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we happily gave sadamme lots of planes, bombs, gas, chemicals. he then used them against the kurds. it was american made planes, bombs and chemicals which committed the gassing and genocide.
terrorism is the new red scare. we will now use it at every turn. and 9-11 was the new reichstag fire.
and until we begin to start understanding out enemy will we know how to combat them.
to negotiate is not a sign of weakness or defeat it is a sign of knowing what is best.
I know its not hte american people that isnt bad. But the CEO's and hte government and the peresident they hate. If so. Why kill the innocent instead of the ones they hate?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreddz
Because they ARE NOT NICE.
CHRIST GIVE ME A BREAK THEY ARE GOD DAMNED TERRORISTS
Would it make anyone feel better to know I'm an American, and almost pointed this out in my last post? If not in specific detail.Quote:
Originally Posted by Traitorfish
This one, I'm on the fence about. It holds together, from the outside, but the truth is that you don't see a lot of specific references in country. It's not focused heavily enough to be propoganda. And that's too subtle for Bush.Quote:
Terrorists are bad, and a I agree that they are all pretty much evil, but the Bush administration uses them as a weapon against the American people, to keep them scared and under control. SO, bye gaining from their actions, he's just as bad. Which is very bad.
you've got to look at the iraq war to see the heavy level of propaganda.
"iraq has terrorists" "well then we need to invade" "he had links to 9-11 too" "that bastard we need to kick his ass"
noone questioned that al-qaeda had infact called for a jihad on iraq. that they hated the idea of a secular state. that they offered to fight for saudi against them.
the fact the bin laden hated sadamme and wanted him dead and an islamic state in place was ignored. and happily replace with the idea "sadamme aided 9-11". these guys were not on the best of terms and anyone with any idea about the middle east knew that. al-qaeda prefered iran to iraq. that much was clear.
but by saying they were supporting terrorists and aided 9-11 the nation got up and said it was okay to invade. it was the government. they wouldn't lie. and this was terrorism. it needed to be stopped. and so we went to war and the public sort of approved. it was for the good of the nation after all.
and that is how terrorism has blinded the american people. link a country to terrorism. no matter how stupid and they will want to destroy it.
iraq having links to terrorism was an outright lie. it was not mistaken intelligence. everyone knew it. it was well documented. why would jihadist, fundamental and fanatical muslim group want to to deals with the man who ran a secular state that had fought a war with the jewel of islamic states?
your enemy's enemy is your friend does not apply. bin laden is far too caught up in his ideas for that.
SUPPOSED WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION
You've got a point there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloud No.9
Wrong, Iraq was up to it's neck in terrorist activity, just not the same terrorists as we were supposed to be hunting for.
And, you're right on that one. Fanatics, the real ones, are easy to predict: they do EXACTLY what they believe is right. It makes them dangerous, but not terribly surprising. Of course, Americans don't know what to do with "True Believers", because it's so rare for us to find them in these borders, anymore. And impossible for them to get into power, because they can't play nice with the jackasses. In democracy, the majority rules, and the majority are losers.
I blame that on the 50's and (moreso) the 60's.
I fully agree with the precept that 'My enemy's enemy is my friend' is a very bad idea. However almost every single regime which has been supported by the West in the latter half of the 20th century was done so because we were fighting against Soviet Russia. And I don't know how many people know about Soviet Russia, but believe me; I'll take Saddam and Al'Quada over Stalin any day of the week.
At any rate, I don't care what they're like on a personal level. All I know is they're trying to kill me and my loved ones and enforce their ideals onto anyone who survives. That equates to kicking theout of them.
Well put Milf and welcome back.
What I don't get, being the uninformed individual that I am, is if we were funding Iraq, did we know that Soviet Russia was funding thier military as well? There is, and always will be something that just doesn't add up in my feeble little mind.
On this, you have my complete agreement. I know why they hate us, and it's because we're assholes to them, and they're also assholes back. But I'd rather be the living asshole than the dead one.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILFAt any rate, I don't care what they're like on a personal level. All I know is they're trying to kill me and my loved ones and enforce their ideals onto anyone who survives. That equates to kicking the
Wow, I was actually going to comment here, about the hateful things udsuna said... but, man, now I have, like, 50 times more stupid crap to address, and I truly cannot be arsed. This is futile.
Like the Linkin Park song, in the end, it doesn't really matter. America is strong, Israel is strong, both are standing on their feet and ready to fight the good fight. If some idiots want to symapthise or join the opposing side - let 'em, as long as they only do so verbally, like in this site. I know they're wrong, and that's really enough for me, and I also know they are powerless to affect the course of things with their baseless hate, ignorance and sometimes sheer stupidity (don't get all pissy, udsuna, you're not stupid. :p ). I would advise, however, not to sound these opinions outside the Internet, as you may never know who is listening and might get offended by you supporting the enemy's cause, for whatever reason you might have.
udsuna the terrorists in iraq were mostly kurds fighting against sadamme. the same kurds we supplied iraq with the planes and bombs to gas them in halabja, the same kurds we incited to rebel then refused to help when they were slaughtered in their thousands.
israel and america are not fighting the good fight. they are both following their own reichstag fire's. america lies then invades who it wants, holds men (and children) for 4 years without charge and tortures them. israel has a habit of shooting unarmed civillians and shelling refugee camps. that is not the good fight.
Ah, but that's the great thing about America. I can say to whomever I want that these stupid little conflicts are complete bull****. The worst I get is the occasional threat, and even that was only once. Freedom of speach kicks all forms of ass. And I have no hate or ignorance involved in this scenario. For me, it's little more than an intellectual exercise. You, on the other hand, if you can't spot your own hate, then you truly are ignorant.Quote:
Originally Posted by War Angel
You see, I thought I had to explain certain things, like why Jews have a right to live, why they have a right to live where they did for eons, why they have a right to protect themselves, etc... but then I thought - why? Why isn't all that obvious? It should be. And if for some reason, to someone, it isn't... well, then there's nothing I can do about it, because as I've said, they are either too hateful, too ignorant or too dumb to want to change their minds. And, as I've said, it shouldn't really matter. Yes, it pisses me off to see that kind of $hit spoken about my home, nation and people... but there's really nothing I can do. If those words were slung to my face in real life, real time, the consequences would be much more severe. But this is the net, and I'm not about to explain the obvious, to those who do not wish to understand.
All completely true, but the Israelis can't force the Palestinians to leave. They've been there for 1500 years, so it's their home too. Not that I support the PLO or any other terrorists.Quote:
Originally Posted by War Angel