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I haven't taken any lessons whatsoever, and any Japanese knowledge of mine has been taken from the Internet.
I spend two or so hours a week on this; anyway, I've been at it for six weeks now, and I've noticed some improvements; at least I can read and understand small parts of the Japanese video game dialogues. XD
How long will this take?
I mean, how long will I have to stay patient?
I don't know anything about japanese, but when you said 'stay patient' I just thought of something. When I lived in Quebec, I made no real effort to learn French, and though I was bombarded by it whenever I left the house, at home it was all English all the time.
You are clearly making an active effort, but remember, children generally aren't proficient with a language until at least their fifth year. While I'm not comparing you to a five-year-old, it could mean you have a long way to go. Maybe it'll take you less time to become fluent because your brain is more developed than a child's, or maybe longer because not only is there one (or more) language already in there, but all kinds of other information.
As long as you're making a good effort, you should learn a lot though
Good luck!
GANBATTE (or somesuch...hope i didn't just swear)
I've been casually learning Japanese (from the internet as well, and a couple of books) for a couple of years. And by casual I mean 'when I feel like it', not any sort of set program. By now I know enough to survive a vacation in Japan (which I did last year), but I wouldn't be able to hold a substantial conversation with anyone for long before asking if they could speak English.
I know in High School I was learning French, and I did that for 5 years. I think by my 3rd year I was able to make some fairly complex sentences, and by 5th year I was pretty good. Japanese is different from French so it's not too good of a comparison, but I can expect probably around 3 years for me to be comfortable with the language. If I were studying it properly.
I think once you get the fundamentals down, it all boils down to your vocabulary. Vocabulary is the hardest part for me, simply because there are so many words :P Getting sentence structure correct and knowing when to use e instead of de and stuff like that is hard enough, but once you get it it's solid. Vocabulary is a constant stream of new info.
I'd say keep up with it 'till you get bored. Whether it's next week or next decade :P I'm sure you learn new things about English once in a while (if English isn't your 1st language) even if you don't take English lessons anymore, so as you expose yourself to more of the language you will pick up more and more.
I'm actually interested the JET Programme where you live and work in Japan for a year or so. They teach you Japanese as well. I just have to get a Bachelor's degree before my passport expires...
Take lessons. Honestly.
I tried to learn it without lessons untill I found my university was doing lessons. Puts everything into context.
it would probably take a while. i learned what german and russian (not very much at all) on my own, and it takes patience and constant environment. i would always listen to german bands (like rammstein and megahertz and such) to immurse myself in it, and if you can be around it all the time, it makes it easier. like spanish, which im taking now, i can just walk out the door and be surrounded by it :P (stupid retards blaring latino music until 3 am!!! grrrr) and my bf's familia married into mexicans from l.a. (:\ double no-no spanglish PLUS l.a. accent.)
in short, surround yourself in the language and culture and you will learn faster
edit: and learning it with a friend helps you guys learn faster and you teach each other. me and amber learned together :)
Without even one book, and just leanring from the internet, I'd say it's near impossible to learn it well enough to even use basically, and if you're talking about learning it fluently by yourself, it'll never happen, at 2 hours a week, it'd probably take a year or two for you to get well enough to not call someone some sort of insulting name, or say something that makes no sense.
lol, sounds promising. XDQuote:
Originally Posted by Chaos Is the Key
If you're hardcore, I supposed you can learn enough of it to get by in a few months.
That's if you're seriously hardcore.
I had a travel guide in Mexico who spoke like 5 different languages. He said he was in the process of learning Chinese so that he could go live there for awhile. I asked him how he was doing it and he said that he had put Chinese characters all over his room, the walls, the ceiling, everywhere. So that from the moment he woke up to the minute he went to sleep, he would be immersed in Chinese.
Isn't that nuts? I think it's nuts.
But if you have the determination, you could learn anything fairly quickly.
Also, I think this would be better for the Study Hall. *kicks*
You'd have to spend a lot of time and be really serious about it. I tried teaching myself through a books on tape thing and just got bored after a while. Now I'm in a class and even though I'm one of the better students in it, I know it's going to be a while before I'll actually be able to do anything worthwhile. If you do a little every day, though, you could possibly be a decent speaker in a year or so.
I'm doing the same thing with Farsi. But I'm not going to lie to myself. I won't really get things down right until I'm actually immersed in a culture where people speak it. My best advice? Go to Japan. Advice to myself (Farsi)? Go into the army.
Going to the Army won't seriously help you learn any language. After a year in Korea I could say hello and thank you. After a year in Germany I still couldn't get by if they didn't speak English.
I hear that immersion helps
Lol I'm going into MI so I will have direct contact with the area. I am sure you've heard the stories about army intel. A friend of mine who recently returned from Iraq had one thing to say about MI officers:
" Them smurfers is crazy!"
I have noticed that a lot of people say that it depends on your personal dedication and I agree that that this true.
From personal experience, though, I can say that I learned the [basics] of Japanese in little over than a year.
I imeddiately suggest that you begin by understanding the different types of japanese writing styles (kanji, romanji, katakana and hiragana). If there are more I am sorry I did not include them.
I do not know what to really say about Japanese writing outside from the fact that it is a colouorful and descriptive language like our own... only the devices used sem foreign from a "home land perspective."
you'll just have to explore nouns and couple then with descriptive concepets
I guess I'm rather hardcore if I've decided to learn the language fairly well in a couple of months, then? :D
I actually tend to have a very easy time learning languages; I also know some tricks that make everything even easier.
First I make sure to get a good grasp of sounds and grammar, and then I learn the most important words ("I", "you", "yes", "no", "and", "but" etc).
I also make sure to learn the words for objects that surround me in daily life, like houses, beds, trees, lamps and so on; I also learn the most basic verbs, like "walk", "eat", "sleep" etc; oh, and adjectives are good to learn too.
If you know this, then you can create a fair amount of own phrases yourself.
Once you start feeling comfortable with your own phrases, you need to start reading a book in that language; make sure it isn't too tricky, though.
Only read 15 minutes at a time, or else you'll just exhaust your brain.
If you run into a tricky word, which will happen very often in the beginning, look it up in a dictionary.
Then re-read the book again, and then start reading other books as well.
Deciding to learn a language in a few months doesn't make you hardcore. Actually doing it, does. :p
I recommend Rosetta Stone
i was thinking of getting that rosetta software. maybe chinese or japanese
im not really fluent in anything but if i really think about it i could babble on about 6 languages (japanese chinese roman greman french and spanish)
but if your going to go for it really go for it use it everyday translate things around you, use the honorifics, run through the phonetics when your not doing anything else
oh and make sure you practice i took german for three years and now all i can do is swear and call for beer
Flash cards are awesome supplements to help you learn Japanese, or any language for that matter.
I think it is best to learn from someone than to learn on your own, especially to understand some of the stuff, like pitch and proper pronunciation. Both of which can be laid out in text but to actually know if you are doing it right is another story. :/
You probably could learn to read Japanese pretty well on your own, though it will take a long time. You can pick up kana pretty fast. Kanji on the other hand can be quit difficult though the basic few are easy to remember.
I think like any language, Japanese is best acquired by being taught, especially by one who has that language as their primary language. It is the small things that we tend to miss if we are to study on our own. Plus there has been a few times my prof told us about errors in our text book, like uncommon spelling of certain words or other ways to say the same thing.
To become actually efficient in it will take a long time, though it is not impossible.
I have that Rosetta Program fro Japanese, but i cant get motivated to actually use it. Ive decided to study it at Uni instead
haha im taking Spanish am am probably the best in class (I studder a lot tho*i do that anyways in englishO_o*) and you can never truly know everything about a language all the big words that make u sound smart as soon as im done with SPanish and become semi fluent i was going to take Japanese at the nearby JC but ill prolly take it in college when im ther
you can always watch lots of japanese anime shows besides your studying.. words like onii-chan and such i got from FFVII AC in japanese.. i only watch that in japanese.. and i learn more every time
You learn to pick out single words and phrases that are almost useless without context. Watching anime will not teach you the language no matter how much you wish to believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith's Knight
read before flaming jackass.. and watching the language being used helps you understand how its spoken, ever tried to learn a language from only a book?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!You learn to pick out single words and phrases that are almost useless without context. Watching anime will not teach you the language no matter how much you wish to believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith's Knight
He wasn't flaming. It is true, in Japanese, as with most languages, you need context. I picked up random words because of anime (a few adjective and adverbs here and there) and it does give you an understanding of how certain things are used. So it can be a good compliment to learning the language, but the same can be said about watching French shows when learning French. The only thing about anime is that often they use the casual form. You do not want to be talking to strangers while using the casual form, unless you want to be rude, very rude at that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith's Knightread before flaming jackass.. and watching the language being used helps you understand how its spoken, ever tried to learn a language from only a book?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ouch!You learn to pick out single words and phrases that are almost useless without context. Watching anime will not teach you the language no matter how much you wish to believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerith's Knight
EDIT: If you want to learn how to read-write Japanese, I'd also suggest investing in a good kanji book. Make sure it shows the kun and on readings as well as the stroke orders (also the handwritten version as well). Just a suggestion though. That way you can practise a few until you learn them.