Why FFIX is the Worst FF EVER!

Why have I said that? Well, it's because it is. Here's the reasons.

1)ITS TOO EASY
Surely an FF is a quest, an epic that you can explore and get hours and hours out the main quest alone. A quest where you have to train until strong enough to beat the many monsters that stand in your way. Not with FFIX. On my first play though, I beat Necron at level 32 with Zidane. I got to the 3rd disc in 16hrs. What is the point in that? I spent £40 on a game, and a Final Fantasy and I can almost complete in less then a day!

2)CHARACTERS
Are whimsical, pointless and 2D good enough. These words describe them perfectly.

3)MAGIC SYSTEM
Is very clever, but way too easy. What happened to the deep junction systems in FFVII FFVIII & FFX? Was FFIX the poor, lazy brother out of these epics?

And these are just a few reasons.
Discuss.

Since this forum is particularly dedicated to the fans of FFIX, I strongly suggest you don't start any fights; they will only turn into pointless flame wars.

Hater...

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Why have I said that? Well, it's because it is. Here's the reasons.

1)ITS TOO EASY
Surely an FF is a quest, an epic that you can explore and get hours and hours out the main quest alone. A quest where you have to train until strong enough to beat the many monsters that stand in your way. Not with FFIX. On my first play though, I beat Necron at level 32 with Zidane. I got to the 3rd disc in 16hrs. What is the point in that? I spent £40 on a game, and a Final Fantasy and I can almost complete in less then a day!

2)CHARACTERS
Are whimsical, pointless and 2D good enough. These words describe them perfectly.

3)MAGIC SYSTEM
Is very clever, but way too easy. What happened to the deep junction systems in FFVII FFVIII & FFX? Was FFIX the poor, lazy brother out of these epics?

And these are just a few reasons.
Discuss.

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You look to hard at the game. Take a step back before you flame it. I'm sure we could all say the same about FF7 and 8. My friend beat Safer Sephiroth at level 40 with 1,500 hp. My other friend beat ff8 in 20 hours with all junctions and gfs. See, all of them are easy as long as you know how to do it. As for the charachters, they are perfect in my opinion. The main charachter is for once not a ticked off 20 year old with a bad atttitude and a colossal weapon, moreover he has spirit and individuality. Secondly, all of the characters in this game were individuals, because none had the same skills. In FF7 and 8 everybody has the same skills, tactics, and abuilitys so no matter which way you go you baisically have 8 of the same guy. Just think before you flame next time. Most of the guys in here love FF9 and can prove anything you say to be wrong. No offense, but most guys and gals around here dont like ff bashing.

Just please.... do us a favor.. and delete this thread before Kurohime sees it. She is in LOVE with zidane... and she gerts mad at 9 bashers.... ooh boy...:eek:

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Originally posted by Vincent06
Just please.... do us a favor.. and delete this thread before Kurohime sees it. She is in LOVE with zidane... and she gerts mad at 9 bashers.... ooh boy...:eek:

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Then you should tell Kurohime to respect others' opinions.

Personally, I think FF9 is the worst game in the series, but I don't hate it. By itself, it's a great game. My only problem is like Legolas63 said, it's just too blasted easy. The optional side bossses were the only real challenges I could find. But, still, I've faced alot harder in a FF.

EDIT: Also, junctioning was only in FF8. It was nowhere to be found in FFs 7 and 10.

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Originally posted by Mr. Graves
Personally, I think FF9 is the worst game in the series, but I don't hate it.

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It's the 'worst game' in the series for me but as Mr.Graves says I don't hate it!.... I was just irritated by the story. At first I was enjoying it but then the story about Terra came into play and the memory into one life source.... I wasn't too convinced on that story part... and then... came Nectron!!!:hot: This end boss who had absolutely nothing to do with the story just appeared! I know in other FFs there are things copied but IX just stole the crown! It ripped off everything from Star Wars to The Matrix! I never felt attached to Zidane, Kuja was just a cross-dresser and it was such a shame on that story because, as I said before, in the beginning I really thought I was starting a great FF but some parts just felt like someone had woke up one day and decided "Hmm, how best can I make up a load of crap to ruin a good FF?"
I really thought there would be good story in the bit when Zidane sees Garnet's memory but instead it was the memory into one life source...
However it may seem as though I hate it- I really didn't! There was only a few pieces I didn't like! The music was great, the ending heartwarming. My end feelings on IX? Not my favourite but we're all entitled to our own opinions afterall...

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Originally posted by Leia
It ripped off everything from Star Wars to The Matrix!

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Well, FF9 was actually made before the Matix, so in truth, the Matrix ripped off FF9. But yes, we're all entitled to out own opinions. FF9 was my favorite.

Nah, FF2j, then FF4 are the ones I like least :p FF9 is okayish, but there's something about it that doesn't make me want to replay this game any time soon, maybe the lack of fun side quests or variations on story, or a lack of overly interesting storyline and characters, unlike with FF6 or FF7 :p

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Originally posted by SpikingZero
Since this forum is particularly dedicated to the fans of FFIX

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Not true. This forum is for discussing FF9 - if someone wants to point out the bad things about the game, they're free to do so.

Okay, its time for me to get quite upset. Ahem, first off, Don't say how horrible or pathetic something is and then attempt to change everything and say "I didn't mean it like that" Or "I didn't hate it" just after you said it sucked and was the worst you've ever played. Secondly, I loved this game. It's no easier then any other FF.. as pointed out before. And as someone else also stated, the characters are FINALLY individual. And of course it has tons of references from other FFs and various games.... It was SUPPOSED to. It told you before you even opened the case that it was in part a history of the previous eight FFs. And you really shouldn't tell other people to respect your opinion when you come into a forum ranting and raving about how bad the game is and how nobody can tell you different cuz you are always right and if anyone else thinks differently, then they just suck. My hands and fingers are tired now, so I'm going to go to another, more intelligent forum.:chop:

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Originally posted by crono_logical
Not true. This forum is for discussing FF9 - if someone wants to point out the bad things about the game, they're free to do so.

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I was just being pre-emptive about a potential flame war.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Why have I said that? Well, it's because it is. Here's the reasons.

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Since when are opinions considered as fact...

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Originally posted by Legolas63
1)ITS TOO EASY
Surely an FF is a quest, an epic that you can explore and get hours and hours out the main quest alone. A quest where you have to train until strong enough to beat the many monsters that stand in your way. Not with FFIX. On my first play though, I beat Necron at level 32 with Zidane. I got to the 3rd disc in 16hrs. What is the point in that? I spent £40 on a game, and a Final Fantasy and I can almost complete in less then a day!

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And that's the way you play the game. Others can clock the game in at nearly 40 hours. I've come close to that time myself. Now as far as beating Necron goes...have you noticed the amount of HP he has? He only has about 50,000HP. Using FFVII as an example, Safer Sephiroth has 150,000HP. You only needed to be at level 32 to beat Necron because, quite frankly, at that level, you were doing enough damage to take out Necron. FFIX was designed this way. All the bosses and enemies had less HP then in some of the other Final Fantasies, so you didn't have to be at such a high level to go through the game.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
2)CHARACTERS
Are whimsical, pointless and 2D good enough. These words describe them perfectly.

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And again, that's your opinion of the characters. Me, I find Zidane a refreshing change for a main character compared to Cloud who was a moody schizophrenic and Squall who was a loner with enough angst to level cities. It was nice to have a main character who had a positive outlook on things and was generally upbeat.

And then you have Vivi, who I find to be one of the deepest characters to ever come out of any Final Fantasy. And I can't see how anyone could disagree.

Of course, there's also Garnet who is second only to Terra as one of the best Final Fantasy female leads I've ever seen.

And then there's Kuja. Some people hate him with a passion. I personally think he's the best villain to come out of Final Fantasy. To me, he is leaps and bounds better than Sephiroth from the way he carried himself, to his motives for doing what he does.

The rest of the characters, admittedly, have their cliche places, but that's true for most of the final fantasies.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
3)MAGIC SYSTEM
Is very clever, but way too easy. What happened to the deep junction systems in FFVII FFVIII & FFX? Was FFIX the poor, lazy brother out of these epics?

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Alright, what was so deep about the Materia system from FFVII? I want this character to have fire. I'll equip him with fire materia.

Or the Sphere system from FFX. Lesse, I'll have the character traverse this grid, and use spheres to activate abilities and attributes.

There's nothing particulary deep about either of these systems. The only one you could make an arguement for is FFVIII where you stats depended on Magic.

Okay, i completely agree with American Bad***. Kuja was a great villain, although thats just my opinon. He had a sarcasm and poeticness about him that made him seem like a villain that knew his powers, wasn't afraid to use them, and yet had an asset of comedy at the same time without being an evil demon. While one of my friends says "he basically told everybody his plans", this is only true to a certain extent. Nobody was around when he told his plans in the scenes thereof, except for the one in Burmecia where most of the charachters were k.o.ed. He also spoke in a poetic-riddle style that i loved. He, in my opinion, is one of the greatest villans in AND out of final fantasy. Legolas63, I'd also like to apolagize for my rudeness in my first post. This is one of my favorite ffs, and your opinion is certainly valid as far as i am concerned. Everyone is entiteld to they're opinion, even if it goes against mine :D

But one question... if you hate ff9 so much, then why do you have a Vivi avatar? :eek:

Nine owned the pants off of Eight and Ten........ by far.

Although I'm still a bit creeped out by the way Kuja looked, he IS leaps and bounds ahead of most villians. Let use comparisn: (this is only my opinion, and I'm no expert.) Sephiroth. What was Sephiroth's main motive and goal. There really was only one. Greed. (SPOILER)He wanted the planet all to himself. That was the only reason he did what he did. Kuja on the other hand had other, very deep purposes. Several spoilers in the following.(SPOILER) Kuja began his deeds for the good old reason of wanting to be the most powerful creature in the universe. Every bad guy wants that. But, later in the story, it becomes a search for his origins. He feels he must find his birthplace after seeing Zidane. Why? Zidane's tail. Kuja has one too. When he finally discovers his origins, he realizes that he wasn't even born. He was created in a test tube. Talk about an ego buster. And also discovers that his lifetime is extremely limited. This is why he goes after the origin of ALL things, the crystal. He decides in his mind that if he is destined to die, everyone else will die with him. Phew! In my mind, thats pretty deep stuff. I also have fair defense for Necron, but I'm getting hungry. So, I'll see you guys later.

Actually, it was the same with Sephiroth. He was mostly confused; (SPOILER) even to the point where he himself thought that he was part of the Cetra - the Ancients. He thought at that point that the planet belonged to his race and only his race, or something bizarre and twisted like that. So in some ways Kuja and Sephiroth are similar.

Though to be honest, FFVIII and FFIX have this one problem in common: (SPOILER)the final bosses of both games just suddenly appeared out of the blue.

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Originally posted by SpikingZero
Though to be honest, FFVIII and FFIX have this one problem in common: (SPOILER)the final bosses of both games just suddenly appeared out of the blue.

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(SPOILERS FOR MANY FF GAMES)The same can be said about FF1's Chaos, FF3's Dark Cloud, FF4's Zeromus and FFX's Yu Yevon.

And what's this about FF9 being too easy? When it was released, everyone claimed it was too hard. And it is harder than FF7 and FF8. In FF7, you can equip lots of materia and all your guys become juggernauts who can do everything, and there's nothing hard about the game, really. Don't even get me started with FF8. You can make yourself totally invincible with the junction system, and if you're too lazy to do that, just use auto-junctioning. Even that will make you invincible. Meanwhile, FF9 has its hard parts. At the end of Disc 1 and the beginning of Disc 2, you'll have to fight carefully because you have no healers. When you're en-route to (SPOILER)Oeilvert, you'll face extremely hard enemies, and the enemies in (SPOILER)Kuja's Desert Palace are hard as well. And for the bosses, (SPOILER)Necron and Ozma can be extremely hard because Grand Cross + Neutron Ring combo might really annihilate your party, same for Curse + Meteor combo.

Well... at least Necron explained his purpose. (SPOILER)Ultimecia said nothing the whole game. and really had no reason to fight the guys.... besides the fact that they were SeeDs created to kill her.... hmm.. well in that case, I guess they were both meaningful. Although I think Necron could have been used better. He had tthe potential to be maybe even better than Sephiroth AND Kuja. But they didn't use him right

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Originally posted by ShadyMilkman
Kuja began his deeds for the good old reason of wanting to be the most powerful creature in the universe. Every bad guy wants that. But, later in the story, it becomes a search for his origins. He feels he must find his birthplace after seeing Zidane. Why? Zidane's tail. Kuja has one too. When he finally discovers his origins, he realizes that he wasn't even born. He was created in a test tube. Talk about an ego buster. And also discovers that his lifetime is extremely limited. This is why he goes after the origin of ALL things, the crystal. He decides in his mind that if he is destined to die, everyone else will die with him.[/spoiler]

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I disagree with everything you said about Kuja with the exception of him having a deep story.

(SPOILER) You see, Kuja's main reason for doing what he did during most of the game before you took the trip to Terra was to prove his worth and overthrow Garland. From the beginning, Kuja was an egomanic. A narcasstic, self-absorbed individual who felt that every other living being was beneath him. And for a time, Garland treated Kuja as number one, since Kuja was doing a good job stirring up war on Gaia, and advancing the transfer of souls. The only problem was that Garland felt Kuja was good enough to finish the job, so he created Zidane. Obviously, being the egotistical man Kuja was, he couldn't accept that there was someone more powerful than him, so Kuja stranded Zidane on Gaia so he wouldn't be competition. Garland didn't really do anything about this because Kuja was still doing a good enough job at stirring up war, so Garland didn't get involved.

The problem with that was that since Garland didn't get involved, Kuja was free to think up plans to overthrow Garland, since he wasn't powerful enough by himself to get the job done. That's what the Eidolons were for. Kuja would use the Eidolons, namely Alexander, to overthrow Garland. When Garland finally discovered Kuja's plan, he showed up in the Invincible and took Alexander out, preventing Kuja from gaining control of it, and thus ruining Kuja's plans at the time.

Since that happened, Kuja kidnapped Eiko to try to extract her Eidolons as he had done to Garnet. Problem was that Eiko was too young, and he was stopped by Eiko's moogle who Tranced and turned into an Eidolon. Since that happened, Kuja devised a plan to get himself to Trance by channeling all the souls inside the Invincible into himself, and then fighting your party to activate the Trance. Once he Tranced, you'll notice that he devestated your party by casting Ultima, and finally overthrew Garland. Kuja achieved what he wanted. He wanted the recognition of being more powerful than Garland, and being more powerful than Zidane. Problem was that Garland dropped the bombshell to Kuja that just like the Black Mages Kuja created, he too had a limited life which he was about to reach. At this point, everything Kuja was, everything he worked for became completely and utterly pointless, and that fact drove Kuja mad. And Kuja was so egotistical that he tried to end all life because he decided that there should be no life without him.
Now I'm done with Kuja.

As far as Sephiroth goes,(SPOILER) after he turns up in the present tense, all he wants is to be God. There's no other motive driving him. Before he fell into the lifestream, he was of the belief that he was an Ancient and that the planet should belong to him. He actually had an interesting backstory to him except that Square didn't follow through with it. Because he went from believing that he was an ancient and that the world was stolen from him and his "mother" to just wanting to be God. Quite simply, the Sephiroth at the end wasn't anywhere close to being as deep as the Sephiroth in the flashbacks. A shame, really.

ummm... I think our views of Kuja really aren't that different. You just sound better saying it. I don't have that sort of flair for words.

Oh...then I'm mistaken. It just sounded like we have different views on Kuja's backstory.

Are you a poet or novelist by chance? Cause you made Kuja's story sound really cool. Yeah, I think all those things you said, but I'm too lazy to type all that.

Hey, FF9 isn't the worst and there is no worst ff yoo know.I simply adore this game and one of the best(FF8 is better) final fantasies!Who cares if it looks childish it still is one of the greatest.I hate it when people thinks some final fantasies are the worst:mad2: ...But believe me ff9 is such an awesome game.

ff9 was an okay final fantasy.
Heres my list of ff:

1.FF8
2.-3.FF6
2.-3,FF3j
4.FF5
5.FF9
6.FF7
7.FF4
8.FF1
9.-12.The gameboy ffs
13.FF2J

Sephiroth is far deeper than American Badass gives him credit for. If you believe the same version I do then his story is deeper still. I'm not going to explain either version now because they're both far too complex.

IX is far easier than VII and VIII, for the simple fact that you don't have to do anything. VII and VIII if you wanted to be strong you actually had to think, and arrange your materia/junction. In IX all you did was level up and equip new weapons whenever the game presented them. No though or skill involved

I think VII and VIII were too easy because yuo could turn any character into an unstoppable juggernot with ease. You could use HP-restore linked to KOR and Mime on the same person. Then they could beat anything by themselves. And in VIII you just use 4X element defense Junction with Meteor, Ultima, and two others that i cant remember and you absorb EVERYthing. Which also makes you invincible. So, what's so dad-gon hard about that?

How hard the game is just depends on your strategy. My strategy made the game easier;
Zidane does a normal attack, followed by Vivi performing his most powerful magic based on the enemy's stats. Then Garnet will either Cure, or summon Odin or Levithan. Steiner follows and finishes by using a high power Sword Strike.
Thats just me. My one friend makes ff8 easy, by doing this
All charachters juncion Curaga, thus giving them 9,999 hp. Squall goes into overdrive, and uses whichever overdrive he chooses. Usually Zell follows up with a GF, and the next characther the same. How hard a game is, depends all upon your strategy. (although, flaring the heck out of somebody helps too):thumb:

Exactly what Vincent06 said. Though in VII and VIII you actually had to think up your strategy, and as ShadyMilkman didn't point out, GET the equipment (KOTR, Mime, Meteor and Ultima aren't easy if you don't know the game). IX just hands you everything on a plate when the game wants you to have it.

Oh please, Eights crappy Junction system didn't even compare to Nines battle system. It might have been simpler, but at least it didn't totally SUCK! Nines battle system was an interesting take on some of the older battle systems. It was supposed to be a throw back to older RPGs, and the results were leaps and bounds better than the Junction or Sphere systems.

I have to disagree with you. You may not have liked the game but that doesn't make it the worst FF. And it's not "because it is" it's because you didn't like it. :p

Anyway to discuss what you mentioned:

1)ITS TOO EASY
Ok it was relatively easy if you just played it straight through but I think this is true for a lot of FF games, but as is also true with other FF's there are extra challenges to make it hard for you! For example, Ozma and Hades (I haven't fought either but I've heard they are hard).

Then there are things like Chocobo Hot and Cold, which may not be very hard but it's time consuming and can be challenging.
But I didn't find FFIX any easier than FFX or FFVII (the two I have played), in fact I'd say FFX was the easiest if you avoid the Dark Aeons and Monster Arena creatures.

Sure FFIX wasn't hard but nor were FFVII or FFX (I can't comment on VIII as I haven't played it very much).


2) CHARACTERS

Well what you say isn't very clear, I mean whimsical and pointless? Why? I loved the design of the characters but that's just my opinion and they weren't pointless either although I didn't use characters like Amarant and Freya very often, that's just cos I chose not to develop them.


3) MAGIC SYSTEM

The magic system was just different, that's all - different. As all the FF's have a slightly different system. Personally I loved this system it was fun getting a new weapon and seeing what you could learn from it, then spending time training so you could learn abilities faster.

I'm sorry but I don't call the FFVII system deep, just putting materia onto whoever you want? At least in FFIX people had their own unique spells, or abilities which made the game much more interesting.
And FFX, just moving around a sphere grid isn't particularly difficult or deep either.

All these systems are just different and should be appreciated for what they are alone, not compared to another FF.

Anyway, I loved FFIX, it was fun and that's the most important thing to me :)

I couldn't agree with you more on the whole Magic System part.

I personally love 9's batte/abuility system. The funnest parts of the game are getting new weapons, which rarely happens in 8. The junction system left me in a daze for hours. I still dont fully get it. However, 9's equipment system was easy to figure out after a while. It took me a while at first, but once you get it down, your rip roarin' and ready to go!

KURO!!! Shed some light on this thread with your amazingly uber FF9 speech (Yes I do mean the one from Q9D!!!!11ONE)

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Why have I said that? Well, it's because it is. Here's the reasons.

1)ITS TOO EASY
Surely an FF is a quest, an epic that you can explore and get hours and hours out the main quest alone. A quest where you have to train until strong enough to beat the many monsters that stand in your way. Not with FFIX. On my first play though, I beat Necron at level 32 with Zidane. I got to the 3rd disc in 16hrs. What is the point in that? I spent £40 on a game, and a Final Fantasy and I can almost complete in less then a day!

2)CHARACTERS
Are whimsical, pointless and 2D good enough. These words describe them perfectly.

3)MAGIC SYSTEM
Is very clever, but way too easy. What happened to the deep junction systems in FFVII FFVIII & FFX? Was FFIX the poor, lazy brother out of these epics?

And these are just a few reasons.
Discuss.

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If you hate it so much why do you have Vivi's picture.

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Originally posted by playaGAW
If you hate it so much why do you have Vivi's picture.

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If you noticed, I said that a few posts ago :laugh:

I really liked it because it reminded me of Final Fantasy Tactics.

I was too confused by FFVIII(8)'s junction system so i never used it and hated that game......

OOC:	Hey Vincent06 are you ever gonna answer my PM's.....Just wondering......PM me PLZ.

For all you disbelivers...I have VIVI's picture because i thought he was a good character. I forget to say that. ALL the rest were rubbish and pointless. Vivi had emotions, deep thoughts and was generally a good charater. However, the rest are boring. Zidane loved Garnet? Well it was difficult to tell because he was so unintresting a character, I couldn't care. Compare him to Tidus's & Yuna love of FFX and you'll see my point.

FFVII's materia system is deep, because it was the first of it's type in the series. It was the first steps towards FFVIII's imense junction system. FFIX's is a step backwards, a system so easy, you could do it blindfolded.

Minigames were also unintresting. SKIPPING? Repetitive button bashing. So was running. The only intresting one was frog catching, but even that was marred by Quina Quen, one of the most S*** characters to ever exist.

As the style, its different. I like that, it is a look back at FFs before and so the style is a rapid departure to FFVIII's futuristic style.

As for you Kuja lovers, you can find Kuja nestling in the room at Square's HQ under "Waste Of Time". Deep. the dude is a homicidal maniac for no reason, except he wants to find his origins. So starting a war on a planet is a good reason to do that. Why didn't he find those elemental guardians, kill 'em and go Terra? Because that would be stupid. As is kuja. He is a cross dresser and probably sounds like a girl.

Battle System is next. Trance is a rubbish replacement to Limits. Because it could annoy how you'ld be saving it up and you get hurt, and have to use it againist a little creature. it should have been made optional when you select it.

I might hate FFIX, but this is my opinion. I admit, it is better than most games and I should be happy with it. But I'm not. Not to be spoilt, but it is like a poor cousin of the series, one that taints the whole family.

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Originally posted by Legolas63

Minigames were also unintresting. SKIPPING? Repetitive button bashing. So was running. The only intresting one was frog catching, but even that was marred by Quina Quen, one of the most S*** characters to ever exist.

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I thought the minigames were a really high point in this game. Right near the beginning was the fighting bit where you had to press the buttons at the right time, I thought that was so much fun it made me love the game the moment I started it.
As well as skipping, and frog catching which weren't my favourite games, who could forget... Chocobo Hot and Cold!
This game was wicked. It took hours and hours of my playing time up plus it was just so damn fun! I don't think I've ever smiled so much in an FF, than the moment my chocobo turned red and could climb mountains :love:

Then there was that other little game, I don't know what it's called but you have the three brothers (ahhh forgot their names too *looks in strategy guide*) It called "a game of cups" in here, the brothers change places and you guess where one is. I love those sorta games :D

Plus there was the challenge of finding Stellazio coins, the festival of the hunt, the hippaul racing, the pop quiz with the ragtime mouse, the auction...

FFIX was packed with mini games and that's one reason why it's my favourite Final Fantasy :D

One thing I will agree with you on - I didn't like trance, it always seemed useless to me, because it disappeared at the end of battle if you didn't use it, and it never seemed to come at the right time. I would have preferred the usual sort of limit breaks, or overdrives.

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but it is like a poor cousin of the series, one that taints the whole family

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I think FFIX is a pinnacle to the series, it has references to the entire series, it is like a celebration of the series, it's a wonderful fantasy experience. And.. I just love it :p

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Originally posted by Xander
One thing I will agree with you on - I didn't like trance, it always seemed useless to me, because it disappeared at the end of battle if you didn't use it, and it never seemed to come at the right time. I would have preferred the usual sort of limit breaks, or overdrives.

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thats just one of the things that make the game harder. you must spend time fighting to get it just at the right spot so that you will trance at the boss.

i looove ff9. i think it is one of the best because characters actually had feelings. not like cloud who has no personality at all or squall is just a prat who thinks he is too cool for everything.

of course there are some things i find boring. like kujas endless dialogue about nothing. e.g the invincible but there is no such thing as a perfect game.

time for a pint....

Just because Cloud wasn't a "happy camper" doesn't mean he had no personality. It was explained very well why he was the way he was. Not like Squall, who was pretty much a bitch for the sake of being a bitch.
As for the Trance Vs the Overdrive or Limit Breaks, they're all pretty much the same thing if you ask me, just with different names. I didn't mind that it took so long to Trance, I did mind how it dissapeared if you didn't use it.
It was a good RPG, but unfortunatly it has the name "Final Fantasy" on it, and it just doesn't compare with games like Final Fantasy IV, V, VI or VII. Oh, and one more thing... Vivi owns you all.

Squall's personality was explained very thoroughly, and it had nothing to do with being cool whatsoever.

Trance sucked. It cleared status ailments, which was about the only upside it had.

Some minigames were decent, but given they came after Snowboarding, Road Rash, Submarine battles, a strategy game, a GOOD card game, an early version of Hot and Cold, an early version of the fight (with a far cooler scene attached), they were really nothing special.

i think i tranced at most 10 times through the whole game.......

thats dumb....

but.....when i tranced i did massive damage......almost too much though......

I wasn't into many of the mini games in FFVII, I didn't really like submarine battles or the motorbike one, and chocobo breeding was hard :(

And I preferred the card game in FFIX to that of FFVIII! Plus the music was 10x better lol. Although I never really played FFVIII's card game much.

But still the mini games rocked in FFIX in my opinion, as did the game and I think it deserves the Final Fantasy title. It's great in it's own right, maybe we should stop comparing the games so much.... :p

But I agree Vivi is my favourite character from any FF so far :thumb:

Sigh, why do people still try and protect FFIX.

Music of FFIX. Theme was good, Loss Of Me was fine, and I love the music on Terra. But it's not GOOD enough. Think about it, Eyes On Me in FFVIII was powerful, enchanting and deep. Melodies of Life is the stuff you scrape off the inside of a Chip Pan. World Map Music was also Dire.

Mini Games....Chocobo Hot & Cold was fine, but it lacked the fun that FFVII's chocobo racing had. As for the others, it just was you pressing X and correct points, talking to Mogs at the right points and doing random actions. Not a Minigame, but a exercise in pressing X,X,X,X,X.X over and over

Battle system. With the differing characters, there were ones you liked, and ones you NEVER played as. Because you did that, they were weaker characters anyway, because they alredy had distictive battle personalites.

Is there anything I haven't covered YET?

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Sigh, why do people still try and protect FFIX.

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Er..simple answer, because they like it. You post a thread about why you don't like FFIX your going to get opinions from people who liked it as well. That makes a discussion! :p Anyway I don't think they are trying to "protect" it, I think they just like it :)

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Music of FFIX. Theme was good, Loss Of Me was fine, and I love the music on Terra. But it's not GOOD enough. Think about it, Eyes On Me in FFVIII was powerful, enchanting and deep. Melodies of Life is the stuff you scrape off the inside of a Chip Pan. World Map Music was also Dire.

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Who decides what is "good enough"? Again you are setting a standard which doesn't exist, not trying to argue with you but I *liked* Melodies of Life a lot! I also loved the World Map music. I liked Eyes on Me too, but the soundtrack to IX is one of my favourites and I hope to buy it soon.. :)
Didn't Nobuo Uematsu compose both of these songs (Eyes on Me and Melodies of Life) in which case you are complimenting one of his songs and totally insulting another. :confused:

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Mini Games....Chocobo Hot & Cold was fine, but it lacked the fun that FFVII's chocobo racing had. As for the others, it just was you pressing X and correct points, talking to Mogs at the right points and doing random actions. Not a Minigame, but a exercise in pressing X,X,X,X,X.X over and over

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Chocobo Hot & Cold was more fun to me than chocobo racing. Oh and in the fighting bit you had to press other symbols not just X! :p


So.. anyway hope you don't think I'm trying to argue or even "defend" FFIX, I'm just saying why I love it, as you say why you hate it. :D

FF9's a great game, and standing proud as my second favorite Final Fantasy title. I've played and beat FFs 1-10 and IMHO, only FFVII is better than FFIX.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Sigh, why do people still try and protect FFIX.

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Sigh, why do you still try and bash FF9? Well, your answer might be the same as my answer for your question. The reason why I and some others defend FF9 is because we have a right to opinions and there's no way you could ever prove us wrong (neither can we prove your opinions wrong) when we say that FF9 in our opinions is a good game.

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Music of FFIX. Theme was good, Loss Of Me was fine, and I love the music on Terra. But it's not GOOD enough. Think about it, Eyes On Me in FFVIII was powerful, enchanting and deep. Melodies of Life is the stuff you scrape off the inside of a Chip Pan. World Map Music was also Dire.

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Once again, a matter of opinions. FF9's my favorite soundtrack, and Melodies of Life is IMHO a lot deeper and more beautiful than Eyes on Me. I guess that's because its sadder melody and lyrics have a larger impact on me than Eyes on Me's happy and somewhat cheesy lyrics.

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Mini Games....Chocobo Hot & Cold was fine, but it lacked the fun that FFVII's chocobo racing had. As for the others, it just was you pressing X and correct points, talking to Mogs at the right points and doing random actions. Not a Minigame, but a exercise in pressing X,X,X,X,X.X over and over

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Chocobo Hot & Cold was really addicting and fun for me. With all due respect to FF7, I thought the Chocobo race got boring very quickly because my Chocobo always reached the finishing line long before the others, and I had to wait for ages while listening to the chocobo race fanfare music until the other snails reach the finishing line. For the rest of the stuff, no offence, but I feel like you have no idea what you're talking about when you talk about constantly pressing X.

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Battle system. With the differing characters, there were ones you liked, and ones you NEVER played as. Because you did that, they were weaker characters anyway, because they alredy had distictive battle personalites.

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Although I actually hate comparing FFs to each other, I'll take FF8 as an example. There were even more characters I never used because an ability called "Switch Junctions" can make each character a clone of each other. In FF9, characters at least have some difference, and you're to use them strategically. Zidane's the main character so he must be in the party for most of the time. Dagger's good for summoning and some healing. Eiko for the same purpose, but she's a bit better healer. Vivi's for black magic. Freya for overall good fighting and abilities such as Rei's Wind and Dragon Crest. Steiner for beating things and using Climhazzard, Shock or Sword Magic. Amarant for fighting and using monk techs (No Mercy and Aura are great support spells). I used Quina less, but s/he's good for casting spells like Mighty Guard, White Wind etc.

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Is there anything I haven't covered YET?

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Yeah, you forgot to use the words "in my (humble) opinion", short for IMO or IMHO, when you criticized FF9. Opinions aren't the same as facts.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
Squall's personality was explained very thoroughly, and it had nothing to do with being cool whatsoever.

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*laughs* What game did you play?

For the music of Eight and Nine, Nine had decent music, but it only had one or two tunes that really stood out. Every other track was just okay, nothing special. For Eight, it had a couple of really great scores, and a lot of really crappy ones. Nothing really inbetween.
As for mini-games, neither game had anything worthwhile. Hot and Cold was boring, and the card games were utter crap.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
For all you disbelivers...I have VIVI's picture because i thought he was a good character. I forget to say that. ALL the rest were rubbish and pointless. Vivi had emotions, deep thoughts and was generally a good charater. However, the rest are boring. Zidane loved Garnet? Well it was difficult to tell because he was so unintresting a character, I couldn't care. Compare him to Tidus's & Yuna love of FFX and you'll see my point.

FFVII's materia system is deep, because it was the first of it's type in the series. It was the first steps towards FFVIII's imense junction system. FFIX's is a step backwards, a system so easy, you could do it blindfolded.

Minigames were also unintresting. SKIPPING? Repetitive button bashing. So was running. The only intresting one was frog catching, but even that was marred by Quina Quen, one of the most S*** characters to ever exist.

As the style, its different. I like that, it is a look back at FFs before and so the style is a rapid departure to FFVIII's futuristic style.

As for you Kuja lovers, you can find Kuja nestling in the room at Square's HQ under "Waste Of Time". Deep. the dude is a homicidal maniac for no reason, except he wants to find his origins. So starting a war on a planet is a good reason to do that. Why didn't he find those elemental guardians, kill 'em and go Terra? Because that would be stupid. As is kuja. He is a cross dresser and probably sounds like a girl.

Battle System is next. Trance is a rubbish replacement to Limits. Because it could annoy how you'ld be saving it up and you get hurt, and have to use it againist a little creature. it should have been made optional when you select it.

I might hate FFIX, but this is my opinion. I admit, it is better than most games and I should be happy with it. But I'm not. Not to be spoilt, but it is like a poor cousin of the series, one that taints the whole family.

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FFVII's system was completely simple, as simple than ff9's system. The mini-games were hard. I liked them personally. Better tahn your cut and slash cloud strife syndrome. Kuja, however, was a great villain. He DID have a reason for existance unlike you say. The reason he didnt kill the gaurdians is because he wasnt strong enough. He fought zidane to make him go into trance so he COULD defeat the gaurdains. As for being a homocidal maniac, what do you call Squall?! Kuja wanted to take over earth and revive the dead sould of Terra. About the trance systems. They were good in my opinion. You couldnt just go in and beat the heck out of a boss. That would make it too easy. The people here at EoFF here dont like FF bashing, especially from Noobs who come in to do just that. Just pick your fights. This isnt one you want to get into, because almost anybody here can prove what you say wrong.

oh joy...
another one of these threads.
Legolas63, you obviously have not been here long.
I bet you have not even gotten past the first 5 minutes of any of the Final Fantasy games, because if you had then you wouldn't be so @$#%in' stubborn about ff9.
you are wrong about ff9,
and ALOT of people here would agree with me in saying that.

so here's a little bit of advice...

QUIT TRASHING THE FRIGGIN' GAME
Final Fantasy IX is possibly one of the greatest Final Fantasies in the series and you sound stupid for trashing it!

Hey Guys, thanks for the advice! But hey, it's a free country so i surpose, i could just continue. Anyway, I ain't THAT new, i've been around for some months. But i guess, you'll prove that wrong too. Still, I'll just like to damn FFIX some more.

Right, first point. FFIX is a fine game. i never, said it wasn't. I just think it is the WORST FF ever. I was disapointed with it, in fact...so disapointed with it, it turned into HATE. It IS the worst. I'm just expressing my opinion about it.

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Kuja, however, was a great villain. He DID have a reason for existance unlike you say. The reason he didnt kill the gaurdians is because he wasnt strong enough. He fought zidane to make him go into trance so he COULD defeat the gaurdains. As for being a homocidal maniac, what do you call Squall?!

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What? A transvestite (Nothing againist Transvestites) who wants to destroy worlds? That seems sane. Plus, your reason for not destroying the guardians, seems weak. He only goes into Trance, when he goes FLIPPING MENTAL so I guess that proves he IS a mental case. Also, Squall had problems like most teenagers who wer adopted, lost their only companion (Ellone) and rasied to fight, maim & kill creatures & people without remorse. Anyway, he mellows near the end, so he isn't a mental case. Kuja, is a villian who mellows at the end. WHY? If he's evil, why does he go almost good. (If you want prove, it's when Zidane *SPOILER* at the end, so i guess that proves I've completed it). Think about it, Kefka diddn't mellow, and he is a great villian. Full of Malice and spite, and boliing with pure evil.

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. In FF9, characters at least have some difference, and you're to use them strategically.

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Yes, but you couldn't switch them mid battle could you? So you either played with a select team or you switched them after battles like some strange person. Also, Zidane is the main chrcter, so he should be kick ass (Like cloud Or squall), a character you want to play as. But now, he has theifing skills. Whup de F***!? Sometimes, i wished, i could dump him, and switch to Steiner or sumthing. Also, FFVI may have had characters with differing skills, but none were the main character, so you could play with a team you perfereed, which is better, so you can battle how you want, without having a S*** main character like Zidane.

Also, the card game WAS rubbish. No skill, or depth like FFVIII's card game. Mini Games were rubbish, and you have to admi it, there weanr't up to the quality of previous FF's.

Basically, I believe, FFIX IS the worst FF. And yes, i appreciate that I will get people in surport and agianist, but calling me names is just pathetic. surely if you think FFIX is any good, you would be able to surport it without calling me "Newbie", and would simply surport it using it's merits.

With the exception of the craziness bit I'm gonna have to side with Legolas.

Kenshin IV Squall WAS explained, and HAD'NT anything to do with cool.

What wasn't explained is how a thief could go in to kidnap a teenage princess, without knowing she wanted to leave, nearly get her killed several times in the process, and still have the nerve to insult a knight for standing by his duty and wishes to protect the princess. Not to mention that he actually grabs her ass shortly after meeting her, which would certainly lead me to question his motives for kidnapping her had I been Steiner, or Dagger for that matter.

The card game was good, it was just a waste of time. FFVIII's was good, AND very useful, and actually fun to complete the set.

[q=Legolas63]Right, first point. FFIX is a fine game. i never, said it wasn't. I just think it is the WORST FF ever. I was disapointed with it, in fact...so disapointed with it, it turned into HATE. It IS the worst. I'm just expressing my opinion about it.



[/q]

keep your opinion on that to yourself
just because you think that doesn't necessarily mean that everyone else thinks that too so you don't need to waste a thread on it.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
Kenshin IV Squall WAS explained, and HAD'NT anything to do with cool.

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*laughs again* You keep telling yourself that.

There isnt any point arguing this matter any longer. Whichever side you're on is going to argue untuil the death. Lets put it this way. FF9 is a good game in my opinion. You hate it as you said. You keep chainging your views on it. First its a good game, then it sucks. Make up your mind. You say the charachters stink, but you have a Vivi Avatar because he is "the only good charachter". Once again, an opinion. If you hate the game, you obviously hate everything about it. Hate is a strong word. You wanna see a psycho villain? Look at Sephiroth. Kuja however wasnt a transvestite. He had no sex because he was a Geonome. Zidane is a male charachter with male charachteristics, but he too is a geonome. Kuja and Zidane have male charachteristics, true, but are both sexless as explained by the girl on Bran Bal. Research man research :o

Although, Zidane seems to have some sort of thing down there, since he at one point is taking a piss with Vivi in Madain Sari. :D


I personally think FF9 is a really great game. It is not the "best" in the series, but I certainly find it the most entertaining and fun to play. I like all the characters. There's none that I really dislike, but there's none that I'm really crazy about either. The story is more than just good, it's great. Once again, not the best story in the series, but its greatness is still there. And I'm also in love with the soundtrack. Definitely one of the best in the series, in my opinion.

The Terrans (Zidane Kuja) do have sexes. When in Terra, talk to one of our little munky-girls and you'll ask if she's a boy a girl or something like that, i can't remember exactly, and she tells you that asexual beings lack the ability to flourish in society or something like that. Since they were created to cause chaos in different worlds..what better way than to rule over society and cause war. And come on... how often would people let someone with no sexual organs whatsoever lead them to war. thats the reason why they couldn't flourish in society. they need to fit in to their surroundings. So... yes, they have wee willy winkies. And no, Kuja is not a transvestite and he isn't psycho. But, like Vincent said, he could argue about it till we are all blue in the face and it wouldn't accomplise anything. and IMHO, I find Kuja to be miles and miles ahead of Sephiroth. (prolly shouldn't have said that, cuz it'll just start another war)

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Originally posted by ShadyMilkman
she tells you that asexual beings lack the ability to flourish in society or something like that.

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You just said yourself that they didnt have sexes hahaa :D

I said asexual beings would LACK the ability to flourish. and Asexual means that it reproduces by itself, i.e.: has no sex.... so unless I typoed somewhere.... the have sexes. they have chicks and guys..... boys and girls.... whatever you wanna say.

the geonomes are made inside of pods. Go back to bran bal

So what if they are made in pods???? You can give something in a pod sexual organs. Why couldn't you???? If they are being created, which they are, and are intended to fit in to their "target planet", which they are, then why wouldn't Garland give Zidane and Kuja sexual organs?

No. They abtain a sexual status after they're body is taken over by the dead Terran host. Imagine a blank faced puppet. It doesnt have any sex untuil you put it on it, using paint or such. A genome is as the same. Zidane and Kuja have sexual organs, but are still geonomes. The reason for this is because they are free spirited unlike the others. Garland probably gave them a sex so they wouldnt be transvestites on Gaia. Besides, if that was true, they'd have to rate the game A for extreme sexual content :(

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Right, first point. FFIX is a fine game. i never, said it wasn't. I just think it is the WORST FF ever. I was disapointed with it, in fact...so disapointed with it, it turned into HATE. It IS the worst. I'm just expressing my opinion about it.

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If you think IX is the worst, you have never laid hands on Mystic Quest. That game is the worst. Hell, FFV was bad enough, but Mystic Quest is even worse.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
What? A transvestite (Nothing againist Transvestites) who wants to destroy worlds? That seems sane. Plus, your reason for not destroying the guardians, seems weak. He only goes into Trance, when he goes FLIPPING MENTAL so I guess that proves he IS a mental case.

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I already made a post earlier in this thread as far as Kuja and his motives go. Since you obviously still think otherwise, you either didn't pay attention to the game, to my post, or the more likely option: both. For your benefit though, I'll give the scoop on Kuja.

First and foremost, if you think his motive through most of the game is to destroy worlds, you're wrong. Kuja has no interest in destroying worlds. His one underlying motive throughout most of the game is to get enough power to overthrow Garland. Nothing else matters to him other than that. And that's also the main reason he didn't destroy the Elemental Guardians: not only was he not strong enough to do it, but it would make no sense for him to do it until he had enough power to take out Garland.

And again, he doesn't go into Trance when he goes mental. Kuja goes into trance when he takes enough punishment from Zidane and company. Its after he finds out from Garland about his limited lifespan does Kuja lose it.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Kuja, is a villian who mellows at the end. WHY? If he's evil, why does he go almost good. (If you want prove, it's when Zidane *SPOILER* at the end, so i guess that proves I've completed it). Think about it, Kefka diddn't mellow, and he is a great villian. Full of Malice and spite, and boliing with pure evil.

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Kefka didn't mellow because he was a complete lunatic throughout the entire game. Its documented that Kefka is a complete loon. Kuja, on the other hand, is what is known as a Tragic Villain, which is a villain who realises what he has done is wrong, before its too late to really rectify the matter. Some people hate Kuja because he's a tragic villain. Since I like tragic villain, I happen to like Kuja a bit more than the rest.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Yes, but you couldn't switch them mid battle could you? So you either played with a select team or you switched them after battles like some strange person.

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And your point is what? FFX is the only Final Fantasy where you can switch mid-battle, and that made things so much easier. Oh, a flying creature, lets call Wakka. Oh, a creature who is hurt by Magic, lets get Lulu in here. Hey, a quick enemy...we want Tidus for this one. Damn, an enemy with a hard shell...we'll let Auron handle that one.

You didn't like the battle system, fine. I happened to love it because it gave your characters some individuality, instead of clones who you can set to have the same magic. FFVII and FFVIII are notorious for this, where you can basically switch stuff around, and to a lesser extent, FFX and FFVI where you can have your characters learn the same magic and abilities.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Also, Zidane is the main chrcter, so he should be kick ass (Like cloud Or squall), a character you want to play as. But now, he has theifing skills. Whup de F***!? Sometimes, i wished, i could dump him, and switch to Steiner or sumthing.

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Just to let you know, if you steal with Zidane enough, you could have him do 9,999 points of damage by using his Master Thief skill. Ass kicker? Why yes he is.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Also, FFVI may have had characters with differing skills, but none were the main character, so you could play with a team you perfereed, which is better, so you can battle how you want, without having a S*** main character like Zidane.

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Again, you bring up Zidane who can kick ass if you bothered.

Anyways, FFVI suffers the same way FFVII, only to a much lesser extent. Yes, FFVI really didn't have a main character, but that doesn't mean that if enough time wasn't spent, you couldn't make everyone clones of each other, skills excluded. Espers was basically the forefather of the Materia and Junction system. You wanted a character to learn this magic, attach an esper to him.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Basically, I believe, FFIX IS the worst FF. And yes, i appreciate that I will get people in surport and agianist, but calling me names is just pathetic. surely if you think FFIX is any good, you would be able to surport it without calling me "Newbie", and would simply surport it using it's merits.

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I have been supporting it using its merits. Problem is, I'm never going to convince you it was a good game. That would involve changing your opinion in some way, and thats not going to happen as far as FFIX goes.

I think its a wonderful game, and bring up its good points which you disagree on by giving reasons which, quite frankly, lead me to believe you didn't care enough to pay attention to the story that was being told. This is best showcased when you talk about Kuja and Zidane. Kuja had motives which, and you were completely and utterly off the mark as far as what you thought they were. And you think Zidane is a crappy main character which couldn't kick ass despite the fact that his Master Thief ability can hit for 9,999 every time for half the mana cost of his lowest Trance moves if you bothered to steal from enemies.

So there you have it. Basically, we're at a point where no more can be discussed which hasn't already been brought up.

Thanks, American Badass. I agree with you, Zidane didn't suck in battles. He did 7000+ damage in battles for tougher enemies, and 9999 for normal enemies or those who had a weakness (for example, I do 9999 to Kuja with a physical attack with Zidane from the back row if he has Man Eater and Bird Slayer equipped). His Trance moves, even Free Energy, do 9999 damage every time.

I think Legolas is just too used for having an all-powerful super juggernaut robot character as the main character. The main character doesn't always have to be a big knight guy with a sword.

Bashing Kuja because "he's a transvestite" is a stupid reason to hate a villain, IMHO. As for the genders, I think it was said that (SPOILER)Garland made Kuja, Zidane and Mikoto special because they had souls and genders. Kuja also created the Black Mages the same way Genomes were created. I'm not sure if he get them all a gender, but I know for sure that he made Vivi male.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
FFIX is a fine game.

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so disapointed with it, it turned into HATE.

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You "hate" a "fine game"? I think you're conflicting yourself.

I'd write more but I'm in school and the next lesson's starting. Later!

It's perfectly possible to hate a game and still appreciate it's qualities.

I don't get why people slate VII and VIII because you can customise.
"Oh no all my characters can have the same abilities!"
"Why not just give characters different materia?"
"Quiet you!"

Besides it's not like there were tactics involved. You could complete the game easily using the basic four characters.

Kenshin IV laughing doesn't get your point across.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
I don't get why people slate VII and VIII because you can customise.
"Oh no all my characters can have the same abilities!"
"Why not just give characters different materia?"
"Quiet you!"

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The reason I slate FFVII and FFVIII is because it can be done. Sure, you could buy materia for each and every character and have that character have a specific role. But what happens when that character is not able to be selected in battle? Answer: simply move the materia to another character and have a near carbon copy.

Or, especially in FFVIII in Ultimecia's castle when the team is split in two, what happens when you have all your GFs junctioned to three specific characters when you switch to the other team? Easy, Junction exchange your GFs and transfer your Magic. Again, near carbon copies.

And lets face it, most RPG players (especially players starting out or players who don't really care) are going to stick to the same characters over and over more often than not.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
Besides it's not like there were tactics involved. You could complete the game easily using the basic four characters.

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I'll agree with that for the most part. But then again, the same can be said for pretty much all RPGs.

Heh, who said I cared to get my point across? I'm not trying to argue with you about it. Squall was an underdeveloped character. If you don't want to admit that, it really doesn't bother me.

I agree with Kenshin IV about squall. This is only my opinion, and I've only played the game for 8 hours, so I cant really say. He blows everything off untuil the last second when he jumps in to save the day. At the end, however, he gets better. I know this because i've seen the eniter game played before my eyes because my best friend beat it a couple of times. As for zidane being a sucky hero, I liked him. He was the first hero that wasnt a huge sword -flinging macho man with an "I'm gonna blow you off" attitude. He was a charachter with a comic side, not a charachter with a need for psychotherapy. As for being weak, Zidane has just as much power as Cloud or Squall. If anything, he's a better charachter in my opinion because he had individual skills that nobody else could have. Squall and Cloud could be leveled up in a way that you have 3 juggernaughts on the screen simontaniously and that just isnt any fun. Plus the fact that he was the first non-human charachter. He had individual features, and didnt dress in chains and armor with dark leather. He on the other hand, was dressed like a theif/pirate, which in my opinion is quite cool. This is just my opinion. Feel free to disagree.

Ps. the reason we called you a nOOb is because your acting like one. You pull out all the bad things in a game instead of looking at the good points. I could sit here and bash FF7 for hours upon end but it wouldnt change your views on it. Besides, some nOObs are really cool. Its not nececarily a bad thing, moreover, just a mind set.

Early in VII giving characters individual roles works pretty well. Eventually they get less individual, but thats your own choice.

In VIII you could only choose three abilities, so if all your characters were the same then you had a pretty ineffective setup.
Squall was developed, Squall was explained, Squall wasn't attempting to be cool.

Zidane wasn't a macho fighter character, he was a perverted, arrogant character. He wasn't a shadow on Squall, or Cloud strength wise.

As for him being able to kick ass with Thievery, is that the same way Quina can with Frog Drop, or Freya can with Dragon Breath (I think it was that one)? They were all basically the same move.

Complaining that it's too easy to complete VII and VIII because you don't have to be tactical is just wierd IMO. You actually have to think in those games, and build up your characters. My main problem with IX is that you don't think at any real point in the game. With the exception of knowing when to do the Chocobo Quest, and pointless levelling up, you have almost no control over your characters' developement.

I already listed all my reasons for disliking this game in another thread, so I wont be detailed unless someone asks me to be. I felt the plot was very stereotypical and shallow, as were the characters. I hated the abilities system, and the sheer number of random battles was staggering. You couldnt walk five steps in any direction without getting into one, and I think that's a bit much. The character design was pretty ugly, too.

Anyway, the main reason is really just that it didnt engage me. When i turned it on and started playing, it didnt pull me in and make me want to play more, like most other FF games did (even VIII, and VIII is the one I hate most for its lack of character development). With, for example, Kingdom Hearts, I couldnt put the controller down, I was so into it. IX failed to draw me in at the beginning, and thus I set my controller down and walked away. Even when I forced myself to try and play it for the mere sake of getting it over with, I couldnt make it far past disc 1.

But, of course, there are people that love it. My boyfriend adores it. The thing is, "one man's trash is another man's treasure.". What I see as a stale and predictable storyline with annoying, shallow characters, others see as a masterpiece, so I'm not really trying to change anyone's mind or argue with anyone, just stating my point.

Though this thread does scare me. A small number of you people are frothing at the mouth. It's just a game. Stop scaring me!

Well put, TheAbominatrix. You are completely right, "one man's trash is another man's treasure."
We will never change each others opinion but we should accept others! After all if everybody had the same opinion the board would be a very boring place, and there would be no discussion.

However I think that the way in which people put across their opinion makes a difference and results in arguing. If you say "this game sucks" but if you can explain why you didn't like it without insulting anyone else who does like it, and post intelligently then we needn't argue.

Although I think that this thread has been discussed to death and there's not much more to say apart from restating what's already been said. :p

Anyway the game is not good or bad, the best or the worst, it is whatever the person playing it says it is.
FFIX is....just FFIX! :D

I agree, everyone should be able to discuss it like mature people. But hey, I think people should discuss this more. FFIX was VERY different to the other FF's on the PS1, so maybe, others have opinions about it.

Howver, i still have some more points that I want to put 4 my case.

GRAPHICS
i don't no why, but they don't seem to be AS good as the other PS1 FF's. FFVII felt solid and chunky, FFVIII's felt real & organic (If a little flickery) but FFIX doesn't feel right. Like they don't feel normal. The summons in paticualr. GFs (FF8) had FMV/Graphics and so looked more impressive, FFVII's felt chunky, yet knda good looking. But FFIX's.....they felt wrong. i can't dexcribe it very well.

STYLE
Cartoony? I didn't like it.
Medievil? Great, a breath of fresh air

ZIDANE
Kick ass? if he can only do 9999, then that's not that great. Cloud can do 9999+ thanks to OmniSlash, and Squall can do even greater thanks to Rendozukan/Lionheart.
Maybe Square, wanted to distance themselves from the whupass main guy. But i just didn't like it. He leaned too much towardd being weak, rather then being overly hard. Tidus, is very well balanced, being not too weak, but not too strong.

SUMMONS
What happened to Ifrit? He looks terrible!
Ark is possibly, the most rubbish summon ever,*(In my opinion), too long, for not enough damage (Eden in FF8 did over 9999 if you boosted it), although it switching into a giant robot was kinda cool.

SEND OFF?
Was it a good send off to the FF's on PS1. and before?
I would have to say...........no.

(Oh yeah, I disagree. FF Adventure on the GB is the WORST by far, but I was discussinf TRUE FF's)

Seeing as we're discussing posting style, I'd like it if for once people didn't jump onto bandwagons and agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion, and that everyone should stay calm. We KNOW liking or disliking something is opinion, and we KNOW we shouldn't be aggressive, it's not new!

Legolas I agree a with a lot of what you said, but I should point out Tidus is way more powerful than Cloud, Squall and Zidane.

Tidus........ powerful?















aaaaaaaaaah hahahahahahahahaha

Zidane was annoying, I dont care how strong he could be. And, regardless of liking or disliking Tidus, he's a powerful fighter.

Alright Legolas, that's cool. Better put than the opening post of this thread. Anyway, as far as the graphics go, I personally preferred them. They seemed smoother. More fluid. FFVII's graphics were very simple. Simplicity isn't bad, don't get me wrong, but it didn't really blow me away. FFVIII had great summon graphics. But, I think FFIX's were good too. I know you'll disagree, but I'm kind of glad that for once, Ifrit didn't look cooler than all the rest. Atomos was tight. And Ark was a bit...... out there considering that the rest of the game was put in a more medievel setting. Ummm... Zidane to me was a breath of fresh air. Squall, Cloud, and Zidane weren't all that different to me. They seemed really cool at the beginning, but their attitude got a bit annoying to me halfway through the game. Then, for some reason, at the end of FFVIII and FFIX, they seemed to change and I liked them again. Cloud never changed, but hey! consistancy is a good thing. Umm... the power thing. Once again, a breath o fresh air for me. Something different. Instead of the main character being untouchable gods of power, every character had the potential to be about equal, which in my mind, is good.

I'm not saying that I didn't like or liked Tidus, but he's NOT a powerful guy. He's a jock that suddenly found himself in some new world. Guys like Cecil or Cloud were first class soldiers right from the get-go. Sure, Tidus was strong in the game, but he's the main character! It's almost a requirement to make the main character really strong for the game they're in.
As for Zidane, he's like Tidus. Storywise, he really wasn't that powerful a character. Just some low-life theif who likes to chase after girls. Personality wise, I can see him getting on someones nerves, but he didn't really bother me at all. Wouldn't say I really "loved" him, though.

Storywise, weak. Statswise, powerful.

Yeah, I agree with that, but since Tidus was being compared to other main characters from other games ("...Tidus is way more powerful than Cloud, Squall and Zidane.") I figured we were referring to them by story. I mean, you can't compare the stats of different characters from different games. Das juz silly!

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Originally posted by Legolas63
I agree, everyone should be able to discuss it like mature people. But hey, I think people should discuss this more. FFIX was VERY different to the other FF's on the PS1, so maybe, others have opinions about it.

Howver, i still have some more points that I want to put 4 my case.

GRAPHICS
i don't no why, but they don't seem to be AS good as the other PS1 FF's. FFVII felt solid and chunky, FFVIII's felt real & organic (If a little flickery) but FFIX doesn't feel right. Like they don't feel normal. The summons in paticualr. GFs (FF8) had FMV/Graphics and so looked more impressive, FFVII's felt chunky, yet knda good looking. But FFIX's.....they felt wrong. i can't dexcribe it very well.

STYLE
Cartoony? I didn't like it.
Medievil? Great, a breath of fresh air

ZIDANE
Kick ass? if he can only do 9999, then that's not that great. Cloud can do 9999+ thanks to OmniSlash, and Squall can do even greater thanks to Rendozukan/Lionheart.
Maybe Square, wanted to distance themselves from the whupass main guy. But i just didn't like it. He leaned too much towardd being weak, rather then being overly hard. Tidus, is very well balanced, being not too weak, but not too strong.

SUMMONS
What happened to Ifrit? He looks terrible!
Ark is possibly, the most rubbish summon ever,*(In my opinion), too long, for not enough damage (Eden in FF8 did over 9999 if you boosted it), although it switching into a giant robot was kinda cool.

SEND OFF?
Was it a good send off to the FF's on PS1. and before?
I would have to say...........no.

(Oh yeah, I disagree. FF Adventure on the GB is the WORST by far, but I was discussinf TRUE FF's)

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Okay lets start again. The graphics were better than 7's, which were composed of blocks and polygons. Secondly, you say you like the original ff.s THEY WERE CARTOONY!! You hate cartoons but like the originals, which are, HEY , CARTOONY! THEY ALL WERE! FF7 AND 8 WERE THE ONLY NON CARTOONY ONES. As for comparing the charachters, thats just stupid. all of the charachters were on different systems. They (in every game) had different attack powers and such. If they were all on the same STANDARD, tahn heck, Vivi could kill them all. Now for ifrit's appearance. Ifrit looked good in this game. In ff7, he was a green blob with horns. In ff8, he was a weak boss that you could easily beat in under 4 minutes, 1 if your a little over leveled. You cant really compare the summon's attack power either, as like recently stated, the games aretn on the same standard! Stop bashing ff9. Give up already.



Oh and as for tidus being a strong charachter, I just ahve to say this.......... :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: That whiny brat couldnt kill a sparrow! Thats just my opinon however. He was, though, voted "Whiniest Brat" by Electronic Gaming Monthly.

Legolas63:

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ZIDANE
Kick ass? if he can only do 9999, then that's not that great. Cloud can do 9999+ thanks to OmniSlash, and Squall can do even greater thanks to Rendozukan/Lionheart.

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Me:

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Legolas I agree a with a lot of what you said, but I should point out Tidus is way more powerful than Cloud, Squall and Zidane.

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Kenshin IV:

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Yeah, I agree with that, but since Tidus was being compared to other main characters from other games ("...Tidus is way more powerful than Cloud, Squall and Zidane.") I figured we were referring to them by story. I mean, you can't compare the stats of different characters from different games. Das juz silly!

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The laugh thing is annoying enough when it's over a game, but doing it because you assumed I switched topic in the space of one post and didn't mention it....

Vincent06 the Ifrit fight is more complicated than running in and beating him as soon as possible in VIII. But that's not important.

Sorry, I assumed you were at least smart enough to not compare statistics of characters from different games. Guess I was wrong.

FF9, by itself, is a fine RPG, and a worthwhile game. It had some challange, but not a whole lot. It just wasn't up to par with the rest of the FFs, 10 included. It had great mini games, and that was where about half the fun was. Musically, it was great. The graphics were pretty good, and the gamplay was alright. I found the battles to be a bit sluggish for some reason, but I dealt with it.

FF10 is actually the almost right behind FF9 for worst FF, but I won't go into that. Although FF Tactics Advance was pretty neat-o. I like what I see so far from that.

And Vincent06, real people do not look like FF7 polygons. FF7 was as cartoonish as the previous FFs.

Hey guys here in Brasil ( dont know in others parts of the world) but here we are used to say this when whe arge about people likes and dislikes: Gosto não se descute( i guess it mean: Whe dont argue about likes and dislikes), so its ok for people to say why they dont like FF9 or the stuff in the game, as long as they dont swear or say bad things about it, it will be nice, even fun, but to say that FF9 is a bunch of trout is too much, this forum is to discuss FF9 not to say bad thing about it or to get an "war" started and if u really want to say bad stuff about this game go to another forum or talk to someone else, cuz nobody here want to listem bad things about the games their like, as i already said Gosto não se descute( i guess in portuguese it sounds cooler, but i cant translate it well, but it can also be: Preferences are unargable( did i said it right ??? i tried to say something like cant arge.), im in the english school yet ;) ) Well, why do i like FF9 ??? Cuz it was my First FF i've played and second playstation game( first Chrono Cross), but i just feel something good about FF9, forgot to talk about Odin :) , yeah, but lets talk about Odin later, i made my point in this reply.

Hi!

Yeah, 1-6 were cartoony, but with the limitations of the hardware, i'd let them off. Anyway, wer the appeal of them the graphics. NOPE. FF7 are simplistic, but look at the FMV's, Square tried to make them look real, less cartoony so there you go. FF9, they tried to MAKE them cartoony, which, i feel is wrong. i also hate Zelda's The Wind Waker crtoony look, but it's a great game.(I'm going off subject)

As for Ifrit, I'm not comparing strength, I'm comparing look, and FF8's Ifrit looks SO much better then FF9's.

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I found the battles to be a bit sluggish for some reason, but I dealt with it.

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I agree, they did feel sluggish, and just a TAD boring. Although, in it's defence, FFx's were even more boring at times with the random battaling

As for Tidus vs Zidane, Zidane was a more 2D character, he didn't have much depth, wheras Tidus's feelings were well explained For example, why was Zidane think he was a ladies man? No idea. but why did tidus hate his dad? Play the game, and he explains it in Guadosalam.

The enviroments didn't feel as great either. Not as real, or as unreal. they felt detached. Rather then bring the player in, they put he/she out, so it felt unatural.

And, by the way, the story was SO weak.

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Stop bashing ff9. Give up already.

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Why? I'm just expressing my opinion. Obviously, you can't.

Kenshin IV:

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Sorry, I assumed you were at least smart enough to not compare statistics of characters from different games. Guess I was wrong.

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Okay, if you're gonna flame me, at least do it properly and think about it first. I'd just given quotes the post before showing I was directly responding to a comment about stats.

I actually didn't find the battles slow. They broke up the tedium of trekking through yet another channeled route.

*contiues laughing* I like you.

Hi, guys. *waves*

Now, someone brought this thread to my attention, especially the arguing/flaming of several of you. Kindly tone that down. Arguing your point is just fine, but you need to do it in a mature manner. No flaming.

Thanks.

Also: is this a thread about FFIX, or comparing FFIX to FFX and others? Please stay on topic.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Why? I'm just expressing my opinion. Obviously, you can't.

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Okay first of all, that was a slam at my person which I will ignore. just want to say that. As for ff9, I think it's a fine rpg. The best in my opinion. The worst HAD to be 10. Tidus was a whiny boy with poor self esteem. He was also kinda stupid. Maybe its just me, but the plot was stupid as well. I hated FF 10. FF9 however was great. As for ifrit's appearance, I still have to go with FF9's. 8's was too odd. The hair on his neck looked like bulged veins. He looked constipated as well. As for his move, wow that was original. A flaming ball. Wow. Who thought of that one? Now onto the weak story. Generally all of the storys in any FF game are weak depending on how you look at them. YOur looking at it from a hating attitude. Of course the plot was weak in your opinion. If I hated FF7 than I would say the plot stank too so it'd look bad. I think this thread should be closed, mainly because it has no purpose. Its just a whole lot of senseless flaming. Give it up already Legolas. FF9 was a great game with good graphics, summons, and the cartoony style was good too. It's better than the "you suck" attitude that cloud and squalls non-cartoony games carried around in my opinion.

Vincent06, please read my post which is directly before yours. Kindly tone it down. Thank you.

If u guys havent realized that flaming each other or flaming other people favorite games it will just brimg more flaming, thats stupid, so as everyone here has proved their points this subject should be left alone, what u guys are doing is trout, first one comes and flames FF9 in the FF9 forum( kinda stupid) and tries to change people minds by flaming it even more ( more stupid stuff) and the FF9 fans who trie to change the minds of people who dont like FF9( watch out for that studid stuff again), ok, u have all proved ur points, its time to stop, its getting pretty anoying.

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Originally posted by Daryl
Vincent06, please read my post which is directly before yours. Kindly tone it down. Thank you.

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Ooops....sorry 'bout that daryl :(

someone kill this thread already!:rabite:

UltimaSepheroth: If this thread turns back into intelligent discussion about FFIX, it'll stay open. But if it turns back into a flame-fest, it's gone.

And please don't post in the future just to say things like "kill this thread" - staff is monitering to see if it needs "killing", and that post was unnecessary. Thank you.

OOC:	Hahaha it's great when a mod gets called in to stop people telling each other to stop flaming :D. Anyway at least I can get back to the topic as I don't want Kenshin to suffer any injuries from laughing to hard ;).

Okay noone actually posted about FFIX since my last post so I'll repeat a question I asked a while ago. How can Zidane's actions be justified?
He was ignorant and rude to someone who was only doing his job and trying to protect a sixteen year old princess. He KIDNAPPED a sixteen year old princess. He grabbed the ass of a sixteen year old princess with no particular reason to think she'd appreciate that.
Not to mention he was a member of a gang of thieves, and known for not having any real respect for anyone, including girls he got close to.

Zidane was (spoiler) hired by Cid to kidnap Garnet so that justifies that. As for being disrespectful, I thought he was only like that because he wanted to just have fun. He didnt mean anything by it, but he sometiems just got a little immature.

Yeah, everything you mentioned Zidane doing pretty much fits his character perfectly.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
He KIDNAPPED a sixteen year old princess.

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She wanted to be kidnapped :p
Anyway Zidane wouldn't have hurt her, he may have been immature and cheeky but he had good intentions and a good heart. He looked after Garnet, he grew more mature and grew to love her and this is why I think he's a great character ^^

I know why he was sent to kidnapp her, but this is only mentioned once in the game with neither Steiner nor Zidane in the room.
That means Zidane was totally unjustified in argueing with Steiner, because for all he knew Zidane wanted to rape the prettiest girl in the Kingdom, or randsom her.
Though given he never mentions it, and the deal was between Cid and Baku, there's no reason to think Zidane even knew what the real purpose of the kidnapping was.

I also know Dagger wanted to be kidnapped, but Zidane certainly didn't when he went in to kidnapp her.

ShadyMilkman:

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Yeah, everything you mentioned Zidane doing pretty much fits his character perfectly.

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Are you agreeing with me? That kinda confused me wording wise.

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Are you agreeing with me? That kinda confused me wording wise.

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Depends on how you look at it. Zidane was a younger, more energetic hero than Squall and Cloud. He was also....hornier. He had no problem expressing the fact that he found Garnet to be darn sexy. We all know Squall liked Rinoa... but he wouldn't say anything. Zidane thinks Garnet is hot... and lets us know! I'm saying that him kidnapping fits the life of a thief. Boss says go get her, you go get her. And as far as arguing with Steiner....Steiner acted like a macho knight-in-shining-armor wannabe at the beginning of the game (which he was, although he became an excellent knight for the princess/queen Garnet at the end).... so why not argue with him. Zidane probably found it amusing. As far as grabbing Garnet's backside....I guess he just couldn't help himself. He hits on her hard in the first half of the game because he still has the rough edges of his Thief lifestyle. But I feel he is a great character. The perfect fit for this game in terms of a main character. And I guess if you still want a "don't talk to me" "I don't care" "too-cool-for-school" character with a nifty weapon.... Amarant is here for you. I personally feel that every character fit his role in the plot and in battle very well. And FFIX is my 3rd favorite FF, right behind #1:FF and #2:FFVIII....

My problem with him argueing with Steiner is that for all Steiner knew Zidane was taking Dagger away to rape and torture her. At no point did Zidane make any real attempt to suggest otherwise, assuming that wasn't his initial plan.

I have no problem with a lively main character, but if that means he has to be arrogant, immoral and disrespectful, then I'll take a quiet thoughtful character any day. Unless of course I'm playing GTA.

I think Zidane was alot like any horny, sex-deprived tennager. (I.e.: me especially) He acts shady and pretends like he is big and bad... but he is really innocent in the end. He'd never do anything to Garnet if he had the chance. As for Steiner, I could understand why he would be upset. But it added to the plot and gave it a comedic touch. Zidane enjoyed getting Steiner all riled up, so he kept acting shady jsut to tick him off. Like when you have a substitute teacher and you organize everyone to raise their hands all at once just to be mean.

Zidane didnt have to explain anything to Steiner. He wasn't listening to stiner and didnt even care what he thought. His boss was Baku and Cid. Why care what Steiner thinks?

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
My problem with him argueing with Steiner is that for all Steiner knew Zidane was taking Dagger away to rape and torture her. At no point did Zidane make any real attempt to suggest otherwise, assuming that wasn't his initial plan.

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You could argue that point in defense of Steiner, but Zidane didn't really do anything to indicate he intended any ill will towards Garnet. Sure, he touched her ass, but that itself could be argued as accidental and not intentional. The fact is that Zidane went after Garnet in the forest, and he chose to bring Steiner along. He could have just taken Vivi, but he chose to take Steiner along also. And even after that, Steiner still gave Zidane a hard time despite the fact that he had the oppurtunity to umm..."disrespect" Garnet, but Zidane never took it because it didn't fit his character.

Even Garnet told Steiner to cool it at certain times. She trusted Zidane enough at the beginning of the game to do what needed to be done. She probably didn't trust him completely until a little later, but the point is she trusted him enough at the beginning, and she never really made any attempt to get away from him.

Apart from what's been mentioned, the relationship between Zidane and Steiner was funny! It added some humour to the game to see Steiner being the worrying knight and Zidane calling him "Rusty". Sure I felt a little sorry for Steiner at times, and he was right in trying to protect the princess, but if Zidane had just been nice and polite and cooperative and said "ok I won't kidnap her" then the game would have ended 5 minutes in :p

Xander, I agree, it WAS funny. If a bit annoying at times. Here's some more point's id like to discuss.

I’m a fair guy, so I’m gonna say some good points of FFIX. (And some bad points) SPOILERS

CHARACTERS
Play as unique characters. I suppose that makes a difference compared to FFVII & FFVIII where characters weren’t that different. However, Square probably wanted to distance themselves from the non-customisation of FF1-4. From then each FF has become more customisable, as square realise that players nowadays want less boundaries.


ZIDANE-He is a 2D character with an annoying personality. As for his strength, that doesn’t matter, but while I’m here, he was weak. He was underdeveloped in places.
For example, why didn’t he know the truth about him and fellow Terrans? I don’t remember Garland whipping his memory. If he is an “Angel Of Death” surly he would know his purpose? Maybe Square wanted to distance themselves from strong heroes, but who wants to play as a wimp? As for the half-human thing, who cares? I’d play as any hero, but I do like them to be that…. a HERO. Not a thieving vagrant. He was horny as well. Who wants' to hang around ahorny guy? But a hrny girl, that's cool with me.

GARNET- She was a bit weak(Personality, not Stats). Tifa (FF7), Rinoa (FF8) & Yuna (FF10) could all handle themselves, yet still have that bit of weakness that made them human. Garnet was all weak, or as some say, a bit damp. Yet again, Maybe Square wanted to distance themselves from strong women, but who wants to play as a wimp?

SUMMONS-My opinions on them all.

SHIVA-Ok, but not as good looking as FF8
IFRIT-Hated the look (And I hated FF7’s look as well) FF8’s look rocked
FENRIR-I did like this one, was kinda cool. But disliked the Golum thing’s punch!
PHOENIX-Is there a FF where this one sucks? Ope.
CARBUNCLE-I like the Gem thing, but other then that, not as nice looking as FF8
MADEEN-Great!
RAMUH-Poor, he just didn’t look as nice or cool
LEVIATHAN-Not as good as FF8’s better then FF7’s
ATOMOS-Good, I like this look, and it is a cool looking summon
ODIN-How can I slag off Odin?
ALEXANDER-Not a true summon, but it sure looks cool!
BAHAMUT-terrible, FF8’s was better. Hell even FF10’s was better.
ARK-The worst. The most long, boring & untimely weak summon. Worst in FFIX

TERRA- (Spoilers ahead)
Right if Zidane is a Genome &, as is Kuja. Why does Kuja look so different? Plus, if they are asexual, why is Zidane manlier? Surely if it was main point of the story, the other characters would have said, “God kuja’s looks a bit girly”. Also, why is Terra, a life-sucking machine? Why is Garland, wanting to consume Gaia. If he did that, then Terra would eventually perish cause theirs no more souls to consume? If they have no personality, why did Kuja & Zidane develop one? Also, why do they have names, if they are dolls? Maybe I wasn’t paying attention, but I want explanation.

NECRON- (Spoilers)
So Necron is evil and the final boss. Why? He has no part in the story, no mention. Maybe it would have been better if he was mentioned like as a myth. Same about the crystal, why is it not mentioned until the end. Very annoying, and it feels like they were chucked in at the last minute to add some weight to the tale.

TRANCE-
A terrible replacement to Limits. Also, Zidnae’s DYNE breaks don’t look THAT impressive, whereas, Squalls were very cool. Another thing, why step back from the interactive limits like FF8’ with u pressing R1 or others for Zell & squall. It just felkt like a step backwards.

OZMA
Is very weird. I was struggling with this boss at one time, with levels about 93, and all abilities, yet mange to beat it at around 67 on another save! At least the Weapons (Ruby,Omega etc) weren’t so unpredictable.
On another thing, where are the WEAPONS? They are one of my favourite bits of the series, with each one being challenging. If this is a lookback to the series, where are they?

Oh yeah, i wasn't flamming you Vincent06. You're cool. I was flamming SOMEONE ELSE. Can't think who...

Sorry 'bout that Legolas. No hard feelings. Okay lets start again. THe reason Zidane didnt remember the Terrans is because he was sent to Gaia at a young age. Its the same with Goku and the Saiyans. As for him being weak, thats all opinionative. Garnet however, could kick all the other girls butts. She could summon the different creatures which, when boosted, were amazingly powerful. They also looked really cool. Now summons

Shiva- the first attempt at a non-porn shiva. Good job
Ifrit- really nice original moves. Ifrit in ff7 lookded dumb, and the one in 8 had an annurism in his neck
Leviathan- this summon sent shivers down my spine. The graphics were awesome
Madeen- perfect and orginal
Ferenir- I agree with the golem statement
Ark- cool looking but not worth gettting
Phoenix- useful when Eiko isnt the first one to frikkin die like she always does
Carbuncle- 8's was better because the graphics were smoother
Atomos- great and orginal
Ramuh- quezacotal was far better
Odin- by far the best looking odin attack imo
Bahamut- great looking and original. Bahamut Zero was better though
Alexander- no opinion. You see him once and he dies. Youc ant realy judge this one

Now as for terra, on the sexes. Look at page 3. That should explain it. As for Kuja looking unlike a geonome, thats because he hid his tail under his ...... dress? Well either way he had a tail but Garland even said he hides it. I guess he grew his hair out and it turned white from a climate change, or mabey mist. They have names because they were the first Geonomes created with soulS. They were created to do Garland's business. As for Necron being random, the same can be said with most of the final bosses with the exception of Safer Sephiroth, who stayed sephiroth the entire game. As for trance, I like it. The moves were an original, and imo, were steps ahead of 7 and 8. In those games, you could control your trance and go whoop up on a boss. How easy is that? Really easy. Stupidly Easy. Imo. Now onto Ozma, he was a push from the WEAPONS. The square team wanted to try something different from the unbeatable Omega Weapon. If you can find ONE person who has beaten Omega Weapon, i'd give him my bank account just for being an FF god. Ozma was mabey a little to easy, but he was defenately a step away from the ff past. The weapons got old and were used too much imo. Thats just me.

The thing that bugged me about Ozma was that he looked like a huge bouncy ball :p Not some terrifying creature. Who wants to fight a bouncy ball?? ^-~

And Zidane being a "horny guy" didn't bother me ;) He was more upbeat and chirpy than Cloud and Squall and as much as I liked their characters, it was good to have something a bit different!

I can see what your getting at in a lot of things you say Legolas63 :) I can't really comment on the storyline because all the in-depth stuff about it goes over my head and I don't really concern myself with it much.

As for Garnet being weak, I'm not sure I agree, at the beginning of the game she was planning to escape from the castle and from the Queen, that was her decision and her plan. She was unhappy at a lot of points but this shouldn't necessarily be seen as a weakness, I thought she was pretty strong just had a lot to go through ^^

Zidane kidnapping Dagger was enough incentive for Steiner to be justifiably angry and distrustful. As far as Cid and Baku being his bosses, neither were. I'm fairly sure Zidane didn't even know about Cid's involvement, and he quit Tantalus.
It might be funny for Zidane to act the way he does, as it may have been funny if Squall had donned a tutu for the concert scene and pretended to be a chocobo while Rinoa was talking. It doesn't mean it means making a character something they aren't at the expense of story for laughs is a good thing.

Vincent06, I have beaten Omega (I assume you mean from VIII), as have many people on this forum. If you know the game he's a pushover. If you don't he's unbelievable. That's one thing I like about VII and VIII over IX, they reward you for being a good player, not for being a patient one.

You say "making a character something they aren't" but that's what Zidane was. The way he acted to Steiner was part of his "cheeky" if you like, character.
Squall wearing a tutu wouldn't be part of his character, obviously but Zidane being rude to Steiner was his personality. I don't really see what your getting at... (no offence intended!)

How do you think the story would have gone if Zidane didn't act like that? If he didn't kidnap Garnet...it was the starting point for the whole game, it had to be done, Zidane had to be like he was. It was what made him Zidane. And I liked him that way :)

Well... Vincent 06 if you tought that Omega Weapon was umbeatable ( with that bunch of Holy War he's not ) try playing FF5 and beat Omega ( yup, Daddy Omega ) tha's a fu**** hard boss, afterwards hes the Daddy Omega, all the Weapons so as Ozma are all frakin easy compared to Omega, i was at lvl 35 when i first saw him, tough he was an ordinary monster like some that look like him, my deception is that i died in 2 seconds, then i came back there on lvl 99 and died on 10 seconds, then i spend an hour to figure how to beat him, plus 30 minutes to kill the godamn thing:mad2: , but im the end i killed the beast and know what i got ??? just a little token for beating him up..... im still very mad at that Omega stuff ( urgh...how i hate freakin Omega)

let's all just get along.. dur! we cud go to a happy place and do... HAPPY tHiNgS! gnahh!:rabite: :rabite: :rabite: :rabite: :rabite: :rabite:
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/image/03/20030812.jpg

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Originally posted by Legolas63
For example, why didn’t he know the truth about him and fellow Terrans? I don’t remember Garland whipping his memory. If he is an “Angel Of Death” surly he would know his purpose?

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It is stated in the game that Kuja purposefully took Zidane and stranded him on Terra soon after he was created. Thats why all Zidane can remember is the light that the other Genomes were looking at. Other than that, Zidane has absolutely no recollection of anything else because he was not on Terra long enough to remember.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
GARNET- She was a bit weak(Personality, not Stats). Tifa (FF7), Rinoa (FF8) & Yuna (FF10) could all handle themselves, yet still have that bit of weakness that made them human. Garnet was all weak, or as some say, a bit damp. Yet again, Maybe Square wanted to distance themselves from strong women, but who wants to play as a wimp?

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I disagree with this one completely. Garnet is one of the strongest female characters in Final Fantasy, right on par with Terra and Celes from FFVI. From the very beginning, Garnet was willing to risk her safety to escape the Alexandria palace to get to her uncle Cid to warn him of her mother's actions, and try to get his help. It so happened that Zidane, whose orders were to kidnap her to take her to Lindblum, showed up.

After staying in Lindblum for a bit, she sneaks out with Steiner in an effort to get back to Alexandria to try to convince her mother to stop what she's doing. Along that journey, she meets up with Marcus, and helps him obtain something that will help return Blank to his normal self, since he was petrified in the process of helping everyone to save her in the Dark Forest. So she puts aside her own interests to help someone because she feels responsible for Blank's current state.

And beyond that, Garnet assumes the throne of Alexandria when he mother dies, and takes on the heavy burden of ruling a kingdom, and defends that kingdom when Kuja attacks it.

And beyond all else, after seeing her mother die, after seeing her kingdom devastated, after learning about who she really is and where she comes from, she accepts all that has happened to her, and hardens her resolve to stop Kuja and Garland in their tracks.

And one last thing to note of Garnet, when Zidane loses himself in Terra, she returns the favor by coming to his aid when he needs it. She went from being quite oblivious to the outside world to being a capable young woman ready and willing to both defend and help her friends when the situation arises, as she proves throughout the game.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
TERRA- (Spoilers ahead)
Right if Zidane is a Genome &, as is Kuja. Why does Kuja look so different?

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You have to consider what motivates Kuja to understand why he looks different from the other Genomes. Garland makes mention of Kuja denying what he is, and he's exactly right. Kuja changes his appearance to deny what he is, because to acknowledge his birthright is to acknowledge that he is lesser than Garland. And Kuja's one motivation throughout the entire game, more than anything else is to prove to Garland that he is better than Garland. That's why for most of the game, Kuja looks so different.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Also, why is Terra, a life-sucking machine? Why is Garland, wanting to consume Gaia. If he did that, then Terra would eventually perish cause theirs no more souls to consume?

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How could you miss this part of the story? Ok, Terra was once a thriving planet. But, for some reason, Terra started to decline in prosperity. The scientists on the planet did everything they could to prevent it, but ultimately, could not stop the process. So, in desperation, the Terrans created Garland and left him in charge of assimilating Terra into the thriving Gaia while they slept. Garland attempted to assimilate Terra into Gaia by force, but succeeded in only a psuedo-assimilation, meaning that the assimilation was incomplete, but that they were still signs of Terra on Gaia, most notably Oeilvert, Ispen's Castle, and more than likely, the four shrines.

After his failed assimilation, Garland went for a more roundabout, but effective way of assimilation. He figured out that Gaia's cycle of life consisted of souls being born out of the crystal, living life in a corporeal body until the body dies, at which point the soul returns to the crystal. Garland designed the Iifa tree to act as a block for the Gaian souls returning to the crystal. That's why he wanted Kuja to get wars raged on Gaia, so that the cycle can be accelerated. At the point in which the last soul on Gaia left to return to the crystal, the Iifa tree would then cycle the Terran souls (who were in hibernation since their civilization fell) into the souless Genomes, who would then in habit Gaia which would be completely be assimilated by Terra since there were no new Gaian souls being transferred to Gaia.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
If they have no personality, why did Kuja & Zidane develop one? Also, why do they have names, if they are dolls? Maybe I wasn’t paying attention, but I want explanation.

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Garland said it himself. When Kuja was created, Kuja had too strong of a will to be like all the other genomes, and Garland did not want to discard him, so he made use of Kuja by sending him to Gaia to start wars. Kuja was actually a freak accident by having a strong will when he was created. Technically, that wasn't supposed to happen. All Garland did was make use of the situation. Zidane, on the other hand, was created specifically to be stronger than Kuja so that he could take Kuja's place. Kuja has personality because he was born that was by accident. Zidane has personality because he was born, but then shortly stranded on Gaia where he was apoted by Tauntlus and he developed his own personality from then on.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
NECRON- (Spoilers)
So Necron is evil and the final boss. Why? He has no part in the story, no mention. Maybe it would have been better if he was metioned like as a myth. Same about the crystal, why is it not mentioned until the end. Very annoying, and it feels like they were chucked in at the last minute to add some weight to the tale.

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I actually agree with the Necron part. I disliked the fact that he was thrown in there, and would have liked a mention of some kind of rumor regarding him. However, from a literary standpoint, Necron was there for the sole purpose of being able to make Kuja a tragic villain.

As for the crystal, although it wasn't mentioned until towards the very end, you can see where it comes into play if you understand how Garland is assimilating Gaia. I explained that above.

Xander:

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You say "making a character something they aren't" but that's what Zidane was. The way he acted to Steiner was part of his "cheeky" if you like, character.
Squall wearing a tutu wouldn't be part of his character, obviously but Zidane being rude to Steiner was his personality. I don't really see what your getting at... (no offence intended!)

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People were suggestion humour as an excuse for Zidane acting like he did. His character being arrogant and disrespectful isn't justified by it being "The way he is" either.

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How do you think the story would have gone if Zidane didn't act like that? If he didn't kidnap Garnet...it was the starting point for the whole game, it had to be done, Zidane had to be like he was. It was what made him Zidane. And I liked him that way

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Dagger had to come with them, but it didn't have to happen like that. She had intended to sneak on the ship, and could have done so without them trying to kidnap her.
Or alternatively and more sensibly, Zidane could have actually explained his actions himself, or it could have been indicated that he even knew the real reason for the abduction. He also could have shown more respect for someone who was only doing their job, and given him a reason not to think he was just a thieving, kidnapping, (possibly) rapist.

Well I can see where your coming from... :) (still :love: Ziddy though :p )

What about the Music? i feel FFIX has quite poor music and the only good ones are the simple piano ones (Melodies of Life & Loss Of Me) and the Dark ones, that are a bit like FFVIII (Padimona and Ilfa Tree) Ohg Yeah, the Theme was good too, but all the rest were a bit rubbish.

Oh yeah, I hated that beach ball Ozma too. still, he was a change from Dragonlike Weapons that were in EVERY game

Some more discussion points.

AMARANT (Spoilers)
Amarant isn’t a “don't talk to me" "I don't care" "too-cool-for-school" character with a nifty weapon. He’s a silent, unlovable character who tries to be a rebel. Squall & Cloud had problems (Squall lost his “sister”, adopted to fight, and has a pressuring rival. He doesn’t know his parents, and can’t remember his childhood at the orphanage.) And (Cloud tried to join SOILDER, failed, became a lowly guard, killed Sephiroth and lived a lie. He was also warped by Jenova, Hojo & his rival.).
Hell, even Kimarhri in FFX siad somthing, and the rerason why he was silent because his WHOLE race wasn't big on talking.
Amarant had no problems. He just wanted to be cool. I felt he was just added to fill in an empty space in the roster. Also, his story has gaps in. Why did he become a thief? When did he meet Zidane? About that bit in Ispen’s castle. Why was he trying to be a rebel? What did he have to prove? If was SUCH a rebel, why did he join a bunch of miss-matched guys on saving the world. Cloud got wrapped up in it, thanks To AVALAUCHE and Squall had a mission that went wrong (He should have assinated the Sorceress)

KIDNAP
Yes, Zidane acting cheeky WAS funny. But, why act that way. A knight with a big sword was threating a street rat, with a tiny dagger. Obvoisly, Zidane must be a prick if he’s gonna be a idiot like that. Also, why didn’t he explain himself to Stenier. It would have caused less commotion, and might have got to Lindblum without getting shot down. (I understand it was there for the game to be exciting, but it was a kinda weak way of getting the plot going)
Kidnap is a big crime, even bigger if it’s the Queens daughter. Surely, if a petty thief was going along with this, he’d be VERY nervous. But Zidane wasn’t. That either means he is a stupid risk taker with no fear of death, or he KNEW that the king was behind it and knew that he would back them up should hey need it. Or maybe, they were blackmailed into it by Cid.

STORY (Spoilers)
Thanks for the heads up on some parts of the story. Heres some more bits that I felt, didn’t make sense.
· When you find out Garnet’s real name, why doesn’t Garnet find out, or Zidane tries to protect the truth from her? In FF8, Selphie his the truth about her from Squall and Co (In Trabia Garden)
· Why could Kuja make Black Mages out of Mist?
· If you can see Gaia from Terra, and you can see Terra from Gaia, why didn’t anyone know (Except Kuja & Garland) about the two’s existence. Why didn’t anyone mention, “Terra’s looking rather Red tonight” or sumthing. Noone mentions it!
· Why do Genomes have tails?

TERRA (Spoliers)

AmericanBadass:

How could you miss this part of the story? Ok, Terra was once a thriving planet. But, for some reason, Terra started to decline in prosperity. The scientists on the planet did everything they could to prevent it, but ultimately, could not stop the process. So, in desperation, the Terrans created Garland and left him in charge of assimilating Terra into the thriving Gaia while they slept. Garland attempted to assimilate Terra into Gaia by force, but succeeded in only a psuedo-assimilation, meaning that the assimilation was incomplete, but that they were still signs of Terra on Gaia, most notably Oeilvert, Ispen's Castle, and more than likely, the four shrines.

After his failed assimilation, Garland went for a more roundabout, but effective way of assimilation. He figured out that Gaia's cycle of life consisted of souls being born out of the crystal, living life in a corporeal body until the body dies, at which point the soul returns to the crystal. Garland designed the Iifa tree to act as a block for the Gaian souls returning to the crystal. That's why he wanted Kuja to get wars raged on Gaia, so that the cycle can be accelerated. At the point in which the last soul on Gaia left to return to the crystal, the Iifa tree would then cycle the Terran souls (who were in hibernation since their civilization fell) into the souless Genomes, who would then in habit Gaia which would be completely be assimilated by Terra since there were no new Gaian souls being transferred to Gaia.

Ok. I believe all that happened, but I have a few questions with it.
· What did Terra once look like? Was it bit like Gaia?
· What do you mean decline? Am I right in saying that the WHOLE planet was falling apart, with would explain the almost skelaton like layout and style of Terra.
· If Garland was created, does that mean he is a Geonome as well?
· Why was assimulating into gaia the only way?
· What did Terraen’s look like? Wouldn’t it been cool if Garland showed his masters as they slept.

Oh yeah, if Kuja and Zidane were dolls, why did they have names> Did Garland give Kuja that name and Baku give Zidane that name?

Another problem with Terra. (This is just a personal thing) If it was a planet, wouldn’t it been better to have a world map. FF5 did just that. I feel that would have been better then just making it a FIELD map.

MOGS
I love mogs, and I was disappointed when FFX didn’t have any living breathing Moogles. However, there were far too many Mogs. It just got a bit sickly sweet after a while. Also, why aren’t any Moomba’s in it. I no, they are from F8’s world. But Moogles & Chocobo’s are in almost all the FF worlds, so why not Moombas? That would have been a great reference to a previous FF, and since they are great creatures, would have been a nice addition. But no, they add those Qus.

QUIENA (Spoilers)
I hate this character. Toatlly unlikable, sice all it does is obsess with food. Fat, Ugly, terrible weapon (A FORK!!!!???) and altogether hideous appeareance. I’m not saying characters have to look nice, but other then his blue magic, was a pretty appaling character. His story (Or what little there was) was weak. Something to do with a dude in a cave near Treno? What story is that?

MUSIC
Since someone brought it up again, I’ll carry on. I feel the music for FFIX is under par, and isn’t original. When the FF went to CD, I felt the muisic quality would get higher. And I wasn’t diaspointed.

FF7 had moody tones, but they were still cartoonish.
FF8 had dark, menacing songs & tunes. Good Piano bits, and for the fierst time, a theme song with words!
FF9 had some really plinkt tunes, some fair piano bits, Hardly any grown up dark, powerful songs & a not-as-good theme song with words
FF10 had some annoying tunes (Dire Thunder Plains, but some FANTASTIC ones and two great songs (Suteki da Ne & song of prayer)

So I see FF9 as the weakest link there. It’s just the music wsn’t inspiaing. Have you seen Donnie Darko? The music fits the tone, and makes some good scenes great. However, some FF9 ones didn’t fit the scene, and that’s why I didn’t like it. The tune I didn’t think fitted the scene was Alexandria when Vivi wanted the ticket.

WEAPONS (Spoilers)
I like the weapons. (Ruby, Omega & Ultima) They were cool if bloody hard. Plus, if this is a look back to previous FF's then having the weapons would be a clever idea. Even if as something you see in a painting, or a book.
Oh yeah, Ultima & Omega Weapon in FFX are VERY EASY.
Ultimate & Diamond & Emerald in FF7 are also Easy (If you have the Underwater Materia for Emarald).m It's only Ruby (ff7) & Omega (ff8) that are F***Ing Hard. i haven't beaten Omega, but I Have beaten Ruby.

MAGIC
why reduce Ultima to THAT? I like FF7's, FF6's, & FF8's version of Ultima then this one. This one was poor. Although, it looked like APOCLYSPE from FF8 a bit (Lasers)
Some of the Magic attacks looked a bit lame I must say. Still, Square were trying a "new" style so I can't complain. Ho hum.

Like I’ve said before. I just didn’t feel that FFIX was a bad FF. Not a bad GAME. But a BAD FF
:whoa:

Legolas can you avoid making unmarked spoilers for other FFs please? I only got one in that last post because I'd played most of the games, but you gave some pretty huge ones.
If someone could tag those it'd be good, but it doesn't affect me now so either way.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
·When you find out Garnet’s real name, why doesn’t Garnet find out, or Zidane tries to protect the truth from her? In FF8, Selphie his the truth about her from Squall and Co (In Trabia Garden)

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Technically speaking, finding out about Garnet's real name is not part of the flowing story. Finding out her real name is a sidequest, so player could go through the game never knowing Garnet's real name.

Since her real name is a sidequest, it wouldn't make sense for there to be a scene where Zidane tells Garnet her real name, especially if players never did the sidequest.

Its kind of like in FFVII, you can get Yuffie or Vincent as extra characters, but they don't appear in the FMV at the end regardless of whether you get them or not.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
·Why could Kuja make Black Mages out of Mist?

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Its never explicitly stated in the game how Kuja is able to make Black Mages out of Mist. But this is not the only thing thats never been truly explained in a Final Fantasy game. And in this situation, like the others, Square leaves a little room to develop theories.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
·If you can see Gaia from Terra, and you can see Terra from Gaia, why didn’t anyone know (Except Kuja & Garland) about the two’s existence. Why didn’t anyone mention, “Terra’s looking rather Red tonight” or sumthing. Noone mentions it!

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This one is kind of hard to explain. There used to be a diagram on FFIX's Online Ultimania website that was useful in explaining this, but since the website no longer exists...

Suffice to say, you can't see Terra when you are on Gaia. The only way to get to Terra is by way of the Shimmering Island portal which connects Terra to Gaia. I can't really explain it anymore than that.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
·Why do Genomes have tails?

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Why does Quina carry a giant fork? Why is Queen Brahne blue? There are just some unexplained things.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
·What did Terra once look like? Was it bit like Gaia?

·What do you mean decline? Am I right in saying that the WHOLE planet was falling apart, with would explain the almost skelaton like layout and style of Terra.

·If Garland was created, does that mean he is a Geonome as well?

·Why was assimulating into gaia the only way?

·What did Terraen’s look like? Wouldn’t it been cool if Garland showed his masters as they slept.

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- Yes, Terra was once a thriving, and quite beautiful planet, much like Gaia.

- By decline, I mean the planet was essentially dying. Vegetation and animals were dying off, nature went haywire, things of that nature. So yes, Terra was falling apart in every conceivable way.

- Not quite. Garland, while not a genome, is not your normal run of the mill type of guy either. Its never explained specifically who or what Garland is, except that he is the caretaker of Terra and was left in charge to bring Terra back to what it once was. You could theorize that he could have been magically enhanced, or mechanically enhanced either of which being completely plausable.

- Terra needed to assimilate a relatively young planet which was thriving, and Gaia was the closest one that fit that bill.

- We don't know what Terrans look like :) They could have looked similar to the Genomes, or similar to Garland for all we know.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Oh yeah, if Kuja and Zidane were dolls, why did they have names> Did Garland give Kuja that name and Baku give Zidane that name?

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The most probable solution is that Garland did, in fact, give Kuja and Zidane their names.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
Another problem with Terra. (This is just a personal thing) If it was a planet, wouldn’t it been better to have a world map. FF5 did just that. I feel that would have been better then just making it a FIELD map.

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Two things. One, the trip to Terra was necessary to advance the story, and Bran Bal and Pandemonium were the only two locations required to do it. Two, by the time you visit Terra, it had become a barren wasteland. There would have been no place to go. Pandemonium was Garland's castle, and Bran Bal was where the Genomes lived. The other places like Oeilvert and Ispens's castle which were probably located on Terra once, were transferred to Gaia in the failed assimilation.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
MOGS
I love mogs, and I was disappointed when FFX didn’t have any living breathing Moogles. However, there were far too many Mogs. It just got a bit sickly sweet after a while. Also, why aren’t any Moomba’s in it. I no, they are from F8’s world. But Moogles & Chocobo’s are in almost all the FF worlds, so why not Moombas? That would have been a great reference to a previous FF, and since they are great creatures, would have been a nice addition. But no, they add those Qus.

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Moombas were story specific to FFVIII. It wouldn't have made sense for them to appear in any other Final Fantasy aside from VIII.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
AMARANT (Spoilers)
Amarant isn’t a “don't talk to me" "I don't care" "too-cool-for-school" character with a nifty weapon. He’s a silent, unlovable character who tries to be a rebel.

Amarant had no problems. He just wanted to be cool. I felt he was just added to fill in an empty space in the roster. Also, his story has gaps in. Why did he become a thief? When did he meet Zidane? About that bit in Ispen’s castle. Why was he trying to be a rebel? What did he have to prove? If was SUCH a rebel, why did he join a bunch of miss-matched guys on saving the world.

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Some people in this world are just like that, they don't need reason to be. His character wasn't explained much, but I'm pretty sure that he would have had a darkish past that made him this way. Otherwise, I don't know. :p

He joined Zidane and co. because he lost to a fight against Zidane. He may respect someone stronger than him? I don't know. Anyways the point being in this post, is that you need to look deeper into the characters and story than what shows. Same deal with FFVII

It seems to be that you aren't even attempting to undetrsand the game. You obviously don't even know the other games all that well. I mean, you didn't even spell AVALANCHE right! If you want to make one game seem superior to another (which will never work, no matter how much you try) at least make sure that YOU appear to know something about it. By the way, your grammar is pathetic.

(spoilers ahead)
Alright, let's discuss Amarant. First, he wasn't a thief, he was a mercenary. Plus, why do you try to make Cloud out to be stronger when he fails miserably at accomplishing his only childhood dream? Not to mention that surely you don't think that Cloud killed Sepiroth all those years ago..... Why does Amarant constantly rebel while still keeping with the party? Amarant lost a one on one fight to a energetic, young, and childish thief. He didn't understand how that could happen. So, he decided to follow Zidane in order to discover how he obtains such power. At the Castle of Ipsen, he tries to beat Zidane to prove that the rest of Zidane's party only brings him down. Amarant is a loner. He was trying to show Zidane that he would be better off being the same way. He fails, obviously, because a team is always stronger than an individual. As for Quina, he wasn't really a storyline character. Sort of like Vincent. If you weren't trying really frickin' hard to understand him, you weren't going to. Quina did have a purpose though. All throughout the game, the other realize that Quina's carefree indulgence is actually a better style of living. They learn from him. Freya decides that constant fretting and worry has been getting her nowhere. Why? Because she watched Quina. Vivi learned from Quina.

Music. According to most professional music critics, FFIX's music is actually cosidered superior to all others. However, the Crystal theme sounds dang familiar. Maybe this is all part of the nostalgic value of the game.


Overall, maybe I'll start taking you seriously when you actually sound like you knw what you're talking about.

The ANSWER for your trouble of FF9 for not having any Moombas is that FF9 dont have the Shumis ( or Shubis ??), if you went on the Shumi Tribe you would know about Moombas and the Shumi true form ( that fushururu boss on the garden of balamb is on the Shumi true Form ), if i remember well there was a limit of experiences or just stuff they came across on their lifes, that decide if they are going to be Moombas or Fushururus ( Shumi true Form), again, there are no Moombas on FF9 cuz there's no Shumi tribe or Shumi people on the World of Terra or Gaia, plus, THE HARDEST BOSS ON ALL THE FF'S IS WITH NO DOUBT OMEGA FROM FF5, more info about him read my last reply here, as i said before: all the Weapons so as Ozma are nothing compared with Omega.
And at least but not last, play FF9 twice and i doubt you will say the same things you said about Quina.

Oh thanks for the grammar thing. THAT REALLY HELPS

So what if I spelt a name wrong? You obviously knew what I was talkng about so whats the problem? What's the point in taking the piss out of trivial things? Surely, you should be surporting FF9, rather then having a go at me.

As for my Spoliers, Im VERY sorry. I hate that, but I mark each section if they have spoilers so I'm sorry.

Anyway, i'll explain somethings and ask other things.

STORY
The only reason I kept asking about that, was because I was INTERESTED. I wanted to find out these things. Thanks American Badass for explaining my questions. You see, i thought it's story was a weak point, but now, i think it's one of it's strongest points. other then Necron, everything HAS a purpose. FF7 had some bits that JUST felt placed in there to give it more weight so their all the same. I just thought FF9's was weaker. But now, I think it's really good. I'm playing through it again so I understand it more. (Ive played it three times before, but i want to understand it better)
Thank's for the help!

AMARANT

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Alright, let's discuss Amarant. First, he wasn't a thief, he was a mercenary. Plus, why do you try to make Cloud out to be stronger when he fails miserably at accomplishing his only childhood dream? Not to mention that surely you don't think that Cloud killed Sepiroth all those years ago..... Why does Amarant constantly rebel while still keeping with the party? Amarant lost a one on one fight to a energetic, young, and childish thief. He didn't understand how that could happen. So, he decided to follow Zidane in order to discover how he obtains such power. At the Castle of Ipsen, he tries to beat Zidane to prove that the rest of Zidane's party only brings him down. Amarant is a loner. He was trying to show Zidane that he would be better off being the same way. He fails, obviously, because a team is always stronger than an individual.

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I said he was a thief but he's a mercenary. My mistake. Plus, the reason i make Cloud sound stronger when he fails is because he eventually becomes EVEN greater then Sephiroth. he proves that Shinra were wrong. He overcomes his set-back, and surpasses it. Amarant has NO back story and therefore, i find it hard to take him seriously as a Character. You could say he isn't a REAL story character, rather like Yuffie & Vincent. However, they had back stories. They were fleshed out, Amarant wasn't. You could say since he was cold, maybe he didn't need to be fleshed out. But Squall was cold, and was given credible reason's WHY. Amarant wasn't.

MOOMBAS

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The ANSWER for your trouble of FF9 for not having any Moombas is that FF9 dont have the Shumis ( or Shubis ??), if you went on the Shumi Tribe you would know about Moombas and the Shumi true form ( that fushururu boss on the garden of balamb is on the Shumi true Form ), if i remember well there was a limit of experiences or just stuff they came across on their lifes, that decide if they are going to be Moombas or Fushururus ( Shumi true Form), again, there are no Moombas on FF9 cuz there's no Shumi tribe or Shumi people on the World of Terra or Gaia

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I know THAT. However, I was saying that FF9 is meant to be a look back to previous games. It has plnty of references to other games (Vagrant Story, FF7 etc) and I just thought it'll be cool if Moomba's were in it AS WELL. Also, your point is a bit unfounded, sice Moomba's were in FFX and they have no real existence in THAT world. Also, Mog is a character in FF6 so he becomes a Story Character so why are they in every FF? Same as Chocobo's, for the main character's best friend is a chocobo called Boko in FF5. But they're in almost every game. I perhaps thought that they could be in this game as a reference to FF8.

MUSIC

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According to most professional music critics, FFIX's music is actually cosidered superior to all others. However, the Crystal theme sounds dang familiar. Maybe this is all part of the nostalgic value of the game.

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I don't care what they say, it's my opinion. i didn't like it.
Anyway, a critic is simply someone who gets paid to express their opinion on it. That exactly what I did (Except get paid). For example, some critics think Eminem creates the BEST music in the world. Some think he writes rubbish songs and is a waste of space.
I like Rage Against The Machine, Do you? Probably not, beacsue THATS your opinion.

Also, the Crystal theme should sound familiar, its in almost all the FF's, from FF5, I definetly heard it in 5 and I think I heard it in 7 as well. it's a regualar, another reference to previous FFs.

QUINA
I have played it OVER twice, and I still don't like him. Some people don't like Squall, some don't like Cloud. I don't like a character. Hell, he aint even the main character.

I feel that if I should have to play as a character, he should be fleshed out. Given a story. Given a meaning. He wasn't, and I just couldn't see the point. Also, before anyone says some characters in other games weanrt even given a story, so i should be happy, one of the reasons why FFs are so respected is because of their story. It's also not the only reason why I like them either. MGS2 had an OVERLY extensive story, and I hated that. Quina wasn't given story and at times, I felt he just wasn't needed.

As for his care-free attitude. If was so good, then why didn't they adopt it? Because if they did, the world would have ended. Yes, Freya learned & so did Vivi. But they were obsesive worriers in the first place. The only way was up for them.

OTHER CHARACTERS
and my opinion on them

FREYA-Obsesive worrier. Didn't like.
EIKO-Slightly annoying at first, other then that, good character
REGENT CID-Stupid Frog story. Wasn't as enderiing as previous Cids
JESTER TWINS-Evil little buggers, and a little Creepy.
BRAHNE-Stupidly fat but good character. Tragic Villan like Kuja
GARLAND-Good, he was a good character because he was dark and was cold to both his creations
MIKADO (Geonome)-I like her, because she showed how Zidane whould gain a personality.
BEATRIX-I liked her because she mellowed Steiner, but I didn't like how she DIDN'T KNOW what Brahne was doing was wrong.

WEAPONS
I know Omega from FF5 is too hard. i was just saying I liked fighting a massive dragon-style character, with lasers and more, then a beach-ball (OZMA)

PLAYABILITY

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Anyway, the main reason is really just that it didnt engage me. When i turned it on and started playing, it didnt pull me in and make me want to play more, like most other FF games did (even VIII, and VIII is the one I hate most for its lack of character development). With, for example, Kingdom Hearts, I couldnt put the controller down, I was so into it. IX failed to draw me in at the beginning, and thus I set my controller down and walked away. Even when I forced myself to try and play it for the mere sake of getting it over with, I couldnt make it far past disc 1.

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I played FF9, and Ive played it again. I play it because i want to. it's a good game. BUT not a good FF (In my opinion). Even FFX was boring at times but I played through it, and forgot all the boring bits, and remembered the good times. But with FFIX, i couldn't. all the bad bits just stuck out. Maybe it could be because I really liked the series, thought it would go down hill after it went to PS1, didn't, and I expected the final PS1 game to be the best. But it wasn't. I was dissapointed with it, and that's why I hate it as a FF. I apreciate the good bits (Vivi, Story "now thanks to some help", Chocograph and some of it's quirkier characters (EXCEPT thos Qus). I liked the Moogles, I enjoyed Terra as a place and numourous other points. i just didn't think it was that good a FF.

I also didn't think it was that good a send-off to previous FFs. Not a fair Tribute.

It's alright about the spoilers Legolas, everyone seems to be doing it now.
Can I request that people put spoiler tags on anything to do with pre PSone FFs from now on as I haven't played them all. I don't wanna have to avoid this thread.

I'm new to this Forum (well mostly), but I think that everyone has a point about FFIX. I think that Final Fantasy IX is hard but I prefer it to Final Fantasy VIII. Number 8 is the most complicated FF there has been. The junction system is a lot harder than all the other ways. Equiping weapons and armour (FFIX) is one of the simplest but effective ways to upgrade characters. I must agree with Legolas63 that some characters aren't very playable, but thats the same with all of them. I couldn't stand Irvine and Zell, very annoying people. I also can't get involved with playing as Barret and Yuffie, they are not interesting people. But as I say, we are not not her to judge characters, but to talk about the nineth Final Fantasy. The music in some places , I must admit is good (Especially the Loss Of Me song, I can nearly play it on my keyboard!). The story was involving, and you can't help but cry for when you think about (SPOILER) Zidane being dead. However, I must say What Is The Point Of Quina And Amarent????? They are DUMB characters!!! Why is there some of the mini games in the game, some are so boring I wanted to scream? I know that you don't have to play them but I thought that was why they were there! The end boss was extremely incredebily EASY! My cat could beat it just by hitting the Control Pad! Phew... I glad I got that off my chest!

Stupid Moomba 88, your post came to me while I was surfing so I'll just argue my case.

FF9 vs FF8

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I think that Final Fantasy IX is hard but I prefer it to Final Fantasy VIII. Number 8 is the most complicated FF there has been

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I don't agree with you there. FF9 is easy, people in this forum have already said that and most the planet had said it's EASY. This means that you must also be new to
FF games too.

Also, FF8 wasn't complicated. It had easy buttons for those that couldn't get it's Junction system. It was just more FLEXIBLE, something that FF9 isn't. FF9 is very restrictive, for each character has different abilities.

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The junction system is a lot harder than all the other ways. Equiping weapons and armour (FFIX) is one of the simplest but effective ways to upgrade characters.

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Nope, FF8 wasn't hard. Plus, FF8 was a revelation, with Square trying new things. So it makes sense it alienated some players. i throughly enjoyed FF8, and if you played it more then you'll agree.

CHARACTERS

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I must agree with Legolas63 that some characters aren't very playable, but thats the same with all of them. I couldn't stand Irvine and Zell, very annoying people. I also can't get involved with playing as Barret and Yuffie, they are not interesting people. But as I say, we are not not her to judge characters, but to talk about the nineth Final Fantasy

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I didn't say they weren't playable, i said they wearn't LIKEABLE. And no, Irvine & Zell wearn't dislikable, they were mis-understood. But i doubt you played FF8 all the way through. And judging characters in FF9 is discussing FF9, so lets continue doing that

ENDING?
As for your (spoiler)Zidane being dead thing, you knew he wasn't going to die. And another thing, it wasn't upsetting, only FFX's ending brought me close to tears. FF9's was too sickly sweet how everything is wrapped uop in a nice little bow. There's no room for plot discussion because everything is wrapped up.Everyone is happy, Eiko gets parents, Garnet gets Zidane, Steiner gets Beatrix,Quina becomes a chef,Freya gets her lost love. Everyone gets what they want. one of the worst endings i'll say.

As for your Necron comment, i couldn't care what you cat can do. If you're gonna post. post something relevent, so we can discuss it and not something so random and irrelevent that it's not worth talking about.
I hope you'll express some better opinions next time.

That was a bit harsh Legolas, Necron being easy is a fairly common criticism of the game.

I think the happy ending was a way to round of the PSone series. Though it wasn't any happier than (SPOILER)VIII's.

Okay pull out your tissues and sit down.We're here to solve this. This is my ultimate opinion on the game. FFIX was a brilliant game taking the good points from all the other games and combining them itno one. Every charachter had a reason for being there. Quina was needed to marry vivi so they could pass thru conde petie. she was also setting out to discover the misteries of the world. Amarant had a purpose in finding out the meaning of forgiveness. Even if they didnt have a reason to continue or so it seemed, there were alterior purposes that you have to see closely. As for the plot, I thought it was brilliant. Two people battling against not only against each other, but against life itself in an attempt to save their souls as well as all of the others of the planet. Kuja wasa perfect villain displaying both sarcasm and poetic skills making him one of the deepest villains of all time. Sepheroth wasnt a deep villain. He was a psychofreak bent on becoming a god. As for the music, I find it great and original. The battle music was especially upbeat and a song you can't get sick of unlike the FF7 and 8 battle music. The other music sent shivers up my spine, especially the scene of the Theater Ship entering Alexandria. The CG's, although few, were to die for in my opinion. Zidane was a perfection as well. He wasnt a massive-weapon-slinger as previously stated, and didnt have a "shut the hell up" attitude as squall and cloud did. He also had very neat double-bladed weapons. The theif idea, as used in ff6, fit perfectly in wtih the theme. Now, as for zidane being rude to stiener, he had a reason. Really, he DIDNT have a reason to explain anything to steiner. He obeyed Baku and Cid and was following the orders he was given. Thats showing good qualities. That is my opinon on FF9. It's the best game in my opinion. :D

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I love mogs, and I was disappointed when FFX didn’t have any living breathing Moogles. However, there were far too many Mogs. It just got a bit sickly sweet after a while. Also, why aren’t any Moomba’s in it. I no, they are from F8’s world. But Moogles & Chocobo’s are in almost all the FF worlds, so why not Moombas? That would have been a great reference to a previous FF, and since they are great creatures, would have been a nice addition. But no, they add those Qus

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In my opinion it was partly the Moogles fault that this game had a humorous side. They were funny, full of life and they wasn't afraid to say what was on their minds. I just loved them.

About the Moomba thing: I don't think that the Moombas are as popular as the chocobos and the Moogles, although I personally think they're cute.

Vincent, there are a few errors in your arguement.

Quina isn't needed to marry Vivi, they can pass through anyway, and her being there to explore things hardly qualifies her as an addition.

Amarant being there to find out the meaning of forgiveness is fairly pointless if they don't explain why he didn't know it in the first place.

Sephiroth is HUGELY deep. If you believe some theories, he's deeper still.

Zidane's reasons for explaining to Steiner and not being rude were simple common sense. If he'd explained Steiner would have actually HELPED instead of trying to stop their progress. It would also be simple courtesy to someone who has no reason to think you aren't a raping, murdering thief.

He didn't work for Baku, and there's no evidence that he knew the kidnap had anything to do with Cid. He never mentions it, Tantalus never mention it, Dagger is the one who wanted to go to Lindblum, and she is the only person with Cid when it comes up.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
Sephiroth is HUGELY deep. If you believe some theories, he's deeper still.

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Sephiroth is deep before he falls into the lifestream. After that event, any reasons he had before that justified what he was doing seemingly vanished. In other words, the past tense Sephiroth was a misguided villain and formed conclusions based off of inaccurate findings. The present tense Sephiroth wants to become God because he thinks its his right. Two very different ways of thinking there, and no bridge between the two.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
He didn't work for Baku, and there's no evidence that he knew the kidnap had anything to do with Cid. He never mentions it, Tantalus never mention it, Dagger is the one who wanted to go to Lindblum, and she is the only person with Cid when it comes up.

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Ok, firstly, Zidane was a member of Tantalus, and therefore, he worked for Baku. In the Evil Forest, Zidane basically left Tantalus and no longer worked for Baku.

While in Tantalus, he was following Baku's orders which came directly from Cid who asked Baku for help in getting Garnet to Lindblum because the two of them go "way back" according to Cid, himself. So whether or not Zidane knew about Cid is rather moot. However, Zidane's attitude towards Steiner, and the fact that Zidane mentions never meeting Cid supports the idea that Zidane did not, in fact, have any knowledge that Cid was behind the whole thing.

Ok, I was harsh to Stupid Moomba 88, but It was late. I'll send my apology: I'm Sorry. Accepted? Then I'll continue,

QUIT TRASHING THE FRIGGIN GAME
I think some of you think I'm bashing FFIX because I can. Because I want to cause trouble. Nope, I'm expressing my opinion on it beacsue I want to. I don't wanna start a war, I just want people to hear my opinion and actually listen, not just dismiss it becasue they don't want to hear it. If you love FFIX enough to just let my comments wash over you, or reply sensibly, with constructive comments (And No comments about my Grammar) then that's cool. But if you just flame me, then I'll reply with more anger. So it doesn't work.

ITS TOO EASY
Right, back to my first point. I payed £40 on a new FF. I did this with FF7 & FF8 as well. I played those ones deeply, and enjoyed every second, so I expected to experience that with this one. Put it in and played. Right, I played a loooonnnnnggg time before getting off because I wanted to play it. So I did. However, I never raised my levels. On my first play, I just enjoy it, I don't look, and i don't look for anything. i do the obvious, and complete the game.
Here comes MY problem, I realised it was something like midnight, and i was on Disc 3 about to get to Terra. 21 hours had clocked. I hadn't raised, all my characters were about lvl30. On the over FF on PS1, that didn't happen. When I got to the huge robot thing in the underwater part of Junon. in FF7,I was stumped because I hadn'/t raised. So i did, then progressed. Although in FF8, the enemie get harder as Squall does, so it makes it a little easier, at one point, he was TO strong, so I killed him, and raised some of the others in battle, still they could cope. FF9, I didn't, so i feel it was made easier.
Also, Necron was VERY easy IMO, even at early levels, so I felt he wasn't a very good conclusion to the game.
(For all you who think I missed out on things, i played again, and tried to get everything)

MINI GAMES
They WERE different wearn't they? They were more simplyfied, and you would miss them if you didn't explore you enviroment (Skiping & Running). That I did like. Howver, here's my opinion
SKIPPING-Cool, but hell on my fingers & pad
FIGHT-Too easy IMO
CHOCOBO-Fun, and better then FF8's chocobo game.
COINS-Simple finding things game, not fun
QUIZ GUY-Different, I like!!!
RUNNING-Stupid F***ING GAME Hate with a passion
CARDS-Poor compared to FF8. VERY POOR

My point was, there wasn't that much chalenging things. it souughta was just pressing buttons (With the exception on CHOCO & CARDS). They all involved some speed thought, whereas Cards & Choco involved actual thought. My problem was that they WEARNT as GOOD as prebviously. With FF7's snowboarding,motocycling, sub dive, mog house e.t.c
FF8's were thin on the ground, but instead they replaced it with CARDS, the holiest game ever!! It was deep and fun, and when you lost, you just wanted to dive back in and face the punk again.
FF9;s cards wearnt as technical, and less simple, so it wasn't as fun. Also, until someone replaces FF7's Chocobo racing with something better, then I'll never be happy. i've hated FF10's, I dispise FF8's and although FF9's is the best of that lot, it's just not AS good as chcobo racing.

FFIX GENERALLY

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Every charachter had a reason for being there. Quina was needed to marry vivi so they could pass thru conde petie. she was also setting out to discover the misteries of the world. Amarant had a purpose in finding out the meaning of forgiveness. Even if they didnt have a reason to continue or so it seemed, there were alterior purposes that you have to see closely. As for the plot, I thought it was brilliant. Two people battling against not only against each other, but against life itself in an attempt to save their souls as well as all of the others of the planet. Kuja wasa perfect villain displaying both sarcasm and poetic skills making him one of the deepest villains of all time. Sepheroth wasnt a deep villain. He was a psychofreak bent on becoming a god.

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As for the Character thing, that was written into the script. They didn' need to get to get married if Square didn't put it in there. Did Amarant ACTUALLY learn anything? Did Quina have to discover the world? Nope, because they didn't have to BE there. I now understand Quina's trole on the party. However, did she have to be so obsesessed with food? You could have had a carefree character that actually ahd something importent to say.

I now believe that the Plot is one of the best bits, so I wont argue with you there. EXCEPT with Sephiroth. he was the LORD of villians. He wasn't human (As in, he didn't have human feelings) but imagine, who would you be more scared of?

1) A cold, heatless monster who doesn't care about ANYTHING, with no feeling could slaughter millions for his own purpose?

2) A guy who wants to get back at a dude who siad he was inferiotr. Finds out truth (That he was created and is going to die ) and flips, destroying a world and then wants to destroy the whole universe.

Sephiroth is a good villian because he's menacing. Kuja is a good villain because he appeared so NORMAL, but he wasn't. Sephioth was a scary guy, Kuja was a tagiv villian. Different styles, Different Villianary.

Vincent06, you are cool, but I want to express my opinion on your opinions. No hard feelings.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
I now believe that the Plot is one of the best bits, so I wont argue with you there. EXCEPT with Sephiroth. he was the LORD of villians.

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In the flashbacks, Sephiroth is shown to be cold, but still having feelings like anyone else. He finds about his past, or rather, part of it because the books he read were inaccurate, and thus, his knowledge was inaccurate. He flipped out for all the wrong reasons, but were right to him, and begin killing at will because he thought he was justified in his actions. This Sephiroth had all the makings of one of the most beautiful badass tragic villains I've ever seen.

Unfortunately, the Sephiroth in present tense FFVII is a poor man's idea of a villain. He gives no reason for his actions other than giving nonsensical riddles, telling us we don't understand, and saying that it is his right. All signs of an incredible villain were not expanded on in the present tense of the game. So the villain I was expecting turned out to be a cliche villain who wanted to be God for no other given reason other than he felt that only he should become God.

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Originally posted by Legolas63
He wasn't human (As in, he didn't have human feelings) but imagine, who would you be more scared of?

1) A cold, heatless monster who doesn't care about ANYTHING, with no feeling could slaughter millions for his own purpose?

2) A guy who wants to get back at a dude who siad he was inferiotr. Finds out truth (That he was created and is going to die ) and flips, destroying a world and then wants to destroy the whole universe.

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This is a moot point. Because while any normal person would be afraid of Sephiroth, Kuja would have someone run and stab you in the back. Before Kuja tranced, he was a manipulator. He had everyone do his dirty work so he didn't have to do anything.

Think about it, Kuja manipulated Brahne to the point where Brahne extracted eidolons out of her surrogate daughter, Garnet, used those Eidolons and the Black Mages Kuja provided to defeat Lindblum, Burmecia, and decimate Cleyra. And when Brahne challenged Kuja, Kuja stole control of Bahamut from her, and killed her with him. And after that, Kuja used Bahamut to nearly level Alexandria until the Eidolon Alexander and later, Garland, Were able to put a stop to it.

My point is, Kuja was as deadly as Sephiroth was, but Kuja just went about it differently. Its about point of view. Would you rather display your power and give your enemy an idea of what you can do, or would you rather manipulate things to the point where your enemy has no idea how strong you really are.

And Kuja has no problem in throwing lives away left and right to accomplish what he wants. In fact, that is one of the two huge ironies surrounding Kuja and the Black Mages.

WOW!! Very good pionts you got American Badass. Never thought of it really. I like both Kuja and Sephiroth. They both make great bad guys not to mention good looking to.

I like the game cause it had cute parts in it. But I kindof got bord with it. Took forever to finish it. But every now and then I play it just to see the cute parts and *cough* Kuja *cough*. I have a cold. :riiight:

American Badass:

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Ok, firstly, Zidane was a member of Tantalus, and therefore, he worked for Baku. In the Evil Forest, Zidane basically left Tantalus and no longer worked for Baku.

While in Tantalus, he was following Baku's orders which came directly from Cid who asked Baku for help in getting Garnet to Lindblum because the two of them go "way back" according to Cid, himself. So whether or not Zidane knew about Cid is rather moot. However, Zidane's attitude towards Steiner, and the fact that Zidane mentions never meeting Cid supports the idea that Zidane did not, in fact, have any knowledge that Cid was behind the whole thing.

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I know he USED to work for Baku. However he didn't when he was being needlessly difficult with Steiner.

It's hardly moot. He was just following orders. So in real life do you forgive people who kidnap teenagers just because they were told to do so? If he didn't know the real reason for doing so then he has no justification.

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Sephiroth is deep before he falls into the lifestream. After that event, any reasons he had before that justified what he was doing seemingly vanished. In other words, the past tense Sephiroth was a misguided villain and formed conclusions based off of inaccurate findings. The present tense Sephiroth wants to become God because he thinks its his right. Two very different ways of thinking there, and no bridge between the two.

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Hence why I believe FFVII (SPOILER) Jenova took control over Sephiroth when he went insane, and is in charge of almost everything he does from then on. There's more to it but that's not for here. Though a later quote of your's on Kuja goes someway:

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Its about point of view. Would you rather display your power and give your enemy an idea of what you can do, or would you rather manipulate things to the point where your enemy has no idea how strong you really are.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
I know he USED to work for Baku. However he didn't when he was being needlessly difficult with Steiner.

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Zidane was being as difficult for Steiner just as much as Steiner was being difficult with Zidane. Even after the princess was saved, Steiner was still as curt with Zidane as he was when he first met. And after Blank essentially sacraficed himself in the Evil Forest, the same Blank who made medicine to cure Steiner which ended up saving his life, Steiner didn't show an ounce of remorse for him, nor did he show any pity towards Zidane...two men who helped him.

This shows Steiner as quite the uncaring brute (at the time at least) even at the point where he could watch over Garnet. And lets face it, if Zidane wanted to rape Garnet, he wouldn't have asked Steiner to come with him for help in the Evil Forest.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
It's hardly moot. He was just following orders. So in real life do you forgive people who kidnap teenagers just because they were told to do so? If he didn't know the real reason for doing so then he has no justification.

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There is no evidence to support that Zidane had any knowledge of Regent Cid's involvement, just like that there is no evidence that supports that Zidane did know about Cid's involvement.

Since neither one of us can say for sure what Zidane did and did not know, the point is actually quite moot because at that point when Zidane was no longer a member of Tantalus, he was doing what Garnet asked of him. Why did he do it? Well, it did just so happen that it coincided with his last orders. Zidane also lived in Lindblum, so continuing with the plan of kidnap and doing what she asked also meant ending up going home. The Tantalus group was also based in Lindblum, so maybe Zidane thought he could go back to the group after he dropped the princess off. And last, but not least, maybe he thought he could get Garnet to fall in love with him.

And I'll throw out a moot point of my own. If you were attracted to a beautiful princess, wouldn't you try to get her to fall in love with you? And what if she was a regular girl? Would you still try?

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh Hence why I believe FFVII (SPOILER) Jenova took control over Sephiroth when he went insane, and is in charge of almost everything he does from then on. There's more to it but that's not for here.

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If that's what you believe, then how does that make Sephiroth a deep villain? If anything, it makes him a mere puppet because he doesn't do anything of his own free will. But you're right, this forum isn't the place for this discussion. If you want, I welcome a PM exchange to hear your views.

American Badass:

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Zidane was being as difficult for Steiner just as much as Steiner was being difficult with Zidane. Even after the princess was saved, Steiner was still as curt with Zidane as he was when he first met. And after Blank essentially sacraficed himself in the Evil Forest, the same Blank who made medicine to cure Steiner which ended up saving his life, Steiner didn't show an ounce of remorse for him, nor did he show any pity towards Zidane...two men who helped him.

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Steiner was being difficult with Zidane because he didn't trust him. It was also his job to be difficult as he worked for Brahne at the time, and helping teenage runaways escape wasn't in his job description. If someone had thought to explain what was going on it might have helped.
Steiner might have thanked them for helping him, had they not nearly gotten him and the Princess into the life threatening situation to begin with.

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This shows Steiner as quite the uncaring brute (at the time at least) even at the point where he could watch over Garnet. And lets face it, if Zidane wanted to rape Garnet, he wouldn't have asked Steiner to come with him for help in the Evil Forest.

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Why? Because rapists prefer to get themselves killed or let their victims die than ask for the help of heavily armed swordsmen?
I don't think Zidane had intended rape, I'd guess he was just in it for cash. But Steiner had no reason to think that.

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There is no evidence to support that Zidane had any knowledge of Regent Cid's involvement, just like that there is no evidence that supports that Zidane did know about Cid's involvement.

Since neither one of us can say for sure what Zidane did and did not know, the point is actually quite moot because at that point when Zidane was no longer a member of Tantalus, he was doing what Garnet asked of him. Why did he do it? Well, it did just so happen that it coincided with his last orders. Zidane also lived in Lindblum, so continuing with the plan of kidnap and doing what she asked also meant ending up going home. The Tantalus group was also based in Lindblum, so maybe Zidane thought he could go back to the group after he dropped the princess off. And last, but not least, maybe he thought he could get Garnet to fall in love with him.

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It's not moot because if he knew he was just being awkward by not telling Steiner, or at least giving some indication. If he did know on the other hand then that makes him just as bad as Steiner says he is.
I really doubt love came into it at that stage, not for someone like Zidane. He was after sex with a beautiful teenager, I really don't think it was more than that.

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If that's what you believe, then how does that make Sephiroth a deep villain? If anything, it makes him a mere puppet because he doesn't do anything of his own free will. But you're right, this forum isn't the place for this discussion. If you want, I welcome a PM exchange to hear your views.

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I doesn't, it makes him a tragic character. It makes Jenova a good villain. There's a really big thread on that in the FFVII though, and it's way too deep for PMs or I would.

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
Vincent, there are a few errors in your arguement.

Quina isn't needed to marry Vivi, they can pass through anyway, and her being there to explore things hardly qualifies her as an addition.

Amarant being there to find out the meaning of forgiveness is fairly pointless if they don't explain why he didn't know it in the first place.

Sephiroth is HUGELY deep. If you believe some theories, he's deeper still.

Zidane's reasons for explaining to Steiner and not being rude were simple common sense. If he'd explained Steiner would have actually HELPED instead of trying to stop their progress. It would also be simple courtesy to someone who has no reason to think you aren't a raping, murdering thief.

He didn't work for Baku, and there's no evidence that he knew the kidnap had anything to do with Cid. He never mentions it, Tantalus never mention it, Dagger is the one who wanted to go to Lindblum, and she is the only person with Cid when it comes up.

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Yes I know quina didnt HAVE to marry vivi, but it was just fun to see. She had a purpose because she joins your party regaurdless wether you stop and get her in the swamps after Lindblum.
Amarant didnt know forgiveness. His actions showed it. He wanted to prove he was a warrior but he decided to follow Zidane to see why he was forgiving.
Sephiroth wasnt a deep charachter.... like said He was a psycho-freak who wanted to take over the world.
Maybe he didtn care what steiner thought because he didnt NEED to. He didtn need steiners help anyways. He had no reason to tell him. He was doing his job. So was steiner, I know, but garnet even ASKED him to go away.
Now, how do you prove Zidane didnt work for Baku? He was in the group which baku was the BOSS of!! Now as for him not knowing it was Cid's order, you dont have any proof that he DIDNT know. So there. And yes, Tantalus DID mention it. Zidane was with cid when he mentioned it was Cid himself who hired them to kidnapp Garnet. By the way, I wasnt arguing. I was stating facts.

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Yes I know quina didnt HAVE to marry vivi, but it was just fun to see. She had a purpose because she joins your party regaurdless wether you stop and get her in the swamps after Lindblum.

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So the reason Quina joins your party, is that Quina joins your party...?

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Amarant didnt know forgiveness. His actions showed it. He wanted to prove he was a warrior but he decided to follow Zidane to see why he was forgiving.

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He didn't know forgiveness, why? He wanted to know forgiveness, why? His entire purpose was unexplained so why put him in at all?

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Sephiroth wasnt a deep charachter.... like said He was a psycho-freak who wanted to take over the world.

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Zidane wasn't a good character, he was a monkey who wanted to have sex with Dagger. Let's try not to make statements that are completely unjustified from now on?

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Maybe he didtn care what steiner thought because he didnt NEED to. He didtn need steiners help anyways. He had no reason to tell him. He was doing his job. So was steiner, I know, but garnet even ASKED him to go away.
Now, how do you prove Zidane didnt work for Baku? He was in the group which baku was the BOSS of!! Now as for him not knowing it was Cid's order, you dont have any proof that he DIDNT know. So there. And yes, Tantalus DID mention it. Zidane was with cid when he mentioned it was Cid himself who hired them to kidnapp Garnet. By the way, I wasnt arguing. I was stating facts.

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He didn't NEED to, but so what? It doesn't justify not doing something just because you don't have to. Steiner would have been totally justified (for the setting) in killing Zidane in his sleep. In fact he would have been hailed in his hometown for doing so, and he probably knew that. He let him live, because he has honour.
Zidane DIDN'T work for Baku. He quit after the Theatre Ship crashed. The evidence that he didn't know is that he never mentions it, and it was Dagger who wanted to go to Lindblum. Zidane being in the room (which I didn't think he was) when Cid mentions it doesn't count as Tantalus mentioning it.

Hey, I'm back to fight the good fight IMO.

SEPHIROTH VS KUJA

SEPHIROTH- Cold, calculating killer. Menacing, even before you actually see him. Strong, emotionless warrior Wants to be a God.. But before that, he was cold, but had feelings.

KUJA-Bit of a women, affeminite. Liked killing without getting hands dirty. Stabbed guys in the back. Goes insane. Realises actions at his death.

So it's really a matter of principle. Do you like your villians evil, or mindly evil? Sephiroth wasn't a Pyscho freek, he was a mixed up individual but he knew hat he wanted. he was clear, and calculated, and aimed for that goal. AS WAS KUJA!!!
Sephiroth wanted to become God. Kuja wanted to prove how great he was. The problem here is that Sephiroth had the ultimate goal and Kuja wanted to prove he was better then his "brother", just to prove "daddy" wrong.
Sephiroth may have been cold, but he wanted to be the most powerful being in the universe
Kuja wanted to prove Garland wrong, so he got a fat person to slaughter people with his creations, just to prove that Zidane wasn't supirior.

Tell me, which one has got the insecurity complex?

QUINA

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So the reason Quina joins your party, is that Quina joins your party...?

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That's right! Finally someone has been listening to me!
There is no point fo a fat, ugly sitophiliac to join the party!

ZIDANE
He was weak (Character strength (As in Rambo is harder then Woody Allen) and personality)
Who wants to play as a horny teenager who wants to have sex with a hot princess(Who's also a teenager. He's got a tail, runs like a monkey and touches girl asses? Oh yeah, and he likes peeing with men watching him.

1 hand up? Put it down Gary Glittter.

ZIDANE VS STEINER
Steiner was doing his job in being nasty to Zidane (I don't think part of his job discription was letting hony monkeys kidnap princesses)
Zidane was just pissing him off. He,a badly armed theif, was pissing off a armoured knight, with loads of battle experiance and a big sword.That either means that
1)He's got a death wish
2)He's a T***

Zidane did quit after the ship crashed, but he needed to take one last visit to their hideout, thats why he went. To say goodbye. He quit cause he wanted to get laid and cause he wanted to see thw orld. To try and find his hometown. yes he didn't find it before, but hey why not try. plus he fancied Granet, and wanted to hang with her so he could get some action. Which leads on to the next section......

LOVE????
Did Garnet & Zidane actually love each other deeply, or was it just that she needed someone. Zidane might have fancied the pants off her, but did she? The only way to compare about the love is to compare love from previous FFs

Cloud 4 Tifa
True love!!! Why? Because they'd always like each other, even back then, then Aeries got in the way
:mad2: Then trout happens so love comes there way

Squall 4 Rinoa
Do I have to explain this one, or will you accept true love?

Tidus 4 yuna
Yet again, do i have to explain?

Garnet 4 Zidane
Not love, just infatuation at the begining. Zidane wants so booty and chases her around the world tying and chatting her up. Then she gives in when she thinks HES DEAD at the VERY END. Not true love, just an infautuation. In the sequel, she's fallen out of "love" with him cause he's too horny and his tail gets in the way. Plus, he's a cocky T***.

Discuss. (Oh yeah, i think some new people should join with the discussion, as to get fresh opinions.Not saying that the ones here are bad, but i want this treadf to be huge!)

First of all, I have played through FF8, thank you very much Legolas63.

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i throughly enjoyed FF8, and if you played it more then you'll agree.

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I have also played Numbers 1,2,4,7,8,10, so you can't say I'm a immature person. Anyway, enough with that, you are right about the love thing. Garnet and Zidane aren't really the love intrest of FFIX. All the other FFs have love intrests. However sometimes I think that Zidane just wants something, or one, to make him happy. Think about it, he is a lonely thief, with only a few friends. The poor guy needs a shoulder to cry on. That I guess is the real purpose of Garnet. I suppose that she doesn't really love him. She just sees him as a excuse to act not so serious as she should as a princess. Just like Tidus and Yuna, Tidus lets Yuna chill out and not be so tight with herself and emotions. Zidane releases the fun side of Garnet.

I like the love between Zidane and Garnet because it is more like a friendship and it develops slowly throughout the game rather than coming from nowhere like I felt Yuna and Tidus' relationship did in FFX in a way.

Stupid Moomba 88, what you say about Zidane releasing the fun side of Garnet is true, but I see this as part of why they made a good couple. Opposites attract and bring out the best in each other.

They were opposites at first, a thief and a princess but Zidane showed Garnet there was more to life and she sorta tamed him by the end I feel, he was less immature and more genuinely caring towards her. It's sorta like the whole Titanic thing, the typical poor guy loves the rich girl and brings her into his world.

I agree that at first Zidane saw Garnet as just another girl, it was obvious that he was always after girls and that's all he saw her as. But through the game they helped each other, and I felt that he grew to respect her, care about her and possibly love her.

And as for Garnet's feeling towards Zidane, she appreciated him showing her his world, when she (SPOILER)cuts her hair with his knife it shows how he has helped her to feel more free, and after that point do you notice how her portrait in the menu is smiling, which it wasn't before. He made her happier and helped her move on from the past.

Just because the love wasn't shoved in your face like FFVIII and FFX doesn't mean it wasn't there, imo.

Its NOT the wrost. It just not the one i play most of. Even though i an playing it now. :choc: I love the characters (mostly Zidane, Kuja, Blank (poor guy), Vivi (sweety), and Baku (AAACHOOO) :D .

Basically, one man's trash is another's treasure. What one may see as silly, another sees as genius. Quina. Some see him as childish and pointless. I loved him. Loved how he taught the other characters so much by just being himself. He was fun-loving and light-hearted. He enjoyed all the simple things that most of us overlook. Amarant. You say garbage, I say great. He's interesting, intriguing, and mysterious. He brought something we haven't seen, a character who didn't really like our other heroes. He thought he had something to prove. He thought he would show Zidane that being alone makes you stronger. But, throughout the game, he realizes that what makes you stronger is by being among companions. Learning from one another. Weapons were a bit different for once. No freaky big swords. No guns. Catclaws are great. Butterfly swords, love em. The air rackets, very creative. I was a happy camper with this game. CHEERS!

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Amarant. You say garbage, I say great. He's interesting, intriguing, and mysterious. He brought something we haven't seen, a character who didn't really like our other heroes.

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Squall, Yuffie, Shadow (maybe I forget). They had progression and explanations though instead of just being pointlessly awkward.

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He thought he had something to prove. He thought he would show Zidane that being alone makes you stronger. But, throughout the game, he realizes that what makes you stronger is by being among companions. Learning from one another.

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Seifer.

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Weapons were a bit different for once. No freaky big swords.

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Steiner.

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Catclaws are great.

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True, though used in FF1 for a start.

As for original weapons, Barret, Rinoa, Selphie, Quistis....

I'm back so hold on your horses.

WEAPONS
Right I must say this. Obscure weapons are not cool. If your'e gonna face a HUGE dragon, you do not carry:

FORKS
RACKETS
TINY LITTLE DAGGERS

No! You take a big Gun Or a big Sword! I no it's a fantasy but please! I would not take a Tennis Racket or a Dinner Fork to take out the creature that is 3X the size of me.Still, most summoners have that sort of weapon so I'll give THAT the benifit of the doubt. But no, I can't stand forks. They are stupid, they are dumb and guess what,not clever. But yes, CatClaws are cool,but sadly, they're on Amarant's hands:mad2:
And, there were big swords (STEINER) and you could sya that Zidane's weapon was just a double ended sword.

AMARANT
If I wanted mysterious, I'll read a Agatha Christie. I do not want a awkward red head who'd moody.

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He's interesting, intriguing, and mysterious. He brought something we haven't seen, a character who didn't really like our other heroes. He thought he had something to prove. He thought he would show Zidane that being alone makes you stronger. But, throughout the game, he realizes that what makes you stronger is by being among companions. Learning from one another.

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I think Seifer did that as well. In FF8. He thought he was the best, becoming [SPOILER]Edea's knight. Even through loss, he was so big-headed he thought he could still be the best. He thought he had something to prove to Squall. He even got rid of Fujinn & Rajinn because he was so bent on becoming the best he wanted to be alone. But, he finally realises that what makes you the strongest, is with friends. (As illistrated when he has fun with his FRIENDS at the end in Balamb fishing. He learned, he grew, and he became nice.
So Amarant wasn't original, he was just annoying. Who would want him in a group. he just hasn't got the grop ethic. WHY DID HE JOIN?

ENDING
I don't believe that the ending of FFIX was as happy as FFVIIIs. The point is, FFIX told the story as if finishing it, like it showed what happened to them, what good things happened to them. FFVIII didn't. It just showed the intial celebrations. Did everyone get what they wanted? Quistis didn't get what she wanted did she?
Plus, FFVIII's was SO much cooler then FFIX with all that FMV and the trendy Video camcording. Plus, the song was cool IMO. (Im gonna get killed)
Also, FF8's wasn't my favourite. FFX's is. Because itb brought me close to tears, (And still does)

EYES ON ME VS MELODIES OF LIFE
Right. As for the "compsed by the same guy" thing.
I like Rage Aginist The Machine. I don't like all their songs. I like them mostly, but some, I just don't lke. And i perfer some Albums over others. So thats why i like EYES ON ME better. i just perfer it. It's a beautiful song, with stirring vocals, and a nice tune. Howver, MELODIES is fine. Just not as good IMO.
Oh by the way, as for ending themes FFX's rocks.

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[SB]He didn't NEED to, but so what? It doesn't justify not doing something just because you don't have to. Steiner would have been totally justified (for the setting) in killing Zidane in his sleep. In fact he would have been hailed in his hometown for doing so, and he probably knew that. He let him live, because he has honour.
Zidane DIDN'T work for Baku. He quit after the Theatre Ship crashed. The evidence that he didn't know is that he never mentions it, and it was Dagger who wanted to go to Lindblum. Zidane being in the room (which I didn't think he was) when Cid mentions it doesn't count as Tantalus mentioning it.

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Zidane did work for Baku. Until Garnet was take by the 2nd boss in the game. Zidane was the only one who wanted to save him. But Baku would not let him. So Zidane left.

As for kidnapping that went out the window when Garnet wanted to go with Zidane.

What's [SB]?

Anyway I made it clear in that comment that I knew Zidane quit Tantalus, and therefore originally worked for Baku.

As for kidnapping just because Dagger wanted to leave doesn't mean it's right. If she hadn't wanted to they still would have done it.

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Anyway I made it clear in that comment that I knew Zidane quit Tantalus, and therefore originally worked for Baku.

As for kidnapping just because Dagger wanted to leave doesn't mean it's right. If she hadn't wanted to they still would have done it.

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Even if she did not Cid wanted to get her away form her mother. So Tantalus was going by Cid's orders. Zidane works for Tantalus until the point at whcih they will nto go save her but he will.

And Garnet's mother was not to worrierd about what happened to her.

Well, I thought I'd give this thread another chance, but now I realize that it hasn't changed any. It's still of bunch of egotistical numbnuts comparing one game to another and one like to another's like, both of which are complete bull. Seifer didn't like Squall cause Seifer was an enemy. not a party member. Sure, forks aren't original or cool, but what else would you give a gourmand. Even though I know your response will be that Quina was dumb and shouldn't have been in the game as you continue to bring up and re-use the exact same arguments over and over in a pointless and never-endin routine. So screw this thread, I'm NOT coming back.

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Originally posted by ShadyMilkman
Basically, one man's trash is another's treasure. What one may see as silly, another sees as genius. Quina. Some see him as childish and pointless. I loved him. Loved how he taught the other characters so much by just being himself. He was fun-loving and light-hearted. He enjoyed all the simple things that most of us overlook. Amarant. You say garbage, I say great. He's interesting, intriguing, and mysterious. He brought something we haven't seen, a character who didn't really like our other heroes. He thought he had something to prove. He thought he would show Zidane that being alone makes you stronger. But, throughout the game, he realizes that what makes you stronger is by being among companions. Learning from one another. Weapons were a bit different for once. No freaky big swords. No guns. Catclaws are great. Butterfly swords, love em. The air rackets, very creative. I was a happy camper with this game. CHEERS!

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:) You have a great veiw of this game, I like that. You dont diss it. Like most people does. Which I hope you dont think I am dissing it. :( Cause I love the characters like I said. :love: :love: :love: But it has sad parts in it I dont like. :cry: Like at the part I am now Lindblum in ruins. Sooo sad. But I DO like the game. And Zidane, Kuja, and I forgot about the weapons until I played it and you mentioned it. Which it is cool as well. (Me and my blond moments)

Kuja124

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Even if she did not Cid wanted to get her away form her mother. So Tantalus was going by Cid's orders. Zidane works for Tantalus until the point at whcih they will nto go save her but he will.

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Which is something I've been pointing out is irrelevant for quite some time now.

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And Garnet's mother was not to worrierd about what happened to her.

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Yes the family not caring, that makes the kidnappers innocent doesn't it? Brahne's actions are explained later anyway I believe.

Nice of ShadyMilkman to come in and flame everyone before deciding not to return. Long as we know he's thinking of us :).

I do not know how you cannot like ff9. I personally find it one of the best final fantasy games. I love it's storyline and the graphics on the FMV where they do not try too hard to make the people look ralistic but to make them look...well, Japenesy. I think this is a cool effect and it makes me far more interested in the game.
I think the gameplay is perfect. Not too hard but not too easy. It has long gameplay durability due too chocobo side quests and card games. I think if you should be cursing any final Fantasy game it should be VIII as it hasa crappy storyline and hard not too mention confusing ways of training. For instance, drawing magic?! I much prefer the simple ways of life with equipping weapons and growing levels. I'd much rather a great story line and easy game than a crappy storyline with an annoyingly frustrating game where the story line does not seem to go any where. Also I like the games where it does not seem to happen in real life. When life was not all guns and blasting each others heads of but a game with magical beings and summons. Surely if the game is too hard you would not want to play on it any more becuse you are stuck and bored. That is how i feel about 8 however in 9 it has an everchaning twisting storyline rather than blowing on guy to bits with a sword that shoots bullets. (i never knew how that would work.) But here in the U.K. we like things different and unusually. You are the weakest link goodbye!

Funny, me being in the U.K. and I think VIII is better than IX in almost if not every aspect.

The game isn't hard if you know what you're doing. It just rewards good players instead of ones who equip the new weapon handed to them then wandered around for hours levelling.
Drawing isn't a neccessity by any means, another benefit given there are many, many ways to play VIII.
The game feels a lot more free because you don't get channelled everywhere, and get given weapons when and where you're told.....

I could go on for a LONG time methinks, but this isn't the place for comparisons.

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But here in the U.K. we like things different and unusually. You are the weakest link goodbye!

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That's weird, I live in the UK, and still think that FFVIII is a better game than IX. Must be something in the water..

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as you continue to bring up and re-use the exact same arguments over and over in a pointless and never-endin routine. So screw this thread, I'm NOT coming back.

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Ok, you want me to be different, to find new subjects to discuss? Oh, if i'm using the same arguements, thats because I have the same OPINION as i did before. So lets see.....I've discussed.....

ITS TOO EASY
CHARACTERS
MAGIC SYSTEM
MINI GAMES
GARNET 4 ZIDANE?
STYLE
KUJA
BATTLE SYSTEM
TRANCE
ZIDANE VS SQUALL VS CLOUD VS TIDUS
MUSIC
INDIVIDUAL CHARACTERS
CHOCOBO HOT & COLD
CARD GAME
TERRA
ZIDANE'S STRENGTH
GRAPHICS
SUMMONS
CARTOONY
IFRIT
STORY
ZIDANE KIDAPPING
ZIDANE VS STEINER
OZMA VS WEAPONS
QUINA
AMARANT
GARNET
VIVI
WEAPONS
(AND MORE, BUT IM BORED)

Now thats a lot, and people have expressed their opinion on ALL of them. So maybe, thats why they all seem the same, they all blend into one. So chill out, maybe you should just understand, I hate Quina with a passion. But here I go, I'll try to raise some new points, IF THAT MAKES YOU FEEL BETTER ok?

MAGIC
Right, I di not like the Magic on this game. Splitting it to different characters meant that you HAD have some people on your battle team, which made no sense. I know that they've split everthing into White, Black,Blue since the beginnig, but the problem is, is that they've restricted you to playing with certain characters. Surely, giving you individul characters is so you can build your own battle stratagy, but the game doesn't wan you do that. it want you to have ZIDANE, a curer, a fighter and VIVI. Pretty restrictive.

On the magic itself, it looks unappealing, but that's because of the different style. SO I CANT COMPLAIN ABOUT IT (People cheer in background)

PLACES
About the actual places themselves, what did you lik about them. Some places, felt fantastic to run around in, wheras some,:mad2: were boring, restrictive and not places. I no that sometimes, it's meant to feel restictive, but when I'm exploring certain places, I shouldn't feel restricted by the game.
On the plus side, Burmecia, Alexandria and Lindblum feel fantasic, almost epic, in size, and you do feel your'e there.
Wheras Mandarin Sari, Treno don't feel big. I know Mardairin Sari is in ruins, but imagine if you could explore the wreckage, getting even more hints to the story later, like you could find Garnet's wrecked house or find wreckage from dead geonomes that fourght there, or bits of the Invincible. Basically, make it feel more lke a wrecked sity of the summoners, rather then just a wreck.
And I know that TERRA was a wreck, but you could have flown around it in the Hilda Garde 3 (If they didn't jump in, and instead flew in of corse) It would have been interesting, seeing the tombs of the real Terrans. Surely, there must have been places other than Branbal and Padimonium to visit. It would have built up to where Zidane finds out the truth, with all the stange things he remembers in this world.

WORLD MAP
Didn't look better the FFVIII's world map really IMO.
And blocking places off (Near the end)meant the game channeled you into facing Kuja. FFVII didn't but then again FFVIII did. And I hated it then as well.

FFVIII VS FFIX
Basically FFVIII is a revolution in FF. Different in SO many places. You either despise it for trying something new or you love it for daring to be different. However, I must point out, FF6 was a slight revolution in FFs when it came out, and that been called the best Square game by FF Online.
FFIX is a step-back, a homage to previous FFs, it is similar to most FFs. You could love it for being a send-off to your'e fabvourite FFs in the past and a final look back before the revolution, or you could hate it for being a easy, look back to games, while not being a good FF in it's own right, and looking at it as simply a self-loving endulgence by the Square team, desperate to round things off with a tidy profit and a reminder that they did make medievil style FFs long ago.
I don't like FFIX and I love FFVIII.

"YOU CAN'T FOOL, THE CHILDREN OF THE REVOLUTION"
I think that line sums up FFIX vs FFVIII, don't you?

QUIRKY
I have no problem with quirky (Which FFIX was in places), in fact I welcome it at times. Most FFs have had something quirky in them, which makes me feel like I have a load of weight on my shoulders. That's uncomfortable, and I don't like that.
FFVII's Cloud had toDress like a women to sneak inro a Horny guy's mansion
FFVIII had a transexual in a bar in Dollet. NOW THATS FUNNY
FFIX had LOADS of quirky bits. And I must admit, slagging off the different weapons was a bit childish. I just don't like Quina.

SUPER FURRY ANIMALS
What did you lot think of the monsters, the normal weapon fodder you find while walking around. (Oh by thje way, I thought there was far too many RANDOM BATTLES)

UNEXPLAINED EVENTS
When was Alexander (The summon) explained before it actually happening? Did anyone actually know that there was a summon in the castle.

When was Necron explained?

When did Garnet and Eiko suddenly get earings to summon Alexander? Is this sugesting that Alexandria was connected to the village of the summoners some how?

Couldn't the game givin hint that Mog was a summon, like "Then the banished Summon was trapped in the body of a creature, until needed by the summoner once more" you could have read it in Madarin Sari or Alexandria but NOOOOOOOOO. That would be too hard. They'e was NO reason why he was a moogle in disguise.

And what the hell did Kuja mean when he said about Zorn & Thorn not being Twins?
(Thanks for the answer Vincent06. That makes sense, and also, is a really cool explanation)


And now, I bring up some previous points (WHY? Because I can)

KUJA VS SEPHIROTH
Right, if Sephiroth was indeed beingcontrolled by Jenova (Which I believe he was), and that made him a midless puppet, where he wouldn't actually be controlling himself, that would make him even more scary. Because, have you ever seen monsters in other games like Resident Evil or Silent Hill? Because they arn't human, arn't in control of their actions is scary, and rather frightening because there is NO WAY TO STOP IT other then killing it before it kills you. Sephiroth would have kept going and going until his purpose was over.
Ok? Now if Kuja was indeeda backstabbing Geonome., then that would make him have a human thoughts and control. He could be stopped, because he has doubt in the back of his mind. Only when he goes Trance does he go off the rails. But still he has doubt, its just clouded by rage, which is also a good explanation for his hair, for people going red is a sign of rage.
So thats why Sephiroth makes a better villian, because he doesn't feel, he doesn't feel the pain you deliver him. He's like a Tyrant in Resi Evil, you kepp shooting, but he just won't stop..damn it, stop you mutha.....ARGGHGHH.
But Kuja can be stopped, by himself. And thats less villain like. Although, he does make a good TRAGIC VILLIAN

WEAPONS
I don't like the strange weapons, but that's connected with the medievil style, which I did like, so it's a bit difficult to argue here.
I just liked the Guns & Swords. Oh, and gun blades. Squall didn't actually fire them like a normal gun, like point and shoot. he fired thenm when then blade entered the skin, and he THEN delivered the bullet. The bullet would be already in the skin, and would require less pulpulsion to gvet a hit. The system works rather like a tranquiliser bullet, where it uses the force of the shot to send the drug into the body, wheras in this circumstances, it's sending a bullet into the body, using the force of the sword slash.
BUT HEY! it's a Fantasy, and somethings, just don't need explanation.




CALM LIKE A BOMB

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Nice of ShadyMilkman to come in and flame everyone before deciding not to return. Long as we know he's thinking of us

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Too true, but hey, it could have been worse. he could have stayed and flammed us. I think he just didn't like people telling him that we didn't like FFIX, but hey wer'e only expressing our opinion

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Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
So the reason Quina joins your party, is that Quina joins your party...?



He didn't know forgiveness, why? He wanted to know forgiveness, why? His entire purpose was unexplained so why put him in at all?



Zidane wasn't a good character, he was a monkey who wanted to have sex with Dagger. Let's try not to make statements that are completely unjustified from now on?



He didn't NEED to, but so what? It doesn't justify not doing something just because you don't have to. Steiner would have been totally justified (for the setting) in killing Zidane in his sleep. In fact he would have been hailed in his hometown for doing so, and he probably knew that. He let him live, because he has honour.
Zidane DIDN'T work for Baku. He quit after the Theatre Ship crashed. The evidence that he didn't know is that he never mentions it, and it was Dagger who wanted to go to Lindblum. Zidane being in the room (which I didn't think he was) when Cid mentions it doesn't count as Tantalus mentioning it.

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Its becoming rediculous. Quan sends Quina wiht you becuase he wants her to travel the world and eat all sorts of food. Quina DID have a purpose, because she found Gargant Roo by smelling the frogs over by it. She *GASP* DOES HAVE A PURPOSE!! Now for amarant. He wanted to know forgiveness. He's an asassin who grew up wihtout friends. When he sees Zidane being kind to him, he is compelled to see why because something moves inside his heart. He wonders why Zidane, being a theif, didnt finish him off. Zidane WAS a good charachter. He went along to protect dagger. Sure maybe he wanted to do it at first, but later on he forogot about his own needs and went along with Dagger to help her. I could say Squall was a bad charachter because he was a pissed-off butt wipe with a bad attitude. You say he's good. Why? Lets not make unjustified statements from now on shall we? Zidane and Steiner were both justifyable. Zidane had no reason to explain anything to steiner. He, AT THE CURRENT TIME, worked for Baku. He kidnapped Garnet while he worked for baku! Baku told him to! Baku got orders FROM CID to kidnapp her. Steiner could have cut zidane to peices if he felt it good, because he had reaosn. Dagger, however, told him to get the heck away and he didn't listen. She could have him beheaded for disobeying a royal order. The fact that nobody was in the room when Cid talked about hiring Tantalaus proves in NO way that they didtn know about it.


About Zorn and Thorn not being twins- they were really one creature, Meltigemeni. They were like a hydra with two heads. Imagine the different hydra heads coming apart and forming different snakes, and then coming back togather to form the hydra (aka meltigemeni)

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Which is something I've been pointing out is irrelevant for quite some time now.

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Why is it irrelevant?

To Legolas 63
My water does taste a bit funny..............

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Originally posted by Kuja124
Why is it irrelevant?

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It's not irrelevant. People are just biased against Quina who is one of the most original charachters in FF history.

http://www.eyesonff.com/forums/showt...threadid=36782

That thread's fresher, and on the same thing :p