Final Fantasy 7 FIRST ending parties

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Originally Posted by Raistlin

Vincent sucks, really; he's almost as bad as Cait Sith. I'm surprised at the amount of people that used him up till Sephiroth.

My party:

Cloud
Tifa
Cid

With Magic Plus materia on Cid(summoner), that party owns.

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Vincent DOES NOT SUCK! If he did... then how was I able to defeat Sephy with him solo without materia and with his first weapon and armour? He has the best magic defense. Just always have sadness on him and place him in the backrow and he will be the super surviveor. Also, if Vincent kill enough and have Death penalty and has high level and stats his Hellmasker can became a real killer machine. He can do a 5-cut for 9999 damage each hit!!!!!!!

My Party on first play was:
Cloud, Ragnarok, Meteorrain and no materia that a chocobo is reqiered to get.
Vincent, Something else than Death penalty, Hellmasker and no materia that a chocobo is reqiered to get.
Tifa, God hand, All but Final Heaven and no materia that a chocobo is reqiered to get.

First off: the facts. Vincent statistically sucks more than any other character. Here's why:

If you go psycho-level up and max out everyone's stats, they're all equal, right? Nope. They're all equal except two people: Vincent and Cait Sith. Why? Because they have crappy limits. Limit breaks is my defining point in picking party members, because everything else can be enhanced.

Now, you most likely won't go psycho level-up, in which case Vincent still sucks, because his limit break still sucks. And if you really don't want to level up much at all, Vincent sucks even more because Death Penalty sucks unless you're willing to put in the time.

Either way you go(psycho level-up or no level up), you can do much better than Vincent.

facts are facts, but Vincent's badass and u no it. he's just...cool to have, and his limit is different...

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Originally Posted by Raistlin

First off: the facts. Vincent statistically sucks more than any other character. Here's why:

If you go psycho-level up and max out everyone's stats, they're all equal, right? Nope. They're all equal except two people: Vincent and Cait Sith. Why? Because they have crappy limits. Limit breaks is my defining point in picking party members, because everything else can be enhanced.

Now, you most likely won't go psycho level-up, in which case Vincent still sucks, because his limit break still sucks. And if you really don't want to level up much at all, Vincent sucks even more because Death Penalty sucks unless you're willing to put in the time.

Either way you go(psycho level-up or no level up), you can do much better than Vincent.

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Vincent stands in backline and have sadness= He takes about 30% damage from all psychical attacks AND less damage from ALL attacks. His Death Gigas is godly in early game. He has very good magic defens and magic attack. While two of your partymembers slay with their limit, Vincent can stand back, heal (his magic is powerful) and survive (sadness+backrow+good magic defense= very hard to kill.)

never thought of it that way...good point

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Originally Posted by Jayren

Cait Sith, Yuffie and Aeris.

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Huh?

oh and my first party.....lets see that was back in 1998....might not remember.....oh yeah it was:

Cloud- level 68 Ultima Weapon....uh...Omnislash
Barret- level 69 Missing Score and uh ungarmax
Cid- level 57 Venus Gospel and Dragon Dive

i wasnt that good back then, didnt really know that much about it, but now i am God

Cloud, Ultima Weapon, Omnislash
Cid, Venus Gospel, Highwind
Vincent, Death Penalty, Chaos

All my characters had the Master Magic materia and were around level 85.

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Originally Posted by Ultima Shadow

Vincent stands in backline and have sadness= He takes about 30% damage from all psychical attacks AND less damage from ALL attacks. His Death Gigas is godly in early game. He has very good magic defens and magic attack. While two of your partymembers slay with their limit, Vincent can stand back, heal (his magic is powerful) and survive (sadness+backrow+good magic defense= very hard to kill.)

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He also has THE crappiest limit break in the game. It might be somewhat useful early on, but later his limits aren't worth it since he can't use materia.
Magic can be altered(magic plus materia and/or sources). Magic power's his sole benefit early-on(especially with healing), but later his lack of damage because of no good limit is just too much.

Fact: every other part of a character(defense, attack power, magic power, etc.) can be improved except one: limit breaks. Since Vincent has a sucky limit break, he's just not worth it. Especially since you can get the Magic Plus materia early on(very beginning of disc 2), and it's pretty easy to master.

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Originally Posted by Raistlin

He also has THE crappiest limit break in the game. It might be somewhat useful early on, but later his limits aren't worth it since he can't use materia.
Magic can be altered(magic plus materia and/or sources). Magic power's his sole benefit early-on(especially with healing), but later his lack of damage because of no good limit is just too much.

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As I said earlier, if you have killed enough enemies the Death Penalty will do 9999 dammage and the Hellmaskers splatter combo will do 9999X5= 50,000 dammage each round. I don't know if you can berserk him to make him only do splatter combo but either way Nigthmare is rarer. Also Vincents stats is boosted when he's transformed to Hellmasker and Chaos. The Beast will raise his HP by 1/3 or something and Death Gigas will DOUBLE his HP. If he's good in early game, then he don't sux. If a character is bad in early game but god in later, then I don't think he's much better than anyone who is god in early but bad in the later. Vincent is not GOD in early game but DOES NOT SUX in later either. And don't forget the free fullcure when he use a limit break

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Originally Posted by Raistlin

Fact: every other part of a character(defense, attack power, magic power, etc.) can be improved except one: limit breaks. Since Vincent has a sucky limit break, he's just not worth it. Especially since you can get the Magic Plus materia early on(very beginning of disc 2), and it's pretty easy to master.

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Magic Plus Materia boosts MP not the magic stat. And you can get it first time in Cosmo Canyon.

Hmmmm... this is going off topic.

Cloud - Ultimate weapon - Finishing Touch
Barret - Missin' Score - Catastrophe
Yuffie - Conformer - Gauntlet

Don't ever use Tifa :eek:

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Originally Posted by Ultima Shadow

As I said earlier, if you have killed enough enemies the Death Penalty will do 9999 dammage and the Hellmaskers splatter combo will do 9999X5= 50,000 dammage each round.

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Yep. But during that time, you can't use materia. Which really sucks in Vincent's your healer(which is apparently what most people use him for).

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I don't know if you can berserk him to make him only do splatter combo but either way Nigthmare is rarer. Also Vincents stats is boosted when he's transformed to Hellmasker and Chaos. The Beast will raise his HP by 1/3 or something and Death Gigas will DOUBLE his HP. If he's good in early game, then he don't sux. If a character is bad in early game but god in later, then I don't think he's much better than anyone who is god in early but bad in the later. Vincent is not GOD in early game but DOES NOT SUX in later either. And don't forget the free fullcure when he use a limit break.

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But again, he can't use materia. Waste.

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Magic Plus Materia boosts MP not the magic stat. And you can get it first time in Cosmo Canyon.

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*buzzer* Wrong. I said Magic Plus, not MP Plus. And you can get it(only once) on the way to Icicle Village at the very start of Disc 2. Starting off, it boosts the Magic stat 10%(50% when mastered). This materia basically voids magic power as a qualifier for who you select to be in your party.

Bottom line: Vincent's alright in Disc 1, but blows later in the game. His limits aren't worth it since he can't use materia, and his magic ability doesn't matter since you can increase anyone's with the Magic Plus materia.

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Hmmmm... this is going off topic.

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So? This is better than the original "discussion."

Well, I will suport Vincent no matter what. :D
The Magic Plus must have been something I eiher have forgot or never got. But if it boost % then that means that the higer the orginal amount of Magic, the higher the boosted amount.
However, Why use materia when you simply do 50,000 dammage per combo. If you mean KotR then it's more powerfull than most limit breaks any way and that means that you only need to use it and no limits at all. As for the healing and suport stuff... if you use him for that then only use him for that because that's one of the things that he does the best (it's more important to survive than to do major limmitbreak dammage). Also if you'r to lazy to max out all the stats, then Vincent is the best magic man (you want to know a secret? Quadra Comet2 + high magic IS better than many of the limitbreaks).

Magic stat maxes out at 255. Once you equip a mastered Magic Plus to anyone, they're at that, if not damn close. Either way, once it gets that high, it hardly makes much of a difference.

Anyway, by "using materia" I mean healing. Most people that use Vincent talk about his vaunted magic skill, and use him as a healer. While he's under that limit, that means that your designated healer can't heal, which sucks. And if you take all worthwhile materia off of Vincent before a battle so that this won't harm yourself too much, not only will your other two characters seriously be overloaded(and probably have to unequip a few materia of their own), but Vincent will suck even more when he's not in a transformation.

cloud, cid, and vincent. i thought he was supposed to be hard, but knights of the round killed safer sephiroth in one hit.

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Originally Posted by Raistlin

Magic stat maxes out at 255. Once you equip a mastered Magic Plus to anyone, they're at that, if not damn close. Either way, once it gets that high, it hardly makes much of a difference.

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Yea, if the characters is at lvl 99. Ok, Vincent is absolutly not the most powerfull character in the game. But he's not the most useless either (Cat site is). In the later game, have healing + suport materia AND that Quadra linked to Comet2 combo. When he don't need to heal, then cast Comet2 4 times (with 255magic stat it's uber powerfull). As long as the partys HP not reach over 5000-6000, Vincents Death Gigas will be usefull thanks to the doubled HP. And you CAN have any other character as healer when Vincents Hellmasker goes 50,000 splatter combo rush. In that chase you'll have an 50,000 dammage per combo rusher + an healer who can also use limmit break witout ruining everything. AND Vincents limmit breaks is not effected by the row so you can keep the Hellmasker in the back row and he will still do 9999 per hit.

nik0tine, with KotR everything is easy.