FF connection theroy based on old turks theroy

[NykylaiHellray]

Yes I know there is another conection thread allready, though I am not keen on some of his ideas, and I thought I would present my theroy on a new thread instead.

THE FINAL FANTASY CONNECTION PROJECT
Based on the original theory made by Old Turk

WARNING: Contains major spoilers so please read at your own risk. Also please do not flame, this is merely a fan project ATTEMPTING to connect them.
No one is saying they are connected just speculating the mere possibility.
Please enjoy.

THANKS TO ALL THOSE WHO HELPED: Old Turk,


WEBSITES THAT HELPED ME MAKE THIS POSSIBLE:
http://forums.adventchildren.net/
http://www.ffwa.org/
http://www.willamette.edu/~ejohnson/findex.htm
http://www.eyesonff.com/




The Crystal and the other


The Crystal

The embodiment of the void
Whatever the crystal is, he is the other, he is the force that wants to consume and destroy. He will not be satisfied until the crystals work has been obliterated in every form possible.

Neo X Death
Necron


Based on what I saw in FF9, I am adapting the theory, which I read before (if you wrote this theory and I forgot to include you in the credits please tell me) which says that Necron in itself is apart of the Iifa Tree.

The theory states that Necron was not thrown in, but was a being which was bound to the tree. It maybe a creation of garland, or something in itself far older we do not know.
He was bound as a component to judge the souls of terra, and to ultimately destroy them.
The theory explain why Necron appears, it also explain why the tree finally dies in the final movie.
It also explains how the souls of gaia are destroyed and also why we hear screams of souls in the battle against necron.
This in itself is also a homage to FF5 of ExDeath and NeoExdeath, as Exdeath was trapped in a tree. Also in the qauballah it states that the tree if life has a component named DAATH which means void, and nothingness, so it would make sense to assume that Necon IS the Iifa Tree, but the spiritual part of it.
The physical manifestation does bring to mind FF7, which the green lifestream seems to be bubbling below, also the physical form seems remiscent of Jenovah, though this may only be a homage and not a connection. Though if it is a connection it could show that Garland found the Terror from the skies, and built the tree around it. Using it’s power as a way to make Gaia the new Terra.

Though this makes necron a far more confusing entity, in a physical existing form, it is the malformed alien we all know and love, though underneath, it is the hollow abyssal spectre known as necron.

The calamity from the skies
(Still under construction)



The Timeline



X – X-2 – FFTSW - CT - VIII - VII – FF:T – XII

Evidence – for X-2 - VII
Nojima: Yes, actually. After Shinra quit the Gullwings he got enormous financial backing from Rin and went to the Farplane to start extracting the Mako energy used by the Vegnagun. But the system for utilizing this energy could not be completed in his generation, so far in the future when space travel was possible, the Shinra Company was founded on another planet... or something like that. That would be a thousand years or so from this game's story.

Shinra: Aha...
Yuna: What are you looking at?
Shinra: Farplane data.
Shinra: The more I study it, the more fascinating it gets. There's limitless energy swirling around in there.
Yuna: Limitless energy?
Shinra: The life force that flows through our planet...I think.
Shinra: With a little work, we could probably extract the energy in a useable form.
Brother: Sweet!
Shinra: Of course, that'd take generations.
Brother: That's no fun!
Buddy: Well, still, it is something worth shooting for.
Yuna: Think how much Spira would change if we ever got it to work!
Yuna: Maybe one day we could build a city full of light, one that never sleeps!
Shinra: No doubt about it.
Yuna: Just imagine!
Yuna: But I'll never get to see it...will I...
*Shinra shaking his head meaning NO*
Brother: Shinra! Don't make Yuna sad!
Shinra: Right. My bad.

Rin: I firmly believe that machina are an indispensable part of Spira's development.

Rin: Even if there is another incident, I intend to conceal the evidence.

Yuna: You really think people will follow you that way?

Rin: I am not alone in my thinking.

Rin: We are researching ways to extract the vast energy that


Evidence for TSW – CT – VII
The ancient cizzilzation was said to have possessed space technology, also that a comet brought the terror from the skies.

TSW world has the space technology, also has the obvious life stream. The idea that the comet is Jenonah maybe a bit far fetched, but then again, when you look at it. Do we ever find out what killed that alien world, was it war, or something else. Maybe after TSW a new age of magic begins, though maybe a second comet comes bringing another thing from that long dead planet.

This is my weakest link so can be ignored.

Evidence – for CT – VIII
Queen Zeal, who wanted to become one with Lavos and become immortal, (sound familiar?) ended up imprisoned in space. Is she sorceress Adel?

Evidence – for VIII - VII
Nearly identical maps
The had a cizzilization that was named cetra or centra, which where both on the exact same place on the map.
Both wiped out by a calamity from the sky.

Centra where wiped out by lunar cry 100 years ago
Cetra where far much longer exstinct in FFVII

Means that VIII is before VII

Evidence – for VII – FF:T - XII
Apart from the obvious ability to get cloud, there is the piece of history that states prior there being a city of immense technology which was destroyed.
This shows that the tactics world is mearly VII’s world but a couple of 100 years in the future.
Being that the tactics world is Ivalice this in turn links in to XII.

Since there are the crystals in Ivalice in tactics, it maybe likely that the huge materia from VII may of manifested itself into a kinda reinvention of the crystal. Maybe created from the planets memory? Or maybe holy and meterors plus the lifestreams power could of mutated them?










If you want to create your own little Final Fantasy theory here is some points to considure

To make a final fantasy connection theroy one must not ignore these points
-anime "legend of crystals" must not be ignored as it is a direct sequel to 5
-the new anime MAY be ignored though if you can fit it in then thats great becuase the inclsion of doom train, and the fact our earth is considued a parrel universe
-secret of mana has moogles and should be included
-secret of evermore has just easter eggs so can be ignored
- Tactics cloud inclusion should not be ignored
-Magus sisters are a boss in 4, so it would make sense that 4 is before 10, as they would not be a summon before they were born.
-This aplies with gilgamesh to, as he has not even obtained the fake ragnarok till 5, and yet has it in 8, SO 5 IS BEFORE 8.
-If anyone remembers in the anime "legend of the crystals" the official direct sequel to FF5, there are two moons on that world.
Which ONE moon has a very 20th century style city on it, I do not know but that city really looks like the city of spirits within.
Also (someone confirm this) there are two moons in ff9, whether this is a connection or not is yet to be disussed.
- Gogo is in both FF5 and FF6, in FF6 as a fully playable character.
- Final fantasy 7 and 8 have nearly identical maps
-Final fantasy 10-2 and 7 have been linked, and officially confirmed
- Tactics is considured to be after 7, as there is mention of a city like midgar (though not been confirmed).
-Final fantasy 12's world is called Ivalice, which is the name of the world in tactics (to be confirmed)
-In FF7 AC the previously unamed world is now called Gaia, which is the name of FF9's world (link to be discussed)
- Crystals in FF8 As said by Vector: The crystal referrence in FF8 is not very clear. Very hard to find, but someone had brought it to my attention when the thread was first started, not sure who. When you defeat Krysta, you can see a crystal. The very presense of that monster denotes a crystal sighting, but no one can tell. Of course, it could very well be the many collectible crystals in the inventory. But there is one occurence of crystals that are completely visible as they start glowing. When you are at the Deep Sea Facility's basement and start the process to fight Ultima Weapon, the crystals in the cavern begin to glow, heralding the entrance of the one creature strong enough to contain Eden, which happens to be a holy reference. Eh, who knows?
As said by old turk: Crystals in VIII seem to have mutated into some sort of Weapon, a creature called Krysta. As when you defeat him a crytsal appears.



This post will be expanded as more information is gathered.

[Captain Maxx Power]

This post would make sense, if it wasn't build on random facts loosely strung together via somewhat similar themes. As such it's crazy ramblings.

[Slothy]

Aside from the admitted sequels to games (FFX-2, Dirge of Cerberus, etc.) none of these games has ever had anything more to do with another than to reuse common elements (moogles, Cid, etc.), or pay homage to older games (FF9 had a lot of this). They aren't connected and never have been. If they were, Square probably would say so with every game, since a tie in to FF7 or other FF's would be great from a marketing perspective.

None of these connection theories are based on real information or facts. And the fact that you're trying to connect FF:TSW and CT in there as well shows you're really just trying to find a connection between just about everything Square's ever made. For the record, TSW took place in our future, not one of the FF world's (I would have thought that was pretty obvious), and I've never seen anything that could link CT to any FF myself. I'm not sure how much stock I put in the FFX/X-2 and FF7 link either since I've never seen where this was confirmed myself, and it seemed a little far fetched if you ask me.

[Craig]

They are seperate. People just make theories that they are all part of the same universe because it gives them hope that they will be able to play as Cloud and Squall at the same time.

[MJN SEIFER]

Square have Said that sll FF games are connected and in order just far apart.

[DJZen]

Did they?

[NykylaiHellray]

If this is true would it make me a bad winner if i shout I TOLD YOU SO ^_^

[Vyk]

They aren't in order. They allude that X-2 set the foundation for 7. Which may give credence to the old theory that they are in reverse order, but even that has huge holes in it. And I'm not quite sure how CT got in there. I don't think anyone has ever theorized any connection between the Crono universes and the Final Fantasy ones. Shall we throw the Mana games in there as well? :D

[NykylaiHellray]

My theroy is based on one done by old turk at the Worlds apart final fantasy site.

here is a link to the thread.

I was trying to get other pinions on his theroy....there is many pages
http://ffwa.org/forums/showthread.php?t=33683
warning: thread spans over two years


The reason crhono was thrown in is because of the link between 8 and CT which both concern a socerress merging with an alien entity of immense power and being trapped on the moon.

One could merely state though 8's moon socerress was merely a homage

[Masamune·1600]

I hope you realize that the "Old Turk theory" is irreconcilably flawed, and that any basis on that theory will suffer the same problems. Any and all arguments for inclusion of Chrono Trigger, for example, are patently absurd. While you thankfully avoided reference to the Masamune in that game, I will point out, as regards the initial theory, that the "Masamune" was actually called the Grand Lion, but was changed when released outside of Japan. Hence, the intent was obviously something else other than reference, to say nothing of actual connectivity.

Concerning The Spirits Within, one has to recognize that it takes place on our Earth. This would make it impossible for anything to precede it temporally, as the evolution of our own planet is relatively documented. While FF: TSW bears some thematic and conceptual similarities to FFVII, that's all they are. And if one was to suggest that the other titles follow from FF: TSW, one would have to explain the utter loss of any and all technology, as well as a completely changed global physical geography and biosphere. While one could argue that this was possible over millions of years, the "real world" would still necessarily be present in the fossil record. Moreover, this aspect completely dismisses any inclusion of Chrono Trigger, a game whose actual prehistory is explored.

I'll just ignore, then, any set of links that uses Chrono Trigger. Moving to the next non-CT link, we're forced to examine the possibility that FFVIII leads into FFVII. Again, this is massively flawed. First, the geographical similarities you see aren't really there. Compare the FFVII map, seen here (http://www.fantasyanime.com/finalfantasy/ff7map.htm), with the FFVIII map, seen here (http://www.rpgfan.com/pics/ff8/map.jpg). In any case, similarity in physical geography would only force the two games closer together temporally, which has no real base in fact. Your main line of argumentation, the similarity between the words Cetra and Centra, does nothing to promote the theory. In fact, it invalidates it. In FFVII, the Cetra were transformed by JENOVA's virus ~2000 years prior to the game. If the Centra civilization, which was wiped out ~100 years before FFVIII, is the same, then there is only a gap of ~1900 years between FFVIII and FFVII. In that time, the continents would have had to radically shift, the entire global society of FFVIII been completely destroyed (there's no mention in FFVII, after all of Esthar or Deling City or Fisherman's Horizon, etc.) with no trace (an absurdity given the oral record, the survival of the "Ce(n)tra," and the fact that archaeological evidence (see both JENOVA and Bone Village) from "before FFVIII" exists.

As to a connection between FFVII and FFT, Cloud's appearance is clearly in the nature of a cameo. If one suggests that FFT occurs a few hundred years in the future, you ignore the method in which Cloud is obtained, as well as promoting the idea that the physical world and culture of FFVII was eradicated in that time. Given that the ending of FFVII takes place 500 years after the events of the game, this line of thinking is impossible. This is only heightened when one considers that FFT has its own established backstory (Ajora and the origins of the Glabados Church, the Zodiac Braves, etc.) which extends further into the past. We would be, ultimately, forced to accept the complete extinction of humanity, full reevolution, and the drastic reconfiguration of continents to link the stories. While this is an utterly colossal leap of faith in its own right, the disparity in the fossil record (based on what we can assume from Treasures, Undiscovered Lands, etc.) would negate the concept completely.

Even FFT and FFXII are not inarguably linked. In FFXII, we can take note of multiple sentient races (an example being the Viera). This was not the case in FFT. For such a radical development, one would have to again address the concept of evolution; this process would not be short. I won't be able to fully deconstruct this possibility until FFXII is actually released, but there's really no point in showing a several hundred million year gap anyway.

Finally, I have a few comments regarding the only connection with any sort of actual evidence backing it, that of course being the link between FFX/X-2 and FFVII. However, note that Spira and Gaia are only linked in "[Nojima's] mind." For this to be considered canon, it would require the tacit approval of the others involved in the story of FFVII, particularly Yoshinori Kitase and Tetsuya Nomura (both of whom are involved with the Compilation). Ultimately, this link would require in-game support in a Compilation title, or a direct confirmation in the FFVII Ultimania Omega. Further, the plot holes and inconsistencies involved with the concept are massive, and using "Shinra's descendents" in the whole Cetra backstory of FFVII simply strikes me as a terrible plot element. Remove "Final Fantasy" from Shinra's descendents, and the idea of them influencing the FFVII backstory seems to me to be bad storytelling. This isn't to say that Gaia and Spira aren't linked, only that it's far from official at this point in time.

[NykylaiHellray]

Good points, though one thing does still bother me.

If legend of the crsytal is a direct sequel to 5 which it is.
Why does the black moon has a city on it identical to our earths citiy?

[Vyk]

That wasn't made by Square so I'm not sure its technically canon. But what Earth city are you talking about? o.O; I just remember it all looking like a big junk yard. Though I guess there was what appeared to be an over-pass or broken highway bridge at the last battle...

[NykylaiHellray]

there seems to be city like building to though