Latecomers

Musing observation: When recalling my one and only playthrough of FFXIII while playing XIII-2 I naturally thought of the party in XIII. Specifically I thought of Team Everyone Besides Me Hates Them(Snow, Hope and Vaille) and how they were my favorite characters. Meanwhile, "fan favorite" Fang was probably the worst party member to me. "Why is this?" I thought to myself. I am so decidedly meh about Fang that I would honestly say I like Lightning more than her if only because my active dislike for Lightning is still preferable to my profound indifference to Fang.

Dawning realization: And then it came to me. Fang took way too long to actually get a character or any sort of focus. By the time she showed up and did anything I can recall I was already invested in everyone else. She was an unwelcome addition. She has a cool voice and look and stuff but she was just introduced way too late for me to give a crap about her.

Profound revelation: And we can see this same sort of problem in other RPGs. Who is everyone's least favorite character in FFIX? Amarant. Eiko isn't much better, either. The end of Disk 2, Square? Really? Someone really dropped the ball thee.

Scathing annotation: And wasn't Edge the last party member in FFIV? God he was garbage, in every conceivable way. I liked every party member in FFIV except him. Well, Rosa sucked too, but Edge was the worst.

Smug proclamation: If a main party member is introduced 10+ hours into an RPG, you have done your job poorly.

What say you all, meatbags?

I think it really depends on the structure of the game. In something like FF4 where the party composition is a rather fluid thing it doesn't bother me in the least.

Idk, I don't think it's bad on principle. Xenogears kept giving us party members throughout the whole game and I liked them. Emeralds is a fan favorite, and is the last one to join, while the most dislike one is probably Rico and he's about the middle character to join. Xenoblade gave us one of the coolest characters to join after the mid-point, and Radiant Historia did something similar.

I think this may suck for XIII for other reasons :p

It's one of those things where it depends on execution. I mean, they'll have a disadvantage over the other characters since you don't have as much time to get to know them (depending just how late they come in), but that doesn't mean it should be avoided altogether.

Oh, and I just remembered everyone has a huge boner for Thundergod Cid from FFT. And he joins you in the final chapter.

Depends. Fang was my favourite actually and sure she joined later but I felt she still got a good amount of screen time and wasn't one of the three I constantly wanted to punch in the face.

The only problem I have with late additions is that I love characters and I hate waiting for them. I want all of them early so I have more time to use them. But it doesn't mean there haven't been some really good characters that just sadly arrive late.

Heck, look at Magus from Chrono Trigger. I didn't particularly care for him but he's absurdly popular and he joins incredibly late in the game

Rikku in X; she joins late, is really fragile to begin with and pre-Bikanel her only use is her overdrive which charges when she takes damage. Plus she tried to kill the party a minute before joining. That's a bad introduction, and she barely got any screentime on my first playthrough as a result.

CAPTAIN GORDON, DEFENDER OF EARTH has such a commanding presence that you forget CAPTAIN GORDON, DEFENDER OF EARTH joins at chapter 10 of 14.

Late comers only work if the game does give them enough screen time. The problem with Fang and Amarant is that even though both are introduced early in the script, neither of them get much characterization before or after they join. What separates them from Magus is that Magus is a huge part of the story before he joins, so it's not like you don't understand his whole deal is before he joins. T.G. Cid is the same way, as you've been watching him deal with Duke Goltana and Delita long before he joins in the final chapter. So it's not like they are not fleshed out characters by the time they join.

Characters like Edge (though FuSoYa and Kain are closer to the theme of this thread) and Relm comes from them having huge story arcs introducing them initially so you do get a good feel for the characters so it's not so bad. Though for them it probably comes down more to mechanics as to why they are not as well loved.

Me and Mr. Carny were discussing this earlier, and he brought up Legion from Mass Effect 2. You meet him right near the end of the game, but Legion is still pretty well liked generally, so this hasn't had a massive effect on his character. This is helped because of his greater role in Mass Effect 3, to the extent that I would say that while he debuted in 2, he really had a main role in 3, especially in the Rannoch section.

I don't mind latecomers, if they're good to me, simply. :P
I hate when annoying characters get a lot of screentime, my frustration is getting higher and higher because of that trout. XD

I think Wolf Canoe is onto something. It helps if they get plenty of time after.

Because I have to disagree with you about Eiko. She's my favorite character. But, going with what WC said, it makes sense why: after she's introduced, much of the remaining disc follows her story.

And don't forget about FFVII's Cid. Personally my least favorite character of the game, but pretty much everyone else's favorite. He was introduced at the end of disc 1/past 10 hours in the game. But people love that guy.

So while I kind of agree with you in theory, I'm not sure it actually holds up once you start investigating.

I don't mind late comers as long as they don't come to late. If they show up, get some screen time and let me get to know them, lets roll! If its hi, now we fight the big baddie.... get lost, you're not needed here.

I just beat Child of Light and I gotta say, it had a latecomer that bothered me. But she only bothered me because the story seemed like it ended a dungeon too late - she didn't get a lot of screentime, and I think I only used her once as she joins just before the final dungeon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fynn

I just beat Child of Light and I gotta say, it had a latecomer that bothered me. But she only bothered me because the story seemed like it ended a dungeon too late - she didn't get a lot of screentime, and I think I only used her once as she joins just before the final dungeon.

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Sounds like my issues with Miranda in Legend of Dragoon. She felt less like a character and more as a replacement for the childhood best friend for the final dungeon.

Except she isn't really a replacement. Her story is cool, but it really comes too late in the game. i didn't expect that to bother me, except the next dungeon turned out to be the final dungeon and I'm like, ???? Why did you give me Gen now, then?

And she had the potential to be a cool character in baddle, kinda being a cross between a bard and a time mage, there just wasn't enough time to raise her to the point of usefulness. And at that point I kinda stuck to using my main character with the Big Guy at all times because that dealt with things the fastest :p

Kain wouldn't count either, Wolf, according to your little distinction. He's basically the Magus of the game as we see tons of him and he's features prominently in the story before he joins later in the game.

It's the same thing with Rikku. We see and play as both of them very early on and that was clearly intended to make us give a crap about them when they returned later on.

Leon from FFII is a weird case as he sorta kinda fits the same area as Kain and Rikku but he's gone for much longer and as the Dark Knight he's still not around very much. Then again,FF2 was clearly Square still trying to find their way in terms of writing so you can expect some missteps.