You're Wrong!

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Originally Posted by DJZen

Maybe not in your eyes. To me the only way to make this thread not stupid is to lighten the mood. Forgive me for thinking that.

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You shouldn't feel the need to help make this thread less "stupid". Your not really contributing anything to this thread if you don’t post your opinion on an FF game (which I clearly stated in my first post)

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Originally Posted by RedCydranth

Alexander, the point of this entire thread is to prove everyone else wrong, no matter how correct they are. Or at least thats the way I intrepreted it. So, giving up on this conversation is WRONG! LOL.

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Err, that wasn't really my intent...the idea of this thread is for someone to post their opinion on what they think was poorly done in an FF game, and see whether they are wrong on some or all of their points. The idea is for people to get a better idea of the difference between what was actually flawed in the game, and what they personally didn’t like about the game. There’s not really any point in arguing something that is clearly true…

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Originally Posted by theoryonlyworksintheory

Ok, I think ff8 had a wonderful plot with as many plot holes as any of the other games, and i think the characters where the most realistic (not like most characters in ff9 Quina Eiko Steiner..., and they did to try to develop Irvine. End of disc 1 his big pressure shot.

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Uh? As many plot holes as any other games? The other games don't have a evil sorceress pooping out of nowhere, with no background, and trying to compress the world for no real reason.
Realistic characters? Duh? I'd prefer totally non-realistic characters if they had some development. Like FFIX. And they DID NOT try to develop Irvine. He just didn't want to shot Edea because the GFs didn't erase his memory. Oh. GF erasing memories... SO forced... and everyone in your team bar Rinoa were from the same orphanage and didn't remeber that because of them... OOOH SO FORCED T______T'''

(Yes, I answered. Just to prove this guy wrong. But that another conversation is dead. *buries it* u.u)

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Originally Posted by ThroneofDravaris

You shouldn't feel the need to help make this thread less "stupid". Your not really contributing anything to this thread if you don’t post your opinion on an FF game (which I clearly stated in my first post)

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Your wrong!!!
Ahem...sorry-couldnt resist it.

Thought of another really annoying thing. Playing as a character only to find they wont join your team. It really annoyed me when in viii Edea joined your team for ten minutes and then buggered off. I thought i'd get to keeep her. Or with General Leo in vi...why the hell did he have to die? IN the same game, you start as Celes...alone...my weakest character who i never used. Took me ages to gt my team back together.

Ive only just realsied this when playing vii and not realising Aeria was going to die. She was one of my strongest characters dammit. In viii when you lose Rinoa for a whole disk-again one of my strongest characters. Its annoying. I dont care about the storyline give me Aeris back!

what's the background behind Jenova? Ultemecia came from the future and i admit she doesn't have much of a background but neither do lots of other characters from ff's. The characters are developed probably the most developed from any ff. ff9, who developed... vivi, and zidane?

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Originally Posted by theoryonlyworksintheory

what's the background behind Jenova? Ultemecia came from the future and i admit she doesn't have much of a background but neither do lots of other characters from ff's. The characters are developed probably the most developed from any ff. ff9, who developed... vivi, and zidane?

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Vivi, Zidane, Dagger, Steiner, Eiko, Beatrix, and Kuja.

Who is developed in FFVIII? Squall, Rinoa, Seifer (sort of) and Laguna. At least in FFIX, the villain is developed.

Zell, Quistis, Irvine and Selphie ARE NOT developed.

And, yeah, Jenova doesn't have much of a background, but she is not the main villain, Sephiroth is.

How is vivi and etc. developed?

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Originally Posted by theoryonlyworksintheory

How is vivi and etc. developed?

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Ehr.

Vivi = He has a huge development. At first he doesn't know what he is, and why he looks like the mass produced Black Mages. Then, when he goes to Black Mage Village, he discovers he is made like the other Black Mages, and that he will eventually stop moving. If you say Vivi is not developed, you are officially one of those FFVIIItards of my quote, in my signature. u.u

Zidane = He starts normally, self-trusting, hits all girls, yeah. But he starts to notice he is truly in love with Dagger. In Disc 3, when she becomes a queen, he himself says he can't live without her anymore. But his true development comes when Garland tells him he is a Genome, he was made to be Gaia's angel of death, and he is Kuja's "brother". Everyone makes him see that he is not alone, he never was, and he was protected while he protected everyone. He is well developed, don't negate that.

Dagger = She changed. A LOT. Her personality was VERY developed throughout the game. Unlike certain characters from FFVIII that are the same crap the whole game. She tried to do something on her own, she wanted to prove she is not only a princess. She tried to be independent. She was different. Even if she weren't well-developed, her personality alone would manage.

The other aren't as developed, but Steiner, Beatrix and Eiko have a nice development. They change the ways of thinking, and such.

If you still are not satisfied... well, I could send a detailed PM. But I will not do that until YOU answer ME how the characters from FFVIII are developed.

well that's 3 just like ff8 and i think Zidane is very forced as a character and not believable.
(i just like arguing and making controversy!)

Prove me wrong and show me how developed the characters from FFVIII bar Squall, Rinoa and Laguna are. XD

Zell has to come to terms that he's in orphan granted that's a very small change, Quistis has to let go of Squall.Edea changes alot through the game and has to live with her actions when she was possessed and even fujin and raijin change alittle and become more mature by the end of the game.

And Selphie and Irvine?

Plus, Edea wasn't developed. She just changed because Ultimecia wasn't in her anymore. And Fujin and Raijin don't change. Raijin said they are with Seifer. Always. So, if they seem more mature, that's because Seifer changed.

And Zell's change was so minimal that doesn't even count. IIRC he didn't even get sad.

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Originally Posted by Alexander

And Selphie and Irvine?

Plus, Edea wasn't developed. She just changed because Ultimecia wasn't in her anymore. And Fujin and Raijin don't change. Raijin said they are with Seifer. Always. So, if they seem more mature, that's because Seifer changed.

And Zell's change was so minimal that doesn't even count. IIRC he didn't even get sad.

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I think what people fail to understand about the supporting playable characters in FF8 is that all of them, save Quistis, are mainly designed to add comic relief to the game. Zell is the outspoken, over energetic, testosterone pumped moron; Selphie is the sweet, happy-go-lucky yet psychopathic teenage girl and Irvine is the visually appeasing sexual deviant. None of these characters were supposed to provide any serious depth to the game, so should really be considered in the same manner that Quina is in FF9. Quistis, being a more serious character, is developed to a certain extent. Unfortunately, due to the early appearance of Rinoa in the game, all of her development had to be dealt literally in the first few hours of gameplay. There is brief evidence later that she has changed, but since it is no longer of relevance to the game it is only mentioned in passing. Fujin and Raijin do change towards the end of the game, they realize that no matter how important it was to maintain there “posse”, it wasn’t worth becoming what Seifer had turned into. As for Edea, even though she didn’t really change her personality, I think the tragedy of what had fallen upon her made her far more interesting than anything she ‘learned’ from the experience. The whole “Sacrificing herself in order to keep Ultimecia away from her orphans” thing made her at least a very virtuous character. Headmaster Cid may not have been the most interesting character (unless you count his uncanny resemblance to Robin Williams), yet he too was developed quite significantly during the game. He starts as the usually “authority” figure, but then you begin to realize that he has no real power over the Garden. I found his reasons for creating Garden most interesting, as was his dealings with Gardenmaster Norg. Character development doesn’t necessarily involve the characters changing (e.g. all of the characters in The Glass Menagerie, Shinji Ikari in Evangelion etc.), it sometime just means an examination of a character’s background.

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Originally Posted by Alexander

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Originally Posted by theoryonlyworksintheory

How is vivi and etc. developed?

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Ehr.

Vivi = He has a huge development. At first he doesn't know what he is, and why he looks like the mass produced Black Mages. Then, when he goes to Black Mage Village, he discovers he is made like the other Black Mages, and that he will eventually stop moving. If you say Vivi is not developed, you are officially one of those FFVIIItards of my quote, in my signature. u.u

Zidane = He starts normally, self-trusting, hits all girls, yeah. But he starts to notice he is truly in love with Dagger. In Disc 3, when she becomes a queen, he himself says he can't live without her anymore. But his true development comes when Garland tells him he is a Genome, he was made to be Gaia's angel of death, and he is Kuja's "brother". Everyone makes him see that he is not alone, he never was, and he was protected while he protected everyone. He is well developed, don't negate that.

Dagger = She changed. A LOT. Her personality was VERY developed throughout the game. Unlike certain characters from FFVIII that are the same crap the whole game. She tried to do something on her own, she wanted to prove she is not only a princess. She tried to be independent. She was different. Even if she weren't well-developed, her personality alone would manage.

The other aren't as developed, but Steiner, Beatrix and Eiko have a nice development. They change the ways of thinking, and such.

If you still are not satisfied... well, I could send a detailed PM. But I will not do that until YOU answer ME how the characters from FFVIII are developed.

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Zidane: Developed? Complete crap! Yeah you heard me. The love between him and Dagger wasnt emphasised enough. When he was told he was a genome (way into the game might i add) we had no information into what he was feeling. Square had great potential into giving us information into what he could have been like, but there was nothing. Basically, they didnt build on any feeling he had. One scene where he is told he was a genome, one scene when we see him fall in love with Garret and then thats it. Nothing else after it. He falls in love...yeah, but does that give us any insight to his character? (arguings fun)

Vivi: Yup...i agree (dammit...). He was the most developed in the game, but only to the standard i came to expect to final fantasy. To me it seemed that vivi would have made a better main character rather than Zidane because we understand his feelings and his character.

Garret: Erm...yes and no. Something tells me you really hate viii...Garret was independent....yes it showed that throughout the story, but she was so plastic. I felt no emotion at all to her. She had no personality. We see her relationship with her mother, her travelling with Zidane unwillingly and then falling in love with him, her belief that she could do something to change the world. And after all that no emotion. No personality and no feelings.

Abotu Zidane. Hey, what was that part of the game, when "You're Not Alone" plays? Just three fights with no reason? No. Zidane's feelings about being a Genome WERE shown, in that part.

yea, that's not what i said. His characters dialogue always seemed cheesy to me, beginning of 3 disc whenever he's in the bar proclaiming his love for Garnet....that always makes me laugh.