 'units'(past, present and future), as explained above, this is simply not correct. The "hyper past" and "hyper future" you speak of are nothing more than "past and future". If the event in which Squall fights Seifer in the opening FMV is in Ultimecias past, that makes events before that simply 'further into the past', not some sort of new past or anything like that.

So time compression really is as 'simple' as it's made out to be. It involves compressing past, present and future into one. That's it.

6. You seem to be confusing yourself. Firstly, the one who tells us that Ultimecia is using Junction Machine Ellone is Doc Odine. Secondly, Ultimecia never rewrites time, because time is never fully compressed as she never beats Squall and Co. Until she fully compresses time, the ideas of 'past' and future' still hold(but are all relative to the observer of course, as you keep pointing out). That makes your next point irrelevant as well; she never fully compresses time(if she had, Squall and Co would not have been able to fight Ultimecia).

7. Yes.

8. Is that the point these 7 points have been leading up to? If so, you certainly made it vastly more complicated than you had to =P

Here, check out this FAQ by me, SquallOfSeeD and another bloke from Gamefaqs:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/psx/game/197343.html

It's the Time/Ultimecia Plot FAQ listed there. It should help clear up most problems you have.

[blackline77]

thats a long theory

[Flare_Cross]

i used the Hyper-past and Hyper-Future words to give a limit to the power of "returning" to the past Ellone has. Ultimecia could'nt go farther in the past without Ellone.... i sequence things here...

[Sir Bahamut]

Alright...

Is that all?

[blackline77]

its really long

[The Wonderful Nobody]

I actually think that Ultimecia is actually Rinoa twisted.

[Skyblade]

My gosh, I hope this is Future Esthar in another account. If not, can you just imagine what would happen if those two teamed up and decided to come up with a theory TOGETHER?! *Shudder*

[G SpOtZ]

My gosh, I hope this is Future Esthar in another account. If not, can you just imagine what would happen if those two teamed up and decided to come up with a theory TOGETHER?! *Shudder*
no.....NOOO...NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

*mind explodes*

ouch.

[Flare_Cross]

no i am not Future Esthar and i just decided to give you this theory because i thought it could be a good one... theories are always the right ones until we found the truth since it's a THEORY and i didn't spent hours reading all the things people wrote somewhere thinking "the things are like that and that's all"... but anyway.... i guess people give too much importance to the words Past, Present and Future since in the site that was linked by Sir Bahamut i saw those 3 words too often(or perhaps it's oftenly??anyway)....... and no i won't join that Future Esthar since i saw his theories and he is a madman or someone laughing maniacly somewhere seeing the little amounts of dorks stupid enough to listen/read what his says/writes and believing him...

And please don't judge people(me) on their(my) first mistakes(from the time you meet them i mean since i made mistakes before like everyone...)I just thought it could be a good one by the moment i thought it..... anyway.... in the begining my theory was suppose to...to "theorize" the fact that Ultimecia could be Ellone in the future.... i really don't see Ultimecia pressing buttons on a machine and Ellone wanted to change the past... Odine may be a little too much overwhelm by his own popularity when he says that Ultimecia could be using his invention...anyway(for the fourth time)...

[Thorn]

*Faints*

[Sir Bahamut]

So, you're saying you think Ellone = Ultimecia simply because you can't imagine Ultimecia using a machine to get to the past with? Sorry, but that won't hold at all. Your personal opinion on one tiny little factor of the plot does not amount to a plausible theory.

And you said every theory is right until we find the truth. That's wrong. If I were to say that Squalls parents are a Chocobo and an Esthar Guard, am I supposed to be considered right? Of course not. A theory can only be considered possible if it is first made plausible. That's why we embrace the 'theory' that Laguna and Raine are Squalls parents; it's made VERY plausible.

Oh, and I still think you're Future Esthar I'm afraid.

[Skyblade]

So, you're saying you think Ellone = Ultimecia simply because you can't imagine Ultimecia using a machine to get to the past with? Sorry, but that won't hold at all. Your personal opinion on one tiny little factor of the plot does not amount to a plausible theory.

And you said every theory is right until we find the truth. That's wrong. If I were to say that Squalls parents are a Chocobo and an Esthar Guard, am I supposed to be considered right? Of course not. A theory can only be considered possible if it is first made plausible. That's why we embrace the 'theory' that Laguna and Raine are Squalls parents; it's made VERY plausible.

Oh, and I still think you're Future Esthar I'm afraid.

Actually, his theory doesn't hold up to the game at all. Even if Ulti was Ellone, she'd still have to use the machine to go back in time. Ellone can only send back other people. She can even communicate with the others that she sends back, but she can't send herself back.

I still agree, and I still pray that it is true. One Future Esthar is enough.

[sparkie]

Nah, Future Esthar's grammar is worse. And I dunno, does FE use the word "her"?

But if it is him it's obviously a little experiment on his part to see if we would believe him because we don't see Future Esthar as the poster and have prejudgements. Weeeak.


How bout this for a theory: Everyone is who the game says they are.

I like it. :)

[Christmas]

theories are always the right ones until we found the truth since it's a THEORY

Is this what Future Esthar said about his theories too?


i really don't see Ultimecia pressing buttons on a machine

Maybe we also dun see Ultimecia's servants chanting evil curse and prayers to seal your powers while you are in their castle but your powers is still sealed. Just for references, this is something like what was said in the past:



Look,many of the things said here were events that the game don´t show.The game don´t show Julia dying neither

But the game tell us she is dead.


and Ellone wanted to change the past...

I remember it being told in the game.



Ellone: Of course! You were my eyes. Thanks to you guys, I was able to
see how much I was loved. I couldn't change the past but just seeing it
was more than enough. Thank you so much.

Squall: It's ok. I came here because I need your help. You said you
can't change the past, right?

[sparkie]

Maybe it's Future Esthar's "brother". They do seem to think alike. :rolleyes2


Btw, welcome back Unknowns! :)

[Skyblade]

No, it's Future Esthar. Has anyone else noticed that despite titles like "A clue, perhaps", and "A theory" (which would normally draw Future Esthar to them like a moth to the flame), Future Esthar has yet to post in either of this guy's threads? Or that this guy has yet to post in any of Future Esthar's? Coincidence? I think not...

[Discord]

Just ask one of the Cid's Knights to do an IP Check:D

[Skyblade]

Just ask one of the Cid's Knights to do an IP Check:D

Different IP doesn't mean a different poster. I could set up accounts on my computer, my dad's computer, my mom's computer... It's not that hard to fool an IP check.

[Christmas]

Different IP doesn't mean a different poster. I could set up accounts on my computer, my dad's computer, my mom's computer... It's not that hard to fool an IP check.

Let's not jump to conclusion here......being wrongly accused is very sad..... :(


Btw, welcome back Unknowns!

Thanks, nice to see you again :D

[Skyblade]

Different IP doesn't mean a different poster. I could set up accounts on my computer, my dad's computer, my mom's computer... It's not that hard to fool an IP check.

Let's not jump to conclusion here......being wrongly accused is very sad..... :(

True. Especially if you are wrongly accused as being Future Esthar. But please, let me believe this, for the sake of my sanity. If these two are seperate people, and they combined their "logic" to form a single theory...

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

[Christmas]

If these two are seperate people, and they combined their "logic" to form a single theory...

If they do, there is not much we can do about it since they had the right to post what they want here and only be removed if the moderators think it is just insane....

But currently I dun see there is much linkage with the theories the two of them.

The similarities I see is that those two tend to overanaylsis and think that almost every minor details in the game might lead to something big.

[Discord]

Different IP doesn't mean a different poster. I could set up accounts on my computer, my dad's computer, my mom's computer... It's not that hard to fool an IP check.

Let's not jump to conclusion here......being wrongly accused is very sad..... :(

True. Especially if you are wrongly accused as being Future Esthar. But please, let me believe this, for the sake of my sanity. If these two are seperate people, and they combined their "logic" to form a single theory...

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Yup! Just what I wanted to say. It wouldn't be nice if someone new gets on the forums and suddenly get accused that he is somebody else whom he doesn't even know. That doesn't give you a very good of the community.

As for the IP check, your right, but most people don't start running IP cloaking or using different computers unless they really really want to hide their identity and thus the IP check is a pretty effective weapon against double accounts.

And yeah: Hi Unknowns:)