Quote:
Originally Posted by Miriel
Assuming both Harry and Ginny live long enough to get married, then I would wish for that, but I have a feeling if Harry survives he will never find true happiness.
Printable View
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miriel
Assuming both Harry and Ginny live long enough to get married, then I would wish for that, but I have a feeling if Harry survives he will never find true happiness.
Everything will be perfect. :mad2:
Good book, good book. I have to confess, I'm rather saddened that Harry broke up with Ginny, but that's just because I love Ginny and would love for her to be as major a character in book 7 (In terms of page time as much as importance.) as Ron and Hermione.
Interesting theories from KB; I'm reserving judgement on Snape for now, but I wouldn't put it past Rowling to double-bluff us and have him turn out to be genuinely evil. As has been said though, Dumbledore might have been getting on some but even with Snape's prowess in Occlumency and Legilimency I just can't buy the idea that Albus was fooled.
I was saddened to see Hagrid becoming less central of a character, and I find it a bit hard to believe that in all that time, and despite the increased security, there was no way to arrange occasional meetings, so it does feel a little forced. Incidentally I'm betting he buys the farm in the last book. I think he's actually top of my list for good guys dieing, but then he was before HBP came out and I was wrong about that.
Does anyone else thing Fred and George will have a central role to play in the last one, too? I mean, it's always been plain to me that despite their general lack of concern over academics and order, they are both actually extremely talented and intelligent. I suspect those two might pull some fairly important tricks out of their hats.
This book introduced me to the verb "snogging"
Can you imagine if one of the twins died? That would kill me. I really do hope that they're around more in the 7th book, they're probably my favorite characters in the whole series.
I don't think Harry is going to have to resort to actually killing Voldemort to defeat him. I believe it was at the end of the third book that Dumbledore told Harry that one day he would be happy that he spared Wormtail's life. He said there's a powerful magic bond formed when one wizard spares another's life and I think this bond is going to play a key role in Voldemort's defeat.
Right, but so did Dumbledore, and Voldemort certainly never told him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirobaito
I could be very wrong here, but I don't see anyone at all knowing where the other Horcruxes are, or even what they are. Another thing you have to remember about the making of the Horcruxes is that Voldy even committed the necessary murders entirely alone without so much as a lookout. Honestly, outside of RAB (and now Harry, Slughorn and the Order), I doubt many people at all even know Voldemort has even one Horcrux.
However, we also know that Voldemort, though very intelligent, is also very self centered, so it's always possible many have already guessed and even have ideas concerning what the final Horcrux is. And while it's an interesting theory to venture Harry as the final, I don't think it's true for two reasons. In GoF, it was said that Harry and Voldemort were bound together; and we found this to be true in OotP because of Voldemort's interpretation of the prophecy. One cannot live while the other survives. So, it'll come down to a showdown in the end, I think.
Also, I've decided for now that Snape is still a good guy. Well, as good as that creep can get *mutters and so on*
I don't think Harry can be the final Horcrux. Voldemort would have had to put his soul into Harry before he tried to kill him, and what would be the point of making Harry a horcrux if he was going to kill him anyway? Wouldn't he be destroying a part of his soul too?
I'm not sure if I can see Harry pulling off Avada Kedavra, I think Voldemort's death (assuming he's not going to win) will be far more theatrical.
I did thoroughly enjoy reading HBP, but to be honest, I was a little bit disappointed - but not a lot!
Firstly, there isn't really a lot of a story... but it is written incredibly well. And JK Rowling needed to get a lot of things out of the way in order to get the last book exactly right.
The Harry and Ginny thing was obvious, it was obvious Snape was going to turn out evil (although I didn't guess he was the HBP), and it was obvious Dumbledore was going to be the one who died. I wish he didn't though, Dumbledore was awesome and one of my favourite characters. I'm also glad that Snape is now no longer going to be in the story as a good guy, I really do dislike him.
Other than those points, I thought the rest of it was fantastic. I wasn't sure about it when I first finished it, but now I think it is brilliant.
I think that JK Rowling has been incredibly clever in the way she wrote the books; the seventh book, I think, is going to be superb. And I hope Luna plays a big part in it, she is awesome!
15 Dollars here.
I haven't bought it yet, but I'm going to the library tonight to see if I can get one reserved. I feel that this one is gonna be good, along with the ending. I think the whole HP series is good, although at first it was a little iffy... I disliked the first book.... I found it boring. But from the 3rd one on, the series just is awesome.
The best part, I think, is that people actually READ. Before HP, no one I knew read a book this big. I can remember people saying that they would never waste their own time to read 200-700 pages. They thought it is too 'hard'. Now these books sell like hotcakes, and everyone, even the people I suspected as 'the type who doesn't like/can't read' read this now. It's great.
Oh, and have you noticed, it is just TOO HARD to skip spoilers these days. You see it and think, " I won't read it...I won't... I....Aw, what the hell." I can't help it these days!
KB: I said I thought it was Regulus Black as well, I was just providing some evidence about why it might not be. It would make sense, I just thought it might be a good idea to count the evidence against.
I think that if Harry was the final Horcrux, it would have been completely accidental, like how Harry became a Parseltounge. I wouldn't be wholly surprised if Harry turned out to be the final Horcrux, though I'm not sure if I want to fully support that theory right now. I might re-read a few bits of HBP and the other books before deciding.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pure Strife
Agreed on the last point too. I think a simple Avada Kedavra might be a little too simple, and the actual event will be "far more theatrical" like you said.
Well Harry may not be an emo in this book but Ron and Hermione certainly are. I hope they die of aids sometime before I finish reading. And I hate how Rowling decided Harry was falling for Ginny for no p-articular reason. Its a great book until they start talking about tehre emotions and you realive what ass wipe teenagers they are. Well most of them.
Alright, so Regulus took the amulet horcrux, and dumbledore had the ring one (on his good hand, at the start of the book) which meant that at the start of the book none of the horcruxes had been destroyed. So what the hell happened to his hand? Any theories?
Sorry to get into the discussion so late; I've been busy and only got the chance to finish the book last night. I'm going to examine the three general theories we're working with: Regulus as R.A.B.; the possibility of Snape carrying out the murder of Dumbledore at his behest; and the possibility of Harry himself being the final Horcrux.
R.A.B. = Regulus Black?
This was the conclusion I immediately came to after finishing the book. Black is the most prominent last name to start with B in the series, and Sirius' brother is (or rather was) named Regulus. Rowling's only other options are to develop a new/unrevealed character, or to reveal that R.A.B. is actually three different individuals. The latter is very unlikely; the note from R.A.B. makes reference to "I."
Beyond this, the markedly gloating tone of the note suggests to me that the contents are not meant to misdirect, or even be esoteric; Voldemort should know R.A.B.'s identity. This lends itself strongly in favor of the Regulus theory, as Sirius' brother was a Death Eater. The fact that the note-writer also calls Voldemort the "Dark Lord" implies that it was authored by a Death Eater.Quote:
Originally Posted by page 609, American edition
Could Snape have killed Dumbledore to carry out the Headmaster's own orders?
I really doubt it. While most of the books have, on some level, seemed to imply that Snape really was supporting Dumbledore, there is simply too much in Half-Blood Prince that points to Snape's ultimate duplicity.
First, there is the matter of the Unbreakable Vow. It's been suggested that Snape had been told to do whatever was necessary to convince the Death Eaters of his loyalty. However, Snape had already formed a convincing argument for his Death Eater loyalty; even Voldemort was convinced. Moreover, Snape's partial revelation of the Prophecy and subsequent "remorse" seems to have been Dumbledore's primary reason for trusting the "erstwhile" Death Eater. If Snape were truly sorry, it's unlikely that he would have abused Harry so mercilessly throughout the six books. James and Sirius may have abused him at Hogwarts, yes, but he played an obvious role in both their deaths.
Further, page 604 suggests that Snape's face was "suffused with hatred" as he looked down on Harry. Snape reacts with undeniable anger when Harry attempts to use Snape's Sectumsempra spell against its creator.
The significance of this will be addressed momentarily.Quote:
Originally Posted by page 604, American edition
At first, I had believed it possible that the "revulsion" and "hatred" etched on Snape's face when he murdered Dumbledore were indicative of self-loathing. The passage immediately after the one I just quoted has Snape screaming at Harry for calling the murderer a coward. I thought it possible, however unlikely, that Snape felt that he had showed courage in killing Dumbledore, staying true to Dumbledore's plan, even though it meant murdering the world's greatest Light wizard. However, this possibility is absoluted "riddle"d ;) with thematic flaws.
First, I cannot see Dumbledore urging, under any circumstances (no matter how dire), an Order member to murder another person. Killing in combat is acceptible; Dumbledore seeks for Harry to strike Voldemort down. However, there is a difference between self-defense and open murder. Dumbledore had no fear for his own life obviously, as he didn't fear death. But Dumbledore did not want Malfoy to murder him, as it would have inextricably tied Malfoy to the Dark. It's clear that one can potentially return from the precipice of moral ruin; Snape had, after all, ostensibly turned his life around after Death Eater activity. But in cold-blooded murder, Snape would have again lost himself. Remember that the Horcrux, the very embodiment of Dark, can only be achieved through murder. It seems to me that it would be particularly galling to Dumbledore for Snape to kill him with Avada Kedavra. This spell, after all, represents the ultimate submission to the Dark.
Further, the series seems to imply that self-sacrifice is, at least on some level, a component of redemption. Having made the Unbreakable Vow, Snape would have died had he turned on the other Death Eaters. Well, I think Sirius said it best in Prisoner of Azkaban:
As important as Dumbledore may have thought it for Snape to remain a "spy," I don't think that could have possibly extended to Snape's betrayal of the precepts of Good. In any case, Snape had to realize that, compared with Dumbldore, his contributions to the war against Voldemort would necessarily be small. By saving Dumbledore, by sacrificing himself, Snape could have unquestionably redeemed his shadowy past. He did not.Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Prisoner of Azkaban', page 375, American edition
Returning to the page from 604, however, Snape's hatred for Harry is suggested to bear similarity to the hate on his face when he killed Dumbledore. When Snape looks at Harry, though, there is no self-loathing. There is only rage at the remembered impertinences of the father. This suggests two things: his hatred was directed at Dumbledore, not himself when he murdered him; and revenge and duplicity are the true characteristics of his identity as a Slytherin.
Throughout the series, Slytherins are noted to posess numerous negative traits. These include an unseemly lust for power, a willingness to bend the rules to get what they want, a certain petty (or sometimes profound) cruelty or malice, and a willingness to betray, backstab, and otherwise double-deal.
Snape has never seemed overly ambitious (and, it's important to note, ambition in itself is not suggested to be negative or wrong in any way) to me. Rather, his Slytherin traits are embodied in said malice and duplicity. I don't think it's accidental that Snape's personal history bears such close resemblence to Voldemort's. Even as we saw Draco take small steps toward Good, we finally saw Snape for what he always was: completely and perhaps irredeemably evil.
In conclusion, I firmly believe that Snape murdered Dumbldeore because he was a Death Eater and was evil, not out of some distorted desire to carry out Dumbledore's plans. Snape pretty much sucks at life; don't expect him to survive Book 7.
Harry's a Horcrux?
I find this unlikely for a number of reasons. The first is purely technical; the creation of a Horcrux necessarily requires a murder. Admittedly, Voldemort had just killed Harry's parents. However, Voldemort sought to kill Harry. It would certainly be illogical to kill that which embodies a piece of one's soul. Further, Dumbledore suggests that the murder of Harry was meant to be the means for the final Horcrux. Given Voldemort's tendency toward a kind of narcissistic symbolism, I expect that this was indeed the case. However, the critical murder did not work; the Avada Kedavra curse rebounded on Voldemort, tearing him from his physical self. Murder involves intent; Voldemort did not intend to kill himself, obviously (further, because of the previously created Horcruxes, he didn't really "die"). As the vehicle to turn Harry into a Horcrux was not effectively present, the possibility for such a plot twist seems slim.
Also, recall why the curse rebounded on Voldemort. Harry was indelibly shielded by his mother's love. It seems to me that the Horcrux supplants Avada Kedavra as the Magick most symbolically representative of Evil in the series. If love, the greatest power according to Dumbledore, shielded Harry from a Killing Curse, I also believe that it would have prevented him from physically embodying the ultimate Darkness of the Horcrux.
Third, the suggestion that the Prophecy is indicative of this idea is contradicted by the book itself. Dumbledore explicitly states that most of the Prophecies in the Hall have been unfulfilled, since the realization necessary to act on those words was not present. Basically, prophecy is not fate. As such, "Harry the Horcrux" was not predestined. Voldemort, admittedly, did attempt to act on the Prophecy. However, he acted on limited information, thus twisting the actual words. Even if he had heard the entire thing, we still must conclude that fate is not suggested to oversee the world.
Finally, although this can be explained away, I believe Dumbledore could and would have realized if Harry had been used in this manner.
Well, actually, at least one Horcrux was destroyed years before Half-Blood Prince. Dumbledore makes it very clear that Riddle's diary (destroyed by the Basilisk fang in Chamber of Secrets) was actually a Horcrux. As to his hand, it's alluded to several times that the injury occurred because Dumbledore's reactions weren't as quick as they once were. Evidently, in destroying the Peverell Horcrux, he could have avoided injury, but wasn't able to as a result of his advancing age. As to the specifics of the spell that withered his hand (and threatened his life), it's really hard to say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pure Strife
I've heard the theory that Dumbledore's simply gone into hiding, based on what he said just before to Malfoy when he was talking about hiding him and his mother, specifically "He cannot kill you if you are already dead."
My theory is that I'll find out in the next book. I hope it doesn't take too long to write.