It lacked the show anything of other characters, the film was too rushed, and hardly had any plot. An extra hour or so would fix it up, though.
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It lacked the show anything of other characters, the film was too rushed, and hardly had any plot. An extra hour or so would fix it up, though.
Visually stunning but too little character development in between the action scenes, giving it a frenzied pace. Another half an hour of characters interacting would have vastly improved things.
It needed a lot more scenes between the main characters other than Cloud and Tifa (would a scene with Barrett and Marlene been too much to ask?). A good example of where this was well done was when Marlene meets Vincent. Very little spoken dialogue, but you get a good impression of their relationship. Also the villains needed more work, motivation and complexity. Kadaj was the only one with more than one character note.
Reno and Rude were handled just about perfectly. They were the only ones I was really rooting for, not because they made the fighting look effortless, but exactly because they had to work hard at it. Plus they balanced action and comedy nicely. Too bad the other Turks were reduced to cameos.
So it's great eye candy, but the story is lacking. But seeing the Turks in action goes a long way to overlook its other shortcomings.
It was awful. The action scenes were terrible. I mean they tried to be flashy, but all they really did was create something thats similar to a hyperactive ten year old pantomiming their favorite fight scene from Dragon Ball Z. Not a single fight scene had any real logic or flow or sense of consistancy in representing technique or power or skill in any of the fighters. It was just so poorly choreographed and directed.
Then there was the story, which played out like a four year olds fan finction. I swear did square have a contest where the winning child could write the script? The story was just terrible. And having Aerieth resolve every major cliff hanger and crisis point was arguably the worst part.
Then there was the dub... But I'm not one to beat a dead horse.
It just cemented the theory that Tetsuya Nomura is a hack who gets by, by assembling a crack team of animators and programmers for his projects.
There are a lot of things that make it a bad movie. Nonetheless, I enjoyed watching it, but it's incredibly far from perfect -- I don't think Square put much thought into it whatsoever. Though I always admire the artists behind the actual making of it. It's a very tough thing to do.
By the way, I think it's fairly pathetic to make it out this movie "cemented" the theory of Nomura being a hack. Whether you like it or not, he has done some pretty good stuff that many other people like.
Every nomura title that people like has either flashy animation, or fan service going for it. FFVII he had backup from sakaguchi as the assistant scenario writer. Every project him and kitase have collaberated on solo have been storytelling disasters, everyone of them.
Then there are his character designs. SOME of his male designs are decent, Auron has SOME personality and coolness, despite being every bit as derivitive of Anime stereotypes as every other one of his male designs. And what is up with his female designs. Can someone please get this guy a girlfriend. In FFX he had high priestesses and holy icons walking around in G-strings, and don't get me started on his own personal final Fantasy (pun very much intended) that took place in FFX-2. now THAT was just storytelling crap, and the fun job system doesn't go to his credit, but to the battle designers.
And as for kingdom hearts... the first one got off to a decent start, then just imploded spectacularly on the final quarter of the story with rediculous exchanges and developments that made no sense whatsoever. How is it that in one cinema, we saw ansem, who is the king of the heartless by this point, killed by the light from kingdom hearts, then in the very same cinema we see Kingdom Hearts sealed because it is overrun by heartless? Can anyone explain the logic in that to me? KHII was just as redundant and didn't have much of a real story either. Just Sora acting all bardarse.
So yah, as a director and storyteller, the man is a hack. Advent Children is just the ultimate piece of garbage that he put out. I like action films. One of my favorite films EVER is John Woo's Hard Boiled. But AC was just not a good, or even adequette action film. It was awful from fan service beginning that made no sense whatsoever, to the awful "please pour bleach in my eyes to relieve the pain", ending.
What are you on about? It doesn't sound like you played Kingdom Hearts or understood it at all. >.>;
A lot of that is just your opinion, but it seems evident that you are making it out to be an actual fact. Sure, he's done some bad stuff, but no body is perfect. There are thousands upon thousands of people throughout the world the actually do like his stuff (where you do or not), so I'd hardly consider him a hack.
reasons people like nomura titles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Omecle
Flashy Animation (thank the animators there)
Fun battle systems (thank the battle designers)
his female characters dress like sluts. Even the serious and religious ones. Hell Yunalesca was walking around in nothing but body paint.
Big pimped out swords.
All grown up male characters are badarse but are deeply sensitive on the inside.
Fan service.
Sorry, but the novelty of putting square and Disney characters does not a good story, or a story make. Like I said, I defy you to explain to me the story developments in the final act in Kingdom Hearts. Sora throwing himself on the keyblade, becoming a heartless, then being turned back to a human was so arbitrary. Then there was that awful ending. And I've said it before on other message boards, the man just cannot write and direct a female character to save his life. The first kingdom hearts is likely his best work as a director and storyteller. The story was actually decent for a while, but the final act just utterly imploded and went back to the nomura style plot contrivances and flashy action sequences in order to hide just how he had no effing clue what the story was about by this point. and KHII? Seifer talking like a 14 year old mall rat (like he wasnt annoying enough before) the return of cloud and sephiroth so they can talk about feelings, him butchering vivi's design, and Sora being about as interesting as dried paint just killed the game for me. The prime reason for me to play RPG's is for the story first, not production values or fey bishonen or big swords or cinema's or fan service, and thats really all the guy has going for him. When it comes down to how to tell a story... He has no effing clue. All his own projects, FF8, KH, FFX-2, Advent Children, and the crap that is the FFVII rehash are all evidence of this fact.
If you disagree, please feel free to point out what you feel makes him a good story teller.
Oh yes, and keep in mind that numbers of sales do not equal talent. Nomura has a crack team of programmers and battle designers at his beck and call. Doesn't make him a storyteller. Avril Lavigne has a crack team of sound editors, song writers, and musicians provided to her by her music studio, it doesn't make her any better a singer or artist.
"A game director is a person who is in charge of significant creative aspects of a video game." - Wikipedia. I'd say that there's more to just story telling in his role as a director, and this could surely include the overview and management of CG work as well as the design of the battle system. Working in the industry isn't that clear cut, there's a huge pipeline in every project that a company or team takes on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
There's no reason to suggest they dress like "sluts" just because they have exotic costuming and designs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
Uh, what's wrong with big swords? They attract a lot of people that think they are "badarse". I don't really see this as a bad thing. Infact, I can only really think of Final Fantasy VII having huge swords, other games you might say have big swords, but I think that just makes it a bit more interesting in design than having some fairly bland small longsword.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
So why is that a bad thing exactly? I think you'll find that many males in this world are very sensitive on the inside. It actually is quite cool that he has put things like that in, so that it relates to a wide range of audiences.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
You see, I actually find it to be fairly decent, as do many other people. So, it's your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
To you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
Examples please on why it is a bad ending and why his female characters are bad. I actually liked the ending.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
I still don't see how the game ended bad, and I really didn't see any "flashy action sequences" to cover such a thing up. Did you seriously pay attention?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
They are cameos, and once again your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
There are people who like those sorts of things, but I don't believe that its all he has going for him. Just because you are not into them, doesn't automatically make him a "hack". In which case I'd actually wonder why you come around in these forums.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
So how exactly do you know he has no "effing" clue? I mean, he seems to have wrapped it up from KH1 to 2 fairly well, and not with "flashy animations". Or maybe I'm just not seeing it, either way it's still just your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
Fact? That's your opinion mate. There are plenty of people out there who love those games you just listed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami
Basically, to me it just seems you keep trolling around here to beat your own dead horse on why you think Nomura is the worst thing to hit the video game market. It's a bit unfair to present those opinions as facts and impose them on other members.
They are your opinions and you are very well entitled to them; I would even agree with some points. Whether or not you like him, he is still doing fairly well and has a good fanbase behind him -- I'd say that makes him successful in one way or another and not a "hack".
Damn, I didn't want it to get this off-topic really, and sorry if anything comes across as a flame, I don't particularly mean it. Feel free to come and post a reply, but I just don't want to go too far off-topic.
Well said Omecle.^^
Just to make one thing clear.Having a writer doesn't mean he can write whatever he wants just as having a battle director doesn't mean he can do whatever he wants.Everything has to pass through the game director which often gives his own input in those kind of things more or less.
And i consider mr.Nomura a very charismatic director (but not as good as a concept artist) with a very clear vision on what he wants in his projects.
Yeah,i enjoyed AC,the graphics were really pushing the cg industry but i admit that the story could have been better...maybe some more development to the characters and their actions would have been better.But as a fan of VII i'm really grateful for this movie,especially if i compare it to the travesty that Spirits Within was.
It was pretty awesome.
X-2 had more story than this movie :tongue:
Omacle, you don't have to worry about offending me. But I do think you are in the wrong. Nomura is undoubtibly a storytelling hack. He fancies himself a competent director, and worthy successor to sakaguchi. He is neither. You claim this is my opinion, but the fact is his style is one of style over substance and intelligence. His direction in AC was absolutely hideous. Twirling a sword or posing does not good action choreography make. And the writing, dear god it was awful. Not only that but his aping of John Woo for various scenes (kadaj leaping over fenrir, the gunplay from yazoo) was clumsy and over worked. And the whole wuxia inspired elements (leaping around like Crouching tiger on crack) was also awful and overdone. Espescially the cloud tossing. And specifically Vincent telling cloud to fly, when thats his gig. also I havn't met anyone who can explain to me how cloud pulled omnislash Ver. 967 1111 out of his arsenal when you clearly see sephiroth stab his sword arm, directly in the shoulder joint. I dont care how strong you make cloud out to be, all the mako on earth isn't going to move an arm when the muscles that control that arm have been sliced.
So yah, Nomura can't tell a coherant or well written story to save his life. I've never seen one from him. I hope someday he'll pull it off. I loved FF once and would like to see the old girl return to her former glory. But I doubt Nomura is the man to do it.
His main character's are always the same. angsty moody swordsmen, sorry but after Sakaguchi who always came up with different themes and different types of leading characters, thats just awful. The one time he (nomura)went away from his leading male character mold was in KHI, and he immediately fell back into that mold for KHII. That shows a distinct lack of creativity. and of course theres his female characters. Two dimensional at the best of times would be a flowery compliment to his incompetence on how to write a female lead. And I still think he designs his females while watching soft core porn.
You may like this style, you may not value storytelling, or value it as much as flash, but to say that nomura has any talent is sheer delusion.
As for examples to my points, I've given them. I hardly feel like repeating myself.
P.S.
Spirits Within was infinitely better then AC. Not perfect, But still better written, plotted, directed, and animated.
I watch it on mute. It's pretty to look at, but I'd rather not try to kill any brain cells on trying to keep with the failing story. :razz:
That I can sort of agree with. I like the detail that went into some of the backdrops and other surrounding environments. There was a decent sense of creativity from the CGI artists (not mind blowing, but respectable) in that regard. But the animation made me laugh at times, it was so wooden at times I was wondering if I was watching a puppet show.Quote:
Originally Posted by Avarice-ness
You know, I agree with you a lot. So don't get me wrong. I really like Sakaguchi and the fact that Nobuo Uematsu is doing work for Mistwalker is absolutely awesome.
I don't really like the additions such as FF7:DoC, FFX-2, etc. But there has been some decent stuff in there. I do enjoy the KH series, and I don't really see anything wrong with it. But I guess you also have to understand that there's a lot of different people working with Nomura, and a lot of limitations that come in the industry, which need to be worked around.
However, the fact that all they seem to come out with are remakes (though I welcome them), does show they are slipping.
I guess my point was really that a lot of what you are saying is seemingly your opinion. I'm not really cool with people who just seem to criticize a lot of peoples work (that's in general), and impose it on others to feel the same way.
yeah i agree, story wasnt great but it was a decent enough movie:)Quote:
Originally Posted by sephiroth3991
Hi there all..first post here in the forums^^
Anyway, i wanted to give my toughts about the movie. For me...it was dissapointing. The story lacked plain and simple. Now of course i dont expect them to create a legendary epic in a 90-minutes movie but still, lower the action scenes and put more effort in to the story. Instead of such a damn long Bahamut fight, bridge the gap between FFVII and the film more. I've had a lot of discussions with my friend about this. He adores it...and he thinks i have too many expectations which is ''lame'' according to him. Well sorry...i dont know about you guys but if suddenly since almost 10 years the news arrives of a movie sequel of my favourite game ever complete with an absolutely awesome trailer(which showed Kadaj attacking Cloud and Cloud walkin in the church..short but very sweet..i found some of those scenes better than the actual scenes in the film itself) then i DO get pumped up. I DO expect a lot. Heck, Square Enix knows that FFVII is popular. Sure the action scenes are terrific, but i felt that it's all that. No story..just fight-scenes. Again, i found the Bahamut fight way too long. And then there's Sephiroth...it felt forced imho. Like: '' hey lets put Sephiroth in so everybody can drool over him again''. I love Sephiroth as a character. Heck he's my favourite character ever with Cloud. But it felt he was just there for show. I wanted more story. More bridging the gap from this and FFVII. Instead they come with 3 villains(which are really cool designed imo) that just come for ass-kickin. Sure, there was story..no doubt. But rather than all the Jenova/Mother stuff i wanted to know what all the characters were doing. Cloud is in the spotlight. Sure Tifa as well..but Cid.. Red XIII...Yuffie..Vincent..etc. all just in that way too long Bahamut scene. And i do agree with Loz being really dumb. When he said that line: ''You meenie'' i swear i wanted to kill him. What the hell is that for cheesy stupid line. Come on..at least you can make it sound more mature and realistic. And we know Loz is childish..but that line just ruins him totally imo. All in all i can talk hours about my dissapointments and the things i liked about the film. The film looked great(not as realistic as Spirits Within and anyone who disagrees go ahead..bite mexD), i really liked the rock music...and that scene where Kadaj sits down and looks up to Rufus and flashes of Sephi's face show up is awesome. But this wasn't what i expected. The oldest trailers had scenes that were so cool but eventually all left out from the final film. The story is lacking...i applaud Square Enix for making such a big step and continuing FFVII. I liked it overall..but when you look at the total package of story and character dedication..it lacked. I hope the Compilation of FFVII brings good stuff worthy of the FFVII name(unlike DoC which was really bad aside from the FMVs imo) and while AC wasn't terrible..it doesn't hold up to that name either. Luckily Crisis Core looks great so i just have to wait and see.
Hey, I watched film again and again. It is quite perfect and motive me to play FFVII again. When you played and beat FFVII, go to watch FFVII:AC....It is a super-duper combination trust me!!
Anyway, I watched the film's early version. So, if you ignore what I wrote, don't surprise, maybe they fix them in the final versions.
I see that, in the film a lot of low-frame points and weaker graphics (different than general graphics) like a PS2 CGI movie...For example, when Cloud rides Fenrir to catch Kadaj, Loz and Yazoo in the tunnel...When Cloud give a slash to Loz's motorcycle and blow it up, Loz's face is in very very bad quality graphics...Am I wrong? So, maybe they fix it eh?
Anyway, I find some stupidity in AC:
1) Why Rufus have a eye-band? Near the end, we saw that Rufus' eye is healthy? It's so ridiculous...
2) How Kadaj hug Jenova's head and turn-out Sephiroth? Why Loz or Yazoo didn't do this? OR, what if Loz and Yazoo were still alive? How can they turn-out Sephiroth? A three-silver haired man combination-and Jenova's head=Super Sephiroth (or like my nickname Great Sephiroth:p )??
That's all for now...
p.s:Amin_strife, we have same avatars;)
That's what I thought his movie was, a piece of turd. I was looking forward to it, thinking it would be similar to Spirits Within (not graphically) but in terms of quality. No, none, at all. Didn't much care for the plot. It was alright but the last twenty minutes simply killed it. I know it's set in the final fantasy world but the last bit looked so ridiculous on film it was ridiculous. Some things work in movies, some do not. So many final fantasy fans hated Spirits Within because it was nothing like final fantasy. Simple because there were no chocobos, moogles, magic powers or anything of the sort they didn't recognize it as final fantasy. It was, at it's core final fantasy. Characters/plot are final fantasyesc. If you took away materia from Final Fantasy Seven the plot, for the most part would be exactly the same. The story does need those things but GAMEPLAY does.
I give Advent Children 3/10
I'd give it 120%. Amazing. Great story line. Although It would maybe be hard to understand quite a bit if you hadn't played the game.
I thought visually the movie was brilliant. the camera angles and scenery were both great but i did find the story hard to understand proberly because i havent play FFVII.
the movie was great. Something more for all of us who loved the game. I agree the flow of the movie is not that good and you have to read alot on the internet to find out alot of what they dont tell you. But look at how long they took to do it and how well they did it. It left me wanting more which we may never get but i give it a 9/10
This film is worth nothing to me without the action scenes
The game was awesome and the movie was awsome! loved it! XD
Awesome, tho i didn't care much about the story :D I just watched it for the awesome graphics and battle scenes for the first maybe 10 times :$ Altogether, I think I've watched it around 30 times now.
9/10
It is an amazing film i love it, they should bring it out on Blu-ray as that would make it all the more impressive!!
I can't wait to watch the Complete Blu-Ray verison :D
I have only started playing VII and never finished it, but this movie motivated me to play through the game. I do understand the negative critisism it gets, but at the end of the day I really just see it as a great, geeky and brilliant fanservice. And I love it for what it is.
its awesome
i lurve it, but i do wish there was more avalanche scenes and less emo cloud and yazoo, loz and kadaj have to much screen time, so do Reno and Rude, i love them and all but come on! AVALANCHE before Turks please
man im tired of people calling cloud emo hes not emo hes not in all black clouthing and black eye lineer with lipstick on he dosent look like he followes mcr around like there the dead or some thing people say clouds emo why becase hes not runing around all COME ON GUYS WE CAN DO IT IF WE WORK TOGETHER AND GIVE ME A BIG FING GAY HUG! just becase the mans not runing around shouting rainbows out his a## like some video game heros that makes him emo come on im sick of hering people say clouds emo not every one is a big happy littel fruit cup some people are the strong silent type not emo and whats the obession with being happy all the time any way all i ever here is have a good day and i say good luck at that :cool:
amazing
I think he uses Organics a lot more and maybe Yoshiyuki.Quote:
Originally Posted by Necron
It took me about a billion watches to figure what the hell was going on, and it just got worse and worse as I saw more of it. Way too rushed and poorly...everythinged.
I have never played the game, but I liked the movie AND understood the plot.
(SPOILER)So Cloud and Tifa have retired from the hero business and are working for the postal service. This is right around the time a disease called Geostigma afflicts children, specifically ones living on the streets. This organization rises up and gains the affected kids' favor by promising a cure and has them join up to fight for them. Also, the silver haired guy is apparently some shell that was used in order to bring back Sephiroth. Cloud and Sephy duel epicly, and then there is a rainstorm that cures the disease.
(SPOILER)It's the great gospel, Aeris' limit break
I really am enjoying the ACC version more than I did the original. The added 30 minutes of scenes definitely added to the overall awesomeness of the movie. Cloud definitely does not get through the Seph fight unscathed, he gets messed up pretty bad for a moment.
Mhmm. And they give no explanation of how any of this works. Probably the most important part of the film and there's bugger all explaining it. That is not a well written story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfen