Really, the ethics of stealing is "boring and false"? Let me know how you feel about that when intellectual property is how you feed your family.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunny
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Really, the ethics of stealing is "boring and false"? Let me know how you feel about that when intellectual property is how you feed your family.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunny
Most people feed their family with money earned from a salary they earn while doing a job they are paid for. Most people do not feed their family with money earned from sales, that goes almost solely to the company and is earned prior to the purchase of a physical copy of a game. Unless you are making commission from sales (which doesn't happen if you sell video games) or you are an extremely small company (which is a completely different monster entirely, especially since we aren't talking about an indie company) your argument is completely invalid.
Only a die-hard Elder Scrolls fan would find something to complain about here. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Pike
Wow, I know many of us pirate stuff and don't bat an eyelash about it, but this is the first time I've heard someone actually argue that it's not stealing and unethical. What the hell?
You know sales figures determine if the company stays in business and these people continue to get a salary, right?
As for the topic, $80 for all that is not too bad, though this is probably geared more towards collectors than newcomers to the series (like myself--I've never actually played an Elder Scrolls game).
I never argued that pirating things was not stealing or unethical. I simply stated that not every person on the planet has the same specific ethics and that they differ from person-to-person. Some people don't view it as stealing or unethical. Sorry if that was not clear in my original post. Regardless though, pirating a video game is about as unethical as most of the business practices that Gamestop or EA uses. Doesn't make it right, but makes it a tad more understandable to me.Quote:
Wow, I know many of us pirate stuff and don't bat an eyelash about it, but this is the first time I've heard someone actually argue that it's not stealing and unethical. What the hell?
Yea, I'm aware of this but thanks for the clarification. I really don't think a small portion of the population that does illegally download video games is going to significantly impact a huge company enough that it will put them out of business. Can you name one established video game company that was put out of business due solely to the loss of sales from pirating?Quote:
You know sales figures determine if the company stays in business and these people continue to get a salary, right?
Well obviously people who don't view it as stealing are wrong. Thanks for clarifying that you're not one of them. It means a lot to me.
I'm with Bunny in that I really can't blame anyone for downloading a copy of a game they wouldn't otherwise buy. I only have a problem with companies who decide to go into budiness ripping off others IP. That was what the SOPA and PIPA laws were all about, except the multi-billion dollar corporations who vicariously and contributarily profit from such infringement spent a ton of money convincing us that it was about our individual rights but that's another thread.
Piracy has killed one platform, though and that was the PSP. Publishers backed off of it once the data was coming out about just how many people were pirating the biggest games as opposed to buying them at release. Although as a gamer, when the PSP became a "dead" platform in the west, that was when the most incredible games started coming out for it. Because of that, I'll never buy the argument that the more sales a company gets, the better games we as consumers will start getting.
Buy that's also another thread.
I do disagree with the straight piracy=stealing equivalence. It is more complex than that. For example, I have downloaded some old NES/SNES ROMs, and even some PS2 games that I already owned so that I could take screenshots. In none of those cases would I have actually bought the game (again), so no one actually lost money from a potential sale. Under what definition of "theft" is that stealing?
It does fit under some standards of copyright infringement, which is another issue. But a big problem with copyright law is where it divorces itself from moral standards, and is enforced in a black-and-white fashion (just see how the RIAA has alienated, well, everyone over the years). The more clear-cut infringer is the distributor, someone who uploads a copy of the game for mass-distribution for any and all comers.
Although at this point we're getting pretty off-topic. :p I will say that the Anthology looks very cool, and if I didn't already have Morrowind and Oblivion I would consider getting it myself.
Well, on-topic, this came up in the context of downloading these individual games for free instead of buying the collector's set, which pretty much fits the definition of stealing. :p
That I would agree with. If I care enough about a game that I would buy it if the internet didn't exist, especially one that's still being published, then I will go out and pay for it. As I said, I would consider this Anthology if I didn't already own Morrowind and if I cared at all about the Oblivion expansions.
I'd consider it for the maps but meh, the only games I don't have are Arena and Daggerfall and I don't have a burning desire to play either of them anytime soon. Maybe if I was still a teenager and had all the free time in the world.
I know it's hard to believe but the expacs are far and away the best part of Oblivion. Shivering Isles in particular.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raistlin
Also, for anyone who is interested, Arena and Daggerfall are available free from the Elder Scrolls website. They're as-is so it takes a few minutes of messing around in Dosbox to get them running, but they work.
But yeah between the fact that I've downloaded those ages ago and own two copies each of Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim, the only real reason I'm interested in the Anthology is because I'm a superfan. :p
I'd personally make a distinction between pirating things that aren't really available for sale as opposed to things that are (I had no problem ROMing DQ5 long ago, when there was simply no English release) and things that are, sure. In either case it's stealing; I just feel justified in doing it.
Whether you want to steal from large corporations is your business, I suppose, but I assume that anyone can see the reasons why someone might not want to do that, which is the entire point.
Theft and copyright infringement are completely different things, and even exist in completely different areas of law. You lot are like the "PIRACY - IT'S A CRIME" tosspots. It's not a crime; stop referring to it as such. Ethical dilemmas aside, it's important to call a spade a spade, for the sake of clarity and just plain being-correct-ness.
Offtopic much, guys? :p Feel free to make another thread as this is an interesting topic but we should really go back to talking about TES and how I really just want these figurines to be included in the anthology:
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