What's left to ruin that hasn't already been ruined?Quote:
Originally Posted by Locky
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What's left to ruin that hasn't already been ruined?Quote:
Originally Posted by Locky
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
Whats the point of even having allies if theyre not going to at least give you a decent meal when you need it. The deal was the Nightswatch can use the town to resupply if they turn a blind eye to the horrible stuff craster does, the Crows kept up thier end of the bargain, Craster did not. Sure "Give us food or we kill you" is more of a bad guy's bargain but Craster knew the stakes and I find it odd that he would willingly provoke a large group of hungry men with only a town of submissive women to defend him.Quote:
Originally Posted by FormalhautYou know what? I agree with you Sam. We agree on something! Yes!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
The thing is, Mormont was just what the Night's Watch needed. Sure, no-one liked Craster, but Mormont had that patience and tread a very thin line. While I understand the Nights Watch were in pretty dire straights, they still have to be patient: bear in mind they turned up completely unannounced. Craster technically didn't have to let them stay.
Lucky they werent in WesterosQuote:
What we have to remember though is that the Nights Watch is made mainly of thieves and criminals. But still, killing under guest right is just a mortal sin in Westeros.
[QUOTE=blackmage_nuke;3246780]
Whats the point of even having allies if theyre not going to at least give you a decent meal when you need it. The deal was the Nightswatch can use the town to resupply if they turn a blind eye to the horrible stuff craster does, the Crows kept up thier end of the bargain, Craster did not.
I'm not saying Craster's being hard done by here, I can't stand him and he probably should have done more, but he's not an outright enemy. He proves to be an incredibly unworthy ally, but not an outright foe.
It's amibguous. A 10-year summer means a long-ass winter and he can't feast these guys every day with a full house to feed. At the same time, he is holding out, and with everything else the NW have gone through, it all erupts into one of the many magnificent plot volcanoes you unsuspecting viewers are in store for this season :semicolonpee:
True, Craster is not known for the readings of situations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolivar
"Hrm, a motley bunch of starving, half-dead criminals with swords and a festering anger issue is at my door step, and they are getting angrier as I insult them. Nothing could possibly go wrong here!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
He is a foe, he's rude to them. They were in real trouble when they came back and he was going to let them suffer. That's not an ally, imo.
Hmm, I see your point, but then again a enemy would just refuse entry in the first place or even worse, attack you. Craster's definitely not a worthy or good ally, but then again, he's not the worst enemy beyond the wall. He's definitely the lesser of three evils to the Nights Watch (between the others, wildlings and himself)Quote:
Originally Posted by Locky
Either way, it's all semantics anyway. I can't wait for Jon Snow's storyline, which let's be honest has really been on the backburner.
Foes don't give you food and shelter in Westeros (SPOILER)LOL. He really can't afford to host and feast the Night's Watch as match as they'd like and maybe the show doesn't get that across as well since it only looks like it's 10-20 guys and they probably haven't stressed the harshness and unusual length of seasons enough in a while.
Started playing Game of Thrones Ascent on Facebook. It is surprisingly fun.
I dont understand what Baeric Dondarion's story is.
Glad Jon Snuuuuaaahhhhoohhh got some.
Not much happened this episode after the initial fight.
You know nothing Jon snoooooooohhhhh
also....
http://25.media.tumblr.com/74665a00d...waqao1_500.gif
Aww, I wish Stannis was my dad.
:roll2
Brienne has a pretty sexy butt.
I have no idea who the new name between Ilyn Payne and The Hound on Arya's list is. Someone please explain who he is and what he did to Arya.
Nice ending credit, poor Sansa, creepy fetus jars. I think Stannis is just attracted to crazy.
He was the old captain of the guard, the one that killed the prostitute's baby and also attacked Syrio.
Was there a reason why he wasnt he on the first list back at Harrenhal?
okay so basically RECAP:
Jon Snow apparently knows SOMETHING :jokey:
Stannis likes creepy chicks
But Stannis also has a cute daughter :love:
Brienne has a nice ass
CERSEI AND TYRION GET TROLLED
did I miss anything important?
Robb being stupid!
She was still writing the list back at Harrenhal, I guess? She was adding to it literally every time we saw a scene with her doing it and not everyone she added was someone right in front of her.
Also Beric Dondarrion :stare: Okay so the Warlocks said their magic came back when the Dragons did, I wonder if the same has been true of R'hllor's priests. Between shadowbabby, magical clones of yourself, and now bringing people back from the dead, there's some serious trout going on.
Stannis' kid is the sweetest little girl, how did she end up so sweet when her mom is so battrout and creepy and wept with joy when the woman her husband smurfed told her of it? Teaching Davos to read :squee:
Honestly I knew something was going to happen to ruin Sansa's day but I expected it to be a good deal worse than that. Tyrion's a decent man, at least. Mind you there's still time.
Also Robb you were stone cold right there sentencing those guys to hang. Karstark was kind of a prick though, he was mad when he thought Robb would let him go then he was mad when he was about to be killed. The difference between Theon killing Cassel and Robb killing Karstark was pretty great too. I wonder how Theon's enjoying Crazy Guy's House Of Fun?
Man I knew I was right about Jaime and how troutty he feels about being called Kingslayer and all that despite him actually having plenty of reasons beyond wanting to be on the winning side.
Oh right that. Seems to be turning into a regular thing to be honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Given that Frey wouldn't let Robb cross a bridge without two betrothals, I doubt there's anything Robb could offer him that will bring his army on board even if he hadn't broken one of those promises and married Talisa.
Brienne has a nice ass but so does Jaime. I don't know why you guys are leaving that part out.
Shireen is so much more lovable in the show! D'awww!
I liked this episode a lot. It certainly wasn't as actiony as the previous one but it went through a lot of important events, especially in terms of character development.
Edit: also great song in the credits! Just wish it was more foreboding like Patchface's ramblings, which it's based upon.
I preferred Ygritte's ass if that's what we're discussing.
Shireen is indeed a precious little darling though. I usually hate kids but her friendly cheerfulness to see her daddy and the Onion Knight was adorable. Bless. :)
Looks like it's all falling apart for Robb though. Great military commander and strategist, pretty smurfing atrocious politician.
Yeah there were a lot of asses in this show and it would be hard to choose between them.
And yeah Robb is definitely his father's son. I can understand why he did it, but he should really have put Karstark under house arrest instead because like I said I somehow doubt Walder Frey is going to be very impressed when he shows up cap-in-hand.
My theory is that he will show Walder Frey his ass and that will somehow make it all okay.
Am currently watching it as I'm typing. I'm at the end of Dondarrion's death/rebirth. Arya's screaming really makes it feel quite visceral for a opening segment.
Who was that naked guy in the gay scene because he had the best ass in the episode
So many asses, not sure which one I like best, tbh
Maybe they'll compare asses? I dunno about you but Walder Frey's ass would be top notch entertainment. Prime time material right there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
I never got why he wouldn't go to the Vale? lysa may be crazy but at least she's related to the tullys. Silly Robb, now littlefinger is going to go there and sweep her away while you're playing at the bridge.
Ygritte > Brienne > Jaime
Also, the scene with Arya and Gendry was fantastic.
I can be your family.
You wouldn't be my family. You'd be m'lady.
:cry:
ohmanohmanohmanfunstuffcomingsoonsoexcited
Did we watch the same episode?Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
1. Sandor Clegane slays Dondarrion, and Thoros of Myr raises him from the dead. The Hound walks free.
2. Robb Stark holds to honor, much like his father, despite the consequences, and sentences Lord Karstark to die, costing him the loyalty of half his men. Declares he intends to win back the loyalty of the Freys.
3. Jon Snow breaks his oaths to keep them.
4. Jaime reveals the circumstances under which he became the Kingslayer, revealing depth about his character beyond being an insufferable ass.
5. Tywin declares that Tyrion will marry Sansa so that the Lannisters can take claim of Winterfell, or at least what's left of it.
Maybe it's just because I know what's coming as a consequence of all this already, but this episode is more stacked than most in important moments. Great episode.
The only thing to say against it is perhaps that the Jaime scene was kind of heavy-handed.
When Brienne grabs Jaime and calls out Kingslayer and he whispers, my name is Jaime it's just a bit, no it's a lot, off-putting and melodramatic.
Cas after the fight it was just ASS ASS ASS ASS and talking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!Did we watch the same episode?Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
1. Sandor Clegane slays Dondarrion, and Thoros of Myr raises him from the dead. The Hound walks free.
2. Robb Stark holds to honor, much like his father, despite the consequences, and sentences Lord Karstark to die, costing him the loyalty of half his men. Declares he intends to win back the loyalty of the Freys.
3. Jon Snow breaks his oaths to keep them.
4. Jaime reveals the circumstances under which he became the Kingslayer, revealing depth about his character beyond being an insufferable ass.
5. Tywin declares that Tyrion will marry Sansa so that the Lannisters can take claim of Winterfell, or at least what's left of it.
Maybe it's just because I know what's coming as a consequence of all this already, but this episode is more stacked than most in important moments. Great episode.
You are going to get really, really disappointed when they start doing material from the fourth and fifth books if political intrigue without people having swords run through them isn't enough to sustain your attention.
Number of things wrong with this: ZeroQuote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
Agreed. I haven't even read the books, and I really enjoy the 'slower' paced episodes. It allows you to connect more with the characters; Jaime got tons of development, so did Arya. Even the Baratheons had a tender moment with Shireen, even if Selsye is bordering on psychopathic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!
None of that would have been achieved if it was just "stab stab stab". Besides, we got our slice of action at the start. Get that done with, and then really let the story let loose. I'm glad Jon Snow got more to do than just walking. Even with the Lords kiss though, his storyline hasn't quite caught fire yet this season, though I suspect the next episode and further will probably focus more on the north.
Poor Bran and co. have barely got a look-in so far.
Poor Bran?
Poor Meera Reed. They've really treated her like nothing in the scenes she's been in.
Lol Robb
the episode before last night's was great, felt a little let down in last nights episode.
but hopefully (if Im thinking right) the next episode will probably be the best
I could be wrong but whatevs :kakapo:
Judging from the episode titles, episode nine will be the one that makes everyone trout themselves.
This one was ok. Better than the first couple but not better than last week's.
I like every time Tywin is in a scene. It means the plot will actually move forward rather than blah blah character development. A good scene moves the plot forward and shows character development. The scene of Rob vs. Karstark was a great example of this. Jamie's scene was interesting to learn but all in all it was just a scene in the bath.
I don't mind when they focus on the political stuff but I still like things to actually progress in that regard. We got some great bits of that from Rob and the Lannisters this week but not much else.
The sword fight between Hound and Dondarrion was pretty weak. If the sword wasn't on fire it would have been lame. The events that followed were crazy though.
Okay, I didn't want to say anything at first... But I swear I saw Jaime's balls.
Yeah there was a bit of balls.
Jaime continues to be my favorite character and he just shattered my heart during the bath scene. I know there's a fine bit of deep character development throughout the entirety of the cast, but seeing him as he is now in comparison to the Jaime Lannister at the beginning of the show is to witness an absolutely astonishing character change.
I am in agreement that Tywin gets trout done. I was glad to see that he wasn't just going to be a trout to Tyrion; marrying Cersei off as well was an incredibly wise move on his part.
Also in agreement about how goddamn adorbs Stannis' daughter is and how full her heart is for Davos.
Robb was just beaming with charisma during this episode. I'm not sure what it was. Should have listened to his council, though, goshdangit!
Really great episode. Thoroughly impressed at the nice follow-up from last week's.
He was sent out (by Ned, I think?) to track down The Mountain. The Mountain killed him, and Thoros (a priest of R'hollor) revived him. At some point (I believe when Ned was executed) they said smurf it and gathered a band of merry men with no allegiances to any of the kings.Quote:
Originally Posted by McLovin'
I was waiting for that scene. <3 JaimeQuote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
Still spent way too much of the scene thinking "WASH THE DIRT OFF YOU" though.
If the characters didn't ever make mistakes, the story would get boring. It was a very character-appropriate decision to make.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
Why would he go to the Vale?Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Yeah, it was. I didn't even realize he was passing out; I was like "Is she sweeping him off his feet? WTF?"Quote:
Originally Posted by chionos
What?? I missed nuggets? BJ was trying to cover my eyes. ;______;Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Noodle Boy
Re-watching again just for this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Noodle Boy
Because she basically stated that she wants nothing to do with the War of the Five Kings. Moreover, Lysa's sense of family is rather skewed. Severely. ADwDBasically if it does not involve Baelish and his little-finger, she doesn't care. So much for the family motto~Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
I'm still a few episodes behind, but having read the books I am not worried. Though sometimes I confuse books and show and cannot recall if one event transpired on the other. :s
Jaime's revelations were interesting to know but I found his scene and interactions with Brienne to be dull. Likewise, Jon Snow's scenes while obviously vital were also kind of uninteresting. Perhaps I'm just not as interested in random nude scenes as I was when I was in my teens. :p
My favourite parts in this episode are without doubt those involving Stannis, Shireen and the good ol' Onion Knight. Stannis in particular, because it's the first time in the entire series I've actually found him to be interesting. Suddenly I'm really looking forward to what happens next with his end of things.
Gendry and Arya... I just don't think "m'lady" is what she wants to be called by anyone, ever. But it was very sweet.
Robb was Robb. It annoys me a lot because I love the Starks like crazy but this guy sure does know how to smurf up in the middle of a war. Will be interesting to see how he thinks he can get the Freys back onside.
Ending scene was awesome. I'd accidentally spoiled the Tyrion side of things when researching something some time ago, but I was delighted to know that there was more to it when he spoke to Cersei.
Oh yeah it was a PERFECTLY Robb decision to make, that's what made it such effective tragedy. His alternative course was clear and presented to him, but because of who he is he couldn't take that course.
This.Quote:
Originally Posted by AulaynaRe-watching again just for this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Noodle Boy
Also, I think I'm the only one who didn't find the Gendry/Arya scene touching. I found her scene with Dondarrion touching and sad, though.
Guys I know why he actually foesnt go to the vale but that was my as a viewer comment. Keep your book spoilers out! In the show they havent said now that the war is full blown that lysa is holed up. They only mentioned her in season one when she was there. The tullys haven't even said a thing about her. You'd think in the show they would address it, even briefly. Only mention of her was littlefinger going to sway her.
Robb: "Why don't we go to the Vale and see if Aunt Lysa will join the cause?"Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Cat: "No, she's a smurfing crazy bitch."
I get what you're saying. To at least remember this character. Both in the books AND in the show, I seriously can't remember Dondarrion. Like, I know who he is, but I don't remember his scenes in the book or in the show.
His scene in the show amounted to Ned declaring that the Mountain was an enemy of the King and would be brought to justice. Dondarrion volunteered to lead the company that would capture him. It was brief.
It's probably because the actor playing him in the first season was a stand-in and the role was recast for the current season. You wouldn't recognize him based on looks, and unless you have good memory/attention to detail, you probably wouldn't remember his name since it was only ever directly mentioned once.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's BoobsRobb: "Why don't we go to the Vale and see if Aunt Lysa will join the cause?"Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Cat: "No, she's a smurfing crazy bitch."
I get what you're saying. To at least remember this character. Both in the books AND in the show, I seriously can't remember Dondarrion. Like, I know who he is, but I don't remember his scenes in the book or in the show.
Robb going to Lysa makes no sense, both from a story and character standpoint. You have to assume that Catelyn told Robb her experiences with Lysa regarding the Tyrion situation and how unreliable she is, both as a family member and an ally. There is no legitimate reason why Robb would try to rely on Lysa's support when she is known to be unreliable and battrout crazy.
Yeah, the whole point with Lysa is that she wanted to keep her army in the Vale, so that she can (over)protect little Robin. She didn't accept Catelyn's plea then, and she definitely wouldn't accept it now.
As for Robb's decision, it was definitely a lack of vision. What Karstark did was wrong, yes, but Robb should have followed his three advisor's advice: to keep him as a hostage essentially. That way, he can pretty much force the Karstark forces to stay. He couldn't do it through loyalty, so he should have done it through blackmail. It's not pretty, but hey, that's war.
Robb is his father's son. Though Ned probably would have also beheaded Catelyn for letting the Kingslayer go.
Ahaha, glad I am not the only one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shlup
The funny thing is, Catelyn's prisoner exchange of Jaime for Sansa, appears at best ill advised and at worst downright stupid. However, when you think about it, it doesn't seem that lopsided. During the same time period when Catelyn was thinking and then releasing Jaime, Sansa was being publicly harassed and having a crossbow aimed at her as well as being stripped, perhaps even raped. Given how idiotic Joffrey is (beheading Ed Stark being just one example) it is conceivable that he might have just, on a whim, struck her down and killed her. During that scene in the Iron Throne where Sansa was being stripped and aimed at, were it not for Tyrion's intervention, much worse would have happened.
Of course, Joffrey didn't kill her, but Catelyn's desperate attempt to exchange prisoners actually had good intentions. Technically, the swap was still very lopsided (a lord commander for a teenaged girl) but hey, it is Cat's daughter. Hell, Robb's 'honor' with marrying Talisa was arguably worse, because it lost the loyalty of the already shady Freys. If the Freys wanted two marriages in return for a simple bridge crossing, holy hell what does Robb expect to be offered this time round?
That whole scene made me really want to take a bathQuote:
Originally Posted by PsychoticAhaha, glad I am not the only one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shlup
Did anyone else yell at Robb when he was looking at the map at the end? :nonono: I kind of don't want to watch because (SPOILER)I know he made a stupid, stupid decision. :(
Taking into account how disloyal the Freys are in the first place, and how much Robb had to pay for just to cross through the crossing, it probably isn't the best plan. Hell, begging for Lysa Arryn's aid is a better option at this rate of going.Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthernChaosGod
Sure she had good intentions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
But it was bad for three reasons:
1. Jaime is Lord Tywin's beloved son, and the Starks know that he'll do just about anything to get him back. Their position of power in greatly increased as long as they have him in their custody.
2. If the Lannisters were to get Jaime back, it'd be a morale win. Jaime is one of their leaders, but all just the fact that they bested the Starks.
3. Jaime is an incredibly gifted swordsman, and it says (at least in the books) that he can take out several people where others might take out one or two. So, he's also a huge asset to the Lannisters battle-wise.
If in doubt, spoiler tag that trout.
Like, go overkill. Be a spoiler tag Nazi. Even "oh man, episode 2 is going to be when MAD MAD STUFF happens, you know, that one thing ;)"
Cheers.
My debate over Catelyn's decisions over releasing Jaime Lannister. Spoilers from the second season are contained, though you'd have to be really behind to be spoilerfied
I'm not saying that Cat was right in releasing Jaime, but that certainly it wasn't so horridly wrong, given Sansa's precarious position in King's Landing. Hell, the Stark encampment was ready to rip Jaime limb from limb, so indirectly you could argue Jaime was safer from escaping. It's not as if being recaptured by Stark loyalists did him any favours.
Certainly, Robb didn't have the right to imprison Cat under house arrest, considering the fact that his error in judgement was considerably worse than Cat's, for the reasons I've already explained. What made it worse was that Robb actively sought out a romance with Talisa, despite knowing his marriage vow, a calculated choice. When Cat released Jaime, it was just after Ed was beheaded, so that threat of violence towards Sansa was very much real. It was a wrong decision, but at the time, it certainly made sense. Besides, Cat was in deep mourning and perhaps wasn't even in her right mind, unlike Robb, who knew he was breaking a vow.
(SPOILER)As someone who kind of sort ofavidly ships them, that scene gave me feels, although I'm still a little disappointed that they didn't have the same amount of depth as in ASOS.Quote:
Originally Posted by chionos
Mmm, a game of asses.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
That reminds me of this gif set I saw on Tumblr.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
Yeah, she doesn't care to be a "lady," and Gendry knows it. His line just further emphasizes how she's in a higher social class than him, and how he thinks he'll never be her equal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
I found both her scenes touching and sad. Maisie delivered her lines very well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
Oh, absolutely. The acting from both Maisie and Joe were great in that scene, it just wasn't my thing, I guess.
Yeah Cat's move was a bad one politically and strategically, but it was a perfectly sane and understandable one as a mother. Her eldest son bore the burden of war and she's well aware that any battle could be his last. Theon has betrayed them all and, as far as she knows, killed Bran and Rickon. Jon she could never love anyway, but he's gone to the wall now, so even if she did want to she could see him only rarely. Sansa and Arya are the only two children who, if they were with her, might be close to safe - after everything she's lost and endured it's little wonder she's willing to try to buy them back with Jaime.
I didn't say I didn't understand why she did it. :p
I didn't say you didn't understand! :p
It's because you are a cold, heartless monster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
I've never denied this, Bunny, dear. :aimkiss:Quote:
Originally Posted by BunnyIt's because you are a cold, heartless monster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
If I were Cat, I would've done the same thing. Husband dead, little sons dead, daughters captive, and the one hostage that can save them clearly about to be killed... I would've absolutely have made the same decision. The reason Robb can't go take back the North from the Greyjoys is because his sisters are still captive; get them back and the causes of the war become far less urgent. Revenge and independence are much easier to strive for long-term then the lives of your family, so I don't think it was a terrible political move either.
It was months later, maybe a full year. Jaime was Robb's prisoner for a year.Quote:
When Cat released Jaime, it was just after Ed was beheaded, so that threat of violence towards Sansa was very much real.
My confusion over your original inquiries have nothing to do with having read the books.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
I know Lysa made it clear to Cat she wanted the Vale to stay neutral, but yeah it doesn't really add up that Robb wouldn't think to ask his aunt for help. Not like he's taking his mom's advice on anything else!
e; then again the fact that it is at all plausible to the King's Landing cabal to send Littlefinger to try and get Lysa Arryn on their side suggests there's some seriously bad blood there we don't know all the details of yet.
(SPOILER)At this point in the books they've been sending raven after raven to the Vale for months with no response at all from Lysa. Many of her higher lords are also pleading for war due to their own ties to the Starks; Ned was raised there and a few of the higher houses can trace their blood to the Starks.
No one knows exactly what's going on.
Well I mean at this point, go to your crazy aunt or go to the guy you kinda threw the middle finger to by marrying someone else when you promised to marry one of his daughters. Options...?
I just don't get what Cat expected to happen. They hand over Jaime, and the Lannisters suddenly say "Oh, nice one. Here, have Sansa back."? I don't think the Lannisters are so gracious. If I were at war, I wouldn't expect my enemy, regardless of who they were, to be so gracious.
Problem: to get to the Vale, he has to cross Frey's lands/The Twins again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
Yeah she would have had better luck trying to convince Robb to trade for them officially.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
Brienne: I present to you Sir Jaime Lannister in return for the Stark daughters.
Cersei: Thank you for returning my brother....Guards!
*guards skewer Brienne*
Best episode yet, by a mile. Fantastic stuff all round.
oh yah i forgot that.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Summoner of LeviathanProblem: to get to the Vale, he has to cross Frey's lands/The Twins again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Freya
This is the core of the issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
Politically, releasing Jaime was akin to suicide and/or death for Robb's army. As a mother of a dwindling family, the move is understandable. Even then, however, as the mother of the King of the North, who is currently engaged in a war with a family who is known to be less than trustworthy, Catelyn done smurfed up.
Catelyn's move, while understandable in certain aspects, was one of the reasons why she is one of, if not the, dumbest characters in the books and series. Kudos to the actress for the great portrayal.
The thing with Cat's mistake is that, it's effect are a lot more subtle. It's only later on that the effects of losing Jaime weigh heavily on the bannermen, in particular the Karstarks. It was definitely a demoraliser.
You can't say though that Cat was one of/if not the dumbest character(s) around, because I can think of a multitude of characters who made similar, dumb mistakes. Edmure Tully and his lack of tact, resulting in the retreat of the Lannisters and their attrition gambit. Robb and Talisa, effectively severing ties with the already disloyal Freys and Robb beheading Karstark? Theon who has been a complete idiot so far? Cersei and her ruthless rule resulting in mass rioting? Joffrey and the beheading of Ed Stark resulting in the war in the first place?
Cat was stupid in hindsight sure, but at the very least she had mitigating circumstances behind her, and at the time it certainly seemed like a decent idea. Meanwhile, Robb had three advisors telling him to not kill Karstark and that he'll lose that part of the army, and... he still goes through with it. The same with Joffrey.
Cat's more selfish than stupid. But she's heaps of both.
Robb's decision is stupid. But it's necessary. It wouldn't fit his character or Martin's world for him to do otherwise.
That was bloody fantastic.
Book spoilersMy favorite ASOIAF fan art - Imgur
Awesome artwork.
And also:
http://i.imgur.com/846iHNI.jpg
I like the part about Roose. "And he doesn't give a trout" xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
A Lannister always pays his debts, ya'll. Jaime is Tywin's favored child, Cersei's lover, and a leader in the war. Sansa is... a notable hostage, but that's it as long as Robb's alive. They wouldn't even be able to offer both girls, though I doubt they'd be willing even at that point to admit they don't have Arya. And none of you think the Lannisters would have done the trade? The Lannister legacy is what means the most to Tywin; he wouldn't've kept Jaime while rejecting the offer outright. The trade was in the Lannister's favor by far.
Cat isn't selfish at all. She's lost her husband, her two youngest son's, potentially her daughters, and her oldest son is leading a war. And her one chance to get her daughters back was facing death by mob. If there's anyone here who wouldn't do the same for their children, you're a troutty, troutty person.
Lannisters might pay their debts, but it would leave them at a disadvantage on the hostage end of things as they would be giving up their only Stark hostage while the Starks still have (well, had, ha!) the nephews.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shlup
Also, regarding how the Lannisters 'always pay their debts', I don't believe this is 100% true and they can twist their debts to their will. As far as Tywin or Joffrey are concerned, one of them could easily say he owes them nothing for the return of Jaime whatsoever.
That Facebook thing is hilarious, Paper Star.
You're assuming the Lannisters have no Stark hostages. Lesser hostages are mostly just ransomed anyway; taking Jaime is a very big deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
Uhm, no. That would be extremely out of character for Tywin to allow that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
(SPOILER)Given Roose's ties with the Lannisters, the whole thing does have some credence. Even if she is a spy planted by Tywin, I doubt she will survive what's to come.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
I keep thinking that Jaime made that whole Kingslayer story up.
(Somebody is going to spoil this for me aren't they)
Tywin Lannister stood at the gates of Kings Landing and sacked the city; if you honestly think he would have honored an exchange he never agreed to, you don't understand Tywin Lannister very well.
Read this if you want Pike:You're never going to hear anyone contradict him. What he said was true, but it's never going to be addressed again. That chapter in the book is told from his point of view, and he's not lying.
I'm not sure I *actually* believe this theory, but I still think that the person who made the video spent a LOT of time nitpicking scenes and putting this together. I just thought it was a cool video, and that they present a very convincing argument.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Summoner of Leviathan(SPOILER)Given Roose's ties with the Lannisters, the whole thing does have some credence. Even if she is a spy planted by Tywin, I doubt she will survive what's to come.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
Also, Loony BoB. The two Lannister cousins you're referring to (the little boys killed by Karstark, right?) were not Stark captives at that point. The Starks didn't take them until this season.
It is quite possible that it is just plot holes/inconsistencies, too. I do not deny that.
Definitely, but regardless, it was totally cool.
In the books, Robb married Jeyne Westerling. The Westerlings are a small house sworn to the Lannisters. There are similar theories that Jeyne Westerling's mother remained loyal to the Lannisters after her daughter married Robb and worked against Robb. It's never confirmed ore refuted in the books. I would not be surprised if this theory never gets confirmed or refuted either.
The books do heavily imply that (SPOILER)Jeyne Westerling's mother was giving her moon tea, unbeknownst to her, in order to ensure she wouldn't conceive, which pretty much confirms they were loyal to the Lannisters and also heavily implies the whole thing was a setup. For whatever that's worth.
Switching allegiances to the winning side of a war isn't the same thing. Not honoring a proposed exchange would damage the Lannister name; he wouldn't do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!
Daily reminder that Caligula and Joffrey look exactly the same:
http://i.imgur.com/Sxl5Iov.jpg
I love his eyes. Like, wow. They are truly corn husk blue.
Proposed by whom? Nobody approached him asking if he would agree to his terms. Instead, his son would show up with one knight--a woman, no less--and insisting that they return the Stark daughters, after he already has his son back and they have no leverage. It would be stupid, and Tywin isn't stupid. He's not breaking any promises because he made no promises.
You don't seem to understand the rules of conduct between honorable houses.
I think you overestimate the amount of honour in both houses.
Let's put it this way: If Tywin didn't agree to the exchange - and as he didn't propose it he's well within his rights - does that mean he allows Brienne (and Jaime) back all the way to Robb's army? If Tywin is so honourable and felt it a fair exchange, why didn't he send Sansa back the moment the Starks had Jaime?
That comparison with Joffrey is creepy as hell.
Tywin Lannister would not accept an offer he has already benefitted from if he has already benefitted from it without accepting it.
He would absolutely honour the terms of any arrangement he agreed to, though the way in which he honours those terms would depend on how well-defined they were.
Catelyn freed Jaime because the offer was made by Tyrion. She questioned the dagger story at the same time Tyrion was making a name as a man of his word. Whether or not Tywin would honor the exchange is debatable, although given his modus operandi he probably would have came up with a really, really shady way to twist the thing around as not an exchange and kill everyone.
As far as the "honeypot" Talisa theories, I have to believe that there's a reason she was invented for the show, since she doesn't really consolidate plot threads or make explicit subtle points from the book. I have faith that it's going to be a giant mindsmurf for readers who thought they knew what was coming.
I think you didn't read the books so I give zero smurfs what you think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
YES I WENT THERE. YOU DON'T KNOW trout UNLESS YOU GOT ALL THE DEETS, BITCH.
You know nothing, Loony BoB.
You know nothing, Loony B-ooooohhhhhhhh
As someone who has read the books, I agree with Ouch! and basically everyone else who isn't Shlup. Cat acted stupidly with no way of enforcing the terms of the "deal," and Tywin would not have honored an alleged agreement that he neither knew of nor agreed to.
"smurf Tyrion." - Tywin Lannister, at every opportunity.
I find it funny that you're accusing people of having not read the books, Shlup, and then insist that I don't understand how house honor works. Anyone who's read the books would immediately recognize how poorly regarded that kind of honor is for any house that isn't Stark, and look where that's landed them. Tywin Lannister would sooner be seen as dishonorable (to half the realm, he already is) than stupid.
I'm not accusing anyone of not having read the books--BoB hasn't read them. I know you have. I just think you're wrong in general.
I think everyone is wrong....Except stannis. Never Stannis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
So does anyone else think the implications here are terrifying?Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
Lucky Danielle :jokey:
Well, there's got to be some reason she's with him. I pretty much figured it was that from the start.
An updated version of our favourite .gif.
Hint: look at Jaime's hand.http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/a...ps4de31bb7.gif
That GIF still gets me each time.
The next two weeks are gonna suck in anticipation
For a second I thought you meant there was no episode this week and I was about to cry.
So ros. Yah that happened. Freaking Joffery.
Loved the storytelling this episode even though not much happened. It was told and shown visually very pleasantly. I didn't want it to end.
Also, MOAR LITTLEFINGER AND VARYS SCENES.
"the laws of my fist are about to compel your teeth" smurf me I love the Blackfish, I wish they'd put him in sooner.
Melisandre - Thoros dynamic was exciting and new! Whoever predicted Gendry was going to replace Edric Storm is very good.
God damn that was some nasty Crazy Guy Torture Fun Palace. I loved the little Karstark ruse.
Roose Bolton is a stone cold mothersmurfer.
Haha Olenna you beast. "Old. I'm something of an expert on it", "Discrete bit of buggery" and then asking Tywin if he is a sword swallower.
I just realised: Quin should've smurfing been Loras. Loras is Quin. Discrete bit of buggery aside (well, you never can tell) he talks and looks like him.
And... Jesus Christ sinister voiceover music Littlefinger. :| They're really going all out to push him and Joffrey as evil. You don't really need to try hard in the latter's case anyway, but I dunno, I kind of think Littlefinger should more more subtle than what happened with Ros. Still, the climbing the ladder speech to Varys was amazing.
I don't really remember anyone predicting this, but it does seem that was going to be the case. I don't recall Edric appearing in the show, so it would make sense to replace him with Gendry, however I don't think this will end well. It'll only cause heartbreak for the many Gendrya supporters out there. I know I felt a bit heartbroken when they were taking him away.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
I think I'd actually forgotten how absolutely loathsome Joffrey is, won't be making that mistake again.
The scene between Sansa and Loras was the highlight for me, friggin hilarious.
I'm sure people almost thought Joffrey was turning nice over the last couple episodes. That should put their thought back into place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent Proto
Just looked it up, T's B's called it!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's BoobsI think they're merging it with Gendry's storyline.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuchulainn
Also, I don't think any of us know how that's going to end now, as it's such a deviation from the book. (SPOILER)Consider that Gendry and Edric are both well and alive in the book, and Melisandre could not actually get her full hands on Edric, just his blood. Gendry also met up with Brienne later. I don't think he's going to die.
Oh, sorry. I don't pay much attention to this thread. :p
That's not good enough! By nightfall tomorrow I expect you to have memorised every post in this thread... or else I'm sending you off to Theon's new friend!
That pause when Roose Bolton says "I wouldve hoped you learned your lesson about over playing your...position" and I was 90% sure he's going to say 'hand'. Pure genius
Also can Tywin seriously just draft people into the Kings Gaurd who arent even part of his country. That doesnt seem to make much sense.
edit: actually are the Tyrells part of South Westeros? I always assumed they were from across the sea because they came in boats but now that i think about it they could come from somewhere along the coast.
Tyrell's are from the east coast, I believe.
The south-west. Also I don't think they came in boats (are you thinking of Stannis?) as their territory borders on King's Landing and the Crownlands.
EDIT: a nice map for you: http://gameofthrones.net/images/West..._Political.gif
Tyrell lands are in green.
The Tyrells are from Highgarden, which is in Southwestern Westeros (specifically, it's the regional capital of The Reach).
edit: smurf, beaten
I think I mentioned it once or twice here? But I also got those hints from WIC and Tumblr.Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent ProtoI don't really remember anyone predicting this, but it does seem that was going to be the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
As a Gendrya supporter... yup. orzQuote:
Originally Posted by Agent Proto
Tits. I knew they were from one side or the other.
Highgarden is Somerset. Blimey, I really am Loras. xD
Yeah, bby, I was about to post this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonely Paper StarI think I mentioned it once or twice here? But I also got those hints from WIC and Tumblr.Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent ProtoI don't really remember anyone predicting this, but it does seem that was going to be the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
As a Gendrya supporter... yup. orzQuote:
Originally Posted by Agent Proto
While I appreciate the credit, Pauw, I got the idea from Pitye. It seemed to make the most sense, and I agreed with her theory/what she read. :)
But yeah, Proto, more than one person called that plot change!
(SPOILER)Which, it'll be hilarious if Gendry turns out to be mega smurfing important later, and how they ret-con that. They've already written themselves into a few corners.
Martin works quite closely with the TV lot, doesn't it? I imagine he'd let them know if Gendry was gonna become super important.
Would be hilarious, though. xD
I read something recently (can't remember where) that said that he actually doesn't have very much say in what happens.
Also, Paul, Laddy is Loras. No Quin.
Laddy doesn't talk like that, though. The man sounds uncannily like young Arthur.
Also, (SPOILER)what corners have they written themselves into? idk if this is even a spoiler but I imagine the answers will be.
Can't think of them atm, I just woke up. But I was thinking about this the other day.
Regardless, this season has been seriously bad.
No it hasn't, it's been great!
Also as an aside, thinking about the map I posted. It must really suck to live in Dorne as they have absolutely no roads. No wonder the Martells haven't bothered to do anything yet!
Puh-lease. It's been pretty good so far, and it's only bound to get better in the coming episodes. (SPOILER)Or worse. I'm sure we'll see more unexpected events to happen in the coming episodes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
I dunno. The pacing and the writing is really off this season. The last two seasons were amazing, this one...
I'm glad you guys are enjoying, but I really don't care for it. I'm watching hoping it gets better, now.
I wasn't too elated with the fact that they're not sticking AT ALL to the books where Gendry, Arya, and even the Brotherhood are concerned, but well... TV adaptations. >.> But bookish spoilif Gendry does eventually go to Lys, and D&D stick to Arya leaving for Braavos in the end, I hope they have a chance to reunite in the future, both being in the Free Cities and stuff.
Also, I found this fan art on Tumblr. Despite the plot change from the book, this made me lol: (SPOILER)http://25.media.tumblr.com/ea910b039...5wfdo1_500.jpg
[source]
WELL THAT WAS A CHEERY EPISODE.
I don't know if Melisandre was just trying to get away with Arya stabbing her or if she was genuinely unsettled, but if something actually unsettles Meli smurfing Sandre like Arya seems to have, you know the kid's some serious trout. Also I dunno what she's planning on doing with Gendry but she BETTER not hurt him :nonono: (or only hurt him in fun ways). Also I love how Thoros just randomly said a prayer one time and the Lord of Light responded. That'll help your faith some I'm sure.
Not the strongest episode but after the crescendo they need time to build it up again so this was just fine. There was finally an Olenna/Tywin scene too, which was JUST AS AWESOME as I expected!
Just put Blackfish in charge of everything to do with Robb's army and they'll be fine.
Also I have a theory about who Theon's new friend is (Bolton's bastard son) but it doesn't really hold up given that he's a MASTER RUSEMAN of the highest caliber so for all we know he's got nothing to do with Roose Bolton after all and is simply flaying to trick Theon further.
Rusiest thing in the episode though was not Sansa getting heartbroken or Ros getting murdered, but making poor Brienne wear that outfit.
Ahahaha ikr she pulled off the discomfort thing excellently.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
I want two buddy movies out of this series
Tyrion & Bronn
And Brienne & Jaime
A series about Ned and Robert would be just as good. It'll be set before Robert became king!
Tyrion, Bronn & Pod imo. The Hangover IV: Westeros.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pike
I thought the climb was pretty cool and the King's Landing scenese were good as always but some of it (Samwell, Bran, Theon) was pretty boring. I guess Bran's storyline doesn't go anywhere for a while but they have to keep showing him to remind us he exists? It's really annoying that nothing is happening with that.
Who's at Storms End right now?
Oh man I was so excited for the sam scene but it looks they'll push it back again. I just love sam, he's such a bumbling fool but I love him, he's so endearingly sweet.
Rickon had a line, I don't know what more CAN happen with Bran's group.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Potential Meera and Osha catfight over who can skin rabbits better.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILFRickon had a line, I don't know what more CAN happen with Bran's group.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
I forgot Rickon existed before he uttered that line.
It's still under Stannis's control although he's back on Dragonstone. Odd, really, as the man ranted and raved about Robert forcing him to have Dragonstone while Renly had Storm's End, and now he has both he chooses Dragonstone as his base anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Also I dunno how you found Theon boring. Well, Theon himself, maybe, but Crazy Guy is a joy to watch.
I'm not a big fan of torture scenes. It was fun when the guy tricked him a few episodes back, though.
I believe Stannis left a modest garrison there, but Storm's End is easily enough defended that it's left alone for now. At least I think that's how it goes in the books.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
And yeah, I feel like this episode was something of a slowdown after the first wave of action, but I don't mind so much. I might prefer a little bit more evenly paced action but overall I think it works well, and it means when it does get intense it'll get really bloody intense.
Edit:
It's not about what castle you like more, it's about what's his by rights! As long as he holds it all is good and well. Stannis :roll2Quote:
Originally Posted by PsychoticIt's still under Stannis's control although he's back on Dragonstone. Odd, really, as the man ranted and raved about Robert forcing him to have Dragonstone while Renly had Storm's End, and now he has both he chooses Dragonstone as his base anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
http://i.imgur.com/D2E1PHd.jpg
That cracked me up, poor theon.
That last scene...omg, best scene in the entire series, honestly.
Sansa crying as she watched Littlefinger's ship leave made me sad.
Also, RICKON HAD A LINE, WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?
It was an okay episode.
That's honestly what I've felt all season. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Locky
But that last scene man. Oh my god.
Finally started season two. Who the smurf is Yara Greyjoy? Never heard of her. :colbert:
In the books, she's originally titled Asha Greyjoy but for the TV series they named her Yara. The reason was that Asha sounded too much like Osha (the wildling), and this made sense to... the creators. Asha and Osha sound different enough to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quint Eastwood
I assume you know who she is in relation to the story though. The 'Greyjoy' title gives it away really.
Both Asha and Osha are meant to be pronounced the same way: [ɑʃə].
Oh really? Fair enough. Just looking at the words, they seem different and should be pronounced differently but what do I know?
This is pretty much true, in one of Theon's chapters, he mentioned how he hated how both women's name sounded the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!
Formalhaut, you act like you've read the books.
Also, I thought it was Oh-shuh and Ash-uh. Similar, but not identical.
He should start reading the books to see just how different the books are from the show. They're similar, but the show can only have so much from the book that it starts to be its own thing separate from the book.
I 'follow' the books, so to speak. I know what goes on in them, to say the least, and the general points of difference, but in terms of inner deep workings, well, I've not read them, so I couldn't say.
I'd like to read them eventually, but right now I'm reading enough books for my A2 English Literature class.
They've regained so much good will they lost from me last season. I guess this episode was slower, but I got to see so many scenes I've been waiting for and the ones they've invented have been really great as well. I've been waiting for another Littlefinger/Varys Iron Throne-side chat!
You do get the feeling that Varys has been a lot more important this season. Last episode, you get Varys with a victory - getting the sorcerer back. Now you get him played by Littlefinger and having his spy brutally murdered. Despite this setback, I wouldn't rule Varys out yet.
Btw, Iwan Rheon makes some great faces.
My excuse for a gif dump.
http://24.media.tumblr.com/5174f6778...p070o1_250.gif http://24.media.tumblr.com/3c675a240...p070o7_250.gif
http://25.media.tumblr.com/6543bd1c4...oseho1_500.gif
http://24.media.tumblr.com/cdb0106f0...wee2o1_500.gif
http://25.media.tumblr.com/581b35caf...2o3_r1_500.gif
http://25.media.tumblr.com/cc7da2934...4o1_r1_250.gif http://25.media.tumblr.com/fd3c37930...vzd4o2_250.gif
http://25.media.tumblr.com/ad170b090...7roko2_250.gif http://25.media.tumblr.com/1a9062131...7roko3_250.gif
I dunno about the TV show but in the books the Redwyne's are sworn to House Tyrell and they hold a modest navy which came to reinforce the losses that King's Landing felt from the Battle of Blackwater.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychotic
trout. Jon sounds like Bronn! Better call him Tony Snow!
I'm still not over the Ros thing.
And if they called him Tony Snow and he inherited his father's lands, he would become Tony Stark.
Kinda in agreement that it was a much slower episode. I found the ending very cheesy with the standing on the ledge holding each other and looking out thing. Gutted about Ros. Interesting to watch Tyrion and Cersei have the longest conversation I can remember them ever having.
Our satellite reception got choppy when Gendry went on about "I thought we were brothers" and so forth and then Melisandre said something to him. Could someone fill me in with that little bit of script? =o
It was something along the lines of "You are more important than they will ever be. They are just soldiers in the war, but you will make kings rise and fall." With that same expression that makes you want to punch her right in the tit.
Adding Arya and Tywin to this list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pike
If I want to watch Tywin talk with anyone more, I'd personally go for the ol' lady Tyrell. Anyone who is happy to personally interrogate him over whether or not he sucks dick has more balls than anyone else in the kingdom as far as I'm concerned. They could be the geriatric buddy movie. Maybe more of a sitcom.Quote:
Originally Posted by Quint EastwoodAdding Arya and Tywin to this list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pike
Beyond that: Bran & Hodor. But Tyrion and Bronn would easily better any of the other options, really.
EDIT: I would love to watch a sitcom version of Game of Thrones. It has all the hallmarks to cover a lot of laughs. Multiple awkward families with snippy elderly people, idiot youths, moody children, etc? Hell, The Lannisters could be a sitcom all on their own. It could be done in the style of Blackadder or something.
Omg, someone needs to add a laugh track to GoT. xD
Yeah, poor Ros. Not totally broken up about her death, but that was pretty gruesome.
Been doneQuote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
holy mother of god, it's perfect xDQuote:
Originally Posted by PikeBeen doneQuote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
It's strange, because although she is a minor character, for the most part, I did feel really sad about it! Maybe it's because I liked her character. Still, it was very unexpected.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifa's Boobs
I'm glad Ros is gone. Dear God every scene with her in it was utterly pointless. Another TV invention that really didn't need to happen. I wanted Alayaya just to hear ppl say Alayaya but noooooooooooo they went with 'Ros'. Whores
EDIT: Has anyone ever added a laugh track to Schindlers List?
Anyone else notice that Arya and Joffrey both fired on their targets in the same spots?
Hmm that's interesting, didn't notice that. Will look at those scenes again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jowy
Yes, I did.
Just finished episode three of season three. Two things:
Pod. jpgabnpaiuhijfghajhadahrha. :D:D:D:D:D:D
And those end credits. xD
Man, did Littlefinger just stomp all over Varys. That scene was awesome. Poor Ros though. :(
Is Littlefinger going Christian Bale Batman on us?
Ha. I think so.Quote:
Originally Posted by Del Murder
Another thing about the Melissandre scene with Arya, she says she sees a pair of brown eyes, blue eyes, and green eyes, and that Arya will close them forever. I'm curious as to what people think of that, particularly book readers. I know we're real sensitive here so I'm gonna put some minor ones in tags:
(SPOILER)Ok, so Arya's still alive in A Dance With Dragons, so this prophecy seems unfulfilled. She kills some people along the way, but I don't recall their eyes being of note. Lannisters have green eyes (at least in the books), and some Starks have blue eyes, although I was also thinking maybe it's referring to (F)Aegon? Brown eyes, idk, everyone has them!
I don't think she was describing the eyes of anyone in particular, just saying that Arya will kill people with eyes of every color because she will kill a troutload of people. That was my interpretation anyway.
No Dany in that episode. I do not approve.
Dany appreciation post: