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ok it was only purple dust in a condom that was chucked at tony blair in the house of commons but it so easily could have been a terroist chucking a deadly chemical dust that could have wiped out the entire uk government.
what do u think this says about how secure any world leader is including bush?
No world leader is really secure. It only takes a split second, one bullet. The main thing protecting world leaders is the fact that anyone who attacks one is likely to be instantly slaughtered by the tons of guards all the leaders keep around them. Running up and shooting the President for example is pretty much signing your own death certificate. I wonder what would've happened differently had someone thrown powder on the President, in this country. Likely would've been a bit bloodier I imagine.
The President came to Pittsburgh a few weeks ago, and they shut down the entire highway from the airport into town so that he could drive through. The President has his guards who are willing to take a bullet for him if necessary. They do go to great measures to protect the President. But still, some have been assassinated. Being a world leader is not a safe job.
It's a tough thing to judge really. As Unne said, there is no way to perfectly secure a leader, unless you drive around in the Pope-mobile.
As a leader, you will always be open to critics and have a lot of people who are against you. The problem is, it becomes very difficult to figure out who is voicing their opinion, and who is actually going to take matters into their own hands. Since we live in a free society, in the USA anyway, you can get relatively close to the President at many various events, which leaves plenty of space open for an assassination attempt.
Sadly, it's almost impossible to always be protected, but I generally feel that the security teams, at least in the USA, do a good enough job.
Take care all.
Well, we haven't had any big presidential assassination attempts in over twenty years, and we haven't had a successful one in over forty. I think our security is working pretty well. Either that, or there hasn't been a whole lot of lone gunmen on grassy knolls or psychopathic Jodie Foster stalkers lately.
Hey theres an idea, lets steal the popemobile, add rockets to it and send world leaders around the globe safely!
Ah....glad i thought of it
Technically, September 11 2001 and that nitwit in the Cessna who was after Clinton were both presidential assasination attempts. However, as you say, security, preparation and circumstance combined to protect the president's life in both cases.Quote:
Originally Posted by DocFrance
We've gotta take steps to protect our leaders, but that needs to be balanced against the risk of turning the powers-that-be into cloistered, unseen figures who just show up on TV now and then.
Quote:
Well, we haven't had any big presidential assassination attempts in over twenty years, and we haven't had a successful one in over forty.
Bush Sr. was almost assassinated and so was Ronald Reagen, Reagen got shot in 1981 there not big at all? Well I think there big attempts. I agree with Big D about sept 11 2001 to, that plane that crashed in Pennslyvania was supposed to hit the white house. I'd say every assassination attempt is big, then no assassination attempt.
When your a president or leader, there will always be people out there that would want to hate you, or even kill you. It must be a tough job, knowing that someone wants to kill you every day.
"It must be a tough job, knowing that someone wants to kill you every day."
In a wierd way, it comes with the title, in that in an election, there will be winners and losers, and the losers will often be upset with the winner no matter what. Bi-partisan politics are again a thing of the past.
Take care all.
Quote:
No world leader is really secure. It only takes a split second, one bullet. The main thing protecting world leaders is the fact that anyone who attacks one is likely to be instantly slaughtered by the tons of guards all the leaders keep around them.
do you think that's effective against an organization such as al queda who's main weapon is suicide?
I heard about that powder incident. Was it one of the U.K tabloids attempting to show how crap security is. The mirror got in to Buckingham Palace as a foot soldier didn't they. You'd think after last weeks fabricated photo fiasco the tabloids would stop showing up internationally laxes in security.
its was fathers for justice campaign or sumthin. tony blair and co should be thankful this security hole has been found and now they can fix it and stop some terroist getting in there with sarin, anthrax, suicide bombs etc.
Am I the only one who thought that the purple-flour-condom thing was really funny?
Gave me a silent chuckle :greenie:Quote:
Originally Posted by Skogs
recently security sheilds were foolishly installed in the houses of parliment.....not that they were any use. farthers for justice is about farthers being entitled to the same rights as mothers in seperations involving children. they throw purple baking powder to raise attention, that was all it was nothing.
our leaders know what they are getting themselves into when they become leaders...frankly both Bush and blair deserve it for all the innocents they have harmed through their eager war. if they die it wont be a loss, they will be replaced..thus is life
to be honest i hate bush and blair for what they,ve done, but while it would be cool to watch it on the news, i would never wish either of then to die, espically in something really horrid...like sarin gas :cry:
I hope nothing happens to the fathers. Dried purple paint isn't going to do any damage, so they don't deserve much in the way of punishment. It could be said that they've done Blair a favour.
I smiled when I saw the story. I doubt it would have been so higly publicised if it wasn't for all the paranoia over terrorist threats (a lot of it perpetuated by Blair).
I was listening to the Yankees- Angels baseball game last night and heard that two fans jumped onto the field before being tackled and escorted off. The two commentators waxed about how before 9/11, fans jumping on the field wasn't such a big deal, the fans would be helped off, but not so violently. Post 9/11, it's handled as a terrorist act, with police and security flying onto the field to catch them. Shows how very paranoid the world, America especially, has gotten indeed.
Take care all.
the news said the farthers wouldnt face jail time.....what i laughed at was how slowly all the politicians acted....no one even looked at blair and then everyone waddled outside as if nothing happend....that would have poisend everyone outside as well.
i really dont trust america anymore....not that i ever did....the thing is that those who tortured the iraque's in prison WERE normal americans, they ones you pass in the street. unfortunatly, for a country that carries guns on it's streets, this IS representive of America, and it's shameful
YOU ARE COMPLETELY RIGHT!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
In fact, did you know torture is considered a national sport in USA? They tie people to poles in the middle of the street and torture them, and people who like it, throw some coins. Running over people with cars is also considered something OK to do when you are in a hurry.
Then, why don't american tourists do that in other countries then? Well...THEY ARE EVIL CYBORG CLONES. And when you visit USA? Well, it's an EVIL ILLUSIONARY USA. It's all a big conspiracy.
Shadow Nexus knows our secret! He must be eliminated! Where's my big American SUV I can run him down with.
(You make me smile :) )
I saw this as sort of a prank to garner attention, I'll admit, but it did focus attention on both the activist group and upon security gaps. However, everyone knows a certain level of mass hatred comes with the occupation. I suppose our leaders are prepared to accept the fact that many many many people want them dead.
EDIT: Just to fully don the role of the headstrong, foolsih, bitchy American, I would like to point out that the INDIVIDUALS who carried out the acts in the Iraqi prison are NOT your "typical" Americans. Stop classifying me, and all other good Americans in the same category as the prison guards.
Don't look at me, I'm a conscious objector.
Take care all.
Oh, I'm used to being labelled. In fact, just yesterday, while walking around downtown Colorado Springs in uniform, someone called me a baby-killer! I feel so frustrated... but at the same time... proud?
you might be onto something there Shadow Nexus considering there are more killings in the texan state Bush used to govern in one month than there is in the whole of great briton for a year.....then again the USA shouts the right to carry firearms and shoot each other....they have the KKK, they have one of the most useless and censored mdeias in the world, they are if i remeber correctly the biggest polluter and consumer of fuel due to their obssesstion with SUV's and other large vehicles etc. if your gonna be sarcastic....do it with a bit more flare :)
well can you blame them for wanting bush and blair dead....they got cought with pie on their face tortureing innocents and they didnt say sorry nor have the culprits been punished.
i would like to think those prison gaurds were the exception.....but they werent, america does this every time they get into a war, these people who did do it were everyday americans, funny how the USA denys that fact when they arent heros, but if they are vice versa. the family and freinds of the first female officer to be cought in the photographs said how you couldnt get a more normal and decent person......yeah, theose pictures show how decent she was, normal people are capable of terrible things, worse than the baddest killers because they are not FIT to do those jobs.
proud of being labled a baby killer? in my mind those who knew, or witnessed these atrocities are just as guilty as the people who commited them...yes that includes any british warriors, but im not condeming the military only for this...im condemning the whole state of america. you guys produced these people, you have to deal with them...and that isnt happening.
EDIT:Shadow....is he in charge of the USA, one of teh most powerful and largest boys in the world.....yes., did he go to war..yes, thus he represents america not only in front of teh other countries and politics but to other people. otherwise what would be the point of a president. i havent seen him pulled out of power for being a tyrant?
Because ive been in a real sword fight to teh death a number of times. the music wasnt to represent a dance, it was to represent battle and it did ti well, if youd been in that situation you would have felt how that particular song matched teh emotions of your mind in those situations not to mention teh moviing visuals....do you think i teach sword fighting for a joke..to run around with bendy foam toys?
No, I do not like USA society, and I am not defending it, but I believe you are really exagerated. Yes, the firearm thing is a disaster, the criminality rates are high too, the media sucks, they have the KKK (And we had the Inquisition, duh) and so on, but this does not mean the average american is a killer. And it's not like all americans are stupid. Of course, USA is full of idiots, but so is UK, Italy, France, Spain and Buthan. Of course, the idiocy in USA is more noticable because they are the most powerful country in the world, but no, I do not believe the average american can be reflected as a torturer. How about stoping the labeling? How would you feel if- basing myself on the fact UK has a powerful monarchy- I started saying people in UK are terribly old fashioned tea-sucking retards? And if you said people in Spain are bloodthirsty barbarians because bull practicing is practiced here, I would tell you to burn in a fire, because, most of Spain is against bull fighting, and most of USA is against tortures too.Quote:
you might be onto something there Shadow Nexus considering there are more killings in the texan state Bush used to govern in one month than there is in the whole of great briton for a year.....then again the USA shouts the right to carry firearms and shoot each other....they have the KKK, they have one of the most useless and censored mdeias in the world, they are if i remeber correctly the biggest polluter and consumer of fuel due to their obssesstion with SUV's and other large vehicles etc. if your gonna be sarcastic....do it with a bit more flare
USA does it all the time that it gets into war. Yes. And every other country. Or do you believe there is any war where there has not been torture, from both sides?Quote:
i would like to think those prison gaurds were the exception.....but they werent, america does this every time they get into a war
The torture was not fair, it was an atrocity, and yes, those soldiers may have been rised in american society, and american society may have many problems, but saying those are the average americans is like saying Robespierre was the average frenchman.
For God's sake, I'm defending USA! O_o
"For God's sake, I'm defending USA! O_o"
Wow, I am stunned. It's okay. There are five step programs that will get you right back to your America-bashing comfort zone.
Indeed, it is very harsh to condemn an entire nation of people for the actions of a few, even if the society might be to blame.
Take care all.
Yes, I am quite proud that those people could call me a baby-killer in plain daylight without fear of punishment. It means that my comrades-in-arms and I - as well as those who served before us - have done or are doing our jobs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
What have you done with the real Shadow Nexus? You're his evil twin, aren't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Nexus
Quote:
What have you done with the real Shadow Nexus? You're his evil twin, aren't you?
Naaaaaah, I was just being ironic :p In fact, I AM SURE people in USA walk in the streets killing each other. It shows in all the movies involving Quentin Tarantino, and therefore it must be true!!!Quote:
Wow, I am stunned. It's okay. There are five step programs that will get you right back to your America-bashing comfort zone.
*enters a random shop and shoots at the owner*
There, the diaries will have something to talk about.
*carries a katana with him in the plane, goes to Tokyo and kills 80 people in a restaurant*
:D
*dances with Uma Thruman*
Ladies and gentlemen, this is EoFF's first documented case of double-sarcasm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Nexus
Is that even possible?
Take care all.
Yes, I am starting to scare myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by DocFrance
does the inquesition still round around and get itself new members on TV today Shadow......the KKK do.
I never said americans were ideots.....i said they were irresponsibal as a society. you would be entitled to label us as -"people in UK are terribly old fashioned tea-sucking retards" - if thats the imprestion we give as a country by our actions abroad. however most people here in fact now drink coffee, most people dont even know what the queen looks like let alone the fact we still have one which brings in thousands of pounds via tourists and we werent a bunch of nutters who murder people for what they are born into ala france when it and russia murderd theirs. you would be "Ignorant" as in, not knowing the fuller details. i talk to many americans in texas and across the united states so that i know what "they" are being shown and i dont make an uninformed comment. i wouldnt say that about spain despite my hatred of teh sport because im well aware of peoples disdain for it. however america has done nothing, the president didnt even say sorry and we are talking about acts commited by normal people. we are labled by how we act.
of course terrible things happen...thats why the geneva convention exists as do so many other rules. when britain was thought to have done this we arrested all people concerned, apologised, offerd repreations, we are still investigating and if we have done anything those responsible will go to jail. not simply be sacked or given a couple of months like the USA did. theres a differnce between rough interrogation and torture.
If a nation does something about it and says sorry then they are vindacated....the USA hasnt, they slapped each other on the wrists and said "whoo we got away with that one". if the american people dont want that label then do some thing about it.
Doc....if your being called baby killer it's because your men have been exactly NOT doing there jobs, since when did peacekeeping involve setting dogs on naked masked men and shooting down wedding parties.
tarentino lived.....he got what he did from his real life.....it was only the style that came from other cinima.....art imatates life. then again seven people have been arrested and killed by police for going on sword rampages this year, the most recent ran down a motorway slashing passing cars with his katana. you can by japanese katanas from grattan, a home order catalouge....thankfully they have no tang. in japan it's regular that school kid bikergangs kill each other and teachers with machettes....havent you seen Battle Royale
Did you even read my post? Because you obviously don't understand what I'm trying to say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
Snowman, yes, USA is a different society. For example, in Europe the idea of death penalty dislikes most people, yet in USA it is widely accepted. War is also treated in a different way, Europeans tend to like less the idea of war than people in USA. Why? Well, the last war fought in USA land was in the mid XIXth century, Europe, on the other hand, has had many wars through the centuries, and this has recorded in the collective subconscious, or in culture. Also, we got in European mentalities philosophies that are not so popular in USA, for example, Immanuel Kant's "For Perpetual Peace" was quoted by Mr. Kagan- that dirty idiot- as an "example of European ingenuity and idealism". May I remind you too, that a large part of Europe is catholic, while in USA, for example, luteranism is the main religious current, and luteranism is more individualist while catholicism is more communal. That is why the economical practices of USA, where capitalism is more free and they lack, for example, public sanitation, is seen as something bad by Europeans while in USA it is vice-versa. Same thing applies for some political ideas, such for example marxism, seen in USA as something ridiculous or dangerous (Remember McArthism) while it is more accepted in Europe (Remember May 1968 in Paris). Of course, this applies for very general ideas, I am not saying "Europeans are this and Americans are that", I am just talking about mentality, but this does not apply to every individual. If you have seen Michael's Moore "Bowling for Columbine", you will see even more evidence of this differences, he does quite an interesting analysis on the views on violence and firearms in USA, and then the same in Canada, a place that has a more european mentality (And Michael Moore does seem to prefer Europe more). As for me, I do confess I prefer European society and mentality to USA one, but I do not like to say this or that is superior, I think both have positive aspects and negative ones. However, I do not even consider my country to fit with European mentality, I think Spain falls more into "latin mentality", we have more in common with Argentina, Cuba or Chile than we do with our neighbor country, France.
However, I don't think you are right to attack them like this. You may prefer one way of life to another, but stating that their culture tolerates the tortures against Irak prisioners is going too far. Yes, it is a different culture, and a different mentality, and even in USA there are different mentalities (New York and Texas, for example) but I don't think you can apply the factor of mentality to every individual, nor determine that USA mentality is barbaric.
About Tarantino, well, his movies are very violent, and he does this as a critique. His idea is to use so much violence to a point it is actually funny, to offer a vanalization of violence to such extreme it actually makes you think how violence infested our society is. Tarantino movies do not reflect reality, Tarantino movies parodize society.
As for Battle Royale, I have not seen it, but Zatoichi - also by Takeshi Kitano- seems to take the same idea as Tarantino. However, Kitano has other movies, like Dolls, that have nothing to do with this concept. For what I know of Battle Royale, it is again- like Zatoichi- a nearly parodical idea of violence.
Finally, I believe the merit about those movies is that they are in fact intelligent movies you can watch without thinking of them as intelligent. Kill Bill can rock you with action, blood, more action, more blood and a nice soundtrack (Except for the pseudo-flamenco theme in the battle against O-Ren), or it can make you smile with it's hidden sarcasm. You cannot -however- watch a Woody Allen movie as if you were watching the last Vin Diesel blockbuster flik.
Doc, you were saying that by peoples acts of free speech you had done your job, am i right. my point was that when fighting for freedom and rights they shouldnt be gotten at the sacrifice of others freedom.
Shadow think of it like this. Might for Right, not the other way around.
i didnt attack teh US, i stated that they havent done anything about it and that makes it look like they tollerate it...this is the oppinion of iraque and it's them that count at teh moment. we vote leaders to represent everyone and they do it the best that they can......BUSH is representing america....and he chuckles at the thoughts of what were done to theose people.
if that viloence wasnt there tarentino would have nothing to "visualise", instead he would be doing films about taxes etc. many people glamourise gang culture and mob culture because they havent had any experiance of it.....it doesnt mean it isnt there, they just got lucky.
the Oren music and battle was the greatest....ah the diffence between me who has been there and you who hasnt experiance it yet.
woody allen caters to the belif that we can all talk things out....i asure you where i have come from you carnt, it's fists and sticks
I don't like the current president, I didn't vote for him and I probably won't vote for him in the upcoming election, but THAT (in the bold) is an out and out lie. I'll let you in on a bit of a secret, VERY few Americans find anything about this event humorous, at least the Americans I know. I personally don't hang around with President Bush on Sundays, so I can't say I'm 100% certain that he hasn't had a laugh concerning the situation, but I haven't heard him making any jokes about it publically, which means you haven't either.Quote:
i didnt attack teh US, i stated that they havent done anything about it and that makes it look like they tollerate it...this is the oppinion of iraque and it's them that count at teh moment. we vote leaders to represent everyone and they do it the best that they can......BUSH is representing america....and he chuckles at the thoughts of what were done to theose people.
I'm not asking for you to like Bush, and I'm not asking you to like America. I'm just asking that you don't make generalizations based on ONE bad event, while ignoring anything good the US does.
You make it sound like he was actually chosen from a lot of options. It was either Bush or Gore, and Bush stole the elections. He dosen't represent USA, and hell, he does not represent America by any means: He represents a part of it: The part of people who can stand him.Quote:
BUSH is representing america
·_·Quote:
the Oren music and battle was the greatest....ah the diffence between me who has been there and you who hasnt experiance it yet.
You confuse me. OK, so the O-Ren music was the greatest...um...OK, I don't know how, if you find anything good about that song it's probably because you haven't heard decent flamenco in your life.
And the second part...you say you have had an experience of it. What? Are you Tarantino? Have you been in the battle? How do you know I have not been there? I COULD BE LUCY LIU!!!
bush never apologised, in fact if you listen or read what he said it clearly states that he thinks it was unfortunate they were cought doing it. by not saying "Im terrible very sorry", he is all but giving the thumbs up. did he sack that wrinkly old turd who said he had the photos and didnt bother investigating....no he didnt, in fact he said what a great man he was, that man himself went and laughed about how hard it is to get rid of him. have ANY of the people who carried out these atrocities really been punished....nope, either a couple of months or a sack. plus the fact bush had teh biggest death row que when he was a governer and it's clear what he thinks and his closest mates.
unfortunatly many americans i speack to online elsewhere dont see a big problem and even deny what happend.
while im sorry you didnt get the leader you want......britain certainly never lets it's leadership do such things without being challenged.
this weasnt one bad thing....it was many men, who knows how many more, it was a mentally ill man who was beaten bloody and died with a sack on his head in the cold, it was a naked human tower 20 men high with US soildgers smiling into the camera, poised at their anus's. it was dogs set on mens peni's. it was a reoccourance of teh shameful behavour in veitnam.
please tell me the GOOD things the USA did recently....when bush crushed teh global talks for enviromental welfare, when the USA was discoverd to consume three times more fuel due to love of SUV's than other countries..i can go on
No, and I haven't seen Blair pulled out of power either, and Blair is quite an asshole. Can I say a??hole or does the damn language censorip thing kick in? Oh, Aznar was kicked through elections, no one misses him.Quote:
while im sorry you didnt get the leader you want......britain certainly never lets it's leadership do such things without being challenged.
did he go to war..yes, thus he represents america not only in front of teh other countries and politics but to other people. otherwise what would be the point of a president. i havent seen him pulled out of power for being a tyrant?
THEY LIBERATED AFGHANISTAN FROM A CRUEL SYSTEM and left the country in hands of a bunch of drug dealers AND FREED IRAQ FROM A TYRANT DICTATOR to start an economic invasion and make their multinationals more wealthy while trying to make the invasion look like a liberation war because the WMD thing didn't work.Quote:
please tell me the GOOD things the USA did recently....when bush crushed teh global talks for enviromental welfare, when the USA was discoverd to consume three times more fuel due to love of SUV's than other countries..i can go on
It looked OK for the scene, with that I can agree, just as that horrible j-pop song in the restaurant matched very well the comical idea Tarantino wished to transmit. But...that is NOT a good flamenco song.Quote:
Because ive been in a real sword fight to teh death a number of times. the music wasnt to represent a dance, it was to represent battle and it did ti well, if youd been in that situation you would have felt how that particular song matched teh emotions of your mind in those situations not to mention teh moviing visuals....do you think i teach sword fighting for a joke..to run around with bendy foam toys?
Snowman, I'd appreciate it if you'd stop making broad accusations of a culture that you don't seem to fully understand. Before you judge us, try walking a mile in our shoes.
'Cause then, he'd be a mile away... and have your shoes! :DQuote:
Before you judge us, try walking a mile in our shoes.
shaodw.....blair is a butt licker......but he wasnt in control of the country who tortured innocent and helpless people.....even so he did officially apologies.
lol you answeard your own question there.....and now bush plans to build a massive american maximum security prisons...aha
that terrible j-pop song was real. that was how they really sing being a real band in japan called teh 5678's. tarentino was in tokyo shopping and heard them in a store playing, he bough their album and invited them over for teh movie....they turned up in what you watched them in and thats how they sing and play...they were the real deal.
Doc...you want me to nip out and torture someone lol, or are you saying we should have children able to get hold of guns while they are growing clinically obease with heros like arnie who, along with teh president are going backwards into the stoneage over rights like gay marrige.
Actually the daily mirrior claimed to have it's own photogrpahs of british parratroopers beating prisoners in the back of a wagon. the press also claimed to have witnesses. immediatly blair apologised out right and offerd reperations to whoever needed them...the problem was that the pictures showed old army kit not sent to iraque....and a truck parked in a british military base just down teh road. regadless of the pictures being faked, british soildgers where immideatly arrested and when discoverd to have been acting outside of orders wer sentanced for prison. i dont like blair...i didnt vote for him or agree with teh war, but the majority of my country did and he represents them as bush does teh USA..very unfortunate.
do you have size 10 and a half
Thank you, Alfred E. Neuman :pQuote:
Originally Posted by War Angel
god this went off topic.
look, i think america is one messed up country too and i despise Bush, and with exception of his steortyping, i agree with snowman.
however britain and tony blair r very messed up. hell, every country is messed up. as shadow nexus said, europe is quite diff to usa and we both have positiveand negative aspects to these diff philosophys.
however i dont subscribe to the notion that american ppl are barbaric or stuiped sheep. there just like any other country, there r scum, there are sheep, there r smart ppl, stuiped ppl, nice, nasty etc. my experience of ppl online(which is 90% american) is that at least 3/4 r smart, sensible , civilised. even if they have an opinion diff 2 mine, they can logically explain why.
so snowman dont judge american ppl. yeah, there may be some sick ppl in its society and army, but same for every one. i,m almost 99% sure that britains would have abused iraqi prisoners even though those pics "offically" fake. almost every army that ever existed would have abused prisoners, no matter how "civilised" they are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
Uh.. what?
http://www.abcnews.go.com/wire/Polit...C-RSSFeeds0312
As an American, I'm quite offended by the jibberish, and slander you've spoken about my culture.
It's fine that you don't agree with, or like it, but I don't feel any need for your generalizations.
Last time I checked, I don't go out in the morning and beat Iraqi prisoners before I head off to class.
Dude! No way! Mine is 22 cm!!!Quote:
do you have size 10 and a half
(What? It's the classical easy joke: I had to do it, or else I'd explode or something ¬¬)
PS: And what do you mean by that question about size 10?
I didn't get it either.
Sure, America right now isn't looking like a politcal genius for what has transpired, but how quickly we forget our history! Without the aid of the USA, WWII probably wouldn't have ended in a success for the Allies. In America's case, I've noticed a trend, when we involve ourselves in a conflict after it's started, we tend to pick the right side and help claim victory. However, when we start a conflict ourselves, that's when we get a little hazy on what to do.
I'm as anti-Bush as the next, but he, to the best of my knowledge didn't attack any Iraqis personally, which might be the problem. If he were actually fighting at the frontlines, perhaps he'd have some real answers and perspective instead of the typical political jargon he always gives us in his speeches.
Funny, how a thread about The PM of England has evolved into yet another Bush bash fest. Seems it's an all-time favorite topic.
Personal favorite Rumsfeld story:
He was being debated by a French politician some years ago, and the Frenchmen said something to the degree of, "What has America ever done for us or the world?"
Rumsfeld suddenly became impassioned and replayed, "Do you speak German? NO! Are you Communist? NO! Is your economy booming? YES!"
Why can't we have a leader, with real ideas that can actually benefit a society, who can also back himself up in the way that Rumsfeld can?
Take care all.
I wouldn't mind :DQuote:
Are you Communist?
Didn't you know? Everybody who's anybody is doing it. Come on, don't be a square.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Captain
Yeah, it's fun, join the party :DQuote:
Originally Posted by DocFrance
Yeah, it's fun, join the party :DQuote:
Originally Posted by DocFrance
It's so much fun, our posts spontaneously duplicate!
MAGIC, MAGIC, MAGIC :D
And now we're both going to get banned for spamming, aren't we?
:banme
There's even an emoticon for it.
But really, who cares about this topic anyway? It just became boring Bush bashing, I am already bored of it, my "Bush bashing baseball bat" is already starting to brake, I have used it too much, and I don't have money for another one.
All you have to do is cross the Pyrenees - those things are ten centimes a dozen over in France.
Actually, if you've never hiked through the Pyrenees, I'd highly suggest it. Probably one of the most beautiful places in Europe.
Does anyone know the stats of about how many leaders of nations are killed per year?
I think that would be a fascinating thing to find out, discuss, and debate. How can we make our leaders safer, or will we forever be doomed to see assassinations?
Take care all.
I don't know the numbers, but I think it's safe to assume that most of them occur in Africa, Central America, and Southwest Asia.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Captain
I read somewhere that in most cases, the places where leaders are most often victims of assassination attempts is where there are large mixes of races and cultures, who often have conflicting views, ideologies, and agendas. It might explain why places such as the Middle Eastand parts of Africa with vast groupings of diverse people always seem to have suicide bombers killing leaders, or assassination attempts on diplomats.
Take care all.
Oh, I have, I have hiked through the Pyrenees. But I don't want to get french Bush bashing bats, I hate it the French style, I want something more latin...well, Spain is full of Bush-bashing baseball bats...I think they grow in the sewers.Quote:
Originally Posted by DocFrance
You trying to save this topic!Quote:
I read somewhere that in most cases, the places where leaders are most often victims of assassination attempts is where there are large mixes of races and cultures, who often have conflicting views, ideologies, and agendas. It might explain why places such as the Middle Eastand parts of Africa with vast groupings of diverse people always seem to have suicide bombers killing leaders, or assassination attempts on diplomats.
Anyway, it's no surprise things like that occur where cultures mix. It looks like- since we all have different outlooks on life- it is nearly impossible to agree on something.
Africa is also one big political fiasco right now because of the damage that the Colonial Era caused. Case in point: Rwandan genocides.
how on earth are the rwandan tribal tensions the fault of european colonialism they preceded any form of impearilism.Quote:
Africa is also one big political fiasco right now because of the damage that the Colonial Era caused. Case in point: Rwandan genocides.
Before the colonial era, they were fine and happy as long as they stayed away from each other. Then when the British, Dutch, and French decided to divie everything up, the Hutus and the Tutsis suddenly wound up in the same country.
Sometimes it seems that "modernizing" or "Westernizing" a country or culture only makes things worse. I believe that is part of the problem in Africa, as most of the tribes and groups of people lost their own culture and had a new own more or less forced down their throats, for good or bad.
Take care all.
we face the startrek situation, do we interfere with cultures that arent to our way of thiking or technologically weaker. Giving aid to countrys on the brink of despair is interffering even with noble intentions...but the fact remains, once you give a helping hand to a weaker man he will grow to depend on it, and why not, he needs the support, he wont feed himself for a lifetime. you have to make a stand when a country is loosing it big time. Either you go in with teh full intention of taking it over and running it proffestionally for the people, or you leave them all to die. Doing just a little can cause more damge than doing far too much, like a drug weaker cultures NEED more. theres a reason third world countries are messed up, simply the land doesnt want them, it carnt support them. if we arent willing to take the burden of them in our lands.....then we must leave them to die however horrid that is. Or we tell everyone from the start, we go in on the soul principle of regaingin control and we keep control speard over the europeon union, not one soul nutcase state (ahem).