What the BevHELLe?

[bipper]

One thing I always wondered. If summoners went on yay pilgramage, and visited all the faith, would someone not have noticed bevelles zealous use of forbiden machina?

Just a thought.

[licence]

Yeah, they would.
Unless it was introduced very recently which is unlikely.

[Aria28]

Maybe other summoners didn't use the same way to get to the Chamber of the Fayth - after all, you're on the run when you get there, so it may be that the party has to take a non conventional way to do so

Sometimes also, when the faith is very strong, some may stop questionning what is done in the name of the belief system they support. Using machinas wasn't the only oddity during a typical summoner pilgrimage, yet some go through with it, or even go to great lengths to defend it (think Isaru....)

[Helios]

I think it was added recently, before Braska, but after the high summoner before him, I think there was some time between the two...

[Tavrobel]

One thing I always wondered. If summoners went on yay pilgramage, and visited all the faith, would someone not have noticed bevelles zealous use of forbiden machina?

Just a thought.

They wouldn't use the same way as the party, since the party did crash a wedding, run into forbidden chambers, and get arrested. Also, it's unlikely that any of the Summoners before Braska would've known about this; the machina were probably introduced near the end of Mika's reign, either before, or right after he died, when his mind was no longer led by mortal reasoning.

Also, Kinoc, Kelk, and Jyscal would've known, not that Kinoc would've done anything about it based on his eaction to it in the game. Jyscal was killed, and Kelk was killed as well. Seymour and Mika are on the same side, being dead and all that.

Since the party did approach the Temple from the top, and fought their way down, I would assume that most Summoners use the ground level lifts, or there were mages that could cast Warp/Exit for the Summoners in order to bring them into the Chamber.

[bipper]

Makes enough sense, except for the fact that all the other chambers have a single path in and out. I would not think this temple would be any different.

[Sain Cai]

Blitzball also uses Machina and was Spira's most popular sport/ means of recreation

[feona17]

Blitzball also uses Machina and was Spira's most popular sport/ means of recreation

Yes but by Yevon's terms, some machina is good, some machina is bad.

[Tavrobel]

Makes enough sense, except for the fact that all the other chambers have a single path in and out. I would not think this temple would be any different.

Yes, a single path, which constitutes... ten percent or less of the Temple's overall interior space?

IKEA plz.



Blitzball also uses Machina and was Spira's most popular sport/ means of recreation

Yes but by Yevon's terms, some machina is good, some machina is bad.

Yevon rules that the Machina usable are the ones that recreate things that people cannot do:

E.g., the Blitzball Stadium spouts are allowed, since they recreate what would take one hundred Lulus to accomplish, and is not used to injure or cause ill will to anyone/thing else; if anything, it helps everyone, except for those that CHOOSE to suffer. Compared to the one used at Operation Mi'ihen, which produces power that cannot be replicated by human means with one small twist: it was made to destroy.

Both machina are incredibly helpful. Unfortunately one is at the expense of the other. The entirety and system of Spira is one gigantic parasite. It helps itself, as long as someone else doesn't get hurt... or you never get caught (and most of the time, someone suffers without knowing it). The people of Bevelle definitely learned this lesson.

[bipper]

bbb...bbbut the part that they went through was designed as a clostier of trials either way.

what is Ikea? I googled and got sweedish furniture. Answering this question was helpful, but I am NOT paying that much for furniture. Even if you do kinda GOE!

[Tavrobel]

Well, I couldn't think of any other furniture stores besides IKEA. It's also European. What's great about it is that you assemble it yourself! WIN!

[bipper]

Well, I couldn't think of any other furniture stores besides IKEA. It's also European. What's great about it is that you assemble it yourself! WIN!

I will assemble software, but anything that matters, I hire and underpaid import to do for me. kthx :0

What about the cloister of trials though? They involved machina. I do not accept the fact that some machina is allowed as an answer. This is a temple of Yevon! There will be no Charlisness here, peasents.

Bipper

[Tavrobel]

Well, Auron does mention that the true face of Yevon does turn on its own teachings.

Do as we say, not as we do. Definitely.

However, it's possible that the floating panels/glowing glyphs are not machina (some Temple-only form of magic), since most machina don't exactly have glowing veins of green and pink. These are also found (in much smaller quantities) in other Temples, such as Kilika, where one vein disabled the fire walls.

The only people that would know about this are Summoners and Guardians (which explains the ban placed on Tidus), and most people don't exactly stop Summoners on the side of a road and ask "zomaigawd, u wure ni teh templez? NO WAI!" This could be assumed. The last thing on someone's mind, I would assume, is details of something that they don't have to worry about. Seems similar to the situation in our current world. Summoners and Guardians usually die, also. Two are guaranteed to die at the revelation of the truth. The others would be incredibly shocked.

Considering that it's been 1000 years since the war, there must have been SOME attempt at non machina design and advancement. Of course, the leaders could simply stop it, or use it to their own whims through subversion, as they did with the Hymn of the Fayth.

[bipper]

I think I accept that answer :p

[Sain Cai]

Blitzball also uses Machina and was Spira's most popular sport/ means of recreation

Yes but by Yevon's terms, some machina is good, some machina is bad.

Fair enough. I didnt read the part of forbidden machina to start...thus:

Given the circumstances in which we see the use of such machina, I am sure summoners were not branded traitors and therefore did not see them. And if there were some that saw this, they were most likely thrown into Via Purifico , and as Kinoc says, No one has survived Via Purifico, or something like that.

[f f freak]

they were most likely thrown into Via Purifico , and as Kinoc says, No one has survived Via Purifico, or something like that
Which is strange considering that it is a straight line from where they throw you in to how you get out.

[Psydekick]

Very good point, And remember they probably went in a different way.

Remember that all summoners arent from besaid

[Ozmoid]

I seem to remeber something about everyone knowing about the warrior monks' machina. But the machina in the traials seem like the kind of thing Sin was made to stop: transportation machina.