would you want to go home?

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03-09-2005, 11:05 AM
Mittopotahis

Ah, but they met Cid outside! He was in the vicinity of the house...but i guess then Marche and Doned's mum would of been taken into Ivalice as well...oh well so much for that...

Your theory...its intriging...Its confusing...but it makes sense if you know what i mean...

I wouldn't go back. No way. Never. That's the problem I had with this game. I disagreed with what you had to do...Sometimes I'd Purposely lose a Guardian Battle so the world will stay the same...but then i thought..."Whats the Point? I'll just get a game over and get another try at it" Then I finished the game (not as in all the missions, im still doing those)(SPOILER)and i was sad cause everyone went back to normal and ritz looked much better with Pink hair and.....yeah thats another thing i didnt really like, the reason Ritz didnt want to go was because her hair was White and she had to dye it everyday...I personally couldnt be bothered doing it everyday but she a girl and they want to...anyway...HEY that supports your theory Skyblade...you said that Mewt's vision of them is kinda taken into Ivalice and that how they were...well Mewt saw Rita as having pink hair, so in Ivalice, she had pink hair!
anyway...

EDIT: Oh you said that..Cursed Skyblade..always one step head of me! :)
03-09-2005, 12:58 PM
Zante

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyblade

Cid wasn't...

I think Judgemaster Cid wasn't the real Cid, as Mewt's mom wasn't his real mom. In the mission with the zombies Ritz says that she doesn't think the zombies were truly Colins band, and I think it's the same with Cid.
03-09-2005, 02:03 PM
tailz

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyblade

Don't challenge me again... :D

That makes sense, except:
(SPOILER)You see everyone in the world get wiped out when Ritz, Mewt, Cid, Doned, and Marche leave at the end of the normal game, remember? So we know that them leaving destroys the world!

argh im going nuts here you counter all of my ******* arguments this is very frustrating (bangs his head into the wall 2 time(thats better)) i dont think im able to talk my way out of this one

after watching the ending again i noticed something

cid says if the people of ivalice wish it enough it will remain but we can never go back

yes got you now

counter that :P:D

your turn m8
03-09-2005, 02:27 PM
Skyblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by tailz

argh im going nuts here you counter all of my ******* arguments this is very frustrating (bangs his head into the wall 2 time(thats better)) i dont think im able to talk my way out of this one

after watching the ending again i noticed something

cid says if the people of ivalice wish it enough it will remain but we can never go back

yes got you now

counter that :P:D

your turn m8

If you really want me to. Cid actually says "maybe", if the people of Ivalice wish it enough, it will remain. And then we see it disappear, so it seems he was wrong...
03-09-2005, 03:34 PM
tailz

oh verneukt gewoon te goed

damm it uhm let me think you dont actually see the world returning you get a picture of the school so like my (i think my first) argumant you dont know if they really are destroyd maybe they marche and co just see them disapear but actually they disapear themselfs how nout that

and how much i like discussing any ff i played i wish to end this cause im losing :P just kidding

your turn m8
03-09-2005, 07:28 PM
Skyblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by tailz

oh verneukt gewoon te goed

damm it uhm let me think you dont actually see the world returning you get a picture of the school so like my (i think my first) argumant you dont know if they really are destroyd maybe they marche and co just see them disapear but actually they disapear themselfs how nout that

and how much i like discussing any ff i played i wish to end this cause im losing :P just kidding

your turn m8

Translate that first line, if you would be so kind. It's...German? I'd like to know what it says...

Except that the disappearances happen all over Ivalice, and they don't start until after Marche and company leave. It starts when Doned leaves the pub (what a kid that young was doing in a drinking establishment is beyond me... :D ). After he's gone, the pub owner and Ezel vanish. So it is not just them disappearing to Marche and his friends, because he and his friends weren't there to see any of the disappearances. Which is why he still thinks that he did the right thing, not knowing that he is a cold-blooded mass murderer...

Your turn.
03-09-2005, 07:38 PM
Destai

I thought going home was absaloutely ridiculous. The creators just used that plot for the sake of sacrafice and I was really dissapointed because it was never explained to me why Marche would really want to go home.
03-09-2005, 07:50 PM
Skyblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by Destai

I thought going home was absaloutely ridiculous. The creators just used that plot for the sake of sacrafice and I was really dissapointed because it was never explained to me why Marche would really want to go home.

Marche wants to go home because he believes it is the right thing to do. Staying in a dream world is very unhealthy, psychologically speaking. It would be even worse for Mewt, since it was based on his dreams. So, if the world was not dependent on Mewt, Doned, Cid, Ritz, and Marche for survival, then leaving would indeed have been the right thing to do.
03-09-2005, 08:16 PM
tailz

translation it says "oh **** just to good"

and its dutch btw damm your good but heres another thing they all disapear the same way doned marche and so it could be just that they also return to st ivalice but that when they went to ivalice they couldnt remember a thing just like cid you cant say he knew al about st ivalice he knew nothing about it also mewt only started to remember when the totema's where destroyed but why marche rich and doned did remeber is beyond me so have your turn if you will

btw sorry about typing dutch i just lost it after what you typed :D now have your go against that :D

your turn m8
03-09-2005, 08:32 PM
Skyblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by tailz

translation it says "oh **** just to good"

and its dutch btw damm your good but heres another thing they all disapear the same way doned marche and so it could be just that they also return to st ivalice but that when they went to ivalice they couldnt remember a thing just like cid you cant say he knew al about st ivalice he knew nothing about it also mewt only started to remember when the totema's where destroyed but why marche rich and doned did remeber is beyond me so have your turn if you will

btw sorry about typing dutch i just lost it after what you typed :D now have your go against that :D

your turn m8

Actually, Cid and Mewt did remember. They were in denial. Mewt was in his perfect dream world, and didn't want anything to be any different, so he convinced himself that the dream world was real. Even when the destruction of the Crystals forced him to relive the memories, he still denied it. Cid was the same way. He really loved Remedi, and liked the dream world as well. I think that when both of them first showed up they were as confused as Marche. But it wouldn't take them long to get into the spirit of things. Probably the only reason why Ritz and Doned didn't immerse themselves into Ivalice entirely was because the changes (Ritz's hair, and Doned's illness) were too sharply contrasting with their memories. Ritz knew that her hair had been white, and she held on to the real world through that memory. Doned also knew that he had been unable to run around and have fun, and that memory was what kept him connected to the real world. Cid and Mewt both knew that Remedi was dead, but she meant so much to them, that when it seemed that they could get her back, they jumped at the opportunity, and did everything they could to wipe her death out of their minds, which is why at first neither of them recognizes the world for what it truly is. They erased their own memories, because they didn't want to believe that Remedi was dead. Doned's illness was actually gone in Ivalice, and Ritz's hair was actually red. Remedi was not the true Remedi from the real world, though. The real Remedi was dead. If Mewt and Cid had held on to the real world, they would have been unable to accept that Queen Remedi was really Mewt's mom. They denied it because they didn't want to face the fact that she was gone.

Right back at ya! ;)
03-09-2005, 08:41 PM
Destai

The dream world practically was real. They could live happy lives there and a disabled kid could even walk. Marche didnt have any right to take that away from anyone. When the crystals were at there strongest Cid clearly didnt remember as he was confused but admitted to the truth when he saw his past self when the 4th crystal was destroyed. It wasnt Marches choice to make because "he" thinks its unhealthy.
03-09-2005, 08:44 PM
tailz

oh damn your good your verry good

but tell me one thing i only remember them not nowing i dont think they where in denial of what truelly happend i quote "i just rememberd something horrible all the kids at school where trowing snowballs at me and one had a rock inside" i think its pretty close and that so outa my head that makes me think they dont remember and that part where cid sees how he was srry cant remember what they said but k

btw skyblade can i have your msn adres its fun chatting with you :D

but explain me that one good and i give up unles you dont want me to

go ahead your turn m8
03-10-2005, 02:35 AM
Skyblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by tailz

oh damn your good your verry good

but tell me one thing i only remember them not nowing i dont think they where in denial of what truelly happend i quote "i just rememberd something horrible all the kids at school where trowing snowballs at me and one had a rock inside" i think its pretty close and that so outa my head that makes me think they dont remember and that part where cid sees how he was srry cant remember what they said but k

btw skyblade can i have your msn adres its fun chatting with you :D

but explain me that one good and i give up unles you dont want me to

go ahead your turn m8

Well, when Cid remembers the truth (when you destroy Exodus' crystal), he talks of how he went all to pieces, which was why Mewt made him the Judgemaster in Ivalice, or "maybe he did that to himself", remember? He did know the truth, he just didn't want to admit it, even to himself. Deep in his head (his subconcious definitely knew about it), he knew that Remedi was dead, but since she was there in the dream world, he blocked those painful memories from his mind until he was forced to face them by the crystal's destruction.

Destai, certainly it was not Marche's decision whether the others should go home. That's why he convinces them to go back, he doesn't just go back and drag them with him. And it was necessary for Mewt to leave. Had he remained in that world he would eventually have gone mad. Marche believed that going home was the right thing, and he convinced the others of that. He didn't force them to go home. He couldn't. The world remained until they all wanted to leave. He didn't "take" anything away from them. They gave it up. Even with Mewt, he just made him realize the truth, that Remedi was not his mother, and that he was betraying his real mother by pretending that Queen Remedi was his mother. Marche made Mewt realize that what he truly wanted couldn't come true, even in the dream world. His mother was dead. Doned and Ritz accepted that the dream world was just that: a dream. Doned knew that Ivalice wasn't real. He did want to run and play, but he wanted to do it in the real world as well. Ritz knew that staying in Ivalice indefinitely was a bad idea. But she was enjoying her time there. So she decided that she would go back, she would just keep playing the game as long as she could. Cid recognized the truth as soon as he faced his memories, and worked to help Marche from then on. However, he did not actively work to get home. I think he suspected the truth (at least, the truth as I believe it), that Ivalice and all its inhabitants would be destroyed if they all left. He knew that he shouldn't stay, but he couldn't let Ivalice die just so that the five of them could get home. I believe this is why he makes the comment that "maybe if the people of Ivalice want it enough, this world will endure" at the end. He wants to hope that Ivalice will survive, even if he fears it will not.

Oh, and tailz? I'm afraid I don't have an MSN address. My internet activity is limited to two forums, of which EoFF is one, and a few other sites. My chatting time is non-existant, and my e-mails are almost as rare. Don't give up though, unless you can't think of anything else. This is a fun discussion.
03-10-2005, 03:49 AM
Mittopotahis

hehehe...i could sit here a watch this all year...
03-10-2005, 04:32 PM
Destai

I can understand what was wrong with Mewt and his farther staying there as long as they pretended the le grim was remedi but for Ritz and Doned(Doned particularly) there was no reason for them to go. And Marche destroyed the fifth crystal with forcing them to go home in mind. .Yes it didnt work but that was clearly Marches intention.

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