sephiroth

[sephiroth 4]

i like sephiroth because he is cool about killing people and has a good act of being evil then like pretty boy on ff9 and a stupid clown on ff6:moomba:

[Azure Chrysanthemum]

This goes in the FFVII section.

And I contend that Sephiroth is not a great villain because he lacks a plausible character development, his "evil" is restricted to burning down one village and being a corpse frozen in a block of ice, and that there are many villains who are far, far better.

[boys from the dwarf]

true. sephiroth is great but kekfa has the ego and sadistic craziness as well as ruthless infinite power and kuja is poetic, clever and in FF9 any scene with kuja in is instantly a good scene. this thread might turn into some sort of hate thread and just cause arguments. whats the point of this thread?

[Rengori]

Kuja started a major war, backstabbed the nation he sided with, destroyed Alexandria, and decimated a whole planet.

Kefka took over an empire, poisoned an entire kingdom, made the planet a dry wasteland, and became a God.

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.

I'm not seeing how him being his own demise stacks up to Kuja or Kefka's evil deeds. If anything Shinra was a far more evil than Sephiroth. Sure, you can kill them and end their suffering, or you can oppress them and slowly kill the planet.

[FF_Chick]

I agree. ShinRa was far more better than Sephiroth. It was funny how you said that stuff about Sephiroth XD.

[Flying Mullet]

I don't get it. Sephiroth looks up at you through a bunch of flames and all of a sudden he's cool. I guarantee you if that one FMV wasn't in FFVII he wouldn't be half as popular as he is.

[Rengori]

I don't get it. Sephiroth looks up at you through a bunch of flames and all of a sudden he's cool. I guarantee you if that one FMV wasn't in FFVII he wouldn't be half as popular as he is.
I remember hearing from another member (can't remember who) that they stopped the FMV seconds before he burst into flames and started rolling around trying to put himself out.

[Ryushikaze]

Kuja started a major war, backstabbed the nation he sided with, destroyed Alexandria, and decimated a whole planet.

Kefka took over an empire, poisoned an entire kingdom, made the planet a dry wasteland, and became a God.

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.

I'm not seeing how him being his own demise stacks up to Kuja or Kefka's evil deeds. If anything Shinra was a far more evil than Sephiroth. Sure, you can kill them and end their suffering, or you can oppress them and slowly kill the planet.

He wasn't under Jenova's control. He controlled Jenova. His deeds are still not as evil as Kefka, Ulti, Kuja, or Yu Yevon.

[Xurts]

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.
Sephiroth never killed Aeris.

[FF_Chick]

Yeah. She just was TOO wounded to have a Pheonix down or a Life spell casted on her <_<...

[Psychotic]

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.Don't forget he took out half the Shinra building, and President Shinra, leaving a mucky trail of blood. If you don't think he's evil, I defy you to call the Midgar Cleaner's Union and ask what they have to say on the matter.

I've always contended that Sephiroth was a good villain, mainly because whenever he appeared and "Those Chosen By The Planet" played, it struck fear into my 11/12 year old self. I was actually scared of the guy. To me at least, that means they did something right.

[Christmas]

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.
Sephiroth never killed Aeris.


http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/3922/cludkillsaeriscd0.jpg

[Rengori]

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.Don't forget he took out half the Shinra building, and President Shinra, leaving a mucky trail of blood. If you don't think he's evil, I defy you to call the Midgar Cleaner's Union and ask what they have to say on the matter.
I don't know, Shinra was the greater of the two evils and I always thought it was more of a good deed he killed all of those Shinra employes and the President.

[Kefka_Almighty]

Lets have a list of the crimes of Kefka, Sephiroth, and Kuja:

Kefka:
- Attempts to burn down two areas: Figaro Castle (fails only because they then go under ground) and Thamsasa (arguably, we don't know if he succeeds or not, but it doesn't really matter after the WoR occurs)
- Poisons an entire Kingdom, killing all inhabitants except one
-Unleashes three bound gods, uses their power to blast his emperor into submission before jumping on his neck to break it and kicking his corpse over the side of the Floating Continent
- Kills his fellow general after he corners him for attempting to carry out the destruction of Thamsasa
- Destroys the Esper's land and proceeds to basically carry out a mass genocide against them, turning them into Magicite
- Becomes God and decides to destroy the world bit by bit, reveling in the despair and misery of the people instead of destroying it outright; technically had achieved complete victory for a year before being defeated.

Kuja:
- Controls and manipulates an entire kingdom, starting a near world-spanning war
- Kills his own mentor
- Goes trance and proceeds to destroy HIS own entire homeworld
- Damages the life sustaining crystal in an attempt to brind death upon all things, thus releasing Necron

Sephiroth:
- Burns down a village (is cut down shortly thereafter by Cloud and remains a corpse enclosed in ice for five or so years)
- Kills the Midgar Zolom (not a real crime; merely killing a monster and impaling it isn't exactly against the law)
- Kills President ShinRa and several ShinRa employees/soldiers (the employees can somewhat be considered innocents, but it's hard to feel sorry for ShinRa and the soldiers)
- Kills Aeris (thus sealing his own failure)
- Summons Meteor (arguably the only thing he had really succeeded in doing truly right)

Sephiroth was an interesting character to an extent, but in terms of pure evil and maliciousness, Kefka and Kuja EASILY trump him.

[boys from the dwarf]

Sephiroth torched a village, killed a snake, killed a woman who actually needed to be killed to stop Sephiroth, and summoned a meteor which failed to kill anything, almost all of this under the control of Jenova.
Sephiroth never killed Aeris.
what do you mean. aeris was stabbed and the game clearly states she is dead. im assuming that you mean that clone (who may have been controlled by jenova. im not sure.) killed aeris. after all. sephiroth cant be frozen in the northern crater and kill aeris at the same time. my guess is that the starter of this thread was completely ignorant of all of the evil and clever and insane things that other FF villains do.

[Zeromus_X]

I don't care about the whole 'Kefka is better than Sephiroth!!11' thing because it's just some strange way of feeling better than anyone who likes Sephiroth anyhow.

I like Sephiroth. He isn't my favorite villain. There are obviously better villains. But I don't think he's a bad villain. He was pretty scary, and mysterious, so he's just your typical villain, I suppose. I liked how the group chased him (or a projection of him, whatever) around everywhere, a different way of following the villain than in most of the other FF games. (Of course, you don't know what on earth he's planning for half of the game, thus adding to his mysteriousness.)

And, well, I wish I had that sword.

Furthermore, it makes me giggle when people complain about lots of people declaring that Sephiroth is great, when more people go on about Kefka than anything.

[Xurts]

Wow, I thought this was common knowledge. Apparently not.


Jenova kills Aeris. It also kills all of the people in the Shinra HQ along with President Shinra. During the game Sephiroth never kills anything. He's frozen in Mako inside the Northern Crater for most of the game. Avalanche thought they were chasing after Sephiroth, but it was actually Jenova taking the form of Sephiroth.

[Rengori]

I thought that they were clones of Sephiroth that were doing the evil stuff, not Jenova.

[Ryushikaze]

Being controlled by Sephiroth. Jenova was a mindless puppet. So while Jenova's body did the killing, Sephy's will was commanding the body.

[Zeromus_X]

Yes, I knew it wasn't Seph but I wasn't sure if it was a projection or if it was Jenova. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

Although, I had to play the game two times to piece together anything even remotely sensible...

[Rengori]

I've beaten it twice and it still confuses the hell outta me.

[Psychotic]

It's never been specifically stated that it's Jenova and not Sephiroth. It's all down to individual interpretation.

[Peter_20]

Yeah. She just was TOO wounded to have a Pheonix down or a Life spell casted on her <_<...Actually, yes.

Phoenix Downs only work on knocked out characters, not killed ones.

[Xurts]

It's never been specifically stated that it's Jenova and not Sephiroth. It's all down to individual interpretation.
It has to be Jenova. Sephiroth can't be two places at once.

[Rengori]

It's never been specifically stated that it's Jenova and not Sephiroth. It's all down to individual interpretation.
It has to be Jenova. Sephiroth can't be two places at once.
Hojo cloned him a couple of times I believe.

[Xurts]

It's never been specifically stated that it's Jenova and not Sephiroth. It's all down to individual interpretation.
It has to be Jenova. Sephiroth can't be two places at once.
Hojo cloned him a couple of times I believe.
Yes, but all of those "clones" except for Cloud were failures and had succumbed to Mako Poisoning (except Zack). There is no way in hell one of those "clones" could've killed Aeris.

Even if they had withstood the Mako, none of them looked identical to Sephiroth. Jenova was the only creature that was able to shape shift. The only possible identities of Aeris's murderer are either Sephiroth or Jenova, and since Sephiroth was up at the Northern Crater during the incident at the Forgotten City, the only answer that would make sense is that Jenova killed her.

[Dignified Pauper]

i thought it was Jenova who was in command of Sephiroth. Further, i thought that Squall of Seed had this already sorted out in one of his webpages. it'd be awesome if someone pulled that up.

further, Kefka is vastly superior to Sephiroth for reasons already mentioned.

[Zeromus_X]

The Ultimania guide stated that Sephiroth's will was strong enough to resist Jenova's control. I never immediately thought that meant he necessarily controlled her, but that seems to be the case.

Yes, there are better villains. Why does that make him a bad villain? Can nobody answer that, or is this just going to be a thread full of 'Kefka is better becasue Sephiroht is overrateedd!!11one'? It seems to me like Kefka is the more overrated villain, in that case.

[Xurts]

i thought it was Jenova who was in command of Sephiroth. Further, i thought that Squall of Seed had this already sorted out in one of his webpages. it'd be awesome if someone pulled that up.

further, Kefka is vastly superior to Sephiroth for reasons already mentioned.
Here it is:
http://faqs.ign.com/articles/657/657331p1.html

Unfortunately, he didn't write a chapter explaining it, but I know it's in there somewhere. That's where I read about it from.

[Kain_Highwind]

Is there anybody else who thinks Hojo could be considered more of a villain than Sephiroth? I'm talking about the man who used his own child as a guinea pig before he was even born, transformed Vincent into an abomination out of spite, turned countless humans into vicious monsters, had Gast killed and stole his work, treated Aeris like any common animal, cloned one of the most dangerous men in the world, rejoiced when Sephiroth got the Black Materia, and nearly destroyed the entire city of Midgar, and all in the name of science and to further his own ambitions. Plus, once he found Gast's files, he knew the truth about Jenova, and still he orchestrated the Reunion by cloning Sephiroth and basically helped bring about the end of the world.

[Zeromus_X]

Yes, they don't focus on him nearly enough.

I'm actually half sarcastic.

[Ryushikaze]

cloned one of the most dangerous men in the world,

When? Sephy clones are not literal clones, and should not be considered to be in any way, shape, or form, like he is mentally or physically.


and all in the name of science

No, he did it all in the name of Hojo. Not science. The man's a fraud. A wannabe genius. The man thought you could breed extra-genus by simple bestiality. He's a gorram nutbar.

[Kain_Highwind]

cloned one of the most dangerous men in the world,

When? Sephy clones are not literal clones, and should not be considered to be in any way, shape, or form, like he is mentally or physically.


and all in the name of science

No, he did it all in the name of Hojo. Not science. The man's a fraud. A wannabe genius. The man thought you could breed extra-genus by simple bestiality. He's a gorram nutbar.

Sorry, I should have said, "attempted to clone." And I guess by "science" I'm referring more to his own incessant curiosity for all things world-ending.

[Aralith]

I think a lot of us are missing the beauty of Sephiroth's character here. He wasn't your typical villain. He wasn't just like: "I need to become a God so I can become powerful. Why I want this power I do not know. Let's go kill some people." Sephiroth wasn't like that at all. In fact, I thought Sephiroth was more a victim than a villain. He was turned into the villain because of Hojo. It was because of what Hojo did to him that made him vulnerable to the villainry. He saw an easy way out of why he might have been the way he was and took it. Most of the time he thought he was in the right, doing the world a favor, rather than destroying it.

Sephiroth had more character than Kefka did in the fact that he didn't do a great number of evil things. I like to think that a part of what he used to be still remained inside of him and kept him from doing many more evil things with his power. As Kain_Highwind said, Hojo was the true villain. He did terrible things to everyone around him and set in motion almost every problem in that game.

[sephirothishere]

what made sephiroth scary and whatever was in the first disc before you really know anything about him he just seems really intimidating especially when you have been playing for a few hours and suddenly you end up in the shinra building with bloody marks as if something had been dragged along the floor...but then once you learn he is just confused he becomes less scary and shinra become the worse of the evils...if you go to nibelheim and see cloud toss him into the mako he jus looks like a little kitten.... hahahahahah...hojo starts scarin me....he is a crazy ass foo...

[Dell]

SEPHIROTHISTEHSUCKERINTHEWORLD!!!1one!!11eleven!!!$elven!!!solution%!!!

Seriously, Sephiroth is just a normal villain, he did what a villain must do, he die like a villain must die and he demand on returning to the world like a villain must do.

In my opinion, Kuja and Kefka was ten-ten-ten-ten-10-10-ten-100 thousand times better than him. Both of them are clever, evil and gracious (Kuja)/funny (Kefka).

But last week, I had played Tactic (Once again) with my friend (Using his PSX), I was amazed by their villain.
They acted like a true villain
Cheers for them
But I hate almost all zodiac face.....
And I hate Miluda and Meliadoul.....and Malak.

[Dignified Pauper]

Does this mean that Sephiroth really is the Puppet Master of Final Fantasy
VII? Yes. JENOVA's instincts play out through Sephiroth, however, it was not
consciously manipulating or controlling him into doing anything, nor was he
technically controlling it. He WAS JENOVA, or, rather, it's evolved form.
There was not any puppeteering going on except that which was exerted over
Cloud and the black-cloaked Clones from Nibelheim. There was just growth.
Sephiroth could control all of JENOVA's Cells that were disembodied and could
manipulate those in whom they were injected, but he was not controlling JENOVA
because the JENOVA that the Cetra had known no longer existed and all that
remained was him. He simply grew as a mutation of JENOVA.

i believe this clears up who was the puppet master.

[Zeromus_X]

Yes, we knew. Ultimania guide, and what-not.

I also think Hojo isn't payed enough attention to, if anything, he can be considered the 'mastermind' behind everything, even if in the end, he doesn't do much but set everything up. He dug up Jenova. He began injecting it into his victims, including his own son, all for the purpose of increasing his knowledge. Perhaps he saw that if Sephiroth became a god, he too, would have succeeded in godhood. Or something like that. I'm delving too deep into it, but point being, Hojo isn't a bad villain.

But anyway, back to Sephiroth, it was nice to see a villain with more character with Kefka, even if his type of villain is so overused by the series afterward. ("I r teh nihilistick godly antaganixt!11one"). Shame, hopefully they'll think of a 'Type C' villain from now on.