BoB, you're missing the point of my argument. My point is that if you only play games for plot, then what does a JRPG offer from a storytelling standpoint, that another genre can't supply if they both have strong stories? For instance, I can say with confidence that MGS3 is a better written game than anything SE released on the PS2, and it's not even a close race. I would also argue MGS3 offers a better gameplay experience over everything SE released on the PS2, again, for me this is not even a close race. Yet I still like FFXII and FFX... well we won't dwell on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
For the longest time, all the way back to the NES/Master System days, the JRPGs strength lied in its ability to tell a story which most other games didn't or couldn't do. Double Dragon, Mario, and Sonic all have excuse plots to give context but nothing more. It was games like Phantasy Star, DQIV, and FFIV that game the characters more purpose and meaning. If you wanted a thinking game back in the early 90s, you played RPGs or Adventure games because they were not simply about collecting coins, or beating up people. They offered narratives that gave real purpose and created characters with their own story arcs that offered emotional highs and lows, but with the advent of 3D and the gaming industry focusing on more of a cinematic experience, games that once only offered excuses to romp through their worlds were now focusing more on characters and world building. Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil, Silent Hill, Tomb Raider, and hell even Tekken and old school plat-formers began to start emphasizing story and world building into their games. What really separates FFVII from Metal Gear Solid and Silent Hill? Largely gameplay and length but character writing and world building are something they all share.
Most JRPG fans I meet only play the games for the plot, I will argue the gameplay needs to be updated and made more challenging and then they whine on about how they are only here for the story and don't want the gameplay to be improved to hinder their ability to progress, at which point I always question why they bother to play when they could YouTube the custscenes or read a transcript of the game's plot. What does the game portion bring that is worth keeping? If your favorite RPGs didn't have a plot and were just blank slate characters, would you still play them and love them? I'm simply pointing out that JRPGs made a mistake twenty years ago and decided to put all their eggs into one basket in terms of focusing on plot and character to the detriment of everything else. Now they are in an age where good character and storytelling are a dime a dozen, the plots people are talking about this last gen are not XIII's, Xenoblades, or Dark Souls, people are talking about The Last of Us, Bioshock, Uncharted, Spec OPS: The Line, and Mass Effect. The genre's one major attribute is no longer unique or even as good as other genres that have adopted it. So then I ask what does an RPG have left to offer to a gamer? The point I'm getting at is that the genre needs to work on that gameplay part of the game and maybe take a chapter out of some of these other games play book.
When I was young, I forced myself to get further into FFVI, I reached the Opera scene and was surprised to find myself thrust into a story event mini-game with no heads up, I wasn't watching an opera unfold, I was experiencing it through gameplay and it changed my way of thinking both about FFVI and gaming's potential as a storytelling medium. Twenty years later, I'm playing Uncharted that made me playthrough set pieces inspired by Hollywood's finest, Modern Warfare had me experience a soldier's dying breath from radiation poisoning, MGS4 has me seamlessly jumping from story cutscene and frantic motorbike chases, Bioshock is twisting my mind with its clever writing, and FFXIII? Well it made me walk down a long pretty corridor until a custscene happened at which point I placed the controller down and watched it like a good boy, then when it was done, I moved forward, occasionally getting into fights where I let the A.I. do most of the heavy lifting before winning and moving onto the next plot point where again, I sat my controller and watched it like a movie. The genre that kind of pushed the envelope in making the player experience the story twenty years ago has now all but divorced the game and story from each other. The player is no longer involved in what happens, at this point I'm watching a movie or TV series, the player has no agency any longer, and if some of these other games can offer a more stimulating experience then why are we bothering with JRPGs?
I'm simply trying to get to the core of why we play these games, especially since all we ever seem to do is whine about how they are not as good as the old days but still we stand in line for the next installment because we've apparently been trained too. So why do we keep doing this to ourselves? Is there some inherent value to the genre that is understood but not said that keeps us coming back or are we simply Pavlov's Dogs salivating to a bell that signals the JRPG of yore we grew up on, even though its been years since the genre offered an experience on par with it?
Two of those games mentioned are handhelds and part of a different gaming generation as it is. Two of the other games are infamous for cleaning up the muck the genre has become by offering challenge and a streamlined interface that doesn't sacrifice the strengths of the genre's game design principles. Neither game is helped by one alienating its audience with its brutal difficulty and the other saw a limited release on a console most self-professed "hardcore" gamers would prefer to forget about. Doesn't change they were both wonderful though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolivar
Yes, there were some great gems this generation, but you can't tell me that in another five years, supposing we get a good stock this current generation (and it's already looking more promising) that we won't be looking back to this period and saying it was definitely the weakest generation in terms of good games in the genre.
