X-2 is the best Final Fantasy game.

A controversial statement? Maybe. But don't assume I am a troll. This game has heart and engulfed me into its world like no other.

Let's start with Final Fantasy X, and why I think it's a terrible game that should never have been created. NEVER. FFX is far from the masterpiece people claim it to be, and FFX2 is the only thing on this planet that justifies its existence.

Tidus was a terrible protagonist. I can see why he is a dream thing that's not an authentic soul because nothing he does or says seems to have any substance. I see his character arc as a metaphor for the ultimate fates of badly written fictional characters. I laughed when he dissipated into nothingness.

The plot of X was also dire. machina? They're called machines, for god sake! And the Al Behd were basically Polish immigrant. Yuna's martyrdom was also too much to take. Every second, she played up to the role of the martyr, courting sympathy because she's gonna die and blah blah blah. Lots of people die, Yuna. We ALL die someday. She definitely abused her position as a summoner for attention and sympathy. Dona should have been the main character. Her no-nonsense quips made her fascinating.

There are so many things wrong with this game; slow battle system, undeveloped characters, the trite religious allegory.

Well, NONE of these flaws are present in FFX2. The characters have progressed...Yuna is now genuinely a fame-hugry voluptuous woman who has cast off her pretensions, Rikku has decided to forego clothes and drop the innocence act, and Paine is a hearty, reliable lesbian, truly a welcome addition from the LGBT community.

I LOVE the dresspheres.

I LOVE sphere break.

I LOVE that Dona gets more screen time.

I LOVE that Auran, Tidus are gone, and that the other characters are present but you can go through the game and ignore them till the very end if you so wish. I snubbed Wakka! he deserved it.

I LOVE LeBlanc. Her wit, heart and mannerisms make her the most enjoyable Final Fantasy villain to date. She's like a sluttier Kefka, but camper and more down-to-earth. Her romance with Nooj is more real than any bond Cloud shared with Aries.

The non-linear narrative is amazing. A-MAAAAA-ZING. Infinitely better than FFX's cheap, linear, boring, preachy depressive story that is barren of life.

FFX-2's story is simple but deep - it tells a story from the perspective of a young girl who just wants to find her old boyfriend, but has to deal with global issues and social problems. It deals with hot-button topics like war, social stratification, fanaticism, the true nature of love. And of course, Yuna self-development is amazing.

Paine's backstory is INTRICATE and DEEP and could have been an entire game in itself. Why do people dismiss her. Is it because she's GAY?

All of the above lay blatant for the eyes to see in this game, along with amazing J-pop music and three overly-sexualized girls as main characters.

All in all, it's a great game.

No, it isn't the best final fantasy game, but I do enjoy it a lot.

I find it great that you took such a liking to X-2. Not that many people can enjoy it like that.

I do love X as well though.

I loved FFX-2. I agree with Mirage that I don't think it's the best, but it's certainly a much better game than people give it credit for. Although, it does seem these day it's no longer cool to hate (that's FFXIII and its sequels) and people are appreciating it much more.

I find your assessment of FFX odd (just like, strange points) but hey, to each their own.

Although, just to point out: 'machina' is Latin for machine.

Well if you want make-up over depth of character I can see why X doesn't appeal to you and X-2 does. I live in opposite world though.

A certain name used in a narrative does not mean the narrative is bad as with your machina example. Also what's wrong with Polish immigrants? X battle system was actually pretty quick by the time it came out. Maybe it hasn't have aged too well but calling it slow is a little bit exaggerated in my book. Especially when compared to IX it holds up pretty well IMO.

I'd take Yuna's kindness over Dona's immature negative - and even supremacist - attitude any day. I'm having a hard time not to judge your own character if Dona is the type of character you admire. Then again at least she apologises at some point so I guess she deserves some credit.

I quite liked X. Didn't mind X-2 that much to be honest.

I do like it very much but, as good as the battle system is, it always seems so insignificant damage- and enemy HP-wise. Of course later you can do much damage but it feels different.

I agree Final Fantasy X-2 is the best game if you're looking for fantasies that will be final until you're ready to go again.

I do love X-2, a lot, but I couldn't disagree w/ you any more on X. Also, just because Paine wears her hair in that manner doesn't make her a lesbian, her sexuality is never even taken into consideration.

I'm reporting your post to the CIA, the NSA, the FBI & Her Majesty's Secret Service. I'm sure the black helicopters will be over your house in a matter of minutes. Good day, sir.

You forgot MI6. Now he's gonna get away!

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Originally Posted by Alive-Man

I quite liked X. Didn't mind X-2 that much to be honest.

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Kind of in the same boat. The thing that killed me about X-2 is how obnoxiously annoying some of the characters have become (i.e Brother being the biggest one) Not saying X-2 is a bad game just not close to being the best IMO. Also X-2 as a game seemed too easy not once in the game did I come to find a part difficult and that game destroyed blitzball for me.

I love that the first post you make here is to go over the wonders of X-2. However, you've forgotten to add an image to the OP:

Attachment 56267

It's completely legit to like FFX-2 though. I like the actual game part of X-2 better than X for sure.

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Originally Posted by Mirage

It's completely legit to like FFX-2 though.

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Absolutely. I like it as well :monster:

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Originally Posted by Love

Let's start with Final Fantasy X, and why I think it's a terrible game that should never have been created. NEVER.

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>>> No..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

FFX is far from the masterpiece people claim it to be, and FFX2 is the only thing on this planet that justifies its existence.

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>>> Wrong..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

Tidus was a terrible protagonist.

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>>> No..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

There are so many things wrong with this game; slow battle system, undeveloped characters, the trite religious allegory.

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>>> Wrong..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

in FFX2. The characters have progressed...

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>>> LOL..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

I LOVE the dresspheres.

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>>> Yes..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

I LOVE sphere break.

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>>> No..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

I LOVE LeBlanc.

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>>> Yes..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

The non-linear narrative is amazing

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>>> No..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

FFX-2's story is simple but deep

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>>> The holes under the temples were deep..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

Paine's backstory is INTRICATE and DEEP and could have been an entire game in itself.

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>>> Sure thing.. "The story of the camera girl", you can make like 3 games with that..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

All in all, it's a great game.

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>>> Wrong..:luca:

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Originally Posted by Love

don't assume I am a troll

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>>> Same here..:luca:

I somewhat agree with the OP, but for different reasons. I thought FFX was one of the worst FFs when I played it, and I had played all FFs from 1-10 back then. Meanwhile, I thought FFX-2 was a lot better game despite everyone hating it.

To mention a few things I greatly disliked about FFX, I thought Tidus was a horrible, whiny main character. I admit, I noticed on my 2nd playthough that he does get better near the end of the game, but it's a bit hard to like him when he's been so annoying throughout the game. This was the first FF game to have voice acting, and unfortunately, I thought the English voice actors of Tidus, Yuna and Seymour failed big-time. The battles felt like a chore to me, especially because the random encounter rate was so high sometimes, and also because I wanted to level up every character, so every battle dragged on with me recycling the characters, having 4 characters do nothing but defend, and 3 characters do the actual fighting. The latter is pretty much my own fault, though, as nobody forces me to level up all the characters.

The cutscenes felt longer than in any previous FF, and it's especially problematic when you can't skip them and they happen just before a major boss fight. It's seriously frustrating to lose to (SPOILER)Yunalesca, and then be forced to watch through the same long cutscene all over again. The addition of voice acting seemed to reduce the role of music more into ambient background music, making FFX one of the weakest soundtracks in the series, IMHO. Now that I think about it, the PS2 FF titles had arguably the weakest soundtracks in the FF series. On the other hand, FFIX and FFXIII/FFXIII-2 have some of my favorite soundtracks in the series. Finally, I thought FFX's mini-games were very disappointing. Cloisters of trials were extremely annoying, not to mention they were repeated several times in the game and as a compulsory part of the main game. Also, thunder dodging, butterfly catching, getting a perfect time for Chocobo races... yikes. :eep: At least Blitzball was enjoyable once you got used to it. As for the good things, I thought Auron and Rikku were enjoyable characters, the story is pretty epic and the ending is very beautiful and emotional.

Now for FFX-2. I thought the voice acting had improved considerably. Especially for Yuna. I also liked her character development. While her more cheerful features might be annoying to some, I liked the way how she changed from a doormat trying to please everyone to an independent character having her own free will and opinions. The story is pretty light-hearted in the beginning, but it does get darker and more emotional ever since the end of Episode 2.

Some have said that the battle system is horrible in X-2, but I didn't really think so. The battles are fast-paced and fun, and the ATB system used isn't much different from the one used in FFs 4-9. The job system wasn't bad, either. It was a bit similar to the ones used in FFIII, FFV and FF Tactics, and those FFs had really addictive battle systems, IMHO.

When it comes to cutscenes, fortunately you are allowed to skip them in X-2. I also liked how there's a save point before the final battle, and after a long cutscene, you're allowed to return to the save point, which wasn't the case in FFX. The final battle is neat in a way that (SPOILER)you'll get to beat "Tidus" (actually Shuyin) there, with Auron, Jecht and Braska cheering in the background. :D The scenes after the final battle and during the ending are enjoyable, even if the ending feels a bit rushed. There's also a "good" and a "perfect" ending for those who want some extra scenes.

It was interesting how FFX-2 made me care more about the world of Spira, and after playing the game, I also enjoyed FFX more than on my first playthrough.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I think FFX-2 is a great game, but it's definitely not the best FF. :D

It's a good game hidden behind the layer of silly campiness. I really like the game, but I can see why people are put off by it.

The battle system and the job system are the best in the series.

Nothing else about the game belongs anywhere near the top of a "Best in the series" list. :p

I actually love it, but it was ridiculously easy (not a pun...) to finish (not helping the not a pun thing here...) off.

FFX-2 Is my favourite final fantasy game to date. I think what bothers me the most about the original post is the lack of ownership of the opinions being personal.

FFX-2 is often disregarded as it is one of the least popular - which is other peoples personal opinion that I do not happen to share.

I do not see the need to bash FFX based on the argument laid out in the original post, if it included some actual facts like the same way Sephiroth199AD has instead of personal opinion I would be able to relate much more. For example there is NO WAY in hell that I am going to try for the dodging lightning bolts, on the way through the area I think I maybe managed to dodge 2-3? LOL

It terms of gameplay I think few jRPGs let alone FF games beat X-2.

I enjoyed the story when I played it as for a large section it didn't really take itself seriously and was honestly a nice change to the uber-seriousness of X.

With regards to both games, I don't really have a favourite because each one is good in its own way.

P.S. this scene will always hold a special place in my heart

I like both, but can't say X-2 is the best despite some of the things they got right. I think your deductive skills could use a bit of work, though. Not sure how Yuna's character comes across as attention seeking and the battle system was far from slow. A chore I can concede. But I can say that about a lot of RPGs, to be frank.

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Originally Posted by Yellow_Magic

It terms of gameplay I think few jRPGs let alone FF games beat X-2.

I enjoyed the story when I played it as for a large section it didn't really take itself seriously and was honestly a nice change to the uber-seriousness of X.

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That seems to be the case for both secondary parts in the series, namely FFX-2 and FFXIII-2. They both have a more light-hearted setting compared to the original game, and the games don't take themselves too seriously. The gameplay, though, is highly enjoyable for both. :) Strangely, the same seems to be true for FFV as well. :D

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Originally Posted by Mirage

No, it isn't the best final fantasy game, but I do enjoy it a lot.

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This. I even like it better than X. For me, it's the fourth-best FF behind I, VII and XII.

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD

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Originally Posted by Yellow_Magic

It terms of gameplay I think few jRPGs let alone FF games beat X-2.

I enjoyed the story when I played it as for a large section it didn't really take itself seriously and was honestly a nice change to the uber-seriousness of X.

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That seems to be the case for both secondary parts in the series, namely FFX-2 and FFXIII-2. They both have a more light-hearted setting compared to the original game, and the games don't take themselves too seriously. The gameplay, though, is highly enjoyable for both. :) Strangely, the same seems to be true for FFV as well. :D

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Yeah, I don't know why anyone would think FFV was to be taken seriously. At one point Exdeath hid as a splinter in someone's foot, for crying out loud

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Originally Posted by Yellow_Magic

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD

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Originally Posted by Yellow_Magic

It terms of gameplay I think few jRPGs let alone FF games beat X-2.

I enjoyed the story when I played it as for a large section it didn't really take itself seriously and was honestly a nice change to the uber-seriousness of X.

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That seems to be the case for both secondary parts in the series, namely FFX-2 and FFXIII-2. They both have a more light-hearted setting compared to the original game, and the games don't take themselves too seriously. The gameplay, though, is highly enjoyable for both. :) Strangely, the same seems to be true for FFV as well. :D

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Yeah, I don't know why anyone would think FFV was to be taken seriously. At one point Exdeath hid as a splinter in someone's foot, for crying out loud

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That is without a doubt the greatest hiding place ever conceived. Long live FFV!

I thought the splinter was in her finger?Also, FFV inspired someone (ObstinateMelon) to create this:http://fc02.deviantart.net/fs70/f/20...on-d4l02dr.jpg

:hahaha: Nice try.

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Originally Posted by Love

A controversial statement? Maybe. But don't assume I am a troll. This game has heart and engulfed me into its world like no other.

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The statement is controversial. I am glad that it has touched you. That doesn't justify you being wrong, though.

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Let's start with Final Fantasy X, and why I think it's a

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terrible game that should never have been created. NEVER. FFX is far from the masterpiece people claim it to be, and FFX2 is the only thing on this planet that justifies its existence.

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Pro-tip: being better than something else doesn't make it good. A kick to the balls is better than being shot in the face, but I still wouldn't willingly go and seek it out. You've gotten me really excited to hear your carefully constructed claims and read your evidence that proves Final Fantasy X is a horrible game even though that's not why we're here.

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Tidus was a terrible protagonist.

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Wrong.

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I can see why he is a dream thing that's not an authentic soul because nothing he does or says seems to have any substance.

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Wrong, but at least it's witty.

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I see his character arc as a metaphor for the ultimate fates of badly written fictional characters.

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He has a character arc. You know that's a sign of good writing, right?

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I laughed when he dissipated into nothingness.

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So you're a jerk, too. Nice.

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The plot of X was also dire.

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Okay. In the immortal words of Pauline Hanson: Please explain.

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machina? They're called machines, for god sake!

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Start your words with a capital letter. Also, it is "God's sake" for future reference. Also, it seems you do not understand the concept of dialects, loan words, or even foreign languages.

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And the Al Behd were basically Polish immigrant.

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Final Fantasy X is terrible because a fictional race allegedly draws comparisons to Polish immigrants and you are racist. Gotcha.

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Yuna's martyrdom was also too much to take. Every second, she played up to the role of the martyr, courting sympathy because she's gonna die and blah blah blah. Lots of people die, Yuna. We ALL die someday. She definitely abused her position as a summoner for attention and sympathy.

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Oh, wow. You... you're an idiot. Yuna deliberately keeps Tidus in the dark because she doesn't want sympathy. I would be surprised that you missed such a fundamental aspect of the plot but your flawed arguments even thus far warned me you might have missed things like this. Martyrs are martyrs because they sacrifice themselves for a cause they believe in. You can't really abuse martyrdom for personal gain. I mean, the happy feels you get from people cheering you on as you go to die is great but, uh, your argument makes literally no sense. Also, way to distinguish between sacrificing yourself at like 20-years-old to protect the world for a couple months/years and being 100-years-old and dying peacefully in your sleep after a long life well lived.

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Dona should have been the main character. Her no-nonsense quips made her fascinating.

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Dona was a bitch. She was unnecessarily aggressive and condescending. She was not fascinating; she was a :bou::bou::bou::bou: and I wanted to punch her in her half-naked stomach.

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There are so many things wrong with this game; slow battle system, undeveloped characters, the trite religious allegory.

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You introduce lists with a colon, not a semicolon. Please do not abuse punctuation. The battle system is only slow if you are slow; choose your commands fast and it can arguably be as fast as the ATB systems. The characters are not undeveloped; some are underdeveloped, but I'm not going to explain exactly how because you are clearly not going to return to read this and I am purely writing this as an exercise in anger expulsion. The religious allegory is one of the most obvious components of Final Fantasy X's narrative but that does not mean it is terrible. Indeed, as I linked in another thread, I wrote an article explaining how Wakka and Yevon are commentaries on the dangers of being blind to the truth and not being critical about your life.

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Well, NONE of these flaws are present in FFX2.

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From the Final Fantasy wikia page for Vegnagun: Vegnagun's design, particularly its moth-like wings on a locust body, is a reference to a popular design of the Judeo-Christian demon Beelzebub (one name also used for the Devil) referred to as Lord of Flies, taking the form of a demonic fly or locust. Yes, I can see exactly how religious allegories are absent from Final Fantasy X-2 and are thereby improving the quality of game immensely.

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The characters have progressed...

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It is amazing how time allows people time to change, isn't it?

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Yuna is now genuinely a fame-hugry voluptuous woman who has cast off her pretensions,

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Yuna wanted to give the people of Spira something else to comfort them now that her role as a summoner had ended. She gave them pop music. It's stupid, but it's there. She's not fame hungry; you can't get more famous than being the person who eradicated Sin forever. She's more relaxed and less pretentious, sure, but that's because she discarded the stuffy crap put on her by Yevon; she's already half way to this by the time Grand Maester Mika is discovered as an Unsent. You should pay more attention.

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Rikku has decided to forego clothes and drop the innocence act,

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And this is an improvement on her character how? Also, she was already severely underdressed in Final Fantasy X. The only perks to her reprisal in Final Fantasy X-2 are that she's no longer considered criminally underage in most Western countries any more so her blatant sexuality and fanservice is a little less scarring.

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and Paine is a hearty, reliable lesbian, truly a welcome addition from the LGBT community.

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I don't even recall it being confirmed that Paine is gay and even so that doesn't suddenly make her character good. She's portrayed as a bit of a bitch for most of the game, which isn't the most positive reflection on the LGBT+ community. Also you have not explained how any of these changes have improved their characters in the slightest.

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LOVE the dresspheres.

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Good for you. How does this make the game better?

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I LOVE sphere break.

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Good for you. How does this make the game better?

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I LOVE that Dona gets more screen time.

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Good for you. How does this make the game better?

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I LOVE that Auran, Tidus are gone,

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Good for you. How does this make the game better? Also: Auron. And use the word "and", don't abuse the journalist's comma. Additionally, Tidus is the smurfing catalyst for the plot, and is present in the Perfect End, and Auron's voice can be heard at one point, so you're entirely wrong.

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and that the other characters are present but you can go through the game and ignore them till the very end if you so wish.

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You are a spiteful creature and therefore the game is better?

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I snubbed Wakka! he deserved it.

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Because...? Part of making an argument is justifying your claims.

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I LOVE LeBlanc.

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I'm not surprised, considering that your favourite characters are Dona, and Yuna/Rikku/Paine when they're being sluttier.

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Her wit, heart and mannerisms make her the most enjoyable Final Fantasy villain to date.

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Oh wow, this is actually a decent argument.

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She's like a sluttier Kefka, but camper and more down-to-earth.

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Yep, of course. She's slutty, so she's good. I see. Remember how the game was panned because it was fanservice, and then people have been struggling to point out that there are actually decent parts to this game?

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Her romance with Nooj is more real than any bond Cloud shared with Aries.

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How are Cloud and Aerith* even relevant? What does "more real" even mean?

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The non-linear narrative is amazing. A-MAAAAA-ZING.

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It's not non-linear if you want the true ending. I do like that you have more freedom; it might be superficial but it is nice.

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Infinitely better than FFX's cheap, linear, boring, preachy depressive story that is barren of life.

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Do you know what a book is? Final Fantasy X is hardly preachy. Depressing does not equal bad. "Barren of life" means nothing unless you qualify the statement. Pauline Hanson, again.

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FFX-2's story is simple but deep - it tells a story from the perspective of a young girl who just wants to find her old boyfriend, but has to deal with global issues and social problems.

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That's not simple or deep at face value. Final Fantasy X-2's story is about love and the pain of letting go. Final Fantasy X-2's story is about subsistence and dealing with "the aftermath": the point after the battle where the passion fades but things have not returned to normal.

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It deals with hot-button topics like war, social stratification, fanaticism, the true nature of love.

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It doesn't provide any commentary on contemporary warfare, as far as I can remember. Just because fighting happens doesn't mean it's a comment. Your other comments are at least accurate enough despite having provided no examples.

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And of course, Yuna self-development is amazing.

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Oh? Really? Yuna becomes sentient and develops herself inside the coding of Final Fantasy X-2? I didn't realise this.

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Paine's backstory is INTRICATE and DEEP and could have been an entire game in itself. Why do people dismiss her. Is it because she's GAY?

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I don't recall any of her backstory. I'll take your word for it. People don't dismiss her because she's gay, and the fact that you love her so much seems to centre around the idea of lesbian sex. Also, signal your questions with a question mark.

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All of the above lay blatant for the eyes to see in this game, along with amazing J-pop music and three overly-sexualized girls as main characters.

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Are you citing the oversexualisation as a positive? Your points are not blatant enough to see, obviously, and I struggle to see how Final Fantasy X-2 is good simply for being better than Final Fantasy X, which is another point you haven't proved.

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All in all, it's a great game.

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I agree. But you haven't explained why anybody else should see your point of view. You suck at this. Don't quit your day job.

I really like this game and I like it more than X but I disagree with a lot of your arguments.

Also, Yuna was not an attention whore in X. She was very modest, very selfless, and carried herself with dignity and tact. That is something very admirable and I very much like her character for it. I do also enjoy her development in X-2.

hook line and sinker

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Originally Posted by Jiro

:hahaha: Nice try.

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I really enjoyed reading this post! Such a well constructed response and very entertaining! LOL

Gah I suck at this forum business... Too long to quote directly, post #28 Jiro ^_^

Actually, you know, on a serious subject:

There's still a LOT of religion in FFX-2. While the world is different, there's a new religion--New Yevon--cropped up in Yevon's place. A lot of people have gone back to it because of the void of Yevon and how it affected every single second of their lives. As someone who has left their religion, I can say it's very traumatic. To have it torn away from you without your consent and thus taking the only life you've ever known? I really can't imagine. So, of course, New Yevon takes the helm.

But then there are people who are dissatisfied with religious abuse and the way Yevon controlled their life, and so they start their own group--The Youth League--which is basically the atheist group who wants to figure things out on their own but are undisciplined because of their new found freedom, disillusionment, and need to control others. Despite not being religious, they're still a new 'religion'.

And seeing how there's an entire chapter (chapter and a half) surrounding this plotline, I don't know you can say that religion doesn't play a major part in FFX-2. Even if there weren't new religions, there would still be the hole left by the downfall of Yevon, so religion would still be directly affecting the course of the story.

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Originally Posted by Jinx

Actually, you know, on a serious subject:

There's still a LOT of religion in FFX-2. While the world is different, there's a new religion--New Yevon--cropped up in Yevon's place. A lot of people have gone back to it because of the void of Yevon and how it affected every single second of their lives. As someone who has left their religion, I can say it's very traumatic. To have it torn away from you without your consent and thus taking the only life you've ever known? I really can't imagine. So, of course, New Yevon takes the helm.

But then there are people who are dissatisfied with religious abuse and the way Yevon controlled their life, and so they start their own group--The Youth League--which is basically the atheist group who wants to figure things out on their own but are undisciplined because of their new found freedom, disillusionment, and need to control others. Despite not being religious, they're still a new 'religion'.

And seeing how there's an entire chapter (chapter and a half) surrounding this plotline, I don't know you can say that religion doesn't play a major part in FFX-2. Even if there weren't new religions, there would still be the hole left by the downfall of Yevon, so religion would still be directly affecting the course of the story.

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It's actually quite deep, the religious aspect in FFX-2. Certainly counterbalances the otherwise light and fluffy atmosphere the game has (especially in the earlier chapters).

I just started FFX-2 again but I can already tell how much an inferior game it is to FFX. Paine having a backstory? Paine is the yang to Rikku & Yuna, and is unbelievably stereotypical so far.

I really get the feeling Enix came in not knowing what FFX mean't and decided to make a completely new game on their own, except it's in Spira. I feel the producers of FFX either would not have been open to making a sequel or else they would have made it more like the first - making you genuinely care about the characters and how the story develops. I don't know if this would ever be true or it could already have been proven to be wrong, but it seems so unlike the first game.

I'm already slightly put off by these whimsical & overly girly remarks that Rikku & Yuna make. Okay, in the first Rikku could be passed for this but Yuna? Maybe things have changed.

I like the mechanics of FFX-2 and loved being back in Spira but this game could have been so much better. Square-Enix strikes again.

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Originally Posted by Rocket Edge

I really get the feeling Enix came in not knowing what FFX mean't and decided to make a completely new game on their own, except it's in Spira.

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Wasn't X-2 created before the merge ?

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Originally Posted by Rocket Edge

I feel the producers of FFX either would not have been open to making a sequel or else they would have made it more like the first - making you genuinely care about the characters and how the story develops..

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- Or they were struggling after the crash that was Spirits Within and they needed some desperate cash.

If memory serves me correctly it was with Square-Enix? Anyway, yeah your probably right.

The merge happened before X-2 was created (or perhaps during development) and they fired a bunch of people who worked on the first game.

Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles was the first FF released post merger, but FFX-2 was the next one. I'd always thought Kingdom Hearts was the first Square Enix joint production (or at least notable titles) but it seems not.

You can be assured that a lot of things in a company are not instantly switched around the second they make the name change official.

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Originally Posted by Jiro

:hahaha: Nice try.

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Jiro! How dare you speak to me like that?! I'm not going to excavate your overwritten post, as I don't have the time, but i will address some of your obnoxious, condescending comments. You've just turned LOVE into HATE.

Firstly, don't correct my punctuation, spelling, style, or any other facet of writing. This isn't an academic essay, it's a fracking forum dedicated to Final Fantasy discussion. If you want a job proofreading, go into the real world and look for one. I personally wouldn't hire you. Anyone with this habit immediately incurs my wrath. because it gives the impression that you want to pick people apart for the sake of it. Treat your anger disorder, preferably AWAY from the keyboard.

Next, about my original post...I don't understand why in the hell you are treating my thread as if it's the devil's thesis? Even the most deranged academic supervisor wouldn't stoop to that kind of babyish pedantry. I don't know what you were expecting me to qualify my personal opinion with...you don't like my line of reasoning, and feel entitled to attack me? Do you feel more intelligent? You shouldn't.

Yes, I think Yuna was a martyr in FFX. I though she subtly manipulated those around her for attention, took her guardians for granted, and was hungry for the glory of liberating Spira...a glory which is eventually realized, and which she continues to revel in the wake of FFX2s events. One doesn't simply go from being a High Summoner to a Pop Star without some form of craving for public approval. She's flaky and uncaring and even admits in FFX-2 Last mission that she probably never was friends with Rikku and Paine in the first place. She was just 'using' them to fill the void left by Tidus' death.

I preferred FFX-2 because it took itself less seriously and had fun elements to it. if you are looking for scientific evidence or references to qualify that, then you really have a warped way of looking at things. The best Final Fantasy game is different for everyone...

Now you better get the frack away from me, or I'll change into the berserker dressphere and use beserk and maul you!!!!!!

PS. What's with the random Pauline Hanson references?

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Originally Posted by Love

PS. What's with the random Pauline Hanson references?

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Hahaha, please explain... :P


Also I think the reason why some people have felt strongly enough about your original post might have something to do with the way you laid it out..

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Originally Posted by Love

Let's start with Final Fantasy X, and why I think it's a terrible game that should never have been created. NEVER. FFX is far from the masterpiece people claim it to be, and FFX2 is the only thing on this planet that justifies its existence.

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This might not be the best way to start a post that is supposed to be around why you think FFX-2 is the best game. Putting something down in order to justify/validate your own opinion... where I have heard something like this before I wonder?

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Originally Posted by Love

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Originally Posted by Jiro

:hahaha: Nice try.

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Jiro! How dare you speak to me like that?! I'm not going to excavate your overwritten post, as I don't have the time, but i will address some of your obnoxious, condescending comments. You've just turned LOVE into HATE.

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So, just as your initial argument, you plan on doing no actual work and simply rely on blanket statements without proof. I applaud your commitment, and welcome back.

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Firstly, don't correct my punctuation, spelling, style, or any other facet of writing. This isn't an academic essay, it's a fracking forum dedicated to Final Fantasy discussion.

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There is no distinction between form and content. You want to make an argument? Make sure it's understandable and justifiable. You did not do this. It doesn't matter if it is an essay or a post on a Final Fantasy forum. You come in here, guns blazing with your statement, and then fail to actually say anything of substance. That's inviting criticism.

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If you want a job proofreading, go into the real world and look for one.

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I think you'll find I am a practising editor :shobon:

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I personally wouldn't hire you.

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Well that's your loss. I think I've demonstrated that my editing skills are immensely necessary for you.

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Anyone with this habit immediately incurs my wrath. because it gives the impression that you want to pick people apart for the sake of it. Treat your anger disorder, preferably AWAY from the keyboard.

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If you had read my post, you would have understood why I was aggressive. I am pleasantly surprised at your return. But I also value clarity and accuracy. That's why I'm a writer and editor. You should probably come up with better insults. :ffvilaugh:

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Next, about my original post...I don't understand why in the hell you are treating my thread as if it's the devil's thesis?

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I'm treating it like a completely unfounded and misdirected failure of an argument. If you want to be the devil, by all means. I suspect he would construct a better argument, though, given that he successfully tempted Adam and Eve.

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Even the most deranged academic supervisor wouldn't stoop to that kind of babyish pedantry.

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They would if they were worth a damn.

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I don't know what you were expecting me to qualify my personal opinion with...

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Evidence. Justification. Anything. You gave an opinion but wouldn't even explain why you hold the opinion. I think you're a moron, and I think this because you have absolutely no ability to construct a case. See how easy it can be?

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you don't like my line of reasoning, and feel entitled to attack me? Do you feel more intelligent? You shouldn't.

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I didn't need to attack you to feel more intelligent. I felt that by reading what you wrote and laughing at the flaws, as I suspect everyone else in the thread did. Your line of reasoning was absolute horsetrout. That doesn't justify my attack, of course; one should not resort to ad hominem. But, again, it was with purpose, which you would have understood if you actually read and comprehended my post.

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Yes, I think Yuna was a martyr in FFX. I though she subtly manipulated those around her for attention, took her guardians for granted, and was hungry for the glory of liberating Spira...a glory which is eventually realized, and which she continues to revel in the wake of FFX2s events.

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This is a viable point. I do not agree, but I could see how you could interpret it in such a fashion. I offer, instead, that Seymour is the character who exhibits these traits; Yuna attempts to become a martyr out of selflessness, while Seymour attempts the same out of greed and pride.

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One doesn't simply go from being a High Summoner to a Pop Star without some form of craving for public approval.

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There are other reasons people become musicians. Like sharing a powerful message to the masses, as Yuna does in the Thunder Plains.

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She's flaky and uncaring and even admits in FFX-2 Last mission that she probably never was friends with Rikku and Paine in the first place.

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Remind me which game you are arguing for again?

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She was just 'using' them to fill the void left by Tidus' death.

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As I expect many people do after losing someone close to them.

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I preferred FFX-2 because it took itself less seriously and had fun elements to it.

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Fair enough. I like these elements. This is why Final Fantasy X-2 is sorely underrated, in my opinion.

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if you are looking for scientific evidence or references to qualify that, then you really have a warped way of looking at things. The best Final Fantasy game is different for everyone...

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I don't need science. I wanted examples. You were making claims that were not widely accepted and you didn't provide evidence to support them. You appreciate the light-hearted aspects of X-2 in comparison to X; the fact that X-2 is less serious in sensibilities is obvious and doesn't need explanation. Saying that Yuna is selfish in Final Fantasy X is as close to being objectively wrong as possible, so you need to explain this, otherwise you sound like a raving lunatic.

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Now you better get the frack away from me, or I'll change into the berserker dressphere and use beserk and maul you!!!!!!

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Violence is never the answer. :ffviwag:

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PS. What's with the random Pauline Hanson references?

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A few weeks ago I attended a '90s themed party. One of the guests dressed up as Pauline Pantsdown, a hilarious parody of Australian politician and gaff-master Pauline Hanson. She is also famed for making completely bonkers blanket statements; the reference seemed appropriate.

I apologise for the aggression exhibited in my original response, because as I mentioned before, it was unfounded, but you did not seem like the type of account that would return. I understand wholly that if you leave the Eyes on Final Fantasy Forms Fantasy Forum Experience (that one's for you, Alive-Man :ffvilaugh:) that it will most likely be entirely my fault, and that will stain my record of being welcoming and inviting to newbies. It would be inappropriate of me to justify why I felt like being a complete and utter prick, so I will not attempt to do so. I will, however, point out that my aggression is comparable to your blasé hatred of Final Fantasy X and lack of substantiated evidence in your original post. We should all expect to have our thoughts and opinions challenged when we put them out in public discourse.

#rekt

Be excellent to each other, alright? Let's turn the temperature down and have a nice chat about FFX-2.

Which incidentally is indeed a quite stonking game.

I like that there's hot babes

This thread


http://www.daidegasforum.com/images/...rain-treni.gif

http://home.eyesonff.com/showthread....FX-2-THE-TRUTH

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Originally Posted by ToriJ

The merge happened before X-2 was created (or perhaps during development) and they fired a bunch of people who worked on the first game.

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The Japanese Final Fantasy X-2 still has "Squaresoft" on it, so they have had the fusion inbetween and only published it as "Square Enix" in the western part of the world.

If I'm not mistaken, (which I probably am), the same team that worked on X worked on X-2. I know they used most of the models from the former for the later, as Lulu NEVER looks pregnant. Only Rikku & Yunie were changed (for obvious reasons).

X-2, the best? I wouldn't go that far. It does have one of my favourite cut scenes (1000 Words!) and the battle system is great fun, so fast and fluid. But in terms of story? It doesn't hold up. Though I do really like the whole Tidus / Shuyin / Yuna / Lenne business going on.

I think Final fantasy 9 is the best, there I said it. To be honest I only managed to get this persons rubbish argument by reading everyone taking it apart.

It's fine to like ffX-2 over X but I your views over Yuna as a character seem warped to me.

not my favourite, but it's very close to my heart. n_n i remember back in my EoFF early years i would do nothing but blindly praise it, kinda like a majority of thread's original post. it gave me warm fuzzies being able to re-experience the int+lm content in (but in english) so many years later.

ps: there's nothing that states pain is gay, she's compartmentalizing most of her emotions for a chunk of the game. but yes i know you weren't referring to her cheery demeanor. she (until confirmed by her creators) merely has a short, spunky hairdo. the only different thing about her default clothes is that they're black, rather than the normal warmth you get from spiran attire. whatever information there is pertaining to her sexuality remains her business (canonically). in a final fantasy game stereotypes are very specific (a shining example is the bath house in VII).

I prefer FFX over FFX-2. For me, the story is better and I enjoyed Tidus' point of view more than Yuna's.

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Originally Posted by Love

And the Al Behd were basically Polish immigrant

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...

Okay, this got awkward for me real quick :erm:

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Originally Posted by Shiva95

I prefer FFX over FFX-2. For me, the story is better and I enjoyed Tidus' point of view more than Yuna's.

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Here at EOFF we encourage all view points. Even the wrong ones.

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Originally Posted by Dat Matt

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Originally Posted by Shiva95

I prefer FFX over FFX-2. For me, the story is better and I enjoyed Tidus' point of view more than Yuna's.

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Here at EOFF we encourage all view points. Even the wrong ones.

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I said that I prefer Tidus' point of view, not that I don't like Yuna's ;)

I prefer X-2 Yuna as a character to Tidus but I prefer X's story. Then again, X-2 is literally only like 35% story. Well, the "main story." My first playthrough of it an eternity ago I only did the main story and I'm pretty sure I only got about 30-something% Completion. People say X was too linear (I disagree) but X-2 is most certainly too optional.

The soundtrack in X-2 is also the worst in the series. That isn't a criticism really - it just shows how good the OST is in every other FF. Plus despite it being inferior to X, X-2 has several absolutely amazing tracks like 1000 Words and Eternity - Memory of Lightwaves. Several more too but those are the obvious ones. The normal battle theme though is right down there with Chrono Cross' "Gale."

It's a very fun game though. I just wouldn't say it's my favorite. It doesn't have my favorite Story or Characters or Soundtrack.

That all being said...it capitalized on the sequel idea perfectly. As already discussed, it deals with Religion as much as X does. It just deals with how the absence of a grand, unified purpose to everyone's life causes a lot of chaos, confusion and pain. Also Yuna's character development was absolutely perfect.

X-2 doesn't really have a story. It just centers around a macguffin, the sphere w/ "you know who" in it.

I like X-2's soundtrack. Much more memorable than other ones.

X-2's soundtrack is one of my five favorite of all time. (The others: VII, VIII, either III or XII, and my favorite: SO3.)

My favorite JRPG OSTs are Xenogears, Xenosaga I and III, Chrono Cross and Baten Kaitos 1.

X-2 had some great tracks, and one of the best ballads in video games with "1000 Words", but by and large it didn't wow me that much. I can only think of two memorable area themes for example. "Abyss of the Farplane" and "Bevelle's Secrets". And of the battle themes, I only like the last few for Vegnagun/Shuyin. I never liked the normal battle music or boss music.

But hey, let's mak ea new topic for that discussion. I made one a long time ago and it got no love at all so I'm glad to see X-2's OST does have some fans active on here now.

I think I've just developed a melanoma from reading this thread

So....you like FFX-2?

@Love

I respect your opinion and the fact you like you X-2. Final Fantasy X was one of the first FF games that I played. :)

It's a troll, obviously.
I'm not stating that FFX-2 is a trout, but this post was clearly written by some horny fanboy, period.

BTW: I'm from Poland and I find it a bit insultive and that's why I think you're clearly a troll without a life.

TL;DR: GO HOME! YOU'RE DRUNK!

This thread is super old so I think I'll shut it down.

Also please don't insult other members, regardless of what you think of their opinions.