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Cataphracts < most Cavalry
However, there is a small chance that Teutonic Knights will survive the fight, but nothing else will. BTW Manus, mass Cavalry = fail. Halbs/Camels/CavArchers will rip you to shreds. Lost, when you see this, send me the replay. There must be at least ten anti-Cavalry civilizations, if you include their bonuses or their own, better Cavalry.
Tavrobel, contact me via MSN or email, i will send the replay gladly. However, fair play to Manus, he DID manage, in our replay, to switch from using massed cavalry (Japanese Cavaliers against Spanish Paladins, poor ickle Manus...) to combining his samurai, cavaliers, champions and halberdiers.
Anyone who can think of an effective counter for this, please tell me.
Hand cannoneers with a pike shield may help. Hand Cannons get bonuses vs infantry and the pike wall will keep the Cavaliers from getting to you. Some heavy Scorpions may also be good if you got them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Number
In addition to pikes you may want to put in some champs of your own.
So Hand Cannons with pikes/champs and maybe some Heavy Scorps if you got them.
This of course rest on you being able to make hand cannons. If no hand cannons Heavy Scorps + pikes/champs could also work.
Paladins can also act as a shield if you like, but if there are a heck of a lot of Halbs I would stay away from them.
My cosuin has this game and I've never seen him lose a game. He just rushes people with the British longbowmen.
I have Age of Mythology and love/ed that. Its been ages since I've actually played it but when I did I was pretty good.
Norse FTW.
I'll get around to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Number
Hand Cannoneers/Conquistadores and Halberdiers, as Shun said. If your Conquistadores get hit, they'll fall almost instantly because of the Samurai ability to completely own other Uniques (except Jaguar Warriors). You could also mass Monks/Missionaries, because Spain has most (if not all) of the Religion upgrades.
Oi, my massed cavalry beat your haberdiers, camels, and cataphracts time and time again!
Thats because first time, I just sent in my units to ambush your hiding paladins as i saw them, which was patently stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Manus
Second time, you interrupted me while i was building my forward base, to BUILD my army.
Third time, cost for cost I kicked arse, and left you with 8 paladins or so and feck all gold.
Thanks for the tips guys, i'll keep manus on his toes.
Out of curiosity are you guys playing via Gamepark.eu or something else? In case you didn't guess I have been playing on Gamepark :P.
We are playing directly via IP.
Been playing AoK and the expansion for years and never got tired of it.
I have decided to adopt a different strategy. I will mass produce units which cost me no gold, ie. halberdiers and skirmishers, which are very cheap and effectively free on a Black Forest map and use these to cause some damage to his gold costing units and stone costing buildings.
Whever I reckon he no longer has the stone to replenish his buildings, I will build your proposed conquistador/halberdier/champion army with missionary backup, and kick arse.
Or maybe I wont. What do you think, Manus? Kekeke.
Also, how about organizing a game with several EoFF players? More the merrier.
I've been playing AOC for a while now. I'm pretty good at it. At least I win more than I lose. I'd like to play with some of you. By the way, where can I get GamePark? I usually play on GameSpyArcade.
The problem is you would always have to outnumber him[Sams can beat both halbs and skirms, champs also can, his halbs beat your halbs, and even caviliers might be able to beat both[I know paladins can, but I never make big use of Caviliers]. Which may not be possible since it is easy for both players to be hitting the 200 pop limit. But of course Trash unit spaming can be very effective when done right. I just don't think the trash would be overly effective on this army. The problem is trash lacks a good infantry counter(which Conqs and hand cannoneers provide) so you have to beat infantry by numbers or hope you can take enough down by focus firing your skirms. To compound the problem Japanesse infantry is superior to yours. Thus you want to avoid an infantry war. You do this by making a unit wall with ranged units behind it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Number
If you want to waste his gold. Forward building Towers(particually bombard towers) and Castles is useful when done right[ie- with proper unit support, in this case the defenses would make an all trash army like you suggested more effective on his army], but that will burn your stone down fast.
Do recall though that your set up is more vulnerable to trash units than his is. His halbs beat your halbs. Conqs are weak to both skirms and halbs(if I recall right). And do recall that even in late post imp it is possible to get enough gold to mass some cheap gold units.Quote:
Whever I reckon he no longer has the stone to replenish his buildings, I will build your proposed conquistador/halberdier/champion army with missionary backup, and kick arse.
Ex. I had a game that went about 4 or so real life hours(not sure how many ingame hours that is on fast) and even though there was no gold left on the map I was able to constantly produce a good 40'ish gold units as fast or faster than they could be killed. Market trading + relics can easily produce enough gold for that. And in Multiplayer as long as you have your trade route secured you should rarely or never be short on gold.
In addition in that game I was a defense whore and I never did want for stone[Market trading again, though that means you have to make VERY good use of your stone]
I for the most part am on Gamepark with the ID of ShunWolfkin, though I don't get on much during the week or saturdays(homework and college wouldn't ya know).Quote:
Also, how about organizing a game with several EoFF players? More the merrier.
Anyways I wouldn't mind playing a game or two, but my age times have gone downhill after taking a several year break from the game(not to mention my microing skills are kinda bleh now. Partial cause I don't remember all the hot-keys, etc).
@Vision in Verse
Gamepark is just http://www.gamepark.eu/en/
I know my trash army wont win, but its not really supposed to. Since this is a 1v1 game, no trade, and its very easy for me to just send in piles of halbs and skirms without thought, i simply get a half dozen barracks and archery ranges mass producing and sending them straight to the fight. Any gods man, I really dont want to fight you, i'd lose hands down uness you gave me a 20 minute head start. Also, I am fairly sure Conqs are just as effective against skirms as anything else, because of the large damage which leaves them still effective in the numbers I have them. The advantage of the current map is that it is very easy to bottleneck an opponent with short sections of walls backed up by bombard towers (and conqs dont hurt either). Stone is very short on this map. Wish me luck.
Just waste his gold is the point of course. However, I have seen a max pop gold unit army plow down a trash army with few casulties. The gold army even managed to hit the trashers econ. Doesn't matter how cheap those units are if your econ gets hit you won't be able to keep up production wise. That was more or less what I was warning against. In a BF map it is harder to hit the econ than some others, but the example battle was on the BF map.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost Number
So basicaly what I am saying is that if he can amass a max pop gold army he may be able to get through to your econ. Though it would be costly to him(but having your econ damaged may make up for that in your opponents eyes).
Market trade(selling one type for another) can easily score plenty of gold for a gold army even in late game if you got a strong econ.Quote:
Since this is a 1v1 game, no trade, and its very easy for me to just send in piles of halbs and skirms without thought
I had a 4 hour(Real life time, not in game time) game that was an FFA where I still had heavily gold dependant army. Purely thanks to market trading(selling resources that I don't need). I also never ran low on stone. Markets are great.
I wouldn't be so sure. I got the theory down, but I am slow in game. Bad micro leads to bad age times. I think my fastest fuedal since I started playing again is 10-11 minutes or somesuch[with standard resources]. which isn't great, though it works as passable. Too bad my average is more like 13 minutes. Castle takes me around 20 minutes, and imperial about 33 minutes. Which is of about rook[maybe bad rook] level if I recall right.Quote:
I really dont want to fight you, i'd lose hands down uness you gave me a 20 minute head start.
Well I was purely talking about that in that skirms have an attack bonus against conqs if my memory serves. And you don't have an attack boost vs. skirms. However, you are right in that they do enough damage that conqs can win 1v1(at least last I checked conqs could).Quote:
Also, I am fairly sure Conqs are just as effective against skirms as anything else, because of the large damage which leaves them still effective in the numbers I have them.
Well if it is a BF map just beware a cut.Quote:
The advantage of the current map is that it is very easy to bottleneck an opponent with short sections of walls backed up by bombard towers (and conqs dont hurt either). Stone is very short on this map. Wish me luck.
And good luck :D.
Edit- Another tip on trash army. Make sure you are always on the offensive with it. Attack his base. This will make it less likely that a charge could break you line and get to your econ. Try to keep battle as far away from you as possible. Build foward Barracks and Archery ranges if you haven't.