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that big :skull::skull::skull::skull:-eating grin i made when i first got triple raid at nine years old is why Chrono Trigger will always be #1 in my book
no video game has ever made me feel like an unstoppable miasma of death and destruction after that...especially when i got the rest of the triple-techs and luminaire
Not a bad list, though I feel Chrono Trigger should get top spot for what it does as a game and as a narrative. Not that I don't love VI it's just CT is easily my favorite game of all time.
Other than that...
Praise:
Lufia 2, Lunar 1 and 2, Wild ARMS, Suikoden II, FFIX and BoFIII
Top 25 was mostly good
Like Laddy, I feel it's a good mix of WRPG and JRPGs
FFTactics Advance and Ogre Battle March of the Black Queen got on the list, and were ranked decently.
Got most of my top favorite games on there.
Scold:
Some of the rankings are off, P3, P4, and Vagrant Story should both be much higher on the list, FFIV and Wild ARMS should probably be lower despite my love for both of them.
Snubbed Valkyrie Profile (despite not liking the game, it deserves a mention) Shin Megami Tensei III, KH: Birth By Sleep, BoFIV, and Suikoden III and V. Not to mention FFV.
I honestly don't feel KH2 belongs on this list, same with FFVIII
I will echo Bolivar and say I am not too keen on the idea of MMOs being on this list, but sadly I can't come up with a good enough reason to disqualify them without it also pertaining to a third of the list.
I won't let you die alone from the torch burns and pitchfork stabs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Polnareff
I like Chrono Trigger. I like it a lot, actually. It's music, artwork, plot scope, cast, and combat animations all kicked a lot of ass. But there's a good deal of games that kicked just a little bit more. At least for me.
And no, it's not one of those "you didn't play it at the time" things. Dragon Quest V is older, but it's at the tippy top with the rest of my faves. CT isn't. Actually, it probably is one of those "you didn't play it at the time" things, because if you weren't 8-years old when it blew your brains, it probably just won't resonate as hard for you.
Yeah pretty much. FFVI and CT as 1 and 2 are spot on! Pokemon also shouldn't be denied since it has influenced and entire generation of gamers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivi22
This list makes me want to play Baldur's Gate II now since it's one that has slipped me by.
The Persona games sure have a strong following at this forum! I'm playing P3P right now and honestly I don't get what all the hype is about. I'd say they are appropriately ranked.
Do it. I'm like a Jehovah's Witness handing out pamphlets with this game and I do it for a reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Miriel
I'll bite, since I haven't had a decent debate in ages.
Well for one thing, Toriyama was a relative unknown outside of Japan (the original Dragon Ball was canceled in NA due to low ratings the very year Chrono Trigger was released) and yet the game still did surprisingly well across the Pacific. I mean DBZ wouldn't become super popular for three more years after Chrono Trigger was released when Cartoon Network picked up Toriyama's magnum opus series, so I doubt the Toriyama art was the only appealing factor in the West.Quote:
Originally Posted by Polnareff
Second, I really can't think of a game that really allowed you to screw around with time travel in a gameplay experience as well as CT did it. While I may agree that Live A Live has some interesting gameplay elements for the "different time period schtick" you are missing the point of what Chrono Trigger did differently which was the ability to start altering the world with your choices. Most of the finals quests and final character story arcs involve traveling back and forth through time to change the course of history for you party's needs and it's this freedom that is important, not just the fact I can go to the future and go to the Medeval times. It's the reward element of your choices that make the game standout, but it was also tied together with a good story where you slowly begin to see how everything is interconnected to each other. It also popularized New Game+ mode and has done multiple endings pretty well, so it has lots of replay value.
Is it easy? Yes, but most JRPGs around this time are, because the developers don't want that pesky Game Over screen to discourage players from enjoying the stories they were writing. Thoughj I feel the true challenge of Chronot Trigger wasn't the battles, but rather exploring the world and finding all the ways you can affect the game with your choices and the game did a pretty good job of that until the internet came along and killed the "joy of discovery".
Is it short? Not really... it's a 30-40 hour game which is pretty standard for most JRPGs. Of anything the game has lots of replay value which sets it apart from most JRPGs.
Meh, while I feel DQV was a great DQ game, I never felt it was special. So I guess once again we're on the opposing side of the fence. I honestly feel I would have appreciated DQV more had I played it back when it was initially released. It was a good game, a great DQ title, but I certainly didn't change my list of RPGs to accommodate it cause the game failed to be nothing more than a typical DQ title with a few really good standout moments and ideas. To each their own I guess. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Bolivar
Twice I've played FFVI and twice I've yet to finish it and have always had no problem putting the game down and doing something else, which to me means the list doesn't fit my personal perspective (and for true internet form, this means it is WRONG WRONG WRONG OMG WTF MAN etc.). But oh well, I like reading over lists like these anyway.
And dammit, I'll finish FFVI eventually. I only have a couple of espers to get and probably a few levels and then I can do the final dungeon and be done with it.
smurfing slack BoB :greenie:
Not my fault the game doesn't keep making me crawl back to it like most FF's do. The thing that really makes me want to finish it is knowing that once I do, I will be playing FFIX, which I'm pretty excited about.
Just ribbin' ya :greenie:
For some reason that just sounds dirty.
Wolf, if anyone was going to get offended and actually respond to CT hate, it's YOU!!!!
First, I don't think Polnareff meant the Toriyama art drew people in because it was popular. I think it drew people in because it was awesome. DBZ may have been cancelled that year, but anime sure was becoming popular at the time. I don't think 8-year olds really cared who the artist was.
And no, CT does not have an upward playtime of 40 hours. It takes roughly 30-35 hours to do everything that's in the game. Playstation 1 + 2 era games take 30-35 hours just to finish the main story. At a minimum.
Lastly, whether or not DQV changed your list is not the issue. The issue is that you can't make a list of the best RPGs with CT in the top ten without having FFVII, Xenogears, Final Fantasy Tactics, and, if they know their ish, Tactics Ogre ahead of them.
Speaking of games people overrate because they were 8-years old when it released:
Similar, I couldn't bring myself to continue on in FFVI the first time I played it. Admittedly, it's probably because it didn't live up to the hype of the RPG fans who insist that it's better than all my favorite games. I've beaten FFVI about 2-3 times since and while it does have those big "FF moments" that make the series so memorable, I just can't imagine it being so highly rated if it weren't for the fact that it was one of the few big, popular JRPGs to be released in the West at the time. In Japan, where they've played the FF series as it was developed, FFVI does not have the same legacy that it does over here. Better technology, larger teams, and bolder ideas led to better games being developed in the PlayStation 1 + 2 era. And IMO DQV, FFV, and Tactics Ogre are much better SNES RPGs.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoB
Also, you don't need an excuse to play FFIX!
where's evony
you ((.)(.)) can ((.)(.)) play it ((.)(.)) SECRETLY ((.)(.)) at ((.)(.)) WORK ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Levian
so they can't talk ((.)(.)) about it publicly :(
((.)(.))
Well yes, it's like you being the only person who responds to VII being overrated It is cause you're a fanboy just as I am for CT. :p Still, it's fun teasing you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolivar
Well, seeing how I actually owned an SNES and played CT back in 95, I can tell you that most magazines I read and guys I talked to in school about CT never really mentioned the art style beyond a "Hey, it's cool" we were all more focused on the dual techs, time traveling, and meaningful choices, you know the actual gameplay unlike the Sony era 8-year olds who just liked flashy graphics to sell a game. I mean the VII commercials never even showed gameplay. It just allured fans through the most shallow of reasons cause only kids would care if something looked cool. ;)Quote:
First, I don't think Polnareff meant the Toriyama art drew people in because it was popular. I think it drew people in because it was awesome. DBZ may have been cancelled that year, but anime sure was becoming popular at the time. I don't think 8-year olds really cared who the artist was.
Wait, what was that I mentioned earlier? New Game+ and multiple endings? You can do everything in only 30 hours despite all of that being locked until New Game+? Don't think so, not to forget all the choices that do change the game world which allows you to mix and match what can unfold in the timestream. I'm sorry, none of that sounds like something that can be done in a mere 30 hours when I have so many reasons to replay the game unlike most of the Sony RPGs later that just tell linear stories.Quote:
And no, CT does not have an upward playtime of 40 hours. It takes roughly 30-35 hours to do everything that's in the game. Playstation 1 + 2 era games take 30-35 hours just to finish the main story. At a minimum.
I'm actually surprised you mentioned Xenogears in that list since you also dubbed it as overrated and a lacking game. So I figured you would be happy with it's ranking. Honestly, I wouldn't mind dropping Fallout 3 and WoW and putting Tactics and VII into the top Ten. I still haven't gottn around to Tactics Ogre, it's been sitting in my to-do pile of games for a year now.Quote:
Lastly, whether or not DQV changed your list is not the issue. The issue is that you can't make a list of the best RPGs with CT in the top ten without having FFVII, Xenogears, Final Fantasy Tactics, and, if they know their ish, Tactics Ogre ahead of them.
You mean like FFVII?Quote:
Speaking of games people overrate because they were 8-years old when it released:
BoB, we've already determined that you are a basket case cause you actually feel FFXIII is a great game, so I am simply going to ignore all of this.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoB
As I said last time you brought this up, I feel your issue comes from both waiting to play the game last and thus allowing the hype to overblow your expectations, which is why this game would never have lived up to your standards.Quote:
Similar, I couldn't bring myself to continue on in FFVI the first time I played it. Admittedly, it's probably because it didn't live up to the hype of the RPG fans who insist that it's better than all my favorite games. I've beaten FFVI about 2-3 times since and while it does have those big "FF moments" that make the series so memorable, I just can't imagine it being so highly rated if it weren't for the fact that it was one of the few big, popular JRPGs to be released in the West at the time. In Japan, where they've played the FF series as it was developed, FFVI does not have the same legacy that it does over here. Better technology, larger teams, and bolder ideas led to better games being developed in the PlayStation 1 + 2 era. And IMO DQV, FFV, and Tactics Ogre are much better SNES RPGs.
Second, this is an American list of 100 Best RPGs so god knows we don't give a trout what the Japanese gamers feel, I mean they think FFX is the best game in the world, so god knows I don't trust their opinion.
If you want reasoning for why VI deserves to be in the top ten, I pretty much clarified it in these posts:
http://home.eyesonff.com/final-fanta...ml#post3092240
http://home.eyesonff.com/general-squ...ml#post3047342
I know you're issue with the game is due to overblown hype and the viscous VI vs VII blood feud so I don't really expect for you to appreciate the games true strength, but whatever. I'm pretty sure BoB is in the same boat, though I am also sure it's cause his game style preference is heavy linear storytelling so VI's open-endedness and lacking a strong lead for an ensemble cast is also an issue for him.
Yeah I agree, BoB get to work on that.Quote:
Also, you don't need an excuse to play FFIX!