The Chrono Campaign Has Begun

Spoilers pop up in the weirdest, most annoying ways. I wanted to beat Janice in the Grand Slam but I had no idea how to collect more monsters. I read there were two ways: beat them with Sprigg or use the Forget-me-Not Pot accessory. Simple, right? Well I look up that item to find out where it is. The wiki says it's in Chronpolis. I'm like "is that the big city ruins we visited in Dead Sea?" First line of the wiki entry oN Chronopolis says Balthazar did something with "Project Kid."

Kid.

I've vaguely known there was something amiss with Kid... Something I read somewhere long before I started the game. I guess all this does is confirm my nagging suspicions.

Oh yeah, not much else to report right now aside from that. I'll talk more later when i'm actually done playing the game this session. All I can though is....SO MANY PARTY MEMBERS!!!

But still no Kid.... Goddammit.

EDIT:

Also apparently I missed out on the dei-human subplot being resolved. I was supposed to talk to Nikki before leaving the Zelbess or something.

EDIT 2:

RANDOM THEORY OUT OF NOWHERE! Dario is Lynx! Or related to him somehow! Could be totally wrong but I'm trying to connect the dots and who or what exactly Lynx is has been totally left in the dark. I was re-reading my posts about the Home Dragoons being dead and I was thinking of their counterparts and it occurred to me "what about Lynx's Home counterpart?" He must have oen as Norris knew him. Or can Lynx just travel the dimensions too?

The odds of Lynx being Dario seem very slim but I'm just throwing it out there. If I'm way off, oh well. I like surprises.

Yeah the Demi-Fiend.Marbule quest is pretty easy to miss in this game.

I won't spoil Lynx's true identity but I will mention that you already know what happens to him and Harle as they were with Viper and his men in the Dead Sea frozen.

Now I did discover an amusing fan theory about Miguel that made me laugh... :shifty:

Oh I missed Home Lynx being frozen with the others. Oh well then....

Also I am going around collecting Dragon Powers/Relics so I figured now is a good sidequest time. It almost feels like the endgame but I don't think we're quite there yet. I mean, Serge doesn't even have his body back yet.

Anyhow, I was wandering around looking for stuff to do and i visited Another World Isle of the Damned. Guess what I found there? Solt and Peppor! Annoying? Hell no, I got Karsh backstory! I neglected to mention but ever since he was available, Karsh has been a mainstay in my party. Loaded up with 3 strength-increasing accessories, he can deal in excess of 300 HP damage with just a full string of melee attacks. Anyway, after beating those two numnuts, I got Karsh's Level 7 Tech! So that's pretty awesome and unexpected.

Not everyone can have a Level 7 Tech can they? There are just way too many characters.
But wait, there are eight Element levels. Does he get a stronger Tech?

Can you tell me the Miguel fan theory or does tha tspil things to come?

Every character but Sprigg I believe has a Level 7 tech but only a few of the cast members have to do a sidequest to obtain it. Others will gain theirs once you get something like 35 Stars or higher.

Elements go up to Level 8 but if memory serves me correct there is only one ability that is exclusively a Level 8 limit and its a plot ability you'll gain eventually.

Karsh is indeed a great character and I wish I could use more people in battle because he and Fargo are super useful. You're kind of in the "open" part of the game since you can deal with the Dragons in the order you want. I think only the Sky Dragon requires you to beat all the other Dragons to actually meet him. Make sure you steal from them because they all carry armor that allows you to null their elements. The Green, White, and Black Armor are the most useful because many of the more nasty bosses (like Miguel) use one of those elements. They can also be broken down to get the materials needed to make the Prism/Rainbow Gear which is pretty nice.

The Miguel Theory isn't really much of a spoiler since the evidence is not exactly rock solid, but some fans theorize that Miguel is actually Crono in disguise. Would explain how a simple fisherman is a total badass with swords made of Light.

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Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno

Elements go up to Level 8 but if memory serves me correct there is only one ability that is exclusively a Level 8 limit and its a plot ability you'll gain eventually.

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I assume you mean asside from the level 8 summons?


Yes, Karsh is a great powerhouse for melee attacks. It is even better to get the Karsh + Glenn combination going, stack the field full of green element from casting Eagle Eye, and then just wail away with 99% accuracy level 3 attacks.

Maybe I'm just not supposed to be able to beat Dario right now? I mean, holy hell. I'm wandering around because I have no idea where the remaining three dragons are and I stopped by Home Forbidden Island because, well, maybe a dragon is there.

Nope, only Dario. And to make things worse, I have to have Riddel in my party. I had admittedly thought about using her earlier but this boss fight has taught me the rror of my ways. She smurfing sucks. She lasts maybe couple turns even with all the defense armor and accessories I have.

Sn now we're down to 2.

Only Lynx is basically good for support and nothing else. I guess because Dario is Black Element Lynx's normal attacks do a pathetic amount of damage. Karsh, my main damage dealer as far as melee goes, can manage doing about 200 if he get sa full combo in.

Anyway, point is, it's basically Karsh vs. Dario with Riddel dead as a door nail and Lynx clinging to dear life witha lot of healing.

I still got Dario down to his hurt animation though so I must have depleted maybe half of his HP or more? I think that will do for now.

But melee has to be the way to go here because he counters every Element I used on him. I have to beat him into submission with brute force, not magic. I think....

So I got Water Dragon and Earth Dragon. The others? Well Sky Dragon is there but he told me to bugger off until I could find the others. Only I don't see Fire Dragon Island or any of the others....

EDIT:

Thank you VeloZer0 for the suggestion of Eagle Eye. I haven't used it up to this point but with it Karsh was doing 100 or close to it a good chunk of the time. Unfortunately it still wasn't enough. Him on his own just can't beat this bastard right now.

Also I noticed there appears to be no difference in the status effect spells being + or -. Eagle Eye -1 seemed to boost him just as well as Eagle Eye + 2. Diminish also seemed to work just as well at handicapping Dario's moves even when I used the -2 version.

EDIT 2:

So the trick is that he doesn't just counter using Elements on him, he counters everything. His entire moveset is dependent on your last turn. So as long as i keep only physically attacking, all he will do is physically attack. Huh....

Apparently Fire is the way to go.

I really hate accepting help on things like this. Now I know the trick to it, I have no desire to fight or beat him.

FINAL EDIT:

Okay, real update time.

1. Hey, Kid is back! Only she's brainwashed and trying to kill us! And now she's gone again.... :(

More awesomeness from Kid's Theme, Star-Stealing Girl. I really loved the scene of Serge just taking a few steps away from the party and having all those flashbacks about her. Serge seems so much more...emotional and possessing of a personality than Chrono. This scene showed you the bond Serge and Kid share really well.

2. Harle dies, right? I would have figured as much even if I hadn't been spoiled on it the other day. Sorry Harle, between you and the world, I choose the world. Oh, of course I said "I don't know" to her question but that was to be polite. If it had been Kid asking me to choose her or the world, then I might have chosen Kid. But Harle is not so endearing or interesting. Why the hell she had a heart-to-heart with Starky of all people, I don't know.

3. How ironic - in Another World, everyone is alive except Dario. Even Viper made it. In Home though, Dario is the last one standing. I appreciated the backstory even if the fight gave me a headache. Interesting that not once did Home Dario ever stop to think about the fact "Riddel" isn't the one he married or loved. Home Riddel is dead. I guess you shouldn't sweat the details.

4. That Black Dragon fight was so hard! Or not. i just walked up and took the Relic. I guess I'll have to make sure to do the sidequest right on New Game+ so I can face him for real.

5. Speaking of which, I think I will in fact do multiple playtrhroughs. Not only for plot clarification but also because I have so many party members here and I want to test some of them out. I frickin' just got ANOTHER one. I want to test Cave-Girl's moveset out!

6. The Dragon God music is really good. One of my favorite tracks in the game thus far.

7. Maybe it's just all the extra stuff available to me now but at this point, it feels like Serge has been Lynx longer than he was Serge. And Kid has been out of our party longer than she was in our party. I'm at 45 hours and I am missing our hero and heroine. Well, our hero is still there but you get what I mean.

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Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover

. Maybe it's just all the extra stuff available to me now but at this point, it feels like Serge has been Lynx longer than he was Serge. And Kid has been out of our party longer than she was in our party

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That is one of my least favorite things about the game, the amount of time you spend playing as Lynx. It all fits together well from a plot point of view, but I just didn't enjoy using him as much.

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Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover

Also I noticed there appears to be no difference in the status effect spells being + or -. Eagle Eye -1 seemed to boost him just as well as Eagle Eye + 2. Diminish also seemed to work just as well at handicapping Dario's moves even when I used the -2 version.

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I believe that putting a buff in a lower skill spot just diminishes the time that it lasts by a trivially small amount.

Serge has his body back!

I DON'T CARE!

I spent forever fighting Lynx-Serge and running away because I wanted his Rainbow Shell. I kept getting Trashy Tiara and I thought maybe it was just a luck thing. I think the key is to wait a few turns or to do some damage and then steal it. Only then do you get his good item and not the crappy one.

BUT IT WAS ALL FOR smurfING NOTHING. Not only did I get locked out of the demihuman sidequest, I got locked out of forging Rainbow equipment. FOREVER.

Goddammit.

This game could have been a Perfect 10 (and believe me, it's not) and I STILL would bump it down to 5 just because of this development. I am irritated right now. My entire endgame plan is shot.

YOU GIVE YOUR PARTY ULTIMATE EQUIPMENT. IT'S WHAT YOU GODDAM DO IN RPGS.

Kid needs a Rainbow Dagger, Karsh a Rainbow Axe, they need Rainbow Armor........but nope.

All because of one easily missed sidequest.

GAAAAAAAAAAH.

40 CHARACTERS
ALL smurfED OVER BECAUSE OF ONE SIDEQUEST
THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ANY OF THEM

Because Zappa hitting trout with a hammer relates to the Black Dragon for REASONS.

Well, if it makes you feel better there isn't really a post game to use it in anyways.

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Originally Posted by VeloZer0

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Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno

Elements go up to Level 8 but if memory serves me correct there is only one ability that is exclusively a Level 8 limit and its a plot ability you'll gain eventually.

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I assume you mean asside from the level 8 summons?.

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Figured I was spacing something but then again, the summons are more work than they are worth, so I'm not surprised I forgot about them.

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Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover

Maybe I'm just not supposed to be able to beat Dario right now? I mean, holy hell. I'm wandering around because I have no idea where the remaining three dragons are and I stopped by Home Forbidden Island because, well, maybe a dragon is there.

Nope, only Dario. And to make things worse, I have to have Riddel in my party. I had admittedly thought about using her earlier but this boss fight has taught me the rror of my ways. She smurfing sucks. She lasts maybe couple turns even with all the defense armor and accessories I have.

Sn now we're down to 2.

Only Lynx is basically good for support and nothing else. I guess because Dario is Black Element Lynx's normal attacks do a pathetic amount of damage. Karsh, my main damage dealer as far as melee goes, can manage doing about 200 if he get sa full combo in.

Anyway, point is, it's basically Karsh vs. Dario with Riddel dead as a door nail and Lynx clinging to dear life witha lot of healing.

I still got Dario down to his hurt animation though so I must have depleted maybe half of his HP or more? I think that will do for now.

But melee has to be the way to go here because he counters every Element I used on him. I have to beat him into submission with brute force, not magic. I think....

So I got Water Dragon and Earth Dragon. The others? Well Sky Dragon is there but he told me to bugger off until I could find the others. Only I don't see Fire Dragon Island or any of the others....

EDIT:

Thank you VeloZer0 for the suggestion of Eagle Eye. I haven't used it up to this point but with it Karsh was doing 100 or close to it a good chunk of the time. Unfortunately it still wasn't enough. Him on his own just can't beat this bastard right now.

Also I noticed there appears to be no difference in the status effect spells being + or -. Eagle Eye -1 seemed to boost him just as well as Eagle Eye + 2. Diminish also seemed to work just as well at handicapping Dario's moves even when I used the -2 version.

EDIT 2:

So the trick is that he doesn't just counter using Elements on him, he counters everything. His entire moveset is dependent on your last turn. So as long as i keep only physically attacking, all he will do is physically attack. Huh....

Apparently Fire is the way to go.

I really hate accepting help on things like this. Now I know the trick to it, I have no desire to fight or beat him.

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Yeah Red Element is the best because its the only thing he doesn't have a nasty counter for and you can basically trap him in a pattern. Dario is the game's hardest boss but he's largely optional but he does grant Serge his best weapon.

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FINAL EDIT:

Okay, real update time.

1. Hey, Kid is back! Only she's brainwashed and trying to kill us! And now she's gone again.... :(

More awesomeness from Kid's Theme, Star-Stealing Girl. I really loved the scene of Serge just taking a few steps away from the party and having all those flashbacks about her. Serge seems so much more...emotional and possessing of a personality than Chrono. This scene showed you the bond Serge and Kid share really well.

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Eh, I felt Crono was a fun character but then again its the alternate endings that really painted Crono for me as well as the official artwork stuff. Serge always felt a bit too much of a blank slate for my taste but maybe its because he is just an unwitting pawn to so many people in this game.

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2. Harle dies, right? I would have figured as much even if I hadn't been spoiled on it the other day. Sorry Harle, between you and the world, I choose the world. Oh, of course I said "I don't know" to her question but that was to be polite. If it had been Kid asking me to choose her or the world, then I might have chosen Kid. But Harle is not so endearing or interesting. Why the hell she had a heart-to-heart with Starky of all people, I don't know.

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I disagree, I love Harle and always found her more interesting than Kid. Funny enough, Harle is kind of an "alternate" of Kid so it makes the issue a bit moot I guess.

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3. How ironic - in Another World, everyone is alive except Dario. Even Viper made it. In Home though, Dario is the last one standing. I appreciated the backstory even if the fight gave me a headache. Interesting that not once did Home Dario ever stop to think about the fact "Riddel" isn't the one he married or loved. Home Riddel is dead. I guess you shouldn't sweat the details.

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It was pretty amusing.

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4. That Black Dragon fight was so hard! Or not. i just walked up and took the Relic. I guess I'll have to make sure to do the sidequest right on New Game+ so I can face him for real.

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He's not that hard actually but fighting him also nets you a chance to steal the Black Plate which makes the Dario fight infinitely easier.

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5. Speaking of which, I think I will in fact do multiple playtrhroughs. Not only for plot clarification but also because I have so many party members here and I want to test some of them out. I frickin' just got ANOTHER one. I want to test Cave-Girl's moveset out!

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Some of them like Pip are interesting and I do like some of the cast members but many of them are sadly a bit samey. Definitely do a second playthrough because this game was kind of designed to be played more than once like CT.

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7. Maybe it's just all the extra stuff available to me now but at this point, it feels like Serge has been Lynx longer than he was Serge. And Kid has been out of our party longer than she was in our party. I'm at 45 hours and I am missing our hero and heroine. Well, our hero is still there but you get what I mean.

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Yeah... you do spend a large chunk of the game as Lynx. Not sure how I feel about this as I was not exactly attached to Serge's true form anyway but whatever.

So when i first read "FATE" some time ago I was like "are they just being melodramatic?" with all the all caps thing. Now knowing that it's a computer makes more sense. Although it being based on Mother Brain - the genocidal anti-human thing from Robo's subplot - worries me some....

And man oh man was my suspicions right.

So my idea was I'd try and jot down my impressions as I went along but I think that kind killed the atmosphere or mood ya know?

So...Chronopolis. To begin with, some people have talked here and elsewhere about how "El Nido was its own thing." Like when I mentioned the fate of demi-humans/Fiends, people said El Nido was an isolated incident and the Fiends we helped in Medina might all still be doing just fine. I honestly didn't buy this idea because...well, it just seemed kinda silly. Perhaps its due to the technical limitations but I feel we saw practically nothing of the world iN Chrono Trigger. We saw a couple kingdoms, a couple random towns and that's it. I had it in my mind we glimpsed just as much of the planet iN CT as we did in CC.

But Chronopolis throws that all out of whack. El Nido truly is "an isolated incident" as it was a super-bubble of pet goldfish. They are nothing more or less than bred lab animals, even if the breeding was super-duper long. Do any real animals get bred "in captivity" for 10,000 years? At that point is it even captivity? Then again, FATE intervened so directly that it kinda is. That poor wannabe poet waitress....

I recall talk earlier about Lavos wiping out the Reptiles "being no accident." And this seems to confirm that idea. Mammals, or more precisely humans, were the creatures Lavos chose and the Reptiles bit the big one. I see now what people were saying about Lavos guiding evolution being a thing iN CC that might have been retroactively put into CT. In any event, I made sure to listen to all the...ghosts? Memories? Time-frozen consciousnesses? I made sure to read everything tey had to say and the one I liked was the idea that humans are such contradictory beings because our evolution has been altered by Lavos. We are contaminated which leads to the way we all live our sad little lives in hate while simultaneously wanting tlove. it's the paradox of starting war for peace and it's all Lavos' fault.

On a more substantive level, let me see if I'm getting Events straight.

El Nido Bubble is created at some point in the future.

Everything is going great for a long, long time.

TheN Wazuki and Miguel stumble upon Chronopolis. For...some reason, Serge is healed by the Frozen Flame and "chosen" by him too as "Arbiter"? Did Wazuki and Miguel just stumble through the facility until they found the giant energy thing? I guess it might help explain things if I knew what the Flame really was.... In all the information I received, I don't recall theme ver saying precisely what it was. Oh wait! Something to do with Lavos? It fell from the sky with Lavos? Is it perhaps like the Mammon Machine? Drawing out Lavos' endless power to do....anything? Still doesn't explain the whole Serge situation though.

I'm getting serious Xenogears vibes from this whole section however. Save Points being used as monitoring devices, the main character had his fate altered by coming into "contact" with a super-energy source, a sort of god-like computer thing.... Heh, I've heard Deus called a 'Lavos Clone" but FATE kinda reminds me more of Deus in a way.

Oh yeah!

[youtube1ercQOGIcAc[/youtube]

Substitute "Yamcha" with "Robo." What the hell was that? I'm still not sold on Kato hating Chrono Trigger or its cast but I think he might have hated Robo.

Also, as a boss, FATE was kind of annoying. Not hard but I had to run away the first time because Serge died. I'm gonna consult a guide because this is getting ridiculous. I have precisely ONE Revive Element and if Serge dies, I'm screwed. I must be missing something.

I also missed some goodies I think. I have no idea HOW I missed it but I missed "Recharge" in Chronpolis.

I also didn't steal whatever the hell FATE had to steal. I got it the first time - when Serge died - but the second time around I said smurf it. Probably gonna regret that but oh wel.

Back to story...I'm utterly at a loss for how the prologue of this game plays into what's going on now. Serge and Kid are after lynx? But right now we're after the Dragons who, if I'm understanding this right, are the super-beings who reign over the future in which the Reptiles inherit the Earth. How the hell does Lynx play into this?

This is pretty neat turn of events though, in every way. The whole El Nido reveal, the kind and holy Dragons being vengeful Reptiles, etc.. I wonder if they're still gonna have that awesome music when they show up again? Be kinda contradictory but at the same time fitting.



Also all the stuff with "Time Crash" and whatever? I'm not sure if i get any of that. I think the big and small of it is that they tried to do an experiment, trout went wrong, and both Chronpolis and Dinopolis ended up in El Nido. But now I'm thinking on this, I realize just how confused I am.... Isn't Chronpolis from the future? Then how did they create El Nido in the past? And wait, wasn't the experiment that screwed up everything them trying to manipulate time? But they already did that with El Nido, right...? I'm lost now. Did Wazuki and Miguel happen upon the destroyed Chronopolis that got sucked back in time?

EDIT:

Yessss, Kid is back! Although that flashback was appropriately nightmarish. I'm not sure how much control I have over what happens there? Is there a "bad' way to do it? Can you screw up and leave Kid in a coma? Masa and Mune said they were running out of power so I got scared and thought they meant the thing was almost over and I had to hurry up and save Kid or risk losing her forever.

The kids' drawings of the CT cast was also adorable yet heartbreaking. As was Gato being there but unable to help and beign destroyed....

EDIT 2:

I just got Lucca's letter from...Luccia.

Wow.

kid is Schala? Only, not the Schala we knew? She mentioned someone from the distant past who was gentle and all the rest of it and yes, Schala did cross my mind. But, come on, we barely spent five minutes with her! So I dismissed that possibility. yet no sooner than had I dismissed it when the next line, about Janus being there to protect Kid, sealed the deal. Kid is Schala... One of the weakest characters from CT is the best character in CC.

Depending on your next update, I can try to sort some of this out for you because frankly it is pretty confusing the first time around. Right now, it's almost 3 a.m. and I need to get some sleep. :eep:

I understand where my problem was. Everything was kinda being dumped in my lap at the same time so, in my mind, I thought it all happened at the same time. That El Nido was created before the experiment thing. But, now I know the Time Crash happened, everyone got sucked into the past, and THEN El Nido was made. That is much more sensible.

AND I BEAT THE GAME!!!! Even got the Real Ending. I say it's all pure luck. Once he...she....it stops spamming Green Elements, you have a chance for victory. I played defensive, saving up everyone's Stamina best I could and making damned sure to keep Serge's Stamina full. I got all the way through Yellow, Red, Green, Blue and Black before he finally got a damned move in. But guess what move it was? PHOTON BEAM! Yep, White! Thank you, video game AI for loving me.

I think I might go to sleep and collect my thoughts on the ending and teh game as a whole but I'm gonna say this right now.

What disappointed me about the ending? Not the little kids with their exposition - couldn't care less about that. The fact Balthasar somehow arranged ALL of this? That is kind of annoying but, hey, wouldn't be the first monumentally and impossibly complex scheme in fiction.

No, what bugged me was Lynx and FATE dying. AND NO ONE CARED. Admittedly right after this there was a big problem in the form of the Dragon God but come on. Lynx has been our central antagonist for 98% of the game. He has bee a driving force of malice and evil and is tied up in a lot of characte's plots. He's also Serge's poor, mind-screwed father.

Nobody cares. He just...dies. No deathbed monologue, not even a little scene between him and Kid or him and Serge or...or someone! What the hell, game. There's just no frickin' closure at all. It was so disappointing in fact that I honestly didn't think the FATE boss fight was the end of him. I was half-certain Lynx would reappear somehow at some point but, nope. That was his end, in all its complete anticlimactic glory.

Good game though and that was only a minor nitpick on the whole. Just saying what is fresh in my mind.

I think that once you get a certain amount into the elemental chain the time devourer starts helping you do it. Also once you get all 6 locked in it just kind of sits there until you build up enough to use the Chrono Cross. Making it not quite so ridiculously difficult.

I though the fay the entire thing was wrapped up in CC was a little on the weak side. It was building up very strong, and then kind of meh. Grated that is the failing of just about every video game that tries to be really complicated and philosophical.

I'm still trying to get to sleep and I won't feel ready to write up my final thoughts until I get some rest. In the meantime...

Dost thou seeketh to break the chains of fate? A son of man to challenge the
Goddess of Fate? Fascinating... Then confront my trials.


Once you learn about the Dragons and their intent, this song becomes a bit less appropriate maybe?