If we do the Danganronpa thing, we could do it like it sometimes happened in the game - Monokuma (the host) could sometimes just get bored and just cut the day short without warning. To keep players on edge ;)
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If we do the Danganronpa thing, we could do it like it sometimes happened in the game - Monokuma (the host) could sometimes just get bored and just cut the day short without warning. To keep players on edge ;)
Well, the night phase should always be very quick, unless day ends in an odd hour for some time zones. Individual night actions should take seconds to make and the mafia does not need several hours do determine a kill. Shortening the day phase during later stages may be good but it can't be too short since we have a lot of members on very different schedules and everyone should have a chance to participate. What bugs me more is when there is a consensus on who people will be voting for and we just leave the day open until the time limit to see if anyone decides to hang themselves with the time left or if some mafia on the chopping block slips up and outs their comrades.
The slowness really boils down to fewer number of players in the late stages who still may be in different time zones. Not really much we can do about that I think.
That would be fun, as long as the players understand this in the beginning so no one gets butthurt if they are the victim of his antics. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
Yeah, time zones is a good point. The Night can definitely be shortened.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Funnily enough, leaving the day open until the time limit is actually what's happening now. But I'm giving the Day 24 hours, not the usual 48.
I think once all Night Actions are in, bam day starts. No need to wait when everything is all ready.
And honestly I'm just waiting for Aerith's Knight to post something today :p
You got it.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaunaWhen They Cry is a series of Visual Novels, Higurashi: When They Cry (Parts 1 & 2), and Umineko: When They Cry (Parts 1 & 2). There's... four chapters of Higurashi available on Steam which I believe is the entirety of the first part, as well as the first part of Umineko. They are mystery supernatural thriller tales.Quote:
Originally Posted by PsychoticIn all seriousness I would like Karifean's answer. There was a thread a few months ago where both he and Ultima Shadow praised it as a fantastic experience and so I was curious and looked it up on Steam but didn't quite get it - are there others in the series you need to experience first, or? I saw someone had done a LP on YouTube and thought about watching it wasn't sure if it was the right thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
I have never actually read the visual novels, but the anime for Higurashi was more than enough to get me wanting to sink my teeth ~eventually~.
(Karifean will correct anything wrong I have said here and probably expand further on certain things)
I would've responded earlier, but I decided to just write up a blog post for this matter, see here: http://home.eyesonff.com/entry.php/6...-When-They-Cry
TECHNICALLY you'll have the next day phase to lose lose, depending on Karifean's win condition preference. If you guys hit a town with a lynch and a town at night, the next day will start 2 v 2 They still aren't the majority at that point. They would just have to convince one townie to vote the other townie. the townies can both vote for a mafia though and be at a stalemate. All they have to do is convince one person to vote for the pro town player.
Honestly it depends on the GM. Some will say mafia win at the even point but others make them fight it out. :gator:
Town has decided.
I'm fine with losing, I just don't want to lose a perfect game. Let us at least snatch one Mafia. Lynching only town is just... sad.
Where's the "place your head in a paper bag" smiley?
This is going to be a fun night phase
"Someone was going to be murdered but then it turned out everyone remaining in town had killed themselves out of shame".
Win conditions are in the original post. As soon as the number of Mafia is equal to or higher than the number of townies, the Mafia win.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Well, congratulations, Mafia!Quote:
Originally Posted by KarifeanWin conditions are in the original post. As soon as the number of Mafia is equal to or higher than the number of townies, the Mafia win.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Oh! I re-read it and didn't see where that was posted but I see now, I must have ignored it cause of the font color difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by KarifeanWin conditions are in the original post. As soon as the number of Mafia is equal to or higher than the number of townies, the Mafia win.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Congratulations to the Mafia. They played it well. Now that I know what to do and not to do I will be a stronger player next time.
Seriously though, once this is all said and done (in 24 hours time), can expert Mafia break down where I went wrong? Because I really need to learn how to read posts inquisitively and suss out suspicious activity. Gosh, first time playing town and I fail to spot a single Mafia? It's pathetic.
I'm curious to see if we were led astray by any of the flavour text. Maybe I was ruling things out that actually hadn't been ruled out, and it had been designed to be read with more suspicion? It's funny, after the first night we were all "Oh I wonder if this'll make things too easy for the town?"
NOPE
Just published my closing thoughts. Basically, I feel as if Day Two was the turning point where things went horribly wrong, and Day Three was just fallout. By carefully crafting a two-man bandwagon of Shauna/Nutty, whoever 'won' and wasn't lynched would end up being lynched without question the following day, out of reaction to the failed lynch.
I feel like being an incompetent town has given me really good practice at being a successful mafia in the future
How often have you played, Fox? I was just curious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
First time in this style. I played half a dozen tabletop games of Secret Hitler before.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormalhautHow often have you played, Fox? I was just curious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
Is Secret Hitler like IRL Mafia, or is there another rule change?Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFirst time in this style. I played half a dozen tabletop games of Secret Hitler before.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormalhautHow often have you played, Fox? I was just curious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
There are some extra rules. You have two teams, liberal and fascist, and you are each trying to get your policies passed. You take it in turns to be president, the president nominates a chancellor (everyone votes to allow the election or not) and gives them two policy cards. The chancellor returns one card to the deck and plays the other one, revealing if it is liberal of fascist.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormalhautIs Secret Hitler like IRL Mafia, or is there another rule change?Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxFirst time in this style. I played half a dozen tabletop games of Secret Hitler before.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormalhautHow often have you played, Fox? I was just curious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
So there's a lot of extra steps where you can introduce suspicion. There's a lot of "I gave him a fascist and a liberal card and he played the fascist!" "No you didn't you gave me two fascist cards!" that gets thrown around. So it's a very different game, despite being based on the same principles.
Secret Hitler is probably my favorite board game overall. It's also a secret identity game like Mafia, but plays rather differrently and fixes a lot of the problems. Mainly these three things:
- People do not die early on. There is a maximum of two kills per game and they happen fairly late in the game if at all.
- Townies are not imbalanced; there are no special powers.
- There is no need for a game master, which is pretty cool in a live tabletop round.
While the basic setup is the same every game, there's an element of randomness that makes every game feel different. The only downside is that Secret Hitler is a game for 5-10 players, no more, no less, and the game kinda sucks with exactly 6 players too.
If you want, and a couple other people feel inclined to join as well, we can play some rounds of Secret Hitler on Tabletop Simulator (can be bought on Steam) sometime. It'll be fun.
Sounds fun! I'd love to play more board games and other games with you guys. Bickering about rules aside, you all seem like a great bunch.
And I love playing games, but it's always so difficult to get people to play party games like these.
Even though I was lynched today I had a blast playing with you guys and look forward to playing next time already.
Everyone was far too obsessed with the flavour text for their own good.
Maybe so, however it was the only thing that could provide trustworthy, factual information. If we did it all again, even after this miserable failure, I don't think I would change that aspect of my approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
But it's clearly not trustworthy! :p
The source is trustworthy, it's my interpretation of it that failed!Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
Shadow had one dying wish and that was for you all to talk, and use the time that you had to gather all the information to maximum potential. Why wouldn't you wait for a confirmed investigator to come in and provide his results? What the heck? He still had a day to surface.
Since the game is over, I will post some things! Namely, my deductions that I sent through to Karifean on Night 2, following my death (he can confirm receipt of this if you don't believe it):
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaunaI will take you up on your offer of listening to the deductions of the dead. Enjoy~
I missed this post entirely because it was so close to my death, and it would have made no difference either way if I had analysed it in time, but.
This makes no sense. None whatsoever. Given the situation he had to believe one of us was mafia. From his point of view, there were a total of four possible girls in play.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
FFNut (Lenna)
AK (Faris)
Scruffy (Garnet)
Me (I am Shadow, but there were doubts on his side that this was true)
Given that Faris could not be the killer as she had performed an investigative action that leaves the three of us. One of us has to be mafia. Scruffy cannot claim to be town, while claiming that both myself and FFNut are town. It just cannot work. And Scruffy is a smart player, he should know this, and I'm sure he does - he's just counting on the town overlooking it, which I am confident they will.
If he were town, he really should have been all over the FFNut bandwagon, because it would save his skin if FFNut flipped mafia. But he wasn't. Because he knew FFNut would flip town, and that would leave him as the only female who was available to kill qwerty in Night One.
I mean, either FFNut or myself being lynched is fine for him and the mafia.
If FFNut went, I would garner all the bad press and probably be lynched under accusations of not being Shadow and being a lying female character.
Now that I'm gone, they'll heap all the blame onto FFNut, primarily thanks to my efforts (it's not my fault he was being so shady :colbert: )
Both of us are town, and both of us would act as scapegoats in Day 3, leading to a Mafia victory. Well, it will, unless the Mafia do something stupid like not take out Freya and instead target her target.
So yeah. New theory is Scruffy is mafia. Don't know who his partner is. Either AK or Fynn.
Going back to something that Formy asked earlier - is it easier to win as mafia or town? They each have their own difficulties.
To be a good mafia, you have to lie convincingly all the time. Playing mafia is playing a lie. If you get caught, you need to come up with a new lie to explain that away, and another, and so on. Lying and convincing deflection.
And that is why town need to talk. Because if they encounter something that doesn't quite fit, they should ask about it. Mafia lies become obvious when they have to keep covering up for themselves, eventually they will slip up. Town have no reason to lie, excepting protecting their power roles. Asking questions is not the same as suspecting someone. Town falls into its usual defensive stance when this comes up - why are you questioning my motives, that means you think I am mafia and I am not therefore you are mafia! If you don't want someone to ask why you said or did something... well, you said/did the things! Why shouldn't someone else ask you about it? It turns the town on itself while the mafia can lie low, throwing in a vote on either side with minimal thought and throw fuel on the ever increasing fire.
When I say it like this, it seems so easy. But it's definitely not easy. FFNut found this the hard way when he had to explain why he asked a question. It was a stupid move for him to do so, with no reasonable explanation. These situations come up. Also, a good mafia will also know how to be a good town. After all, it's part of their lie.
Anyway, gg mafia. You got us good.
I think a combination of AK not surfacing, Psy saying that waiting is annoying and everyone else just wanting to get on with it prompted me to vote AK.
I said what now?
I SAID NOTHING OF THE SORT :monocle:
Only a Mafia would say I would say such a thing!
get lynched, scum
##vote: Formalhaut
Another thing, going on from the above interaction - read what people actually say. Don't rely on other people's recaps.
Don;t put the blame on Psy now, Formy :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
I think the main mistake Town made this time around was latching on to one theory. We had plenty of clues to go on and we forgot a very simple thing - we all assumed only one mafia was capable of killing, when in reality, it might as well have been both of them taking turns. And this was most likely the case, considering what happened to the girl that was most suspected while the other was watched
I certainly didn't forget, not that it did town any good. xD I was crying at my PC as everyone only focused on FFNut, instead of the lies peddled about how we only had one person (FFNut) unaccounted for in the night action. "What about Noctis?!" I cried.
:jokey:Quote:
Originally Posted by Shauna
Ya I wanted you guys to wait too. Like Shauna I was ok with getting the ax, just wished you guys would not focus on me only and talk about others just to open up the range. You guys had tunnel vision for one.
To to be honest I had a feeling Shauna was town, but felt like if I changed my vote then it would have been a flip flop yet again and it was me who would go.
Now that I know how to play I do look forward to playing again and I won't make those same mistakes.
I didn't even post about the game yesterday. And before that I did say I was pro-mafia from then on! :pQuote:
Originally Posted by FynnDon;t put the blame on Psy now, Formy :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
Yeah I wasn't convinced nut or shauna were town and only bump a vote for nutty to get more talking. Then they all went loony!
Well maybe not Psy, I wasn't really going through the backlog of posts. But there was definitely a sentiment of impatience settling in Day Three.
I was actually one of the last people holding out hope for Nutty, but opinion turned so much the other direction it'd be suspicious to keep championing him. And then I decided to give in to suspicion and vote for Nutty.
At this point I'm just wondering if I should wait for the return of the absent player so they don't come back to a finished game or just go ahead and end it already ^^;
Just end it. Unless, of course, you were waiting for any vital night action from him! ;)
AK be like "Right! I have an hour left, I should go and tell my fellow towns the critical information I discovered during the last night ph-oh"
END IT
And that, as they say, is that!
AK was Cosmos. I was wrong on one. Since it is ended I will say Scruff was my other guess on Chaos and with AK dead he is the obvious choice of the first night killer.
Fox would be my guess as the other Chaos. He was third on my list.
Fynn and Scruff.
I made this decision at 8:20 this morning before I even checked this thread.
Let's see how it all played out.
THAT'S IT!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Shauna
I've come up with a new recipe!
It better be Fynn and Scruff. If it's Formy I'm going to have to go on some kind of rampage.
It was us. Basically confirmed in the other thread.
:roll:
Will do this later. I'll try to make it worth your while.Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
So I see...Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
Did you kill Freya, Fynn? The reason I got so caught up on FFNut was because he was the unaccounted female character for murder 2, and as a girl had killed Qwerty that made sense. I completely missed that there could be a second killing role.
WHAT ABOUT NOCTIS!?!!?!?
The lynch of Shauna was the tipping point, and I really like how the mafia got FF Nut to doubt Shauna's Shadow claim. Both Fynn and Scruffington said that it was likely that someone would lie about their character identity and then when Shauna claimed Fynn added a lovely "if she's telling the truth" after it. FFNut goes right in for that and then Scruffington seizes on this and absolutely hammers the nail in by saying what claiming Shadow is BS. Everyone else then swoops in and gg. Wonderful manipulation there fellas.
We basically won thanks to luck. And the fact that you Cosmos people were giving us your full cooperation ;)
Yes, Scruff did the first killing. If my guess is correct, we were incredibly lucky because it looks like Qwerty was the detective. Had we had anyone who could read alignments from the beginning, this would have gone way different.
So I followed the general rule I learned from IRL mafia - if you want to win as mafia, you have to roleplay. And by roleplay, I mean you have to roleplay as a town version of yourself (pretty obvious, doy). BUT, we were not anticipating the amount of details that the flavor text would contain. But I took to breaking it down anyway. I was worried I'd incriminate Scruffy - after all, there were two confirmed girls who could have performed the killing, Garnet and Lenna. Me pointing that out was almost guaranteed to get Scruff killed - if not on that turn, then on the next.
But in came Nutty. He was acting super suspicious, so I knew he could be used to divert attention away from Scruffy for the second day, but he turned out to be even more helpful than that with the Shauna suggestion which actually made sense in light of the fact that her claimed character hadn't appeared in the flavor text. I rolled with it, convincing enough people to vote Shauna, while Scruffy went in another direction, which really helped prevent people from associating us with each other until the very end of the game. Before we knew it, Shauna was lynched. We stood a chance after all.
Now, on the second night, we were facing huge risks. Scruffy and Nutty were bound to be watched by the investigators and we didn't know what roles they had and what they would learn about them. We thought killing Fox was the safest since a lot of factors pointed to him being the detective, but we were convinced Freya knew that herself and would protect him, so we took her down. I was actually thinking of killing nobody, since the flavor text would have given me away and there was no way Scruffy could do anything without getting discovered. But in the end, it paid off. Attention was diverted from both of us.
Now, everybody played well, but Freya and Shauna were definitely the most dangerous players. We were left with FFNut, who basically couldn't say anything that would let him defend himself; Fox, who was pretty hung up on the FFNut theory from the getgo; as well as Formy who only became more and more lost as everything he believed in crumbled to dust. At this point, we didn't even need to do much manipulation since everyone just banked on FFNut. Nobody noticed that I didn't point out what I pointed out the day before - that there may be two killers, that if lynch the wrong person, it's game over. And then there was the fact that AK was missing, which also worked to our advantage. So the third day was pretty much over before it started. IMO< the only way this could have been averted was if the Cosmos people took a step backwards and decided to reevaluate all the options from the start. Of course, there's still ways in which we could manipulate that (again, I think you were trying too hard to to "feel out" people rather than logically evaluate their motives for saying what they're saying, Formy, but that's easy for me to say since I had the high ground).
And then I killed AK in the end just because Fox and Formy were both convinced he's the bad guy and were screaming "TAKE ME FIRST", so I just wanted to twist the knife, so to speak :radred:
Also, as a sidenote, I know that I would have voted No Death on the first day even if I was Cosmos since I was just used to playing a variant of Mafia that always starts with Nighttime ^^;
Pretty much, yeah. No need to go into any more detail from there, because Day 3 would be the inevitable lynch of either myself or FFNut depending on who survived.
Mafia will sow seeds of distrust and light fires under misinformation and faulty logic. As soon as FFNut outright said "Shauna is lying", they propped that up further with support and more 'reasoning'. Boom, done.
Yeah. If that hadn't happened, I'd have lost Scruffy along the way and would have to struggle myself against the entire town, and I'd need to reduce it to two
So thanks a bunch, Nutty! :D
I also think this is delightfully ironic:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox
Oh Fox. If only you knew that the clown was your only real ally XD
And it was YOU who killed Freya, not Scruffy, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
Yup yup!
OK good.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
I mean not good, but... you know. It makes sense :P
That's why waiting for AK wouldn't have changed a thing - he watched Scruffy, and Scruffy did nothing at all. Another huge stroke of luck since had he watched Nutty and told everyone he did nothing, we'd have to improvise. Though I doubt we'd have much trouble convincing you guys that AK is actually on the Chaos side and in league with Nutty :p
What you can take from all this is if you're town, at the start of every day take a breath and read through everything. Don't jump right back on the bandwagon from the previous day. Your opinions are changeable, and that's olay!
I mean, I 180'd my opinion on FFNut when I died, with the reasons I highlighted in my PM to Karifean. It would have been tough to explain had I survived, but it's not against the rules to decide that someone isn't as Mafia as someone else.
Not necessarily, Fynn - AK could have seen Scruffy's alignment.
Ah well, turns out he couldn't. xD BUT it was a risk that you shouldn't have been willing to take.
You hardly paint a glowing picture of me, Fynn. It's a fair one, but it hurts all the same!
Can I make a suggestion for the host: can the start of each day be bookmarked in the OP? Because going through post trying to quote a suspicious post or find yesterday's vote count is really dull and tedious. It's a small thing, but it would really help.
I think what made me suffer was the flavour text discussion. Oh, that confused me no end.
The problem is, we carefully weighed all options. And there was no way we could avoid a huge risk. This was actually pretty much the safest route.
AK's tracking - oh man, if he'd only done it the other way around!
No kidding. I felt so bad for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
Trust the Mafia to have two expert players in their midst. Between myself, the Town was basically babysitting me for most of it.
But pinning it all to the OP defeats the whole purpose of this :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
The whole point of Mafia is staying alert and paying attention to everything! So you gotta dig yourself - the host can't just point you to what's important!
And hey, you asked for it, bro! You specifically asked the mafia to tell you where you went wrong.
Yeah, that's the whole thing. As I said before, when you're mafia, winning depends largely on luck - when it comes to nighttime actions, at least. The lynching was the easy part, tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by KarifeanNo kidding. I felt so bad for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
I had a feeling fynn was mafia. And that's why he wouldn't talk to me about books the other day cause I started the convo saying how mafia was crazy active and then wanted to talk about the silkworm book and he ignored me :colbert: I WANTED TO TALK ABOUT THAT BOOK FYNN
I know, but when I think to myself and say 'nothing went right, it shatters your confidence a bit.
And it's lazy, but trying to a bit where [x] claims to be [y] in a thirty page document is just intimidating. It'd take me half an hour to even check. To be honest, even with all that, I'd still be lost in the conversation. Ugh, why do I even bother.
What this tells me is I should keep a log of activity in real-time, so I don't even have to check back.
Seriously? That's your reasoning? MAYBE I DIDN'T WANT TO SPOIL ANYTHING HUH?Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Btw, did you get to the murder yet? :jess:
Yeah, ~back in my day~, when I actually analyzed every little detail instead of being lazy like I was this round, I kept a notepad next to me where I scribbled notes down as I read through things. It helped a lot.
Not yet but I'm a lot more into it than I was the cuckoo's calling. Also you know how I was complaining about the narrators voice, I think I like it now.
I just wouldn't stop thinking about mafia and mulled over everything everyone said in my head at all times just to come up with how I can twist that to make myself and Scruff look innocent :bigsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Really happy I can drop the act now, though
Did I actually do anything right? I can't stop thinking that me not even being there would have helped Town win.
I am so writing down notes next time, though.
So who wants to host the next one! :D Anyone up for the Danganronpa theme I mentioned? This time with alt accounts and everything!
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/...20130606182754
And yeah that's what set me off cause normally you'd be all hyped to talk about books xD Specially those books, so I thought maybe you were too busy with SHADY things. You almost always reply to me, and you weren't so I was suspicious :shifty:
Mind you this wasn't valid really in the game or anything and I thought I was just being crazy BUT TURNS OUT I WAS RIGHT baum baum baaaaummm
I had scruff pegged at the end of day two. I thought AK may have been the other. Then I suspected Fox after that. Never really expected Fynn in the least. Well played Fynn.
Fynn is right, and like I said before - you need to do all the reading yourself. You cannot rely on recaps from someone else. Mafia will attempt to twist those to suit their needs.
WELL IT'S SO GREAT FOR TOWN THAT YOU'RE BRINGING THIS UP NOW!Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
The ghost of Cecil should have dropped some hints.
"Hey guys, fynn always replies to me and lately he's not so he's a bad guy!"
Yeah okay, now i'm just a crazy socially anxious friend and they all know that!
Scruffington did a great job too, honestly. If it weren't for the fact that the first culprit was revealed as a girl, I doubt anyone would have a reason to suspect him at all.
Yet nobody really did anyway. xD
It was actually because I'm just done talking to you. At all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Jk, we're friends. We'll talk books more, I promise.
I wanted to murder Scruff before the game started because he kept telling everyone that things were wrong and this is how it's supposed to be played. Drove me up the wall. But I didn't just throw my vote because I thought people would think I was doing it because of that reason.
This is why second accounts are good. I don't have any bias clouding my judgement.
I am already waiting to play again with all of you. Win or lose I had a blast. I was constantly thinking on who and what. Re-read the whole logs. I also now know the rules and know towns don't get a night vote that is private and a day vote that is public. I honestly did just misread the rules 30 mins into the game and thought we all had a secret night vote.
Stop beating yourself up over it!Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
Look, if it makes you feel any better, you didn't lose because you sucked.
You lost because we were too good :smug:
I'm in a bit of a self-deprecating funk, but I did really have fun playing. I'm so up for playing new again!
Probably not hosting yet, though. This is only my third game. I feel like one of the winners should host.
Fynn doing a Dragon Quest theme?
Idk, I've only played one forum mafia so far, I'd like to do it again!
Karifean, perhaps you aren't opposed to hosting another one? :D After all, pretty sure you're the only one here who could do a When They Cry one!
Yeah, don't beat yourself up - learn from this so you know how to better play! As both a member of town and mafia.
I think Psy said he wanted to do a quick one over a weekend too?
Don't worry, Formalhaut. You win some, you lose some. Have more confidence in yourself and don't allow others to lead you. Unless they're me. ;)
There seems to be clamour to play again. So do people want a game this weekend because if so I can make a game THIS WEEKEND and it'll be super cool.
edit: psychic freya
I now know I can play better then this time. Picked up on a lot of tips from others and think that I wouldn't be soooo Shady next time. I am ready to go again.
If you are doing one Psy I am all in!
Ok
I can probably do a Danganronpa one after that, then. I just need to figure out which format to follow. Definitely using alt accounts, though.
Yeah, FFNut, you learned to PM the show runner if you have any questions. xD
Let Psy know what you want with the alt accounts. We'll prep the ones we have for Mafia.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
Yes I did Shauna.
hey what about pokemon as a theme everyone likes pokemon (never mention the infamous EoFF slowpoke mafia incident)
WAIT NO
EEVEELUTIONS AS A THEME
BUT THERE'S ONLY EIGHT!
Dibs on Sylveon tho
Will do! First, I'll need to learn how many participants there will be, though!Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaunaLet Psy know what you want with the alt accounts. We'll prep the ones we have for Mafia.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
Thanks guys. :)
I should remember this is my first time playing as a Town, and honestly it is so much... I wouldn't even say harder, just different. Really different. When I was Mafia before, I just took part enough in conversation to seem helpful but with no substance behind them. It's kinda a different change when you have to think intently about so many different people, different scenarios, possibilities. As Mafia it is simpler, as you know straight away everyone's alignments.
I certainly wouldn't be opposed to the idea of hosting another one. It's just, I like to keep to the format with writeups when I do them, and maybe it'd be a good change of pace if we had a different one inbetween.
Regarding this format in general, I feel like I've learned a lot myself. But first, I'd like to hear from you guys, what do you think of it? Does it add or detract from the game, and in what ways?
It adds a deductive element, which I think is incredible. We actually get information that allows us to piece together what happened. On one hand, it leaves the mafia fewer places to hide, but the information is limited enough that they can still hide behind something. I think if we ever did this again, people would be much more reluctant to reveal their identities on day one :p
I liked the way you did it. It gave lots of info without giving a lot away.
You can do the When They Cry thing after the Danganronpa thing, then! :D Unless someone else wants to do it!
I felt it gave too much away. :monster: I was easily outed in the second day. Saying someone protected someone else told them exactly what role there was doing what.
Maybe not tell people whether write-ups will be long or short? That way people reveal what they want?Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
I have to say Karifean: you hosted a great game. Nothing really jumps out at me at all in terms of feedback. Maybe slightly less detail? I felt like the flavour text discussions too easily sidetracked stuff (allowing those lost like me to well... get lost) and allowed the Mafia too easy a time of twisting things, but then again: they were really good.
I liked it though. It adds another layer. Maybe slightly less detail?
A lot was given away, but it was also incredibly misleading in many ways, which is probably something the GM should intentionally do at all times. After all "A girl" was protected, and "A girl" was the killer, and they ended up being different people.
Except from the fact that almost everyone was outed on Day 2, that is something that shouldn't be able to happen. :3
Nine with Eevee :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
In fact, the investigative roles could easily have been thought to be one of the various different ones when they "visited" each other. but my flavor text gave everything away of what I was as a role. Even if they didn't figure out it was me, they knew there was one doctor. The investigative ones you have to guess, identifier, tracker, detective etc
Idk, it's not that obvious. I didn't say this during play, since I didn't want to throw a wrench into our plans, but I actually wasn't sure for the longest time whether it was you or Shauna that was Cecil, since you didn;t reveal your identity, and Shauna could have wanted to disguise her identity as a protector to keep herself (and the town) safe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
So up until she was confirmed to be Shadow, I was not sure :p
"Casts a protective spell before leaving" in the flavor text made sure to cement there was a doctor.
Well in this particular game the fact that there was a Protector was established in the rules.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Maybe only the kill should be embellished with detail?Or maybe omit the doctor and only say a spell was cast over [x]?
I agree with Freya, it was very easy to guess the doctor.
Ya I never had the doctor guessed right away, but when we had the information of identities it pointed directly to Freya.
Scruff was waaay too easily able to deduce there was a doctor and who it may be on day two because of the flavor text. I debated on claiming a different identity but by that point it went too far and I was like :gator: hence the increased use of my smilies in game such as :gator: haha
Saying "a white knight" rather than the generic a girl, a girl, a boy, that the others got made it easier.
Very true, it was easy to deduce. That is one of the dangers of being open about your identity as a townie in this variant. Imagine if instead every townie had been silent about it - nobody would've had anything to go off of in regards to who the Protector was and their identity would've been vague for a while longer. On the other hand, it would've been much harder for the townies to make any suspicions based on identity as well. Both being open and being silent has its advantages. I think the idea of the identity-based flavor text is a little lost if there is no hint towards a role's identity in the text.Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
Although there are exceptions of course, I still admit that revealing the first night's killer to be a girl (when there were only two players that would be described as such) was a mistake on my part.
From my point of view, the fact that the Protector was so easily identified was simply because the townies (and Mafia too, ironically) were so open about their identities; I actually expected people to be generally secretive about their identity , it's what happened in my own first game in this variant. And I think it's okay for it to be a risk vs reward type situation where you risk exposing your more important roles while potentially cornering the Mafia in the process.
Don't get me wrong, I thought it gave an extra element to the game which I found fun, I just think some of the descriptors gave too much away. To a point that I don't really see the need of the identifier role.
Which I figured out day 2 as well with this post
Oh and I was totally dropping hints to townies I was the doctor but not actually saying it. xD If I talk about my own role as if i'm not, no one would suspect :shifty: right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
I thought shauna would get it. That's really who I thought would get it.
The valuable the role, the less detail should be given. Having the killer be named only through gender is fair enough; maybe detective/doctor should have that same level of obscurity? Less vital roles like identifier could have a fuller description, likewise with targets of actions, like 'colourfully dressed man'.
It's just what I think. I know others feel different, but much of the tension and balance went after the doctor was revealed, because Freya was an obvious target from that point on.
I think that's because identities have not been historically important in EoFF Mafia games. I didn't think much of it either, as we only really started dissecting it after I had also revealed, but as we went on it was like "Nope, this is actually really important and we know who everyone is now".
Yeah, no-one thought it was important Day One, so I was like "mwah ahaha! I am Kefka", not knowing that such identities would be very important in the writeups. No-one knew how much detail there would be; I assumed it'd be the regular amount.
That too. We typically use identities, on our second accounts, as flavor to roleplay as. So this threw a lot of people off too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shauna
In fact even as the game start I was still really confused on what the point of them and the identifier role was even for. It seemed like useless nonsense to me. But I kept fighting for the fact that this CAN be played that way rather than understanding it.
So basically we all broke the game.
Well that's fine. I didn't expect you guys to realize it either, if anything I was surprised when Scruffington came out and casually put all the pieces together.
I did post example games where the power of the writeups could be seen, but nobody ever reads those things anyway.
Well, now you know. =P
Really I think this format is especially well-suited to if you want to have a lot of crazy roles or extra rules in play and you want the players to figure it out as they go. I went with a simple game for the sake of easing everyone into the format, but ultimately, complex crazy messes are more of its thing.
If anyone else does ever feel like hosting a game with the same general format, my main pieces of advice would be to 1. have two-ish vanilla town players for every Mafia role that cannot be a town role (most notably the Murderer, or in this game, the Lackeys) and 2. be *very* careful about how explicit you are with information. I conversed with the game master of my previous Mafia games during the game and he told me about how he usually only gets more explicit during later night phases, and I think that's a better way to go. I got too caught up in giving everyone a recognizable trait in the writeups.
I did actually look at some of those links and was still confused. I read a little bit, went to the night phases and I just didn't understand it.
Also that forum was weird.
But that's also why I shut the smurf up about my identity.
Maybe ours is the weird one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Ahh nah it was the way replies worked, the layout, it was... weird to me? Like comment sections and less forumy? That's what I mean
As I had a vanilla role being a newbie all I had was the info from the posts, and what people said. I think my biggest mistake was a quick vote on Fynn day2.
I only did that to see how people would react and see if anyone would slip up and give information. Didn't realize it was a shady thing to do really. Thought if he was Mafia he would try and claim innocence in a way with heels dug in and maybe even give a personal shot to me for suggesting it. I was also looking at others to see how they responded, if they would hop on the band wagon or kind of just toss it aside.
It had nothing to do with Fynn himself, it just happend to be the last name I read and it was in my head.
My one issue was that the role of 'identifier' didn't seem particularly useful when it's not tied to a role. If everyone had kept their identities secret, I gradually could have started identifying people and figuring out who was doing what actions. But it would have taken half a dozen nights to identify enough people to make that useful.
So just a balance complaint than any issue with the ruleset :)
If only you checked me out that night instead of Scruffy Fox we may have stood a shot because Scruffy was on my list with AK, and we would have nailed him.
But the only thing Fox could really do was confirm that Scruffy was indeed Garnet. That really wouldn't have made much of a change.
I thought Fox had the if you did something that night power. I knew Scruff was Garnet and he said his checks cleared Scruff.
I could have given him an alibi though. If the flavour text had told me that FFNut was in the room with me while the murder occurred, it might have shifted the balance.
I said "I can confirm Scruffy is at least somewhat honest". By which I meant "he said he was Garnet and he is". ...That's kinda all I had to contribute on that one
Ok I thought you had the did they act at night role.
I know these roles can be hard to grasp, Nutty, but don't worry - normally when you play mafia, the roles are much simpler. Usually, mafia just kills, and there's a protector and a detective. And that's it.
Now that you all are on a detective kick, please engage me as I freak out about Sherlock and Westworld theories. :colbert: Because Mark Gatniss said there were hints at the reveal that happened in Ep2 of Season 4 all the way back in the beginning and that we're missing a lot. And I have many theories and want to discuss them
And the Westworld website has new information about some characters and guys
i am needing to deduce.
No I do think I have it down for the most part.
BUT SPOILERS!Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
I'm not touching Sherlock until the season is concluded. As always.
That's not true. The mafia roles had claimed that there would be a supplementary role in addition to a Murderer (if they didn't have two Lackeys). I used this to my advantage to push town towards the idea that AK could be mafia. I knew that if I didn't lynch FFNut or Shauna and it turned out Shauna was town, FFNut would appear incredibly scummy and would be an easy lynch the next day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shauna
For the second time, stop putting words in my mouth. I never said that things were 'wrong' nor that the game is 'supposed' to be played in any specific way. I said multiple times that it isn't the way mafia is played, because it wasn't a traditional game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
I personally thought my game was over after the first kill. Karifean revealed my identity to everyone, which made it a 50/50 chance that it was either me or FFNut was the killer. That was until I was able to asspull a theory that Faris could somehow be the killer.
The real clincher was having Fynn kill on the night Fox was going to investigate me. I figured someone would be watching me to determine if myself or FFNut is guilty..and it proved out to be a really good call.
The final episode is sunday for this season!
Sh, guys. No fighting. We are family here. It's time to put all grievances and misunderstandings behind us! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
For the second time, stop putting words in my mouth. I never said that things were 'wrong' nor that the game is 'supposed' to be played in any specific way. I said multiple times that it isn't the way mafia is played, because it wasn't a traditional game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScruffingtonThat's not really the way mafia is played.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
So with this evidence I've laid out now ##vote: Scruffington ;)Quote:
I never said that things were 'wrong' nor that the game is 'supposed' to be played in any specific way.
Guys. Enough.
This is not a thread for handing people receits for what they said and what wording they used. Please keep your personal business personal.
Buuut they could only have one action per night - Karifean clarified this. So Faris investigated, taking her out of the possible killer roles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
And not at any point did I say that things in this game were 'wrong.'Quote:
Originally Posted by FreyaQuote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScruffingtonThat's not really the way mafia is played.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
So with this evidence I've laid out now ##vote: Scruffington ;)Quote:
I never said that things were 'wrong' nor that the game is 'supposed' to be played in any specific way.
But go ahead, you can continue lying about what I really said. I even sent you a VM apologizing if you misunderstood me and made an effort to clear things up, yet you straight up ignored it and have continued on with this immature assumption.
I'm not going to let someone sit here and try and twist my words.
Good show mafia. Scruff was the one I suspected after the first day, but the other two were Formal and FFNut so I only got half of it. I definitely was not on to Fynn.
I must have glossed over that part. I was really just hoping town would get lost in the details. :PQuote:
Originally Posted by ShaunaBuuut they could only have one action per night - Karifean clarified this. So Faris investigated, taking her out of the possible killer roles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
And they certainly did! You slipped up pretty majorly, but only a ghost of a shadow noticed. xD
Thanks for hosting the game Karifean. Sorry I got upset after you revealed my identity. I think you did a good job hosting, and you put a lot of effort into the game. I appreciate how you made an effort to get another game of Mafia going and it was definitely fun for me overall.
Every game can be a little rough around the edges, but I'd be happy to play another one regardless of the theme.
I think I realized from this game that the community here is pretty cool. And Fynn is the realest homie. If I ever felt like leaving before, I don't anymore. :P
Yeh, we did a good job working together :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Scruffington
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
cant agree enough. I played pro hockey half my life. During the game things would get heated in the moment, but win or lose the best thing you could do is leave those heated emotions in the game. I had a situation were one guy was playing really dirty against us. Cheap shots the works. The next day he was traded to our team and he had to walk into our dressing room. We would have doomed his whole career if we didn't leave emotions on the ice, and shake his hand and say welcome to the team. It also would have split the team and all of us would suffer.
I li have zero ill feelings about getting Lynched or being suspected or anything. It is a game and I treat it as such. We all want to win and so we all will play hard. It isn't a personal thing at all.
I'm glad you enjoyed it ;)
It was quite fun seeing the Mafia manage to pull off their gambit after it looked rather desperate on the morning of the second day.
Now let's have fun killing each other in this next game.
Oh god. I just found out Mafia is basically Werewolf, which is one of my favourite games, and now I'm mourning the lost opportunities!
When is the next game? Can it be now? Can it be right now? D:
Formy and myself are putting everything together now.
Hell yes. I'm in. For this and all future games.[/qwerty]
We are. Sorry I didn't get around to Mognetting you over the weekend, Qwerty! I'll be sure to get around to it tomorrow.Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertysaur
If you are doing one Formy I'll sign up!
I have never lost at Mafia.
You have also never played a game against me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba
What a curious correlation.
FixedQuote:
Originally Posted by KarifeanYou have also never played a gameQuote:
Originally Posted by Bubba
against me.
What a curious correlation.
:monster:
Count me in for the next mafia. This time, I aim to make it past the first day. :p
Yeah, that's pretty bad luck. Day Two is when the serious Mafia stuff happens.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Carnelian
Has it started?
...Have I won? :ohdear:
Btw, I wanna host the next one, whenever that will be. It's gonna be Danganronpa themed and I wanna implement some... twists to the formula :D
The sign-up hosting thing is stickied! You can put yourself down there!
Wat!
Dat's dumb
Ugh, two more games? Laaaame. People will get burnt out by mafia by then.
Whatever. Scrap that idea then. I'm happy I at least have Karifean's mafia to look forward to :D
The stupidest part? That sign-up was made way after I'd already said I wanted to make one after the one that was happening back then :grumble:
This mafia #27. I doubt we're going to get burnout.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynn
And to be honest, I'm pretty sure there'll be a gap in-between. I mean, this game started like, at least two weeks after Psy's game.
I still have to wait much longer than I should :grumble:
Have we had a Game of Thrones theme? I just want a host to end a day saying "The night is dark and full of terrors"
Bagsy badass Granny Tyrell.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya