Kewl! Now we also have a name for that hole. The Balambadian Crater!
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Kewl! Now we also have a name for that hole. The Balambadian Crater!
i think you guys pick on FE too much the guys only trying to figure some stuff out..
I agree. Im surprised he still bothers to share his theorys with you. Whether you think he's a fruitcake or not, you've got to appreciate his resolve.
We do, just disagree with quite a number of them.
i dont think hes a fruitcake....just a visionary of things that dont exist! lol
*cough* Back to "A Beautiful Mind" are we? Be nice now:)
what all because he is wrong 100% of the time (so far) doesnt mean hes a fruitcake...me on the other hand am completely bonkers!
kind of offtopic here. No one who theorizes is a fruitcake until they come up with something that is totally irrelevant. Like, Rinoa was off of a sitcom. That would be fruitcake material.
How about all the main characters are really Propagators (yes, that IS the monster you fight onboard the Ragnarok) who used to rule the ancient Centra dynasty? Would that qualify for fruitcake material?
Yes pretty much.
We wouldnt pick on him and call him a fruitcake if he would just accept that his theories are comepletly wrong when he is confronted with logical evidence. But he doesnt, instead he just keeps talking about how he has some kind of proof that only makes sense to him.
And im still waiting to hear how he tells me i am comepletly wrong about my earlier post on how his WOTC theory is comeplete bull****.
Well, it makes sense to more ppl than just him, and a theory is a theory which is a statement that could be true but isn't fact until proven so. Besides, you haven't proven him completely wrong so his theory still stands.
Excuse me, but you ARE aware that the statement I just gave (that the main characters are Propagators etc.) is an integral part of Future's theories? You agreed that that is fruitcake material, yet now you still claim that it 'is a statement that could be true'?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
I really don't understand this attitude, I'm afraid. No offense, but you admitted that it was fruitcake material! All of Future's theories are fruitcake material. His gathered works are like one massive fruitcake! Period. And are you claiming we should actually take this seriously? That we should give him the same benefit of the doubt that we give someone who claims, for instance, that Zell is gay (which one CAN actually make an argument for)? No. That simply isn't true.
So far, all of Future's theories are fruitcake pieces, so so far we don't really even have to argue against him, because everyone can (should) see the lunacy in his arguments. And insane ramblings are NOT to be treated in a serious manner. Further, they can't even be disproved, because there's no basis for rational discussion (it would be like trying to engage in a conversation on religion with a kitchen bench), so you simply cannot hold it against us that he's not been fully disproven. Further still, Future has not even accepted statements from Square themselves as being proof, so what else would you suggest?
Oh, and you said his theories don't just make sense to himself. In that case, what part of his theories do you think make sense? The part where Irvine and Selphie are Zell's parents (something to that extent) or the bit where Rinoa is a robotic version of Ellone?
Evolution isn't that fast fruitcake!
I'm sorry? If that was a specific reply to my post, you'll have to go into more detail...
Ok, the propagators might have been the dominant species in the past of the game , but species do not evolve in a matter that their entire body image changes making that irrational and irrelevant. And on the topic of his theory, why do yu think that the "beautiful" color check was in the game?
That's exactly the point. Future's theories are full of statements like that, which are irrational and irrelevant. Unfortunately, Future is immune to anything with logic in it, which is why his topics keep on coming, long after stuff like that has been stated.Quote:
Ok, the propagators might have been the dominant species in the past of the game , but species do not evolve in a matter that their entire body image changes making that irrational and irrelevant.
How about the obvious reason: so that the Esthar technicians in charge of maintaining the camouflage hiding Esthar could check if the system was running smoothly. It's really that simple. Of course, it was really put in there more so as to reaffirm the revelation that Esthar was hidden by a complicated camouflage wall, set to showing an empty landscape instead of the huge metropolis really present.Quote:
And on the topic of his theory, why do yu think that the "beautiful" color check was in the game?
um...are we still talking about Raine's gravestone? What happened to the nice little debate we had? I think FE was right about that, but his other theories are just a little too complicated to work.
Sorry, I may have pushed things off topic a bit.
About the gravestone though, I'll grant it as being a fair guess, and reasonable attempt at a theory, although the resolution of the picture is simply not good enough to establish anything concrete. It might be written in another language for all we know!
Ok obviusly you havent read any other threads made by FE because in every thread he starts there are always a couple people that point out some major discrepinsies from game information but he compeltly ignores it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
I dont think theory is the right word for the stuff that FE comes up with. Theory is a scientific word and the scientific equivalant to FE's ideas is like saying that trees can talk but we just dont understand the language. Comepletly rediculous but it cant be disproven because there is no way for us to know that trees dont really talk...
The words i and many others would use for what FE comes up with is FAN FICTION.
Oh and i dont think that thing on Raine's gravestone is a date. Just to stay on topic.:D
Now you've created your own theory on future's theorys. I wonder if he'll confirm that this fruitcake theory is true? I think we should entitle this theory,"the fruiter Esthar". And just to be on topic, that gravestone huh?, crazy business.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Bahamut
You call that a proof?Quote:
Okay in the above picture you clearly show your "time walls" or whatever and you say that nothing except for the specific time traveling vehicles can get through the "walls". So how do the missles get from the Gabaldia Missle Base to Balamb Garden? and also to Trabia Garden? Wouldnt the missles launch but then go to the wrong time or whatever?
I already explained that these missiles also time travel.
The owner of the missile base is Vinzer Deling,a Shumi possessed by Hyne.
And Hyne is the only one who knows about WOTC (he created it).
So we expect that he knows how to program the missile trajectory (this backs up my theory of the internal GPS).
The Estharians don´t know about WOTC.It was created by eliminators (cyborg Esthar Soldiers) under Adels orders.It is a statal secret hidden from the citizens.There is only one single Estharian who knows that."Hyne".Quote:
Okay FE you are saying that people smart enough to travel into space are too stupid to realize that they arent looking at the moon and are actually looking at the planet they just came from...right. When they go into space there is a moon and there is their planet, how stupid would you have to be to mix up the 2. You are telling us that these super inteligent people can build holographic walls seperating "eras" and go into outer space but they cant tell the differance between their planet and the moon.
They don´t tell the difference because they have never saw it even on the floor.An holographic abode covers Esthar and shows on the sky a picture of the entire planet.It looks smaller than "Earth" because the "Earth" is WOTC and contains about 8 eras which means the planet is about 8 times smaller.
When they get to Space,they finally saw the planet live because they time travelled to that era.
Of Course the missles can travel through time. Why didnt i think of that?
What about how nobody in space seems to know that they are actually looking at their own planet instead of the moon? What is your explination for that?
Actually it wouldnt be 8 times larger because it just has 8 specific places in specific times not 8 comepletle planets put together into 1...right? So technically the size of the Earth is not any different than it would normally be without WOTC because the areas were all on the planet at some point in time and land was not actually added to the planet.
Also do you mean that there is a holographic "roof" covering Estar so that they cannot see the sky? Does this "roof" cover the entire planet or just Estar?
I need the details on this roof that you just invented before i can come up with a problem with it.
The planet looks white because they were on the glacial era(Trabia +Balamb era more than 17 years ago).Ice covers the entire planet before the vulcan boils down.
It boils down and melt the ice sorrounding it.
Only some special vehicles can travel through them.Quote:
But earlier someone said that the lines cross over sea so no one would discover them, but then if anything can travel through then what is the point of not putting it on land if this theory is true.
The ones with an internal GPS system which determines where they should time travel.
No one can cross through them on foot(unless they found a passage to go inside like on the Esthar ones).
But then the walls would be discovered (and they aren´t supposed to).
WOTC would make it so that a bunch of different "eras" were like different countries on a planet which means that in space you would be able to see each Era and not just the Trabia +Balamb era.
Also since the Ragnaroks could travel through space freely how did the people that went into space on them know how to get back to Earth if the Earth looked like the moon. Also when they are in space wouldnt it look funny if there were 2 moons and no Earth?
Wrong.WOTC is not magic like what we see on Bugs Bunny,Lost in time demo.Quote:
WOTC would make it so that a bunch of different "eras" were like different countries on a planet which means that in space you would be able to see each Era and not just the Trabia +Balamb era.
It´s an optical illusion created by an holographical dome over each era (which happens to be the same just with different side shapes).The time travelling vehicles make it look like the pictures were real because they time travel when they pass the boundaries limited by the walls.It then creates the continuum illusion.
The rockets on the Lunar gate were also time travelling vehicles.
They time travel as soon as they pass over the dome.
But on Space they see it from above.They travelled to T+B era and they see the dome (which works like a simple glass now).
The eras weren´t glued on a continuum.This is an illusion created by the walls which leads to the creation of flawed atlas on FF8.Hyne planned it carefully.
They saw the Galbadia era and the T+B era on space at the same time due to a complex hol. system.Quote:
Also since the Ragnaroks could travel through space freely how did the people that went into space on them know how to get back to Earth if the Earth looked like the moon. Also when they are in space wouldnt it look funny if there were 2 moons and no Earth?
I don´t know how it works and I am in the process of researching it.(I admit my ignorance).
But calm down.
One has yet to explain how the monsters are seen on the game falling on Galbadia with Esthar on the other side of the planet (or not because we only see one era).
Judging from the duration of the space events I say it takes much less than 12 hours(the time needed for Esthar to be seen from this side).
Uh... you still didnt say why the people didnt freak out when they noticed that in space there is no Earth and 2 moons.
They notice Earth (they see Galbadia from space ) and the "moon" (T+B era).
I don´t know how the hol. system works here.
so are you saying they 2 Earth's of different eras at the same time but they just think that 1 of them is the moon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
It was mentioned by the Crew Member that they are heading towards Tear's Point.Quote:
Crew Member: Tons of monsters...! I...I believe they're headed for Tears' Point in Esthar...
Researcher: Then that means Lunatic Pandora is at Tears' Point. When
did this happen!?
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv.../fmv138-28.jpg
The above pic show that the wave of monster start to dispel at a certain point.
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv...0/fmv140-3.jpg
Apprantely, it had dispered high up in the sky due to the effect of the Lunatic Pandora. The point of impact won't be Galbadia and also this is why the sky in Esthar is red since it will spread to somewhere pretty far which will be Esthar. But it is still likely that they dispered above the sky of Esthar instead but this too explains why monsters didn't shown up in Galbadia if your case apply since it is possible for the monsters to spread this far being manipulated by the Lunatic Pandora.
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv...0/fmv140-7.jpg
Lastly, we can certain that those dispered landed onto Esthar and Adel Tomb was caught halfway although I highly doubt that pic of yours was Galbadia in the very first place.
It sure doesn't look like it to me cause the target isn't Galbadia in the first place since the Galbadian won't be dumb enough to destroy their own hometown and judging from that pic if it is really Galbadia, it is somewhere on the edge of the continent which happen to be where Tears Point is in the Esthar continent.
Also, since there are so much lies in the game, the shape of the continent shown in the world map might be lying too just like what the creators of the game want us to think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christmas
You know,when they got to space they saw the "earth" getting away from them.Quote:
so are you saying they 2 Earth's of different eras at the same time but they just think that 1 of them is the moon?
__________________
Not only that but they know the white planet they see on space is the same they see from "Earth".And of course was just an holographic video which appears on the "roof" of the holographic dome.Obviously they will say that the white one is the moon.
So there is a moon and the people know the difference between the moon and the Earth...right?
Also in the pic below you have your "walls" marked off as the white lines but it isnt right. The bottom of the hexagon should be flat with the world map but as you can see it is has actually been rotated slightly so that the bottom of the map and bottom of the hexagon do not match up.
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...gonredblue.jpg
No dude, your time travelling in space theory won't work since I did show you how the waves of monsters landed up in Esthar which that happens to be the only proof you had.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Right.But the "moon" is not the moon but the planet on Glaciar era(T+B).Quote:
So there is a moon and the people know the difference between the moon and the Earth...right?
[QUOTE][No dude, your time travelling in space theory won't work since I did show you how the waves of monsters landed up in Esthar which that happens to be the only proof you had.
/QUOTE]
Explain to me how the monsters that were on Esthar before the Lunar Cry disappeared.Where did they go?
(I know the answer).
And:
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...tthecenter.jpg
There you have the monsters heading to Galbadia.
Quote:
People at the Lunar base weren´t really spotting the moon.
They were on Space but on the PAST.
They thought they were spotting the moon but they were really spotting the planet.
Dude those 2 quotes prove each other wrong first u said that the people in the space station thought they were looking at the Earth and mistaking it for he moon then you changed your mind and decided that they were looking at the moon and they saw themselves leaving the Earth.Quote:
You know,when they got to space they saw the "earth" getting away from them.
Not only that but they know the white planet they see on space is the same they see from "Earth".
Also in the pic below you have your "walls" marked off as the white lines but it isnt right. The bottom of the hexagon should be flat with the world map but as you can see it is has actually been rotated slightly so that the bottom of the map and bottom of the hexagon do not match up.
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...gonredblue.jpg
You said just a little while ago that the eras are not actually connected to each other so how do you explain this:
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/6027/radio3uw.jpg
If the eras are not connected then how do the people in one area talk to people in another area and how did the put in the underground cable in the first place?
Very interesting. Many points are coming up but all contradict each other. this is a battle of statements. I thought this was about the theory alone! This thread is not here to disprove a theory but to discuss its validity. there shouldn't be any debate on how bogus it is!
Disproving a theory is the same thing as making it invalid, so we are discussing its valididty.
They thought that the "upper" planet is the moon.The one they saw from Earth.Quote:
Dude those 2 quotes prove each other wrong first u said that the people in the space station thought they were looking at the Earth and mistaking it for he moon then you changed your mind and decided that they were looking at the moon and they saw themselves leaving the Earth.
I don´t know if I understood you but there is no problem to have a white line passing these rough mountains.After all it seems one can´t cross them on foot.Quote:
Also in the pic below you have your "walls" marked off as the white lines but it isnt right. The bottom of the hexagon should be flat with the world map but as you can see it is has actually been rotated slightly so that the bottom of the map and bottom of the hexagon do not match up.
The waves somehow time travel when they reach the boundaries.
The cables were created in a way that they seem to link with each other but they not.
Maybe there were transmiters at the extremity of a cable on one era which emit to a receiver on the extremity of another cable on another era.But since they were underground people other than Hyne don´t know it.
Maybe shumis possessed by Hyne created them.
What i meant about the hexagon is that the bottom white line of the hexagon should be parallel to the bottom of the world map but it isnt it is at an angle.
Oh come on you gotta be able to come up with something better than that.Quote:
The waves somehow time travel when they reach the boundaries.
The cables were created in a way that they seem to link with each other but they not.
Maybe there were transmiters at the extremity of a cable on one era which emit to a receiver on the extremity of another cable on another era.But since they were underground people other than Hyne don´t know it.
Mybe shumis possessed by Hyne created them.
Also you said that you could go through time in the Balamb underwater train tunnel but you said that no one would go through there because of the risk of getting hit by a train. What about when it was being built?
True, its all very interesting to hear everyone's views and such.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnislash07
umm..yeah man I mean he sort of has a point there. But um whats your reply ? FEQuote:
Originally Posted by Omnislash07
What the smurf?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
It was mentioned by the Crew Member that they are heading towards Tear's Point.Quote:
Crew Member: Tons of monsters...! I...I believe they're headed for Tears' Point in Esthar...
Researcher: Then that means Lunatic Pandora is at Tears' Point. When
did this happen!?
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv.../fmv138-28.jpg
The above pic show that the wave of monster start to dispel at a certain point.
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv...0/fmv140-3.jpg
Apprantely, it had dispered high up in the sky(sky above Galbadia if your case applies)due to the effect of the Lunatic Pandora. The point of impact won't be Galbadia and also this is why the sky in Esthar is red since it will spread to somewhere pretty far which will be Esthar. But it is still likely that they dispered above the sky of Esthar instead but this too explains why monsters didn't shown up in Galbadia if your case apply since it is possible for the monsters to spread this far being manipulated by the Lunatic Pandora.
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv...0/fmv140-7.jpg
Lastly, we can certain that those dispered landed onto Esthar and Adel Tomb was caught halfway although I highly doubt that pic of yours was Galbadia in the very first place.
It sure doesn't look like it to me cause the target isn't Galbadia in the first place since the Galbadian won't be dumb enough to destroy their own hometown and judging from that pic if it is really Galbadia, it is somewhere on the edge of the continent which happen to be where Tears Point is in the Esthar continent.
Also, since there are so much lies in the game, the shape of the continent shown in the world map might be lying too just like what the creators of the game want us to think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christmas
Since the world is round,the DSRC era includes probably all the area outside of the hexagon.Quote:
What i meant about the hexagon is that the bottom white line of the hexagon should be parallel to the bottom of the world map but it isnt it is at an angle.
After all the rectangular boards are irrelevant.
Forget the first two lines of that post.The other lines were what matters.Quote:
Oh come on you gotta be able to come up with something better than that.
Also you said that you could go through time in the Balamb underwater train tunnel but you said that no one would go through there because of the risk of getting hit by a train. What about when it was being built?
The underwater tunnel was created by shumis possessed by Hyne(as well as every project which involves top secret phenomena).
Christmas,we must trust more on our eyes than on dialogues.
Can´t you see Galbadia on the picture?And the camera is outside of the base.
Maybe the glasses of the Lunar base were holographical.
This Lunar cry will hit Galbadia changing its geography into the Esthar one.
Can't you see this little picture below. The lunar cry dispered.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
http://images.bluelaguna.net/ff8/fmv...0/fmv140-3.jpg
If it is over the skies of Galbadia, it might dispel so far that the monster rain on Esthar.It is still logical this way.
I saw the video and the COLUMN is right over Esthar.
Just for your consideration, physically speaking, and I do suppose that the laws of physics apply in FF8, we couldn't really have the earth twice. You see, if we are talking about the earth in our time = En and the earth in the ice age = Ei, we will have two almost identically massed astronomical objects. Let me explain.
The earth orbits the sun. The moon orbits the earth. The particles of lesser mass orbit the ones of a greater mass. This means, the moon has to be clearly smaller than the earth. If you compared the masses of En and Ei, the difference will be minimal, i.e. meteors that stroke the planet, etc. This would mean that we would have two gigantic objects very close to each other. In empty space, this would cause a collision very quickly. Thus, in order for the moon to be able to exist near the earth, i.e. on its orbit, it must have a clearly lesser mass and thus, your theory is impossible FE.
Just a quick example from our world:
Mass of the Moon = 7.36 × 10^22 kilograms
Mass of Earth = 5.9742 × 10^24 kilograms
Mass of the Sun = 1.98892 × 10^30 kilograms
When it reaches the planet high up in the skies it DISPERED and SPREAD all over the place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
But we also see the column over Galbadia.How do you explain that.
Cause it's wide in diameter?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Out of curiousity, are we clear about the moon not being the Earth? I just want to make sure you don't use it in any further arguments causing confusion in newbs.
You misunderstood.
There weren´t two Earths on space.
It is an holographical illusion.
On space they are on T+B era.
What MaxGrin said was true, but im gonna use his meteor thing for another problem I have with this.In different eras there would have been different events that happened that would change the earth's mass (thus using MaxGrin's examples) of that area but only affects that era because it is in a different time. But since every era has different events that do change the mass of the earth, wouldn't this throw off the earth entirely?
Are you saying that even in space the moon is holographic? If that is so how the heck is that possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Is it just me or is everything in FE's FF8 world holographic. Holographic walls, holographic ceilings, holographic windows, holographic moons...
What are you talking about rectangles? On your map thing it is a hexagon and your hexagon just happens to be perfectly aligned so that no one can cross the lines on foot but if you rotate it so that the bottom of the hexagon is parralel to the bottom of the map i bet you could cross the lines.Quote:
Since the world is round,the DSRC era includes probably all the area outside of the hexagon.
After all the rectangular boards are irrelevant.
Also does anyone else find it strange that on his world map thing the blue line where the holographic wall is supposed to be can be crossed but according to FE the red line is where it actually is because Adel was reshapping the planet or somethin. And not suprisingly the red line cannot be cross on foot because it mostly runs over water.
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...gonredblue.jpg
I think he's trying to say that the holographic walls aren't really lines, but that is the general area that they are in. I think by the red line he is showing what the real holographic wall loks like and that Adel keeps changing the holographic walls so that no one can cross overe them. I still think he should answer my question from my previous post also.
I don´t know whether the "moon" was holographic or the "Earth" but at least one of them must be holographic.Quote:
Are you saying that even in space the moon is holographic? If that is so how the heck is that possible.
Is it just me or is everything in FE's FF8 world holographic. Holographic walls, holographic ceilings, holographic windows, holographic moons...
It is not required for my theory to stablish an orientation.That´s irrelevant.Quote:
What are you talking about rectangles? On your map thing it is a hexagon and your hexagon just happens to be perfectly aligned so that no one can cross the lines on foot but if you rotate it so that the bottom of the hexagon is parralel to the bottom of the map i bet you could cross the lines.
What I said was that the drawing can fit the world map at a certain angle.The coincidence is not lost just because of an angle shift.
It is stil a coincidence that it fit the world map and the topology is equal of that of the picture(External or internal angles don´t matter).
Don´t forget Hyne is behind WOTC and the Lunar Cries.Quote:
What MaxGrin said was true, but im gonna use his meteor thing for another problem I have with this.In different eras there would have been different events that happened that would change the earth's mass (thus using MaxGrin's examples) of that area but only affects that era because it is in a different time. But since every era has different events that do change the mass of the earth, wouldn't this throw off the earth entirely?
Which means these events were artificial and not random.
Hyne knows exactly how to change the geography of the planet.
He knows exactly what geological catastrophes to enable.
He understands physics and geology(which isn´t really a surprise).
But it doesnt really fit you had to adjust one line to make it fit. So the way u origionally had it doesnt work which means that there is no coincidence.Quote:
It is not required for my theory to stablish an orientation.That´s irrelevant.
What I said was that the drawing can fit the world map at a certain angle.The coincidence is not lost just because of an angle shift.
It is stil a coincidence that it fit the world map and the topology is equal of that of the picture(External or internal angles don´t matter).
One has to understand the context to understand the meaning of that red line.
What we saw on the panel was a strategical MODEL which Adel couldn´t follow because Laguna sent the Pandora to the sea.
I know what ur talkin about i read the WOTC thread but what im saying is that if the line is there then you can walk through it and the big thing with your whole theory is that people cant go through it on foot. So that would not be an "ideal" position for the wall like you said in the other thread.
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1...sh07/proof.jpg
You see that little black line FE? The one that crosses the red line marking where your holographic wall is at. The red line that only vehicles made to time travel can cross. Well i crossed it on a chocobo. How do u explain that. Chocobos do not have internal GPS that tell them how to time travel.
Wait, is Hyne still alive throughout this whole thing making the artificial events and such?
You can find him on the future where he resides(and suposedly never time travelled).
ooohhh, that makes sense a bit.
WHAT COLUMN?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
I think he's talking about the shot from the space, where it heads somewhere looking like Galbadia. I suppose. Don't ask me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christmas
But umm do you actually get to see him ? can you post a pic of him if you actually do see him ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
We actually see him.
And he looks really odd should I tell you.
A very odd Hyne.
Are there any pictures of him ? could send a link perhaps, if you have any.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Just when I decide to reveal.Keep looking at the "Evangelic view on the occult" thread.
He is not called Hyne.
That was the way that Vascaroon spelled his name.
Yes,I know about that problem.Quote:
You see that little black line FE? The one that crosses the red line marking where your holographic wall is at. The red line that only vehicles made to time travel can cross. Well i crossed it on a chocobo. How do u explain that. Chocobos do not have internal GPS that tell them how to time travel.
That is a big one.
In fact one can go from the sacred chocobo forest to Edea´s house.
Let´s think a little.Were are the only places were we find a chocobo not riding by anyone?
Its Winhill and the seven chocobo forests.
The chocobo forests looked artificial from the outside.The chocoboys treated these forests and decided to perform experiments on them.Genetic manipulation was made on some animals to create mutations.The time traveling and GPS orientation characteristics were implement genetically on these animals.
The GPS probably become some innate pattern on the Chocobo´s brain.
All of the chocoboys had the same appearance.That´s because they were all shumi´s who became possessed by the same person-Hyne.And they look like Hyne.
Maybe the sacred forest was the firsst place.Hidden by a deep forest it is perfect to develop hidden experiments.
Pff... can't you just post your theories instead of ending every sentence half finished with an intrigue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
This kind of reminds me a Soap Opera:
Quote:
Jack: Simon, there's something very important I need to tell you?
>>>ADVERTISEMENTS>>>>
Jack: Simon, there's something very important I need to tell you?
Simon: What is it, mate?
Jack: Your pants are open.
Simon: O, thanks man.
...
Post 266 edited.
Thank you.
Where is your proof or even a reason that would make you think that the chocobos were being genetically manipulated? I mean unless you have some proof then there is no reason to believe you.Quote:
The chocobo forests looked artificial from the outside.The chocoboys treated these forests and decided to perform experiments on them.Genetic manipulation was made on some animals to create mutations.The time traveling and GPS orientation characteristics were implement genetically on these animals.
The GPS probably become some innate pattern on the Chocobo´s brain.
As for the choco boys all looking the same, its because they are the same person. There is just 1 choco boy and he travels between the chocobo forests using chocobos so he isnt some shumi he is just a normal person.Quote:
All of the chocoboys had the same appearance.That´s because they were all shumi´s who became possessed by the same person-Hyne.And they look like Hyne.
Plus how can Hyne possess like 10 different people at the same time? I mean if you are in 1 persons mind how do you go and get into another persons. There is no way to simultaneusly possess multiple people.
What was post 266
FE just added more info to nr. 266.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnislash07
That chocobo forest being artificial thing is a crok. I'm gonna have to side with Omnislash here. The belief that chocobos were genetically manipulated is completely absurd. There is no possible reason either. I don't think Hyne would've even thought of that.
That´s irrelevant.Quote:
As for the choco boys all looking the same, its because they are the same person. There is just 1 choco boy and he travels between the chocobo forests using chocobos
Chocoboy is a Shumi possessed by Hyne.
Now can you post other counter arguments to WOTC please?
Why?Argue,please.Quote:
That chocobo forest being artificial thing is a crok. I'm gonna have to side with Omnislash here. The belief that chocobos were genetically manipulated is completely absurd.
That´s because you don´t know him.Quote:
I don't think Hyne would've even thought of that.
No because you still havent given any proof that the chocobos are genetically enhanced and you also havent explained how Hyne (1 person) can simultaneusly posses about 10 people or more.
FE, u are telling us to give u proof when it is urself that must have the arguments since u obviously are not even giving reasonable statements.
Maybe you are right,there is one Chocoboy.But he is a Shumi possessed by Hyne.
Don´t wanna proof.Just explain why it is unreasonable to you.Quote:
FE, u are telling us to give u proof when it is urself that must have the arguments since u obviously are not even giving reasonable statements.
I wasn even talking about how he posses all the chocoboys because i knew there was only 1. I mean how he can posses Ulti, Aldel, Elone, Rinoa, and all of the human/shumi's that you say created the Balamb underground train tunnel.
That´s a problem about multiple consciousness.
Since this wasn´t never experienced one our world I don´t know what it looks like or if it can be proved.
dude all ur saying is unreasonable! the chocobos being genetically manipulated, the chocobo forests being fake, that Hyne can possess so many ppl. they can happen but the fact that Hyne was able to think or even be able to do all this isn't right! u got some explainin to do.
Okay lets use actual game information: When squall and company are in the minds of Laguna and company their bodies are asleep because their minds are inside of Laguna and com. If Hyne was possessing someone it would work like that and so he would be unable to possess multiple people at a time.
that clears one thing up. (FE, no more about the possession thing now).
Don´t forget Hyne knows more about possessiong capabilities than Elle.
He knows things about Elle´s powers that she didn´t know.
But please start yourself explaining why the genetic manipulation thingy was unreasonable.
ok, i'd like to know why and how he would think of it. if this is unable to be asnwered without something having more questions to it that be questionable then the genteic thing just doesn't work. pls give ur insight to this.
It doesnt matter how much he knows about possession. If he is possessing them then he is sending his mind into their bodies so he can make them do as he wishes. Since he has only one mine he cannot simultaneusly control more than 1 person.
ok, this is why i would like to take the multiple possession thing out of the rest of the conversation. we have proven it invalid to Hyne's capabilities so it should be dropped.
Ill drop it as soon as FE accepts that it is invalid.
i know, i decided to want it dropped since u proved it invalid.
All right,I admit.I have to rethink my theory here.
Let´s start with the axiom "Just one person can be possessed at a time".
We know that a shumi evolves to what is on their hearts.
Most of the persons possessed by Hyne remain stopped when we talk with them.
Maybe a shumi takes a long time to get back to normal when they weren´t possessed.
Hyne uses a circular device to possess people which works as some kind of comm. tower.It also works as a clock to syncronize the time (and maybe space also) factor.The era to which the wave is sent.
Hyne´s pigtail works as the clock pointer.
So to change the person to be possessed he only needs to be as fast as turning his head around (to the possible extent).
So maybe he quickly changes the possessed person.
Imagine the implications.Quote:
ok, i'd like to know why and how he would think of it.
Even if the citizens of FF8 discover the WOTC system and the time travelling vehicles they would deny it by using the chocobo argument.It is more clever to use an animal as a time traveller than a man made vehicle.
ur not telling me why and how he would think of it though. ur just using a possible reason.
I explained the why.To be more efficient on the WOTC deception.
Hahaha, this is pointless IT WILL NEVER !!! But you know, you guys can try :D . Ill just sit back and be entertained. ;)
Dude ur right, this is comepletly hopeless because as soon as we come up with a problem in FE's fanfic he just makes up something new to get around that problem. So im gonna just say screw it and not even pay attention to his posts anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by TonightWeFly12
alright that could be the why, but what about the how? he's human and open to mistakes too u know.
True he has a point there. Ill just stick around a while longer to see what happens here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
I am not a biologist.
But the better explanation is that there would be some celullar pattern on Chocobo´s brain which enables it to time travel.The information about the map is innate on the Chocobo´s memory.
I see no problem with that.One should learn with one´s errors and enhance one´s theory.Never said I am perfect.Thanks for showing me the flaw.Quote:
Dude ur right, this is comepletly hopeless because as soon as we come up with a problem in FE's fanfic he just makes up something new to get around that problem. So im gonna just say screw it and not even pay attention to his posts anymore.
FE:
Hyne faught the humans he created and was able to flee by leaving half of its body behind to the humans (fled with the other half, which was stronger).
Humans studied their half of hyne in the underwater research center (aka Ultima weapon) and developed paramagic.
The other half escaped, and is found when time began to compress, the stronger half aka Omega weapon.
And about the Chocobos, I guess it's possible that they are genetically engineered chickens for all we know!
ur saying they have a map on their brain, that's not what im asking. im asking for how would Hyne think of it? i mean, don't u think the chocobos just know their way around the world of FFVIII, and since they are before Hyne ever existed and the different eras on one planet were created they should be able to go to different continents without jumping to a new era (i just thought this up, makes sense to me, unlike that Hyne brain implant chocobo thing).
Time loops.Chocobos exist before Hyne because he sent his consciousness inside the chocoboy on the past and created them there.
And there is no reason to think Chocobo´s exist before WOTC.Hyne created WOTC first and then the Chocobos.
Hyne, or the choco boy, did not create the chocobos... Squaresoft did when they made Final Fantasy II...Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Are there any humans left in the game?
And:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christmas
I will give you an aproximate list of the names of the persons possessed by Hyne.
Quote:
Hyne, or the choco boy, did not create the chocobos... Squaresoft did when they made Final Fantasy II...
Since all the games are related maybe the most ancient era (Centra) is before the times of all FFs.After all it has a medieval touch.
Ok, FE, before you come back to your own little world and start being different, let me remind you that all the FFs are not related. They happen in different places and different times. Quoting:Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Now this might seem irrelevant to you, but the game are different as are their worlds. Clearly, FF6 and FF:Spirits Within are different worlds. One takes place on the Earth, the other in a fictional world. Though the planet might have come through various era's the landscape would still look similar, which is not the case in any off the FFs. Compare the maps:Quote:
Final Fantasy was made in 1987 by Hironubu Sakaguchi and was actually made as a farewell "present" to Square Co., Ltd. He felt that the gaming world was going in circles and that no-one wanted to take any chances with a new type of game. So he decided to quit the buisness and start a new career doing something completely different, maybe become a fisherman. But before he could do this he needed to prove to both himself and the rest of the world that the age of groundbreaking games were not over. He sat down and worked over a long period in secret on his last project ever. His last dream. His Final Fantasy. And so the name was created. Final Fantasy was a single man's last wish for proving that new things could still be made. And so far every single FF game has improved the gaming world in ways no-one could imagine. Every game has introduced something new, either in terms of graphic, gameplay, voices & music, engine... You name it, Final Fantasy has always been the first to go new ways. And that is how it should be. The moment Hironubu Sakaguchi feels the games are copying themselves he is going to quit and become a fisherman.
4:
http://www.ffonline.com/1_ff4gfx/map-world.gif
5:
http://www.ffonline.com/1_ff5gfx/map-world3.gif
6:
http://www.returnergames.com/worldbooks/ff6/ff6wor.jpg
7:
http://www.ffward.net/images/7/7map.jpg
8:
http://www.galbadiax.com/ff8/ff8map.jpg
9:
http://www.kristasalter.com/gamesgur...ap_general.jpg
Now a map of our Earth and thus FF:SE:
http://www-us.ebsco.com/home/images/...ap-servers.gif
Now please, tell me that they all look similar? Or maybe you want to say that the earth has changed during that time and that the periods between the games are so long. Well:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...tonics_map.gif
What you see on the picture are continental plates. No matter at what age of the development of earth you go, you'll be able to more or less see them on the map. Now, all FFs have different maps and the plates tend to be different as well, so no, I do not think that it is the same planet.
No ideas of interplanetar training has been introduced in either of FFs, but FF:ENDLESS NOVA, which is not made by SquareEnix, and thus cannot be counted as evidence. Thus, your wrong.
FF VII took place 1000 years after FF VIII right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
wtf?! are u saying that Hyne was here at the beginning of the world for this game and had all the intelligence to do all this? I don't think so!Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
And Jesus spoke, I shall give you free food and free drinks, and I shall be in your chocoboys when thy shall need me. Oh please, this is too much.
To summarise:
- All FFs take place in the same, very unfortunate world
- Everybody is has been created by the almighty, omniscient God Hyne*kneels down and prays*
- The Earth has been divided into time warping walls, without anyone ever noticing. Yeah, I mean, the scientists never look at things like climate, light and atmosphere
- The Earth has a nifty high-tech roof which for a to us unknown purpose projects a picture of a moon, who is the earth in one of it’s other eras. Maybe God Hyne was bored and though that there could be no Romeo & Juliet without a moon or it was too dark for him to sleep and he set up a night-lamp, which he called the moon
- Ellone is in really a killed-robot send from some more progressive FF, which is still to come out, in order to play around with Squally-Poo
- Erosion is a myth; the landscape just shuffles every century
- Evolution is a myth; humans never develop
- Bigs and Wedge are time travellers, responsible for humour in the world
- Everyone is mad, but FE, who is certainly right with his theories
You know, the one problem I have with your theory is that I don’t know where we are compared to the other FFs. I mean, clearly FF:Spirits Within takes place very close to our time. 2100 was the date or something. Now what comes first, FF:SE or FFVII. Both have quite progressive technologies, however, FFVII is clearly quite a bit behind FF:SE, plus the landscape looks a bit different but that’s ok with point 6. Now FFVII cannot happen before our time, since it’s not in our history(would be cool if it was:p), thus it must have happened either a long time ago before dinosaurs since we don’t have any fossils of Cloud and Tifa. Now this means that it happens after our world, which means that humanity did die out and fell to a very low tech level after FF:SE. I think this is messed up.
EDIT:A look, your wrong, the most ancient era are the ancients for FFVII. Plus, medieval = medieval, not ancient. Ancient comes first.Quote:
Since all the games are related maybe the most ancient era (Centra) is before the times of all FFs.After all it has a medieval touch.
Yes I am.
But meteorites coming from space and the Lunar Cries would change the plates,I bet.Quote:
What you see on the picture are continental plates. No matter at what age of the development of earth you go, you'll be able to more or less see them on the map. Now, all FFs have different maps and the plates tend to be different as well, so no, I do not think that it is the same planet.
No ideas of interplanetar training has been introduced in either of FFs, but FF:ENDLESS NOVA, which is not made by SquareEnix, and thus cannot be counted as evidence. Thus, your wrong.
You are misunderstanding things.
Hyne is not a God but a human being.
Ellone is not a cyborg.
I just said there is a cyborg which imitates Ellone.
This cyborg is big Ellone.
The true Ellone is the little one we see and for those who don´t know I think it is Rinoa.
On my theory,wind making devices exist on the walls.Quote:
The Earth has been divided into time warping walls, without anyone ever noticing. Yeah, I mean, the scientists never look at things like climate, light and atmosphere.
You know, I'm surprised that Hollow Earth theories haven't been mentioned yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
You know how idiotic the idea of wind making devices sounds? Ok, and how about light polarisation, moisture, erosion, material integration and intersection and, my all time favourite, birds? Do you also have some bird making devices on those walls?
Esthar, where do you have a slightest notion on any sort of walls in the game, except from a window that with a bunch of imagination fits the map?
There is an interesting FMV about birds on the game.It actually seems to show there is a wall there.Ask old members.I already posted it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Someone here is getting new ideas from our friend here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
I dun really know what theories you two had discussed but judging from our friend's past history:Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
Those posts he promised never appear and I strongly doubt whatever he said nor do I had any faith in what you said in the first place anyway. But it is really terrifying if you two fuse together.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
If you had just played FF VIII and FF VII, you are really in no position to said or made this assumption regardless if you gotten anyQuote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
twistedinformation from your new friend.
FE, u are coming up with new reasons just at an attempt to keep ur old original theory questionable. That's messed up. Tell us about the birds. Did Hyne gentically maipulate them too? :rolleyes2
NO NO NO NO NO!! You've got it all wrong, the birds are shumis possesed by hyne with little gps sticking out of their heads. Duh!
That is obvius from in game information that i will soon make up with another theory that is almost inpossible to proove wrong because it is so comepetly retarded.
(FE I hope u catch the small amount of sarcasim in that post)
[leeza]And I hope you catch on when I say that if you can't post without throwing a flame at someone, veiled or not, don't post. ~ Leeza[/leeza]
lol! :lol: but seriously, i'd like to know so i can come up with an easily thought up counter.
These "theories" are ludicrous. All the FF games are COMPLETELY different games. They are NOT connected whatsoever ( except same game designers ).
These theories are the most idiotic thing I have ever heard :eep:
I like FF8 but not in an sick obsessive way...
Once again. What the Smurf?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Interesting enough these idiotic theories are probably true.It´s difficult to believe them but I put my hand on fire for them.Quote:
These theories are the most idiotic thing I have ever heard
Quote:
FE, u are coming up with new reasons just at an attempt to keep ur old original theory questionable. That's messed up. Tell us about the birds. Did Hyne gentically maipulate them too?
Actually these birds are normal.
So far I had seen no one passing through an holographic wall on FF8.
The opposite happens.
Christmas... These threads WILL appear one day when I can gather the proof. And also when it's died down. A bit
Some people are getting sick of me stating that FFs are related so I'm taking a break until I can get the proof uploaded. (I do have it - sort of)
Midgar is FH,Deling City and Garden.
That´s obvious.
I'd stick my hand in a Quiznos oven for this theory too...Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
::Ahem:: Ultimecia is the only REAL human in the game :eek: Everyone else is an illusion in her mind caused by a more powerful being ( Will reveal later ). Ultimecia's mission to compress time was so she could expose the being and end its terror on her mind...
Dont tell me that isnt a relevant theory I came up with just now. Why else is she compressing time but for that reason!?
YES! It all makes sense! Ultimecia is the main character in the game, Square you are so sly and tricky, making us think the whole time Squall and Rinoa were the good guys and Ulti was bad.
The ironic thing is that Ulti was defeated...And she never escaped the powers of the evil being, she became enslaved by it...
I am calling this the U = ORH theory!
Ulti = ( only real Human ) theory makes the most sense in my mind after all the FFVIII is not a love story about a young man who is taught to love again by a beautiful young woman... Its about birds, cyborgs, and smurfs.
.Quote:
[FFVIII is not a love story about a young man who is taught to love again by a beautiful young woman...
Of course it is.This concept is not out of my theories.
You didn´t use the binary or quasi-binary association method of argumentation on your theories.
This is a method I use.I consider this is the method which gives the best results and must be the base of an axiomatic theory(One which can´t be proved and along with other ones gives the evidence for non axiomatic ones).
Doesnt matter, all you do is prove your theories WITH other theories of yours. None of your theories make sense without the others. Thats why you keep making new ones up, to cover your ass.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Its like evolution, they dont have any proof, so they just make up new hypothesises and theories to "prove" the other ones.
You cant give me three times in FF8 where your theories prove themselves.
And when it is all over, they will be proven wrong because they have no relevance to the game. YOu said yourself " IT IS a love story between a man and a woman " BUT these theories destroy the story themselves, so how can they be true?
Nothing can be proved on an RPG.
But there were axiomatic theories which can be obtained through the binary/quasi-binary association method.The other theories can be obtained from these but these can not be obtained from any other.
No,they don´t.Prove me they do.No one has ever.Quote:
BUT these theories destroy the story themselves,
My theories are to the game what Relativity is to Newtonian physics.
They don´t contradict each other.Newtonian physiscs is just an approximation on Relativity.Of course this one sounds farfetched.
Actually no its not. Midgar cannot be three different cities in the future because it was destoyed at the end of 7 and never rebuilt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Dude dont even compare evolution to FE. Evolution is true, maybe not on the scale of everything coming from single celled organisms but everything does slowly evolve. If you disagree with this you need to take a basic Biology class.Quote:
Its like evolution, they dont have any proof, so they just make up new hypothesises and theories to "prove" the other ones.
Rumors has that on FF7 DOC it still remains.
Yeah its ruins remain. Its ruins are still there 500 years after 7 as seen in Red XIII's little scene at the end. But they dont rebuild it, they leave it in ruins forever.
Thats a lame excuse for your theories. Everything I witnessed during the time I played FF8 through twice is proof. Not once did I ever witness any of your theories in action or even in question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Axiomatic theories are theories that are self evident or self proving. So give us an example.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
You have gone on about theories for weeks now without any self proving evidence, everyone who listened deserves to hear some real proof. Everyone would respect you more if you gave us some. But like I said, I bet you couldnt even give us three examples of your theories proving themselves.
Seems I was right...:eep:
Actually, Evolution is not proven truth. If you have taken a biology class than you should know that the "proof" you call evolution are just genetic defects and are mutating the creature. Evolution states that the creature should get stronger and fitter, but all these mutations do is hinder the animal or do nothing at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnislash07
Mutations are not evolution in action because no NEW information is being created ( a 5 legged cow has not evolved, it already has information for a leg, but a genetic defect has caused it to copy the leg a fifth time by mistake ). And there has never been a time in history that a creature has EVER been observed creating new genetic information on its own.
So evolution IS a theory and has no proof ( like FE's theories ), thus we should treat it as a theory ( as I was ) and not state it as true. And yes I have taken biology. :rolleyes2 And the way the evidence looks, I believe evolution to be a false theory.
I'm not sure how evolution got involved in this, but at least I agree that it is a theory, in the sense that it is always possible that a newer better theory will be developed to replace or modify the existing one.
However evolution does not happen within single organisms, although mutations do. Evolution involves populations of organisms, some who are more and some who are less fit. Not all mutations are helpful, although the harmfulness or helpfulness depends a lot on the environment.
For example, genes that cause sickle cell anemia can be useful in tropical countries, where one copy of it can actually help to protect you from malaria. In colder climates, it's merely harmful.
Once a mutation develops that is helpful within an given environment, it increases the odds of survival of those that have it. So they would be more likely to reproduce. Gradually the mutation would spread to more and more of the population until the entire population has it. Given enough time and mutations, new species would arise.
So harmful mutations are the price individuals pay in order for a species to have genetic variation.
Anyways, it's apples and oranges. Future Esthar is using the term theory in a very different context.
No he's not. Like evolution ( which has NEVER been observed, ever ) which proves theories with new theories, he does the same thing with his own. He proves them with "proof" that is not proven.Quote:
Originally Posted by BG-57
I hope you can follow that last line...:rolleyes2
I agree with you that Future Esthar's theory here doesn't have a solid basis in the game.
But evolution is not in the same category. It's a critical part of biology and has been supported by a lot of direct evidence.
For an observation of evolution in action, how about the development of antibiotic resistant strains of bacteria?
No, what you are observing is natural selection in action...Quote:
Originally Posted by BG-57
Humans developed this strain of bacteria through a process of elimination by killing the weak bacteria and upholding the resistant ones. Thus, those with the stronger immunity survive and the strain improves generation after generation.
Thats why doctors want you to take your medicine for the whole duration because there might be bacteria left that is strong and you need to take it all to eliminate them.
That is not evolution in action though. The bacteria did NOT create new genetic material to counter the antibiotics. Humans interfered and did the process themselves.
But that is not evolution either. Evolution is the process of nature causing the natural selection and nature growing the new genetic material.
Evolution has NEVER been observed in nature EVER and has yet to produce ANY real proof...
And like evolution, Future Esthar's theories have NEVER been observed in the game EVER and have yet to produce any real proof...
Nothing creates new genetic material anyways. Mutations are random changes in DNA. Some bacteria have mutations that make them resistant and some don't. It's not a useful mutation unless that antibiotic is present.
I take it that you don't find the fossil record, characteristics of lower vertebrates (like gill slits) in fetuses and nonfunctional genes in noncoding DNA segments convincing evidence.
At any rate, I don't think we're going to settle this issue on this thread.
On that note, good night all.
Yes, nothing creates new genetic material ( even though thats whate evolution teaches ), but mutations are not random CHANGES they are random DEFECTS. The DNA has not changed it has simply made an error in the constructing process.Quote:
Originally Posted by BG-57
The gills in the fetus evidence was used years ago, like 1950s...
The so called " gill proof " has since been disproven. The "gills" are in fact pouches that develop important organs such as the Thymus gland and the Parathyroid glands. You can look up the evidence in the book "Medical Embryology".
The "gill proof" was made up by a evolutionist fraud named Ernst Haeckel, who in fact confessed his evidence ( such as the gills ) as false before he died...
The evidence you have cited is indeed false ( if you dont believe look it up in the book I refrenced above ).
Evolution does not have ANY proof at all, and the gill fraud was a desperate attempt to deceive people who are not too familiar with our pharyngeal...
Good night to you :)
Future Esthar where are you...
OK, for some of u, take biology again. I agree that evolution is a theory because u can't actually se it happen because it is soooo slow (natural selection is part of evolution). Also, when an organism gets stronger and fitter, those are not mutations. As u should know from biology genes that are past into offspring are combined and the genes that carry the similar trait are combined and change into a dominant(stronger for some genes) and recessive (weaker for some genes). No mutations, sry! And no, evolution is not saying that new genetic material is produced. Just so u know, I think God just made evolution to give something for ppl to think about. God does all by His will and is the Most High!
wtf?! u've been saying that chocobo's and vehicles pass through holographic walls and now ur saying that with birds the walls pass through them?! no, no, no, no, no! ur making new theories to try to back up ur old ones! STOP IT! :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
No, no. That's religion. You prove the existance of god with bible, which is also fictive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noj_R
By opposite,I mean,birds don´t pass through hol walls nor hol walls through them.Quote:
and now ur saying that with birds the walls pass through them?
I don´t mean opposition but negation.That´s what I mean by "The opposite happens".
So...ur sayin they can't? :confused:
Good one. Now let's try figuring that out. Ok, could you please say that in a different phrase, since I'm having a problem with comprehending the one above. Silly me:rolleyes2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
yes.Quote:
So...ur sayin they can't?
Quit avoiding my questions FE, you DO prove your theories with new ones! And you have yet to show any of them that can stand on their own...
Your bird theory makes NO sense either, try using your binary/quasi mediocre method to prove it WITHOUT ANOTHER THEORY TO BACK IT UP!
And about evolution, YES, it does say new genetic material is made. How could they say dinosaurs evolved into birds without bird genes? The dinosaurs "made new material to grow wings", dinosaurs did not have wing genes in their DNA at any point ( and scientists have dinosaur DNA, and they do not have any extra genes ). And evolution cannot be said to be true because its sssslllooowwww... thats a lame excuse, science must be able to be observed to be science, and evolution cannot be observed because it doesnt exist...
What bird theory?I made no bird theory.
Bynary association method.
This method consists of making an association between two similar events being these events the only two ones on the game.It also relates to the recognition of patters between two related events(unique ones).This method has flaws but give the best and most accurate results.
Quasi binary
like the binary but more than two events appear.More flawed than binary.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noj_R
Dude chill out :greenie:
edit: Who said anything about dinosaurs evolving into birds :s Evolution can be as simple as growing an extra finger. For example, Men have nipples but do not use them like women. By having them, it suggests that once we perhaps did use them. And have evolved because as the male of the species (and the hunter/supplier) we have left this part of parenting to the female. I realise ive spun into a theory of my own, but this would strongly suggest that evolution at least exists, even if you refuse to believe it
Cristmas. Why did you include the "Jenova = Ultimeicia" in you're Quotes from me? that's irellovent if what you were trying to was point out my obsession with conecting the FFs.
Also I'm sorry (Kishi) To bring up the subject again but thoese maps have given me MORE evidense that the FFs might be connected.
FF1 is NOT set on "Earth".
Your theory is legitimate, now state your arguments and explain how the maps connect the FFs.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
FE, please, could you give a detailed explanation of the bird-dilemma? What did you mean?
The maps look similar but Evolved. (Of course It's not just the LOOK of The world that helps me - Storyline does too.)
Well, could you explain the storyline similarities?Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
About the maps, no, they aren't evolved. Geologically speaking they are completely different; no common heights, no similar tectonic plates, nothing. They tend to have sharp edges, but that doesn't have anything to do with evolution of the landscape. It's nothing but the love to sharp edges of the artist who drew them(relating to "The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"), maybe he wanted to win a competition.:)
The map of FF7 is actually very similar to Centra era if you look at it.
The birds are normal,that´s it.Quote:
FE, please, could you give a detailed explanation of the bird-dilemma? What did you mean?
OK, ill "assume" your theories are relevant... Now, show us some facts to back up your theorys, and I mean in game facts/occurances that are relevant to your stand...
and I would like to see some proof by your binary association method...:eep:
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinangel2292
And about the evolution sub-topic... We started this topic on a couple of things: Antibiotic resistant starins of bacteria - those were man induced immunities, evolution? no. The gill in fetus proof - a fraud made up by a dead evolutionist those "gills" are pouches that develop important organs ( that is fact ), evolution? no. A simple thing like an extra finger? no, no new genetic material is created, it was simply a genetic mistake ( and mistakes are not evolutionary ). Evolution? no.
You see... There is no evidence for evolution. We have been taught to believe it through our school biology classes. But everyone can figure out that evolution isnt even science because it CANNOT be observed ( that is science 101, for something to be scientific it must be able to be observed ).
And how do you think evolution works without creating new genetic material? Is it possible for a single celled organism to grow into a human and a dog and a cat over millions of years of evolution without new genetic material being made? You know the answer to that...
You guys arent dumb, you can think for yourselves and see that every evolutionary theory has no proof to back it up and is not scientific without observation ( of which there has been none )...:)
Thank you.
I will do it tomorrow.Time to sleep.
Future Esthar, what are the walls made of if birds don't run into them?
Noj_R, I did a websearch for material on gill slits. So far every one that I've read that claims gill slits were a myth are Creationist sites. Make of that what you will.
I do admire your convictions and the passion with which you defend them. But we'll have to agree to disagree here.
Thanks for the compliment, did you check out the book " Medical Embryology ", and the evolutionist who claimed this as proof confessed it ( amongst other things ) as false before he died.Quote:
Originally Posted by BG-57
I am goin to bed :)
I shall be back tomorrow...Count on it...
hey! if ur going to start an arguement on evolution, start ur own thread.
also, if ur going to start talking about how FF games can be set on the same planet, again, start ur own thread pls.
that can't be right. If birds can't pass throught the walls then they'd hit it going at high speeds and then fall in the water and die. there would be a line of dead birds in the sea somewhere in the game, but there isn't so u have failed to prove that and ur syaing they don't because u can't say that they were possessed by Hyne.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
stop using that method as an excuse for making theories that do not make sense. that method is completely irrelevant to the subject as well. give reasons for evidence pls.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noj_R
W/e tbh. How do you suggest we got here then smartarse? I suppose you think god made us eh? Well don't give me that god bull[img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img] because that is simply faith and has no evidence whatsoever
Fact is, Theories on evolution make perfect sense. And yet you refuse to believe them. maybe you are not the best person to be arguing with FE on his theories tbh
That´s the best we can get.That´s the method Square enables us to make theories about non explicit things.They almost allways create similar events to give hints to players.Quote:
stop using that method as an excuse for making theories that do not make sense. that method is completely irrelevant to the subject as well. give reasons for evidence pls.
It´s IMPOSSIBLE to make theories about things that weren´t expliciting on the game script without using this method.
Birds travel with little speed.They would not fall because:Quote:
that can't be right. If birds can't pass throught the walls then they'd hit it going at high speeds and then fall in the water and die. there would be a line of dead birds in the sea somewhere in the game, but there isn't so u have failed to prove that and ur syaing they don't because u can't say that they were possessed by Hyne.
1-They would immediately gain flight again should they stomp on the wall.After all wings would not be broken.
2-They had good memory so they would not make the same mistake .And the best:
3-Birds can perceive they surroundings using non visible electomagnetic waves(or something like that).
That didn´t happen:
Balamb-There are birds there but they never get out of the region.In fact there were times were it seems that they touched something because they suddenly changes direction.
Balamb Garden FMV-The same happens.But people think they change direction because of garden.
Dude birds fly into windows...
Dont even say that they can avoid invisible walls but not windows.
FE, get over it. FF is made for entertainment, i.e. having good time. It’s a theatrical production with many elements of… theater in it. Theater is based upon conventions, thus what is no in script doesn’t exist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
If you’d see a whole in the textures of Cloud model in FF7:AC, would you tell me that a part of his brain has been actually magically warped away?
no, birds fly at high speeds and they go even faster because of the wind speed (birds do not fly into wind just so u know). They may not make the same mistake because they're dead the first time they try. and the perceiving surroundings by using electromagnetic waves has already been disproven by the fact that they run into windows. and with the next sentences about it seeming that birds touched something, that's another one of ur theories. and no ur method isn't the only option.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Closed windows? I had birds and everytime they scape from the cage and hit a wall they never died(with or without wind).Quote:
and the perceiving surroundings by using electromagnetic waves has already been disproven by the fact that they run into windows.
okay this thread is getting WAY too confusing for me!!! there is theories flying around left, right and center! its INSANE!!! *runs outside slams the door and screams!*
How are close windows related to birds crashing to death? I've heard no theories from any leading research groups, about birds having any of those senses. Electromagnetic waves sensing birds? Birds do not sense anything similar. They are sensitive to touch. Some species, hawks for example, have good sight, some don't, like hens. But they do not sense electromagnetic waves, which are actually in debate of being waves.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Now if some smart-ass will think of saying that bats sense electromagnetic fields, and I feel that someone is just thinking about that, no they do not. They just send ultra-waves and receive a feedback from the object. Similar to radars.
Now FE, if you want to support your position on the birds vs. non-existent hol walls, do so and explain exactly what happens to them? I mean exactly. Quit saying, "post you tomorrow!" Think through it and give a full response. If you choose not to support the theory any longer, state it openly, here and now. This discussion has been pointless from it's start, people see it, and if you want to save your argument by any possible way, do as I advised above.
If you look at the end of FFVII you can see part of Midgar being rebuilt during the 500 years clip.Quote:
Actually no its not. Midgar cannot be three different cities in the future because it was destoyed at the end of 7 and never rebuilt.
And it's entirly possible for a city to be devided. concidering what happens at the end of FFVII A lot of place get sepperated. And If you look you can see obvious evidense these places WERE Midgar at one point (Deling and FH is obvious)
for gods sake!!! none of the ffs are EVER in the slightest related!!! how could you ever dispute this when everyone on the production team openly says this!!!
Seriously guys.This was old after the first 200 hundered posts.Forget it.Quote:
Originally Posted by omegaweapon2005
well ffx and x2 are realated i think maybe
Have you any proof to back up that ridiculess statement?
yeah but that is the OBVIOUS exception! but none of the other ffs are related! and concerning desert wolfs comment: its their fault for getting their hopes up! i dont like argueing with people but they are quite obviously WRONG!!!
Why its fun.j/k:D
acutaly all the ffs that have gfs sommons exct......... are all realated just because they have gfs sommons ecxt...........
If it´s not electromagnetic waves it is radiation.
What matters is that birds has non-light sources of detection.And the hol walls use just light.
The production lied to add a surprise efect to the FFs.Quote:
for gods sake!!! none of the ffs are EVER in the slightest related!!! how could you ever dispute this when everyone on the production team openly says this!!!
If you can give me complete proof that they lied then i will never bother you again.
shut up dude your annoying
Look at this story I developed.It´s about a city that explodes when someone go eat some cookies.
Stephanie says to Philip:
What the hell is that on your hand?
Philip says:
It´s a red cylindrical box with some cookies inside.Can´t you see?
I am gonna eat them now.
Stephanie:
Oh,I see.
(there was a guy with a paint brush on his hands near Philip).
Some minutes later the city explode with a nuclear explosion.
ROFL!What the hell whs that!?!LMAO!
Do you believe me?
it funny yup yup
About what?Cookies causing disasters?
When I said "someone go eat some cookies."
duh dumb ass
MMM cookies.... :D
shut up
Couldnt have just said it no?Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
why?
I'm not ACTUALLY alowed to say this anymore but I have heard Square say that FFs are related. (Sorry admins)Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
I guess you havent read On the Way to a Smile (the story about Denzel) because it clearly states that after it was destoyed Midgar was deserted and then a NEW city was built somewhat nearby using the scraps of Midgar. The new city is called Edge. Also how is it obvious that FH is Midgar? FH is a city built on a net thing over an OCEAN. Midgar was built on the ground.Quote:
Originally Posted by MJN SEIFER
yo is day which it
Ok,it is Edge then.
what
That makes no sense. Why would the people decide to change the name of the city? Also Edge doesnt look like Midgar so your argument that the cities in 8 look like it wont work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Quote:
Also how is it obvious that FH is Midgar? FH is a city built on a net thing over an OCEAN. Midgar was built on the ground.
I will post the apropriate pictures when I can.
I already explained that Midgar(d) was divided. So FH isn't Midgar it's PART of it.
And FH isn't bulit ON an ocean that's impossible it would SINK!
It's built on an Island type area.
As You've probly guessed I'll post more later.
This statement is true, and I agree ;) . If its not in the script it has absolutely NO relevance, it is simply fluff to fill in the gaps. There is no real "inner game" called " Hyne Possession VI " hidden underneath the cover up game Final Fantasy VIII...Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxGrin
Of course the game has " deep " stuff in it. But Hyne possession, birds that dont die when they fly into a timewarp forcefield thing ( but people can ie. ragnarok ), amongst other perverse ideas are REALLY off the rocker ( Im not dissin you FE ), it just doesnt feel quite right...
I didnt say anything about God, that has about as much evidence as evolution ( which is none ). They both have one thing in common though, they are both faith based. Evolution has never been observed before and neither has creation, thus they are both proofless theories.Quote:
Originally Posted by shinangel2292
Theories on evolution dont make sense, I just shot down three evolution instances of "proof" ( see earlier posts ).
Im not indoctrintating or forcing anyone to believe anything, I'm simply showing you something they dont teach in biology at the high school...At school they only give you half truths and lies, evolution is NOT a fact and NOT a science, but is a theory and should be taught as such ( but they dont ) It's just as relevant the theory of intelligent design because they both have no evidence, are not science, and must be believed with faith...:eep:
That was funny:pQuote:
Originally Posted by dante the demon prince
Hey Future Esthar, I told you I would assume your theories are relevant. Now give me some cold hard proof. Proof that is present in the game and is actually meritable...
What? How does evoulotion have no proof. The finches in the galapagos islands evolve every year to suit their food source thats proof.
I have to agree that FF is only a game. It is made to provide us entertainment and square money.
No FH is built in the middle of the ocean, there are no islands in the area. It is just a small town built off of the Horizon Bridge going across the ocean.
bull! for one, birds have good sight. things that are see through they can't see because with their eyes they see only air in the area of the clear thing. no radiation, no EMW. they'll hit the holo walls and fall into the sea and die! no excuses! :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Esthar
Exactly, birds do not possess such capabilities. Bats have sonar equipment, not birds. I have birds fly into my/others windows all the time. I guess they may be experiencing technical difficulties with their sixth sense?:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
And that does not explain why Squall and co. can commute through the portal by walking and/or vehicle ( ie the raganorok anyone ) without the wall zapping or blocking them.
Why in hell would there be holographic, time warping, force field whatevers in the middle of the continent in the first place??? It is just NOT logical...
FE you still have yet to give us proof, you said you would last night, so...where is it? All ive read so far is more theories, the newest one being Hyne is Dr. Odine ( evangelical thread ), which makes no sense at all...
I demand an explanation.
While I agree that FF8 is only a game, we disagree on the finches proof...Quote:
Originally Posted by xancithus
Ah, the lovely finches of the famous Galapagos. Many think that the finches evolve to suit their needs, but of course they do not. First off, you say they evolve every year, but evolution is supposed to take millions of years to occur, does it not... The finch world is like so, one year there are many edible seeds, all finches eat freely and are happy. In the next few years there is a shortage of seeds, but many bugs hide in the tree bark, the finches with longer beaks can reach them to eat. The finches with shorter beaks cannot quite reach the bugs, so they starve and die. The longer finches thrive and now there are lots of long beaked finches.
A zoology professor Peter Grant held an 18 year study of the finches, he estimated at the current rate of generational changes ( the info gleaned from the beak incident ), that it would take only 1200 years to transform the medium ground finch into the cactus finch , to convert to a larger ground finch only 200 years.
No, this does not qualify as proof for evolution. The finches have not created new genes, they have simply gotten bigger/smaller through process of elimination. Evolution states that it should take millions of years for such events to occur, yet they only take place in a few hundred years and have not evolved.
The theory of evolution could be as stated as this: any creature that develops into a different superior creature by growing new genetic material over a period of millions of years has evolved. The finches have shown no such behavior, thus it is not evolution.
The finches show no signs of new genetic material ( the foundation of evolution ), thus they have not evolved.
actually, it does. evolution is the longer process of natural selection practically. through natural selection animals use what they need to survive and is then strengthened. after a couple thousand years or even millions the animal looks quite different than it was before. evolution is again a theory, i agree, but it does explain why animals have many different looks. also, evolution does not state anything about new genetic material. it is only enhanced.
New genetic material is the foundation of evolution, the main argument being a single celled organism evolved into mankind. A single celled organism MUST aqcuire new genetic material to make that leap, right? No? Then how else? Evolution's "goal" is to continually improve itself and it has to acquire the new genetics to make the extra leap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
Yes, the animals will look different, but that isnt evolution. No new genetic material is present they simply improve upon what they have ( like the finches ) . Chihuahuaas and Saint Bernards do LOOK different, but they are still dogs nonetheless. Black people and white people are still human...:greenie:
Where did FE go...?
I never heard evolution say we came from single celled organisms. I'm pretty sure it said we came from primates. Another thing, no, evolution is not based off of new genetic material forming. as i said before, it's just natural selection but waaaaay longer. by the way, new genetics? all organisms have the same genes but are different in a sense that their genes make what they look like and our genes make what we look like.
I know I'm going to regret this. :greenie:
Organisms actually can aquire new genetic material but that process is transformation, not evolution. Frederick Griffith and Oswald Avery did a series of experiments that indicated that one strain of bacteria (smooth) was able to transmit some of it's DNA to another strain (rough), and some of those rough cells transformed into smooth cells.
Evolution is a process where existing DNA in populations gradually accumulate small changes in base sequences, some beneficial, some not, depending on the conditions. Existing DNA is being modified, not new DNA that is being created. What you call mistakes are certainly unintended, at least from the point of view of the organism, but that does not mean they are purely destructive. We would all be the same if not for these mutations.
Exactly, if everything came from the same single celled organisms then every creature has the same genes. Different parts of DNA are used for different organisms.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heero Yuy NWZC
this thread went off on a tangent