Hey all,
If there was one part of this game that could have been left out or not so long, what would it have been for you?
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Hey all,
If there was one part of this game that could have been left out or not so long, what would it have been for you?
The part with the (SPOILER)Vampire in the Earth Cave.
I just thinks it's so dumb to have to go in half-way through the cave only to come out and then go back to complete it.
All the level grinding/money hunting, of course.
AgreedQuote:
Originally Posted by robfinalfantasy
I'll second that.Quote:
Originally Posted by robfinalfantasy
The only other thing I can think of is needing the lute. It was absolutely pointless (we're never told why she would have a lute that has anything to do with the temple), and it never happened to me but I can imagine the frustration of the person who has never played the game, doesn't talk to her to get the lute, and never figures out why they can't get through the temple of fiends (this was before easy online access to FAQs). Probably didn't happen often, but I'm sure it happened to somebody.
Yep, I think you nailed it. :rolleyes2Quote:
Originally Posted by robfinalfantasy
(seeing as how we even have to spoiler-censor something as little as (SPOILER)The Vampire, I just decided to do it to this whole post)
(SPOILER)
I somewhat disagree with robfinalfantasy, but I do admit that the Vampire is not one of the strongest pieces of plot in the game. So... go ahead and take him.
As for the lute, I would put that at the top of the list for things to KEEP rather than get rid of. I always thought it was the coolest thing that the very first item you get and that you have throughout the entire game is the very last item that you use. It ties in with the first boss = last boss thing as well. I doubt that anyone had trouble with it, since it would be insane to beat nearly any older RPG without a strategy guide. And, it is seriously one of my favorite parts of the plot.
For me, I think it goes without saying that the hours of imp/ogre/giant fighting should be the first things to go (as mentioned by Poetically Pathetic). But, when it comes to the plot itself, I wouldn't get rid of the Vampire first, I don't think. Rather, the Waterfall, while being an exceptionally easy and nice and almost relaxing dungeon filled with lots of shiny treasure at the end and a talking robot who gives you a rubik's CUBE, is not the greatest of ideas. I mean, you already have one item required to enter the Mirage Tower in the first place (CHIME), and then you have to have another one to get to the Floating Castle? Not making as much sense. It's the only major dungeon I can think of that requires more than 1 item to pass through (Earth Cave=ROD; Gurgu=CANOE [actually doesn't need any real ITEMs]; CastleofOrdeals=CROWN; SeaShrine=OXYALE; ToF=LUTE, not counting the 4 orbs), and it really doesn't need it. Subtract the Vampire, and you get a straight run at Lich without much more than leveling up, and that's as soon as the canal is cleared, not to mention having to subtract Titan's Tunnel, Sarda's Cave, and Melmond's connection to the plot (besides Dr. Unne). But, subtract the Waterfall/CUBE, and you still have the SLAB, and then the CHIME to acquire, and it doesn't really affect anything but itself. The only thing to do would be to move the Ribbon and the Defense somewhere else.
Ugh. If I could skip Marsh Cave, I would be a very happy woman.
So far, I would have to agree with good old FF1BlackMage so far.
(SPOILER)
That cube just seems out of place and seems like a chore to go after. It seems like everytime I have to go there, I really don't want to go there. I mean a robot underwater, with a cube a little odd as well.
As for the vampire, I always considered him to be the most well developed villian in the game. Although he was very easy to beat the Vampire charcter had some what of a plot twist in Melmond the whole town thought it was him, but was shocked when it wasn't him rotting the Earth. But I completely understand how going all the way back was useless.
By the way, is there any unique monsters in the waterfall? It has been a Long, long, time sicne I played it on the NES.
I can't remember much of the game. I suppose the ending was pretty long. I just wanted to be done with it, save my game and get on with the rest of my life
I had to restart the game at the very end (cause I accidentially saved over my file) and I hated to redo the Earth Cave and crap, it annoyed the hell outta me.
The Sea Shrine ticks me off. It has far too much surface-area especially if you want to get all the treasure. As though there wasn't enough walking in the game already.
Nearly every aspect of the game is significant to the plot, really.
Nothing can be skipped, except, perhaps, as a very minor exception, levelling up for the Marsh Cave.
(SPOILER)With the right party, that can be skipped
I haven't played through the game yet, but I would say the levelling up. It would make the game more enjoyable if that was not required due to needing Gil and level to almost every new dungeon. More Gil and level than you got from just walking to the place and do a bit more fighting than you had to.
agreedQuote:
Originally Posted by Poetically Pathetic
:eep:
Leveling is one of the most fun parts of FF1. You actually need to invest time and effort in making your party good. It makes it more worthwhile to finish the game rather than breezing through it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tabris
It also adds an element of strategy that is missing from many games. Where do you fight? What do you spend your money on first? Do you save up to get a Silver Sword or do you spend it all on a cheap Short Sword and hope that it helps you level faster in the meantime? How much money should you devote to Pure potions and Heal potions? Is it worth spending money on Tents or can you struggle back to town and use the Inn each time? Is it worth buying Steel armor from Melmond when you're going to get Ice or Fire armor in a little while anyways? Should you buy FIR3 or go back and fill up your 3rd and 4th level magic slots instead?
It also gets you to really experience the game to its fullest. There are few enemies in FF1 that I haven't fought, and that's because you're forced to fight so much for everything. Other games I often find myself fighting certain enemy types maybe once or twice per game, if at all; I never get to see their enemy skills, I never really get to know the enemies at all.
I couldnt have said it better! Its the problem of many latter FFs actually... When you get to the end theres little to no reason to be all powerful, you just dont need it, in this game if you dont youll never make it throught the whole chaos shrine..Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr UnneLeveling is one of the most fun parts of FF1. You actually need to invest time and effort in making your party good. It makes it more worthwhile to finish the game rather than breezing through it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tabris
It also adds an element of strategy that is missing from many games. Where do you fight? What do you spend your money on first? Do you save up to get a Silver Sword or do you spend it all on a cheap Short Sword and hope that it helps you level faster in the meantime? How much money should you devote to Pure potions and Heal potions? Is it worth spending money on Tents or can you struggle back to town and use the Inn each time? Is it worth buying Steel armor from Melmond when you're going to get Ice or Fire armor in a little while anyways? Should you buy FIR3 or go back and fill up your 3rd and 4th level magic slots instead?
It also gets you to really experience the game to its fullest. There are few enemies in FF1 that I haven't fought, and that's because you're forced to fight so much for everything. Other games I often find myself fighting certain enemy types maybe once or twice per game, if at all; I never get to see their enemy skills, I never really get to know the enemies at all.
As for the topic I have to agree with earth cave.. its just bull:skull::skull::skull::skull:, unless you somehow are over leveled and managed to get warp in melmond
I ALWAYS think "Hey, I'll get Warp, then I can avoid those cockatrices!". But Warp is only learnable after class change. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Frostwake
Of course, you can overlevel ang get EXIT!!!
But if you're way up there at lv. 16-17 in the earth cave...
I don't even know what that would mean.
Actually, I don't think a visit to Elfheim town is required to complete the game, but it would be crazy to skip it. However, I really wish I could skip Earth Cave/Terra Cavern. Going through the first half three times gets painful, in addition to everything above. But even worse for me, I find the dungeon bland (on Origins at least, I don't have the NES version). There's not much to make it stand out, like the other dungeons. I don't think it has many unique enemies, but it does have Lich, which is the only thing I like in there.
Dr. Unne, you have raised some good points about the Sea Shrine that I have never thought of. That part it is a lot of walking, why couldn't the treasure be more compacted? I would defintely have designed that dungeon a lot differently.
And I really like your point about leveling up and how lots of games don't have that anymore, it makes the game a challenge. However, I think just about everyone would agree that there is too any random battle of seeing the same monsters before the Marsh Cave. Orges, Creeps, Archanidas, and sea mosters, is very tedious and doesn't add so much to the game. You asked where do you fight? Well else is there to fight except around Elf town and it's port. Once your HP is low, head up to Concernia and stay at the INN. Repeat process. Isn't that the most sensible and intelligent method?
So I must ask if it was up to you Dr. Unne, (or anyone) would you have lowered the price of equipment in Elftown or would you keep the prices that high?
It depends on what you want from a game. As the graphics (at least today) isn't impressive, you need something else to make the game interesting. As FF-I doesn't have a good story either, the challenge and strategy required for leveling up is what makes it interesting, I can agree with that.
To take another example: FF-X is a fairly easy game, and the second time I played through it, all the bosses were a breeze. So what makes the game interesting to me isn't the challenge of the bosses, but the graphics, battle system and the (to me) very interesting storyline. Of course, FF-X graphic will also grow old, and then it's up to the battle system and storyline to make it interesting.
FF1 Fan
The equipment in Elftown isn't very expensive compared to Melmond.
You get ther around lv. 4, and it usually takes lv. 8, a long way away, before you can tackle the March Cave.
So after raising up those exponentially longer 4 levels, you'll have enough gold to balance out Elfland Prices of Copper Bracelets, spells, and/or a silver sword.
But the silver sword is something that lasts until the Gurgu Volcano, so it's an extroardinary deal, even at 4000.
The Copper Bracelets aren't incredibl useful on your fighters, and Iron Armor is in the Marsh cave... So if I want to save money, I find it more profitable to make an extra grand and buy another Lv.3 spell instead of bracelets.
And the uber expensive lv. 4 spells, if you actually pay attention, are too high level to use during most of your time in Elfland. I think you get 1 at level 8, and the only spells worth having are Fast, Ice2, and Pure or Aice (maybe. white lv 4 kinda sucks)
So, unless you're rushing through the game at low levels, Elfland shouldn't be too expensive, but, instead, tight and evenly priced. If I go to the Marsh Cave at lv 8, I have a Silver Sword, 3 Lv. 3 spells (Lit, Fire, Cure), 1, maybe 2 Copper Bracelets, I'll get Iron Armor in the Cave, and I'll have enough cash for Ice2 after the Wizards, which will help me murder Astos.
Cheap!
Melmond is kinda expensive, but after buying either Fire3 or Harm 3, I guess you can afford to get the airship and raiding treasure chests to buy the massively expensive magic and whatnot that comes later.
Maxing out on lv. 8 mgic, if you don't use your cash wisely, probably can take you longer than necessary.
But, of course, anything more than Nuke and Life2 is more than necessary, so what the heck?
Can I say now that I actually wouldn't change anything about the game? I mean, I talked about the CUBE and crap, but really I think that none of the game should be deleted, not even the leveling (since I actually spend little time on that anyway) and that it is all part of the awesome plot.
And, Tabris, not to offend, but I wholeheartedly disagree. This game has the best (and my favourite) story of any game. And this is coming from someone who grew up watching Hitchcock.
No worries, why should I be offended by someone disagreeing with me? I personally believe the storyline is the weakest one in any FF I've played (I've always read that FF-I is the only FF that doesn't even have a storyline!). So it's interesting to hear someone who actually love it.
As far as elfland items go my main things is getting the poison cure as 3MP vs. an antidote is important to me but I played the uber easy DoS. (Does anyone have the def. of UBER)
Dunno, I always thought that part was fun. I can see how people would think it's not though.Quote:
Originally Posted by FFI Fan
Silver sword is overpowered for that part of the game anyways. You don't actually need to buy it. There are sensible alternatives at less than 1/4 the price. I think it's nice to have the option of getting it early and I think it's good that you have to work for it if you want it. Same with level 4 magic. You don't actually need any of it before going into the Marsh Cave.Quote:
So I must ask if it was up to you Dr. Unne, (or anyone) would you have lowered the price of equipment in Elftown or would you keep the prices that high?
[qq=Tabris]As the graphics (at least today) isn't impressive, you need something else to make the game interesting.[/qq]
I think the FF1 remakes look amazing, personally. There is no real replacement for well-drawn sprites.
[qq=Tabris]I personally believe the storyline is the weakest one in any FF I've played (I've always read that FF-I is the only FF that doesn't even have a storyline!). So it's interesting to hear someone who actually love it.[/qq]
It doesn't really have a story, nope. The scraps it does have (elemental crystals, saving the world etc.) have been reused in nearly every FF afterwards though.
There is something to be said for leaving things open-ended. Personally I have all kinds of stories I've imagined in the FF1 world over the years. The game feels more "mine" than any other game, possibly for this reason. You see what you want to see rather than what the game developers give you. Would we have 8-bit Theater if FF1 had a real, defined storyline?
I was about to say Marsh Cave until I read this.Quote:
Originally Posted by robfinalfantasy
And hey, at least all the leveling outside Elfland is 100% optional.