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I was playin the game a few hours ago, and got up to the flashback where they show ***SPOILER(kinda)*** Elmyra looking for her husband at the train station when Aeris' mother died and then they reveal Aeris is an ancient, i noticed, in the bottom left corner, by the lamppost, Biggs huggin Jessie and swinging her around, as if they were married/going out. I pondered on this and began to think: Are Biggs and Jessie, how you say, having a sexy time?
Unfortunatly, they're not together as a) they're dead, and b) Jessie had the hots for Cloud, as can be seen in this thread: http://forums.eyesonff.com/final-fan...hip-chart.html
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Originally Posted by jammi567
That's kind of a contradiction in terms if you ask me, of course they have had to have been "together" while they where alive aswell which I have no proof of other than this scene.
To BizarroSephiroth: I asked this same question about two years ago and I got flamed for it, just a warning.
Yes they were madly in love. Now the story is forever changed as we know it.
I always thought the character designers were lazy and reused the sprites for Biggs and Jessie for a couple of random NPCs in that scene.
It was during the war, so perhaps one of them fought and came to hate Shinra as a result of things they saw/did during it. It would also make it possible that one of them was coming home and they were still just friends back then.
That said, there's nothing in the story or anything else that ever delved into their relationship so the point is rather moot.
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Originally Posted by Firo Volondé
yup, the sprites were reused, almost all the incidental character sprites were reused in multiple places except for the main characters, and Biggs, Wedge, & Jessie do not count as main characters they are only incidental chars to move and flesh out that particular part of the story...
That's what I thought, too...of course maybe they were but it just didn't work out?Quote:
Originally Posted by Big DQuote:
Originally Posted by Firo Volondé
I noticed in FFX that if you return to Remiem Temple at the end of the game and talk to the fayth, Cindy looks just like FFX-2's Cali. Also the girl that asks for Tidus autograph in the beginning (or was it the one next to her?) reappears in FFX-2.
What a bunch of lazy bums! I want my money back.
Yeah, but they usually have the decency to alter them a bit, particularly when they reused characters like Wedge, Biggs or Jessie. I can't remember another time when they used their exact sprites (though granted I'm playing through again right now for the first time in five years or more) which leads me to believe it is supposed to be them. Minor characters or not, they're a little too recognizeable to just reuse as is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elly
When I played this game the first time, I thought Jess was a boy and it was cute Biggs would swing him around. Then I realized she was a girl and thought "lol, nevermind." You'd think the Cloud crush thing would've tipped me off, but I figured Cloud was pretty enough that crushing on him was acceptable for everybody. Shut up, I was 11.
Anyway, they could be reused sprites, or it could be put there so fans can write fanfiction for all eternity on the mysteries of the lost pairing as I'm sure Square desires of us all.
That flashback scene happens when Aerith is still very young, so it's possibly 20 years in the past. Biggs and Jessie don't look that old when Cloud's with them... sure, it's hard to judge ages accurately from super-deformed sprites with cubes for hands, but I'm reluctant to believe that those two are both in their forties yet are lacking grey hair or other stereotypically 'old' features.
Aeris is only 22, so it's unlikely it happened 20 years in the past, particularly when the incident with Sephiroth and Nibelheim was shortly after the end of the war. At most it might have been ten years earlier, which could put Biggs and Jessie in their mid-late teens at the very least if they were in their mid twenties when the game starts (not exactly a bad presumption since Cloud is 21, and we can assume Jessie is at least the same age.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big D
That said, the game seems pretty inconsistent to me as far as the timeline of characters before, during, and after the war.
We don't know how long the war went on for, though... Aerith sure seems to be an infant in that flashback sequence, though with FFVII's graphics it's nigh impossible to tell.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivi22
Still, we can assume that the Wutai war ended some time before Cloud left Nibelheim to join SOLDIER, since Cloud knows Sephiroth as a famous war hero but he never shows any fears about heading off to war.
Maybe it was Biggs' and Jessie's parents and they are really brother and sister. OMG PREQUEL!
Possibly, though I doubt she could easily have been older than an infant. It is hard to tell from the character models, but she could just as easily be ten as four or five years old. My point wasn't that it was definitely Biggs and Jessie, but that it could be. I think I've shown that it's possible. Also keep in mind that it could have been them and Square just had no regard for any actual timeline. I believe the game does mention Aeris and Tseng playing together when they were kids, though a flash back clearly shows Tseng to be in the Turks already when she's still a kid (that's probably due to the poor translation though).Quote:
Originally Posted by Big D
I thought they were just using the same sprites too.
lol, Aerith and Tseng playing together may be a 10 year olds view of hiding from him while he looked for her (Hide & Seek), i always got the impression that Aerith was around 10 when she was taken in by Elmyra, by her speach patterns, she doesn't speak with a lisp in any of the flashbacks as most game makers make their 10 and under characters speak in, which is sortta explained by Elmyra when she says Aerith seemed a bit more mature than most children her age, and she definatealy would not have been an infant otherwise she would not have been walking around when Elmyra met Ilfana, she would have been crawling at most...
Jessie and Biggs are both there so Square get an excuse to make another FF7 sequel:D
You're right about that being a poor translation - the line of dialogue happens when Tseng has been wounded at the Temple of the Ancients. Aerith says to Cloud, "...I've known him since we were little." This could easily give the impression that she's known Tseng since she and Tseng were little, but in reality she means she's known Tseng since she and Cloud were little. I'm pretty sure this has been confirmed by someone, somewhere, somehow. Possibly by a direct translation of the Japanese script, or maybe a reference to the Ultimania.Quote:
I believe the game does mention Aeris and Tseng playing together when they were kids, though a flash back clearly shows Tseng to be in the Turks already when she's still a kid (that's probably due to the poor translation though).
In the flashback where you see those sprites that look like Jessie and Biggs, it's possible that it could be them, since Aerith is 7 in that scene. If Biggs and Jessie are in their teens as some people have guessed, then that'd make them about thirty in the game. So it could be them, they could have just broken up before the game started...
I thought that the two people embracing were the same as the two lovers you see at the train station with Cloud near the beginning of the game.
They did not actually die they make an appearence on dirge of cerberus which is based after ff7Quote:
Originally Posted by jammi567
I've never seen them in Dirge of Cerberus... where do they show up?Quote:
Originally Posted by hermy304They did not actually die they make an appearence on dirge of cerberus which is based after ff7Quote:
Originally Posted by jammi567
Yeah sure they're dead, but that doesn't mean they weren't an item. Also, who the hell cares if Jessie was flirting with Cloud. She could've just appreciated the blonde-hair, the blue-eyes, the ex-SOLDIER past, the earlier sense of confidence, or maybe OMG she could've been throwing herself at him to make Biggs jealous. *gasp* "That's impossible."
What I want to know is this: How the hell old are these people?
If that really is them in that flashback, they were already late-teens or going on early-twenties and yo, Aerith was just a kid. Aerith's a year older than Cloud so that'd mean Jessie would be robbin' the cradle if she actually got it on with the VII hero. No wonder he wasn't interested.
That's a blatant lie.Quote:
Originally Posted by hermy304
I don't think those two characters are supposed to be Jessie and Biggs. :jess:
They did die. It is explicitly stated in FFVII by Barret that all three of them died.Quote:
They did not actually die they make an appearence on dirge of cerberus which is based after ff7
I agree, I think they were just reused sprites. Aeris was 7 in the flashback, as Elmyra says her husband was sent off to war 15 years ago. I'm sure it's possible that B & J could have been teenage lovers at that point, making them slightly older (Barret is 35, so they're not all young). Still makes Jessie liking Cloud a little dodgy...but hey, his mom said he needed someone older! Hehe.Quote:
I don't think those two characters are supposed to be Jessie and Biggs
Don't forget that there could have been 2 other combinations: biggs and other female sprite, jessie and other male sprite. There were certainly enough sprites to have gone with these combinations, if it was just randomly chosen.
That the Biggs and Jessie sprites were chosen together I'd say it was likely, although not definite, that square intended these two to be Biggs and Jessie from AVALANCHE.
I never really thought about it up until now, actually, but what Firo Volondé makes most sense to me. I naturally assumed it was Biggs and Jessie when they younger but never realised that, obviously, that would've made them significantly older in the present day.
Did Biggs and Jessie ever appear in Before Crisis? (Or Crisis Core for that matter?)
It would make sense that it's not them, unless they're in at least their forties by the time Cloud meets them in AVALANCHE (the flashback takes place a few days before Elmyra meets Aeris, who's only about four or five at the time; in the main game she's twenty-two) in which case it's no friggin' wonder Cloud never responded to Jessie's subtle display of affection.
[blowing=smoke]More than anything, it's probably because of the way when a person you know dies, you suddenly see loads of people who you mistake for them, and since all fictional characters apparently have the ability to show their flashbacks to other people, it stands to reason that Cloud, Barret and Tifa would mistake others for their dearly departed so much as to be convinced of a perfect resemblance.[/blowing]
"Hehe" indeed! You win.Quote:
Originally Posted by gothic_fantasy
LOL maybe they were still goin out but didnt tell ne1 an jessie wuz gonna break up with biggs 2 go out with cloud then they died
orr maybe she fell in love with tha cookie monster:monster2:
lol jk
I thought the two characters in the flashback were younger versions of Biggs and Jessie, but who knows. It's not like FFVII is a game with no plot holes at all. :p Oh, and (FFVII and AC Spoilers)Rufus died in FFVII, and it was also quite implied that Tseng died, but they're both alive in FFVII AC, so I wouldn't be too surprised if Biggs, Wedge and Jessie appeared in some FFVII prequel/sequel/other spinoff. Or Cloud could see them the way he saw (AC Spoilers)Aeris and Zack in AC. :p
Lol, you just wanted to post that Cookie Monster animation! :pQuote:
Originally Posted by ~Death~Stalker~910
Well, I guess you're supposed to think that he died, when he did not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD
*SPOILERS!*
The same could be said about Biggs, Wedge and Jessie too, though. You only saw them wounded, but you never saw them die. The point about Barret saying they're dead is so-so since even Heidegger says (about Rufus), "The President is dead! Now I'm doing things my way! Ghaa haah hah hah!" I'm not saying Biggs, Wedge and Jessie survived, but if SE wanted to make a twist like that, it definitely wouldn't be anything new.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seal EvilWell, I guess you're supposed to think that he died, when he did not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD
Ah, yes. I forgot about that part. You have a good memory!Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD
Heideger was just a pompous arse with delusions of grandure who only assumed Rufus was dead, according to the "FF VII Ultimania Omega" Tseng and Rufus did survive, unfortunately it does not mention how either did it...
I think if it was intended to actually be Biggs or Jessie they would have made it obvious that it was them (like them saying one another's names).
I can see how Tseng survived. How do you think Elena a) know that he had been wounded, and b) know that it was Cloud and co. who supposidly do him up like that? Clearly, she saw and heard it from Tseng himself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elly
Unless Tseng's a really sick liar, Elena would know that it was Sephiroth who attacked him if that was the case, she wouldn't have blamed Cloud.Quote:
Originally Posted by jammi567
Elena has a nasty habbit of jumping to conclusions and talking too much when she really doesn't know what's going on... we all know when someone is injured or traumatized in these things they tend to speak in incomplete sentances, so her convo with Tseng coulda gone something like:
Elena: Tseng! what's happened? who did this? who is responsible?!
Tseng: ... chasing Sephiroth... Temple of Ancients... Cloud, Aerith, Avalanche...
but unfortunatealy we get no real dialogue between them, and this is speculation, but i like to think it went something to that effect, but it's implied later that the TURKs did rescue him while Cloud and Co. were messing around in the back of the temple...
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Originally Posted by Elly
That's pretty good speculation, as I can totally see her reacting like that.
I have no idea if they were in love or not. But when friends are reunited they can also hug without there being anything else other than just a good friendship. Anyway, this entire thread is just based on speculation.. as someone else mentioned; it could might as well just be Square being lazy and reusing some character sprites..
As much as I'd like it to Biggs and Jessie, it probably isn't because as someone already mentioned, they would be much younger at that point, providing they've even been born at all. It's a shame that Square could be that lazy... I realize that NPCs get reused a lot, but Biggs and Jessie are pretty important NPCs at this point in the game, so it seams strange that Square would use their sprites for other characters - particualy since this scene is more or less straight after (SPOILER)they die.Quote:
Originally Posted by Breine
I think Sephiroth1999AD's point about Biggs, Wedge and Jessie being alive is certainly a possibility. There's nothing to rule out that they're alive. I mean, there was an order to evacuate Sector 7, though whether anyone actually did we never really see. I don't think SE would bring them back, so it's all speculative, but I think it's a valid point all the same.
Nah, they're dead unfortunately. Their deaths are confirmed in one of the canonical novellas released y Square. Aerith encountered their spirits in the Lifestream, so they've definitely passed on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Heath