Zozo, Desert Prison, and just about every Cloister of Trials manages to make me go insane.
So, which parts of the game do you hate?
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Zozo, Desert Prison, and just about every Cloister of Trials manages to make me go insane.
So, which parts of the game do you hate?
The Nibelhiem flashback in FF VII. We get it Cloud Sephiroth did some trout and burnt down some trout.
Any forced tutorials... and the D-District Prison.
Cait Sith.
EDIT: Oh sorry, you said places. Then I guess I'll go with... places containing Cait Sith.
Um....
- The Hanging Edge and the Pulse Vestige in XIII. Both chapters were just a tutorial chapter, and requires no skill at all, other than 'attack' 'attack' 'attack'.
- The annoying underwater section after Baaj Temple in FFX. It was slow, annoying drivel.
- Having to traverse BOTH sandseas in FFXII, which must have taken forever, or seemed like it.
- The Great Crystal in FFXII was both confusing and housed Larvae Eater. That annoying Danjuro wielding freak instantly makes the Great Crystal absolute torture.
- Nibelheim flashbacks, of course, was just plain irritating.
FFI: The Marsh Cave, hell the whole Elfland section if I could be honest. It's one of the least important sections of the game and the Marsh Cave is one of several That One Level in a game filled with this trope... The Ice Cave deserves mention as well, largely for being filled with some of the most overpowered mooks in the game.
FFII: Oh man, there are too many to count. Maybe Deist Cavern, the Tropical Island and Mysidia Tower because they are terribly long, are filled with "Encounter Rooms" hold little value in loot, and the first two could be easily written out of the game, and thus feel more like padding than anything else.
FFIII: Goldor's Mansion, because it has those damn horse enemies that confuse your party, and the Cave of Darkness because you have the splitting enemies, high encounter rates, said enemies tend to always ambush you and can do ridiculous damage to non-over-leveled Knights. Did I mention its seven floors deep and involves hidden winding pathways?
FFIV: Part of me wants to say the Sealed Cave but I've learned to deal with it. The Sylph Cave is another story with damage floors, hidden paths, two exits, and some of the most obnoxious enemy encounters in the whole game.
FFV: I never cared for the Pyramid of Moore, very few dungeons in this game really left an impression on me to be honest.
FFVI: Fanatic's Tower, I believe, is the sole reason why the Moogle Charm exists. Other than that, I would say the Cave of the Sealed Door is easily a dungeon I dread going through due to making sure I don't miss anything like the Ultima Weapon but mostly because it has some of the most annoying enemy encounters in the game.
FFVII: Fort Condor, I really hated the RTS game cause it's way too slow, thank god it's mostly optional. The Great Glacier is also super annoying especially since I have to do that long winded quest to get my fave summon Alexander. I also dislike Wutai.
FFVIII: The Deling Sewers and Esthar City during the Pandora mission, also the Ragnarok.
FFIX: Like FFV, very few dungeons left an impression on me.
FFX: Spira... oh that doesn't count? Well then Mi-Hien Highroad, Mushroom Rock, Thunder Plains, The Calm Lands, Cavern of the Stolen Fayeth, the Bevelle Cloister of Trials, Mt. Gargazet, and Inside Sin.
FFXII: The Henne Mines, largely the Zodiark Section, Tchita Uplands and Cerobi Steeps, partially because they are boring to look at and felt interchangeable, I hate the treasure farming in these regions, and I largely felt they existed for padding.
FFXIII: It would be easier to list which places I did like.
hahahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno
I just played through FFVI again last week. I did a run through Fanatic's Tower without Mog, and some rather weak mages. I have never been so frustrated with that game. It seemed every time I tried, I would make it a little farther up the tower, before being destroyed. I think I have that place mastered now.
As for me, I hate having to watch Cloud's reminiscence at the inn. Hate it so much that I'd rather just not play the game. :/
The problem with Cloud's flashback isn't that it exists but rather it consists of actual gameplay. Why would you ever need gameplay when a few cutscenes could have done it? I mean, I don't care too much for loads of cutscenes, but in FFVII it wouldn't have been too out of place. :/
The FF staple "desert prison" sections tend to suck. Places I wish I could skip in each one:
FFVII: The desert prison
FFVIII: The desert prison and the sewers
FFIX: The desert prison
And then they kinda stopped doing them I guess, phew.
FFX: The Calm Lands and Macalania
FFX-2: The Calm Lands and Macalania
FFXII: That great big massive desert type place you have to go through to get to the other end of the world, with the sort of maze of circular structures? And the sewers. Unfortunately combined those seem to make up 90% of the game.
FFXIII: That never-ending foresty place which you have to slog through and just goes on and on with little to no advancement in the story, I think it's when it's just Lightning and Hope, and it's a little bit reminiscent of FFX's Macalania.
I'm so upset. I legitimately thought this was a thread about skipping - or prancing down places. In which case, I'd like to skip everywhere.
You mean the two Sandseas in FFXII? Yeah, they were boring desert slogs. Such a bore. The Garamsythe Waterway for me were more of a very annoying puzzle/maze, so I didn't really like them as much. As for FFXIII, that place was more of a build-up to Palumpolum rather than something of it's own right. It was decent, I guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudane
And seriously, no one else has beef with the Great Crystal of XII? That place didn't even have a map! And was just a confusion maze, filled with waystones and oddly named locations.
I'm surprised nobody mentioned IV's Magnetic Cave yet.
That flower field in FF8. Best skipping place ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lockharted
I find it more annoying when I was looking for some of the rare loot but some of the locations are easy to find if you know a bit of astrology cause hunting down Ultima and Omega Weapon is not too difficult if you know you just need to go to the Virgo and Taurus sections.Quote:
Originally Posted by Formalhaut
I've made my peace with it, and I never felt it was annoying as some people. Its actually a pretty novel dungeon and it's still nowhere near as long or as infuriating as the Sealed Cave or some of the Babel Tower sections.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elpizo
I think one time I forgot to get Edward's harp so I had to go all the way back and all the way back to the Dark Elf again. I was not pleased. :stare:Quote:
Originally Posted by Elpizo
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smurf off zozo is amazing :(
JUST LISTEN TO THAT SLAM SHUFFLE
elfland/marsh cave quest in ff1 is pretty terrible
the veldt also serves little purpose, mostly because i don't care for gau
That friggin dream flashback thing with Tifa and all the transparent Cloud Strifes floating around during disc 2 of FFVII.
Everything at Trabia Garden.
It's far, far, FAR worse to read all that Orphanage crap than it ever was to read through Cloud's flashback. Namely because Cloud's flashback had stuff happening.
Nothing happens in FFVIII.
Also Wolf you really should switch all of your X hate to VIII. It is a worse game in every conceivable way. It's objectively worse, from a design perspective.
Every game needs an option to skip tutorials, but with FF the only ones that have them are VIII and hmmm. I think you can skip VIII's.
I also do hate the eidolon cave in IV and the dungeon that had the living doors.
I would much rather read through both those moments of FFVIII a couple times over than have to sit through the Cloud flashback.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
At least it didn't have Tidus laughing like a retarded seagull on drugs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
And
At least it didn't have Tidus.
The GF memory loss is a little silly for a storyline plot-twist but Irvine's speech is always neat and enjoyable to experience each time as well as Squall finally realizing who Ellone is; so it's not that bad.
And the GF memory loss is warned to you at the beginning of CD 1 so at least it's not like a Deus Ex or a giant plot-hole.
There was that place in that Final Fantasy game that I did not care for and I wish I could have skipped it.
Truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
VII:
Shinra HQ
Kalm Flashback
Fort Condor
Desert Prison
That mountain place after Icicle Inn
IX:
Honestly, the whole first disc until you leave Lindblum
Fossil Roo
Oeilvert
Ipsen's Castle
FFX:
Everything until after Luca/Blitzball (except for maybe Yuna's first summon/Besaid Temple)
Calm Lands
Mt. Gagazet
Zanarkand
Sin
Except in FFXIII that'd put you straight on to somewhere like Archylte Steppe since about 80% of the game is tutorial.Quote:
Originally Posted by Depression Moon
UGH, so true. It was run through this wave of monsters to get a little bit of story/flashback and then run through some more long hallways, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno
VIII was a game that really tried to do some new things, and while it utterly failed I felt their were some diamonds in all the muck, I criticize the hell out of that game but I can still enjoy it. FFX, was a lazy game in terms of its writing and design, and that is far more difficult to forgive, especially considering Square's track record at the time. VIII at least has dungeon design, it has a breathing world, it has ways to counter the abusive combat system without simply choosing to play dumb, Squall is a far more engaging and thought provoking character than Tidus, and while VIII has the terribly orphanage twist, its still a hundred times better than Tidus being a dream will ever be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
Though XIII is the game that truly deserves the hate, because it tried something new, which was being as utterly lazy with its overall design as it possibly could. At least it can be argued that FFX had some thought put into it and its lazy design can be attributed to outside factors. XIII was just phoned in. :barf:
I-VI: Almost all generic dungeons. And yeah, Zozo.
VII: The mountains between Nibelheim and Rocket Town.
XII: I can't recall the names of the areas, but I think the one where you start to head up into mountains was the one I liked least.
XIII: The Ark. Worse than the rubbish dump area, and that's saying something.
Oh good one yeah, that's one of those that seems to go on forever with battles every few steps. Plus that silly ladders+tubes puzzle where I think you end up also going around again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
Which also brings me to the Temple of the Ancients. That was a pain too.
Oh and the cliffs where you fight those icicles. Yay live icicles!
No dungeons bothered me o'ermuch -- I like RPG's -- but I wish I could skip every minigame ever except Triple Triad.
I love the crystal cave in xii :(
i also loved both sandseas D:
Id skip raithwalls tomb (and the one in the mountains)
They were both so borrrrrrrrrrring
I just don't know about you anymore BoB...:screwy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
I wouldn't mind skipping those last couple of floors in FFIV's final dungeon. What a pain.
Yeah, IV's final dungeon was pretty tedious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
This is a minor one, but you know how in FFX, there's that one last room in Sin right after the final save point? The one where the camera is spinning around uncontrollably so you can barely see anything around you, you have to touch 10 of the randomly-appearing egg thingies to move on, and touching one of the spike-icle things forces you into an enemy battle. The first time, it's okay, but sometimes I boot up the game and all I want to do is fight Braska's Final Aeon for fun, and I have to do that room all over again. Urrrgh.
>>> FFXIII-2, the whole game..:luca:
What, you like generic dungeons? They're generic. Don't go talking about characters being generic and therefore sucking and then go on about how dungeons were cool when they were the same every time you went into one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf KannoI just don't know about you anymore BoB...:screwy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
Except they weren't BoB, FFI had the Ice Cavern that not only spiked the enmey encounter up to 11 but was a puzzle dungeon involving trying to fall through the proper holes to get to the Cube to revive the airship, it also had the Tower of Trials which was a giant teleporter dungeon, neither of which was re-used in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoBWhat, you like generic dungeons? They're generic. Don't go talking about characters being generic and therefore sucking and then go on about how dungeons were cool when they were the same every time you went into one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf KannoI just don't know about you anymore BoB...:screwy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
FFIII had dungeons that forced you to use transformation spells to proceed forward and altered how you dealt with enemy encounters. Most of the dungeons involved using specific jobs, actually incorporating the games customization system as a puzzle element.
FFIV had a dungeon that altered what you could equip and altered party dynamics, it brought back the teleporter dungeon from FFI, it had dungeons with damage floors, with surprise boss doors, hidden passageways, and the final dungeon is a maze leading to all of the game's optional super bosses to net the party's final gear.
FFV - Brought back FFIII's idea of incorporating your party build into making the dungeons easier, introduced the time limit underwater boss fight that VII borrowed, and introduced the magic and physical only dungeons.
FFVI gave us the puzzle dungeon of South Figaro, switch puzzles that utilized the games huge cast, hell many of the games dungeons themselves had puzzles to proceed forward like the security light in Narshe, the path puzzles in the Cave of the Sealed Door, a crushing ceiling in Gogo's dungeon, the find the proper path puzzle in Lete River and the Serpent Trench, brought back the magic only dungeon is brought back from FFV and pushed to 11, and the whole talking to the troops puzzle in Vector.
I mean most of these games have dungeons that stand out for their gameplay purposes not because of visual appeal, and to me that is far more important than the dungeon looking "fantasy". So yeah, I just don't understand your taste BoB and I don't want to. :p
The Cave of the Gi in FFVII was pretty boring as I recall. I have not beaten teh game in many, many years, but I do recall that section being one of my least favorite. (to contrast with the rest of Cosmo Canyon, which was great)
I didn't really mind Cave of the Gi. True, it had a lot of annoying enemies casting Death on you. I quite enjoyed the challenge of those spider enemies that hit you with that 1000 HP draining stingbomb attack. Gi Nattak wasn't overly tricky when you reached him though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forsaken Lover
Plus, it was the build up to one of the most emotional sections of the game... for this reason I always enjoyed completing this cave.
Don't skip too much, that defeats the purpose and the challenge. Some of the places mentioned in this thread I could see myself skipping but they're part of the game.
I didn't say "all dungeons", I said "all generic dungeons". You're misinterpreting me. Also, while switches can be considered something that adds to the gameplay, some of them are so blatantly obvious in how they will work that they don't add to things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf KannoExcept they weren't BoB, FFI had the Ice Cavern that not only spiked the enmey encounter up to 11 but was a puzzle dungeon involving trying to fall through the proper holes to get to the Cube to revive the airship, it also had the Tower of Trials which was a giant teleporter dungeon, neither of which was re-used in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoBWhat, you like generic dungeons? They're generic. Don't go talking about characters being generic and therefore sucking and then go on about how dungeons were cool when they were the same every time you went into one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf KannoI just don't know about you anymore BoB...:screwy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony BoB
FFIII had dungeons that forced you to use transformation spells to proceed forward and altered how you dealt with enemy encounters. Most of the dungeons involved using specific jobs, actually incorporating the games customization system as a puzzle element.
FFIV had a dungeon that altered what you could equip and altered party dynamics, it brought back the teleporter dungeon from FFI, it had dungeons with damage floors, with surprise boss doors, hidden passageways, and the final dungeon is a maze leading to all of the game's optional super bosses to net the party's final gear.
FFV - Brought back FFIII's idea of incorporating your party build into making the dungeons easier, introduced the time limit underwater boss fight that VII borrowed, and introduced the magic and physical only dungeons.
FFVI gave us the puzzle dungeon of South Figaro, switch puzzles that utilized the games huge cast, hell many of the games dungeons themselves had puzzles to proceed forward like the security light in Narshe, the path puzzles in the Cave of the Sealed Door, a crushing ceiling in Gogo's dungeon, the find the proper path puzzle in Lete River and the Serpent Trench, brought back the magic only dungeon is brought back from FFV and pushed to 11, and the whole talking to the troops puzzle in Vector.
I mean most of these games have dungeons that stand out for their gameplay purposes not because of visual appeal, and to me that is far more important than the dungeon looking "fantasy". So yeah, I just don't understand your taste BoB and I don't want to. :p
When looking at the dungeons I'm thinking of, all I see is the same dungeons with different maps. This is the pitfall of the underground dungeon in many games, and older games in particular suffer from them to extreme levels. Essentially, it's very hard to make an underground dungeon on a 8-bit or 16-bit game look remotely interesting. They do add some minor gameplay value by making you press switches to move forwards, but having puzzles AND high encounter rates mixed together is something I feel is a Very Bad Thing. I like to be able to focus on battles or focus on puzzles, not try to be solving a puzzle but being constantly interrupted. I love puzzles in my games, and I love encounters in my games, but they should be carefully balanced.
More than anything, though, it's the boring, uninspired, lifeless aesthetics found in any cave-dungeon you can find in the old games. Even some new games suffer from this - XIII did when they took you to the Ark and again when they took you to the mines. But at least in modern times they can do something to make it interesting. I just don't think they could back in the old days, so they made do with what they had. That doesn't somehow magically make me want to go through those areas again, though. I'd rather spend my time in the more interesting areas of the world, where there are still enemies, still puzzles, but also interesting lore and/or culture.
But yeah, back to the main point: I never said every dungeon in FFI-VI was generic, just that there were generic dungeons in FFI-VI.
Marsh Cave (FFI) and Lodestone Cavern (FFIV) immediately came to mind. Basically anything that has to do with an annoying Dark Elf messing with you.