Your arguments are baseless...It is ADVENTURE
If you can’t understand the difference between a point-and-click game and an adventure game, then you shouldn’t be arguing about them. Your arguments are weak and have no basis, nor do they cite sources for their defenses. Now, let’s go through each one and see where exactly you are mistaken, mmmmmmkay?
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
If it is simplier for you to process, please replace every mention I make of "Point & Click" with "Point & Click Adventure Game", mmmkay?
Like I stated above, adventure games and point-and-click games are not the same thing. You can keep telling yourself they are if you want to support the foundations of your belief in yourself, but that doesn’t change the truth at all. Not only are point-and-click games different from adventure games, but “Point-and-Click Adventure Games” are also very different from actual ‘adventure’ games. The main implication of point-and-click games is that “software interfaces can be controlled solely through the mouse, with little or no input from keyboard.” By this definition, we can issue a blanket statement which would be misleading: strategy games are not point-and-click games, nor are adventure games after the early 1990’s.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Please, would you care to tell me where I said that any of the games you cited previously were text adventure? What I said was that the Point & Click genre was an evolution of the text adventure genre.
Ok, let me see if I can get you to comprehend this (we tried this in one of my psychology classes, it’s called “step functioning.”)
The point-and-click genre WAS an evolution of the text adventure. Following the point-and-click genre, there was a second evolution. (You aren’t lost yet are you? Mmmmkay) That evolution, was called, ADVENTURE games. Like I stated above, you can keep telling yourself that King’s Quest or Gabriel Knight or whatever else you can think of is a point-and-click game, but it is simply erroneous. They are adventure games, and differ greatly in complexity and actual interactivity with the related point-and-click genre, and even less with the text adventure genre.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Ever play Zork? It was text adveture game realeased many a moon ago.
Okay, following me to this point?
As time passed, graphics were introduced to many of these games.
Hence we reach games such as the initial Kings Quest, which is essentially just a text adventure with graphics.
Here is where your logic deteriorates even further. I think I know now what your problem is and why you cannot understand the concept of the modern adventure game, which by the way began after the early 1990’s. You are in what we call your “comfort zone,” where you’ve been accustomed to grouping gaming genres in your own little system, regardless of whether or not it is accepted in the general gaming community. To even state relate King’s Quest to the text adventure genre is ludicirous, and I believe you may even be fibbing when you say you have played this game. Ok, got that? Now, once the text adventure genre was done away with, point and click games came into being such as the INITIAL Monkey Island or King’s Quest. You seem to be stuck in this “point-and click” phase, kind of like someone stuck in the 1980’s and refuses to acknowledge any other developments in music.
As stated before, following this point-and-click genre, true adventure games which involved more than pointing and clicking, more than just basic “text adventure puzzles with graphics,” were released and a new genre was born. This is something acknowledged as fact, and I still have a hard time believing that you actually defend some established adventure games as if they were “point-and-clickers.”
Are you following the progress so far? I know it’s tough but hang in there. (Your misconceptions have to be crushed before you can establish the true ones).
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Many people at this time expressed their frustration with this verbal based system of exploration.
You still with me? This part is especially important!
A system was pioneered (for which Sierra is often credited), whereby people could play through such games using a graphical interface. Instead of spending half an hour trying to find the right word for an action, all they had to do was POINT & CLICK!
(Note: I'm actually old enough to have lived through 90% of this.)[/color]
Aww, he’s using italics and bold, how cute! You know, I often do the same thing when I want to emphasize a weak argument. Now, as far as Sierra goes, I am well aware of their history as Sierra On-Line, up to the point when they were dismantled by Vivendi.
You erroneously relate a game function with its title. Yes, you can point and click in many of Sierra’s ADVENTURE games, but they are not of the “point-and-click” genre. Just like many RPG’s have “turn-based combat” but they are not CALLED TURN BASED GAMES. Got that? Good. Now, I hope you can see how your logic here is completely fallacious and baseless. I hope you’ve been paying attention, because now we’re really getting somewhere. Let’s move on.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
And it still is, when you refer to those kind of games. Are you going to tell me that Syberia and Syberia II aren't Point & Click games?
You have to have virtually no knowledge of the gaming community to state that Syberia or Syberia II are point and click games. Listen to this: They are ADVENTURE GAMES, not of the point-and-click genre, or they can possibly categorized as ADVENTURE PUZZLE GAMES. The point-and-click genre died out in the early 1990’s, but I guess you’re stuck in that time period and refuse to acknowledge the facts. Here is another wikipedia article you can check out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syberia
While you’re at it, check out the Syberia II article and let me know what you fing, mmmmkay?
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
But hey, if you really want to be so incredibly fuzzy and trivial with your phrasing, then technically they are "Point & Click Adventure Games".[/color]
Incorrect again! I wonder if you will ever get one fact right in your entire response! They are purely adventure games; the point-and-click name and genre died in the early 1990’s, and a new genre emerged called ADVENTURE. So technically speaking, they are ADVENTURE games.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Actually, I have. Before you were even out of diapers.
Calm down son, it’s all right. You have no idea how old I am. It looks like you are assuming my profile is correct, just like you are assuming your delusional belief that the “point-and-click” genre is still in existence. Tsk, tsk, tsk. I honestly doubt you’ve ever heard of the King’s Quest or Gabriel Knight series before I mentioned them, and you most certainly have no mastery or detailed knowledge of the game if you consider them to be “point-and-clickers.” King’s Quest is an ADVENTURE GAME, and Gabriel Knight can be classified as a MYSTERY ADVENTURE game. Read up on this because I am tired of citing common knowledge to you.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
How, exactly?
Yes, Kings Quest IV (one of my personal favourite games, ever, for record's sake) and Gabriel Knight were genuinely mature games in both their execution and their stories, with an amazing level of depth and intelligence, but this does not change the fact that you POINT with your mouse, and you CLICK on the screen, to move your avatar through the stories, often using items to solve puzzles in the scenery.
Again, you make the error of assuming a function of the game is the basis for the entire genre’s title. This was true back in the time of text adventures and “point-and-clickers,” but is no longer valid, especially with the coming of new genres after the ADVENTURE genre, such as RPG, strategy, FPS, sports, sims, etc…The point-and-click genre was replaced in name and in component by the ADVENTURE GENRE.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Played them all. I recall quite clearly pointing and clicking on things, using my inventory of items to solve the puzzles in the gameword.
Aww, come on now, I thought we were making progress!!! These games are all ADVENTURE games. Your logic of pointing and clicking is fallacious- I can play an entire strategy game by pointing and clicking; I can play an entire puzzle game by pointing and clicking; I can play an entire SIMULATION game by pointing and clicking. Therefore your logic null and void. Let’s keep moving; hopefully you’ll be able to comprehend your error and we’ll get you out of the dark ages!
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Case in Point:
"Broken Sword: The Shadow of the Templars" is a Point & Click game.
"Broken Sword: The Sleeping Dragon" is an adventure game.[/color]
Incorrect once again son! Ok, pay attention, I’m going to say this slowly to you, mmmkay? Broken Sword is….an….ADVENTURE game, both CIRCLE OF BLOOD (the correct name for Shadow of the Templars) and Sleeping Dragon. In the United States of America, by the way, Sleeping Dragon was published by “The Adventure Company.” You caught on to anything yet? Maybe? Good, let’s move on son, mmmmmmmmkay?
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Did I say that Hearts and Solitaire were puzzle games? No. I said the list of games you mentioned were either puzzle games or card games. Please, read what I actually type first, mmmkay?
Once again, calm down son. It is normal to feel frustration when your belief and concept system is being systematically disemboweled. You did say Minesweeper was a puzzle game, don’t try to circumvent this since you’ve already been proven wrong. The list I mentioned are ADVENTURE games. You seem to confuse yourself with all these genres because, once again, you are stuck in the period when point-and-click actually existed.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
Why don't you read the first sentence of that article and then get back to me, mmmkay?
Here is the article for Gabriel Knight:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel_Knight
Again, read the first sentence and get back to me, mmmkay?
Just in case your eyes refused to see the FACTS, here is the website for Gabriel Knight and King’s Quest once again: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel_Knight & http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kings_Quest
In fact, here is the first sentence from the Gabriel Knight article: Gabriel Knight is the title character in a series of adventure games produced by the Sierra Corporation in the 1990s.
And here is the first sentence in the King’s Quest article for you son:
King's Quest is an adventure game series made by the American computer game company Sierra Entertainment.
Now, you were saying? Keep reading those sentences and maybe you’ll realize what they actually say one day. (Hint: ADVENTURE; I don’t know what you call it in Britain, but these games are from the UNITED STATES, and we call them ADVENTURE, mmmmmmmmmmmkay?)
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
(I would never actually take the opinion of Wikipedia seriously, seeing how most of it's information is usually misinformed tripe submitted by internet fanboys, but if you feel that it's a credible source to help "prove" your point, then I may as well use it's articles to "prove" mine.)
Wikipedia is the most convenient and easy way to access valid information fast. It’s information is confirmed and SOURCED, and it is meticulously watched for vandalism and misinformation. Also, by citing wikipedia, you actually proved MY points. All the articles of the games in question classified the game genres as ADVENTURE, mmmmkay? So get your facts straight and realize that after the early 1990’s, the genre point-and-click is no longer existent. Welcome to the real world son.
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Originally Posted by Vincent Valentine
My point from the very beginning is that the games you listed were not simply adventure games. They were Point & Click Adventure Games, which is a very different beast to the basic adventure game itself, which is the genre into which Zelda lies.[/color]
[/quote]
Incorrect once again. Following the point-and-click genre (which I believe is pathetic compared to the greatness of some of the finest ADVENTURE games), the ADVENTURE genre came into its own. It’s not classified as point and click, or point and click adventure, but simply ADVENTURE. Got it? Zelda is NOT a BASIC adventure. The early Zelda’s were RPG’s and the later ones on N64 and up are ACTION ADVENTURES. Once again, I don’t know if you have some kind of different thought system in Britain about this, but this is how it is in the United States of America. Hope you were able to understand this.
In conclusion, it turns out it is YOU who is taking the phrase “point-and-click” too literally, by applying it to any game you see with the point-and-click characteristic. This isn’t going to fly, and the sooner you realize that the point-and-click genre is long dead, the sooner you’ll be able to appreciate great ADVENTURE games. Every single game you mentioned as point and click is categorized as ADVENTURE, so wake up and smell the new age, MMMMMMMMkayyyyy?
