The Rule of Three Women

We were talking about how there are virtually no FF lady villains. Even in the games usually beloved for their writing like VI or XII, not a single female baddie in sight. VII only had friggin' Scarlet. The one and only female big bad was 20 years ago.

But then somebody pointed out an even weirder thing. From VI onward and with the obvious exception of XV or the MMO's, the playable party ALWAYS contains three women. Doesn't matter if the cast is huge like VI or it's just three people like X-2, there are only three ladies allowed to be playable.

VI: Celes, Terra, Relm
VII: Aerith, Tifa, Yuffie
VIII: Rinoa, Quistis, Selphie
IX: Garnet, Eiko, Freya
X: Yuna, Rikku, Lulu
X-2: Yuna, Rikku, Paine
XII: Ashe, Fran, Penelo
XIII: Lightning, Vanille, Fang

This can't be a coincidence It's so bizarre. I've been playing FF games all my life and never noticed this. I don't know what the reasoning behind it could be.

Earlier than that

IV: Rosa, Rydia, Porom
V: Lenna, Faris, Krile

But then again, this might not be exclusive to FF. Chrono Trigger has Marle, Lucca and Ayla, Xenogears has Elly, Emeralda and Maria, Xenoblade Chronicles has Sharla, Melia and Fiora, Xenosaga has KOS-MOS, Shion and MOMO, both Persona 2s have it (Maya, Ginko, Yukki / Maya, Ulala, Elly), etc. etc.

It's a thing. Funnily enough, it's even present in EoFF's very own fan game, Death of a Fansite, so you could just ask Psychotic :p

Pretty sure it's to meet a quota. Just enough to not be considered pure tokens, not enough to be """"too girly for boys to enjoy"""".

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

What makes it weird is the amount of males has no bearing on it. In FFV you only end up with one dude and in X-2 there are none whatsoever but it doesn't matter, three women and no less. Likewise in some of the bigger casts like VI or VII, nope, no more room, three women only.

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Originally Posted by Fynn

It's a thing. Funnily enough, it's even present in EoFF's very own fan game, Death of a Fansite, so you could just ask Psychotic :p

Pretty sure it's to meet a quota. Just enough to not be considered pure tokens, not enough to be """"too girly for boys to enjoy"""".

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

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That was purely based on who was in the top 10 posters, and could've been 10 females or 0 :D I did notice it at the time and thought it was funny though. I also strongly disagree with Jinx's assessments!

You did have Edea for a bit in VIII, giving you 4 different playable women in the game. The rule of 3 is odd though.

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Originally Posted by Psychotic

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

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That was purely based on who was in the top 10 posters, and could've been 10 females or 0 :D I did notice it at the time and thought it was funny though. I also strongly disagree with Jinx's assessments![/QUOTE]

Rosa the wife/mother (in TAY), Porom the child, Rydia the whore

It fits XD

Also, it's an actual trope!

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Originally Posted by Fynn

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Originally Posted by Psychotic

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

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That was purely based on who was in the top 10 posters, and could've been 10 females or 0 :D I did notice it at the time and thought it was funny though. I also strongly disagree with Jinx's assessments!

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Rosa the wife/mother (in TAY), Porom the child, Rydia the whore

It fits XD

Also, it's an actual trope![/QUOTE]

It's 100% a thing. You can also sub out maiden and crone, but it for sure works.

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Originally Posted by Jinx

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Originally Posted by Fynn

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Originally Posted by Psychotic

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

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That was purely based on who was in the top 10 posters, and could've been 10 females or 0 :D I did notice it at the time and thought it was funny though. I also strongly disagree with Jinx's assessments!

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Rosa the wife/mother (in TAY), Porom the child, Rydia the whore

It fits XD

Also, it's an actual trope!

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It's 100% a thing. You can also sub out maiden and crone, but it for sure works.[/QUOTE]

But hey, you know me. I'll never pass up a chance to call Freya a whore. :^)

(inb4 she colberts me)

(in case there's a misunderstanding, I was only referring to them as DoaF characters; please don't kill me :O)

On the other hand, XIII-2 and World of Final Fantasy had one female party member (or, if you count all the recruitable enemies, way more than 3), LR had only one and Type-0 had 7.

Anyway, seems to me like in semi-recent times they try to balance the female:male ratio, barring entries with only one playable character or only-female/only-male entries like FFXV and X-2. XII and XIII both had 6 party members, 3 of which were female. IX had 8 party members, 3 female/4 male/1 genderless. Type-0 had 14, 7 of which were female.

I chalk VI only having 3 female characters out of like 14 total up to the times and coincidence.

Not only that, but it's usually always " love interest ", " tough/ misunderstood girl " and " cheerful one/ the kid "


Rosa, Rydia, Porom

Lena, Faris, Krile

Celes, Terra, Relm

Aerith, Tifa, Yuffie

Rinoa, Quistis, Selphie

Garnet/ Dagger, Freya, Eiko

Yuna, Lulu, Rikku

Ashe, Fran, Penelo

Serah, Fang and Vanille

I've used the rule of three women all my life. Though I've only been ever been able to sleep with one at a time.

It's weird that I've never noticed this before. Even BioWare (likely unwittingly) adheres to this trope with Dragon Age and Mass Effect and the first Knights of the Old Republic. Though now that I mentally dissect what's going on with them, at least recently, I can see it somewhat has to do with the class systems. You generally have rogue, fighter, mage, and you get girl examples of each. For some reason it doesn't matter if you get male duplicates of any. Is there a social/psychological construct where it sticks out more if "Whoops, we made 2 female mages on this team." Like we see the guys as just guys and have as many of whatever, their abilities don't matter we just need them in the story or on the team. Whereas girls are tied to their class and are more noticeable from a mechanical view? It's interesting...

Also worth noting is that each of the three females fits or is a combination of the same reused archetype in every FF (or at least from VII onwards) i.e the genki girl, the shy love interest and the one that's just there for the T&A.

In Chrono Cross, the female characters you could not avoid recruiting eventually as they were part of the story were Kid, Harle, and Sprigg.

In Radiata Stories, there was only Ridley. Every other chick was optional.

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Originally Posted by Example

Also worth noting is that each of the three females fits or is a combination of the same reused archetype in every FF (or at least from VII onwards) i.e the genki girl, the shy love interest and the one that's just there for the T&A.

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Quistis and Freya are "just there for the T&A"? That's the "archetype" you'd assign to them?

Freya’s definitely got tail!

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Originally Posted by Jinx

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Originally Posted by Jinx

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Originally Posted by Fynn

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Originally Posted by Psychotic

They're also there to fill archetypes. As Jinx herself put it best, regarding DoaF, "Pumpkin the cute one, Shauna the mom, Freya the whore".

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That was purely based on who was in the top 10 posters, and could've been 10 females or 0 :D I did notice it at the time and thought it was funny though. I also strongly disagree with Jinx's assessments!

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Rosa the wife/mother (in TAY), Porom the child, Rydia the whore

It fits XD

Also, it's an actual trope!

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It's 100% a thing. You can also sub out maiden and crone, but it for sure works.

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But hey, you know me. I'll never pass up a chance to call Freya a whore. :^)

(inb4 she colberts me)

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How am I just seeing you all call me this, you hooligans. All of you are banned.

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Originally Posted by Spuuky

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Originally Posted by Example

Also worth noting is that each of the three females fits or is a combination of the same reused archetype in every FF (or at least from VII onwards) i.e the genki girl, the shy love interest and the one that's just there for the T&A.

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Quistis and Freya are "just there for the T&A"? That's the "archetype" you'd assign to them?

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Quistis hangs around because she wants to get into some edgy seventeen year old's pants.

Freya ... poor girl just wants her lover to remember her again.... she also wants to fight for Burmecia and see it recover.

They are completely different characters.

IX has 4. You forgot Quina.

I’m not sure Quina would appreciate the fact you’re trying to confine him/her into the gender binary

Quina is technically genderless, right? If that's the case then I don't think Quina counts into this.

I am what ever the world needs me to be.

But not what the world deserves you to be..

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Originally Posted by Fynn

I’m not sure Quina would appreciate the fact you’re trying to confine him/her into the gender binary

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Technically labeling their gender as him/her is also confining them inside the gender binary!

Who spilled Tumblr all over my precious Eyes on FF?

I

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Originally Posted by Jinx

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Originally Posted by Fynn

I’m not sure Quina would appreciate the fact you’re trying to confine him/her into the gender binary

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Technically labeling their gender as him/her is also confining them inside the gender binary!

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I’m just going by his/her preferred pronouns as used in-game

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Originally Posted by Fynn

I

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Originally Posted by Jinx

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Originally Posted by Fynn

I’m not sure Quina would appreciate the fact you’re trying to confine him/her into the gender binary

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Technically labeling their gender as him/her is also confining them inside the gender binary!

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I’m just going by his/her preferred pronouns as used in-game

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I believe they use s/he and his/her, not she/he.

That said, s/he is still inside the gender binary! There's nothing wrong with being part of the gender binary!

But if you’re both parts of the binary, is it still a binary to you?

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Originally Posted by Fynn

But if you’re both parts of the binary, is it still a binary to you?

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By the very definition of "both" and "binary", yes, yes it is.

But ... binary is one or the other. One and the other makes a third option of both

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Originally Posted by Vyk

But ... binary is one or the other. One and the other makes a third option of both

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Nope, it just means consisting of two.

Which is a third option, because by the very definition of binary, it’s one or the other, like Vyk said

I can't believe I'm delving into this, but...

He/she suggests one or the other, not both genders at the same time, and in that case I'd say Jinx is right. It's like an unknown or a flickering between the two options. If it were he-she, then that would suggest it is a combination of some kind, which would probably take it outside the binary.

I'm going more by grammar rules here than a massive education on gender though :shobon:

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Originally Posted by Fynn

Which is a third option, because by the very definition of binary, it’s one or the other, like Vyk said

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Being composed of things that exist firmly in the binary doesn't put it outside of the binary. Bigendered people are still binary, as their very gender is defined by the binary itself.


(SPOILER)This is the hardest I've ever argued about something I don't really care about. xD

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Originally Posted by Jinx

(SPOILER)This is the hardest I've ever argued about something I don't really care about. xD

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(SPOILER)same

Why you care about small things? World very simple place. World only have two things: Things you can eat and things you no can eat.

Yeah everything in the world either is a potato or isn’t a potato

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Originally Posted by Fynn

Yeah everything in the world either is a potato or isn’t a potato

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https://i.imgur.com/G1F1ECN.jpg

What about a french fry, which isn't a potato but isn't not a potato either?