Persona 4 Golden, a rant

So having finally acquired access to a small list of (really good) Vita games with my VitaTV, the top of that list being Persona 4: Golden. Which I also recently acquired

I had played through about 40+ hours of the PS2 Persona 4 game, and was absolutely in love with it. I was really sad when our PS2 started having power issues and would cut out in the middle of games. Making further attempts at progress pretty pointless when sometimes you'd be forced to go through an hour or so of events without a chance to save, only to have the power cut out a good portion into it. Sucks having to repeat large areas of content. And I'll forever miss that game (Though I heard a rumor that it's getting its own PSN release early next year, so...)

Anyway, Golden supposedly has tons of extra content. New anime scenes, new areas, new events, new social links, new characters, added costumes, a new ending, etc.

One of the changes however, are a couple of "new" voice actors (relatively. From my perspective anyway. Though in both instances I guess these new voice actors have actually done more work on the series, performing in both the anime, and the fighting game of Persona 4. Only the original Persona 4 had different actors)

One voice actor damn near nailed an identical style. If I hadn't been told it was different, I'd have presumed it was the same voice actor who was just barely unable to recapture their previous performance. But close enough for it to not matter

...the other voice actor however, is a complete departure from their PS2 depiction

Chie Satonaka

The group's tomboy and cheerleader

Most people tend to like the new voice actress. But for me, it's ear-splittingly bad and annoying. It almost ruins the game for me. I kind of have to struggle through all of her scenes. Hearing Teepo's voice from Tales of Xillia in a game set closer to reality is really jarring. And I think that's part of the problem. It's a voice. I get the impression that aside from the animal mascot character in the game (Teddie), everyone else is voice acting a character. But Chie's voice actress is actually doing a "voice" rather than a "character". That is to say, she's purposely manipulating her own voice, instead of just manipulating her inflections as an actor

Like Tom Cruis trying to sound like Popeye. Its just so unrealistic in comparison to the original Chie. Sure she had a more mellow and deeper voice, but it was a real voice. Something a real person would have. She was calmer, friendlier, her inflections were realistic, her pitch was in real human decibels

This new Chie misses all her proper inflections, and makes herself sound like a beach bimbo. She's hyper and high pitched and so far off from a real relatable person it's just become a charicature. She's not a real character. She's a stereotypical anime trope of the generic and over-used hyper-active annoying anime side-character. And I hear I'm in the minority and people actually like it, because "it's closer to the original Japanese character". But I listened to the Japanese dub. That Chie just sounded happy. Not nauseating. It puts a whole different spin on her character, and ruins that character in the process

Something I loved about this game was that the characters were characters, and not so much the typical anime and JRPG tropes you always see. I mean sure, they probably still fit some archetypes, but not the typical over used and annoying ones. They were realistic and relatable

I'm told that after a certain major event involving her best friend that her voice gets more tolerable, that maybe the director finally took note and came in and had her tone it down a couple notches, and I'm super looking forward to when that happens

But I'm still just extremely sad and miss my old Chie. I was actually in the process of romancing her in my original playthrough

In this game, with her whiny high pitched shrieking... I wouldn't dream of it

I just had to rant before going to bed. I hear all the extras in this game make it far more than worth it. And with the prospect of her character getting less annoying soon, it'll be even more worth it. But I'll still miss you, OG Chie~<3

Rant over

Anyone ever have any similar experiences, or are able to relate to this one? I know there are other instances out there where voice actors or character portrayals or changes in ports/remakes have ruined some things. Its a sad state of affairs

While I did like her voice in the PS2 version I feel like the new actress is more "Chie." Chie is a hyperactive teenage girl and it's probably more appropriate that she sounds like one. Have you heard teenage girls talk?

I've heard humans talk. I think it would have been more appropriate for the voice actress to use her own voice, and display that hyperactivity. I think half my problem is the shrieky high pitch'ness, which is not normal. It completely stands out from the rest of the cast. Everyone else has normal human voices

Have you seen the interviews? That is pretty much her voice.

I still think she sounds better as Chie than Agnés, but that overly breathy voice was most likely a direction quirk. I think Erin Fitzgerald is actually a very good VA.

Video examples?

high pitched voices on anime (or anime game) characters make me want to cut myself

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Originally Posted by Mirage

high pitched voices on anime (or anime game) characters make me want to cut myself

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High pitched voices usually make me want to cut myself even IRL. But somehow Chie's voice seems not that bad to me really.

I didn't know that Teddie had a change of actors until my friend told me. Chie, however, was noticeable right from the beginning.

I like her new voice, but she oftentimes inflects words wrong, so it clashes with the rest of the characters. You can tell that she was re-recorded just from that alone. Other than that, I have no real problems with her.

my messages keep getting deleted before posting. yay for mobile browsing with super limited caching ability. thanks for listening to the rant. i had intended to reply proper but it is not meant to be right now

Edit: I should note I have nothing against Miss Fitzgerald as a voice actress and actually quite like some of her characters. And more than likely if I had met Chie with her as the voice actress from the start I probably wouldn't have as much of a problem. Or any problem.

Only thing is that new Chie even sounds like old Chie sometimes. So I know it's a problem with the directing. They want Chie to sound like a spazz. Old Chie was calmer and more level headed sounding. Insecure uneasy and only sometimes a bit spastic. But not really over the top. And I knew people in my teenage years just like that Chie. I've known people in my adult years like that Chie. I've never known any person like the new Chie. Only characters. Generic annoying tropey characters. She reminds me of Yuffee. Rikku. Excel.

Oh well thanks for listening to the rants. I'm on my phone at lunch at work so I can't provide video evidence at the moment but I can probably dig something up when I get home

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Originally Posted by Mirage

high pitched voices on anime (or anime game) characters make me want to cut myself

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How much anime do you watch?! Only out of concern, because you might need to go to your nearest AED for a blood transfusion!

Not a lot. But don't worry, even if I did, I have an extremely strong willpower.

I feel that old Chie's voice sounded better. The new Chie is a better actress, and fits the character more though.

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Something I loved about this game was that the characters were characters, and not so much the typical anime and JRPG tropes you always see. I mean sure, they probably still fit some archetypes, but not the typical over used and annoying ones. They were realistic and relatable

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As much as I love P4, I gotta disagree with you on the bolded part. The female cast in particular were very much typical anime tropes. They can all be found in many harem anime.

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Originally Posted by Bright Shield

I feel that old Chie's voice sounded better. The new Chie is a better actress, and fits the character more though.

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Something I loved about this game was that the characters were characters, and not so much the typical anime and JRPG tropes you always see. I mean sure, they probably still fit some archetypes, but not the typical over used and annoying ones. They were realistic and relatable

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As much as I love P4, I gotta disagree with you on the bolded part. The female cast in particular were very much typical anime tropes. They can all be found in many harem anime.

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He mentioned reducing characters to tropes. Yes, the P4 characters may utilize some tropes, but there's a difference between a character being just a trope or cliché, and a character being an actual character/person beyond that. The characters in the games, due to their nature (getting to deeply know them in the passing school year), are never shallow tropes, and there's always many layers and nuances to them.

I haven't played either game, but I can relate to a new voice actress driving you mad. When I heard Linda Ballantyne's voice as Sailor Moon for the first time after getting used to Terri in the role I wanted to tear my ears off. I did get used to her after a while, she just didn't hold a candle to Terri.

Oooh yes I feel you there. I haven't played P4G yet (honestly, I don't really feel like doing so anywhere soon - I'm more of a mainline SMT person nowadays) but I played Persona 4 Arena recently, and no offence to Erin Fitzgerald, but she's just nowhere near as...Chie-like.

Interested in how do you feel about Marie? I hear a lot of contrasting things about her from the wider Persona community.

Yeah, I just started interacting with Marie, and her lines are fairly... I dunno. You can kinda tell she's shoehorned into the story, and not written with quite the adeptness they had back in the day with the game's creation. It's not bad, it just seems a bit more amateurish. She starts off really thorny and abrasive, and immediately does a 180 when you start interacting with her without any build-up or proper progression. And then still has sprinklings of stand-off'ishness. Kinda inconsistent. And her voice isn't all that great. But she'll probably grow on me. I'm considering pursuing her romantically since that's one of the additions, I figure I may as well see something new with this version of the game since Chie is ruined for me. So she's not a total turn-off. I just think she could have been written a tad better

I see a lot of people saying the new voice is "more" Chie. Like the old voice didn't represent her character properly. So I think we can agree that the different voices create effectively different characters. Until I get used to this voice representing her, my feeling is not just a voice change. Its like her whole personality changed, from my perspective. The pitch, the inflections, the emphases, the delivery, all make a huge difference. And apparently the Chie liked wasn't the real Chie, but I still like her more

I'm at the point where her voice is starting to calm down, after events in the game affect her directly. People online said her voice became more tolerable after that, and they're pretty much right. On top of that, I'm starting to get used to it anyway. I'll probably never get so used to her that I prefer her, but I'm not going to let it ruin a great game for me. At least now I can appreciate her as a character more

Also, thanks for the understanding, Flynn. I guess there are always tropes if you look hard enough. But the characters in this game are some of the best fleshed out in any Japanese medium, since the whole point of most of the game is to explore people's personality on a deeply personal and psychological level. Even their darkest, most immature and selfish parts of their personalities are put on display for the player. And the reactions to it are very human. So maybe that helps overlook the tropes, since they're not treated nearly in a typical manner

Marie seems like your everyday tsundere to me to be honest.

Typical as her trope may be I think it could have been done a tad bit better. I guess I hold them to high standards. But she's not a turn off or anything. Part of the problem may be that I don't have lot of exposure to tsundare archetypes that I'm aware of

I enjoyed the Marie story but I always felt like it would have felt weird if you played Golden before the original. Like her story is just there. Idk about "shoehorned" but very disconnected even if they did loosely tie her in at the end. It's good bonus content for people who were already fans but going through Golden first she'd seem like a hugely important character and I would imagine some people expected a bigger impact.

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Originally Posted by The White Wizard of Fynn

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Originally Posted by Bright Shield

I feel that old Chie's voice sounded better. The new Chie is a better actress, and fits the character more though.

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Something I loved about this game was that the characters were characters, and not so much the typical anime and JRPG tropes you always see. I mean sure, they probably still fit some archetypes, but not the typical over used and annoying ones. They were realistic and relatable

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As much as I love P4, I gotta disagree with you on the bolded part. The female cast in particular were very much typical anime tropes. They can all be found in many harem anime.

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He mentioned reducing characters to tropes. Yes, the P4 characters may utilize some tropes, but there's a difference between a character being just a trope or cliché, and a character being an actual character/person beyond that. The characters in the games, due to their nature (getting to deeply know them in the passing school year), are never shallow tropes, and there's always many layers and nuances to them.

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Maybe, but the same can be said of most JRPG casts. The P4 cast certainly isn't special in this regard. They are just as trope-ish as your average JRPG cast. The difference is that most JRPGs take tropes from western fantasy titles, and shonen fighter animes. While P4 goes for slice of life/harem anime tropes.

Tropes Are Not Bad

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Originally Posted by The White Wizard of Fynn

Tropes Are Not Bad

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When did I say tropes were bad?

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Originally Posted by Vyk

Yeah, I just started interacting with Marie, and her lines are fairly... I dunno. You can kinda tell she's shoehorned into the story, and not written with quite the adeptness they had back in the day with the game's creation. It's not bad, it just seems a bit more amateurish. She starts off really thorny and abrasive, and immediately does a 180 when you start interacting with her without any build-up or proper progression. And then still has sprinklings of stand-off'ishness. Kinda inconsistent. And her voice isn't all that great. But she'll probably grow on me. I'm considering pursuing her romantically since that's one of the additions, I figure I may as well see something new with this version of the game since Chie is ruined for me. So she's not a total turn-off. I just think she could have been written a tad better

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That's interesting...Marie's just been introduced in Ultimax, and after talking for a bit about...stuff, she suddenly went all tsundere on Yu, which was kinda confusing. I'm getting the impression that she wasn't really a smooth addition into the P4 Universe at any rate.

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I see a lot of people saying the new voice is "more" Chie. Like the old voice didn't represent her character properly. So I think we can agree that the different voices create effectively different characters. Until I get used to this voice representing her, my feeling is not just a voice change. Its like her whole personality changed, from my perspective. The pitch, the inflections, the emphases, the delivery, all make a huge difference. And apparently the Chie liked wasn't the real Chie, but I still like her more

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Yeah, Neo-Chie is just really squealy and less action-y to me.

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Originally Posted by Bright Shield

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Originally Posted by The White Wizard of Fynn

Tropes Are Not Bad

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When did I say tropes were bad?

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I never said you said they were bad :3: Just throwing it out there to aid our discussion.

I think it may be partly my fault, as I insinuated that tropes are bad by suggesting that these characters don't match what I considered "typical" tropes. Though I apparently misrepresented my argument. Tropes are a great foundation to build a character upon, and it's done really well in this game, and in the previous game as well. A lot of Japanese media use tropes as a crutch and don't expand on them, and then I guess they get a bit cliche and bland, and I get sick of seeing the same thing over and over with no variance or development upon anything established

That sorta thing always bugs me as a writer since I've taken courses on how to avoid that situation, and sadly I see it a lot in Japanese media. I was really just trying to praise the creators in this case for being a-typical and doing a good job building on the foundation of those tropes and developing the characters in realistic and relatable ways

But like I said, I may have given more praise than was due (though it's certainly due, regardless) because I don't have a lot of exposure to slice-of-life anime, or much harem anime (not anymore anyway, though I used to love their romantic comedies which are mostly harem animes)

Anyway, I'm glad a lot of constructive conversation came out of this topic. I mostly just wanted to bitch about Chie like a whine-o. The change seems to have set in stone now in the game, and everyone was right, so far now that I'm at that point in the game, her voice hasn't reverted much, and now that she's a battle companion, her shriekiness at least has better context than it did in normal everyday conversation. So it's a lot more tolerable

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I never said you said they were bad :3: Just throwing it out there to aid our discussion.

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I guess. For the record, I tend to love certain tropes.

I was just saying that the P4 cast is just as trope-ish as most JRPG casts. The difference is that it uses tropes which are rarely seen in JRPGs.

Not sure if I made it clear, but I'm not trying to put the P4 cast down either. I love those guys and gals. One of my favorite RPGs ever. I probably only prefer 1 game to it(my list changes a lot though, lol).

I realized something last night with a Chie heavy week in the game. Her new recordings are not the same quality as everyone else. It's nothing but treble. Which is not helpful since her voice is nothing but treble. The recordings of the rest of the cast sounds much fuller. Even the higher sounding characters. I'd say there's not enough bass in the audio but I'm not sure everyone would understand what. I mean since there is no bass to her voice. But something is definitely missing. Which is weird because you'd think all these years later they'd have better equipment and policies for their audio

Not entirely sure if it's the mic or the mixing equipment or a lazy or inexperienced mixer. But even as a novice who is not an audiophile I am certain I could have made all her dialog sound as full of audio frequency as the rest of the cast just messing around in an adobe program over a weekend. I'm not sure how Atlus let it slide

I need another event to involve Teddie to see if I can hear that distinction in his recordings as well

Good thing I am close to deaf to anything even close to music and deeper tones so I totally do not hear that difference in the recordings.

I use my stereo speakers (pseudo-surround sound) for most of my gaming. Now that I'm not raging over the voice change, I can pick up on other nuances. I think it's kinda unfair to the voice actress. There was something about her that seemed strangely out of place in comparison, now I know what it is. It's just weird, because it would have been an easy fix. Kinda wish I had an amp that I could force higher pitches to lower ends. But whatever. It was just an observation is all :3