ff12 says goodbye to random battles

so what do u ppl think of the end of random fighting?

i have my reservations. i hated this aspect of say grandia, and the old zelda games. but if any one can make it good its square-enix.

i know most hate random encounters. but to be honest in the last few outings they havent been that annoying. its in ff1 and ff2 that they drove me insane on.

it would be really cool though if u were running through a forest and suddenly a giant behemoth or even omega weapon jumped out the trees and started chasing u :D

I think its a pretty bad idea. Without random battles the game becomes predicitable. And are you implying is that you'd like to be able to see enemies on screen? Would there be an infinite amount (meaning i can train :D) or will these be limited, making the game a little less fun to play? I'd hate to think that you could kill everything in an area and be done with it. Why not just use items to block random battles (enc-none!) I think they should stay- its good the way it is.

well a link from this sites news page said you would see monsters on screen and could run to avoid them. i suspect they would either infinitally re spawn or all spawn back everytime u enter or leave an area.

but yeah i dont want it too but then again i hated the idea of ffX ctb combat..until i played it.then i loved it.

I guess we can't know if it's good or bad before we have played the game.
But i think it's a bad idea :( ... however i have played a game with that kind of encounters (super mario rpg) and in that game it worked pretty well. :)

Chrono Trigger & Cross don't suffer from having the enamies on screen. So I can't see it being a problem in an FF game. I'm sure the monstors will just come back when you leave an area. Again like they do in CT/CC.

It'll be interesting to see how well this all plays out on a serious 3D RPG.

First feeling: I don't like the idea.

Hopefully my opinion will change after playing the game. Hopefully.

AH! no! never get rid of idea that works so well!

didnt they do this on ragnorak in ff8?

If they are going to do it the monsters should stay dead throughout the entire visit, then respawn when you leave to the worldmap. That way you can train. Otherwise they just get annoing having to dodge them all the time when you meet a dead end even if you kill them (Xenosaga)

CT/CC are both excellent games without the randomness. So if it's done similar to those it shouldn't be a problem.

With so many comments about this being an offline "online-estique" game, I wouldn't be surprised if there wasn't a world map and it was like FFXI, with all the different areas.

From what I read at PA it's supposed to be in real time, with your other party members being controled by the cpu, and certain behavious you set for them, like .hack, or tales of phantasia.
Seems kind of weird, but I didn't much mind the different battles in X and X-2, so I'll definitly check it out, hopefully it won't be too hard.

well, FFXI got rid of random battles, and is anyone complainiing?

a step away from the traditional formula...ffx-2 is an example....i guess i wouldnt like it at first but i reckon ill end up liking it....i havent played it so i cant really judge....

i do worry for ffXII. but then again i worryed for ffX and i love that.

but i say again, it had better get away from the ffX-2 trend. if it doesnt then in my eyes this could be the death of the seris.

I have always hated, HATED random encounters. Even in the new ones. That's one of the (legion of) reasons I think Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross are so great, they lack random encounters. I think this is a great step in the right direction. The only thing I can see me not really liking is that the CPU will control most of the party members. But even that shouldn't be too bad as long as they throw in the option to change the AI settings on the CPU, like in Secret of Mana.

Makes you wonder if they'll allow for a 2/3/4-player fully 3D FF in the future. Sort of like a full-scale FF done with the added FFCC multiplayer function. I could see it happening.

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Originally Posted by Loony BoB

Makes you wonder if they'll allow for a 2/3/4-player fully 3D FF in the future. Sort of like a full-scale FF done with the added FFCC multiplayer function. I could see it happening.

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Not only could I say it happening, I look forward to it.

Wooohooooo! :D

Sorry but random battles were tedious and annoying, and usually you were faced with loads of them when all you wanted to do was advance the story a little. They only serve two purposes in my opinion:

a. To level up
Well, it's perfectly possible to level up with non-random battles. Chrono Trigger did it wonderfully.

b. To pad out the game
As for this, if it's a deep enough story - and with enough sidequests, then it won't need padding out.

On that last note, sidequests work great for lengthening a story and providing more depth, whilst still allowing the player to blast through and see it first. As long as you're given an incentive to do the sidequests on a second play (FFX-2 demonstrated this perfectly, and was one of its biggest strengths IMO)

I hope it works like CT and other games in that you still have battle music.. FF wouldn't be the same without battle music! The traditional victory fanfare too... I really missed that in X-2 (well not really, but it didn't seem completely right)

As long as it doesnt cost me $130....FFXI...

actually ffx-2 did have the traditional end after each fight...just a very twisted 1. it is there.

and i never had a problem with ff6-10 random encounters. they wernt any where near as annoying as ff1 and ff2.

I relly LOVED the random battles in FF4-10! The battles in FF1 and 2 could at some times be annoying.
But you never know... maybe the new encounters will be great.

Enemies appearing on the screen still worked well with Chrono Trigger, Seiken Densetsu 3 and Kingdom Hearts, so I don't think the lack of random encounters is that bad an idea. Even if the enemies appear in every screen, you can still make those battles more unpredictable and somewhat randomized by making a few different formations that can appear in a location. For example, in SD3's Rabite Forest, sometimes there are rabites in the screen, but if you re-enter the screen, there might be myconids there instead.

Taking the FF series in a different direction is risky, but I think it's a good idea to experiment. Random encounters are almost always annoying for me, and I like the fact that they took them out. I like being able to see the enemies and be able to try and avoid them if I'm tired of fighting or I'm too weak to do so.

It's going to be like KH, except that the enemies will be on screen. I'm assuming that there will be different enemies every time you visit that place. I honestly don't understand what's not to like. Square made the transition from turn-based battle to real-time battle. You know that Square-Enix will pull it off. They always do... With an exception to FFX, that is. Me? I can't wait to see what the super-boss(Omega Weapon, Ozma, etc.) is like.

As for the X-2 victory theme, I didn't hear it? I know it has one, but it's the cheerful:
dooo-da dooooooooo diddly-diddly da-doo!
rather than the traditional:
da-da-da-da.. deee-da.. dum-da-dum
that we all know and love.

Am I getting too technical? :D

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Originally Posted by SomethingBig

It's going to be like KH, except that the enemies will be on screen.

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The enemies in KH are on the screen. You can see them before the battle and go around them, and when you fight them, you won't enter a different battle screen.

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Originally Posted by Cloudane

As for the X-2 victory theme, I didn't hear it? I know it has one, but it's the cheerful:
dooo-da dooooooooo diddly-diddly da-doo!
rather than the traditional:
da-da-da-da.. deee-da.. dum-da-dum
that we all know and love.

Am I getting too technical? :D

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true its not exactly the same but it has a very similar structure, its almost like a really changed remix.

i dont mind at all this style of random encounter i,ve decided...but they had BETTER not use that crap atb systerm from ffx-2. that had better be a 1 off.

About time. I am sick of random battles. At least in FF. I am glad the series is taking a drastic change. After playing the FF series for years (been a fan since the first), I am glad we are finaly seeing REAL changes. Sorry to the people who jumped on board with VII or VIII.

what u mean is real changes that affect u. i "jumped on board" at ff7 and have played all but ff5 and there has always been real changes here and there with the odd ff not changing much.

ff1-ff3 were more or less the same, the only change being a horrible ff2 lv systerm and adding of cid, chocobos,etc, not real changes.

then ff4 added character development, the biggest change ever. then ff5 i hear had the prefect game play.

ok ff6 didnt change much, despite kicking ass. ff7 went 3d. ff8 changed lv systerm of monsters and started the silly sub game trend. ff9 , ok old school ff1 rehash. but ffx added ctb, no world map, 99999 hp, sphere grid...etc

these r huge changes, 2 me no world map would be a far greater change then no random encounter and ff12 had better have a proper world map.

All FF's are alredy different. I don't want them change into a new sort of game. Like FF CC or FF XI.

"ff12 had better have a proper world map." - Aeries

HERE HERE!

Tastey Pie's must have list for good RPGs

Tastey Qualifications

A.world map (Walkable, drivable)
B.Visitable towns with (talkitive people, secret items, activatable events)
C.Shops with (weapons, armor, items)
D.Some good whoop arse (Turn based or active single person)

Tastey Rating
(Ratings only show how much I will like it)

1. eh....
2. ok
3. Good!
4. SWEET!

What pies rating system is before he buys a game .. (Examples)
Game has A,B,C and D therefore it has 4 qualifications and is *4.Sweet!*
Game has Cand D therefore it has 2 qualifications and is *2.ok*
Game has C therefore it has 1 qualification and isn't verry good at all, so i shrug it off with an *1.eh....*

KH had
A,B and D (3 Good!)

ff8 had
A,B and D (3 Good!)

ffx had
B (1 eh..)

ffx-2 had
B (1 eh..)

Chaos Legion had
D (1 eh..)

Seven Samari had
B and D (2 ok)

FF1 had
A,B,C and D (4 SWEET!)

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Originally Posted by TasteyPies

1.(Walkable, drivable) world map
2.Visitable towns with (talkitive people, secret items, activatable events)
3.Shops with (weapons, armor, items)
4.(Turn based or active single person) battle system

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ditto. I'm up for the no random battles but to be honest, i don't care. Square-Enix has a way of making their changes good, just in a different perspective.

*tasty pies confusion is so potent even with a ribbon i,m dizzyuing, trying to understand his post* lol :)

Ha ha ha, i eddited it about 10 times to make it more understandable...whew...

It's totally fine with me. For years I've heard people complaining about the random battles, and now Square-Enix finally says goodbye to them... It doesn't make such big og a difference if there're random battles or not... They had to change something to keep the tradition anyway.

What I don't like though is that the cpu are controlling some of your party members. I like to be in full control of my characters, but on the other hand I'm sure that Squre-Enix will pull it off with great style.

I'm indifferent to this 'demise'. Since I'm more used to see the enemies before a battle (well... I've played my fair share of Infinity-powered games, see, where the battles don't take place in a separate screen), I feel pretty much at home with this. Random encounters... can disturb me. Not all that much, but they take up time I'd rather use for something else.
Let's all pray for subquests netting you XP. :D

what are you talking about FFX-2 has a completely different winning song.... mainly because Nobuo Uematsu didnt do any of the music...

Random battles are a pain sometimes, and hellishly unrealistic.

I mean, your characters are walking through a narrow, cramped cave or an empty alleyway, then BAM!, there's suddenly a whopping great dragon or even a house trying to kill you. Even the smallest rooms can hold an unlimited number of random enormous monsters, it's a little bit of a stretch on the 'suspension of disbelief' deal.

It's fantasy. ^^

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Originally Posted by Big D

Random battles are a pain sometimes, and hellishly unrealistic.

I mean, your characters are walking through a narrow, cramped cave or an empty alleyway, then BAM!, there's suddenly a whopping great dragon or even a house trying to kill you. Even the smallest rooms can hold an unlimited number of random enormous monsters, it's a little bit of a stretch on the 'suspension of disbelief' deal.

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You have no idea how much I would love to have a non-random battle with a few houses. :D "Look out! There's a house!" *hacks at the house with sword*

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It's fantasy

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That's no excuse. A good fantasy story has to follow its own rules. Either the monsters are invisible, or they're visible. Why would they just materialise out of thin air, and in regular intervals, no matter which way you are moving? How can they respawn without limit? Why do they all want to eat me? Are all animals in the FF world man-eating predators?

You can always recognise a good RPG by its lack of invisible random enemies. In Dragon Warrior, Chrono Trigger or Earthbound, monsters are visible, and die when you kill them. They don't re-materialise in a couple of seconds while you're still in the same room. In the 7th Saga, you have a radar where you can see the monsters move.

I won't miss invisible random enemies.

I have the same aspect as Aeris...the random encounters were fine in 7-10-2, but in 1 and 2 they were annoying, mainly cuz there was preset fighting tiles ONTOP of random encounters...and i think it would be cool to get chased by something, a somewhat similar perspective to Chrino Trigger for SNES...i think

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Originally Posted by Grover

what are you talking about FFX-2 has a completely different winning song.... mainly because Nobuo Uematsu didnt do any of the music...

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i never said it was like the others. but its not completly diff. they share the same structure. i can definitly hear the old theme song within it, like i said, a very twisted remix, in the same way penenance from ffX is a twisted Alexander.

Hey folks. I don't post here much, but I thought I would put in my two cents about the new battle system. From what I gather, the battles and the way you encounter enemies will be similar to that of Vagrant Story, in the sense that it is fairly real time and that there are no random encounter. But if you want a taste of the actual battle mechanics, pick up Summoner for the PS2. You will see what they mean by real time, no random encounters, AI controlls for your party and the ability to switch between controlling party memebers.

I wasn't too keen on the Summoner style of battles. I'd much rather encounter visible enemies (as opposed to random) but still be thrown into a turn-based battle screen as before where you can actually use your brain and think about the strategy without being rushed into hack-and-slash stuff. I think Chrono Trigger worked something like this.

Even better would be true turn-based non-ATB like I seem to recall FFX was (with the list showing whose turn it is next)

Its reasons like this which will make FFXII the best FF ever(I have been saying this for 2 years now).

Yay. I wanna game like Crystal Chronical except for playstation.

if its not random how does the battle system go?

Random battle suck and take away from the game. I used encounter none so much in previous FF it wasn't funny. FFXI has best idea, you see the monster and know whats up. Monsters just appearing was lame anyway.

I am glad if its going away. I like how FFXI did its full map view: first and third person and be happy to see it in FFXII.

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Originally Posted by Cloudane

I wasn't too keen on the Summoner style of battles. I'd much rather encounter visible enemies (as opposed to random) but still be thrown into a turn-based battle screen as before where you can actually use your brain and think about the strategy without being rushed into hack-and-slash stuff. I think Chrono Trigger worked something like this.

Even better would be true turn-based non-ATB like I seem to recall FFX was (with the list showing whose turn it is next)

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Active battles like in Chrono Trigger, Seiken Densetsu 3, Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy X-2 would be what I'd prefer, where your characters move around the battlefield and can use the position of themselves and their allies to their advantage. I'd also want the Geomancer class or some other ability/feature that lets you take advantage of the terrain in battles. I wouldn't like FFX-style system, though. That was slow, boring and stupid, and it was a big step backwards from the ATB system.

i loved the ffX ctb and while i,d prefer the original atb, i would gladly take ctb over this ffX-2 STYLE crap. i want to play final fantasty, not grandia...

Lunar SSSC, the second-best RPG ever made, has visible enemies that you can avoid. So yeah, I won't miss it, if it's done well.

I don't hate random battles, though. I think people that do are very narrow-minded. You get the same end-result, basically.

If it's going to be non random, I hope they can have the characters be able to "jump". This way you can dodge battles easier. One thing I didn't like some RPGs is the fact that you and the enemies stand in place waiting for your turn to attack. I'd say something along the lines of Parasite Eve, where you can move around to dodge attacks during a battle.

Well, as for me, I liked the random battles in the ff series and will be sad to see it leave. Random battles, being taken away is a big step away from the final fantasy we already know. The battles being random kept you on your feet, making sure you were always prepared. "Do I have enough hi-potions, will i make it back to the airship, I hope I don't run into a t-rex." I liked asking myself these questions. It kept me on my toes during the whole sereis. But who knows Kh was way fun. So in the end I think we should give "random battles" a moment of silence. Ya'll can pick a time.

Are you saying its gonna be like Crono Cross and Saga Frontier, where you see the enemies before you run into them? As long as its still the good ol' FF turn-based combat when you're actually fighting I don't care.

And quite personally, I dig random battles(though at times they become very annoying). :D

I dunno, i guess i'm the only person who dislikes KH. I just passed the Alice in wonderland part and couldn't bring myself to board that lame gummi ship. I don't know whether it was the fact they were children, that my partners were incompetent buffoons who star in cartoons i don't like, or because the battles lacked any real strategy, and resolved more around me just beaning whatever came close to me with my key.

I like random battles. If you're in a sewer and a mind devouring mutant pops around the corner, he won't just sit there waiting for you to walk idly by, he's going to come over and eat your brain. Unexpected things should happen when you're saving the world, you can't plan everything out.

Removal of the world map was the worst idea ever. Talk about removing the aura of the towns. How cool would Thamasa have been were it not located on the edge of an island in the middle of no where? Also it makes the player feel less in control. Instead of going wherever you want, you can go where the game lets you.

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Originally Posted by Sephiroth1999AD

I wouldn't like FFX-style system, though. That was slow, boring and stupid, and it was a big step backwards from the ATB system.

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Amen. Monsters literally waited for you to make a move before they moved.

Star Ocean 3 is real-time and that looks damn amazing. KH was real-time and look how successful it's become.

>>> Random battles are annoying, Im glad they got rid of them.. about the battle system I hope its ctb like FFX, I never liked atb system..

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Originally Posted by SomethingBig

Amen. Monsters literally waited for you to make a move before they moved.

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I always thought of it more along the lines of time stoping so you could think about what you were going to do next. So imo the monsters didn't wait for you...the battle did.

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Originally Posted by aeris2001x2

i loved the ffX ctb and while i,d prefer the original atb, i would gladly take ctb over this ffX-2 STYLE crap. i want to play final fantasty, not grandia...

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Amen. :jap:
FFX2 style was pure chaos. I didn't even like the command menu.
Old ATB is the best but FFX CTB is still very good.

it worked for mystic quest it should work again

Yaaaaay.

Random battles drove me insane, whenever you take two steps something leaps out of nowhere and tries to kill you.

Guess that makes me one of the few then. I love random battles and believe it too be one of the few things that makes FF, FF.
Have to say i agree with the atb ctb thing
pre ffx atb = cool
ffx ctb = okay
ffx-2 atb = a real mess

I do like the random battles. I like leveling up, I like getting stronger, and learning abilities and stuff that way. *shrug*. As long as they make it cool (which they somehoe always do), then I'll be fine.


:D

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Originally Posted by disapointedchild

Well, as for me, I liked the random battles in the ff series and will be sad to see it leave. Random battles, being taken away is a big step away from the final fantasy we already know. The battles being random kept you on your feet, making sure you were always prepared.

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Originally Posted by jarsthegooner

Guess that makes me one of the few then. I love random battles and believe it too be one of the few things that makes FF, FF.

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Needless to say I concur that. Give me my FF with random battles! and atb! and limit breaks! and great story *remembers*! and all contrallable chars! I want FF, I don't want another CT (one is enough) or Vagrant story or Kingdom hearts *shakes and shudders*

i LOVED kh, but I didn't like that I couldn't control all of my characters. I have to be in completely control, or else I get freaked out. I know SE usually make good choices, but if theyr'e going to do this, I don't know...


:D

I like havin random encounters. I think they are one of the kool things about Final Fantasy. They can need lots of strategy and stuff like that.

I wish they kept random battles but allow you to "clear" an area after a set number of battles. then maybe give you a special item to attract monsters in the game. like a reverse "no-encounter" materia. i would like searching the dungeons for items with the level cleared.

Lufia 2 implemented this type of battle system very well.

Non-random battles worked in Chrono Trigger/Cross but I dunno- messing with random battles in FF? that's like dealing with The Devil.