Reviews

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Originally Posted by Depression Moon

Well I can agree that the fanbase is everywhere and most of them can't agree on what they want.

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with all the flamewars involving that game.

I don't pay attention to G4's recommedations.They can hate a game or love it.Whether I buy it won't be determine by what they think of it.

Is FFXIII all it could have been ? No. Would I have designed it differently and I feel better if I had been the producer ?Surely.
But it is what it is and if you look at the interview with Toriyama he doesn't seem inclined to make western style changes or to go back to fuller games.He seems to like this "streamlining" he did with this game and if it sells well as it seem to be doing Square has no incentive to change.

:(

It just comes down to this:

Everyone is searching for that new VI, new VII, new *insert favorite game in the series* that'll singlehandedly "revitalize the series" for them.

Well, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but, that is never going to happen. What made these games so great wasn't even necessarily gameplay, story, mechanics, or any of the other commonly quoted reasons (do you seriously want to make the argument that a menu game is fun and intuitive?).

The fact is that those games that are so commonly quoted as the favorites were pretty much genre defining games for reasons almost entirely not related to the game. Usually it was either the person's first Final Fantasy and sticks as their favorite in the genre for nostalgic reasons (regardless of whether or not they want to admit it). If your first Final Fantasy was X and you grew to be a fan of Final Fantasy, I'm going to bet that FFX is probably going to be your favorite FF. You will never again have the first Final Fantasy game experience. Or the game left an indelible impact on the minds of the players for social reasons and cannot be reproduced. Half the reason the killing of Aeris was so shocking was that A. ) No one expected that to happen in a game...character's don't die for really reals in games...and those that had died in games before didn't have the additional effect of being in 3-D, the fact that the game was so graphically advanced for the time added a great deal to the impact of that scene vs. an 8 bit, 16 bit, et cetera character's death. And B. ) that was my healer...man...

I would bet my income on that if FFVII was re-released with revamped graphics that the Aeris death scene won't be as powerful as it was the first time you saw it. Unless of course it was your very first exposure to the game - and even then it won't be as big of a deal as it was when the game came out.

I could go on, but I'll save the details. FFXIII has it's problems, but you know, I'll give you a list of problems and reasons not to play any of the FF games out there. And on the other token I can also give you a myriad of reasons why it's a good game to play (I might have to realllly go out of my way for X-2 though, that was, well. We don't speak of that one).

So you can either focus on every flaw and ruin your game experience or you can take the game for what it's worth and have some fun. Take your pick. But if you're looking to see your favorite final fantasy you're going to be disappointed.

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Originally Posted by Siegurd

It just comes down to this:

Everyone is searching for that new VI, new VII, new *insert favorite game in the series* that'll singlehandedly "revitalize the series" for them.

Well, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but, that is never going to happen. What made these games so great wasn't even necessarily gameplay, story, mechanics, or any of the other commonly quoted reasons (do you seriously want to make the argument that a menu game is fun and intuitive?).

The fact is that those games that are so commonly quoted as the favorites were pretty much genre defining games for reasons almost entirely not related to the game. Usually it was either the person's first Final Fantasy and sticks as their favorite in the genre for nostalgic reasons (regardless of whether or not they want to admit it). If your first Final Fantasy was X and you grew to be a fan of Final Fantasy, I'm going to bet that FFX is probably going to be your favorite FF. You will never again have the first Final Fantasy game experience. Or the game left an indelible impact on the minds of the players for social reasons and cannot be reproduced. Half the reason the killing of Aeris was so shocking was that A. ) No one expected that to happen in a game...character's don't die for really reals in games...and those that had died in games before didn't have the additional effect of being in 3-D, the fact that the game was so graphically advanced for the time added a great deal to the impact of that scene vs. an 8 bit, 16 bit, et cetera character's death. And B. ) that was my healer...man...

I would bet my income on that if FFVII was re-released with revamped graphics that the Aeris death scene won't be as powerful as it was the first time you saw it. Unless of course it was your very first exposure to the game - and even then it won't be as big of a deal as it was when the game came out.

I could go on, but I'll save the details. FFXIII has it's problems, but you know, I'll give you a list of problems and reasons not to play any of the FF games out there. And on the other token I can also give you a myriad of reasons why it's a good game to play (I might have to realllly go out of my way for X-2 though, that was, well. We don't speak of that one).

So you can either focus on every flaw and ruin your game experience or you can take the game for what it's worth and have some fun. Take your pick. But if you're looking to see your favorite final fantasy you're going to be disappointed.

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Thank you. Ive been saying this for eons but not quite as direct.

FFXIII has a lot of problems, but also a lot of good things about it, just like with every other FF. The question is, are you prepared to play it for what it is and will it ultimately give you a joyful experience that outweighs all the negatives?
With most FF games it has been yes for me, even when there are some glaring issues.

Final Fantasy is unique in the aspect that every game is different, this is very good, but it also creates the unique problems within the fanbase and critics. No 2 of these people can agree on what makes a good Final Fantasy, so naturally the older the series gets, the more the 'fanbase' is split everytime between people who love it and hate it (the inbetweeners arent as loud as the rest).

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Originally Posted by Siegurd

It just comes down to this:

Everyone is searching for that new VI, new VII, new *insert favorite game in the series* that'll singlehandedly "revitalize the series" for them.

Well, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but, that is never going to happen. What made these games so great wasn't even necessarily gameplay, story, mechanics, or any of the other commonly quoted reasons (do you seriously want to make the argument that a menu game is fun and intuitive?).

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If no one here didn't believe this then why are they here and why do you play the games? also with the validation that a series can't revitalize itself with a series that is similar to the game you first played and loved, well I can personally say that outside of this series, Zelda and Mario have been able to do it.

Note that I didn't state there aren't games that could 'revitalize' an established series, but rather that there isn't going to be a singular game that revitalizes the series for each individual member of the fanbase precisely because it's such a long running series with different experiences and expectations. Honestly, XIII did a lot to revitalize enthusiasm for me, and I started with the original. I'm not going to make the argument that XIII is a perfect game, and I'm not going to make the argument that any of them were perfect games. One of my favorite aspects of XIII is precisely the small references scattered here and there to the older games.

Someone whose first game was X is going to have a drastically different opinion of what needs to be done to revitalize the series than someone who started with IV, and while there are common middle grounds, rarely is this going to please both sides to the extent that would be necessary to satisfy either camp. There are some specific traits that define what a Final Fantasy is - and as long as those are maintained I'm all for attempts to fine tune the machine. But then again, I went into XIII with no expectation what so ever after having been so disappointed with XII.

So you could argue that I like XIII because the battle system is better than XIII's, or you could argue that I like XIII's battle system because I had already played through a lot of the Shin Megami Tensei games and was already okay with the whole "main character death = game over" aspect. It's anyone's guess, and it doesn't matter.

XIII has a good story (would have been great had there been a little bit better story-telling mechanics)

XIII has great gameplay - it's fast paced, requires on the fly stratagem changes and has a new-age feeling to it while maintaining classic FF qualities (ATB) that people are familiar with. It's far and away the best system battle system they've had so far. It certainly helped to add an epic feeling to certain fights and you couldn't necessarily just completely out pace the content by over-leveling, which isn't a bad thing.

XIII has top of the line graphical capabilities and is just a beautiful world to walk around in.

Individual fights in XIII have the ability to just wipe you out - making the content overall better as opposed to "just losing because you're slowly whittled away." This adds more challenge to the game overall - since there's no mana and you refill hp upon battle completion it allows you to go all out and use tools that otherwise don't get used often because it's not mana efficient in the long run.

XIII didn't totally make summons completely worthless, albeit some of the limitations needed to be adjusted for the relative power each has.

XIII's linearity really isn't something you end up getting irritated about because of the active story telling and the fact that you're kept in a fairly fast paced state the whole time unless you consciously choose to stop. This is something I doubt that people who don't read reviews or the like would ever key in on until they heard someone else say something. However, there is a pretty linear aspect to it, there isn't really a feel for something going on behind the scenes, you don't get lost in a world, you're focused completely on the task, there aren't really any big huge surprises (but I guess that card has been played to death) to make you go "wow." But for the story it does make sense, i mean they kind of are focused to get their task done pretty quickly.

XIII has tons of references both obvious and subtle to previous FF titles - let's face it, regardless of your opinion for IX, (SPOILER)being introduced to Cid on the Lindblum was pretty cool, as an example of one of the more obvious references.

I'd say those attributes make for a pretty solid FF.

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Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF

In any event, GamesRadar have made me feel a good bit better about FFXIII. Their review addresses most of my concerns and points out that, well, I love FFX to death and that was linear as hell.

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Yea, that review was key to my excitement for the game, and I haven't even played FFX.

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Originally Posted by Siegurd

The fact is that those games that are so commonly quoted as the favorites were pretty much genre defining games for reasons almost entirely not related to the game. Usually it was either the person's first Final Fantasy and sticks as their favorite in the genre for nostalgic reasons (regardless of whether or not they want to admit it). If your first Final Fantasy was X and you grew to be a fan of Final Fantasy, I'm going to bet that FFX is probably going to be your favorite FF. You will never again have the first Final Fantasy game experience. Or the game left an indelible impact on the minds of the players for social reasons and cannot be reproduced. Half the reason the killing of Aeris was so shocking was that A. ) No one expected that to happen in a game...character's don't die for really reals in games...and those that had died in games before didn't have the additional effect of being in 3-D, the fact that the game was so graphically advanced for the time added a great deal to the impact of that scene vs. an 8 bit, 16 bit, et cetera character's death. And B. ) that was my healer...man...

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I have been playing FF games since the original. I loved FFI and FFIV growing up, and FFVI was amazing, but none of those are my favorite FF game, or even among my favorite, nor am I looking for retreads of those games (or FFVII or FFV or FFT). I am really enjoying FFXIII so far, as the great new game it is.

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Originally Posted by eestlinc

I have been playing FF games since the original. I loved FFI and FFIV growing up, and FFVI was amazing, but none of those are my favorite FF game, or even among my favorite, nor am I looking for retreads of those games (or FFVII or FFV or FFT). I am really enjoying FFXIII so far, as the great new game it is.

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Well in that case your in the blissful minority :)

I'm up to chapter 11 now, and I must say it's been a blast to play so far, and I can firmly say I disagree with all those negative reviews whining about "linearity", "no NPCs!" and "no towns!". If the story had been dragged down by that kind of nonsense, I would have been sorely disappointed. Few have been the times that I wanted to see the next cutscene as fast as possible, and luckily for me, XIII is designed to do just that.

Gameplay is very enjoyable, as good as XII's was, though grinding for items or CP is less fun and fluid as hunting for loot was in XII. Graphics are gorgeous, especially in chapter 11. And the cast is the best ever in a FF game.

I'd give it between 8 and 9 just for being fun and enjoyable. The lack of towns, NPCs (which are both actually there) or minigames I've barely noticed.

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Originally Posted by Elpizo

I'm up to chapter 11 now, and I must say it's been a blast to play so far, and I can firmly say I disagree with all those negative reviews whining about "linearity", "no NPCs!" and "no towns!". If the story had been dragged down by that kind of nonsense, I would have been sorely disappointed.

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I'm having a 'blast' with FFXIII too but I disagree with the notion that the addition of towns and NPC's would have been disappointing. The main complaint I have with the game so far is that, from what I can see, there have been no real departures from the telling of the story. This is a problem because some of the most memorable scenes from video games, for me anyway, don't necessarily advance the plot in any way. The date scene in FFVII for example. There was no point to it, it was just a couple of friends having some fun at an amusement park.

It's all down to what you like I guess. For me, I like to explore towns and talk to random people. I like to feel that the 'quest' I'm on isn't the only thing going on in the world, and the character's take time out to just enjoy themselves. I suppose when you're a ticking C'ieth time bomb though you don't have the luxury of relaxing in the pub and having a pint.

But from a story point of view, having towns or NPCs to talk to would not make sense. (SPOILER)The world hates you. =/

Well no one will know you're a l'Cie if you keep your brand hidden so I don't see why interacting with NPC's would have been difficult.

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Originally Posted by Jings

Well no one will know you're a l'Cie if you keep your brand hidden so I don't see why interacting with NPC's would have been difficult.

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But that would require a costume change! :p

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Originally Posted by Elpizo

But from a story point of view, having towns or NPCs to talk to would not make sense. (SPOILER)The world hates you. =/

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That isn't the reason why there aren't NPC. The decision had nothing to do with the story. In the same way Avalanche members can talk to Shin-Ra soldiers and Shin-Ra's mayor, and even Palmer.

There are no NPC because the game designers chose not to have them, same way they chose not to have towns because "It was too hard to do in HD"

This whole "the story doesn't permit it" is largely a cop out to try and excuse what they did.

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Originally Posted by Elpizo

I'm up to chapter 11 now, and I must say it's been a blast to play so far, and I can firmly say I disagree with all those negative reviews whining about "linearity", "no NPCs!" and "no towns!". If the story had been dragged down by that kind of nonsense, I would have been sorely disappointed. Few have been the times that I wanted to see the next cutscene as fast as possible, and luckily for me, XIII is designed to do just that.

Gameplay is very enjoyable, as good as XII's was, though grinding for items or CP is less fun and fluid as hunting for loot was in XII. Graphics are gorgeous, especially in chapter 11. And the cast is the best ever in a FF game.

I'd give it between 8 and 9 just for being fun and enjoyable. The lack of towns, NPCs (which are both actually there) or minigames I've barely noticed.

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If people like it that's fine and I expect to like it when I play it but I hope people don't make up reasons to defend the game by taking shots at things that worked well in previous games.

If FFV has towns and is loaded with npcs I fully expect to give it a shot like I do with this game.I won't criticize it for having those things and while I would have preferred them to be in this game I won't slam it for not having them.:p

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Originally Posted by ANGRYWOLF

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Originally Posted by Elpizo

I'm up to chapter 11 now, and I must say it's been a blast to play so far, and I can firmly say I disagree with all those negative reviews whining about "linearity", "no NPCs!" and "no towns!". If the story had been dragged down by that kind of nonsense, I would have been sorely disappointed. Few have been the times that I wanted to see the next cutscene as fast as possible, and luckily for me, XIII is designed to do just that.

Gameplay is very enjoyable, as good as XII's was, though grinding for items or CP is less fun and fluid as hunting for loot was in XII. Graphics are gorgeous, especially in chapter 11. And the cast is the best ever in a FF game.

I'd give it between 8 and 9 just for being fun and enjoyable. The lack of towns, NPCs (which are both actually there) or minigames I've barely noticed.

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If people like it that's fine and I expect to like it when I play it but I hope people don't make up reasons to defend the game by taking shots at things that worked well in previous games.

If FFV has towns and is loaded with npcs I fully expect to give it a shot like I do with this game.I won't criticize it for having those things and while I would have preferred them to be in this game I won't slam it for not having them.:p

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I'm not taking shots at previous FF games. Towns and NPCs were in there, okay, no problem, didn't mind and never will. They aren't in XIII. Okay, no problem, I don't mind and never will. XIII has a good and interesting story, and I'm glad they made it so that it flows as quickly as possible.